If No Deal, A's "To-Do" List For The Rest Of The Season, And The Off-Season
by Nico on Jul 31, 2007 1:15 PM PDT
in News
147 comments
The trade deadline has come and gone, and barring a post-deadline announcement it appears that Joe Blanton, Mike Piazza, and the rest of the crew are still A’s. Assuming that the team we’ve known is the team we still have, here’s one fan’s view of how the A’s need to approach the time between August 1st and April 1st in order to return to being a contender in 2008…
THE REST OF THE SEASON
- Donnie Murphy needs to play at SS every day. I am worried that Chavez’ return will put Scutaro at SS and Murphy on the bench and that would be a big mistake. The A’s need to find out what Murphy can and cannot do as an everyday SS. My suspicion is that Murphy is good enough to be a real plus option as a platoon player that his range and his hitting against RHP will prove not quite good enough to be the right SS option over 150 games. Assuming Murphy is not the answer, I would love to see the A’s make a play, over the Winter, for a long-term SS solution, and I would hate to see the A’s give Crosby “one more year to see what he can do”. We know what Crosby can and cannot do and we know what Scutaro can and cannot do. We have a chance to learn a lot about Donnie Murphy and we need to. Now.
- The A’s should seriously consider shutting Huston Street down for the rest of the season. His injury scared me and it scared me even more to hear he was not feeling great after his first outing. Meanwhile, the A’s have Andrew Brown starting to throw better and featuring a 97 MPH fastball. Does Brown have what it takes to be a set-up man or closer? Why not use August and September to find out what Brown can do by throwing him into the closer role for two months, while resting Street to maximize the chance he can come back strong in 2008?
If August and September can’t bring us the excitement of a pennant race, perhaps it can at least bring us some valuable information about Murphy and Brown. (Quick, someone call Candice Bergen!)
THE OFF-SEASON
Everyone will have a different opinion on what the A’s should do, and Beane undoubtedly will have a different one yet. I believe the A’s are two pieces away from contending in 2008 and they are substantial pieces: A shortstop and a CFer, one of whom can bring a middle-of-the-order bat to the party. I do believe the A’s have the resources, though barely, to fill this tall order.
I think the A’s need to make one big splurge, whether it means spending money or spending talent. The A’s may not have a lot of money to spend but they have even less talent to spend, so it may be time to open up the pocketbook for one good gamble. With no appealing shortstops on the market, I would make a strong bid for Aaron Rowand if he can be secured for 4-5 years at 10-12 million/year. I think he would be worth it, because he provides a legitimate bat from the right side, plays excellent defense, and does it at one of the key positions the A’s need to improve.
Then I would look for the next A’s shortstop via trade. Might something along the lines of Dan Johnson, Dallas Braden, and Bobby Crosby fetch Felipe Lopez coming off of a down year? Between Lopez, the intriguing Chin-Lung Hu, and other possibilities, the next A’s shortstop is out there somewhere and he’s available for a package the A’s can afford to offer.
<dreaming> Buck, Barton, Swisher, Cust, Rowand, Chavez, Lopez, Ellis, Suzuki…Haren, Blanton, Gaudin, Loaiza, and DiNardo…Brown, Casilla, Embree, Duchscherer, and Street…A bench with Murphy and Denorfia…
OK, now I’m excited again!
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I cant believe they didn't make a move
by 3Chavy3 on Jul 31, 2007 1:09 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
So is that final?
Nobody moved? Can I go back to work now?
by iglew on Jul 31, 2007 1:10 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
We don't know for sure
We just know it's 1:12 and nothing has been announced.
by Nico on Jul 31, 2007 1:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
murphy is not good
I would much rather see scutaro.
by bballfanr33 on Jul 31, 2007 1:11 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Scutaro has no future
Murphy might not, but at least it would be good to find out, he is only 23/24 (not sure which) and the A's should find out if he does have a future. He seems to have more range than Scutaro who has none.
I know we all love Scutaro but be honest, he would be in AAA if it were not for the A's having nobody in AAA ready for a middle infield spot.
by china bob on Jul 31, 2007 1:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Disagree completely.
No, he's never going to be a starter, or a superstar, but he's a fantastic and very veratile back-up, and that does have more value than many people seem to think. No matter who you have on your team, you're always still going to need back-ups, so you might as well have one of the better ones.
by UncleLeo on Jul 31, 2007 1:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes but..
We have another person similar to that you describe in AAA: Gregorio Petit
by muffinpryde on Jul 31, 2007 2:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, and Petit will make $400000
instead of $2M.
And he's a much better fielder, if I understand correctly.
by PaulThomas on Jul 31, 2007 2:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why?
We already know he isn't good.
by OaktownPower on Jul 31, 2007 1:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
Scutaro is inconsistent at the plate and makes to many errors in the field. He is a good utility guy to have, but seeing him as an everyday player for the rest of the season when I know Murphy could be developing isn't right.
by chavyizdamn3 on Jul 31, 2007 1:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
Murphy is not even close to the A's solution, and it won't take two months to realize that. It's obvious already. He is a downgrade on both offense and defense from Crosby.
by Slurve on Jul 31, 2007 1:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Downgrade on Offense?
I beg to differ.
by chavyizdamn3 on Jul 31, 2007 1:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No kidding.
How do you get worse than .220 with no ability to otherwise reach base? Neifi Perez wouldn't be a downgrade from Crosby at this point.
by jeepers on Jul 31, 2007 2:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Unfortunately, bad though Crosby
has been, Neifi's been worse. 29 OPS+.
by rfloh on Jul 31, 2007 3:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Murphy is batting .163, and has struck out 6 time
in less than 30 ab's. He is not exactly killing the ball.
by theblackpearl on Jul 31, 2007 3:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He just deserves a chance, that's all.
Nobody's claiming he's a lock to be better. It's a plain fact that you can't be worse than Bobby Crosby is at baseball this year, though, so there's nothing to lose.
by jeepers on Jul 31, 2007 4:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Plus
A healthy Rich Harden, but we all know that can't happen.
by chavyizdamn3 on Jul 31, 2007 1:11 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
absolutely right Nico
I have the same fear you have that Scutaro will be put back at SS. In fact, it is time for the A's to consider a utility man other than Scutaro. He is fine as a 2nd baseman but when he plays SS or 3rd he has absolutely no range at all, the A's need someone ot fill those slots for our regular injured players, perhaps Murphy, perhaps Petit or Pennington but probably not next year.
I'm still holding out hope that a trade was made and just not announced yet, please!!!!!!!!!!
by china bob on Jul 31, 2007 1:12 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Rowand = bad move
He's inconsistent, injury prone and having a career year in a walk year. Signing Rowand equates to signing a league average player with consistency and injury issues to Eric Chavez money.
by lenscrafters on Jul 31, 2007 1:13 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Have you
seen his Batting Average? He would be a god in the A's weak line up.
by chavyizdamn3 on Jul 31, 2007 1:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He is playing in the NL
which is a weak league, and playing in a real hitters ballpark, beware of getting any NL hitters or AL hitters from Boston.
by china bob on Jul 31, 2007 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ya I thought about that
but anything he does is better than Kotsay or anybody we have at Triple A.
by chavyizdamn3 on Jul 31, 2007 1:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Have you seen his career stats?
Last two years, OPS+ under 100. Missed a ton of games last year. Had one other good year in 04 (hence why I call him inconsistent).
Career OPS+: 106
Is that a guy you want to commit multi year big bucks to?
by lenscrafters on Jul 31, 2007 1:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm So Desperate
for offense right now, I'd take it.
by chavyizdamn3 on Jul 31, 2007 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He missed a ton of games
last year because he smashed his face trying to catch a fly ball (which he held onto I believe). I don't think that makes him injury prone. I don't believe he's missed substantial time in any other year, unlike Kotsay, Crosby, Chavez and Harden. We already have players far more injury prone than Aaron Rowand.
I'm sure you're against signing Rowand regardless of injury, and your arguments have merit. I just think the label of injury prone is misplaced.
by IndianaAsfan on Jul 31, 2007 2:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
How does a guy become injury prone
because he smashes into a wall one time?
by Nico on Jul 31, 2007 1:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rowand plays hard yes
And his injuries have mostly been caused by those freak accidents. But that's more of a reason not to sign him. I mean, what's to keep gritty, hard nosed Aaron Rowand from running into a wall and suffering a severe injury? That'd be pretty bad for the team, especially if they're paying him 11, 12 million dollars a year.
by lenscrafters on Jul 31, 2007 1:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think you need to reword
this argument. So, what you're looking for are lazy players who can hit but don't care about defense? I'd rather have a guy get hurt because he plays the game hard than because he has some affliction that cannot be diagnosed, or misses his chiropractor, or gets hurt while rehabbing. Rowand, compared to Milton Bradley, is one of the most healthy players around.
by IndianaAsfan on Jul 31, 2007 2:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
And
He's a proven winner, and there arent any of those on the A's, besides Piazza and Haren who both made it to the WS.
by chavyizdamn3 on Jul 31, 2007 2:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, come off it
Haren's a proven winner because he worked middle relief for a team that got swept in the WS... whereas Chavez, who's started for five playoff teams, isn't?
Give me a break. A bench player on a WS team doesn't become better just because his team makes the WS. Haren's good because he's a good pitcher, not because he once played on a team with Rolen, Pujols, Carpenter and Isringhausen.
by PaulThomas on Jul 31, 2007 2:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I was assuming <fe>
Right?
by iglew on Jul 31, 2007 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You'd have a better argument
if Chavy didn't have a career .640 OPS in more than a hundred playoff ABs.
by jeepers on Jul 31, 2007 3:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Snarky
but completely irrelevant. If anything, it reinforces my point. Chavez was on many winning teams, ergo must be a "proven winner." Right? Regardless of his own actual contributions to those teams. Right?
Or maybe the entire concept of a "proven winner" is ridiculous.
by PaulThomas on Jul 31, 2007 4:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What would you call a player...
...whose team wins in spite of him?
Not saying Chavez didn't contribute, just questioning your general implication that a player is a "winner" just because he was on a winning team even if he grounded into double-plays every at-bat.
by UncleLeo on Jul 31, 2007 5:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not implying this at all
I'm sarcastically mocking this point of view. Obviously a player who GIDPs every time is not a productive player. Neither is someone who sits on the bench the whole time.
In a nutshell: Kenny Rogers won a World Series in 1996 by pitching like utter garbage in four games for the Yankees. This does not make him a proven winner.
by PaulThomas on Jul 31, 2007 6:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hmm
David Eckstein is a proven winner. Let's go get him.
And he's not JUST a proven winner, he's gritty too!
Oh what the hell, let's make a run at Darin Erstad too.
by lenscrafters on Jul 31, 2007 5:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No I'm not saying we should get lazy players
And really whether I use "injury prone" or not, it's not a big deal. Would you rather me rephrase it to say "Aaron Rowand gets injured alot"? I'll do that, but it doesn't change anything.
Bottom line, Rowand is a guy who gets hurt for various reasons and his injuries have caused him to miss a lot of time in the past. Some of his injuries are a cause of him making/trying to make spectacular plays. Based on his style of play and past history, it's reasonable to be expect him to continue to suffer these type of injuries in the future. Do you deny any of that?
Really, it's not just his injury history that's worrisome. Like I said before, this guy is very inconsistent offensively.
Add it all up and he's not a sound investment.
by lenscrafters on Jul 31, 2007 4:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You missed my point
I don't care what you call him. Your arguments about his performance are persuasive. But the way you used gritty and hard nosed implied that you didn't value those characteristics and were mocking them. That's why I said you may want to re-word the argument, because I think you do, in fact, value those attributes.
by IndianaAsfan on Jul 31, 2007 6:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We won't be able to get Rowand
anyway. He's going to very sought after.
by IM4Oakgal on Jul 31, 2007 2:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Internet has spawned
more lust for instant gratification than ..
than...
well, more than I can imagine.
As they say in Loouisiana, "Waidawile, waidawile".
by One won lost won on Jul 31, 2007 1:15 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I feel
We can do better than Jack Cust in the middle of the lineup next year.
by migueltejada on Jul 31, 2007 1:18 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
yes we can I would like to see Cust as our
number 7 hitter he would be great there
by 3Chavy3 on Jul 31, 2007 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i'll say it again
crap...
by jubjub on Jul 31, 2007 1:22 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Murphy should be given a chance...
An Crosby should no longer wear the green and gold. We should try to see how good Brown can be in order to make the most out of parting with Bradley (which was probably a good move for everyone).
Does anyone know what did or did'nt happen with Kielty ?
by Carlos1118 on Jul 31, 2007 1:23 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Boston wanted him if Dye deal died
So, since Dye stayed with White Sox, perhaps we'll hear Kielty for a player to be named later.
It is phenomenal and uncanny how these people without names gravitate to the occupation of professional baseball players!
by One won lost won on Jul 31, 2007 1:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just pathetic...
We should have given stewart, kotsay, embree and piazza away. From my understanding of our "organizational depth chart" we have a three legged hamster as our second best SS prospect and an actual piece of granite (its carved as a human I believe) as our third overall OF prospect. I think we should at least pencil some humans in there...
I mean if the Angles offered a B or C grade prospect for Mikey P that would still be a good prospect for our system...
Nonetheless, excited for Doyle's return (and pending injury).
by CyZito on Jul 31, 2007 1:28 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Embree?
Give away Embree? Guy has a rubber arm, and throws 93-94 MPH. And, he's healthy.
by Colorado Fan on Jul 31, 2007 3:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kielty will be sent to Sac....
he won't risk losing his 07 salary
by athleticsBB4life on Jul 31, 2007 1:29 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
His agent no doubt working the phones
Getting assurance from a club that would pick him off waivers, or would sign him if he got his release.
by One won lost won on Jul 31, 2007 1:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
unless the A's outright release him
by athleticsBB4life on Jul 31, 2007 1:30 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
BB high on Gregorio Petit at SS
we may see him in September
by athleticsBB4life on Jul 31, 2007 1:31 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
where did you hear that?
Just wondering.
by chavyizdamn3 on Jul 31, 2007 1:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Beane not a big July trader lately
2007 - nothing
2006 - nothing
2005 - minor trades for Kennedy and Payton
2004 - nothing
by jubjub on Jul 31, 2007 1:34 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Other Gm's are scared
just shivering I tell you.
by chavyizdamn3 on Jul 31, 2007 1:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
When was Moneyball published?
Just asking.
by UncleLeo on Jul 31, 2007 1:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Spring 2003
by jubjub on Jul 31, 2007 1:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What a waste.
Can't believe they didn't do a thing.
by jeepers on Jul 31, 2007 1:41 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
"Two pieces away" I pretty much agree with...
...but I would add a third. Something's gotta be done about the consistently weak clutch hitting and seemingly overall inability to drive runners in. Though that's more of a team thing, and not a "piece", per se.
by UncleLeo on Jul 31, 2007 1:46 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
no deal? wow.......
i wonder if this means the pocket book will open in the off season for a FA or two? you know, start the ball rolling for the move to fremont?
any wish lists?
by greendatitiz on Jul 31, 2007 1:49 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
the answer is no
The A's will try and take some cheaper options of some players who are past their prime and injury prone. I really can't see how the A's are going to make their offense any better next year with the same garbage they have on the field right now.
by 3Chavy3 on Jul 31, 2007 2:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Since JoKe apparently didn't get traded...
does that mean we can stop "showcasing" his "talents" in the 9th inning now, and actually put in someone who's decent?
by ZeroIndulgence on Jul 31, 2007 1:52 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Please God.
Let them sit Kennedy down now!
by IM4Oakgal on Jul 31, 2007 2:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They never were showcasing
his talents, any more than "more stuff happens on a night with a full moon".
by One won lost won on Jul 31, 2007 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
unfortunately this team is in shambles...
we have nothing to build on aside form starting pitching, which will likely regress next season. Even with the outstanding starting pitching, it been proven that the bullpen is a mess, and the offense is just simply inept. Building around Chavez and Crosby has turned into a huge mistake...they are both poor hitters, non-existent RBI guys, and injury riddled. And neither Chavez or Crosby had good defensive years, which portends that those skills are diminishing.
Ditto for the major components of the bullpen..Duke and Street have pretty much peaked out as far as I'm concerned...they both suffer from chronic injuries and will never produce to the level expected of them. And lets not forget "King" Richard...the biggest disappointment of all.
The Oakland A's are a joke right now....they lack talent and they are CONSTANTLY injured. This makes them unworthy of playing at the MLB level and unworthy of many on this blog. What are we supposed to say to a BOS or ANA fan who uses the Choakland or Jokeland stuff? How can I argue? The Pathetics are more accurate than Athletics.
I am done giving the organization the benefit of the doubt, etc. I have been a fan since 1971, so I dont want to hear any bandwagon crap or otherwise...I went through the pain of the mid-to-late 70s and also the 90s, so I have seen some pretty awful clubs. The difference now is that they are a bore to watch play the game. The injury thing drives me nuts, and BB doesnt seem to address it all.
I'd like to see a completely new slate in the field, as unrealistic as that is...no more Chavez, Cust, Crosby, etc. I'd even part with Ellis, Buck, etc. just to see something new. Keep Haren, Blanton and Casilla and go from there.
What a disgusting year for baseball....
by tdwclark on Jul 31, 2007 1:55 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I agree with some of that
but I wouldn't say yet that Street is injury prone. That is fair to say with Harden, Chavy and Crosby but not with Street quite yet.
by 3Chavy3 on Jul 31, 2007 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Adios
You don't seem like you know a whole lot about how baseball works anyway with all this RBI BS and thinking them "unworth to play in MLB".
And not wanting Jack Cust, LOL. You sir are an idiot, even I know that and I think Barry Bonds clogs bases for a living.
by Dusty Baker on Jul 31, 2007 2:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
adios yourself
the bullshit on this team is self-evident. Do you want to build a team around Matt Stairs? John Jaha? thats all Cust is...he's a novelty. He's great when he's hitting HRs, but he's so pitchable its not even worthy of argument. Thats the main problem with this team...they can be pitched to so easily. Every AB is so predictable so even mediocre pitchers throughout the league take advantage of it.
Who the hell are you to tell me I dont know baseball...have you been watching the plate approach the last three seasons? Everyone here and in MLB knows the team wasnt even good last year...they got lucky because the league was wide open (much like this year). They have been streaky, both winning and losing. Thats a horrible approach to a 162 game season.
And RBIs are BS? Maybe on your team if you dont bat runs in, you still win, but in the real world you are required to score more runs than the opponent. And RBIs are to come from the 3-4-5 guys in the line-up...thats why they are there: TO DRIVE IN RUNS.
The team sucks...of course its my opinion...everything on this site is opinion. However, the standings are what they are and the if you have been actaully watching the Oakland A's in 2007 you wouldn't even think about arguing that they suck.
by tdwclark on Jul 31, 2007 5:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
proven?
"proven" is for mathematics.
Otherwise, everything you wrote is simply "your humble opinion".
Suggestion: state your biased observations as "your opinion" rather than as "indisputable facts" akin to the measurement for the acceleration of gravity on Earth, the speed of light, etc.
thanks, oh, and "adios".
by One won lost won on Jul 31, 2007 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I dont need to state
that anything is my opinion...its self-evident as of course I cant "prove" anything, other than to point to the W-L record and observe why it is what it is.
This isnt Semantics 101...figure it out by utilizing critical thinking skills.
And save the self-righteous, indignant crap for someone who cares...
by tdwclark on Jul 31, 2007 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I want some of what you all are somking
if you think Murphy is a better option than Crosby or Scutaro, or even if you think he COULD be a better option. What on Earth has Murphy done to win all these believers? Hit a couple seeing eye doubles? Big f'n deal. The dude is a .163 career hitter and is batting a hefty .160 right now for the green and gold. He is more than 5 inches shorter than Crosby, has less range, and a comparable arm. Murphy has never hit .270 or 22 HR or been an ROY or an projected MVP candidate (as is true of Crosby). He has never played a full MLB season, meaning that his durability is unknown. In short, Murphy blows, and the sooner we can get Crosby healthy, the better.
by Slurve on Jul 31, 2007 1:55 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Are you
Bobby Crosby in disguise?
by chavyizdamn3 on Jul 31, 2007 2:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If he were
he'd most likely cause himself to strike out swinging.
by oblique on Jul 31, 2007 2:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The sooner we find
a better replacement for Crosby the better.
by boilerdan on Jul 31, 2007 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the problem is that we don't have a good
replacement anywhere in sight
by 3Chavy3 on Jul 31, 2007 2:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bobby Crosby, career .240 hitter....
Murphy is 3 years younger, so people think he can become a reliable ML player, which Crosby has failed to prove he is capable of doing.
I think Crosby will go on to have a Jose Valentin-like career, but that's not saying much.
by jubjub on Jul 31, 2007 2:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You're right...
...in that Murphy has never shown any real evidence for any rational person to believe he'll be a great player... especially not as great as people here seem to think is needed to replace Crosby.
But, Crosby has dimninished quite a bit from his first couiple years, also.
by UncleLeo on Jul 31, 2007 2:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree, Slurve
I think it's possible that the A's could learn that Murphy is a plus-hitter against LHP and a good 2Bman, in which case he could potentially form an outstanding platoon with Melillo.
by Nico on Jul 31, 2007 3:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Platoons
I think that Murphy and Melillo COULD be decent platoon mates at 2nd, but when was the last time Beane really stuck to a strict platoon of any regular defensive position...or even relegated ANY rookie to part-time status after a handful of major league at-bats? Yeah, not very often, if at all.
I imagine that Beane is going to give Murphy all the at-bats he can handle while Crosby is sidelined, with the hope that Donnie can step in next season and take over Scutaro's UTILITY role (not Crosby's STARTING role), since it'll be a more efficient use of resources to pay Murphy 400K instead of Scutaro's 1.5+ million to essentially provide similar skill sets (defensive infield versatility, under-sized body, righty bench-bat).
by Taj Adib on Jul 31, 2007 4:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
yup, yup, yup, and yup
I've never understood why Beane hasn't moved to a platoon-heavy, multiple-position-capable roster. I would think that it would actually be a cheaper way to build an effective roster.
by monkeyball on Jul 31, 2007 4:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
scrolling up...speaking of Mortimer
by ak_A on Jul 31, 2007 5:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
OK, I could see Murphy as a 2Bman someday
(which I think he was in KC), but not as a Crosby replacement at SS. I know I sound a bit overstated about Crosby, but my main point is that he is a better option for us than Murphy; not that he is a great option in general (he is, and has always been, all about potential).
by Slurve on Jul 31, 2007 5:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Chavvy get that f'in surgery done now
no more excuses. this guy is supposed to be in the prime of his career and he continues to come up lame. if he's really the leader of this club, he needs to set an example with his preparation for a solid season going into next year.
by oak1 on Jul 31, 2007 2:13 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
clutch replacement
by jubjub on Jul 31, 2007 2:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
whatever it takes
i dont care if they need to attach a bionic ass and prosthetic shoulder. just get the right diagnosis and get into playing shape. you've got to believe medical science has progressed beyond the witch doctor shit that larry davis + co. throw out there.
by oak1 on Jul 31, 2007 2:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Street should be shutdown for until 2008.
No reason to take any chances with his future. Brown might be a nice pickup for the A's and may allow BB to have a trading chip from the A's setup/closer pool.
I am not big on Murphy AT ALL but the guy still deserves an opportunity to play for a while so we can see his potential. We've seen Crosby's potential and there just isn't much to be found. In regards to Scutaro... if you looked up "utility player" in the dictionary there would be a picture of him. He is simply not an everyday player but he is quite useful in his current role, although his salary is going to become an issue soon.
BB must believe that Kennedy, Piazza and Stewart are all type B free agents. Why trade any of them if that is the case? We have an option on Piazza and Stewart may stick around since we took a chance on him. Not sure I want to see either of their 2008 salaries (maybe 10 mil and 3 mil?) on this team.
by ohtobe21likehuston on Jul 31, 2007 2:20 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Nico?
Maybe Embree likes the closer job? and kind of earned it?
by IM4Oakgal on Jul 31, 2007 2:25 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
OT: HAHAHAHAHA!!!
http://www.ars.usda.gov/pandp/people...
by oblique on Jul 31, 2007 2:27 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
He studies GRIT!
by Poppy on Jul 31, 2007 2:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What about Tejeda?
You talk about getting a shortstop in the offseason, why do you neglect to mention bringing back at Miguel Tejeda, who has a desire to return to Oakland at least in one account I read. In my opinion, the team needs a first baseman, too. Billy Beane needs to blow up the team and start over and no one should be spared possibly being moved. If we land Tejeda, then we keep Chavez at third base. There are enough CF's out there to land one of them. Can Daric Barton still catch or does he have to play 1B. If he is stuck at 1B then give the job to him and leave him there. The outfield needs a complete makeover, except for Swisher in RF.
by jaylans on Jul 31, 2007 2:34 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm afraid that we have all fallen in love with
former-Miggy and I'm not sure he would be a good pickup anymore. It's impossible not to think of him whenever you think of the 20-game streak but we need to stay away from guys that might be on the decline.
by ohtobe21likehuston on Jul 31, 2007 2:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Barton was a "catcher"
What would Tejada cost?
by rfloh on Jul 31, 2007 3:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
SuSlu says no deal today involving the A's...
though waiver deals still possible. truly disappointing.
by inbillywetrust on Jul 31, 2007 2:36 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Piazza is probably the only deal that gets done
if at all next month. i wont be surprised to see him start a few games at catcher over the next couple of weeks to increase his trade value.
by oak1 on Jul 31, 2007 2:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
RIP, my interest in the 2007 season
Then the A's will win 1 game in a row and I'll get my hopes up for a record-breaking streak
by JediLeroy on Jul 31, 2007 2:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hey! That's *my* Candice Bergen joke!
by monkeyball on Jul 31, 2007 2:39 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Injury situation should be addressed
The number of injuries the A's have had over the past few years leads me to believe that this is more than just a string of bad luck.
We all know that there have been several injuries that have been misdiagnosed and some players questioning the diagnoses of the A's medical staff.
I believe that the A's should thoroughly evaluate their medical staff and make sure we have the best people taking care of our guys. This should also include the training staff who help the players structure their workouts and tell them where they need to improve.
This should be one of our most important moves this coming off season. Of course, some of our players seem very injury prone, so I'd like to see more done as far as correcting that or doing as much as we can to keep them in good shape.
That being said, I'm disappointed in the production of Chavez and Crosby especially. I know Chavy has been hurt here and there, but his tendency to swing at pitches way out of the strike zone really makes me cringe. Same deal with Crosby. They are both free-swingers and always seem to hit into DPs or flyouts in key situations. Arrgh! It's tough to watch, when they are among the highest paid on the team.
I still have faith in Kotsay though. He's pretty aggressive at the plate and sometimes takes a hack at the first pitch. I think he can be close to a .300 hitter like he was a couple of years ago.
Our pitching should be good to go if everyone returns healthy next year. I'm not sure what to say about Harden though. He's been my favorite, so it's been hard to see him go down so many times. I'm not sure what can be done to help prevent all those muscle strains he has.
I'm looking forward to 2008 without a doubt. As for the rest of 2007, let's see what all the young guys can do and as for the regulars who are coming back from injury... let them play, so they have something good to look back on going into 2008.
I really like Buck and Swisher's attitudes. Those guys are tough, bruisers who always go all out. I know it's cliche, but these guys always seem to give it 110%. Hopefully Swish will emerge as the leader next year, because we really need a respected player who can act as our go-to guy.
I agree with the one who says we should splurge and sign a good free agent hitter. If most of the people missing in 2007 come back healthy and we add another bat, we should be good to go in 2008.
by Athletics78 on Jul 31, 2007 2:42 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Good insight...
Athletics78, you say some good things in your post. I, too, am worried about the A's medical staff. Brad Halsey who has been injured down in AAA, is (or is considering) suing the A's medical staff for misdiagnosing his arm injury. While I don't know the merits of the case, is it evidence of the problem you suspect?
I worry, too, about the constant back problems that both Chavez and Kotsay seem afflicted with. Backs are tricky things, to be sure, but they don't bode well for longevity in the majors.
Crosby does seem both brittle and unlucky. His HBP broken hand could be considered unlucky, but others may say it's because his bones are brittle. I would put the broken leg sliding into home in Baltimore on Opening Day (or was it the second game?) as more falling into the brittle category.
I think 2007 is a washout. I would consider shutting down Street for the year (and certainly Harden).
by MoragaMike on Jul 31, 2007 9:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
my dearest nico,
while i agree with most of your diary i must remind you that you and i root for a team with a GM that is almost, if not more, stubborn then the shortstop he has employed. as "jubjub" correctly pointed out several spaces to the north of the posting mr. beane usually does nothing in august. no, our esteem GM goes shopping in NOV and not in JULY when everyone wants something for nothing. i just noticed the ATL GM fleeced another unsuspecting GM out of a potential superstar. anyway, back to the a's. i predict we will watch bobby c @ SS and kots patrolling CF in '08. both have been low performers and beane would get absolutely zero for both. why not keep both (kotsay is in a contract yr is think) and hope for the best. we'ii see swisher in LF and buck in RF. i further predict that buck will be the a's allstar rep ,much like alex rios in TOR was this yr. the IF will be same as it is now but with barton at 1st. cust will likely DH.
what will be interesting is what beane will do with geren. geren signed for 2 yrs and his first has not gone well (understatement, to say the least). will beane fire geren in the fall? will he let geren manage for the full yr in '08 if the same sickening play repeats itself? will geren be gone after '08? will gerren be resigned?
finally, one last prediction- a's lose again tonight :-(
by bigelephant on Jul 31, 2007 2:48 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I tend to agree with you
Although I hope the A's don't lose tonight but the poker chips will ease the pain.
by mlleaimee on Jul 31, 2007 3:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No trade not the worst thing to happen
First if the A's don't get what they want why trade a player just to do something. If Blanton gets traded it will be at the GM meetings in Dec. BB loves to trade at that time of year. Piazza may be traded later because the A's will try to pass him through waivers.
by Arcman on Jul 31, 2007 2:54 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I. Am. Pissed. Off.
I'm not surprised that neither Stewart or Kennedy got dealt as the market for either player was miniscule, and am only mildly disappointed that Blanton didn't head to the Dodgers. (Let's be honest, that was a deal that needed time to play out and 24 hours wasn't going to cut it. Besides, I think this is still an option that can be pursued in the coming offseason.)
No, what pisses me off is that Beane did not trade Piazza. I know some have suggested that Mike could still get dealt in August after passing through waivers but I highly doubt that the market is going to be that much better for him in 2 weeks then it is now. Trading Piazza after the 15th does jack to help the A's significantly. All I can do now is hope the A's pony up some extra cash in the next few weeks, and I'm not gonna hold my breath for that to happen.
by grover on Jul 31, 2007 2:59 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I. Was. Pissed. On.
Not really, but I understand your frustration. I wonder if the A's are hoping to get compensation picks for Piazza... I don't want to wait years to get good, though, and the A's current farm system doesn't inspire me.
by JediLeroy on Jul 31, 2007 3:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
considering the trend set by Kendall, Bradley
trades, trading Piazza would do a little better than jack to help the A's pony up some extra cash by unloading his contract
... we're still on the hook for most of Bradley's, right?
by popcornjames on Jul 31, 2007 3:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
so much for "step 1"
it will probably happen though...the a's will get nothing for piazza-'07 perforamce or through a trade in august.
by bigelephant on Jul 31, 2007 3:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
just makes Phase 2 that much harder
by grover on Jul 31, 2007 4:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Remember, Piazza had to approve trade
if any was to be made.
The agreement was in place, as such.
So perhaps Mike "front loaded" any deals, so no deals were made.
by One won lost won on Jul 31, 2007 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
OK
And Piazza nixes a starting DH job in LA because...?
by grover on Jul 31, 2007 5:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Angels valued prospects over
by One won lost won on Aug 1, 2007 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Which has absolutely nothing to do
with Piazza's agreement with Beane.
Which is what you were talking about.
by grover on Aug 1, 2007 1:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
absolutely nothing??
"Absolutely" means 100%. Which isn't the case.
Why exaggerate? No money in it.
by One won lost won on Aug 1, 2007 9:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What the Hell are you talking about?
Piazza could influence where he goes, he doesn't have any power to dictate which prospects the Angels would have to send to Oakland. That is absurd.
by grover on Aug 1, 2007 9:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I always thought the rumor was that ...
... Mike "back loaded" ...
by monkeyball on Jul 31, 2007 6:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
5 things we learned today
- Joe kennedy value is 0. Nobody wants him for a few bats.
- Are the yanks plain dumb? Trading a pitcher for a DH when they don't have pitching to begin with.
- The A's are thinking of retaining Shannon Stewart next year. With him out of all trade rumors makes you wonder if they are keeping him past this year.
- Piazza wil be gone when the next contending team is desperate for a big bat.
- One of the A's starters will be traded in the offseason. Who will it be? Harden, Blanton, Gaudin or Loaiza?
by Arcman on Jul 31, 2007 3:02 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Nothing even for Kielty
We couldn't even get anything for Kielty. We just released him...WTF?
by GusanoQuemador on Jul 31, 2007 3:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good news first: Kielty is
a switch hitter with .255 career avg, injured for most of the year, hitting .200, having problem "hacking" back into a weak hitting A's lineup, and is 30 years old, probably peaked already, what do you think he should be worth?
by asfansince1989 on Jul 31, 2007 9:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He hits over .300 vs lefties
by GusanoQuemador on Aug 1, 2007 9:15 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
5. Blanton or Harden
I doubt Loaiza has value at all, and Gaudin is unproven.
by Kelly on Jul 31, 2007 3:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
re 5 things:
- absolutely, all this crazy talk lately on AAN about "JoKe's" value has been ,well, a joke. i said kennedy is maybe worth a 3rd 4th level AA player- maybe
- ya ,sure they are.
- i hope so. althougth i see swisher, kots and buck in the OF i can see beane trying to sign stew so that barton is not pressured to perform right out the box. that way swisher can stay at 1st some of the time.
- sure, likely right.
- let's hope for loza....although he is usually lights out in a contract yr.
by bigelephant on Jul 31, 2007 3:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Yanks traded a pitcher for a DH?
Did they trade for someone other than Betemit?
by rfloh on Jul 31, 2007 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hope the A's do keep Stewart.
He does have a decent batting average at least.
by IM4Oakgal on Jul 31, 2007 4:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Since we couldn't trade JoKe . . .
can't we just leave him in swaddling clothes in a safe place -- say, a fire station -- and wait for Adult Protective Services to pick him up!
NO MORE APPEARANCES AT THE COLISEUM OR ON THE ROAD!!!
by millbraeforAsfan on Jul 31, 2007 3:16 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Piazza
Keeping Piazza all this year is a problem if it prevents the A's from finding out if Jack Cust can be their DH for the next 4 years. Piazza has looked terrific lately but he's still on a pace to hit fewer than 10 home runs this year, which is not ideal for a DH so he probably won't be back with the A's next year.
by SA on Jul 31, 2007 3:30 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I believe that at this time of the year
the GM's flood the market with players on waivers, I think they have already done that so that this trading deadline is not really an accurate deadline, waived players can still be dealt, and since the A's are not concerned about getting quality major league players back but AAA or AA players trades can still occur as they should for this team.
I share the same concern as other members of AN, I want to see Cust in every day, Murphy also although I don't view him as a legitimate starter in this league, but then again no other GM saw Ellis as a major league starter, no other GM saw Cust as a major leaguer, and maybe he is not, I just think the A's should find out over the next 60 days. If Piazza isn't dealt we are not going to find out.
BB obviously thinks that Stewart will bring two draft picks next year and so will hold on to him, I doubt if there is any thought of keeping him, not with the Denofria, Snelling and Cust deals. If Barton is here next year then Swisher is going to the outfield. Too many outfielders already.
by china bob on Jul 31, 2007 3:46 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Not sure if there is a flood
While you can be sure that GMs are putting players on waivers in August, I don't think they are doing without caution. Keep in mind that if a player is put on waivers and claimed by another team, then the waiving team can then eather work out a trade or cancel the waiver. The problem is once they cancel the waiver once they can't do so again with the same player that year. So once you put a player on waivers you've accepcted that you're not going to get much for him unless you work out a trade with a team you know will claim him before you actually put him on waivers.
by GusanoQuemador on Jul 31, 2007 5:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just SS and CF?
Give me a break...
How about relief pitching? We have one of the worst bullpens I've seen in a long time...I have zero faith.
How about starting pitching? Yeah, that's right, I said it. Haren is an ace. Gaudin and Blanton are playing over their heads (what a missed opportunity in not trading Blanton when he would have fetched much more than he is worth). Braden ain't ready. Dinardo is a question mark, who knows if he is a fluke or the real thing.
And if I hear one other person mention Harden as if he is worth ANYTHING to this team, I'm just going to lose it. Harden will never - I repeat - never be a contributor. His body is not built for it. He can't pitch.
How about ONE GOOD, CONSISTENT HITTER?
Forget it, this is too painful. The bottom line is we need a lot of help. We aren't two moves away from second place in the West, let alone contending.
by ClutchSteinbach on Jul 31, 2007 4:08 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
just focus on happy thoughts
visualize the angels fading and the mariners beating the red sox in the postseason. any a's fan should enjoy that.
by notah8er on Jul 31, 2007 4:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
My brain wants the Mariners to win
because they're run by idiots, hopefully inducing more teams to act idiotically.
But my gut wants the Red Sox to win, because their wins more or less validate the A's/sabermetric philosophy.
F it, I'm rooting for Cleveland.
by PaulThomas on Jul 31, 2007 5:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Why do you need validation?
You know the sabermetric meathod is sound...who cares what other people think?
by GusanoQuemador on Jul 31, 2007 5:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
More than anything else,
just to shut up the annoying media pundits.
It's the same reason I was pulling hard for Manning to win the Super Bowl last year-- just so I'd never have to see another stupid "he can't win the big one" story about him again.
by PaulThomas on Jul 31, 2007 5:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think
Beane has a sabermetric philosophy at all. His philosophy is to get whatever is undervalued at the time. If he had a sabermetric philosophy how do you explain the lack of OPS on this team?
Even Boston doesn't use a complete sabermetric philosophy, which is only sound offensively. Sabermetrics don't value a closer at all, if I understand things correctly, yet Boston has one of the best in the business - taking him out of the rotation as well. In fact, the one year they followed James was a disaster in the pen.
by IndianaAsfan on Jul 31, 2007 6:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
good point
problem with that approach is that good players are not often undervalued, you have to assume that there are going to be other GM's as smart as BB is, and worse yet, great players are almost never undervalued, when they have a bad year, everyone knows it's an aberration.
The only likely outcome of bargain bin shopping is we get average players for cheap, and gamble on injury risks. We need a lot of luck to make these kind of moves work out, and we might've spent all of our luck on big Frank.
by asfansince1989 on Jul 31, 2007 9:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No kidding.
But to be fair, Harden is worth something to some other team who can and will figure out his mechanics problem. It's obvious that he's overstressing 1800 different body parts with his delivery and there has to be a trainer / pitching coach that can harness his talents for their use. The A's obivously can't.
by NicksDreamy on Jul 31, 2007 5:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i still think we need a big nats trade
we need their infield
by notah8er on Jul 31, 2007 4:24 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Phil reacts to the A's trading deadline non-moves
by LawDaddy on Jul 31, 2007 5:19 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I read the reference to Candice Bergen
Just to complete the cycle let me mention Mortimer Snerd.
by ak_A on Jul 31, 2007 5:47 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Rowand TERRIBLE Idea
Rowand at 10-12 mil/year for 4-5 yrs? Are you freaking crazy? Has Seattle's Ichiro contract really done this to the market?
The two years he hit over .300 (this year and 2004) he was EXTREMELY lucky: BABIP of .341 in '04 and .362 this year. When his BABIP was much more normal around .300 in '05 and '06 he hit .270 and .262 in those two years.
Rowand has a career 3:1 k:bb ratio. That's a pretty poor ratio to be throwing 10-12 mil at. His strikeout rate is usually over 15% vs. walk rate of 5%. That's a pretty poor batting eye.
Plus he's played in two hitter friendly parks - CHW and PHI. Oakland is a pitcher's park. He's a career .218 hitter in Oakland with a .573 ops in 55 at bats (granted some of that is b/c we've had a really good pitching staff over the last six years).
Bottom line: it's not a good idea to throw 10-12 mil for 4-5 yrs at a 29 year old with a career .280 avg and .800 flat ops. He would probably avg 15-20 jacks and 70 rbi's and .260-270 avg with us if he successfully made the league switch and adjusted back to AL pitching. That is the best case scenario.
by johnjahafanclub on Jul 31, 2007 5:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Rowand = Kotsay
maybe a little more power but a 270 hitter with a 350 oba and plays good D. the slight upgrade is not worth the money.
by Arcman on Jul 31, 2007 6:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Keep Kotsay
he'll bounce back. Back surgery is a big deal, and often players will take > 1 year to recover. Look how long it took Dye to recover from the broken leg in 2001.
by asfansince1989 on Jul 31, 2007 9:58 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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