How The A's Make Hitting More Difficult Than It Needs To Be
by Nico on Jul 20, 2007 8:59 AM PDT
in News
52 comments
Don’t get me wrong, hitting is one of the single most difficult skills of any aspect of any sport. This post is not about how easy hitting is, because it isn’t. This post is about how the few athletes who have the skills to hit major league pitching can make hitting easier, or more difficult, for themselves. If the A’s hitters—a lineup not blessed with enormous hitting talent by major league standards—would just follow some basic principles, they would instantly hit better.
“zone hit” with less than 2 strikes
The A’s should never take a first pitch fastball down the middle, as Kendall often did, as Crosby often does, as even Dan Johnson is apt to do, because that should be the one pitch they are sitting on. Far from being able to get ahead with a quick strike, pitchers should be forced to throw to the corners, and to throw off speed pitches, which will create more hitters’ counts—at which point the hitters can still look for a pitch and/or a location, forcing pitchers away from the middle of the plate and away from their best pitch. It’s a nice vicious-cycle if you’re the hitter, and it comes from looking for a pitch and/or a location and being prepared to mash as soon as you get it.
The A’s hitters appear to have an idea, before they step into the batter’s box, of how they expect the at-bat to go. Crosby does not intend to hit the first pitch (or sometimes he suddenly does, no matter what or where the pitch is), or Swisher is looking “to get into a hitter’s count”. As a hitter you should have no idea whether or not you’ll swing at the first pitch, or whether you’ll swing early or late in the count, because that should be dictated by the pitcher. You’ll swing at the first mistake, or the first pitch you see that is in the “happy zone” you have established on your terms. Hitters tend to hit this way when the count is 3-1. They should also hit this way when the count is 0-0, 1-0, 0-1, 1-1, 2-0, and 2-1. Wouldn’t it be great, as a hitter, if the count was always 3-1? Well until you have two strikes, it can be.
“Hit the ball hard where it’s pitched”
The easiest kind of hitter to pitch to is a pull hitter and the hardest kind of hitter to pitch to is the guy who hits to all fields—because these hitters can hit “pitcher’s pitches,” not just mistakes. I think trying to pull the ball gets more hitters into trouble than any other tendency. Again, let the pitcher dictate where you hit it and just focus on driving the ball with authority. If you can line or drive the ball to left, center, or right, you force the defense to spread out and you take away both sides of the plate from the pitcher.
This means that as a hitter, you need to let the movement of a pitch work for you, not against you. Pitches that are tailing or breaking away from you should be driven the other way; pitches moving towards you, and off speed pitches out over the plate, will naturally be pulled. With this approach, you no longer need to be out in front because you no longer need to gear up your swing early. Let the pitch dictate where you will hit the ball, and just focus on driving the ball hard with a solid swing. You have now become difficult to pitch to and difficult to defend.
As simple as these two basic principles sound, they are generally not followed by Crosby or Chavez, usually not followed by Johnson or Swisher, and for long stretches neglected by Cust and even Ellis. “Zone hitters” who just look to drive the ball hard where it’s pitched are very difficult to pitch to and very difficult to defend. The A’s are neither, and that’s why they get the least out of what is already a disadvantaged lineup.
On my team, the rule would be simple: To earn playing time tomorrow, your at-bats today just need to reflect an effort to follow these two basic principles. There is a lot of love in “tough love,” and hitters who think they love to work the count and pull the ball actually love hitting closer to .300 than .200.
The A’s hitters are welcome to use these ground-breaking ideas anytime, including tonight, at 7:05pm, against Erik Bedard...
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Sometimes the simple
things are the hardest to implement. If it's possible to have more than 100% agreement, Nico, you've got it from me. From a former hitting coach, thank you.
That being said, I'm not sure I'd do anything to change Cust, other than to remind him he's a fastball hitter. I don't think he'll ever be a hitter with a decent average, and if he'll just look fastballs in his zone with less than two strikes I think he'd cut down on his strikeouts.
by IndianaAsfan on Jul 20, 2007 8:57 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I agree, but even Cust
follows these principles in his "high HR/high K" way. When he's hot, where do you start to see his HRs? Left-center field.
I still think that if Chavez just followed these principles--especially the second one--he could hit .280 with power against LHP. Cust, when he's on, is a good example of why.
by Nico on Jul 20, 2007 9:14 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
One thing to note, Nico:
The A's have an organizational philosophy when it comes to the first pitch of an at bat, and it's taught up and down the system as something.. Every. Player. Must. Do.
If you're a pitcher, your first pitch should be a strike.
If you're a hitter, your first pitch should be watched. So too should your second and third and so on, until there's a strike on the board.
Now, we can argue whether or not this is a wise philosophy, especially when other teams know it's happening and adjust acccordingly (any pitcher who isn't throwing a first pitch strike at our guys is not paying attention), but this is the game plan that every A's hitting coach of the last ten years has been told to employ, up and down the minor league system as well, so we can't really accuse them of doing anything but what they're told.
by Ozzz on Jul 20, 2007 4:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe we need baby steps
In this day and age, I'm sure our scouting department is all over opposing starting pitcher's recent trends and control abilities. If we're going up against a tier-1, low BB/9 pitcher, be ready to go first pitch swinging if it's in the right spot. If we're going up against a 3rd or 4th, be ready to take some pitches and wait for 'the pitch'. Against a Santana, it makes little sense to dig yourself an 0-1 hole if you know he's not going to walk a lot of batters.
Like you said, any opposing scouting department worth a pile of Beane knows that we're very likely to take the first pitch. Our scouting department needs to know when it's time to mix it up a bit to keep them honest.
by Rickeyfan on Jul 20, 2007 6:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
With Bedard on the mound,
I might be satisfied just to see the guys make contact. It could be an ugly nght for some of our hitters.
Nice piece, Nico.
by TurnTwo on Jul 20, 2007 9:07 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Thanks, both--
Interestingly, Bedard has never beaten the A's (6 starts). Remember when he retired the first 9 in Baltimore, but then we knocked him out in the middle innings? Tons of line drives the other way. Hint, hint...
by Nico on Jul 20, 2007 9:11 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He has pretty bad
numbers vs. the A's for his career (and this year) so hopefully that will continue.
by mikeA on Jul 20, 2007 9:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hopefully.
I guess I just had that recent 15-K performance aganst Texas on the mind.
by TurnTwo on Jul 20, 2007 9:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yup, dead on Nico ...
the sad part? This is stuff you learn when you're 6. The thing that has consistently made me angry about the team is the failure to change things up -- make adjustments -- at the plate.
Different day, same tired approach, same result. Failure. Chavez and Crosby are certainly the most guilty, but not alone on this. When Chavez concentrates and makes an effort to "go the other way," he's a much better hitter ... like probably 20-30 points higher on his average better.
But he simply refuses to do it ... this is when I get upset and scream about a "lack of effort!"
There are guys on the team -- whether we want to admit it or not -- who know they would be better if they did things differently, but because of some unknown reason ("this is the way I've always done it," just plain old stubborness,) they refuse to change.
by Vacafan on Jul 20, 2007 9:31 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
my suspicion on Chavez ...
... is that the PAs where he looks like he gave up before even walking into the on-deck circle, he's in so much back/arm pain that it's all he can do to stand up at the plate. Any swing he takes is predicated on minimizing the torsion pain, not on trying to hit the ball most efficaciously.
by monkeyball on Jul 20, 2007 1:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
chavez has displayed
power to left and willingness to go there throughout his career. crosby, not so much. i think he's actually screwed himself up further by trying to hit it the other way. he should just look to pull the ball, if he's gonna hit 240 hit might as well do it with 175 ks and 20+ hrs.
by Backspin on Jul 20, 2007 2:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I am by no means an authority on hitting...
but I have often wondered the about some of the same points. The A's are known as a patient team, one who works the count almost as if walking is the goal. It's well known that obp is a premium stat for a would be Athletic. This little fact cannot possibly be unknown to opposing teams. So perhaps they make an adjustment when facing the A's. Throw one down the middle for strike one on the first pitch. Then next a breaking pitch on the corner for strike two...looking or swinging. Now the hitter is 0 and 2 and playing the pitchers game.
I don't think the A's should completely alter their style, but they are going to have to adjust. Sometimes that first pitch is the best one you are going to see. They need to put the ball in play to keep the opposing pitcher honest. You have to force your opponent to play your game. Sometimes that means you have to beat him at his on occasion.
by alox on Jul 20, 2007 9:37 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Let's Hope our Hitting Coach
is preaching these same words of wisdom to our guys. If not, he should be fired. If so and our guys can't execute then we are destined to live through the pain of this offense until we get new blood on board.
I am suspect about this weekend's pitching machups. Even though we have Blanton and Haren going this weekend I only see us winning one game. We scored six against Texas but remember we only got six hits.
Unfortunately, with our current collective offense we have to rely on the other teams' mistakes to score.
by EastbayBen on Jul 20, 2007 9:42 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I think your sentiment is exactly the problem
There are too many people clamoring for firing the hitting coach here on AN. That's exactly the problem the A's have had 3 different hitting coaches the last 3 years, you can't build any consistency or even instill your beliefs as a hitting coach in one year. If we gave any of the hitting coaches more than one year we might start to see more adjustments from the players as they grow to trust the coach and have success with long-term study from one coach.
On that note, I have seen more adjustments from A's players as a team than in any year past. If anyone is paying attention when some of the young hitters step in the box (Buck, Swisher, and a few others I am blanking on), Ty VanBurkleo has given them all a similar approach. They all line up the bat on the ground to the outside corner of the plate and lay it diagonally to their back foot this allows them to know exactly where the outside corner is every time and have more effective at-bats. You'll notice Crosby is not someone who has taken to this approach and as a result has no idea where the strike zone resides low and away.
The solution to fixing bad hitting in this case, as oxymoronic as it sounds, is KEEPING the hitting coach.
by marco magic on Jul 20, 2007 10:23 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
great observation
by rebus on Jul 20, 2007 11:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
that has nothing to do with Van Burkleo
Swisher has been lying his bat on the ground to position himself since he was in little league. I wish the hitting coach deserved some credit for this, but it seems the basic problem with A's hitting coaches over the last three years has been a complete inability to connect with A's hitters, especially Crosby, Chavez. If the Mets can entertain the notion of Rickey as hitting coach, why can't the A's consider getting someone with instant player credibility that can maybe reach these guys. I mean, no offense, but who the hell is Ty Vanburkleo?
by Papago on Jul 20, 2007 2:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have confidence in the hitting
coaches but not confidence in the hitters listening to the hitting coaches.
by china bob on Jul 20, 2007 4:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Art of Hitting .300
Ted Williams book had a graphic with the strike zone showing which pitches an individual hitter would have most success with. In other words a very disciplined approach to #1.
When Chavez hit a HR last Sunday it was on 3-1 count and the TV camera showed the Twins catcher put 1 finger down. I immediateley thought he should get a pitch he can do something with -- fastball in a hitters count. Chavez hit the pitch like he got exactly what he was looking for.
by NoeValley on Jul 20, 2007 9:51 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Confidence is key...
We need the Tommy Lasorda of hitting coaches to blow some serious smoke up these peoples' asses and get them confident again.
Confident hitters are better hitters, and the luck starts falling their way, too.
by The Pilots Dared Me To Die on Jul 20, 2007 3:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Does anyone know...
where I might find "hit zone" graphics for each player? Such as where in the strike zone a player gets what percentage of his hits, not where do the hits go on the field.
by Poppy on Jul 20, 2007 10:17 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
fox sports does this:
by rebus on Jul 20, 2007 11:16 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Chavez has a hot zone??
In all seriousness, his chart is a little odd. I would not have guessed that away was a good spot for him. I hear announcers all the time say "Down and in is a lefty's hot spot or wheelhouse," (I have no idea why they all say that. I speculate it's because they are idiots.) but that definitely is not true about Chavy.
by RayRay59 on Jul 20, 2007 11:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Chavez isn't a "classic" lefty
That "pretty" "classic lefthanded" swing -- like hitting a 2-wood -- has never been part of Chavez' mechanics. He's got more of a "typical right-hander's" short swing (a la Bonds, though without the consistency/discipline). When Chavez' swing does get long, it's on those pitches low and away.
by monkeyball on Jul 20, 2007 1:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks, rebus!
by Poppy on Jul 20, 2007 12:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
seems that these points
were also stressed by Geren and Van Burkleo in their spring training interviews. If I'm not completely memory-impaired, I think they were also stressed by Macha and the various other batting coaches in spring trainings past.
by OaklandSi on Jul 20, 2007 11:16 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I guess they bark about these points to the team
but they don't bite 'em when they are not followed.
by ohtobe21likehuston on Jul 20, 2007 11:25 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I believe zone-hitting is the key
with this team and I am also tired of watching a fastball go down the middle for 0-1. It's understandable with the guys who were brought up through the A's minor league system because of the OBP requirements for promotion. Kendall was the worst at it but I truly believe he was adopting what he "thought" was an A's philosophy.
I certainly remember how great of a hitter Chavy was when he went opposite field earlier in his career. It would seem less stressful on his body to use that approach more often and his slower bat speed should benefit from that approach too. I am not in the mood to talk about Bobby Crosby today. We all know about his glaring inefficiencies and 0-2 counts.
Great diary, Nico! I sure hope we hit the ball tonight.
by ohtobe21likehuston on Jul 20, 2007 11:23 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Another simple hitting technique
Is using the lightest bat that you can.I saw where
Crosby on Wednesday said in an article by Tim Kawakami in the San Jose Mercury that he used one of
Scutaro's light bats to hit the homerun. On the
highlights, it looked like he had much more bat
speed than he usually does.
According to the article, Crosby credited the bat
with the result, "For some reason,"
he said ruefully, he decided this season to use a bigger bat and never felt quick with it."
Great, so he wasted 4 months. Crosby also needs to
stand closer to the plate, but the lighter bat will
make his long swing quicker.
I was a pretty good hitter in high school using a
light bat, being that I was smaller than most guys.
When I coached little league, one of my pet peeves is
that the kids would generally pick a bat that was
too big, to prove how macho they were.
I would make the kids that weren't hitting well switch to a lighter bat, and move the heavy bats off the bat rack.
by SanJoseRon on Jul 20, 2007 11:37 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I think the formula is F=m*vsquared
So if the mass of the bat is slowing down its speed much at all, then the bigger bat loses you power in a hurry.
Just ask Corky Sosa, en espagnol, por favor.
Generally, I don't think we adjust adequately in this "game of adjustments." Moneyball's devotion to statistics shouldn't devolve into a slavish predictability on which the other team can rely. I thought Geren crossed-up the norms to very good effects early in the season, but we seem to have reverted to form. Hitting as Nico recommends is a much more dynamic approach, which could keep the opposition off-guard, without sacrificing allegiance to pitch count.
by The Dogfather on Jul 20, 2007 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i am
an advocate of using as heavy a bat as you can still swing without suffering a serious loss of bat speed. the heavier bat will impart more force to the ball than the lighter bat unless the lighter bat is moving significantly faster than the heavier bat. and heavier bat also maintains moment and momentum through the ball better also.
of course, i mainly play slow pitch softball these days, but i can't even believe how many guys are hitting warning track shots with 26 oz bats that would be hrs with 28s or 30s.
by Backspin on Jul 20, 2007 2:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
A little over-simplified?
Your observation that Cust takes this approach most of the time, but not all the time, perfectly illustrates just how difficult it is to do what you are proposing.
I think it's safe to say Cust lives by your motto, yet even he can not execute it perfectly every time.
I just think it's a little less than honest to act like this is the solution to the A's problems.
The fact of the matter is the A's have quite a few players without the necessary skills to be plus major league hitters.
by FreeSanJose on Jul 20, 2007 11:58 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I admit it. I'm lying.
(What the heck does I just think it's a little less than honest to act like this is the solution to the A's problems even mean?)
Most aspects of hitting are more difficult than applying the two principles set forth in today's post. That's what's frustrating. Your mechanics, your timing, your "seeing" of pitches will come and go; only these principles have a chance to remain constant--through intelligence and discpline.
by Nico on Jul 20, 2007 12:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
that you're over-simplifying the problem
And that this is surely stuff the A's coaches, and most of the players, already realize. It's actually executing it that is the difference between Adam Dunn and Richie Sexson or Bobby Crosby and Jack Cust on a smaller scale.
My point is, you're kind of stating the obvious.
by FreeSanJose on Jul 20, 2007 2:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
(tries to find sports blog site
where nothing is obvious...its all brand freaking new!)
by ak_A on Jul 20, 2007 2:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
A's cant catch a break
In his last 2 starts he has allowed 5 hits and 0 runs in 16 IP with 22K's.
He was scheduled to pitch Wednesday in Seattle but woke up with a stiff neck and was pushed back a day. The O's had yesterday off so instead of missing him altogether, the A's get him in game 1 of the series.
by cvdoug on Jul 20, 2007 12:32 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
While the Angels miss Johan...again
Speaking of the Twins, they sweep the A's in the Dome only to be swept there by Detroit. Maybe the Tigers are just a better team than Oakland...NO, I WON'T believe it, NO!
by Nico on Jul 20, 2007 1:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
but, umm...
the Tigers are a better team than the A's this year. So are the Twins, Indians, Red Sox, Angels, Mariners, Brewers, Cubs, Mets, Braves, Dodgers, Padres, and Diamondbacks.
That's just this year, though. Things change quickly.
by The Pilots Dared Me To Die on Jul 20, 2007 3:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mets
You could take the title and replace it with the Mets very easily (with the exception of last night)...
by JMEnglish on Jul 20, 2007 1:13 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
(goes in to talk to boss
about flying nico up for some "pointers-advice, etc.)
by ak_A on Jul 20, 2007 1:38 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
A flyspeck, I think.
...and hitters who think they love to work the count and pull the ball actually love hitting closer to .300 than .200.
Shouldn't those numbers be reversed?
by The Dogfather on Jul 20, 2007 1:46 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
You mean to .003 and .002?
On the A's, probably yes.
by Nico on Jul 20, 2007 1:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Shit. Okay let me try that again.
"transposed"
by The Dogfather on Jul 20, 2007 1:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would THINK hitters would
love hitting closer to .300 than .200, but maybe Crosby's favorite number is 200. It's not his "lucky number," that's for sure.
by Nico on Jul 20, 2007 2:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think that YOU think ...
... that batters who pull and work-the-count think they are doing so in service to hitting .300, but (now, stay with me here) they are, in reality, working on hitting .200, for all the reasons you cite.
In contrast, I think you think that batters who "zone hit," and "hit 'em where they is" are much more likely to hit .300 than if they don't do those things.
Ergo hock, skrockter hock,
"...hitters who think they love to work the count and pull the ball actually love hitting closer to .200 than .300."
/spits
/adjusts uniform
/swings away
by The Dogfather on Jul 20, 2007 2:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
spits...
adjusts uniform... crouches real low like Rickey Henderson and tries to draw the walk...
by The Pilots Dared Me To Die on Jul 20, 2007 3:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who cares about average
if you are a big power hitter like Crosby?
by china bob on Jul 20, 2007 4:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sometimes I think Manny Ramirez...
...has it figured out...
ME SEE BALL... ME HIT BALL!
(semi-tongue-in-cheek)
by UncleLeo on Jul 20, 2007 4:20 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
i hope it is as simple as that
DJ certainly takes a lot of pitches and so does Swisher at times. so certainly they can learn to zone in and use the whole field better.
but i dont think it applies to the struggling 'veterans' like Kotsay (who is both a zone hitter and uses the whole field but just not very well) and Chavvy (who continues to be an enigma with his never-ending list of injuries). and Crosby needs to be more selective and work on his swing which is a complete mess at this point -- pitchers are just not giving him anything to hit that's down the middle and even if they do he just fouls it off straight back instead of getting a good swing on it.
by oak1 on Jul 20, 2007 5:35 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
maybe
piazza will help the offense. off the DL today.
can't hurt.
by cvdoug on Jul 20, 2007 6:30 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Dan Meyer no hitter through 5 for Sac.
by athleticsBB4life on Jul 20, 2007 8:31 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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