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WhiteSox GM lashes out at Thomas

Here's the meat and potatoes:  

"We don't miss him, by the way," Williams said. "If you go out there and ask any one of my players or staff members, we don't miss him.

"We don't miss his attitude. We don't miss the whining. We don't miss it. Good riddance. See you later," he said.

What did we get ourselves into? Is there something to this?  I remember hearing some stuff about Thomas being a bad clubhouse guy in the past, but in the last few years I haven't heard anything.  Is he the real cancer, not Bradley?  Are they both?  I'm worried about the team chemistry here.  Anyone else?

Here's the story in question:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2345972

0 recs  |  Comment 77 comments

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Also...
This is the article that showed up in a Chicago newspaper that has Kenny so pissed off. After reading what Thomas said I can't help but feel Kenny is over reacting.

http://www.dailysouthtown.com/southtown/dssports/pro/261sd1.htm

It's a pretty interesting read, I recommend it.

by FireballerHARDEN on Feb 26, 2006 4:01 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Wow
I just read it. I can't believe that a GM would sound so unprofessional. I just can't picture Beane or Epstein or Cashman throwing such a tantrum.

by TurnTwo on Feb 26, 2006 4:03 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

But...
Beane has been known to throw chairs.
"Damn kids" -Ron Flores

by secret ASian man on Feb 27, 2006 11:53 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Sounds like a bitter divorce
Don't listen to either side. Just dream about ponies.
Why yes. I am a ray of Fucking sunshine.

by grover on Feb 26, 2006 4:18 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Think about your own relationships,
though. Remember the girl/guy you broke up with and talked that way about? You were fine with your new romance even while you were telling anyone who would listen what a &%$ing #&@!* of a @(*$# your ex was.

That's not just me, right?

by Nico on Feb 26, 2006 4:20 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

It wasn't just you.
I talked about you that way, too.  Can we still be friends?
Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Feb 26, 2006 4:21 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

LOL!!!
<sigh>
Why yes. I am a ray of Fucking sunshine.

by grover on Feb 26, 2006 4:35 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Ahhh yes,
I remember that girl from high school...b$#@ch.  To top it off, she later married a doctor.  But on the bright side, she put on 80 pounds.  Several years ago I use to send her an anonymouse box of chocolates on her birthday......ah yes, it's the bitter vengeful things in life that make it worth living.
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer

by alox on Feb 26, 2006 5:33 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Kenny Williams, Ozzie Guillen, and Frank Thomas...
...all three are full of shit here.

Something I noticed while reading their recent quotes is that each one thinks that he's taking the high road.

This quote from Guillen is ridiculous:

Manager Ozzie Guillen, a former teammate of Thomas', didn't want to get involved.

"I won't put my nose in something above me," Guillen said. "He never mentioned my name and if you don't mention my name, I try to stay away from every part of the conversation."

Do I need to dig up what he said about Frank Thomas the moment he was hired as manager?

Here's what Williams actually said:

"He's an idiot," Williams said in a 6 1/2-minute, profanity-laced interview. "He's selfish. That's why we don't miss him. And we've held it in for far too long. And if you go out there and look long and hard enough, you'll find particulars. But I've got something to say directly to him. And I'm holding back as much as I can because, unlike him, I'll say it man-to-man, face-to-face."
(emphasis mine)
Thhat's "holding back"? Once again, there's been bad blood there for a long time. Williams has done his fair share of taking dirty laundry to the media.

And how long is Thomas going keep referencing how the White Sox organization has slighted him? Taken from fireballHARDEN's link above:

But I've held the high road. I've always held my chin high and was the bigger man in a lot of situations over there.
Stop giving yourself kudos for acting like the "bigger man" in the past when you're certainly not doing it now.
I don't want the people in Chicago to think I'm bitter and I'm angry, because I'm not. I'm really not. I'm really happy and I'm relishing this opportunity.
He may not be angry, but it's difficult to pretend that he's not bitter when he's still talking about this.

There's a lot of blame to be shared by all three men. This is very pathetic.

"Any shots that I'll be callin' will be to the bartender!" -- Band Camp

by Sharon on Feb 26, 2006 4:21 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Great post
Am I bitter that it wasn't ME who wrote it?  No, I'm not bitter.  I've written lots of great comments, none of which have gotten the recognition they deserved ... but that's in the past.  I'm not going to complain about it now--I'm a team player, just like always, and I'm going to keep on not complaining and not complaining and not complaining about how I don't get enough props for being the team player that I am.  

by rubin sierra on Feb 26, 2006 6:16 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

You're a
selfish idiot.  We don't miss your posts.  You better stay out of  AN business.

by eamb on Feb 26, 2006 8:22 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Jeepers is staying out of this one
I won't put my nose in something above me.  Rubin Sierra never mentioned my name and if you don't mention my name, I try to stay away from every part of the conversation.
A Beane in the hand is worth $60M in payroll

by jeepers on Feb 27, 2006 4:18 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

exactly
If you say you're "moving forward" and "dealing with something like a man"... well, then effin' MOVE FORWARD AND DEAL WITH IT LIKE A MAN! I don't think Thomas will be a sure cancer in the clubhouse any more than I think Bradley will be, but he does need to shut the hell up and get over the fact that his feelings were hurt by no one calling him after he'd given 16 years of high-quality service. Yeah, if true, that really sucks... but get over it.
I've seen the error of my ways... MaElLuvR

by Poppy on Feb 26, 2006 10:15 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Feh.
He might be still talking about it because he's being asked about it. I would think in such a situation, saying 'no comment' would be news in itself and seen as him 'holding a grudge'.

Williams does this crap all the time. Anyone remember what he said about Billy Beane not long ago? The guy is an A-grade asshole, but that seems to be the requirements for employment at the White Sox front office.

by Ozzz on Feb 27, 2006 10:20 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

not just the white sox front office
hey, this is a team where pierzynski fits in!
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Feb 27, 2006 10:28 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I think it's pretty obvious
that Thomas is more than willing to complain to the media. It wasn't just one question in a sea of quesitons that he answered. He agreed to the interview with Phil Arvia. When he's sitting down at that picnic table with Arvia, he knows exactly what he's agreed to.

This is the third time he's spoken out against the White Sox about the split. The first was when he was released. The second was during the pc after he signed with the A's. I can understand being questioned and wanting to answer honestly. So I'll forget about those two. But now, he's stretching the limits of just being honest. It's coming off as whining, and I think that it's disrespectful.

I agree that KW loks like an ass, but that doesn't absolve Thomas of blame. Both are acting like children.

"Any shots that I'll be callin' will be to the bartender!" -- Band Camp

by Sharon on Feb 27, 2006 10:40 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Headline tomorrow:
"Sharon Admits She Hates Children"
"Keep the juices going by jangling around gently as you move." - Satchel Paige

by McFood on Feb 27, 2006 5:08 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Chicken Jennifer?
Damn! Street is so imposing, he even causes the earth itself to freeze in fear! - monkeyball

by Jjjsixsix on Feb 27, 2006 6:19 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Here's your SouthSideSox take, if you care.
(link)

Though I must agree with Sharon in that this is extremely pathetic, and I'm going to agree with The Cheat as well, that this is only going to get uglier.

Kind of sad. It's almost the height thread with grown men in the public eye. Not quite, but close.

Damn! Street is so imposing, he even causes the earth itself to freeze in fear! - monkeyball

by Jjjsixsix on Feb 26, 2006 4:26 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

They both look terrible
Certainly when I read Kenny's comments, I couldn't believe that he actually said those things out loud to the media. However, I can't fault him for his sentiment. Granted, he's definitely over-stepping his boundaries by calling Thomas an "idiot." But I agree with his main point: why are you running to the media to bad-mouth your former employers? If you need motivation, use it for yourself. Don't complain to the press, because that looks like whining.

Don't get me wrong, I'm thrilled to have Frank Thomas and I hope he makes the White Sox look dumb. However, I don't think they'll miss him, and I think Williams is right. They did it without him essentially, and they're fine without him. They've moved on and he's an A now, so he really should just leave it at that.

He's a risk for us, a risk that we perhaps needed to take. They didn't need to take that risk. He looks equally bad in my eyes to be complaining about how they treated him, because it's still very possible that he won't be a huge impact player again (though I hope like heck that's not true).

by nycfan on Feb 26, 2006 4:27 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Instead of the current pissing match...
...it sure would be nice if Frank decided to show Kenny Williams what the Sox are missing in 2006 with...oh, say....400 ABs and 42 HRs.

by Mission1929 on Feb 26, 2006 4:41 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

sure everyone looks terrible
but players say stupid things all the time, managers are supposed to be above that for the most part, which Guillen never does.  
and GMs, i've never heard a GM talk like that to the media before.

hopefully comments like this just motivates Thomas...

"Play two or three games in a row first before you start popping off."

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Feb 26, 2006 4:45 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I've heard a GM talk like that to the media before
His name is Kenny Williams. :)
"Any shots that I'll be callin' will be to the bartender!" -- Band Camp

by Sharon on Feb 26, 2006 4:51 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Surely you're not badmouthing
Kenny William, who was maligned for years but is now a genius after having won the world series.
Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Feb 26, 2006 5:33 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

a good sign?
Kenny, Stanford guys aren't supposed to talk like that ...

from the Thomas i-view, let's hope for a repeat...

Arvia: This I do know about you. Every time you've been (ticked) off about something, felt slighted about something, you've had a monster year because of it. Not making an All-Star Game, not making the Olympic team ...

Thomas: I've always been a highly emotional ballplayer. I care about playing. Yeah, it's OK to turn up the heat. It shows you when players are really locked in. Turn that heat up on them.

by vk on Feb 26, 2006 5:41 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

absolutely
if there's anything that A's fans can take away from this, it's that Frank, without a doubt, plays better when he's properly motivated.

And if Frank is motivated, it almost invariably means he perceives he's been slighted by the media, the fans, the front office, etc..

by The Cheat on Feb 26, 2006 5:53 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

What's great about Kenny Williams' comments...
...is that they come just one week after he said that the White Sox are working to become a classy organization.
"Any shots that I'll be callin' will be to the bartender!" -- Band Camp

by Sharon on Feb 26, 2006 5:52 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Just wanted to weigh in...
The interview that Frank gave to Phil Arvia was terribly one sided, and that's what prompted the response (more on that later). Anyone with knowledge of the situation can poke holes in almost every one of Frank's responses.

It seems that the genesis of his anger is that he received only one phone call, a voice-mail really, to inform him that he wouldn't be back with the Sox. -- Now you have to know Frank's relationship with the Sox to understand why even that solitary phone call was overkill. -- In 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, and so on, Frank would walk out the door on October 1st and not answer a single phone call, message, media inquiry, anything, until he showed up his usual week late to spring training. He would then complain about 'not wanting to be bothered.' The fact is, if the Sox had come to him every step of the way and told him his current situation with the team, he would have found something else to spout off about. Or he would have still spouted off about the way they handled it.

Frank somehow isn't able to grasp that this isn't about his ability to hit a baseball. It's about minimizing risk, and optimizing the Sox line-up not just for 2006, but for 2007 and beyond. It's really hard to think about multiple years down the line while including a guy who has his 3rd foot injury in 3 years, weighs as much as Frank does, and has only had 345 ABs in the last two years.

My favorite comment from Frank was about Carl Everett and how Everett wasn't brought in as insurance on Frank's foot, but that Kenny had brought in "too many good players."

Now onto Kenny's response. Should he have responded like he did? Absolutely not. But that's the way we handle things on the southside. We fire back with the truth and add a little venom.

Any player who wins a World Series, thanks in large part to the foresight of a GM to acquire 'too many guys', then complains about 'too many guys,' is quite obviously thinking of only himself. Everything Williams spoke was the truth. I just wish he could have done it without resorting to name calling.

All that being said, and with Frank due to fire back at the Sox in t-minus 24 hours, I'll still be at USCF along with 38K of my closest friends on May 22nd to give Frank a huge standing ovation in his return to the southside. That is if Frank is healthy enough to step into the batter's box.

by The Cheat on Feb 26, 2006 5:50 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Good post
I'm glad that sox fans aren't soured on Thomas over this whole bitter breakup.  I could care less about this feud on whos right or wrong, but it would be bad if this affected the way the fans look at the big hurt.

Also BTW cheat, I enjoy your insight and posts as you are always brutally honest and genuinely unbiased.

Bill Stoneman is about to be offered three seasons of a right-handed version of Vladimir Guerrero - Rev Halofan

by pickinmachine on Feb 26, 2006 6:23 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

ugh
All that being said, and with Frank due to fire back at the Sox in t-minus 24 hours...

It would be nice if everyone could keep their mouths shut. I think both men are acting childish. And it bothers me that this drama is going to continue.

"Any shots that I'll be callin' will be to the bartender!" -- Band Camp

by Sharon on Feb 26, 2006 6:06 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

oops...this was in response to The Cheat.
"Any shots that I'll be callin' will be to the bartender!" -- Band Camp

by Sharon on Feb 26, 2006 6:06 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Don't worry folks,
I have reported all three men for their CGVs. Granted, we're now looking for a DH, but at least the White Sox have no manager and no General Manager. Wait, that improved them? Codswallop.

by Nico on Feb 26, 2006 6:14 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

<throws chair>
"Any shots that I'll be callin' will be to the bartender!" -- Band Camp

by Sharon on Feb 26, 2006 6:17 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Classless
Just like his manager, Ozzie Guillen, Williams displays an attitude not befitting of a GM in Major League Baseball. Guillen's always spewing garbage like this. He even said something similar when Thomas was still on the team!

I can't imagine Beane or Macha saying crap like this publicly. Unprofessional.

I guess when you win, you can be a jackass publicly but this kind of thing always comes back to you when you're down ...

by Crosbino on Feb 26, 2006 6:30 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

See: RED SOX
Lou Brock was a great base stealer, but today, I am the greatest! - Rickey Henderson

by haren4prez on Feb 27, 2006 12:38 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Beane said some pretty nasty things about T-Long
Before he shipped him to San Diego, and this type of bickering certainly has a lot of precedent. To me it's surprising that it doesn't happen more often. For example, Jeff Bagwell has supported the Stros so steadfastly after being treated like complete crap.

by Nick86 on Feb 26, 2006 8:17 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Interesting though
Anyone think Beane signed Thomas just to wage psychological warfare vs. Kenny Williams?
Why yes. I am a ray of Fucking sunshine.

by grover on Feb 26, 2006 8:23 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

No, but I think he
probably acquired Charles just to wage psychological warfare with you.

by Nico on Feb 26, 2006 8:36 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Didn't work
I was right, he was wrong.

I'll tell you the real blow, though. I just got banned from Halos Heaven.

Why yes. I am a ray of Fucking sunshine.

by grover on Feb 26, 2006 8:40 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I saw you messing
around there and figured you would not last long!  They don't brook no contrary views there no matter how well stated.
the great playoff miss of 2004 followed by the good try of 2005 but we got the fix for 2006.

by ak_A on Feb 26, 2006 8:51 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I guess
Some guy called me a troll. I asked if he was a moron... next thing I know I'm gone.
Why yes. I am a ray of Fucking sunshine.

by grover on Feb 26, 2006 9:05 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Troll?
I just read that diary out of curiousity, and by no means were you playing the troll. When Depodesta used to come around here with that two laptop BS over and over, now THAT was a troll. You were just stiring up the pot on a dull sight. I thought that we were maybe drinkin the kelly green Kool-Aid around here, but we have nothing on those drunks down in the OC. You stood your ground Grover. Well done.
Lou Brock was a great base stealer, but today, I am the greatest! - Rickey Henderson

by haren4prez on Feb 27, 2006 1:12 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Now you know you've made it
Bill Stoneman is about to be offered three seasons of a right-handed version of Vladimir Guerrero - Rev Halofan

by pickinmachine on Feb 26, 2006 9:21 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The sad part...
Is that diary was probably the most excitement HH has had in months.  
Bill Stoneman is about to be offered three seasons of a right-handed version of Vladimir Guerrero - Rev Halofan

by pickinmachine on Feb 26, 2006 9:25 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

And I just noticed the
recent diary there announcing they had banned Grover!  Heh, heh, HH seems a bit inbred.
the great playoff miss of 2004 followed by the good try of 2005 but we got the fix for 2006.

by ak_A on Feb 26, 2006 9:34 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

oh man...
This poor Angels fan isn't long for HH:

Can you list the posts he made that compelled you to ban him? I went back to find some, and none of the ones I read were near the threshhold of exile. Frankly, I would enjoy some healthy debate on our turf. Either I'm missing some truly evil posts, or this action reflects poorly on halosheaven.

by Angels95 on Mon Feb 27, 2006 at 12:54:14 AM EST

I've seen the error of my ways... MaElLuvR

by Poppy on Feb 26, 2006 11:25 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I thought that Grover
was very appropriate on the HH site. I don't see why they banned him. I don't like to see ANers go in and brag, though, on the Halo site. Very bad Kharma! Oh one more thing ... AN is a much better blog than Halo Heaven! So there !

by IM4Oakgal on Feb 26, 2006 11:35 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I also thought grover was very appropriate
It's just stupid how, when he was trying to have an open, fair discussion with them, they decided he was only "pretending to be polite."

Bottom line is that the Rev and his groupies aren't interested in any points of view that question or criticize anything about the Angels (even if the "criticism" was only invented in their own minds, as was the case with grover's comments). I also would like to hear more about other teams from the people who follow those teams, but Halos Heaven is really a disgrace to SB Nation.  That's why I don't think the Angels fan whose comment I quoted above is going to be very happy there; he/she seems too bright & reasonable for that lot.

I've seen the error of my ways... MaElLuvR

by Poppy on Feb 27, 2006 7:17 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Spot on
"AN is a much better blog than Halo Heaven!"

Absolutely!

"the dumbest player I've ever met." --Larry Bowa, on Vincente Padilla

by AgentProvocateur on Feb 27, 2006 7:39 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

My userID
was 306.

They're very close knit over there.

Why yes. I am a ray of Fucking sunshine.

by grover on Feb 26, 2006 9:46 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

What took you so long?
;p
"the dumbest player I've ever met." --Larry Bowa, on Vincente Padilla

by AgentProvocateur on Feb 27, 2006 7:34 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Hey
I wasn't trying to get tossed...
Why yes. I am a ray of Fucking sunshine.

by grover on Feb 27, 2006 4:32 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Read all of it.
It's a disgrace.

FIRE REV NOW.

Damn! Street is so imposing, he even causes the earth itself to freeze in fear! - monkeyball

by Jjjsixsix on Feb 27, 2006 9:40 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

If you thought that was bad
Rev's really losing his cool because people are questioning his decision to toss me.
Why yes. I am a ray of Fucking sunshine.

by grover on Feb 27, 2006 4:33 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

His last comment on it
was typically poorly chosen:

"I ain't fucking Grover's dad."

I'm sure your Dad will be happy to hear that :-).

A Beane in the hand is worth $60M in payroll

by jeepers on Feb 27, 2006 5:01 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

LOL
I've seen the error of my ways... MaElLuvR

by Poppy on Feb 27, 2006 5:35 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Irrational fear?
Is anyone else somewhat scared that, fueled by this new bulletin board material, Frank will try to overdo it and re-injure himself?
"I knew when my career was over. In 1965 my baseball card came out with no picture." - Bob Uecker

by JLaff on Feb 26, 2006 8:41 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Sadly, I'm not sure
he'll even have to overdo it in order to reinjure himself.

He and Rashad have something in common: they both really need to grow another foot.

by Nico on Feb 26, 2006 8:57 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Without knowing who Rashad is
I would bet this is a patented Nico thing...I am guessing that Rashad is probably a basketball player who is short, hence the other foot.
the great playoff miss of 2004 followed by the good try of 2005 but we got the fix for 2006.

by ak_A on Feb 26, 2006 9:26 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Oh man
Its pretty much the funniest diary ever posted on AN

Enjoy!
Bill Stoneman is about to be offered three seasons of a right-handed version of Vladimir Guerrero - Rev Halofan

by pickinmachine on Feb 26, 2006 9:35 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

yes, memories.
should be an interesting year on the AL west blogs....I check HH for the sick thrill of it...hopefully (of course) that our A's will pull through this year and I get to see HH go off the deep end.
the great playoff miss of 2004 followed by the good try of 2005 but we got the fix for 2006.

by ak_A on Feb 26, 2006 9:41 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Rashad = Huston123
"Baseball is reassuring. It makes me feel as if the world is not going to blow up." -Sharon Olds

by AsGirl on Feb 26, 2006 9:37 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

No..
He needs to grow maybe 5 or 6" at the most
"I knew when my career was over. In 1965 my baseball card came out with no picture." - Bob Uecker

by JLaff on Feb 26, 2006 9:36 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

What about
The part where the reporter says I know you, and you have always had a monster season after feeling slighted (or something to that extent). Could be a big season if his health holds up.
"If you throw at someone's head, it's very dangerous, because in the head is the brain." -- Pudge Rodriguez

by niallmack on Feb 26, 2006 11:19 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Kenny Williams is an idiot ...
if he really wants to tell Frank Thomas off 'to his face'.  OK, tough guy, pick a fight with Frank Thomas?  He can say what he wants to the media, but when he starts claiming that he held in his bitter feelings far too long, I think he's lying.  I'm guessing he held in his feelings until big Frank was 2,000 miles away and never again in his clubhouse.  No shame there, I know I wouldn't pick a fight with Frank Thomas.
On the other hand, imagine hanging out in the same room day after day with Jerry Reinsdorf, Kenny Williams, Ozzie Guillen, AJ Pierzynski, Bobby Jenks, Carl Everett, and Frank Thomas.  What an enjoyable bunch they must be together!

by iceplant on Feb 27, 2006 2:08 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Frank took High Road
in response today. Good-- let's show 'em on the field.
oaktoon

by oaktoon on Feb 27, 2006 3:17 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

retro kenny williams drama
remember this?
GM's BEANE, WILLIAMS TALK TO CLEAR AIR
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/chronicle/archive/2003/05/07/SP168316.DTL

and i also happened upon this, which really makes me want to win it all to silence all haters:  

ANTI-MONEYBALL
http://www.chicagosportsreview.com/news/newsview.asp?c=169267

"...what makes a winning team - winning 92 games a year, or winning the World Series?  The answer, at least as far as the public is concerned, is the latter. When was the last time you attended a parade for a division winner? And the other answer intrinsic is that a team that wins 90+ games a year should also be the type of team that can win a few games when it really needs to.

The best part about this whole thing, for me anyway, is that it's fun. It's unbelievable to watch a sort of misguided and crazed experiment work out. It's exciting to see someone stare conventional wisdom in the face, ignore it, and then be more successful than anyone else.

It re-arranges the way that we look at the world; at least the baseball world.

It's ironic, at the end of the day. Kenny Williams, and his conventional wisdom, anti-Moneyball philosophy taught us more about flying in the face of conventional wisdom than Billy Beane ever has. And he got us a ring, too.

So we've got that going for us, which is nice. -CSR"

trieste-zurich-paris, 1914--1921

by slipperyfrog on Feb 27, 2006 4:23 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

That article is somewhat
misleading.  The "old" way has been winning world series for over 100 years.....for whatever team happens to stumble on the right equation that particular year.  It speaks volumes about the "old way" when you point out someone used it to win the WS....it's been used that way for a very long time.  Now beating the "old way", there's something worth getting excited about.
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer

by alox on Feb 27, 2006 4:59 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Its hard to imagine how bad sportswriting
is in a market like Chicago.  "The second best part about this whole thing is that the White Sox have done what the A's have never done, which is win in the postseason."  Where's the editor?  Shame.
"We've added a little more bling to it, so to speak," Macha said.

by eshock on Feb 27, 2006 11:05 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Those are both great reads...
I like how in the first one, just like Joe Morgan, Kenny Williams apparently thinks Billy Beane wrote 'Moneyball'.  

Williams:

"If I would have written that book, I would have started out by giving thanks to my directors of scouts and that staff for drafting people like Mark Mulder, Barry Zito, Tim Hudson, Eric Chavez and Miguel Tejada."

Does K-Dub think Micheal Lewis's (the author of Moneyball) staff does the scouting and drafting for the A's?

by blueconversechucks on Feb 28, 2006 12:51 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Kenny Williams might be as stupid as Joe Morgan
I know you might be tempted to scoff, but hear me out:

-He couldn't manage to keep the cursing and insults out of his tirade
-He thinks Billy Beane wrote Moneyball
-He's given the Big Hurt (and the A's) all the motivation he needs (if he needed any more) to beat the crap out of the White Sox and help the A's match ChiSox's achievements of last year.

by blueconversechucks on Feb 28, 2006 12:56 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Thomas v. Williams
I think this controversy will blow over soon.  After all Barry Bonds will get wind of the fact he is not the center of attention and will release a bizarre statement about his retirement, family life or some other mundane topic.  A day or so later the story will change and poof he's in the news again!
"There is no crying in baseball." Tom Hanks in A LEAGUE OF THEIR OWN.

by twopups on Feb 27, 2006 7:19 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

True, and it will likely resurface
(if not sooner, certainly when the A's and White Sox first meet). I may have missed a more damning quote, but if the worst Thomas has said is the oft-mentioned comment along the lines of, "After 16 years I feel I deserved at least a phone call," then I'm not quite ready to villify him in this feud. Williams and Guillen were way out of line in comparison. Or did Thomas pop off more than that?

by Nico on Feb 27, 2006 7:49 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

BAD MOVE
Frank Thomas is a Chicago legend and a historical figure in his own time. It's <HUGELY> offensive and disrespectful to White Sox fans for the sitting GM to alienate the team's greatest player.

by kvn on Feb 27, 2006 7:48 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

his foots ok right?
really, so long as that foot of his is ok.  

oh, and the part about him and everett becoming good buddies.  that is very encouraging (think milton bradley).

vote mcbronsh for most disliked AN'er.

by mcbronsh on Feb 27, 2006 10:03 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

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