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The Internal Candidates

I've stated many times that I think that a manager is as good as the players provided for him.  Oh sure he can royally screw up a good thing, but my feelings on baseball managers is that they get too much credit only when a team wins it all (see Guillen, Ozzie) and get too much blame for when a team falls short.

I've seen this all across baseball with people in New York blaming Joe Torre for the Yankees demise.  People in Anaheim often complain about Scioscia.  Jim Leyland was not the legend he was in Pittsburgh in Colorado because he didn't have the players.

Ultimately, a manager's job is to not get in the way of success and to set up the players for success.  Macha did a good job of not screwing up a good thing this year.  Well, he did contribute a bit to the A's demise in the ALCS, but how much of a difference it made in the big picture is arguable.  I think Detroit was clearly the better team.

As for our now open position, I'd pretty much be happy with any of the four internal candidates.  DeFrancesco, Geren, Washington and Lachemann.  Although all of them have their drawbacks.

DeFrancesco, Washington and Geren have never been been a manager at the major league level.  Although both Geren and DeFrancesco have been successful managers at Triple-A in the A's minor league system.  Lachemann was a major league manager, just not a successful one.

With Geren you've got the concern being whether or not Beane and Geren can work together successfully in spite of the fact that they're best friends.  Beane, as many have seen by reputation, can be a hardass.  That doesn't always fly in friendships.  

Washington is the sentimental favorite, but his belief in being more aggressive could wind up butting heads with the A's front office.  Of course Washington knows this already.  So if he was taking the job, I imagine the understanding will be that the style of play is dictated by the front office, not the manager.

DeFrancesco is a younger guy who works well with younger players.  He's the perfect minor league manager for the time being, so the chances of the front office wanting him to stay in that role to groom future A's major leaguers are high.

I think the only thing standing between Geren and the manager's office are whether or not Beane and he decide that can work together and that the fact that they are best friends won't impact their working relationship.  If anyone should understand Beane and his approach to the franchise, it would be Bob Geren.

Of course, that's only of the internal candidates.  That doesn't take into account the fact that Beane might look elsewhere.  The caveat being that people need to understand how this organization works.  And that fact leads me to believe that the chances of the next manager coming from the four candidates above is very high.

Any way, I wound up wondering today, what manager will AN be happy with?  Most of you seem to be calling for Ron Washington, so my question is will that be the only manager you'll be happy with - especially out of the internal candidates?

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from the diary "why Wash"
Beane said that communication and development of young players will be absolutely key for the next manager to do well:

http://oakland.athletics.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20061016&content_id=1715021& ; ;vkey=news_oak&fext=.jsp&c_id=oak

Question: based on what you know of the candidates so far mentioned, who do you think might be most likely to do this well?

I vote Wash.

by OaklandSi on Oct 16, 2006 7:02 PM PDT   0 recs

Geren was incredible
at that in Sacto.  That's another reason why I think he's one of the top candidates.

Wash is great at teaching infield defense and he seems like a great mentor as well.

by Blez on Oct 16, 2006 7:05 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Interesting side note
Could that quote be signifying that there could be a considerable amount of roster upheaval in the coming months? Let's be honest, the A's aren't expecting an influx of youth next season so it makes me wonder if some of the vets (Kendall, Kotsay, etc.) could be heavily shopped in the offseason.
Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Oct 16, 2006 7:16 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

it could mean
that some of the guys who complained to Beane were not just the veterans, but young guys. Macha really lays on the tough love sometimes I think, maybe it got to them after awhile.
"The future's like, who cares?" ~Eric Chavez

by rebus on Oct 16, 2006 7:22 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

especially given Beane's emphasis
on young player development in his remarks today about the next manager

by OaklandSi on Oct 16, 2006 7:24 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Regarding Geren
From my perspective, especially with 20-20 hindsight, it was interesting to see Bob Geren rise to a higher level of prominence as the season drew to a conclusion. Geren was almost always the one exchanging lineup cards, and there was the one game where Macha handed him the reins to run the game - all the way up to the pitching changes.

It seemed to me that this was either Macha saying, "You think this is so easy, you do it," or a premature admittance that Geren would be the next guy.

Washington is a great part of Oakland's organization, and unless I were part of the interview process that got to speak to everyone, I can't speculate on whether he would make a great transition from 3rd base coach to manager - the roles are quite different.

If it's somebody that AN just happens to like a lot - then you might as well put Dave Stewart or Dennis Eckersley out there. What's Walt Weiss doing these days?

More than just ANtics: http://www.louisgray.com/live/

by louismg on Oct 16, 2006 7:06 PM PDT   0 recs

not just liking Wash
(from the Why Ron Washington diary)

among the reasons

He's a baseball man with a keen understanding of all aspects of the game and a knack for explaining it.

He inspires much respect and even love from the players.

He has done an excellent job as third base and infield coach, both very important jobs.

He has a strong desire to manage, and will take a job managing elsewhere if offered. It's pretty widely acknowledge that losing him would be a bad thing for the A's.

It's true that he doesn't have much managerial experience, none in the majors. But having that experience doesn't guarantee that a person will be a good manager, as we have seen all too often.

by OaklandSi on Oct 16, 2006 7:16 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Amen
To add to what you said... I like Wash in the aspect that he constantly has the "big picture" in mind.  

by anomaly_kat on Oct 16, 2006 11:05 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Walter...
What's Walt Weiss doing these days?

He is working with the Rockies as an instructor during spring training.  He's also a big time weight lifter, I saw him in spring training this year and I couldn't believe it was the same skinny guy I remember with the A's.  I'm not joking when I say his arms are like McGwire's or Canseco.  Not to cast any doubts about how he got there, I'm just sayin' he's a big guy these days.

by Rickey35 on Oct 17, 2006 10:49 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

It sounds
like that Geren will be the guy.  I hope that Wash gets his chance in Texas or San Fran.  The article really seems to point to an internal candidate.

The A's will live or die next year based on the development of swisher, Crosby, Harden, Blanton, Street and possibly DJ.

by DKNJ on Oct 16, 2006 7:10 PM PDT   0 recs

I'd vote for Wash
simply because he wants to run an aggressive style of offense which is EXACTLY what the A's need to be doing. The A's no longer feature a line-up designed to walk and bash. Instead, they have a bunch of guys with good bat control and a bit of athleticism. We might not have a bunch of base stealers but the hit & run should be a staple of the offense. Any time you can get the pitcher to split his focus between the batter and the baserunner you have gained an advantage offensively.

Wash yearns for that type of gameplan.

Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Oct 16, 2006 7:12 PM PDT   0 recs

EXACTLY CORRECT !!!!!
i don't understand why they hate to "give up" outs with small ball , but don't seem too upset about so many GIDP's....nothing frustrates me more !!!! Get 'em on, GET 'EM OVER , and see the runs go up and the GIDP's go down. my opinion.

by hexy on Oct 17, 2006 8:18 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Vote Washington in '07
....

by SinceIwas7 on Oct 16, 2006 7:13 PM PDT   0 recs

How long will it take,,,
to choose another manager?

by IM4Oakgal on Oct 16, 2006 7:14 PM PDT   0 recs

A couple issues...
It depends how long it takes for Blez to go through the interview process, and second, the negotiations on whether Beane will pay for him to relocate. Of course, once he's manager, he'd have to hand over the reins of AN to you-know-who.

Fire BBG Now!

More than just ANtics: http://www.louisgray.com/live/

by louismg on Oct 16, 2006 7:18 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Haha
very funny.

by IM4Oakgal on Oct 16, 2006 7:25 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

BBG?
Isn't she, how does one say this, a little power hungry?
"The future's like, who cares?" ~Eric Chavez

by rebus on Oct 16, 2006 7:26 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

HIRE CINDI NOW!!!
Seriously, she already has TONS of ideas about improving the neckline on the home jerseys.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 16, 2006 7:32 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'd go for Cindi in a heartbeat
if not for the green-and-gold nail polish requirement for the players she keeps insisting on.
Thank you Athletics and AN for a magnificent 2006 to remember ... only 121 days until pitchers and catchers report

by emperor nobody on Oct 16, 2006 7:36 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

It looks like Geren
I would rather have Wash, Bud Black, Orel Hershiser or Don Mattingley.

by Zonis on Oct 16, 2006 7:15 PM PDT   0 recs

These are the names swirling around right now
Bob Geren
Ron Washington
Rene Lacheman
Buck Showalter (horrible)
Bobby Valentine

by tankormike on Oct 16, 2006 7:17 PM PDT   0 recs

Showalter?
Isn't he, how does one say this, a little power hungry?
Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Oct 16, 2006 7:19 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

like I said before, Girardi and Showalter
are an absolute no way, because the Nick Swisher facial hair possibilities are too stylish and too creative next year for BB to bring in a manager that forbids such things.
Thank you Athletics and AN for a magnificent 2006 to remember ... only 121 days until pitchers and catchers report

by emperor nobody on Oct 16, 2006 7:29 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I love Bobby V
He took a crap Mets team to the WS.  The OF was Jay Payton, Timo Perez and Benny Abagyani.  He also won a title in Japan with a small market team.

He is a brilliant in game tactician.

by DKNJ on Oct 16, 2006 7:21 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Valentine is an interesting possibility
But I can't see him getting a chance in Beane's World.

by socal on Oct 16, 2006 7:40 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

He is dying to get
back the in the game.  He is an east coast guy though so the match may not be perfect though.

by DKNJ on Oct 16, 2006 7:44 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I like Bobby V too.
But he has a tendency to grate on the media, the fans, his GM and his players. Sometimes even his owner.

I'm not sure he's "dying to get back in the game". He seems pretty happy in Japan.

On Sunday, Minaya ticked off a list of candidates to join the rotation, and for once this season, none of them was Jose Lima.

by rfloh on Oct 16, 2006 10:58 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Conneticut
school boy legend. He lives there and owns a great sports bar.

by DKNJ on Oct 17, 2006 6:28 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Bobby V is not a bad manager...
...but he's an incredible jerk as a human being, for whatever that's worth.
If nothing else, he knew how to chew a stick of gum.

by GreenNGoldSooner on Oct 17, 2006 6:25 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Bobby V...
Couldn't agree more with this post, he is a pretty bad guy from what I've heard.  Just ask Dave Stewart how he feels about the guy.

by Rickey35 on Oct 17, 2006 10:51 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I know too little...
Wash is out there, he's approachable, and players are vocal about his performance. But just because we don't hear as much about Geren, DeFrancesco and Lachemann doesn't mean they're less than Wash.

As for managerial question marks in Wash's court, I doubt it would be too difficult for him to quickly adjust. He knows what he'd do in certain situations (and, more importantly, what the A's do) and he'd have a guy like Geren as his bench coach. No biggie in that department, imo.

I'd really love to see Wash get a chance because I feel like I know a little bit about his character. He's so candid and works so well with Chavvy that he just seems like a stand up dude who deserves a great gig like this.

"The future's like, who cares?" ~Eric Chavez

by rebus on Oct 16, 2006 7:19 PM PDT   0 recs

of the four internal candidates
the one I favor least is Rene Lachemann. He was a fairly mediocre major league manager.

by OaklandSi on Oct 16, 2006 7:20 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I agree...
Living in Milwaukee I got to see how "great" he did back in the 80's and it wasn't pretty.  Granted we had a lousy team back then, but he didn't do much to help the cause.

by Rickey35 on Oct 17, 2006 10:52 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

To his defense he has always had bad teams
to manage - it's difficult to gauge how good someone can be when they have never had the horses to win a race - so to speak...

by SD Erik on Oct 17, 2006 2:19 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I would think Geren
he managed a lot of the players in Sacramento, a friend of BB's, was on the bench the entire year, it makes a lot of sense that he moves in to the managers job and possibly Wash made the bench manager if he doesn't get another job.  I am elated.

by china bob on Oct 16, 2006 7:21 PM PDT   0 recs

Blez, I agree with you
on Geren. I think he'd be a good coach, especially with the younger guys, but there may be problems with the whole friendship. It's just like one of my professors was teaching a class about becoming a flight instructor. One of the things you want to avoid is having a friend/boyfriend/girlfriend/husband/wife/family member as one of your students. As soon as they start to struggle or get frustrated with their flying, the personal relationship is down the tubes.

I think the best canidates are Wash and DeFran, but I think Lachemann would do well, too.

"I guess more players lick themselves than are ever licked by an opposing team." ~ Connie Mack

by Flyin As on Oct 16, 2006 7:21 PM PDT   0 recs

That might throw a monkey-wrench in the whole
resigning Bradley thing. Let's just play it safe and go with someone with experience: Mike Scioscia?

by kvn on Oct 16, 2006 7:33 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

He'd be the first to manage two teams
"Scioscia goes to the pen, he's gonna turn Swisher around! ... Well, looks like Scioscia's going to bring in a pinch hitter.  This is a brilliant strategy."
It's a shame that families get torn apart by something as simple as wild dogs. -Jack Handey

by JediLeroy on Oct 17, 2006 6:43 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

My hope is that if all the candidates
are internal, that they will dispense with the charade of "formal interviews". Beane knows these guys, and surely knows which one he feels would be the best choice at this time.

Don't humiliate Washington or Geren with a sit-down session of, "So, what makes you the best candidate for this job?"

Just pick the one you had in mind when you pulled the trigger on Macha, and make an offer.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 16, 2006 7:30 PM PDT   0 recs

Can't do that
Baseball teams have to interview minority candidates, don't they?  Isn't there some sort of rule about that?

But if Beane has his mind made up on Geren, I hope he doesn't put Washington through much of a farce.

by bear88 on Oct 16, 2006 8:29 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I did think about that--
And sadly, the reason guys like Wash get on so many "short lists" is because they satisfy the "minority quota" joke--a joke because no one has to hire them, they just have to make sure to interview them.

So if Beane has known for a while that Geren is his (best) man, he will still interview Wash as the convenient quota-satisfier--with no intention of hiring him. Good minority candidates like Wash deserve better than that.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 16, 2006 8:34 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I like these three
Gammons said that Beane thinks Showalter is the best in game manager. I personally think he's the worst. Im hoping that Wash gets the spot because of his ability to work with players and bring out the best. I love Valentine because he is a Leyland type and knows the game very well. A strong personality but at the same time wouldnt mind using Beanes philosophy. Geren is a Beane puppet and although I wouldnt mind him its just more of the same.

by tankormike on Oct 16, 2006 7:35 PM PDT   0 recs

Valentine loves
proving how smart he is.  I am sure he wouldn't mind trying some out of the box managing.  He is a very strong personality though.  He was also a world class toolsy athlete in his day.  Beane probably sees a bit of himself in Valentine.

by DKNJ on Oct 16, 2006 7:38 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

That's just my worry about Valentine
He's a good manager, but he's thinks he's an absolute genius. And he isn't. That always worries me...it's a great recipe for outsmarting yourself.
If nothing else, he knew how to chew a stick of gum.

by GreenNGoldSooner on Oct 17, 2006 6:28 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I was gonna get season tix
but not if that Fundamentalist "Christian" douche Showalter is hired.

Bobby V and I'm in for at least a 40-game package, however.

Thank you Athletics and AN for a magnificent 2006 to remember ... only 121 days until pitchers and catchers report

by emperor nobody on Oct 16, 2006 7:39 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

If the A's didn't think Macha
knew how to communicate with, and get along with, his players, they are in for an unpleasant surprise if they hire Showalter.

Ugh--what a horrible choice that would be, IMO.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 16, 2006 7:45 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

seriously
Showalter is loathesome, a poison.  He builds up such antipathy amongst his players that as soon as he leaves they win the WS just from the collective relief of his exile.

He is all rules and no results, the most contemptuous breed of leader IMO.

Thank you Athletics and AN for a magnificent 2006 to remember ... only 121 days until pitchers and catchers report

by emperor nobody on Oct 16, 2006 7:49 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm unclear
How is it exactly you feel about Showalter?  Black plague or airborne toxic event?

by Leopold Bloom on Oct 16, 2006 8:08 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Showalter
is just one of those authoritarian assholes that I despise, his style symbolizes so much about what I hate about the relationship between humans and power.  If he was named our manager I would probably break something.
Thank you Athletics and AN for a magnificent 2006 to remember ... only 121 days until pitchers and catchers report

by emperor nobody on Oct 16, 2006 8:15 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

That Showalter continues to get...
...showered with praise (and job offers) is a great example of what's wrong with baseball's hiring practices.

Any objective observer can see what's wrong with the guy. But he got a reputation early on for being a great manager (largely 'cause he had the Yankee publicity machine behind him...and George was in a good mood), and it's just stuck. And nothing will undo that rep.  It's like Don Zimmer (the ultimate "baseball guy"), who kept getting hired despite clearly being a rotten manager.

If nothing else, he knew how to chew a stick of gum.

by GreenNGoldSooner on Oct 17, 2006 6:31 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

If you liked Macha's approach to media and players
You'll love Valentine's.  The guy was famously reviled by NY players for calling them out in the papers instead of in his office.
Eternal Springsā„¢: The official 2007 bottled water of your Oakland Athletics

by FreeSeatUpgrade on Oct 16, 2006 8:08 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Exactly
He's a deeply, deeply lousy human being.
If nothing else, he knew how to chew a stick of gum.

by GreenNGoldSooner on Oct 17, 2006 6:31 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Wash, No Geren
Geren sounds like a total rock during radio and TV interviews. Public speaking is not a requirement, but it clearly is not a strength of Geren's. The fact that he can't speak is at best an annoyance and at worst a sign of an ineffectual leader. I have also never heard anything over the top positive said about him by the any single guy, rookie or veteran. Lastly and most importantly (and most obviously), it is a conflict of interest with Beane relationship.  
"We owe it all to one man. And we are all extraneous. 'Billy' has denuded us of ego". Liar's Poker

by Sashulia on Oct 16, 2006 7:37 PM PDT   0 recs

I would enjoy the publicity...
that Bobby V would bring to the A's. Can you imagine?

by IM4Oakgal on Oct 16, 2006 7:37 PM PDT   0 recs

the players would dig him, I think
Bobby V has a perverse sense of humor and isn't afraid to use it.  It would mean that Swish would be knocked down to second-loudest motormouth in the dugout.
Thank you Athletics and AN for a magnificent 2006 to remember ... only 121 days until pitchers and catchers report

by emperor nobody on Oct 16, 2006 7:41 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Time for something different?
Hiring Washington or Geren wouldn't be a bad move. And I think Washington especially would be popular with the players.

But I wonder if it's time for Beane to tweak his strategy and bring in someone from the outside. For that, I like the mad genius: Bobby Valentine.

What the A's lack is the ability to change their style of play as circumstances dictate. The post season is a prime example of where aggressive play is often rewarded.

Beane/Valentine could be a disaster. Or it could be absolutely brilliant. Either way, it would be interesting.

by Dann on Oct 16, 2006 7:40 PM PDT   0 recs

I like Wash
If Beane is unwilling to give Wash a shot, then I very much hope he gets the Rangers job.  He deserves his chance to be a big-league manager.

Wash might not be the best fit here, anyway, he's not exactly the kind of guy who will reflexively say "How high?" every time Beane says "Jump." If Geren gets the A's job, then we will know that quality was the key to the decision.

by socal on Oct 16, 2006 7:44 PM PDT   0 recs

I am torn between
wanting Wash's happiness and the idea of losing Wash to someone in our own division. Ack!

by IM4Oakgal on Oct 16, 2006 7:46 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Frankly, that's one of the reasons
I like the idea of Wash as manager. It would mean that Mr. Beane had finally figured out that a good manager needs to have the authority, respect from above, and independence, to ask "how to win?" rather than "how high?"

The very fact that Beane was SEEKING a manager who wasn't just a "yes man" would be, IMO, a big step forward for the A's organization.

Plus I suspect Wash would do a great job, as he is already liked and respected by these players, is a proven "great teacher," and is highly intelligent. And the "life" and "energy" he brings to the diamond is infectious, just as a lack of life can be...

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 16, 2006 7:48 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

A caveat:
we hadn't really heard anything about Macha having problems with his players until today, when it all came out.  If Washington has any warts, we likely haven't heard about them yet (nor are we likely to!).
Stat Wonk Futurist

by salb918 on Oct 16, 2006 7:54 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

however, I've wondered
at some of the comments that Macha has made, such as the "nonentity" remarks. Players feel bad enough about being on the DL without having to read that their manager said that to the press.

by OaklandSi on Oct 16, 2006 7:56 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

something not as yet mentioned
is that a proven outside candidate like Bobby V would probably want to bring in their own coaches, which I don't think is on the table... it seems that Curt Young and Perry and them are staying, so this reduces the outside option somewhat.
Thank you Athletics and AN for a magnificent 2006 to remember ... only 121 days until pitchers and catchers report

by emperor nobody on Oct 16, 2006 7:44 PM PDT   0 recs

Very good point
If you bring in a Valentine type you need to let him choose his own coaching staff.  

by DKNJ on Oct 16, 2006 7:47 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I wouldn't assume anything
about the coaches. Perhaps with an internal hire we won't see many changes in a coaching staff. But an outside hire may well want to bring in some of his own people.

By the way, the Giants popular head trainer (forgot his name, he was there 15 years) has just said he's looking for a job with a different club.

by OaklandSi on Oct 16, 2006 7:50 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Get the Giants
head trainer.  The A's should also put a chiropracter on the staff.

This Macha firing got the off season rolling quickly.  It is sad for Macha, but very exciting.

I trust beane here.  Macha won 98, 92, 88 and 97 games with the A's.  Not shabby.

by DKNJ on Oct 16, 2006 7:58 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Stan Conte would be an amazing hire.
"This must be heaven," he says.
"No. It's Oakland."

by Kyli on Oct 17, 2006 1:20 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs