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Down But Not Out

Goat_tiny by Nico on in News


Don't get me wrong, I don't like going down 2-0 at home. The A's are now officially the underdogs in the series no matter how you slice it, having simply been outpitched, outhit, and outfielded in two home games, off to face their nemesis, Kenny Rogers, in less friendly confines.

But tonight's game was a microcosm of why there is hope for the series as a whole. Tonight, the A's looked like they were cooked only to rise up and get Milton Bradley to the plate representing the tying run, only to go a step further and get Frank Thomas to the plate representing the winning run. Perhaps the series will follow the same script and the A's have some rising yet to do.

Tonight, it was April and May, with Frank Thomas juuuuuust missing pitches he knows and you know he can drive, stranding runners who could have been tying runs and winning runs. Perhaps the series will follow the same script and the June-September portion of the series is still ahead.

Right now, I feel like 10 really smart guys sat in a room over the weekend and outsmarted themselves, chickening out on throwing Harden twice and then planning to do it anyway, opting to relegate a "big-game pitcher" to only one guaranteed start, and going with the "known quantity" in Esteban Loaiza, who is mostly known for two things over his career: a lack of consistency and a lack of comfort under pressure or in the spotlight.

The bad news is that 10 really smart guys may have outsmarted themselves and helped to put the A's in a 2-0 hole (they had plenty of help, as the players did their part). The good news is that Rich Harden and Danny Haren pitch the next two games, and I feel good about that duo in any park.

The A's are down, but they're far from out. Frank Thomas hasn't hit his last high fly ball yet. Let's hope his last one has the distance.

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Clap, Clap, Clap....
I feel a major league comeback!
"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 8:43 PM PDT   0 recs

NEVER GIVE UP
NEVER SURRENDER
Barry Zito is my secret mancrush. There. I said it.

by interior decor on Oct 11, 2006 8:45 PM PDT   0 recs

maybe the first AN reference...
to "Galaxy Quest".

"Please, Frank Thomas, YOUUUUUUU ARE OUR LAAAST HOPE!"

We've got what we need to win. We've seen it all season. We just need it now.

"Is Frank Thomas the Mariah Carey of Baseball, or is Mariah Carey the Frank Thomas of Pop Music?"

by roysteelefan on Oct 11, 2006 10:23 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

This will be an exciting series.
and I think the A's will come back.

Harden is the key.
Frank Thomas will get a key hit sooner or later and Milton will continue to be an ideal #3 hitter

"Straight outta Oakland, California where we sparkin on ya" - 2Pac

by Erik being Erik on Oct 11, 2006 8:45 PM PDT   0 recs

Agreed
Going to Detroit means that the A's have to forget what happened in games one & two, forget what they did to the Twins, and take it one pitch at a time. Forget about the pressure and play baseball like they've always done. If they do that we can start getting some wins.

by Smartball on Oct 11, 2006 8:46 PM PDT   0 recs

PS......
My cholesterol level has officially been lowered by 20 points due to that ninth inning. I ran 10 miles. Oh wait, I didn't go running. Oh yeah, I the A's tried to kill me.
"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 8:46 PM PDT   0 recs

Get ready for a beatdown, Roaster.
"Next thing you know, they'll have me taking an overdose of pills."--Milton Bradley

by jeepers on Oct 11, 2006 8:48 PM PDT   0 recs

A's in 6
Please?
Keep our A's in Oakland!

by twofootslim on Oct 11, 2006 8:49 PM PDT   0 recs

That'd be a sweep
Kinda crazy, but I certainly can see the A's winning two in Detroit and bringing it back home for a different story!

by achiappanza on Oct 11, 2006 9:54 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

great post Nico
I feel better already.  Now I must stay away from AN for the rest of the night to keep the feeling.
"...we don't score six, seven runs. We score three, four runs and play defense and pitch." - Eric Chavez

by pickinmachine on Oct 11, 2006 8:49 PM PDT   0 recs

Ditto...
On both counts...

Goodnight all, it starts Friday....

"Get Heavy!" - Kotsay

by OaklandInvader on Oct 11, 2006 8:53 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I know baseball
is not important, but I'm watching Macha being interviewed right now and he's chuckling like it's just a little league game.

by Salvatore on Oct 11, 2006 8:49 PM PDT   0 recs

I have no idea
if that's a good thing or a bad thing. I don't think anyone else does, either.
When the lights...go down...in the city...

by senork on Oct 11, 2006 8:51 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I agree with Nico's sentiment.
I wish they could get on a plane and play a day game tomorrow in Detroit tomorrow. We have to take that offense into the first inning on Friday and quiet the crowd and let Harden play with the lead.

I can't believe my optimism right now...

"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 8:49 PM PDT   0 recs

1/4 of an inch
away from what would have easily been the most amazing comeback in baseball history (or at least recent baseball memory):

-2 outs
-Bottom of the ninth
-Home team down by three
-Bases loaded
-The team's big slugger at bat

Thomas had the chance to end the game in a way that (I am quite positive) everyone has dreamed of. He also had the chance to do his best Casey impression. You all know which happened.

I won't be watching the game on Friday. I've seen or listened to the last eight A's games and I've seen all the playoff games that have been on Fox, and I need a little bit of a break. Also, the teams that I've been rooting for are on a five-game skid, so maybe a change of pace will help.

When the lights...go down...in the city...

by senork on Oct 11, 2006 8:50 PM PDT   0 recs

Disagree -- Pujols vs. Lidge last year
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s

by Nick on Oct 11, 2006 10:11 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Can't believe nobody is blaming D'Angelo Jimenez
for tonight's loss?  The night is still young I suppose.  (I wonder if this non-profanity laden message will also get deleted by tomorrow).
"You have to make your reputation by being honest ... and unmerciful." Lester Bangs

by Sashulia on Oct 11, 2006 8:50 PM PDT   0 recs

indeed
he gave up all 8 of those runs on his own.

by Kevin2 on Oct 11, 2006 8:53 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I could not agree more
Harden should have gone in Game 2, Haren in Game 3, but now we have them for two critical games. Tigers will fold in Game 5.

by Vegas Bettor James on Oct 11, 2006 8:50 PM PDT   0 recs

By god,
I hope you're right :o/
"It's never 'just a game' if you're winning" - George Carlin

by bluelightrain84 on Oct 11, 2006 9:04 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

The A's always have to do it the hard way
I said it last night, and Game 2 seems to reinforce the idea, that each game in this series is representartive of a month of this season. The A's were bad in April and May and should now play well in June and July... aka Games 3 and 4.

A couple quick thoughts...

  1. Mr. Harden, Friday night would be a good time to become the pitcher so many of us hope you will become.
  2. Not to start a fight with you Nico, but you for got to add "out-managed" to your "out" played litany.
Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Oct 11, 2006 8:50 PM PDT   0 recs

Seconded on point 2.
"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 8:52 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

blah
This series has made me sad so far. We aren't playing like we should/can and it's disappointing. Now I know what the Twins fans felt last series... I don't like it.

Come on Oakland. Don't go out this easy.

"I never saw a hooligan I did like. They're like left-handed pitchers, they all have a screw loose somewhere." - The Asphalt Jungle

by drmmerchk on Oct 11, 2006 8:51 PM PDT   0 recs

Yeah
These two games have both ruined my last two evenings
"It's never 'just a game' if you're winning" - George Carlin

by bluelightrain84 on Oct 11, 2006 9:07 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Oh God, I can't believe..
Yeah, I offically have heart burn to cover the entire year.

A's better start playing a "better brand of baseball" if you know what I mean or we will be watching the Tigers in October if you know what I mean...

"The sea will crowd us with lovers at night".

by Sheldon72 on Oct 11, 2006 10:04 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Nice Post
I liked it. Being down 2-0 doesn't mean it's the end of the series. We just need big starts from Harden and Haren. Even if we lose this series, i can still view this season as a really great and fun one.

KEEP THE FAITH!

by swisherroks33 on Oct 11, 2006 8:52 PM PDT   0 recs

It IS a great season...
...and hopefully it's going to continue a bit longer... but just in case our luck runs thin, as it has done already for the 26 OTHER teams in the majors who are watching us on television... rest easy, loyal A's Nation, with the thought that the team that got us THIS far this year... probably won't look too different NEXT year. And a lot of the question marks of 2006 will be exclamation marks of 2007. I'm already excited for Spring Training in Scottsdale, Arizona. This year is just the beginning...

..."A New Hope".

"Is Frank Thomas the Mariah Carey of Baseball, or is Mariah Carey the Frank Thomas of Pop Music?"

by roysteelefan on Oct 11, 2006 10:35 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Please
The A's will be lucky to make the playoffs next year. The AL will be even more stacked and the Angels getting their s*it together. With Soriano in red and white providing all the protection in the world for Vlad, and perhaps MIGGY or A-rod in that lineup with the great pitching they have they are the favorites to win the west and have home field in the AL. I'm an A's fan to the core but I also know baseball and the A's are toast if they can't get it done this year.

by CyberFT on Oct 12, 2006 1:58 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Game 3 is the series
and we got our boy rich harden on the mound, time for him to become a superstar stud ace of a pitcher on the national stage, obv game 3 is a must win

and big frank going 0-5 with 3 K's is VERY alarming, its too bad he is becoming the goat of the series but no real fans will dog on him, he had a helluva year and it aint over yet

also swisher and scutaro looking awful isnt too good either, time to man up and show the sorry haters whos boss

go A's

by AsFanTexas on Oct 11, 2006 8:56 PM PDT   0 recs

As posted by NorthDakotaSomethingOrOther...
Why does Macha insist on pinch hitting Melhuse in the late innings of post season games when he doesn't want to peel him off the bench all season?

It really is obsurd and absolutely highlights the ineptitude of Macha. Does Macha do ok sometimes? Yes, but Macha is terrible. Flatout. How does your starter give up 7 runs in a almost 'must win' game? Please help me.

With that being said, let's take this thing on Friday despite our pussy of a manager.

"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 8:57 PM PDT   0 recs

I thought...
you'd be busy w/ your Jessica Simpson photos by now.... ;-)
"Get Heavy!" - Kotsay

by OaklandInvader on Oct 11, 2006 9:00 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Trying to catch my second wind after that ninth!
:)
"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 9:01 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

that still stuns me...
Our starters gave up 12 runs in what - 10, 11 innings? - over the last two games.  It makes you wonder exactly what point of suckiness they have to reach before Macha even gets someone up in the pen.

I'll also note that Leyland made multiple trips to the mound over the last two games, while Macha sat on the bench chomping gum.  Great motivator.

by coffee roaster on Oct 11, 2006 9:01 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

absurd...
"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 9:03 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm convinced that
in the post-season, that unless you have all winning players about 30 years or older, you need a mean son of a bitch manager to keep these guys on the right path.

by Salvatore on Oct 11, 2006 9:03 PM PDT   0 recs

Will somebody please tell Macha
That when your starter has at least 3 runs scored against him, and you're relying on the A's offense, you NEED to pull that sucky pitcher.  I can't understand why it took 5 runs scored against Z, and 7 against Loiaza for Macha to decide to pull them.  

For the Love of God, this is a best of 7 series, not a freakin 160 game season!

Ok, rant over, I'm off to bed.

Tear down Mount Davis!

by polytician on Oct 11, 2006 9:03 PM PDT   0 recs

Now I Understand
Like another poster said, they were saving Duke to keep him fresh for Spring Training, so 10 people can vote and not decide if he should be our closer.

Brilliant!!

by ChucklesSD on Oct 11, 2006 9:03 PM PDT   0 recs

I heart AN
good night, folks... see ya on Friday, right?
"Straight outta Oakland, California where we sparkin on ya" - 2Pac

by Erik being Erik on Oct 11, 2006 9:04 PM PDT   0 recs

street
"we're down 2-0, thats ok!"

haha i have faith believe it or not...

by Nickathleticsfan on Oct 11, 2006 9:05 PM PDT   0 recs

Macha and BaseballGirl....
We need to get BBG back from that damn cruise. WE NEED THE BBG MOJO.
"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 9:07 PM PDT   0 recs

I'm here!!!
LET'S GO OAKLAND!!!!
"I have an owie; can I go to first?" ~louismg on Vlad

by baseballgirl on Oct 12, 2006 9:34 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

re
We've got our stud going Friday.  If we take Game 3, we're right back in it.  Bonderman is an easier matchup for us than Rogers.  

by 31Boots on Oct 11, 2006 9:08 PM PDT   0 recs

Down 2-0 Sucks
for sure but there are plenty of reasons to be optimistic about our chances.  Both games were winnable and Chavez and Bradley look to be hot at the plate.  Harden and Haren, who would have made a great opening duo in hindsightville, need to dominate the way they can and well be fine.  
"I like playing for Oakland, they have a very colorful uniform" Rickey Henderson

by natsirt on Oct 11, 2006 9:13 PM PDT   0 recs

nice!
I love the attitude. lets go take em down in the motor city!

by Nickathleticsfan on Oct 11, 2006 9:18 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Where is everyone?
"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 9:17 PM PDT   0 recs

I agree Nico
10 really smart guys might of screwed this one up... sometimes you wish they would think from a fans standpoint or step out of the box for once.  Oh well, series not over yet and I believe we still have a spark... LETS GO OAK-LAND!!!
"East Oakland, Yeah that's right" - Too Short

by bart on Oct 11, 2006 9:17 PM PDT   0 recs

okay, that was a game
my wife kept checking me for signs of flipping out, yet in the end, she had to leave before it ended instead of me.  I feel oddly calm about the whole thing.

I remember in 2004 I was convinced that Boston was going to win the whole ball o' wax, then New York got up 3-0 and yet I still had the same feeling though my head was asking what was up with that calm feeling?  WTF?  

But just getting Big Frank up to the plate with the bases loaded was a great baseball scene.  Tiger fans must have been sweating, we were delirious with stolen hope.  Baseball, alas, breaks your heart.  And as Bart Gaimatti said, it's designed to break your heart.  But I don't have that heartache yet...

Go A's

by jakarta on Oct 11, 2006 9:18 PM PDT   0 recs

I'M STILL PRETTY BUMMED THOUGH
"East Oakland, Yeah that's right" - Too Short

by bart on Oct 11, 2006 9:18 PM PDT   0 recs

grover, I didn't forget to rag on Macha,
I happen to feel that he hasn't managed all that poorly. Sure, I would have liked to see Kennedy vs. Gomez in the 6th, but Gomez also could easily have flied to CF.

The decisions that have hurt the A's the most were the decisions about the rotation (not Macha's). The on-field actions that have hurt the A's the most were Zito and Loaiza not having good starts--and no, you don't just yank a guy automatically after 3 runs--Chavy not making plays he usually makes, and all the hitters combining to be Antonio Perez with RISP.

Blaming the manager is easy, but not accurate. Leyland has done a great job; that doesn't mean Macha has done a bad job. And if I were a Tigers fan, I would have been screaming for Jamie Walker to face Chavy to lead off the 8th, followed by Zumaya to face Bradley and Thomas. What did Rodney do? He struck out the side. Great performances make for "great" managers. The players have to own the first two losses.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 11, 2006 9:27 PM PDT   0 recs

Nico...
I agree that the A's on the field have not played well. That being said, Macha has not made a pre-emptive move to prevent runs. Yes, because Leyland has made the moves that workout doesn't necessarily mean Macha has managed poorly, but today he did.
Further, will someone answer me this: Why pinch hit Melhuse in the post season, but only put him in that situation throughout the season, what, 5 times?
"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 9:34 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

My feeling tonight is that
the game was lost in the top of the 4th. If you pull Loaiza in the top of the 4th (by which time the bases are already loaded, if not runs already in), you have to go with Saarloos. Not what I want to see.

And if someone wanted to see Duke in the 4th or something, then we're just not on the same page because I don't know any manager, myself included, who would do that. Sometimes as a manager, you just have to hope that your guys perform--and when they don't you have to accept that they just didn't perform.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 11, 2006 9:40 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Nope
As a manager, you need to build a time machine, then keep going backwards and forwards in time making different moves until something works.
""Let's [stay] home and do this shit!"

by mikeA on Oct 11, 2006 9:45 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Interesting point, MikeA--
Let me think about it some more and get back to you yesterday.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 11, 2006 9:48 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I have transported myself to yesterday
so, what time is the game on Weds?  Hope we pull Loiza before it gets too bad.
a manager, my kingdom for a manager!

by ak_A on Oct 11, 2006 10:04 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Also, as I replay everything
in my mind, I keep coming back to the same main gripe: I have never felt Loaiza was the best choice to pitch two games, and at Haren's expense it just seems wrong, wrong, wrong. I thought the "5-5 split" was between rolling the dice with Harden going twice or going with Loaiza twice and Harden once. But Haren in Game 4 and Loaiza twice? I don't see how that got 1 vote, let alone 5.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 11, 2006 9:45 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Because
Haren has pitched badly for two months while Loaiza has pitched great.
Additionally, Haren's MO of throwing lots of straight fastballs in the zone seems ill-suited against the Tigers.
""Let's [stay] home and do this shit!"

by mikeA on Oct 11, 2006 9:47 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

That's not really true, though--
Following his Lidle-esque (RIP) August, Loaiza came back to earth to be solid but unspectacular in September. He has also always pitched best under the radar (e.g. Chicago, Washington) and worst in the spotlight (e.g. NYY). Haren has not pitched great lately, but he is a "big-game type" competitor with a track-record of LCS/WS success.

In other words, yes, Loaiza has pitched better than Haren over the last two months, but I trust Haren more in a big game.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 11, 2006 9:51 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I'm not saying
Loaiza was the obvious choice by any means.  It was a tough choice, but it's hard to criticize either way.  Frankly, going into the playoffs Zito worried me more than the other three.

Color me unimpressed with your "big game" and "spotlight" analysis.  That stuff only applies to Jeter.A few sucessful appearances out of the bullpen is hardly a "track-record" of LCS/WS success.  Also, I thought Loaiza looked better against Minnesota.  

""Let's [stay] home and do this shit!"

by mikeA on Oct 11, 2006 10:03 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

well
if it goes 7 both Haren and Harden could pitch...if Harden started game 4, then he'd be done.  So we could have Harden for 5 and Haren for 4 or something like that...assuming it goes 7.
But if your life is such a big joke, then why should I care?

by johnspaz7 on Oct 12, 2006 8:25 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Not the 4th....
This game was lost in the 6th. I can hear the thoughts run through Macha's mind now, "Oh boy E-Lo could get through 6 with only 80 pitches. I can squeeze another inning out of him if he gets through this inning. Ok, just this last lefty who already has a hit against our teetering righty. C'mon E-Lo, just 1 more then on to the 7th. I know that we are down by 2 already and another run would really be demorallizing and mountain of a comeback would be needed, but I really want to get E-Lo into the 7th. I need to save the pen for Friday."
"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 9:55 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I don't agree; I think it was lost
in the 4th. We had the lead, and a chance to keep the lead for just a couple innings and we could ask Calero, Duke, and Street to pitch as many as 4 innings to protect a lead.

In the 6th we trailed by 2. If we keep the deficit to 2, and the game progresses as it did, there's no reason to think we ever would have taken the lead. We would have had a better chance, but that's it.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 11, 2006 10:01 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

But that's the point....
Macha doesn't take the initative to keep the deficit as it is. I think the game plays out differently if he doesn't give up that 2 run shot. Maybe we score those 2 runs and it is tied after seven. And if it is then most likely we see Duke in the ninth and maybe (definitely) doesn't give up the homer to Granderson. I just think that in a game as big as this you play as if the game is tied if it's still within striking distance which it was up until the 6th.
"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 10:06 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Sure,
But sometimes as the manager, if they're not performing you don't just sit on your hands.

And people were making fun of Leyland before the series started for going Roberston-Verlander-Rogers-Bonderman. He's so dumb.

On Sunday, Minaya ticked off a list of candidates to join the rotation, and for once this season, none of them was Jose Lima.

by rfloh on Oct 11, 2006 9:57 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I still think, and I'll continue to think,
that the Tigers played it wrong by throwing Robertson twice and Bonderman once. But the more the players perform, the better Leyland will look, and the less the players perform, the worse Macha will look. Or vice-verse and verse-vica.

If Robertson had gotten shelled--as he well could have--and if Zito and Loaiza had been on their game--as they were in the ALDS--who would look good and who would look bad?

The A's pitched and fielded like crap in the 4th inning. That's one of the main reasons they lost. And the manager's job in the first 4 innings of a game is generally to sit on his hands, because unless you want to overmanage (like much of AN), the right move is usually to make sure you're sitting in your "lucky seat" as you hope for the best.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 11, 2006 10:05 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I don't disagree about your 4th inning analysis.
It's the 6th I have the problem with. And I'll use your logic to support the idea tha we needed our best relievers in there despite any homers they may give up to leadoff hitters that weigh a buck 10 to straight away center. :(
"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 10:09 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

My personal opinion is that
Kennedy should have come in to face Gomez in the 6th--but that's pretty easy for me to say now. My point is, I don't think it cost us the game; that cost us a slightly better chance to win but probably still lose. Macha's part in the loss was, IMO, minimal, and other people's far bigger.

And anyway, had Kennedy come in to face Gomez, apparently what would have happened is that Gomez would have hit a routine chopper to second that Jimenez booted.

For which, of course, Macha would be blamed. :-}

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 11, 2006 10:14 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Logic when it's convenient....
Yes, we can always say, no matter what the situation, that any alternative move would've yielded just as bad as a result as the actual move. I just don't see any reason NOT to take out E-Lo in that situation. No reason at all. Please let me know what the reason is, if you have any ideas.
"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 10:18 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Playing devil's advocate:
  • ELo was only at 84 pitches and had settled down prior to the Monroe double.
  • Guys like Gaudin, Kennedy, Blanton, and Saarloos are not really an upgrade.
  • Even in a 7-game series, if you use Calero, Duke, and Street in the 6th inning of games you're trailing, you are likely to find them unavailable in the 7th, 8th, or 9th inning of games you're leading.
Those are the best I've got--keeping in mind that I keep saying I would have liked to see Kennedy brought in to face Gomez. (And that I think we probably still would have lost anyway.)
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 11, 2006 10:23 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Remember ...
Kennedy is beter against right-handed batters. We don't have a LOOGY

by Eck on Oct 11, 2006 10:25 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Those are regular season reasons. -Tupac.
"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Oct 11, 2006 10:31 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Are you saying
there's no need to manage the playoff  games any differently than the regular season games?

by Salvatore on Oct 11, 2006 10:10 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

That's not what I'm saying,
as evidenced by the fact that I've never said anything like it.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 11, 2006 10:16 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I can think of 2 reasons
why Leyland made the decision he did. One, the "dance with what brung you" reason, not disrupting the pitchers comfort level. The other would be to allow all of them to get the maximum amount of rest.

Would you consider Leyland to have overmanaged? Not just in this series, but also in the Yankees series, and throughout the season? Because Leyland has shown throughout the season a willingness to do the things that Macha doesn't like / want to do.

Macha has made a habit of trying to squeeze the most possible out of his starters. This might be understandable, if he's been given Boston's bullpen. He also has been reluctant to platoon players when they should be platooned. Furthermore, he's reluctant to move players around in the rotation, even when they arguably should be moved.

On Sunday, Minaya ticked off a list of candidates to join the rotation, and for once this season, none of them was Jose Lima.

by rfloh on Oct 11, 2006 10:20 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

"Dance with what brung you"--
So the way Macha manages the pitching: Where did it bring the A's?
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 11, 2006 10:28 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I didn't say that was the only
reason.

And that was just a minor point in my post.

On Sunday, Minaya ticked off a list of candidates to join the rotation, and for once this season, none of them was Jose Lima.

by rfloh on Oct 11, 2006 10:35 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

And you're taking
my comment out of context. The comment was that Leyland didn't want to disrupt the starters' comfort level / schedule.
On Sunday, Minaya ticked off a list of candidates to join the rotation, and for once this season, none of them was Jose Lima.

by rfloh on Oct 11, 2006 10:39 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I get that. My reply is that
the "comfort level" of the A's pitchers doesn't have Duchscherer coming in to a game in the 6th when the A's are trailing, or whatever people were pining for. It cuts both ways--except Detroit's pitchers pitched better, so Leyland looks better.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 11, 2006 10:44 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs