The Official FIRE MACHA NOW List of Gripes
[editor's note, by Nick86] It seems as if I've confused many ANers with an oft-used deviced known as "sarcasm." For the record, I think Macha is a perfectly capable and effective manager. Please read the entire article (not just the caps) before responding with "Your arguments for criticizing Macha are dumb" or "Boy, you're so right about Macha!" The following is a semi-accurate caricature containing anti-Macha arguments that I have heard too many times on AN.
Ever since Kenneth Edward Macha became manager before the 2003 season, I've hated him. In fact, I've sometimes questioned if he had ever partook in or witnessed a baseball game prior to his 2003 managerial debut. I've also wondered whether he is the A's manager simply because he is blackmailing Billy Beane, or because Beane wanted a horrific manager so winning the World Series wouldn't be "too easy." Of course, many of you ANers feel the same way, so I decided to make a short lists of complaints I've heard from the various Macha-haters of AN. Here it is:
GRIPE #1: MACHA CHANGES THE BATTING ORDER ALL THE TIME!!!
Macha changes the batting order all the time, which prevents our star players from becoming comfortable in their roles. One day, Dan Johnson is batting 6th, the next day, he's batting 7th, the next day he's batting 6th again. How can a player go out and compete if he doesn't know where in the order he's going to hit? What if he gets confused and forgets to bat at all? We haven't seen that one yet...no thanks to you, Macha.
GRIPE #2: MACHA NEVER CHANGES THE BATTING ORDER, EVEN WHEN IT'S CLEAR HE SHOULD!!!
Remember when Macha had Kotsay leading off and Kendall hitting second, even though Kotsay is like Barry Bonds out of the two-spot and Lou Merloni leading off? He finally switched them...but then he refused to hit Ellis first and Kendall ninth? And even if he DID hit Kendall ninth this year, he would be punishing a gritty, hard-nosed player with a .380 career on base percentage on the brink of figuring it out who came on strong at the end of the year, and we'd STILL HATE HIM!
GRIPE #3: MACHA DOESN'T PINCH HIT, OR USE OUR LEFTY SPECIALIST RINCON!!!
For whatever reason, Macha refuses to put in our lefty specialist(s) against good lefty hitters, even though almost every other manager does. As a baseball fan, I want to see a lot of mid-inning pitching changes where we substitute in Rincon to get that lefty-lefty advantage against Texeira, Garret Anderson, and other top lefties.
GRIPE #4: MACHA USES RINCON ALL THE TIME, AND OTHER RELIEVERS NOT NAMED DUKE OR STREET
Only an idiot would use a reliever with numbers as bad as Rincon's. In fact, I don't think I can remember one time in all the games I watched where Rincon didn't blow an A's lead and pick up the loss. Every time Rincon gives up a run, I just say, "Crap, that was Macha's fault." But it's not just Rincon. Macha last year pitched relievers Jay Witasick, Kiko Calero, Seth Etherton, Ron Flores, Joe Kennedy, and many other relievers not named Ducscherer and Street multiple times! Every time he did, I cringed! Even though Ducscherer was third in Innings Pitched among AL relievers last year...he should have been second, and Street should have been first!
GRIPE #5: MACHA NEVER EXECUTES THE HIT AND RUN, EVEN WITH CONTACT HITTER JASON KENDALL
From reading Moneyball, we all know about Billy Beane's fondness for the hit and run. Yet despite this fondness, Macha steadfastly refuses to adhere to his boss's wishes and hit-and-run. Shame on you, Macha.
GRIPE #6: MACHA NEVER PLAYS OUR BENCH PLAYERS, SO WHEN THEY GET IN, THEY STRUGGLE!!
Macha doesn't play our bench players as much as he should, and for whatever reason plays only OUR BEST PLAYERS. In addition to damaging team morale, it renders our back-ups ineffective. Macha should be blamed for the struggles of 2002 Al MVP Marco Scutaro, four-time All-Star Keith Ginter, Zeus's nephew Eric Byrnes, and future Hall of Famer Erik Karros.
There you have it: Macha sucks. He always changes the lineup, he never changes the lineup, he never uses Rincon, he uses Rincon too much, he doesn't hit-and-run, and he only plays our best players. I'm sure there are more areas where Macha needs improvement. Feel free to add your own.
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ROFL!!!
Go get 'em
Just tell them your mom has won as many pennants as Billy Beane and they usually go away.
Macha isn't a good manager, but in the Moneyball belief system the manager isn't worth much. What happens then is that you have a laid-back college atmosphere that never galvanizes into a winner.
Just good enough is good enough for the majority of fans on AN.
by wonderbread74 on Jan 26, 2006 3:33 PM PST reply actions
"Macha isn't a good manager" ...
And please let's retire the "AN is a bunch of Gabba Gabba Beane zombies" nonsense. Posters get flamed on AN because of the quality of their argument and/or expression thereof, not because thee hath spat 'pon the sacred Beane.
Do I detect a hint of sarcasm in this post?
I got a better reason
Funniest. Macha. Diary. Ever.
Hilarious!
I Blame Ken Macha
Bad cup of coffee this morning....fire Macha.
Boss yells at me...fire Macha.
Got mad cow from lunch at McDonalds....fire Macha.
Sat next to a smelly dude on BART...fire Macha.
The girl I liked on "Survivor" gets kicked off...fire Macha.
Wife says, "not tonight, honey"...fire Macha.
Ken Macha makes life livable.
by Mission1929 on Jan 26, 2006 4:16 PM PST reply actions
Finger in your Wendy's chili?
Also Macha's Fault
Abandoned puppies and kittens.
Latch-key kids.
Maria Carey getting fat.
by SportySpice @ Athletics Nation on Jan 26, 2006 4:40 PM PST reply actions
I KNEW IT!!
by BobbyCrosbysGirl on Jan 26, 2006 4:51 PM PST up reply actions
Is this serious?
The third and fourth condradict eachother. He never plays rincon, but he does all the time. huh?
5th is basically billy's call.
And for the last one, how many times is Macha supposed to play the bench. The only guys who sat last year were Melhuse, because of kendall, and Ginter cause he blew. Why would you want to replace a mark ellis, bobby crosby, or eric chavez, for Ginter?
I'm kinda getting tired of FIRE MACHA all the time. People, we were injured last year, started dreadfully, were counted out before the season started, and still battled into the last week. What more do you want from a manager but an even keel who doesn't throw around blame, and keeps his team optimistic and feeling good.
People have too much time on their hands.
Feel free to critique.
Solution
by secret ASian man on Jan 26, 2006 5:25 PM PST up reply actions
Not a contradiction
He does the exact opposite of what all other managers do.
by OaktownTribesman on Jan 26, 2006 7:09 PM PST up reply actions
Rauber23....
by Nick86 on Jan 26, 2006 5:08 PM PST reply actions
yeah, that must be it
Well done.
I think it speaks
by Nick86 on Jan 26, 2006 5:11 PM PST reply actions
yea maybe i shoulda read it
I swear, when we win the World series....
by Rob @ Athletics Nation on Jan 26, 2006 5:58 PM PST reply actions
Point Number Five
It's not called hit-and-run with Kendall, though. It's called a grounder-to-an-eagerly-waiting-middle-infielder.
He'll be better this year, though.
Managing: More than just Being There
I happen to think Macha sucks as a manager because he sits back and watches bad things happen without response. Bad umpire calls, bad lineups, bad bench utilization...at least he's still smiling, if not actually doing anything.
Though civil engineer Kenny is clearly a smart fellow, as a manager he's fencepost material. A few months back I dubbed him Chauncey Manager for the beatific placidity with which he's willing to watch disaster unfold around him. I stand by that label...FIRE CHAUNCEY NOW!!
And if you insist there's some reverse intelligence correlation among us FMN'ers, I'm afraid I'll have no choice but to challenge you to a duel...say, No. 2 pencils at 30 paces?
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Jan 26, 2006 8:00 PM PST reply actions
Hyphenation, please!
Small difference, granted, but an important distinction.
I may grind slowly, but I do grind finely.
... and would the title of the movie in which Macha stars be ... Beaneing There?
I thought you were in the hyphens are archaic camp
Of course, by the modern usage standard we'll soon all be talking about the lovable loosers of Wrigley Field letting lose their voices in the 7th inning.
Man, I gotta stop typing...in closing, only users loose drugs.
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Jan 26, 2006 8:24 PM PST up reply actions
Lucy goo, see!
thank you
by gWiLiKeRzZz on Jan 27, 2006 12:04 AM PST up reply actions
I see a HUGE potential problem...
by rsur5 on Jan 27, 2006 2:26 AM PST reply actions
i heard it
The "but not before that" referred to when Macha and Bradley talked, not to Bradley's enthusiam about the trade prior to hearing from Chavvy and Kots. I know the comma use is confusing and can be misread, but I heard it with my own ears and didn't have the same take as you.
For more in depth analysis of this "HUGE potential problem" you cite, consult the recap diary of Macha's appearance on KNBR that I did along with AsGirl and eamb.
My two gripes
- I was unpleasantly surprised when he went to Foulke in the 8th inning of game 4 (game winning double off the green monster by Ortiz).
- I will probably never forgive him for pinch hitting for Dye with runners on 2nd and 3rd, one out in the bottom of the 9th, down by one.
Foulke
by regfairfield on Jan 27, 2006 7:34 AM PST up reply actions
Yep
Again, this move didn't get to me as bad as pinch hitting for Dye the next day, but it didn't seem right to me at the time, and the results were awful.
Don't be mad at Foulke
Great list
by OaktownTribesman on Jan 27, 2006 5:51 AM PST reply actions
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
I hear you.
by baseballgirl on Jan 27, 2006 10:36 AM PST up reply actions
Macha
by Nick86 on Jan 27, 2006 3:47 PM PST reply actions
as a consistent Macha-basher ...
Nick, here's my issue with your diary: you're looking for consistency in the amalgam of criticisms of Macha, as if there was a monolithic single point to be made against him. It's very rare that any single poster makes the self-contradictory arguments you've posited, and to imply that all arguments contra Macha are moot because of the self-contradiction en masse is, to me, foolish.
You also seem to imply that one can either love or loathe Macha, when, as is the case with most of the A's players, Macha actually presents an array of strengths and weaknesses that can be appreciated and critiqued on a one-by-one basis.
And, as with the "AN is a mass of glassy-eyed Beaneac zombies" posters who pop up occasionally, you're either creating a straw man or letting a tiny handful of zealots synecdochally stand for AN as a whole.
That being said, this post in particular I agree with you 100%: we do tend to recall the catastrophically bad outcomes over the established pattern of good outcomes that preceded them. And many folks (myself included) are occasionally a bit unjudicious in their critiques of Macha.
According to the OED
by green star oakland on Jan 27, 2006 5:07 PM PST up reply actions
Moist with your own bombard
by green star oakland on Jan 27, 2006 7:37 PM PST up reply actions
Royced by my own clayton
As a consistent Macha supporter...
What I think Nick was trying to humorously illustrate is that Ken Macha gets consistently ripped no matter what he does, win or lose. Perhaps the Cult of Beane is partly to blame, perhaps it's Ken's own mellow personality, but he gets far less credit, and far more blame, than your average Major League manager. It's not a "straw man"....it's reality.
Think back to the voting for AL Manager of the Year. When Macha finished a distant fourth, there was hardly a peep of protest here at AN, or anywhere else (except for the ever equitable Mychael Urban, who thought Macha was shafted, and came out and said so). Why? Does anyone here actually believe that Joe Torre did a better job with the Yankees last year than Macha did in Oakland? Where were the howls (or, even, whimpers) of protest?
by Mission1929 on Jan 27, 2006 5:39 PM PST up reply actions
b.s.
Back that up, please.
b.s.????
Perhaps the point of my last paragraph was unclear...
Ken Macha finishes below Joe Torre in the voting for AL Manager of the year...is that not a glaring example of Macha getting far less credit than he is due?
by Mission1929 on Jan 27, 2006 6:24 PM PST up reply actions
o.k., Cletus ...
You cited his fourth-place finish for MOTY.
Now, correct me if my math is wrong (or if math is also too snooty and pointy-headed for your liking), but fourth out of 14 calculates out to roughly the top 29% of AL managers.
And that's even if you grant that MOTY voting by the BBWA members is a valid "measurement" of respect.
And if you grant that BBWA members are representative of the overall respect- and derision-granting baseball community; your initial comments implied more of a fan-wide sentiment regarding manager assessment, not just among beat writers.
I'm not intimately familiar with other teams' fan bases, but I'd venture a guess (not a certainty by any means, and I may well be 100% wrong) that Macha actually receives from AN more thoughtful and respectful critiques and appreciations -- yours certainly included -- than other teams' managers do in general or at the other SN sites. (That's my AN homerism: from my sporadic reading of other SN sites, we have a far better and bigger reader/writer population.)
A fourth-place finish for the manager of a team that finishes 7 games out of first is, to me, a pretty impressive result for Macha, given the biases of the BBWA voters. I won't even argue that that's an overrating of Macha -- Macha in fact did an excellent job keeping the team motivated and positive through a hard slog of what was frankly a rebuilding season for the A's.
Look, the FIRE MACHA NOW crowd is about as sizable as (and has a lot of overlap with) the annoying trolls at AN.
The number of posters who have legitimate and well thought out critiques of certain and various aspects of Macha's strategic decisions is broad and diverse -- and is in the main respectful of Macha's demonstrated strengths and/or acknowledging of the fact that managerial strategy is not, in fact, a significant determinant of the outcomes of a lot of games. As with most disputes at AN (and this one as well), it's splitting hairs, looking for granular distinctions at the thin edge of the factors that determine the likelihoods of wins and losses.
I'm entirely amenable to the sentiment "Cut Macha some slack"; I'm opposed to ludicrous assertions of nonfacts backed up by obstinate refusal to answer to the facticity of those arguments.
Excuse me, that last paragraph probably offends you. Let me put it this way: "You're wrong because you're making shit up." That better?
pinch hitting for Dye
Not only that, I read multiple reports after that game in which it seemed clear that the sox were going to intentially walk Dye, giving us bases loaded and 1 out, with Melhuse still available.
I also remember a very stupid Macha comment in which he basically said something like he went with Melhuse because he thought that was the best chance to win the game and he felt they needed to win it, not tie it. In other words, he was afraid that Dye would only hit a sac fly, and he didn't like our chances in extra innings.
Don't get me wrong, I don't think Macha single-handedly lost the series, he got a ton of help from Byrnes and Miggy in game 3. But with the season on the line (bottom of the 9th game 5, it doesn't get more on the line) I disagree with going to an unproven back-up catcher who happened to have a good game earlier in the series as opposed to an RBI machine who happened to have a crappy season.
Monkeyball
I also agree that i've probably been a little unfair to the members (even the Macha hating ones) of AN. Obviously I find some people on AN pretty intelligent and insightful, or I simply wold never visit. Nevertheless, I have heard variations of all six arguments on this website many, many times, although people rarely put the arguments that contradict each other in the same thread. If you don't believe me, look at the first twenty comments on this diary.
You also say that you have to either love or hate Macha. I disagree. Personally, I think we could make Mark Kotsay player/manager and drop only a game or two in the standings. To prove it, here are my two (actual) complaints about Macha.
- In game 3 of the 2003 ALDS, Eric Byrnes dashed home and was clearly interfered with by Jason Varitek. The umps got the call wrong, and Macha didn't go out to argue. If he did, they probably wouldn't have overturned the call, but who knows?
- In a memorable indians game last year that the A's ended up winning, the A's had runners on first and second in a tie game with no one out after an impressive comeback. Melhuse was set to pinch hit for Scutaro, but then Macha called Melhuse back so Scutaro could lay down a bunt. Scutaro bunted and the runner was forced at third. Although this was certainly one of those rare moments where a successful bunt increased the odds of the A's winning a game, what Macha should have done was leave Scutaro in the game, and have him swing away (because everyone KNEW macha left Scutaro in to bunt). It would have been more awesome if he showed bunt and took the first pitch, and then swung away at the second.
by Nick86 on Jan 27, 2006 7:54 PM PST reply actions
Macha is not a risk taker..he is a civil engineer!
Sometimes is seems clear that for weeks on end the series of decisions we see coming from Macha (whether it be lineup decisions, sending runners or not, or pitching change decisions) are so predictable that most of us on AN can easily know in advance what he is going to do in most every situation...... I am a civil engineer, and Ken's educational background is also as a civil engineer, so although I sometimes want him to take more of a risk and try to pull a suprise now and then, he always seems to fall back on his conservative mind-set, "play it by the numbers" and "play it like Billy likes it" approach.
Now that I have read my own post........
Don't forget Macha's role in the Tsunami
One apparently serious comment about Macha above was:
"He does the exact opposite of what all other managers do"
Now, I'm not a philosopher or expert in logic but this comment raises some interesting questions doesn't it?
If Macha does the exact opposite of ALL other managers, does that mean they all do the exact same thing?
If this is true and Macha had not come back, it would have made absolutely no difference who replaced him since they all do exactly the same thing.
What is the exact opposite of making Haren the # 3 starter?
What is most opposite of bringing the infield in..putting them on the warning track?
What is the most opposite of yelling...Humm Now Chavvy!
What is more opposite of taking Haren out in the 6th...taking him out in the 5th, or 8th?
What is most opposite of batting Kendall in prime double play position?
If Macha chooses a Ham on Rye after the game, what would be the most opposite of that?
What is more opposite of a post-game Bud Light...a post-game Michelob or a pre-game Michelob?
signed..too much time on my hands in Nebraska
by ropeinthegap on Jan 28, 2006 7:59 AM PST reply actions
I meant
In other words, he fixes it if it ain't broke, but doesn't fix it if it is broke.
by OaktownTribesman on Jan 28, 2006 6:16 PM PST up reply actions

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