Goodbye Andrew! Was It Enough? Who Might Be Next?
by DanHennessey31 on Dec 29, 2011 8:02 AM PST
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PrintThe Red Sox have found their closer, and the A's continue to ship off pieces to grab more players that might be around in 2015 and beyond:
When the Boston Red Sox acquired reliever Mark Melancon from the Houston Astros, it looked as if they had found a potential replacement for departed closer Jonathan Papelbon. But the Red Sox didn't stop dealing, acquiring low-salary closer Andrew Bailey and outfielder Ryan Sweeney from the Oakland A's. From Buster Olney:
The Red Sox have acquired Andrew Bailey from Oakland... Details to come ...Olney later elaborated on the deal in a series of tweets. To wit: Bailey and Sweeney went to the Red Sox in exchange for Josh Reddick and prospects Miles Head and Raul Alcantara.
As Grant noted, the A's were in need of outfielders, but they included the only one they currently had to get Reddick. So they're still at one. Which is not enough.
And anyone who's upset about losing Ryan Sweeney for baseball-related reasons is probably wrong about whatever they're thinking. Sweeney is a good defender who hits for no power and is a good fourth/fifth outfielder for a contender. The A's are not a contender. Obviously there are some Sweeney fans out there who will be upset for other reasons, and to them I say, "Sorry, Mr. and Mrs. Sweeney."
Obviously Bailey is the most valuable piece of this trade, but without him here next season, the A's will win 71 games instead of 74. He would have been very expensive by the time the A's are ready to be good in 2015 or 2016. And while he's had good results, he's not without warts. Bailey has had trouble staying healthy and has benefited a great deal from the A's outfield defense and, more importantly, the cavernous Coliseum. Boston just acquired a good pitcher, three years away from being costly, but he's not Papelbon.
Of the three players the A's received, only Reddick is close to the majors. Reddick has had 400 plate appearances in the big leagues over the last three years and is only 24 years old. Apparently he can play all three outfield positions, but centerfield in Oakland is different than centerfield for other teams (though to be fair, it's no picnic in Boston either). As a hitter, he doesn't profile as anything special. I kind of see him as Ryan Sweeney with more power and some upside remaining.
If that's the case, then the trade really boils down to Bailey for two prospects that can't legally drink yet. I know nothing about prospects and have never claimed to, but this guy does, and it seems like both prospects are high-risk, high-reward type of guys. For an injury-prone closer, I think it's fair value to get two shots at a player with a high ceiling.
The Opening Day roster next season may remind us of the scene from Major League in which the Tribe front office attempts to put together a roster ("This guy's dead!"). Of the guys remaining, Suzuki makes sense to move if there's a taker, both Dallas Braden and Brandon McCarthy are candidates to be on their way if they show they're healthy and effective, and most of the bullpen should of course be as well. (Grant Balfour, Brian Fuentes, and anyone else making more than the minimum).
It'll become a familiar refrain, but the losing for the next couple of years is part of the plan. I suppose it's your opinion of the plan that really matters.
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I voted "yes", but I have reservations.
My concern is that the FO won’t commit fully, and will pull another “Holiday” fiasco.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
At this point...
Not committing all the way would look terrible. He just sold off three of his best five players, all under the age of 28. I don’t think they have a choice
by DanHennessey31 on Dec 29, 2011 8:38 AM PST up reply actions
True.
I’m more concerned with 2014. They need to see this through ALL the way.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
ugh
what we would still have, were it not for the Holiday trade
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
We heard when Haren
and Swisher were traded we were building for 2011/2012. Now we’re building for 2014-2015. If a GM is graded on his body of work, and his body of work suggests a losing record for 10 or so consecutive years is a strong possibility, isn’t it time to look at the business model itself? I personally am not excited to be Kansas City West.
both trades netted us valuable pieces
the problem was turning around and shipping CarGon out to the Rockies for 1/2 a year of Holliday
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
I'd love the Kansas Cit y model. They look like a contender in the next year or two
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:33 AM PST up reply actions 2 recs
If I recognise anyone in an A's jersey come opening day then Beane has failed.
Make it happen, Billy.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
by OldhamA on Dec 29, 2011 8:08 AM PST reply actions 2 recs
I don't agree with trading Sweeney at this point.
I would have waited until the end of ST, or into the season. We traded him at his lowest value. If he proves to be healthy in ST, and puts up good numbers, we would have gotten a better return. If not, the return wouldn’t have been any worse.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
i think his injury history would trump anything he did short term, but yes it's possible that it could have netted us something modestly better.
what bugs me is that we trying to grab all these b-/c+ prospects that don’t seem to have many skills at all. i’ll exempt brandon allen because he seems athletic and is not a defensive liability. but carter, kila and head?
these guys have contact issues and no natural position. yay!
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
by stm72 on Dec 29, 2011 8:48 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
That is my concern as well.
The returns don’t seem to be of much improvement. Where is the trade for a Smoak( who at least has possiblities), Trout, etc.? Sounds like we got a lot of Minor League filler. To be clear, I’m am talking about the positional players only.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
i think it's just proof of what a lot of guys around here have been saying. that some of our players just don't have much value in trades. we just have really weak pieces.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
you're probably right, which was why we were pretty much
sucking in the first place. I agree with the blow ‘em up faction. If you’re going to scrub the place clean, don’t insult your fanbase by trying to put a dress on the pig. I can respect an overt surrender. On the other hand, if we’re not getting anything back but career minor leaguers, then the A’s are going to be losing for a lot longer than just 3 years since I would assume we’ll have to rebuild largely through the draft and to a lesser extent FA.
what bugs me is that our drafts haven't been great either. is it bad luck or poor strategy? either way...
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
that's true. i'm thinking though that if the A's suck...
as much as they should after this purge, then we’ll be picking much higher than normal for a few years. right now they should just dump payroll to absolute minimum and eat the consequences and presumably save up for FA spending when a new facility is presumably open for business with a demographic that will be willing and able to spend for that spree.
in the meantime, hopefully people have reliable “backup” teams to keep them into baseball.
And most draftees won't be ready for 2015 anyway.
Some of these trade prospects will HAVE to play before 2015.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
they'll be fielding a triple A squad in essence anyway,
so I don’t expect they’ll have too much trouble with a trial-bypfire approach with a gaggle of longshots.
Yes, but doesn't this also mean that we will be burning up their service time?
Which means they will be at the end of their time here when 2015 rolls around.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
And we aren't talking about AAA players here.
We are talking about AA for most of them.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
that's just for some of these new prospects. but it's the
Cats that are going to have to fill the breach for now. if one of the kids gets hot in AA or something, they’ll probably give ’em a go earlier than normal.
which is why paul thomas is saying that it's not likely that the rebuild is complete. there will be a few more steps backward before we go forwards. yay!
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
i just don't know. i didn't think much of our triple A prospects
as it was, but if anything we’ll get a really good look at how talented or not our trainees are. someone has to man those positions, right? just hope one or two emerge from extended pt.
it will be a pos team the next few years. it'll be really bad. really bad.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
(sniff) I want my mommy....
god, the last two weeks have me reaching for the
Kleenex.
there could be some 3 game series in which we get outscored by 15-20 runs.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
imagine the amazing banter
between kuip and Fosse…..Last year the TV audience was around 30-40k,…this year maybe a 5-10k? ouch
they're gonna drink during games. heavily.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
by stm72 on Dec 29, 2011 9:51 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
that might get viewership right back up
hmm….there’s a potential marketing thing here somewhere
that'd be great
Fosse as Harry Doyle, empty whiskey bottles next to the mic. Norm Macdonald has a hilarious stand up routine about hanging with uecker in the press box during a game. Worth U’tubing.
harry doyle style
Win or lose, we'll always be there for you.
by johnjahafanclub on Dec 29, 2011 10:29 AM PST up reply actions
They haven't done a bad job
You just have to be very lucky to get a star after the first few picks. If you ask “who was available when we picked?” you’ll see that we have done a very solid job.
I sorta agree
Carter was had awhile back and hasn’t proven to be the OF/1B the A’s hope he would be. Kila that is a strange pick up. I think Head is a longer solution at 1B or maybe a potential try 3B and hope it works better then Wallace. But he’s the youngest out of the bunch and has time to improve. Carter/Kila not so much
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
Exactly
So long as we’re not in the same predicament come 2014 and 90% of the team is shipped elsewhere again, I’m ok with playing “Who’s on first” this season.
** Rule of Tree ** Pounding the Rock ** Battle of Cali ** Fear the Fin ** Athletics Nation ** Niners Nation **
Why would we not be? Who in the farm system do you believe can step up and make the
team a winner, or be traded for someone who can? I’m having a hard time seeing anyone.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:36 AM PST up reply actions
Two differing views of Miles Head's defensive abilities from last year
Last May, Sons of Sam Horn posted this profile of Miles Head. This was before he spent the first few months of last season crushing the ball in the South Atlantic League. The soxprospects.com scouting report they quote mentions that he was drafted out of high school as a 3B/C and then moved to 1B in the minors.
“While he looked like an average to below-average third baseman early on, he could prove to be an above-average first baseman. Good reaction time, soft hands, and scoops balls in the dirt well.”
FWIW, they also like his arm strength.
Last July, scoutingthesally.com posted a report on Head that included some embedded youtube video of him hitting. Their report is much less sanguine — a bit dismissive of the great hitting numbers he put up last season, and totally unimpressed with his talents in the field:
“Lacked athleticism; Struggled to scoop throws at his shoe tops; Feet tied up on foul balls…Well below average defense; Projects as DH or liability at 1B…his overall skill set plays like a poor man’s Matt LaPorta.”
He is still very young, and
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
oops, cut off that last sentence!
He’s still very young, and he’s already shown pretty good plate discipline and good power, though at a low level. He won’t win any accolades for athleticism, but if the A’s are right that he could handle 3B I think he’d could be a reasonably well-regarded prospect.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Poor man's Matt LaPorta...
Is the world’s most backhanded compliment/in-your-face slight. I’m not even sure what it means other than that he won’t hit baseballs very well.
by DanHennessey31 on Dec 29, 2011 8:41 AM PST up reply actions
The guy who wrote that doesn't mean it as a compliment, backhanded or no...
He’s calling him a slow, defensively useless RH AAAA masher, I think.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Agreed
My point was poorly stated. I’ll be more blunt about it now.
THAT’S AN AWFUL COMPARISON FOR A BASEBALL PLAYER YOU HOPE WILL BE GOOD.
Thank you.
by DanHennessey31 on Dec 29, 2011 8:56 AM PST up reply actions
No doubt, but look at the other scouting report
that actually says he projects as a good 1B, with soft hands. There doesn’t seem to be a consensus here.
And remember that he is only 20, and absolutely crushed the ball for a couple of months in Greenville before being promoted in the middle of last season. .338/.409/.612 with a 30/53 BB/K as a 20-year-old in A-ball is legitimate raking.
Not to pull a total sour-grapes assessment, here, but compare Head with Middlebrooks, whom Sickels lists as the Red Sox’ #3 prospect, and grades as a B. As a 20-year old at Greenville, his line was .265/.349/.404, with a 48/123 BB/K. People seem impressed with Middlebrooks’ athleticism, and he’s subsequently done well at higher levels. But I think it’s obvious that Head was a much better hitter at the same age in the same league.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Such a pointless observation on his part
considering what comes to mind for me is a highly rated prospect who was a top 25 prospect in back to back years. Yeah, he didn’t work out, but he was the centerpiece of the Sabathia deal and it was thought that he would continue to mash when called up.
He may have meant it as a slight, but it’s a pointless comparison.
"Minutes from the last save opportunity...Balfour got 3 outs..."- Nico
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 11:07 AM PST up reply actions
Brett Wallace?
Brett Wallace was a better 3B than that description of Head, and that didn’t work out so well.
I don't think anyone's counting on Head (waits for laughter to subside), but we were hoping
he would at least have a chance to be successful if he can really really hit. I’m not seeing it.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:37 AM PST up reply actions
I dig the youtube video
As opposed to a glam video of his greatest hits, they did the complete opposite to prove their opinion that he sucks. I have never watched a video of foul tips and swing throughs before. Kudos for capturing exactly what you wanted to scoutingthesally.com …that is unless Miles Head really hit .000 with a lot of foul outs.
The world is not your Trade Machine.
-Ziller
@James_Ham
www.cowbellkingdom.com
Not a fan
Looking closer at Reddick’s major and minor league numbers, I don’t get it. A slight uphrade over Sweeney. I’d have preferred to keep Sweeney and get a couple of better prospects. Billy seemed to be in a rush. I can’t believe he couldn’t have gotten a bit more by holding out. What’s the rush?
I think Reddick is more than just a slight upgrade over Sweeney
Reddick has shown consistent power in the minors, and he’s shown some HR power in the majors, as well. Unlike Swingles.
Career Major League numbers:
Sweeney — 1,681 PAs, 14 HRs
Reddick — 403 PAs, 10 HRs.
I don’t think Reddick resembles Sweeney so much as he resembles Cowgill, actually.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
I think for the rushing factor..
There is a chance Bailey’s elbow still could be a concern, for all we know it could blow up. Or he could be completely fine and would have fetch a better offer in July?
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
Well, we got some prospects who won't be ready until 2016
So that is good, right?
Reddick > Sweeney
Saved a bunch of $$$$ going forward.
We better sign Solis or Cespedes
If you meant Soler I agree.
Cespedes otoh doesn’t quite fit our timeline since he’s already in his mid-20s. He’s a player for a win now type team.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 8:49 AM PST up reply actions
Solar maybe but Cespedes isn't happening
He’s 26, wants 6-10 year deal? No way in hell he’s an A’s..Maybe after he’s 32.
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
I thought the NEW STADIUM was going to fix that. Isn't the NEW STADIUM a panacea?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:38 AM PST up reply actions
Since it doesn't exist yet I guess it can't fix current issues.
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
No but it shouldn't stop them from doing a 10 year deal unless it won't exist for more
than 10 years, no?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:59 AM PST up reply actions
I can agree with that - I think Beane is afraid of long term commitment
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
I guess I am too.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:02 AM PST up reply actions
Honestly, 10 years is a long time, but I also wouldn't expect anything "long term" until a shovel hits the dirt.
by LoneStranger on Dec 29, 2011 11:45 AM PST up reply actions
If it were me, I might not do anything long term till the first pitch in the
new place was thrown
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 12:04 PM PST up reply actions
He's supposedly 26
"Minutes from the last save opportunity...Balfour got 3 outs..."- Nico
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 11:08 AM PST up reply actions
I was impressed with Reddick
Stats aside (I realize that’s dangerous on this site) I remember thinking the Red Sox were going to have a pretty good outfielder last year in Reddick. My opinion was based on nothing but watching his confidence and aggressiveness. Seemed like he wanted to play. Being from Cedar Rapids, Iowa, myself I always wanted to see Sweeney excel, but have come to the same conclusion that most others have. He’s going to be a backup, not a starter—definitely not a star.
Face it a money drop
the Sweeney thing looks more like a money drop than a trade for the future. Sweeney can play CF with good defense something the A’s will need next year since none of the other outfielders are CF prospects. Reddick is not as good defensively but has a slight power but his OBA is much lower since he is not truly a good OBA guy. Wolfe is getting cheap so ask yourself why?
First to get San Jose the A’s will be sending the Giants money it always work out that way. Second Wolfe will be paying for the new stadium not San Jose. Wolfe is guttuing the team of money so he can pay for the other 2. Fact is until the stadium is built the A’s will be the lowest payroll in baseball.
A's don't need good defense in CF
What’s the downside of Cowgill or Reddick playing bad CF? We win 64 instead of 65 games?
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 9:12 AM PST up reply actions
But to the extent that they're trying to develop young pitchers
you’d like to put at least a reasonable defense out there to help them out.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
There's a big gap between good and reasonable
We are not talking about Cust playing shortstop. Cowgill or Reddick will still make a vast majority of plays that good CF would make.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 9:31 AM PST up reply actions
But they could cost the team 5-8 runs vs an average CF and 10-20 runs vs a gold glover
That’s not chicken feed or chopped liver.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:40 AM PST up reply actions
given all the problems with substandard players playing out of position, i'm not sure a league average-ish CF is a huge problem. problem, yes. huge problem? no.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
True, but I don't think we have one.
League average last year in CF for a starter was around 3 WAR — Adam Jones, Dexter Fowler and Austin Jackson. Neither Reddick nor Cowgill is at that level. They seem more like 1-2 WAR players.
It’s not a huge problem because the team will be terrible, but the pitchers aren’t going to like a substandard defense.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:54 AM PST up reply actions
the health of young pitchers is a big concern for me. extra pitches per inning can be a long term disaster. it's why jai miller in CF may not be a terrible idea.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
I'd probably go all defense just to give the pitchers a break on innings
and also boost their confidence and numbers. Also they need some durable long relievers like Livan Hernandez to soak up innings in blowouts
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:57 AM PST up reply actions
Should be decent at least
Cowbell and Reddick in CF and RF respectively should be a good set of flycatchers. Zooks, Weeks, and Penny up the middle is also serviceable.
Cardenas!!!! WoooooooooooooHOOOOOOOOO
I disagree that Cowgill in CF is a good flycatcher. Suzuki,
Pennington and Weeks are serviceable in the sense that they’re somewhat below average but not Cust-like, but I’d want better than them. I’m willing to tolerate Weeks in the short run since could improve but I’d definitely try to improve on Suzuki and Pennington.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 12:06 PM PST up reply actions
Hm.
Penny has the tools, he just makes too many errors. He’s still young enough to improve and consistency is one of those things that can/usually does get better.
Zooks is the very definition of an average catcher. That’s no knock on him at all and I’m not sure why there’s all this ‘hate’ for him.
Cardenas!!!! WoooooooooooooHOOOOOOOOO
Suzuki may be average but I'd want better than that with a
very young staff, at least defensively. If we were trying to win now and just needed an average catcher to fill the hole then he’d be fine
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 12:20 PM PST up reply actions
How is his game calling?
That may become very important with a young staff
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
It seems pretty good, judging from how well Gio,
Cahill and Anderson did at young ages. Some guy who analyzed catcher “framing” found him about average IIRC. Overall he seems non-terrible.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 12:52 PM PST up reply actions
Being an average catcher in MLB
means there are 15 guys in the WORLD who can do the job better than you.
Curious to hear your plans on getting Yadier Molina to mentor our young pitchers next year.
Kurt is roughly:
average framing
above average blocking/fielding
below average throwing
Cardenas!!!! WoooooooooooooHOOOOOOOOO
This was my point as well
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
Yes but there are guys cheaper than Kurt
who are above average defenders, but can’t hit. The idea would be get a prospect or two for Kurt, cut salary and get a better defender.
The Rays just did this with Jose Molina for example. He would have been my first choice, but there are still Henry Blanco and Matt Treanor running around…well slowly.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 3:21 PM PST up reply actions
I would take
being above average at least at one position.
ogallalabob
Are you bearish on Weeks?
"Minutes from the last save opportunity...Balfour got 3 outs..."- Nico
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 12:23 PM PST up reply actions
Not really, I think he could be a 3-4 WAR 2B in his prime.
I just think that might be more valuable to a contender who wants to win in 2012-14 than to a team looking to contend in 2015. I don’t think he’s an all-star or anything. He’s no Chase Utley for example.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 12:51 PM PST up reply actions
Weeks is 24
Chase Utley wasn’t Chase Utley as a 24 year old.
The thing with prospects/young players is that you really don’t know. Jemile is a first round pick so the tools/talent are there. Whether he fulfills his potential is what we have to wait and see.
Cardenas!!!! WoooooooooooooHOOOOOOOOO
Not all first round picks have the tools/talent/potential
to be Chase Utley. Unless he drastically changes his game, Weeks probably doesn’t have those tools. I think the most likely comparison for Weeks is Ray Durham, and I think that’s fairly realistic, too.
Durham was a pretty good player who posted
between 2.8 and 3.9 WAR nine times. That’s nice but not someone I’d call “untouchable”. I could live with it too, but I’d trade it in a rebuild in a second.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 3:24 PM PST up reply actions
Oh definitely.
I proposed trading him a while back to somebody like Toronto. I suspect it may be a trade that both sides are reluctant to make because the A’s would want value for a former first round draftee, top prospect, above-average second baseman of the future, while the other team would me wary of his injury history and skeptical as to whether he can repeat his numbers since he’s not a “proven” MLB player.
If someone wants to pay, then yeah. Do it.
I do expect he'll be part of the next round
of sell offs though.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 3:32 PM PST up reply actions
I think the A's are a little clingy with him.
“Untouchable” isn’t something you hear from Oakland’s FO very often, but they’ve thrown it around for Weeks. For why, I don’t know.
Maybe he’s like a trophy to them. Look at this position player we drafted and developed.
I remember when Beane drafted Weeks
he talked about wanting a guy who was aggressive and exciting and energetic. I think even beyond his production they really like his attitude, and Beane would be reluctant to part with him for that reason, as well.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Interesting that Cowgill and Reddick seem to fit that mold as well
Guys that play hard, “all-out”, etc…
I know it’s not a measurable stat, but I think Weeks had a really positive impact on the team once he came up due to his enthusiastic attitude and the way he plays the game. I’m excited that we have 2 more players supposedly like that in Cowgill and Reddick.
Frankly, it was getting really old watching such a bland team that just didn’t seem to care that much. Yeah, I know they probably all cared, but as a fan, it’s much harder to stomach losing when the losing doesn’t seem to infuriate the players on the team.
You know you are big-time when people chant your name while you pee. - 67MARQUEZ
by bakerbeachboy on Dec 29, 2011 4:04 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
Absolutely
he’s really the only drafted and developed position player the A’s have had since Swisher who actually contributed for more than half a season from the get go.
Plus, with his personality and skill set, he’s a guy who could become the face of the franchise going forward…
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 4:21 PM PST up reply actions
If he's going to be the face, he'd
better be better than Ray Durham
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:26 PM PST up reply actions
I think
That even though there selling everyone and everything, they still need someone to gear pr and marketing around. They can’t afford to have no one show up for 2 years. Weeks gives them a young player who will put up good roto stats that they can try and convince a few people to attend games.
ogallalabob
And I think that is why the FanFest is back.
Now that they know they’re going to SJ, they can begin to rebuild the fanbase with an added focus on the South Bay.
by LoneStranger on Dec 30, 2011 9:47 AM PST up reply actions
Good point.
Funny how FanFest has been MIA for the past three years, but now suddenly resurfaces. Interesting, too, that it’s being held in the Coliseum Arena instead of in the stadium. Just one more way to distance the team, however slightly, from the Coliseum as its home, I suppose. I also note that the FanFest is prominently sponsored by CSN-CA, instead of simply being put on by the A’s. Perhaps the television network is desperate to recoup whatever they can from holding the A’s broadcast rights, and has decided that if A’s ownership won’t spring for, or organize, a fan gathering to stoke interest for the upcoming season… then they’ll do it themselves! :)
by still bills kingdom on Dec 30, 2011 2:33 PM PST up reply actions
I don't think Sickels is calling Head a high-risk/high-ceiling prospect
Here’s his quote
Head is a Grade C+ type who has major league potential but still has things to prove. He could develop into a very productive slugger
Becoming a big league regular at 1B would of course be a good thing but the “high ceiling” label is usually reserved for players with elite potential. Nowhere have I seen that description applied to Miles Head. He’s got a chance, but he has less potential then Chris Carter did at a similar point in his career.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Sickels also says, "He could rank much higher next year"
I think that’s based on 2 factors: 1) if he can maintain something like that Greenville production at AA this year or next, he’ll be a real prospect; 2) if he can play decent 3B, he’ll be a real prospect even if his hitting slips a little. If he can do both (maintain the hitting and play 3B), then he’s going to be someone to be excited about.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
I asked Sickels point blank about Head sticking at 3B
He gives it less than a 50/50 chance.
I’m not saying Head is without potential. I’m saying high risk/high ceiling is a mislabel.
The monster at the end of this blog.
I'm not surprised about that assessment
I figure that if he were much better than a 50/50 to stick at 3B, the Sox wouldn’t have been willing to include him in the Bailey deal, any more than they would have included Middlebrooks in his place.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Not necessarily
Boston has 3 real good 3B prospects that all rate ahead of Head.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Even so, if he were a better defensive player
and were more of a B- or so, I think they might have said no just on a pure value basis, regardless of the depth in their system at 3B.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
I woud call it a wash between 2011 Head and 2007 Carter
Carter wasn’t regarded very highly before he cranked out 39 HR in Stockton.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 9:20 AM PST up reply actions
That's incorrect
Carter was making a name for himself in the preseason 2007 prospect lists and in 2008 made Sickels’ Top 50 hitters list prior to unloading in Stockton.
The monster at the end of this blog.
14. Chris Carter, 1B, C+
“Very strong bat, but where does he fit?”. This is literally what Sickels wrote about Carter in 2007. He got the same grade as Head which is not that surprising since they posted very similar numbers at the same age in Sally.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 9:59 AM PST up reply actions
You've got your timeline wrong
Chris Carter got a C+ grade in the 2007 book before he spent more than a handfull of AB in the Sally league. Carter earned a B+ after spending the 2007 season in the Sally league.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Oops, this was prior to the 2007 season, not after
I apologize for the confusion.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 10:06 AM PST up reply actions
Do we really have any choice?
I’m completely on board with selling out until 2015. I don’t really see how we can compete in a crap stadium with the Angels and the Rangers being far and above us this year. If we’re gonna lose and lose big, i’d rather lose with guys who have room to improve.
Its not trading bailey
Most people feel we didn’t get enough for Bailey. I do not see either of the players as top prospects when trading a productive player like Bailey. Its like we traded Balfour for a few low level prospects not your best bullpen guy. Beane looks like he rushed this trade through instead of waiting for a better offer even if it means starting the season with bailey as your closer.
I guess this is my view as well.
This haul for Bailey alone, might be ok, but why throw in Sweeney? Billy gave up too much IMO.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
the problem with bailey is that he could be great in boston or blow out his arm. i dunno which. his trade value isn't as great as his numbers would seem to suggest.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
they sold low
Closer are much more valuable mid season which could have brought a true top propsect. Cowgill is Sweeney 2 so that doesn’t bother me but reddick is just a 4th outfielder type. Unless Beane thinks Head is the next great 3b but scouting reports say differently. Looks to me Beane traded to quickly for the first thing came his way.
not sure i agree. bailey has been on the block for a long while now. this can't be the first deal that came our way.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
Then the trade breaks down to Reddick for Sweeney,
and Bailey for the other two. Not a good haul for Bailey.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
the same as I see it
Bailey for 2 low level prospects.
I doubt Red Sox would trade Reddick for Sweeney
Reddick is at least healthy.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 9:26 AM PST up reply actions
I'm not talking about what the Red Sox think.
I’m talking about what WE get in return.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
I agree, but this is conceding control of the trade to them.
Why trade now, if you can’t get what you want/need
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
Erm, the buyer always controls the trade
And Bailey is a risky asset. Another elbow blowout between now and July and you can trade him for Josh Reddick’s underwear.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 9:40 AM PST up reply actions
The players you get in return sets your willingness to risk the injury
BB made the trade, IMO it wasn’t enough at this time.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
my view is that you're over-valuing sweeney and bailey by quite a bit
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
Why do they get to be the "buyer"? Why can't we be the "buyer"
We never get to be the buyer
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:42 AM PST up reply actions
Well, we were the buyer when we got Holiday.
Of course, it cost us a lot. Then we traded him to the Cards, and paid them to take him.
hmm, I see a pattern here. Kind of one way
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
you're talking about fleecing someone. that was unlikely given his injury history. it's easier to do with dan haren who is cheap and good. bailey will not be cheap soon and may not finish 2012 on the 25 man roster.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
No, I'm talking about throwing in Sweeney, just to make this happen.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
see my comment above. i think you're overvaluing the pieces we gave up.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
the injury risk for bailey and sweeney means that nobody is going to give you fair value for them. not even close.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
If I read the reports correctly, the RedSox offered the other two for Bailey.
BB countered with Reddick. The Sox countered with Sweeney. So, Sweeney for Reddick, and Bailey for the other two.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
bailey's value is going to get eaten up by salary, so i get not paying up for him. i'd rather have reddick than sweeney.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
Then why trade Bailey NOW?
I’m for trading these players, but not for this return.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
cuz bailey is going to be expensive and a risk to be injured.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
Trading him now vs. All-Star break
Thought they might wait to see what contending team would overpay for a quality closer…doesn’t their value generally inflate as the season lengthens? Of course, there’s always the specter of injury.
Let's Go Oakland! clap clap clapclapcl-- damn, I think I sprained my wrist...
we also tried to trade him last year but didn't get a sufficient bid. it's a recurring theme with bailey.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
It's going to hurt to see the position-player haul
some team receives at the break for a worse closer than Bailey.
Don’t tell me we couldn’t have babied him into the break healthy. Hell, Oakland’s closer is only going to pitch twice a week!
Oakland Athletics * St. Bonaventure Bonnies * Green Bay Packers * Buffalo Sabres * New York Knicks
by RyanFromBonas on Dec 29, 2011 3:59 PM PST up reply actions
And by that I mean "impact" pos. haul
Not 4th OF and AAAA fodder.
Oakland Athletics * St. Bonaventure Bonnies * Green Bay Packers * Buffalo Sabres * New York Knicks
by RyanFromBonas on Dec 29, 2011 4:00 PM PST up reply actions
Yep
I do think we’ll see this with someone at the deadline.
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 4:22 PM PST up reply actions
But their requirements may have been too high
if Rosenthal is right about the Texas offer
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 4:14 PM PST up reply actions
He's got a 50-50 chance!
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:26 PM PST up reply actions
I don't remember, offhand. Sorry
I’ll try to find it.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
I said I was sorry...
Isn’t that what we are looking for here?☺
Maybe someone could help out a poor country boy?
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
I'm a little ole country boy, just young and in
my teens.
Don’t gamble, drink or swear, and she did this to me.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:44 AM PST up reply actions
I think what you remember reading was from Slusser
And they threw in Sweeney to ensure they got Alcantara she was told.
http://blog.sfgate.com/athletics/2011/12/28/as-send-andrew-bailey-ryan-sweeney-to-red-sox/
They traded their entire OF for Alcantara?
Boy, he’d better be really good.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 12:49 PM PST up reply actions
This may be where I saw it, grover
I know he isn’t the best source, but there you go.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
more like
Sweeney = 1/2 Reddick
Bailey = 1/2 Reddick + 2 young prospects
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
I think you're being overly bullish on Reddick
He’s maybe a quarter again better than Sweeney was… And these prospects aren’t all that great either.
Even if Reddick is just as good as Sweeney.
He has 3 fewer years of service time, which effectively doubles his surplus value relative to Sweeney.
Well, it doesn’t do exactly that, but it makes him much more valuable as a player.
Not at all.
I imagine it was closer to Beane asking for Reddick, Alcantara, and Head for Bailey, and Boston saying, “Well, we’re going to need an outfielder to replace him on the MLB roster.” And the answer was Sweeney.
Given he is really the only OF we have
the answer had to be Sweeney. But given the team currently this trade probably wins a few extra games next year and also allows a chance that a few of these guys will be here come 2015 or whenever we get in the new park.
Not sure it is a great trade but given Bailey’s injury history and that you have 3 of spots where your giving players 600 ab’s that need to be filled. You may as well find someone that has potential to improve and be above average at the position and who you can bat in the middle of the order and not be a total joke.
ogallalabob
You think Reddick in the middle of a major league order is not a joke?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 30, 2011 10:43 AM PST up reply actions
The Quote was a total joke
I understand that he would be bottom of the order on a contending team. But .810 ops lead the team last year. Ridick had a .785 last year granted he is going to lose a lot of that moving from Boston to Oakland but he also should pick up some being a year older and having a season of experience. I would not be at all surprised that he could wind up with 20 hrs and a ops north of .800. I could see him hitting 5 or 6th, I don’t think you could hit Sweeney anywhere but 8th or 9th.
ogallalabob
Yes we have one Choice. Michael Choice.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:41 AM PST up reply actions
The problem with hoping for a decent team in 2015 is
We have no idea if Head, Norris, and Cowgill will be any better than Charles Thomas, Chris Carter, Aaron Cunningham, Josh Donaldson, Matt Murton, Eric Patterson, or Daric Barton(!!!!). With Beane’s track record for acquiring position players the odds are that they won’t be any better.
Well no team has any idea if their lower prospects will be any good in 2015.
It’s just that we know that 2012 isn’t likely to be good, so we have to hope for the best later.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:25 PM PST up reply actions
Between Santos trade and Bailey's injury concerns
I braced myself for a return that was going to be miles behind Gio’s or Cahill’s, so I wasn’t too disappointed. I see Reddick as a left-handed Jeff Francouer, hopefully with a more consistent career. I think A’s might flip him if he has a good year in 2012.
I love rebuilding.
Not a terrible trade, but I was hoping for more.
I thought Bailey would net the A’s one good hitting prospect, but this must’ve been the best offer. Reddick looks pretty good though and we need some starting outfielders. Hopefully management will spend all this money they’re saving on the draft/Intl FA’s.
From MLB Rumors:
ESPN.com’s Keith Law says Oakland got fair value for Bailey, whose health is an unknown, and Sweeney, whose raw power hasn’t translated during games. Reddick provides the Athletics with additional years of control and Head and Alcantara could also prove useful. However, the Red Sox aren’t likely to miss the trio of players they gave up and they obtained a proven closer.
This quote made me laugh- We will sure miss Sweeney’s “Raw Power”.
Enter arbitrary sig line here
by theoriginalrods on Dec 29, 2011 9:16 AM PST reply actions
The Bailey trade was sort of meh...
I don’t mind trading Bailey, as he’s an injury risk, and Sweeney was a 4th outfielder on any other club. It’s the return we’re getting for these trades that annoys me.
Everyone of value has been traded away and we still have Sizemore starting at third base next year. I don’t expect a championship team in 2012, or even one that won’t lose 100 games, but at least make an effort to match players to positions and not just throw warm bodies out there because they’re cheap. Sure, get prospects but try to pick up someone who can actually play for the next couple of years.
Is the team worth watching?
Watching a team get blown out by the 3rd inning will not be fun this year. Or watching a opposing pitcher throw no hitters at the A’s will not be fun. This is what we will be seeing. Any veteran that shows a sign of life will be traded. Looks like the 1977 A’s all over again. It will be that bad.
Reddick can be a regular
He’s got 20HR potential and decent defense. I see nothing wrong with picking him up to lock down a corner-OF slot or possibly a shot at CF.
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
Who plays CF
lack of CF on this team is the problem. That is the reason for keeping Sweeney is defense.
this is his wife cheering him on
http://www.femmefan.com/site/images/featurepics/03_04Season/Brenda-Warner-and-Nails.jpg
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
So, he is a Milf hunter!
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
bagging groceries in between games has it's benefits
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
p.s.
I trust everyone recognizes this was a Kurt Warner reference.
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
fair enough
but sweeney’s health and knee are an unknown quantity heading into this season. loved his D, but not sure how he would have faired post-surgery
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
might as well
A co-worker asked me the 5 Starters on the pitching staff, it took me a few minutes…..We could use some depth so we aren’t placing all of our faith in Ross and Outman.
always love Rich
give him a 1-yr contract w/ big performance bonuses and a club option for 2013. Felt like he did alright last year and think he would benefit from some continuity
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
We can also throw in Bailey's jersey # back to him
That way my loved and weathered road grey Harden jersey can match up.
still have my fingers crossed
with my #49 anderson jersey
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
I think BA will be kept through this rebuild
Beane has a sentimality for carry over players (i.e. Chavez), I think by virtue of his TJ surgery lowering his stock, he will be the one “veteran” to remain on the team.
The way A's rehab TJ patients
He should just be ready to join the new A’s for the 2015 Cisco Field opening.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 10:16 AM PST up reply actions
Next years lineup?
Cowgill
Weeks
Pennington
Carter
Barton
Taylor
Reddick
Suzuki
Sizemore
Looks like a pitcher’s dream lineup
his master stroke
would be Crosby at 3
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
by ru155 on Dec 29, 2011 9:41 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
That will not be the order
I just wrote down the names. Weeks will lead off and Barton second if he is healthy. allen will compete with Barton and Carter for a spot.
Why is Sizemore batting 9th? Wasn't he the team's best hitter last year?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:46 AM PST up reply actions
Whew! For a minute there I thought it was a list of A's starters in 2012.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:55 AM PST up reply actions
oh, it might be the starters list on opening day. it's just not meant to be the game 1 lineup.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
Crap. My worst fears are confirmed.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 12:13 PM PST up reply actions
I'm calling it right now
Scott Seizemore is having a breakout year, and he’s gonna start batting cleanup halfway through the season
by Bender Bending Rodriguez on Dec 29, 2011 11:32 AM PST up reply actions
Will you eat your hat if it does not come to pass?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 12:07 PM PST up reply actions
His Oakland hat?
Or his San Jose hat?
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
Whichever's older and more grimy
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 12:13 PM PST up reply actions
Could have used a better player than Head
or a fourth player in the deal.
depressing times again for A’s fans.
What is the point?
of taking a bunch of AA players, putting them together with a bunch of other AA and AAA players with no veteran leadership and expecting them to improve to the major league level. These young guys will be forced to play at a higher level long before they are ready and they will lose badly- destroying any confidence they may have gained by playing for a real team. Billy Beane, you are an idiot.
The greenmachine
Who says they'll have no veteran leadership?
I’d put money down that Beane makes a couple hole-filling FA signings before April. And besides, isn’t that what coaches are for?
No. Coaches are for making the manager feel better when the team loses and for getting
fired when specific things go wrong. Team can’t hit? Fire the hitting coach!
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:47 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah the veteran leadership is the secret sauce
That makes you hit 97 mph fastballs and 12-to-6 curveballs,
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 10:08 AM PST up reply actions
They're done
They are done trading, err, I mean giving players away. Not because the desire is gone, simply because they lack any players any other team would want at this point.
There's always next offseason!
And I’d watch for McCarthy to be dealt in July if he’s healthy and productive. Balfour as well.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Is there any reason why McCarthy hasn't been brought any more up this offseason?
There are still quite a few teams that could use a starting pitcher.
My guess is
teams want to see if he can stay healthy and repeat 2011’s success.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Anybody that is healthy and productive in July
and makes more than the MLB minimum will be shipped out.
God, I hope somebody will take Fuentes
I would do it for 2MM salary relief.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 10:09 AM PST up reply actions
I bid $1M
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:47 AM PST up reply actions
Well, at least our Opening Day Starter has a great sense of humor
McCarthy
Braden
Ross
Outman
Milone
Straight Up Craftyness in the 1, 2, and 5 spots.
They might sign a Harden type
Moscoso will make it too. Outman hasn’t done much last year to earn a rotation spot. Ross is a mystery, but I think they could just give up and send him to bullpen this year.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 10:13 AM PST up reply actions
After Outman came back from injury, he posted a 3.90 FIP in 58.1 IP.
Outman and Moscoso would both be in my rotation before Ross would.
His xFIP was 4.77 though
And his AAA stint was underwhelming too. I think it would be better if he went back to AAA to work on his issues and then go back to majors once rotation spots inevitably open up.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 1:32 PM PST up reply actions
Well if anyone was opposing San Jose, you'd better get on the bandwagon now...
http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-news/ci_19639441
The state just completely killed redevelopment agencies. They upheld AB 26 and struck down AB 27 (the latter of which was a redevelopment safety net that cities like Oakland, Escondido and San Diego were hoping to use to maintain some of their agency money). Which means that 250 million dollars Oakland was going to use to buy the Victory Court site or help make “Coliseum City” worthwhile, no longer belongs to Oakland but to Jerry Brown. Which means no ballparks, football stadiums or arenas will be built in Oakland (or anywhere that was counting on public money not already locked up in contracts).
People who are still convinced that East Bay Fairy
Is just waiting for Wolff to give up and sell the team so she can buy it and build a privately-financed stadium in Oakland are beyond reasonable argumentation at this point.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 10:57 AM PST up reply actions
Root for the front of the uni not the back...
This is my mantra. I am on board with the 2015 plan as long as a new ballpark is part of the deal. My love for the A’s is too blind for me to ever bail no matter how many times I get kicked in the balls by the powers that be.
Color me stupid I guess.
by RudiFan on Dec 29, 2011 10:39 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
Nope, just means you are a fan.
Just like the rest of us.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
I'd kill to see the package that Texas offered for Bailey
It had to be better than the return from Boston, right? I can see Beane not being thrilled about trading within the division, but we’re going to be so bad it really wouldn’t matter.
by dashman33 on Dec 29, 2011 10:44 AM PST via mobile reply actions
You'd think so.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:48 AM PST up reply actions
I am pretty sure Billy would pull the trigger
If Texas was willing to offer some awesome prospect even if they were a divisional rival.
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
Even someone like Olt
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:58 AM PST up reply actions
Yea, hell I know I would - specially since we are not competing and Bailey is a piece we don't need at this point.
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
You'd figure Olt would have about the same value as Reddick
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:59 AM PST up reply actions
Ott would be better
If we got Ott we would have a true future 3b instead cross your fingers and hope your A ball guy can be a 3b.
It fills a need and a better prospect - I just think the Rangers were not willing to part with anything good.
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
And yet they were willing to trade Weiland and Erlin for Adams.
How did we not take that deal if it were available to us?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:08 AM PST up reply actions
Maybe the Rangers are the one who doesn't want to trade within the division?
And probably view Mike Adam as being better then Bailey? Its not the years under control since I think Bailey has more then Adams.
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
You mean the Rangers feared us rising up and beating them in the
division race? Why?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:14 AM PST up reply actions
Who knows?
I am just tossing out guesses on why a trade was not completed between us and the rangers
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
Supposedly Rosenthal heard the A's were the ones who turned it down
According to one source, the Rangers offered Oakland a package that included pitchers, Robbie Erlin and Joe Wieland along with shortstop Leury Garcia in exchange for closer Andrew Bailey
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:20 AM PST up reply actions
Ott?
But he’s been dead for over 50 years…
"Minutes from the last save opportunity...Balfour got 3 outs..."- Nico
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 11:11 AM PST up reply actions
He's still alive.
He just retired 30 years ago.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:12 AM PST up reply actions
Touche
"Minutes from the last save opportunity...Balfour got 3 outs..."- Nico
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 11:33 AM PST up reply actions
Ya, that's pretty optimistic
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 10:58 AM PST up reply actions
God no.
It means we are again stuck with a seventh or eighth pick at best.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 10:59 AM PST up reply actions
I think this is within our reach.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:03 AM PST up reply actions
Us and astros for the #1
think about this 2013 A’s, astros, and M’s in same division. You know the Rangers and Angels will both make the play offs that year.
As long as we don't pick Tim Beckham, Luke Hochevar, Matt Bush, Delmon Young,
Bryan Bullington, Kris Benson, Pat Burrell, Matt Anderson, Darin Erstad, Paul Wilson, Phil Nevin, Brien Taylor, Ben McDonald, Andy Benes, Jeff King, BJ Surhoff, Shawn Abner, Tim Belcher, Shawon Dunston, Mike Moore, Al Chambers, Floyd Bannister, Danny Goodwin, Bill Almon, David Clyde, Dave Roberts, Mike Ivie, Jeff Burroughs, Tim Foli, Ron Blomberg, Steven Chilcott or Rick Monday
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:07 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
We might be better, didn't we get the new head of scout that worked for the Rays?
Or i’m I screwing up the role?
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
They still picked Tim Beckam and Delmon Young 1st
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:09 AM PST up reply actions
Those weren't all bad #1 picks
I’d be delighted if the A’s ended up with Rick Monday, Jeff Burroughs, Floyd Bannister, BJ Surhoff, Andy Benes, or Pat Burrell.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Sure, but I wouldn't deliberately lose an extra 20 games for the privilege
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:14 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
No, that's true
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
If he wasn't retired
I’d so want Burrell on the A’s, team needs, etc. be damned. It’d be nice from my point of view for either him or Kevin Frandsen (both went to my high school) to be on the A’s. Rather selfish on my part but whatever
Go bells
2011 Oakland Athletics: Waterboarding
by supermarc589 on Dec 29, 2011 4:19 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Rick Monday, Jeff Burroughs, Bill Almon, and Mike Moore
All played for the A’s. In 1970, at the first A’s game I ever attended, Rick Monday hit a home run. (A’s 5, Washington Senators 0, Chuck Dobson pitched a shut out.) Mike Moore was 19-11 during the World Series championship year of 1989. He even hit a double off of the Giants in the World Series.
Yes, Monday and Moore had some great games for the A's
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:24 PM PST up reply actions
Danny Goodwin, too
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Yea it will be hard to watch but you can always turn off the tv.
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
Too high
55 wins – 107 losses
986,000 total attendance for the season
12,172 average game attendance
No less than 50 different lineups over the season
Giants and their fans still blowing goats…
Book it.
by athletics68 on Dec 29, 2011 11:08 AM PST up reply actions
Funny
I’m thinking the A’s will do a lot better than that. Here’s why: generally the really really bad teams are those with second-rate veterans augmenting 4-A players and a couple of young studs.
The A’s in 2012 will be slightly different. Three players - Allen, Cowgill and Reddick - could well have break-out seasons, and unless you see more trades, a rotation of McCarthy, Moscoso, Peacock, Braden and (name a FA fifth starter) is probably not as bad as you think.
It will be a bad team, but I’m figuring 65 wins, maybe close to 70. They’ll suck but I think this team has more potential than some of the worst A’s teams of the past 35 years. Of course, it depends on Reddick and someone else, anyone else, havinb break-out years.
You know your team is bad when...
your AAA team can out hit the major league team.
I don't think ours could. Does that mean we're good?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:00 AM PST up reply actions
I don't know since most of the AAA hitter would be on the MLB team next year.
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
better middle of the order
Choice, green, Mitchel
If Mitchel can play, isn't he still coming back from surgery?
I don’t know would have to see the 9 vs 9
"We drank, we fought! He made his ancestor proud!"
Mitchel
Starts the season in AAA for the first few months until healthy than will be promoted. Beane is very high on him.
There's some chance that Green will become a major league hitter
but at the moment he’s flailing at AA pitches. 39 BBs and 119 Ks in AA, and with only 9 HRs…I mean, it’s not like he’s facing killer sliders or knee-buckling curves every day in the Texas League.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
it's hard for me to be optimistic about the team these days
I guess these trades were necessary, but I don’t think they improved the farm system nearly enough. If we had a league-average farm before the trades things would have been different, but as it is I don’t see this team being competitive even by 2015. We need better drafts and a higher payroll, or else this process will keep repeating ad nauseum.
I'm actually afraid that the team is still too good to be a total disaster
We have to find a way to take care of this without doing something totally unethical. Probably we will just trade everybody who is doing something right and is not the part of the master plan.
I love rebuilding.
the pressure from the player's association to maintain payroll makes it difficult for a team to be truly horrible
I mean you can’t give 10 million dollars to Ben Sheets every year.
I'm starting to think A's are just trolling now
And don’t give a crap about anything.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 11:08 AM PST up reply actions
the road uniforms say "Ah, Fuck It" on the front.
by DDroney on Dec 29, 2011 11:10 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Frankly I wouldn't be shocked if they don't wear the road greys this year
And switch them to “Athletics” in 2013. They’ve mentally checked out of Oakland and now checked the MLB team out of Oakland as well.
by athletics68 on Dec 29, 2011 11:16 AM PST up reply actions
Get used to it.
I have a feeling we’re going to be seeing a lot more of the generic stand alone “A’s” and “Athletics” logos on stuff than we already do along with almost a complete lack of the road uniform until they get around to modifying it. Particularly if they get approval to move to SJ.
If they don’t get approval, well so will begin the team sale and out of state move saga which will eventually change everything anyway…
by athletics68 on Dec 29, 2011 11:35 AM PST up reply actions
They stopped ordering the "oakland" Jackets at the Coli last year around May
Wouldn’t be shocked if they are not stocked this year.
Back in the Charley Finley days
Nothing ever said “Oakland” on it. It was always just “A’s.” (Never Athletics.) And they won 3 World Series’ in a row before they imploded. In this current Lew Wolff era, if the A’s would have won just one World Series, I wouldn’t mind the current implosion.
Welcome to how San Diego Chargers fans feel about their team.
It’s not an usual situation for a team to be in.
Might be worthwhile to invest in RiverCats seasons for a year or two
That’s where the real action is going to be in the A’s organization (and where the nicer place to see a game is…)
by athletics68 on Dec 29, 2011 11:10 AM PST up reply actions
It's been like that for a few years now.
Which is a bad sign. Didn’t the Pirates have winning AAA teams all those years that they were being run into the ground?
I don't think they're indifferent, I think they're incompetent
This is really the best they can do.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:10 AM PST up reply actions
I like the writeup, and agree with everything but this
both Dallas Braden and Brandon McCarthy are candidates to be on their way if they show they’re healthy and effective
There is just no way in hell, IMO, either will get us a return equivalent to what they’re worth. McCarthy pitched like a straight up ace last year, and he may very well do so again, in which case we need to either try and extend him, or hope he becomes a Type A and receive picks as compensation.
And Braden will never, for the rest of his career, be worth as much to any team other than the one who he is currently a part of. His injury problems have become public, and in his lawsuit he alleged that the damage done to his toes will shorten his career. Braden will almost certainly be worth next to nothing on the trade market.
"Minutes from the last save opportunity...Balfour got 3 outs..."- Nico
Would you sign either one long term?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:16 AM PST up reply actions
McCarthy for sure
the rest of Braden’s career is one massive question mark. Once he hits FA, he’ll survive on one year deals the rest of his career.
"Minutes from the last save opportunity...Balfour got 3 outs..."- Nico
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 11:34 AM PST up reply actions
Should we view him like the RedSox do Wakefield?
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
As long as he's serviceable, sure
"Minutes from the last save opportunity...Balfour got 3 outs..."- Nico
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 11:51 AM PST up reply actions
I agree with this.
He isn’t the type of player to invest in long term, but I really want him around if he can take the field as needed.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
I would give McCarthy a two-year deal with a third year option
And if he’s healthy for two months and pitching like he did in 2011, sell, sell, sell.
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 11:17 AM PST up reply actions
You mean now? How much do you think he'd want to buy out a FA year?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:21 AM PST up reply actions
I have no idea
But given the fact that he hasn’t exactly made gazillions so far in his baseball career and that he’s smart enough to understand how big of an injury risk he is, it should be doable. 2 years, 8M?
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 11:25 AM PST up reply actions
Yes I'd do that in a hearbeat if he'd go for it. He'd probably want more like $12M-$14M
I’m thinking.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 12:09 PM PST up reply actions
The A's aren't going to offer McCarthy $12.5 million unless he agrees to turn them down beforehand
So no draft pick compensation when he departs as a FA. A July trade is probably the best way to maximize his trade value.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Is that what he'd get in arbitration?
Damn, then perhaps a trade is the best option. Well that sucks.
"Minutes from the last save opportunity...Balfour got 3 outs..."- Nico
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 11:35 AM PST up reply actions
He made only $1M last year
I love rebuilding.
by John of Gaunt on Dec 29, 2011 11:37 AM PST up reply actions
The new CBA
says that in the future teams have to offer their FAs a salary equal to the average of the top 125 salaries in the league in order to receive draft pick compensation should the player sign elsewhere, which for next season projects to be around $12.5 million.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Yeah, I assumed that it was that sort of deal
Interesting, almost like MLB’s equivalent to the franchise tag.
"Minutes from the last save opportunity...Balfour got 3 outs..."- Nico
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 11:51 AM PST up reply actions
It's shitty, but this is the only avenue available
Marlin strategy is what we have left.
You assume you’re getting a stadium. If you make that assumption, then blowing up the team is the correct move.
If you don’t get the stadium then you pocket the profit sharing money and run a cheap-ass team out every year. That puts pressure on MLB to resolve the situation. The A’s have played ball with Selig long enough.
And I don’t think the A’s will be as bad as everyone seems to assume. Which is a shame in a way b/c they need the draft picks.
Cardenas!!!! WoooooooooooooHOOOOOOOOO
Jesus if we don't get the stadium I may finally throw the towel in
I can’t deal with the 4-8 years of “moving drama” that the team will go through before they finally leave the Bay Area.
by athletics68 on Dec 29, 2011 11:26 AM PST up reply actions
I don't think anyone wants that including Wolff or Selig. I think everyone wants the team
in San Jose other than the Giants.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 12:10 PM PST up reply actions
FUCK THE GIANTS!!!!
Ah now I feel better. It’s like taking a big dump just to say it.
by athletics68 on Dec 29, 2011 12:19 PM PST up reply actions 6 recs
It seems like Texas was right there at the end, competing with the Sox for Bailey
I find it hard to believe that whatever Texas was offering was anything less than this package from the Sox. It seemed all along that Texas was a better trade partner (a couple of available 3b prospects with Beltre signed long-term and other mid-level rotation and upside relief arms at all stages of development).
Plus, you would have to believe that there was understanding on both sides that Texas would have to pay a slight premium to offset the inter-divisional aspect of the deal.
Perhaps Texas low-balled Beane once they signed Nathan, but jeez…they had so much more to work with than Boston…
I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!
There's a rumor (supposedly) per Gammons
That the A’s chose the Boston offer because of Josh Reddick. It seems they really, really wanted him in the Oakland outfield.
The monster at the end of this blog.
I did try to find the link, grover.
If I remember correctly, it was from the Sox point of view, that they were afraid that if they didn’t include Reddick, the A’s would trade Bailey to the Rangers.
"Trying not to rec a "F**k the Giants" post is like trying not to look at boobs."-anonymous
"i guess i just like beer"-stm
I really really really wanted a Geo Metro once...
Doesn’t mean it was a good idea
by athletics68 on Dec 29, 2011 11:36 AM PST up reply actions
State Supreme Court just upheld Brown's plan to kill Redevelopment Agencies
HINWEIS MIR! HINWEIS MIR!
Yep
It’s San Jose or bust now. Good news is this gives Wolff even more leverage with the other owners since Oakland’s plans are now both dead. Bad news is, if they turn Wolff down the slow march out of the Bay Area will begin to a state that’s not as adverse to building ballparks regardless of market considerations. Because MLB will not let the A’s stay in the Coliseum beyond the end of this decade and no one in Oakland is going to come up with 900 million bucks to buy the A’s from Wolff AND build them a private ballpark in Oakland.
by athletics68 on Dec 29, 2011 11:44 AM PST up reply actions
Jerry Brown has been stickin' it to the A's in some way, shape or form for years now.
F U, you weird-ass jerk.
I needed a team so I wouldn’t turn into one of the eighty million pink hat-wearing Bud Light-drinking mulleted idiots at Fenway.
Losing when you know you're going to be bad
isn’t nearly as painful as losing when you think you just might be able to contend if everything breaks right.
That’s been the plan that led to the resulting pain the last few years.
I like the new plan better. The A’s are going to lose a lot. I know this going in. I can still go out to the ballpark on a sunny day and have a good time rooting for them. If they don’t happen to win that day, oh well, I didn’t really expect them to anyway and the game was still kind of fun.
They could lose over a 100 games for all I care. In fact, I’m sort of hoping they will so they finally get a top pick.
by RLangford on Dec 29, 2011 12:07 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
I love watching young prospects play
Win or lose.
Cardenas!!!! WoooooooooooooHOOOOOOOOO
Well I love watching the A's play no matter what, but I'd prefer better prospects than this bunch
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 12:12 PM PST up reply actions
+1
Definitely one of my favorite aspects to being an A’s fan.
You know you are big-time when people chant your name while you pee. - 67MARQUEZ
by bakerbeachboy on Dec 29, 2011 1:48 PM PST up reply actions
You may be right
Being terrible hasn’t hurt the Cubs in over a century of futility.
by athletics68 on Dec 29, 2011 12:20 PM PST up reply actions
Rec'd
That first sentence sums it up very nicely.
We haven’t done anything since 2006 and since then, we’ve had 2, maybe 3 years where fans were given a false sense of future success. At least if we do anything this year, it’s going to be a nice surprise.
"Minutes from the last save opportunity...Balfour got 3 outs..."- Nico
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 12:26 PM PST up reply actions
Very positive attitude
Of course, if we have a short winning streak it will mean that Cliff Pennington is on his way out of town and Jemile Weeks is no longer so untouchable.
You mean we have to wait for a short winning streak for those things to happen?
Crap. They’ll be here all year.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 12:48 PM PST up reply actions
Horrible trade
I’ll still support the team. It will just be a little bit quieter at the ball park
Get The Team Away From Wolff
Does anyone think that Lew Wolff deserves a team? Either take them team away from him or just let it go away. The bay area doesn’t need two baseball teams.
I think Lew Wolff paid for the team so it's his to do with as he pleases
As for the bay area not needing two teams, you’re right. The Giants should have left in 1992 as they agreed to do with St. Petersburg. Shame Wally Haas was such a nice guy.
No kidding...
Never give away something without a stipulation and/or time-limit. HUGE mistake.
Forever is a very long time.
Cardenas!!!! WoooooooooooooHOOOOOOOOO
I think He's is a good owner
I believe LW is making decisions that are in the best, long term, interest of the A’s. I don’t think he only cares about money. I wish he had been the owner during the 2000-2006 run… he would have spent a little bit more money on payroll.
kurt may be next
Though trading catcher Kurt Suzuki isn’t a priority for the Athletics, Olney suggests he’ll likely be playing elsewhere by the time next summer’s trade deadline passes (Twitter link).
"You know whats funny? I always thought uhm dogs lay eggs and I learned something new today" Peter Griffin
Please let this be true
My least favorite player.
Not as much as called third strikes!
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 4:12 PM PST up reply actions
I think that's just more of Olney's BS
It makes absolutely no sense to move him. Suzuki is infinitely more valuable to us with how he can handle the pitching staff, especially with Parker, Milone, Peacock, Gray all coming up in the next two seasons. I can’t imagine he’ll bring much more than a C+ prospect back anyway. If anything, I think they’ll do they same thing they did when Suzuki was brought up: wait until Norris is ready, let Suzuki tutor him for half a season, then trade Suzuki.
I'm not so sure. We seem to be dumping ANYTHING of value.
And a catcher who can control a staff is a valuable commodity. We obviously don’t care about 2012 or 13 so who cares if we have a catcher who can control the staff…
Suzuki is a valuable commodity for us, a team with young, developing pitchers
Not nearly as valuable to a team with established pitchers. Developing pitchers would have nothing to do with 2012 or 2013. It would be for a few seasons down the road. A catcher like Suzuki would be much more helpful than Recker/Donaldson.
Suzuki is scheduled to make $5M next season
He’ll be traded to anyone that will take him, and the A’s will pick up half of his salary (for 2012 and 2013). The only problem is that every other team knows this, so the A’s will be lucky to get a light hitting Single A shortstop (with no power, no speed, and is a defensive liability).
Poppycock!
$5M is one win. In the last four seasons he’s been 3.0, 3.0, 1.8. 2.2.
I feel comfortable calling him a 2 win player worth in the neighborhood of $10 mil a year.
Of course, trading him at the end of 2012 will not net you much since that’s only $5 mil of surplus value. But there’s no way the A’s will be eating part of his contract unless it’s to get them better prospects in return.
Cardenas!!!! WoooooooooooooHOOOOOOOOO
$5M is one win for a contending team. A win for a 70 win team is worth a lot less
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:09 PM PST up reply actions
I really, really hope that Head can make it to the majors
so that he can choose this as his walkup music.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Really? I would prefer "Circle Sky" or "One Night in Bangkok"
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 1:57 PM PST up reply actions
I could definitely go with "Circle Sky"
I think of Porpoise Song as the theme of the film, which is why I suggested it. If we’re going in that other direction for the connection, I’d prefer “Save It For Later”.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Don't get me wrong, "Porpoise Song" is on my iPod and certainly great. It's just not
very inspirational walk up music. I always thought the Monkees were never accorded the accolades they deserved. They’re not even in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 3:30 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah, I know
2012 is a key year for him. First, he mashed at A for a couple of months, and held his own after his promotion to A+. If he can hit well at A+ and AA this year, that’ll mean something. Second, it sounds like the A’s are going to try him at 3B. If that goes well, his potential value goes up significantly.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
I fucked up the post again..
This is in regards to Head’s walk up song:
by Menechino_Incarnate on Dec 29, 2011 2:06 PM PST up reply actions
Hee
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 3:30 PM PST up reply actions
Oh great he's bashing the Coliseum
Talking about how bad the football outfield is for his knees and Bowa is talking about how his BA will be going up away from the Coliseum’s ridiculous amount of foul territory.
Yeah, Ryan, the Coliseum was the whole problem...
Career Home: .276/.338/.368
Career Road: .288/.346/.388
His numbers at home will improve a fair amount in a really good hitters’ park, but still…
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Sweeney brought one good thing to Oakland.....
A HOT Freakin wife! and thats about it…
Sweeney was for sure a salary dump – we don’t need him making 1.2 million next season with 2 HRs in 600 at bats…He has a beautiful swing, but the guy just can’t bring it during game time.
Lance "you sunk my" Blankenship
Who cares about Ryan Sweeney
Could be said about many of our players of the last few years, but he’s definitely one of them.
Oh good, another one
can’t wait to see what excuse he’ll use for his knees when he goes down in Boston.
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 4:27 PM PST up reply actions
Still I'm with Ryan
I love the Coliseum, but I’m damn tired of it and it’s deficiencies (like torn up outfields all late summer and fall).
THAT DAMNED WALL KILLS MY POWER STROKE
THAT DAMNED MANUAL SCOREBOARD KILLS MY KNEES
THAT DAMNED NEIL DIAMOND SONG etc etc etc
No mikev, no peace
Know mikev, know peace
I have a sneaking suspicion
that the A’s will play surprisingly competent baseball for much of 2012 and end up with 70-75 wins. Once again, theretofore obscure pitchers will keep them in games they haven’t the offense to win and lead them to some unexpected victories.
Get ready for another season of that unique brand of despair we have come to know so well as A’s fans.
The A’s got the worst of this trade, but not by that much. It has an air of inevitability to it.
I agree - The A's are expected to the the WORST team in baseball....by its own fans
so all we need is a bit of energy and luck and this team will compete and not be the worst team in our division….or I hope!
Lance "you sunk my" Blankenship
I don't think they'll be nearly as awful as some people think.
Between Cahill, Gonzalez, and Bailey, they’re probably losing somewhere around 8-9 WAR. I wouldn’t be surprised if Parker, Milone, and Peacock combined for 3-5 WAR over the full season, or maybe more. Plus, the A’s were slightly unlucky last year according to Pythagorean records (77-85, rather than their actual 74-88 record).
They’ll be bad, to be sure, but I don’t think they’ll be competing for the #1 draft pick in 2013. It’s not like Houston’s done anything to drastically improve their team.
I tend to agree with this
Plus, as was mentioned upthread, Houston needs to replace 1/2 a year each of Bourne and Pence. Although they’re also due for a Pythag bounceback of their own.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
They also lost Matsui, Crisp, Willingham and DeJesus though and replacing
them with Carter, Cowgill, Reddick, and Allen. That might be another 3-4 WAR downgrade. It sounds like overall about a 67-70 win team
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 4:12 PM PST up reply actions
3-4 WAR downgrade?
You’re assuming those 4 will combine for <4 WAR?
If they’re given 600 PAs each, I think they’ll be comparable to what those 4 did.
by stranahanahan on Dec 29, 2011 4:30 PM PST up reply actions
Those 4 were 7 WAR. I guess it's possible that the new foursome could do that
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:22 PM PST up reply actions
WTF. Apparently I just forgot about that part of Oakland's offseason.
Reddick and DeJesus should be a wash, and I’m not bemoaning the loss of Matsui. I’m not expecting much out of Carter or Cowgill, but they could bring the total loss to around 2-3 WAR, which still isn’t that bad.
51 wins at the most
And Bud Selig will waive the rule that says there has to be one player from each team at the All Star game.
You are not considering one possibility
That their replacements will have negative WAR. With this team, that is not out of the question.
I want to see that -11 WAR player. Could be awesome
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:11 PM PST up reply actions
Too late, you got rid of Eric Patterson awhile ago.
"When you find your way. Then you see it disappear."
We tried our best to keep him, but he just refused to hit or play a position.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:20 PM PST up reply actions
in a theoretical situation, which predicting the future is,
a “replacement” cannot have negative WAR, because WAR stands for Wins Above Replacement, and the “replacement” player sets the baseline of 0 WAR.
"I think what baseball projects, and what classical music needs, is the sense that one goes to a live event not to experience greatness, but to experience the possibility of greatness.... Not every game is great but what we go for is the chance that this particular game might be.' —David Lang
by King Richard on Dec 30, 2011 12:50 AM PST up reply actions
im ok with this 5 year plan
at least my expectations and hope wont be killed…wait im a raiders fan too.
The Soviets had five year plans, too
And they’d say they were taking one step back in order to make two steps forward. Didn’t work out too well for them. Billy Beane even looks a little like Lenin. I’ll keep my fingers crossed that he’s a better planner than the Soviets.
I see no resemblance between Beane and Lenin....or Lennon.....or Lannan
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:51 PM PST up reply actions
I think I should be able to pay for my season tickets in rubles
1: Both have last names five letters long. 2: At 35, Beane was named GM of the A’s. At 35, Lenin was named President of the Revolutionary Forces. 3: Lenin had to deal with no money and crappy infrastructure. Beane had to deal with no money and a crappy stadium. 4: Lenin was desperate to control a Southern port. Beane has been desperate to move to the South Bay. 5: Lenin promoted a new approach to government, communism, that didn’t work. Beane promoted a new approach to talent assessment, moneyball, that didn’t work. 6: Lenin was portrayed on the screen by a major movie star, Ben Kingsley. Beane was portrayed on the screen by a major movie star, Brad Pitt.
So Ben Kingsley looks like Brad Pitt?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 30, 2011 8:45 AM PST up reply actions
It was an Italian movie
Italians don’t care about verisimilitude.
That's one of the great and terrible things about Italians
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 30, 2011 9:18 AM PST up reply actions
But the food's good
"Hello and welcome to another wonderful and frightening night of A's baseball." - Gaijin_Suketto
by EddieVegas_NRAF on Dec 31, 2011 8:36 AM PST up reply actions
Actually, they were pretty damn effective at turning what was a completely rural country into an industrial powerhouse
(Obviously, they had plenty of drawbacks… mostly to the environment, which has pretty much reached such epic levels of toxicity in modern Russia that I’m amazed everyone doesn’t run screaming from the place… but they did what they were supposed to do…)
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
If you factor in the pain and deaths of the industrial revolution in Europe
It wouldn’t be that far more than what Stalin was responsibe for. Not to mention the German warm machine would have fulfilled Hitlers dreams of conquering the slavic people. Now, Stalin’s cruel treatment of the Ukranian Famine, the NEP attach on simple farmers, the purge of the old Bolsheviks, those are different issues.
I lived in Moscow for a year
It isn’t so bad PT. The only real bad areas are the some nether regions east of the Rural mountains (atomic testing etc).
So....what would you take for Josh Reddick?
He’s a nice OF, Good, but not great. If you’re looking to rebuild long term, why not spin him off into 3 C+’s? I’m not going to bother to name names. If it seems like a good idea, the list is here
"When you find your way. Then you see it disappear."
Why would he only warrant three C+ prospects? He was a B- before 2011 and posted 1.9 fWAR
in Boston. He’d be a straight B right now. Plus, he’s MLB ready and Oakland is starved for outfielders, so you’d have to pry him away. I’d want any of your B+ prospects not named Anthony Rizzo.
I just thought you'd want quantity over one quality prospect.
Three high upside pieces might help you rebuild faster.
"When you find your way. Then you see it disappear."
Yes but I don't see three high upside C+ guys on that list
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:15 PM PST up reply actions
Unlikely
Probability is that three C+ prospects end up being worth diddly squat, and you’re even worse off than before you made the trade.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
A straight B position player is worth more than a B+ pitcher no?
We could ask for Weiland and Tate
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:14 PM PST up reply actions
That's probably fair, a little on the expensive side though.
"When you find your way. Then you see it disappear."
We'll throw in Adrian Cardenas if it will make the deal happen!
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:19 PM PST up reply actions
Yay!
You now have the next Jesus Guzman!
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:23 PM PST up reply actions
I mean, I think a high ceiling prospects still in the minors might have more value to Oakland
than Reddick—which isn’t to say that Reddick doesn’t offer more current value to the A’s than Bailey. If it’s not Erlin or Liriano, I’d probably ask for Decker or Tate, too. And since I don’t the A’s will compete any time soon, I still like the strategy of stocking up on pitchers and trading them two or three years from now.
At what point do you stop the trade pitcher for pitcher cycle and try to compete?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:46 PM PST up reply actions
Well hopefully the next one.
In terms of above-average MLB pitchers, you have McCarthy.
In terms of average MLB starters, you have Braden, Moscoso, and Outman.
In terms of good pitchers recovering from injuries, you have Anderson and Ross.
In terms of good prospects at AA or higher, you have Gray, Milone, Peacock, and Parker.
In terms of decent relievers, you have FDLS, (maybe) Cook, and Devine.
If things break well, or even if they break the way things usually do, the A’s could have more than five valuable trade chips to trade by 2015 (three good chips netted Parker, Cowgill, Cook, Milone, Cole, Peacock, Norris, Reddick, Alcantara, and Head).
I have no doubts as to whether this is actually the A’s long-term plan, and they’d never publicly admit it at this point. If San Jose happens, the more likely scenario is that younger of guys just listed are paired with a couple high-profile FA signings like Miami has done this offseason. I think it would be wiser to do one more scorched earth rebuild—trade everybody worth trading by 2015. Even with middling drafting, the farm system after the next one would look fantastically good. It could put the A’s in position to compete on the trade market, the home-grown prospect market, and the FA market for several years.
Erp, first sentence on the last paragraphs should read,
“I have my doubts as to whether this is actually the A’s long-term plan…”
FA's will be signed...
BB has already stated this. But he say it would be the latter part of off season, when there will be more bargains to be had.
Think Cojax or Cody Ross types – ya know, the scrap-heap types that are the only ones willing to sign with the A’s. Heck, I could see even Matsui coming back. Melvin loves him, and the youngsters are going to need a veteren presence.
by jeff-athletic on Dec 29, 2011 8:41 PM PST via iPhone app reply actions
Think Zito ...
… as part of gnats compensation package for SJ. The gnats desperately want to off load Zito’s fat contract so they can go after a bat or two (or work on stadium debt). And the A’s need to add to payroll (to keep players union happy), and need SJ.
by jeff-athletic on Dec 29, 2011 8:47 PM PST via iPhone app reply actions
Fuentes for Zito!
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:16 PM PST up reply actions
Let's say the A's do lose 100+ games
and they end up with the #1 pick. Will they end up taking a collegiate player instead of a high upside high school player who might cost them more? If they’re really serious about an honest-to-god rebuild, then they better be willing to spend on the draft.
No mikev, no peace
Know mikev, know peace
Supposedly they've budgeted like $10M for the draft, no?
Beane says the team has not spent enough in recent drafts, because resources were going to the big-league level. Oakland spent about $3 million on the draft last year; Beane anticipates spending $10 million or more this season.
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:18 PM PST up reply actions
bb better not
go all money ball on us and draft another jeremy brown. he should play it by the book and sign the highest upside player available and forget about issues or makeup and sportsmanship or shit like that
by cahill123anderson on Dec 29, 2011 9:19 PM PST up reply actions
You want players with bad mascara and poor sportsmanship?
And issues?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:22 PM PST up reply actions
Sounds like Bryce Harper to me
"Hello and welcome to another wonderful and frightening night of A's baseball." - Gaijin_Suketto
by EddieVegas_NRAF on Dec 30, 2011 8:48 AM PST up reply actions
There's no way I want that guy on my team. He looks disgraceful!
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 30, 2011 9:16 AM PST up reply actions
Do you really think Braden would be traded?
He’s the marketing department’s hero! I think if anyone on the team is safe (besides Weeks) it is Braden. Everyone loves him and he loves being close to home.
Wade Hines
Love tge dude
But he has roughly the same trade value as my ’71 Pinto. That is to say, none.
No mikev, no peace
Know mikev, know peace
Had.
71’ station wagon. First car, ripped out all the vinyl interior and replaced it with astro-turf. The fake wood paneling eventually all fell off so I replaced it by nailing plywood panels to the doors. Best shitty car anyone could ever own.
No mikev, no peace
Know mikev, know peace
My buddy had a pinto. The engine exploded trying to climb the road to Mt Soledad.
Rebuilt, tried again, exploded again.
"When you find your way. Then you see it disappear."
I can see him getting traded if he wants to go to a contender.
Ellis was loved too, but he wanted to go close to South Dakota and they made it happen for him. I doubt they’d trade Braden for the prospects since he’d probably net the next Ryan Cook or Bruce Billings
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 9:50 PM PST up reply actions
I hear the Yankees are looking for pitching.
That way him and A-Rod could “share” a mound…
Wade Hines
This would amuse me
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 29, 2011 11:46 PM PST up reply actions
If we can land Soler and Mr. Miles continues to mash
We can have a team Head and Soler above the rest
Cardenas!!!! WoooooooooooooHOOOOOOOOO
I'll be here all week
(tip your wait staff)
Cardenas!!!! WoooooooooooooHOOOOOOOOO
Jorge Soler
If we get him, how much would that improve our farm system? Anyone have any idea what grade range (on the Sickels scale) he would fall into?
You know you are big-time when people chant your name while you pee. - 67MARQUEZ
I'd expect him to be a straight A
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 30, 2011 1:06 AM PST up reply actions
Probably. Callis said he'd be a similar prospect to Bubba Starling, who got an A from Sickels.
He also said if he were in the 2010 draft, he probably would have been a top five pick (after Harper, Taillon, and Machado, but before Colon and Pomeranz. He said he’d probably fit somewhere in the top twenty overall, so he’d probably get an A (or maybe an A- until we can see some actual data). Links for your viewing pleasure.
He’s probably gonna cost a fortune, but the A’s have shed so much payroll it shouldn’t be a huge problem. Additionally, they desperately need the talent.
That's promising!
I would have to think that getting him would put us into the top 10 farm systems in all of baseball, if not the top 5.
You know you are big-time when people chant your name while you pee. - 67MARQUEZ
by bakerbeachboy on Dec 30, 2011 11:35 AM PST up reply actions
Soler energy
Would be nice, but it’s too expensive. You folks really think the A’s will splurge on anyone?
They better.
Theeeeey better. If they “splurge” anywhere it’s going to be in the draft/International free agents.
You know you are big-time when people chant your name while you pee. - 67MARQUEZ
by bakerbeachboy on Dec 31, 2011 2:14 AM PST up reply actions
Prediciton on what happens next:
1.) Kurt Suzuki gets traded to the Tampa Bay Rays for prospects Jake Hager, SS, (Grade B- #14 in Rays Farm) and Oscar Hernandez, C, (Grade C+, #16 in Rays Farm).
2.) Our Farm System looks much much improved, an early guess on our Top 25 Prospects would look something like this (this is my own list, obviously, but no doubt it will be more accurate than the most recent rankings I saw on mlb.com)
1. A.J. Cole
2. Jarrod Parker
3. Michael Choice
4. Grant Green
5. Brad Peacock
6. Sonny Gray
7. Chris Carter (I believe he still, just barley, qualifies as a “prospect”)
8. Tom Milone
9. Derek Norris
10. Yordy Cabrera
-————————————————————————————————————————————-
11. Jake Hager
12. Vicmal De La Cruz
13. AJ Griffin
14. Michael Taylor
15. Aaron Shipman
16. Ian Krol
17. BA Vollmuth
18. Renato Nunez
19. Stephen Parker
20. Ynoa
21. Miles Head 22. Max Stassi 23. Dixon 24. Thompson 25. Alcantara
-—————————————————————————————————————————————————-
3.) Meanwhile, this leaves the Major League Squad looking like, well, fill in your own joke here. Projection, IF THE SEASON WERE TO START TODAY, on what our MLB team would look like (I’m assuming that Daric Barton will be ready to go opening day)
1.) Jemile Weeks (2B)
2.) Daric Barton (1B)
3.) Josh Reddick (RF)
4.) Brandon Allen (LF)
5.) Chris Carter (DH)
6.) Scott Sizemore (3B)
7.) Michael Taylor (CF)
8.) Cliff Pennington (SS)
9.) Josh Donaldson, C
Bench: DH, Ka’aihue; C, Recker; INF, Cardenas; OF, Cowgill; Util, Rosales
SP: McCarthy
SP: Ross
SP: Milone
SP: Parker
SP: Braden (will he be healthy?)
LRP: Outman
RP: Moscoso
RP: Balfour
RP: Devine
CP: FDLS
4.) And, um, the future is bright? Right? Glass Half Full…..We are almost allowed to move to San Jose…..which leads me to prediction 5
5.) The SF Giants continue to fart into wine glasses to take a big sniff.
6.) After the Giants cry to the Commish, all the while proud A’s fans listen to “Giants Fans” attempt to list their starting lineup, still unsure if JT Snow is at 1st Base or not, the A’s are in fact granted the right to move to San Jose, no strings attached! (except for 1, each and every player on the roster is responsible for housing Bud Selig for 3 weeks out of the year, feed him, bath him, etc. etc., as part of his retirement housing situation).
Glory is restored to this once proud franchise as the retooled farm, a new stadium, and the acquisition of an actual free agent or two makes the A’s a great team by 2015 and ready for a run similar to that of 1999-2006. However, it will be 2015 to 2022, and popping Fish Oils will have recently ban banned by the MLB, making Ryan Sweeny the greatest power hitter in the game
My mannerism a prism/ And it should shine
Light it if you would/ Be so kind, right now'd
Be A' Good Time
by DaRubiesSLOKingsA's on Dec 30, 2011 10:04 AM PST reply actions
Can Hager even be traded at this point?
He was drafted last year, so I don’t think the Rays can send him anywhere until the middle of the 2012 season, right?
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
I believe so, we will need the Draft Experts and Rule Efficiendos
to chime in on that one. I’m also not sure how many ABs or IPs a Player needs to no longer be considered a rookie or prospect
My mannerism a prism/ And it should shine
Light it if you would/ Be so kind, right now'd
Be A' Good Time
by DaRubiesSLOKingsA's on Dec 30, 2011 11:02 AM PST up reply actions
We're going to lose 4 Game 5s in a row again? Ugh.
Also I hope Parker’s in AAA, Moscoso’s in the rotation and someone better than Donaldson is teh starting catcher. And Reddick will play CF and Taylor RF with that combo. Where’s Fuentes and Blevins?
tko bira, masturbira -- Croatian proverb quoted by elcroata
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 30, 2011 10:42 AM PST up reply actions
I left out Fuentes and Blevins just so I didn't have to think about them throwing a ball
this early in the off-season. But yes, they will be in the pen’ unless of course we could find some value for one of them in a “C” prospect. I doubt we could get anything for either of them
My mannerism a prism/ And it should shine
Light it if you would/ Be so kind, right now'd
Be A' Good Time
by DaRubiesSLOKingsA's on Dec 30, 2011 11:04 AM PST up reply actions
Jordan Noberto is dominating in the winter league
As a starting pitchier. He’ll be in that lefty buillpen mix
by J.J. Miller on Dec 30, 2011 11:09 AM PST up reply actions
Well it's better than any BB/9 he's ever posted as a reliever. Or a starter.
Ever.
But yeah, the DWL is definitely a small sample size.
nice!
My mannerism a prism/ And it should shine
Light it if you would/ Be so kind, right now'd
Be A' Good Time
by DaRubiesSLOKingsA's on Dec 30, 2011 12:17 PM PST up reply actions
They aren't going to trade Suzuki
I can’t believe he’ll be worth a B- and C+ prospects, and I wouldn’t want to trade him just yet. I would for Hager, but there’s no way the Rays trade a 32nd overall pick for Zooks.
McCarthy's value
I’m confused what the A’s should do with him. He’s 28, not much of a track record. Last offseason, he was in the 5th starter bin. There was probably more hype behind harden, ross, outman, etc. Was last yr a turning point in his career?
If he remains healthy, he’s likely out of the A’s price range. But with lack of sp on the fa/trade market, McCarthy could also be a pretty valuable trade piece. Would you cash him in for a “B” prospect + bit more or hope he stays healthy and is legit?
Lets say a team offered half of the nats deal equivalent for mccarthy (norris and milone) would you do it? Or maybe a blocked 3b type like darnell, dominguez
McCarthy's probably more valuable to the A's than he is in a trade to another team
because of his injury history. Him and Braden both fall into that category where teams will likely refuse to overpay in a trade because of their bizarre injury histories. I wouldn’t mind signing him to a long-term deal. Or, I also wouldn’t mind trading him if somebody gave fair value—fair value being a high-ceiling, high-risk starting pitcher.
Err, they gave fair value for McCarthy as a high-ceiling, high-risk starting pitcher.
Not a high-ceiling, high-risk starting pitcher in return.
I'd roll the dice, sign him to a 3 year deal, and see what happens
Last season was ridiculously good, and I would hang on to him and see if he can pull off another 4 WAR season or two. His value would skyrocket. We have a pretty sound system now, so there shouldn’t be any desperation to get just a B prospect.
another wait and see if they pan out period
with the key difference being the prospect of playing in a new park in a few years. I am a fan of the team which means I become a fan of individual players on the team. When certain players rise up and perform, thus earning my fan-love and then said players are shipped out for another crop of maybe-somedays it tests my loyalty. It has not broken it, but it tests it.
I suppose I will count on the new park bringing an era where when we develop players or bring in young talent they stay for awhile (like long enough to see them have their best years in the green and gold rather than pinstripes or another wealthy club). What else can I do? The last 10 years have been dreadful with only a few exceptions.
Baja been here
The real problem with trading for prospects
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2011/12/padres-acquire-carlos-quentin.html
Carlos Quentin was traded to the Padres for two pitching prospects. Go back a year or two, and these were the two top pitching prospects in the San Diego system. Now, neither ranked in the top ten.
uh what
Pedro Hernandez was never a top 2 pitching prospect in the Padres system. Castro, yes. Pedro, no. Decent pitcher, nice upper level guy who has a shot at being an end of the rotation arm if all goes well (including the right opportunity arising), but I don’t recall a time when he was a top 2 pitching prospect.
Because he wasn't
That and the Padres are like the A’s in that they’re a small market team. You have to acquire talent young and take a gamble when you’re in that financial position. Just like the A’s can’t go blow for blow with the Angels and Rangers in buying overpriced existing MLB stars neither can the Padres do the same with LA and SF.
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