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Rostifornication

We have had a few acquisitions since the last look at the Athletics of late. We have also had a few acquisitions go through for our opposite numbers. The preliminary look is that the A’s are a good second place team in the AL West behind the Rangers, and ahead of the Angels and Mariners. This was true even before the Adrian Beltre acquisition by the Rangers, but with that move, the Rangers have rose farther ahead of us, and it is my belief that if the Rangers go out and acquire a First Baseman or Designated Hitter of quality, the division is all but theirs, despite the strides the A’s have made this off season.

In my last thread, I came to the conclusion that the A’s biggest weakness was Corner Outfield, suggesting Josh Willingham as a good trade target. Like clockwork, after my post, the A’s went out and acquired said Willingham, filling a massive hole in their outfield.

That leaves the other areas of the team that were deemed upgrade worthy: Second Base, Third Base, Fifth Starter and Relief Pitcher.

I, Personally, do not like going after expensive relievers, unless the team is desperate for a closer and has no one internal who is good enough to cement the bullpen, such as the dreaded Arthur Rhodes/Octavio Dotel disaster. Relievers will either cost too much on the free agent market, or cost too much in trade, and the A’s practice of pulling good relievers from their farm system and from the MLB Scrapheap has become something admiral and should be encouraged, and not disrupted by signing an expensive reliever that will cost a pick, or trading for a ‘closer’ or ‘elite setupman’ who would cost valuable prospects.

The flip side is true also, however. Relievers are at a premium right now, and the A’s ability to farm them puts them at a great advantage to sell them for prospects to either bolster their system with or to flip to other teams for something of greater value. Of course, having a great bullpen behind a great pitching staff is also very valuable, since it leaves you in control the entire game when you are leading.

Therefore, I want to focus on the other side of the game, the side we have the most trouble with and the side that makes A’s fans groan when the team gets down a run; the offense.

As I previously identified, we currently have solid production from 1B, SS and Catcher, and now the entire outfield and Designated Hitter. Our problem stems from having no great hitters, which are important to have to carry the team through the valleys of production that occur. The two positions that can be best for the A’s to find in this case are Second Base and Third Base, with an aging Ellis and an offensively challenged Kouzmanoff. Previously, I identified Kouzmanoff being the easiest to replace, as he was Arbitration eligible/Non-tenderable, and if the A’s cut him in Spring Training, they could be responsible for only a fraction of his salary, while Ellis was due his entire $5 Million dollar option. With Beltre off the table, this becomes even more tricky. The A’s need to find a Second Baseman and/or Third Baseman who can produce greater production than Ellis or Kouzmanoff can.

First, let’s figure out how much Ellis and Kouzmanoff are worth. After that, we will locate players that will be an upgrade over them.

According to Fangraphs, Mark Ellis has been worth 2.9, 1.2 and 3.2 WAR over the last three years, with the bulk of his value coming with defense. However, Ellis will also be 34 in 2011. Ellis has also had his share of injuries, making it a very real possibility that we may end up with a repeat of his 2009 campaign than his 2010. Factoring in his injury risk-factor, I would pencil Ellis in for a ~2 WAR season, between his 2009 and his 2010 campaign.

Kouzmanoff saw a huge boost in his defensive statistics in 2010, which also pumped up his value. In the last 3 years, Kouzmanoff has produced a WAR of 2.7, 2.7 and 2.9. I feel that it is safe to predict his value for the upcoming season. We can probably mark Kouzmanoff down as a ~2.8 WAR player for 2010.

If we narrow the field for Second Base to players who have had a combined WAR of over 6 (3 per season), we get the following list:

Chase Utley – 12.8
Ben Zobrist – 11.5
Robinson Cano – 10.7
Dustin Pedroia – 8.3
Dan Uggla – 7.9
Ian Kinsler – 7.8
Rickie Weeks – 7.5
Brandon Phillips – 7.1
Martin Prado – 7.0
Placido Polanco – 6.8
Chone Figgins – 6.7
Kelly Johnson – 6.6
Orlando Hudson – 6.1

That is an impressive list. A few of those players are likely due for decline, and not worth pursuing. Others might very well be untouchable. In another aspect, I am saddened that the A’s did not go after/acquire Dan Uggla, who would have provided a great upgrade for the A’s, especially if they could have mitigated his defensive hit by moving him to Third Base. Disregarding Uggla, the A’s best trade target might be Brandon Phillips if he can be pried from the Reds, as I do not see the Phillies, Rays, Yankees, RedSox, Braves, Rangers or Brewers, all of whom fancy themselves as playoff bound, would deal their starting Secondbaseman. Kelly Johnson might also be an intriguing trade target with the Diamondbacks in sell mode.

Let’s look at Third Base, taking the same qualification of 6 WAR over the last 2 years:

Evan Longoria – 14.2
Ryan Zimmerman – 13.9
Kevin Youkilis – 10.1
Adrian Beltre – 9.6
Scott Rolen – 8.8
Jose Buatista – 8.8
Alex Rodriguez – 8.4
David Wright – 7.4
Casey Blake – 7.2
Pablo Sandoval – 7.0
Martin Prado – 7.0
Placido Polanco – 6.8
Chone Figgins – 6.7
Micheal Young – 6.6
Chase Headly – 6.0

Here, I believe we have a much more open field, filled with gambles. Scott Rolen might be a nice trade target if you pray for health. Ryan Zimmerman would be for sure worth going after in any case, but would Washington dare to deal him? David Wright is a popular player to talk about in trades, and Pablo Sandoval, if you believe that he can remember how to hit and can put up with his defense, would be a buy low opportunity for sure. And no, I would not consider going after Mikey Young.

My feeling is that Third Base is still the best opportunity we have to upgrade. The problem is that upgrades at either position would require a bounty, and our farm system is rather thin as we have seen in the Community Prospect List. Would it be worth emptying, or sacrificing a potential future start at the position we are acquiring for? For example, it is almost a certain that the Nationals would demand Grant Green in any trade for Ryan Zimmerman (signed till 2013), something I would likely do in a heartbeat, but the Nationals would not. Many other teams would also likely demand one or more of Green, Carter or Choice.

Ultimately, the path of least resistance for the A’s to improve, albe likely not enough to catch the Rangers, probably lies in a reacquisition of Joe Blanton with the assumption of his salary, something the A’s have a lot of to spare at the moment with the failed signings of Iwakuma and Beltre. 

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3RD Base

What if um we platoon Stephen Parker and Kevin Kouzmanoff ?

by inspyro on Jan 8, 2011 11:47 PM PST reply actions  

He still projects better than Kouzmanoff by ZiPS 93 to 92 OPS+

OK that’s actually the same

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 9, 2011 4:11 AM PST up reply actions  

Damn, I never quite realized that....

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Jan 9, 2011 4:35 AM PST up reply actions  

He's much worse defensively of course.

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 9, 2011 8:54 AM PST up reply actions  

would love to see Phillips

but at what cost? He’d probably require 3 or 4 of our best hitting prospects in addition to a pitcher like Ross or Krol. I’d love to see Zobrist, too, because of his versatility, but he too would likely be overpriced. I’m wondering if the A’s are still going to go after pitching. Besides Blanton, who could be had cheap (prospect wise) if the A’s are willing to absorb his salary, it now looks like Ryan Dempster might be available since the Cubs have acquired Garza. There’s also Pavano (no thanks) on the market and a host of other lesser 4/5 type starters available.

by oakballnack on Jan 9, 2011 12:12 AM PST reply actions  

I'd take Carlos Zambrano

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 9, 2011 4:11 AM PST up reply actions  

I wouldnt

"So, the A's new organizational philosophy involves adding Viking relievers? God save us all."
"Berserkers: the new market inefficiency."
-LonestarBall

by Zonis on Jan 9, 2011 7:53 AM PST up reply actions  

Do you live in Chicago?

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 9, 2011 8:55 AM PST up reply actions  

yes

"So, the A's new organizational philosophy involves adding Viking relievers? God save us all."
"Berserkers: the new market inefficiency."
-LonestarBall

by Zonis on Jan 9, 2011 9:57 AM PST up reply actions  

He is kind of lazy, causes a lot of clubhouse disputes, is overpaid, and pitches like crap

If the A’s acquired him, he’d be like the the Giants & Zito

"So, the A's new organizational philosophy involves adding Viking relievers? God save us all."
"Berserkers: the new market inefficiency."
-LonestarBall

by Zonis on Jan 9, 2011 11:36 AM PST up reply actions  

That doesn't sound too good

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 9, 2011 1:16 PM PST up reply actions  

yeah

Unless the Cubs were willing to pay $17 mil of his salary (ha!) I’d strongly advise against Zambrano, for all of the above reasons…and he’s a douche bag.

by oakballnack on Jan 9, 2011 5:24 PM PST up reply actions  

Aaron Hill

Year Team G AB R H HR RBI BB SO SB CS OBP SLG AVG
2008 TOR 55 205 19 54 2 20 16 31 4 2 .324 .361 .263
2009 TOR 158 682 103 195 36 108 42 98 6 2 .330 .499 .286
2010 TOR 138 528 70 108 26 68 41 85 2 2 .271 .394 .205

While he had an off year last year due to a leg injury which slowed him up, he would be a great fill for 2nd base base and while his WAR didn’t qualify him on your list, he has local ties and would be amenable to playing for the A’ s if they get a new stadium.

He’s 28, entering his prime and is as focused as ever at improving off of a down year.

"I've been accused of using too many words...I suppose that's like accusing Mozart of using too many notes." Bill King

by Gerard on Jan 9, 2011 8:24 AM PST reply actions  

I don't know. One of those years is unlike the others...

"So, the A's new organizational philosophy involves adding Viking relievers? God save us all."
"Berserkers: the new market inefficiency."
-LonestarBall

by Zonis on Jan 9, 2011 8:40 AM PST up reply actions  

You mean for 3B?

I’m more worried about Pennington than Kouzmanoff. Kouzmanoff is going to give a 2 WAR season pretty much dependably. Pennington is starting the year on the DL and has had a minor league career wracked by injuries. But still I’d rather get a 5th starter and relief pitcher than anything else.

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 9, 2011 8:54 AM PST up reply actions  

Well,in Pennington's first full season as the starting SS

he put up a WAR of 4.

"So, the A's new organizational philosophy involves adding Viking relievers? God save us all."
"Berserkers: the new market inefficiency."
-LonestarBall

by Zonis on Jan 9, 2011 9:58 AM PST up reply actions  

Sure but if he's not healthy he's not going to repeat that.

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 9, 2011 11:03 AM PST up reply actions  

He suffered a torn labrum in his L shoulder surgically repaired Oct, 29

The team expects him ready by the end of ST. He said it affected him only when batting R handed. Unlike Ellis who suffered the injury from Crashkid Crosby and tore the labrum in his dominant arm and lost a season. I think he’ll be fine and can put up comparable numbers to last year. If his injury takes longer to heal then I expect him back by May.
I am encouraged if this is his only injury. With that said, shoulder surgeries generally take longer to recuperate from than others.

"I've been accused of using too many words...I suppose that's like accusing Mozart of using too many notes." Bill King

by Gerard on Jan 9, 2011 1:19 PM PST up reply actions  

From Fangraphs

HR R RBI SB BB% K% ISO BABIP AVG OBP SLGwOBA wRC+ Fld WAR

3 49 40 2 8.4 % 11.4 % .111 .299.274 .342.385 .322 95 3.3 1.2
6 70 50 5 6.9 % 12.1 % .095 .319.291 .349.386 .322 93 5.6 2.3
17 87 78 4 6.2 % 16.8 % .168 .324.291 .333.459 .341 107 5.7 3.5
2 19 20 4 7.0 % 15.1 % .098 .301.263 .324.361 .307 86 1.1 0.6
36 103 108 6 5.7 % 14.4 % .213 .288.286 .330.499 .357 119 -4.9 3.9
26 70 68 2 7.1 % 16.1 % .189 .196.205 .271.394 .291 80 3.7 1.1

The number that I can’t correlate is the -4.9 in 2009 for his fielding when Scutaro was the SS for Toronto. Not knowing if this defensive statistic is used to calculate WAR. If it is, his WAR would be much higher.

What I like about his game is that he will be healthier playing on a natural field and his power is outstanding for a 2bman. Could he play 3rd, I wasn’t considering that at this time. I did my best to fit as much data as possible. He is definitely under the radar due to his poor numbers which were lost on a prolific offense last year but hitting 62 HR certainly speaks to his power.

The data is compiled from 2005 through last season.

"I've been accused of using too many words...I suppose that's like accusing Mozart of using too many notes." Bill King

by Gerard on Jan 9, 2011 10:08 AM PST up reply actions  

UH OH

someone mentioned RBI’s!

Where’s the RBI police when you need them?

by CrazyBoutTheGreen on Jan 11, 2011 10:49 AM PST up reply actions  

The A's appear to be stockpiling relievers, to some degree,

with the two acquisitions from the Jays, Harden/McCarthy, and interest in Qualls. I wonder what the odds are they’re discussing a trade of a good reliever (e.g., Wuertz) as part of trying to add a hitter (e.g., Phillips, Headley, etc. on your list).

I kind of doubt they’re looking at 2Bmen at all, though, with Ellis under contract and only useful as an everyday starter. But clearly they have hoped to upgrade at 3B, so I’d think that’s still a possibility — if I could see a player that made sense, which I don’t really.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 9, 2011 9:25 AM PST reply actions  

I don't think any of these trade targets are really feasible

Beane isn’t going to empty the farm, especially not right now when we’re not sure if there will be pitching regression/injuries to Willingham or Crisp. Maybe midseason he could pry Hill away, or Kelly Johnson if Arizona implodes, but I don’t see any 2b above him on the list being made available period.

"The world is your oyster, but you're allergic to shellfish" -Apathy and Other Small Victories

by IChaseFrisbees on Jan 9, 2011 10:19 AM PST reply actions  

The intriguing guy on the list for me is Jose Bautista, in a couple of ways.

He’s a free agent in next year, so he’d be cheaper to acquire than many of the names on the list. So, the team could either wait a season and try to sign him next year as their long-term 3b or their long-term corner OF…or they could try and make a move in the next six months. I could see Toronto trading him, because their new core is much younger than Bautista and their window really is a few years away, as evidenced by their Marcum trade.

I would prefer the A’s trade for him rather than wait for free agency, partially because I don’t think the A’s can get anyone desirable in free agency, and partially because I think the A’s won’t have a protected first-round pick next year and would end up needing to give up the No. ~18 overall pick to sign a good player like Bautista.

The huge Jose Bautista question is, “Did he establish a new true talent level last year?” Many teams will shy away from him, believing that 2010 was a fluke, and that he’s pretty close to the player he always was. And maybe they are right.

Ultimately the A’s have to take risks to be successful, given their payroll and undesirable conditions.

Bautista is a below-average defender, so he would be an un-A’s like acquisition, but if he hits even close to how he did last year going forward, no one would complain.

The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.

by notsellingjeans on Jan 9, 2011 11:06 AM PST reply actions  

Carter and Choice for Bautista?

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 9, 2011 11:12 AM PST up reply actions  

I doubt Carter appeals enough to Tor...they've got a few future DH types already.

The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.

by notsellingjeans on Jan 9, 2011 11:36 AM PST up reply actions  

I think I'd rather...

Give up the first round draft choice than top prospects (especially a late 1st.) Keep in mind not every number one becomes a top prospect but many top prospects are not first picks.

Bautista value on the trading block will be probably cost a Carter/Green/Choice and a B-/C+ type prospect.

by OnlybuyBeaneJerseys on Jan 9, 2011 2:05 PM PST up reply actions  

I would not give up Choice and Carter for Buatista

I am not sold on Buatista being the real deal, and he would be a rental.

"So, the A's new organizational philosophy involves adding Viking relievers? God save us all."
"Berserkers: the new market inefficiency."
-LonestarBall

by Zonis on Jan 9, 2011 11:40 AM PST up reply actions  

If we are going to keep Cahill around and have a meh 5th starter

We gotta keep Kouz (or someone else who’s at least 2-5 true-talent UZR) around. While Cahill’s FIP’s isn’t great, he can be an effective pitcher with a good defense behind him. Bautista would be a disaster defensively, especially for Cahill, but for the rest of our pitchers, too.

!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon

by cuppingmaster on Jan 9, 2011 3:07 PM PST up reply actions  

Bautista would be OK in RF methinks

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 9, 2011 9:17 PM PST up reply actions  

That's a thought

He’s a good arm, right?

!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon

by cuppingmaster on Jan 10, 2011 9:33 AM PST up reply actions  

According to Fan Scouting Report, a big YES!

Release/Footwork — 78
Throwing Strength — 89
Throwing Accuracy — 88

Better scores than anyone on the Blue Jays including Yunel Escobar and Alex Gonzalez

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 10, 2011 9:59 AM PST up reply actions  

Bautista makes the most sense as a midseason acquisition.

Trading for him now is the epitome of buying high. It’s better to see if the A’s are still in it at midseason, and see if he’s still producing well enough next season to be worthy of being trade for. Plus, I think the Blue Jays still think they can compete next year so he might not even be available right now, unless for a king’s ransom.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 10, 2011 9:58 AM PST up reply actions  

There's rumors that Phily have overdone their payroll

If they somehow blow it this year and the Roys get hurt or something, thanks to the Howard deal, Utley might be worth throwing the farm and $130MM at long term. We dont have a giant contract and dont really have that A+ young stud we need to lockup at that position. I’m all for making Utley our guy.

by PL78 on Jan 9, 2011 2:43 PM PST reply actions  

2b is the only position in the farm that you can honestly assume that it will produce a prospect that you can get league average production from.

Why would you make Utley, who is getting old fast, be your guy to give 130m to?

You don't need a religion, you have the A's. - My girlfriend

by designatedforassignment on Jan 9, 2011 4:03 PM PST up reply actions  

Chase Utley is 32 years old

and as awesome and underrated as he is, he’s also injury prone. Combining him with this team’s medical staff is a nightmare waiting to happen.

"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.

by PaulThomas on Jan 9, 2011 6:37 PM PST up reply actions  

32? I thought he was in his late 20s!

Have pix been disabled? My post would be so much more if it had this gif in it:

http://static.funnyjunk.com/gifs/gif_chapeu.gif

by PL78 on Jan 9, 2011 11:35 PM PST up reply actions  

Slightly related

Twins revealed that they came in 2nd for bidding for Iwakuma at about 7-8 million…

Way to overbid Billy

"So, the A's new organizational philosophy involves adding Viking relievers? God save us all."
"Berserkers: the new market inefficiency."
-LonestarBall

by Zonis on Jan 9, 2011 7:35 PM PST reply actions  

this.

You don't need a religion, you have the A's. - My girlfriend

by designatedforassignment on Jan 10, 2011 9:25 AM PST up reply actions  

Exactly. THIS was the problem.

And why, I believe, Rakuten offered to share some of the bid with Iwakuma if he and the A’s could get a deal done.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 10, 2011 5:01 PM PST up reply actions  

If they offered to share the bid it is highly likely that a deal would have gotten done.

ipso facto, they probably didn’t offer to get the deal done.

You don't need a religion, you have the A's. - My girlfriend

by designatedforassignment on Jan 10, 2011 7:00 PM PST up reply actions  

true, but he didn't know what other teams were posting

Better to win and be able to negotiate, then underbid and have nothing. If anything, this illustrates the problems with the posting system itself.

!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon

by cuppingmaster on Jan 10, 2011 9:34 AM PST up reply actions  

True, but he could have bid an amount that would have enabled them to sign Iwakuma for an amount

that made sense for both sides. They’re lucky Iwakuma didn’t challenge their negotiations on good faith grounds, whether he would have won that challenge or not.

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 10, 2011 9:55 AM PST up reply actions  

Looks like the A's primary goal was to block.

Getting Iwakuma for a lowball offer would’ve been the cherry on top.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 10, 2011 9:54 AM PST up reply actions  

It seems possible they wanted to block

But I still don’t see their offer as a low ball. I think they misread the market and Iwakuma was going to need major cash since he is a FA after this year.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Jan 10, 2011 1:45 PM PST up reply actions  

So either the A's misread the market (as they've been doing for a while now)

or they lowballed a player…neither of those inspire much confidence in me.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 10, 2011 1:47 PM PST up reply actions  

I endorse this statement,

The A’s have had a pretty horrible offseason.

Signed,
DFA

You don't need a religion, you have the A's. - My girlfriend

by designatedforassignment on Jan 10, 2011 7:01 PM PST up reply actions  

Iwakuma and Beltre didn't turn out optimally

But Willingham and DeJesus were good moves. The Raj trade wasn’t great either but the A’s have certainly improved over the offseason while not adding a ton of payroll.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Jan 10, 2011 10:43 PM PST up reply actions  

They sold high on Raj

It wouldn’t be shocking for Raj to be a non-tender candidate a year from now. The A’s got the very best value of his career in the two years after they grabbed him on a waiver claim. Let some other team overpay for his decline phase.

I think one of those two relievers will pan out. If even one of them does, the deal is a good value.

The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.

by notsellingjeans on Jan 11, 2011 11:01 AM PST up reply actions  

While I'm not as opposed to the Raj trade as some

Raj makes a pretty damn good 5th OF. I also don’t have the vitriol some here do for Conor Jackson, but Raj fills his role much better for the same price.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Jan 11, 2011 12:50 PM PST up reply actions  

They seem to be worse prospects than a guy the A's grabbed off the minor league free agent wire

I’d be quite surprised if either of them ever amounts to anything of value.

"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.

by PaulThomas on Jan 11, 2011 6:18 PM PST up reply actions  

yeah, but having the three option years of flexibility is a key advantage over the minor league FA...

assuming one of them does pan out.

I tend to give the A’s the benefit of the doubt when evaluating relievers.

On the flip side, ask me if Rashun Dixon, Shipman or any toolsy A’s offensive prospect will harness their gifts and develop into a 4 WAR player. There’s nothing I’m more pessimistic about than the A’s inability to find and develop that.

This franchise desperately needs a guy to randomly explode into a Jason Heyward/Mike Trout-type talent.

The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.

by notsellingjeans on Jan 12, 2011 12:59 PM PST up reply actions  

yes

and unfortunately, they need to draft him first! I don’t know that anyone in our system is going to randomly explode into a Jason Heyward type (Dixon might be the closest thing, and I, like you, have serious doubts), and the last guy that tried to randomly explode into a blue chip offensive prospect is now delivering sermons and leading worship at Our Lady of Perpetual Minor League Dropouts Church in Southern California.

by oakballnack on Jan 12, 2011 1:28 PM PST up reply actions  

J. Ortiz still has all three options

He was granted FA because of having spent six-plus years in the minors; he’s never been on a 40-man roster, however.

"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.

by PaulThomas on Jan 12, 2011 3:34 PM PST up reply actions  

Not quite

That trade was close to a salary dump. I doubt Davis’s salary has anything to do with the price of beans. I just think they overvalued Conor Jackson.

"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.

by PaulThomas on Jan 12, 2011 10:48 PM PST up reply actions  

They've improved in the timeframe where it matters most.

I don’t see how you can call that “pretty horrible”. Could it have turned out better? Of course. But it’s, at worst, okay.

by danmerqury on Jan 10, 2011 10:47 PM PST up reply actions  

I'm sorry

but you can’t call this a “pretty horrible offseason”. Not to direct this soley at you, but there are a few fans around here that would rather play the pessimist then just be happy about having a better team then last year and rooting for the A’s. What exactly should the A’s have done different this offseason that would have turned this offseason from “pretty horrible” into solid? Offered Beltre 6/110? Given into Iwakuma’s demands and overpaying him? Putting a gun to Lance Berkman’s head and telling him “sign on the fucking line now!!”?

We missed some targets, yes. Most of that was out of the A’s hands. That said, we had some gaping holes last year in the COF, and that IMO was our biggest offensive weakness. We addressed those with two pretty damn good players in Willingham and DeJesus. Yes, DFA’ing Cust was probably a dumb move, but having Cust over Matsui wouldn’t make or break this 2011 team. There’s a pretty good chance that Matsui will produce at or near the same level as Cust this upcoming season.

Once you add the additions to the pitching staff in Harden and McCarthey, this offseason actually looks pretty successful considering were not the Phillies, Yankees or Red Sox who can just pluck who they want off of the market. I’m pretty happy about this offseason. Could I be happier? Absolutely, but Beane did what he could to improve this team and give them a shot at contending in 2011. Not quite “pretty horrible” IMO.

by JPShark on Jan 11, 2011 9:28 AM PST up reply actions  

Allowing Beltre to fall into the Rangers' hands was one of the worst things that could have happened this offseason

Allowing that after the team had already made a bunch of win-now commitments just adds pain.

"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.

by PaulThomas on Jan 12, 2011 3:36 PM PST up reply actions  

No one of the best things....

It’s one player. He’s 32 to start the year. He’s was giving a contract at 16 million a year, until he’s 37 year old.

My division rival overpaying for players is a good thing. Did their overpayment of A-rod make or break the team? No in fact they still can’t pay off his contract.

It’s much better than Lee resigning. Beltre<Lee and he’s paid almost the same. See what happens over the next couple years in terms of trying to make mid season get over-the-hump trades that involve payroll pickups. They wouldn’t be able to get the 8 million dollar Blanton who could help them eat innings. Or in the future pick up not known name now.

Money for players shouldn’t be spend unwisely or just to stop another team from getting a player. Which is what Texas did, and it will prove to be stupid.

by OnlybuyBeaneJerseys on Jan 12, 2011 4:27 PM PST up reply actions  

Lee would have been worse

The Beltre scenario worked out pretty bad for the A’s but quite a few things could have been worse.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Jan 13, 2011 1:04 AM PST up reply actions  

I'm unconvinced of this, to say the least

I think the difference between Beltre→A’s and Beltre→ Rangers is very probably higher than the difference between Lee→Rangers and Lee→third party. If the A’s had actually been serious contenders for Lee, maybe this would be a different story.

"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.

by PaulThomas on Jan 13, 2011 4:19 PM PST up reply actions  

I agree that Beltre signing with Texas is a bad thing.

The Rangers are the pretty clear favorite to win the division at this point. That said, we are looking at fielding a pretty damn good team next year and I just don’t see Texas as quite the powerhouse that some feel they are. Their offense looks pretty fucking good yes, but their rotation just doesn’t scare me without Cliff Lee at the front. Webb has been a non-factor in MLB the last two seasons, Wilson is a converted reliever (I realize a pretty good one at that) who is coming off a season in which he threw 3x as many innings as he had in any prior season, and while I think Colby Lewis is for real, he’s not an ace.

I guess I just don’t see what could/should have been done differently. Contract-wise, I don’t like the deal for Texas. So any offer that would have lured Beltre to Oakland, would have been well beyond what Beltre is worth IMO. It more then likely would have taken at least 6/102 (or 5/85 with the vesting option), and that is a figure I just didn’t want to see the A’s getting anwhere close too. I just don’t see any kind of justification for a team like the A’s committing that type of contract to a player like Beltre. He’s good, just not $100 million dollar good, especially in his age 32-37 seasons. The A’s made a couple legit offers, and it resulted in Texas overpaying because they needed to make a splash after losing Lee.

by JPShark on Jan 13, 2011 10:09 AM PST up reply actions  

The problem with NOT overpaying, in this case

Was that we may feel good about not paying Beltre that kind of money, but now he’s on another team. What’s more, he’s on a division rival. If the Rangers win the division by a couple games over us this year, not paying Adrian Beltre $3M more a year for an extra year you might not have really wanted to pay isn’t going to feel so good.

I’m slowly coming to the realization that many FAs on the market who are close to elite are going to get overpaid anyway. When your team has the money to do this and they are 1 or 2 pieces away, it might as well be your team that overpays instead of someone else.

That said, here’s hoping Kouz has another career defensive year and gets his wOBA over .300.

!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon

by cuppingmaster on Jan 13, 2011 11:26 AM PST up reply actions  

He claims that his back hurt for a lot of 2010.

Kouz, I mean. And yeah, I know I know, it’s another one of those “best shape of my life!!!” things, but still.

by danmerqury on Jan 13, 2011 3:01 PM PST up reply actions  

Like I've said,

once you realize that a sizable part of the “contract” to Beltre is actually a bribe to get him not to play for Oakland’s division rivals, it’s pretty easy to justify going much higher than the A’s did. It’s not about “is he worth this money in a vacuum.”

As for their pitching, I’m expecting Derek Holland to be a #2 or better starter by 2012. Don’t make the mistake of underestimating him because of one rookie-stress-induced meltdown in the World Series. He was an extraordinarily good pitching prospect in the minors, on a par with Cahill and Anderson.

"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.

by PaulThomas on Jan 13, 2011 4:23 PM PST up reply actions  

it may be bad faith, but it's good business

I don’t know if BB would have thought the Twins would have come in second in the bidding, but if the goal was to keep him out of the AL West(Texas) or even the AL in general he accomplished that without giving up anything. You’re right that it’s kind of a dick move, but if it keeps a potential 2 or 3 starter irrelevant and it costs nothing it’s the right call.

The worst person to run from is yourself.

by noesis78 on Jan 10, 2011 12:02 PM PST reply actions  

I don't think we made the move from that perspective, as it would kill any relationship with Japan

I think it was simply negotiations that broke down between the two parties, as seen by Twittergate.

"So, the A's new organizational philosophy involves adding Viking relievers? God save us all."
"Berserkers: the new market inefficiency."
-LonestarBall

by Zonis on Jan 10, 2011 12:15 PM PST up reply actions  

In addition....

He is a number 4/5 starter (at least in many expert opinions) I don’t really think creating a potential A’s and Japan PR problem is worth blocking a number 4/5 starter from being in our division.

Remember Dice-K was much better than him in Japan, plus he’s older, and had some surgeries. His potential is less than Dice-k who has a career- FIP of 4.21 in the MLB.

Would you really risk PR/Legal problems for this level of player? There’s no way our front office is that stupid/shady!

by OnlybuyBeaneJerseys on Jan 10, 2011 12:32 PM PST up reply actions  

Olney: Rangers are pursuing Jim Thome.

Crap.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 10, 2011 12:36 PM PST reply actions  

ah! Beat me to it

And yes…^&%^&% Rangers.

!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon

by cuppingmaster on Jan 10, 2011 12:38 PM PST up reply actions  

I think, at this point, the A's have to block this move.

They can’t afford for the Rangers to get any more significant upgrades this offseason. Yes, I realize that Matsui is already the DH, but I have no confidence in his ability to produce much if anything and the A’s have such high injury risks in the outfield that it’s not inconceivable that Matsui will end up playing the outfield anyways.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 10, 2011 12:46 PM PST up reply actions  

so, sign him anyways?

Then, what do we do with two dudes who actually can’t play the field? Carry one less pitcher?

I guess we could trade Sweeney or something… I just think we bit too early on Matsui and there’s not much we do about it now.

!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon

by cuppingmaster on Jan 10, 2011 12:59 PM PST up reply actions  

I wonder if the Jays would consider trading us Rajai Davis.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 10, 2011 5:03 PM PST up reply actions  

It's your fault he got traded in the first place

"You ain't got nothin to say, it was perfect" -Dallas Braden, 05/09/10
Eric Chavez smiled at me once and I got pregnant -Jennifer

by MissOakland on Jan 11, 2011 11:45 AM PST up reply actions  

I doubt that

My mom has made life miserable for everyone around her since the trade.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 11, 2011 7:15 PM PST up reply actions  

Another Rajai fan?

My best friend is devastated..as if it wasn’t hard enough to get her to go to games..

"You ain't got nothin to say, it was perfect" -Dallas Braden, 05/09/10
Eric Chavez smiled at me once and I got pregnant -Jennifer

by MissOakland on Jan 12, 2011 5:20 PM PST up reply actions  

She adores Rajai

And believed in him long before he did anything good.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 12, 2011 6:31 PM PST up reply actions  

Cut Jackson.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 10, 2011 1:06 PM PST up reply actions  

There's still no way to give both Thome and Matsui playing time

"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.

by PaulThomas on Jan 10, 2011 1:10 PM PST up reply actions  

Then we're in serious trouble here.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 10, 2011 1:12 PM PST up reply actions  

pretty much

I don’t see how there is room for both guys without cutting something important, like a utility IF (Rosales) or one of those two not playing (thus severely diminishing their value.)

!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon

by cuppingmaster on Jan 10, 2011 1:18 PM PST up reply actions  

I'm not sure why we went for Matsui over Thome anyway.

Matsui was the safety pick. He wanted to come here. Why not go for a better choice in Thome, and if he says no, then sign Matsui?

by danmerqury on Jan 10, 2011 1:38 PM PST up reply actions  

Probably cause Beane liked the fact that he could get Matsui for under 5 million.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 10, 2011 1:41 PM PST up reply actions  

Do the Twins have a possibl DH already?

I thought they would re-sign Thome and the Rangers would have Young at DH

"You ain't got nothin to say, it was perfect" -Dallas Braden, 05/09/10
Eric Chavez smiled at me once and I got pregnant -Jennifer

by MissOakland on Jan 10, 2011 1:44 PM PST up reply actions  

Delmon Young emerging as an everyday player means they have Kubel as the primary DH option.

So Thome isn’t necessary.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 10, 2011 1:49 PM PST up reply actions  

You don't turn down Thome for Jason Kubel.

That’d be like turning down Jack Cust for Eric Chavez.

by danmerqury on Jan 10, 2011 1:55 PM PST up reply actions  

Well, Kubel at DH isn't the disaster that Chavez was

so technically Thome isn’t an urgent need. But it would be a significant downgrade. Let’s hope Minny realizes that right now.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 10, 2011 2:06 PM PST up reply actions  

Does this mean Young loses the DH role

and becomes just the utility infielder? Or could Moreland be losing 1B?

"You ain't got nothin to say, it was perfect" -Dallas Braden, 05/09/10
Eric Chavez smiled at me once and I got pregnant -Jennifer

by MissOakland on Jan 10, 2011 1:40 PM PST up reply actions  

Ugh.

Either way, that’s bad news. Thome is an upgrade over Young at DH, and Young is an upgrade over Moreland at 1B.

by danmerqury on Jan 10, 2011 1:45 PM PST up reply actions  

Juuust wonderful.

I’m going to go ahead and hold out hope that Minny re-signs him because he likes where he’s at, Texas has Young at DH and the Angels are dissolved

"You ain't got nothin to say, it was perfect" -Dallas Braden, 05/09/10
Eric Chavez smiled at me once and I got pregnant -Jennifer

by MissOakland on Jan 10, 2011 1:51 PM PST up reply actions  

Even if they don't sign Thome,

Assume that they will add either Branyan or Nick Johnson.

With their current roster construction it makes way too much sense to add a lefty-hitting DH. They’ll get one of those three dudes.

They’ll get Young 550 at-bats all over the diamond. The lefty DH they sign will only face righties, and then Young or another RHH will DH against lefties.

The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.

by notsellingjeans on Jan 10, 2011 2:57 PM PST up reply actions  

Heh. You said Nick Johnson.

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 11, 2011 12:22 AM PST up reply actions  

Let's not get stupid over Texas trying to lure Thome

Our pitching should be able to handle these guys, yes, even aging veterans. Is he better than Vlad? I doubt it.

The A’s have plenty of time reassess what holes they have. I just wish someone would give Kouz a break by seeing what he will do in the 6 spot or lower.

"I've been accused of using too many words...I suppose that's like accusing Mozart of using too many notes." Bill King

by Gerard on Jan 10, 2011 4:03 PM PST reply actions  

Thome was better than Vlad by a huge margin last year, even while Vlad was playing in Texas and Thome had to play in Target Field.

And the Rangers get to play other teams beside us…

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 10, 2011 4:09 PM PST up reply actions  

Especially the Astros

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 11, 2011 12:22 AM PST up reply actions  

I stand (actually sit) corrected

I was thinking about the 1st half of last season when Vlad did well c/w the 2nd half where he looked tired. But I think that’s what the Texas heat can do to older players. Thome would be an upgrade and maybe just sitting and sweating won’t be as bad for him as it was for Vlad.

"I've been accused of using too many words...I suppose that's like accusing Mozart of using too many notes." Bill King

by Gerard on Jan 13, 2011 9:38 AM PST up reply actions  

Nick Johnson/Chad Qualls - expensive minor-league deals.

This seems like the best place to post this.

I think the A’s are done this offseason. I think they basically like their 40-man roster. They were willing to make a trade to acquire the guy who currently their 40th man, and he has an option remaining, both of which imply that they don’t believe there’s any chaff at the back end that they’d be willing to simply let go of.

More than ever, though, I’d like them to spend a couple million bucks on minor league signings.

Qualls and Johnson will probably both get major league offers, but I’d like the A’s to outbid other teams’ major league offer with a $1-2.5M minor-league deal, and stash them in Sac until someone gets placed on the 60-day DL.

In Johnson’s case, he’s a Sac native and lived there through high school, hopefully that would appeal to him, along with the $2M outlay. He DH’s and plays some 1st there. He’s insurance in case Barton or Matsui go down. There’s a big left-handed vacuum if either one does.

Qualls…I’m ambivalent, but I’m thinking the team’s interest is sincere, and the million-dollar minor league deal is a way around him requiring a roster slot right now.

The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.

by notsellingjeans on Jan 12, 2011 1:05 PM PST reply actions  

I think Johnson and Qualls would rather take a cheaper major league deal with a guaranteed roster spot than that.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 12, 2011 2:03 PM PST up reply actions  

Despite his down year...

I’m not even sure 2M will do it, even with last year’s injuries. The guy is an OBP machine, and a sports a career OPS of .844.

If he’s healthy he’s almost a guaranteed 2 WAR player. I like the idea of having him and it’s not like we can’t give him a some cash on a one year deal. Give him 2M with some incentives to make it 3.5

It could be a win/win. If he plays well in ST we could find a spot from DFA Conor, send down Sweeney, or he can replace one of the members of our fragile outfield who will probably get hurt during ST. Matsui hides his sub-par defense in the outfield and Nick goes to DH. I don’t think he’s play OF for a few years but I bet he could be hidden there a few times.

If he doesn’t do well or there are not injuries (miracle!) he will get cut and find a job on another team.

by OnlybuyBeaneJerseys on Jan 12, 2011 5:50 PM PST up reply actions  

I like the irony of signing Nick Johnson

to be at the ready when someone gets injured.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 12, 2011 6:32 PM PST up reply actions  

I'd like him to PH in every game that he's healthy....ie Opening Day

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 15, 2011 10:24 AM PST up reply actions  

minor league contracts

are not guaranteed, correct? Why would any athlete with an IQ higher than a small house plant sign even a huge minor league (non-guaranteed) contract when they’ve been offered a modest guaranteed major league deal (with all the trappings that come with a major league contract)?

by oakballnack on Jan 12, 2011 9:10 PM PST up reply actions  

No need to disparage house plants here.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 12, 2011 9:39 PM PST up reply actions  

They can be guaranteed if the team guarantees it, sure

Who’s to stop the team from doing that if they want to?

"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.

by PaulThomas on Jan 12, 2011 10:49 PM PST up reply actions  

Yep.

The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.

by notsellingjeans on Jan 13, 2011 8:39 AM PST up reply actions  

They could even offer him an out-clause if they want

Something like, $2M guaranteed, with the promise that he’ll be released/traded if he’s not on the Major League Roster by July 1st.

He would be insurance in case Barton or Matsui went down.

The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.

by notsellingjeans on Jan 13, 2011 8:40 AM PST up reply actions  

That still wouldn't do them any good.

Why would he only agree to a half season to reestablish value?

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 13, 2011 1:17 PM PST up reply actions  

I'm proposing the highest dollar figure offer.

That’s what most player want – the most money possible.

With Johnson, there’s perhaps the added benefit of “coming home,” since he was born and raised in Sac.

The last part of the proposal is that – if he chooses to – he can be granted free agency a few months in. Assuming the A’s had already given him the best offer he received, dollar wise, he probably wouldn’t do this…unless another team’s starting first baseman had gone down, he was putting up a .320/.450/.650 in Sac, and the other team offered $2M+ for the remainder of the year.

The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.

by notsellingjeans on Jan 13, 2011 2:03 PM PST up reply actions  

You're not getting it.

Let’s say Johnson’s highest monetary offer is indeed the A’s 2 million dollar minor league offer. Do you really think he cares about the extra million or so he’ll make with the A’s if it adversely impacts how much he’ll make following the season? No, he wants to reestablish his value to earn a bigger payday. That means a major league roster spot and getting the most major league at bats possible are the most important things to him next season. A league minimum major league deal is a lot more appealing to him than 2 million dollars and a guaranteed major league spot only in July (or free agency!).

And who cares about “coming home” to Sacramento if it means playing in AAA after 10 years in the big leagues?

The only way your proposal works if no one else offers him a major league deal at all, which doesn’t look likely. But then that’s not part of the premise of your argument, right? In any case, you wouldn’t have to offer him 2 million to sign anyways. I suppose you can offer him an insane 5 million minor league deal to try to substantially outclass those major league offers….but why would you spend that much on someone’s who not even the 25th man on your roster?

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 13, 2011 2:22 PM PST up reply actions  

There is a bit of precedent

Hank Blalock ended up taking a similar deal to NSJ’s proposal…

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Jan 13, 2011 4:32 PM PST up reply actions  

Blalock had absolutely no other offer, major league or minor league.

He had to take the Rays’ minor league deal. It’s not comparable at all.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 13, 2011 4:41 PM PST up reply actions  

Why is everyone assuming that a Nick Johnson deal

Wouldn’t include an invitation to ST, and competition? A lot of players sign knowing the odds are against them making the opening day roster. I think what NSJ is actually saying is that give him a deal (best of the market) to come be on a team with a non roster guarantee, possible time in the minors.

I don’t think that’s completely unreasonable. (and maybe I was totally wrong about what he was saying)

by OnlybuyBeaneJerseys on Jan 13, 2011 7:55 PM PST up reply actions  

The whole point is that if he has a major league offer on the table, he wouldn't take the A's non roster invite, minor league deal, etc.

The best deal for him has to have a guaranteed major league roster spot.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 13, 2011 8:58 PM PST up reply actions  

I guess I'm much more pessimistic about the Nick Johnson market....

Actually, it’s just where I put my comment that’s causing the confusion. I don’t mean to argue Johnson would take a MiLB deal over a ML one if offered. Just that I think Johnson could very well have to take a deal like Blalock.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Jan 13, 2011 8:39 PM PST up reply actions  

NSJ's premise is that the A's can have him for a 2 million dollar minor league deal, even if he has major league offers on the table.

I disagree with that.

Obviously if he has no major league offers at all (like Blalock) then he’ll take that 2 million dollar minor league deal in an instant. But then again, it wouldn’t take 2 million dollars to get him so it’d be an entirely different situation.

And with plenty of teams still looking for DH upgrades (including our two AL West rivals), I seriously doubt Johnson isn’t going to find a major league offer for at least a million or so.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 13, 2011 9:03 PM PST up reply actions  

There is some point at which...

The increased dollars tip the scale.

Is it a $2.5M offer in Sac, vs. a $500K in the bigs with another team? We don’t know the particulars of what he’s going to be offered.

I get that it’s easier for him to market himself in MLB. I get that it helps his next contract. I disagree that there is no scenario in which the wise play is for him to take the minor league deal for greater money. At some point, the upfront money talks.

The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.

by notsellingjeans on Jan 13, 2011 10:54 PM PST up reply actions  

Right, I mentioned that in my original comment.

Maybe if you blew Johnson away by offering something that’s 5 million or so better than the next guy’s offer, you’d have a shot. But that doesn’t work for the A’s because it makes no sense to pay someone who’s not even on the 25 man roster that kind of money. I highly doubt an extra one or two million this year is enough to convince him to agree to the probability of sacrificing half the season toiling in the minors.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 13, 2011 11:11 PM PST up reply actions  

I think he's a downgrade

from Thome/Manny/Damon/Vlad. That’s 4 better options, and I’m not sure Texas will sign any of them.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Jan 14, 2011 2:07 AM PST up reply actions  

Except that....

Thome is 40. He had a good year so maybe he still has some gas in him, but I think it’s as much of a dice roll as Johnsons health.

Manny is 38. personality issues, and I’m pretty sure he is a tail end of his career guy. Given his decline and personality I’m not sure he’s totally better.

Damon-37-For sure he’s in a tail end of his career. Sub 2 WAR last year. The year before his WAR was only due to a short porch in left. Even with Johnson’s Health concerns I’ll still take him over Damon any day.

Vladimir-Numbers were totally helped by being in Texas. But still has a couple seasons in him being only 35. I’d take him over Johnson.

But this Johnson idea seems like a good gamble. He’s young enough. His OBP skills are something that will stay with him no matter what kind of season he’s having.

He played in 130 games in 2009. I’d say the gamble is worth is on a one year deal. 2 Million invitation to ST. Heatlh incentives to be 3.5. I think it will take that much because there are Big “Names” inflating the DH market.

The names you brought up do make a good point though. It’s supply and demand and there’s a lot of DHs out there. I think this Nick idea could really work.

 

by OnlybuyBeaneJerseys on Jan 14, 2011 5:39 AM PST up reply actions  

Thome was way better than all those dudes last year

There’s no reason to think he’ll fall off a cliff even though he is pushing 41. I would have rather signed him for 6 or 7M than gotten Matsui for 4M.

!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon

by cuppingmaster on Jan 14, 2011 7:04 AM PST up reply actions  

He was great last year....

2009 not as great. His last 3 years were not Thome prime years. I’m willing to suspect he had one great one left and that was 2010 and now his age is just too scary.

I also don’t think a playoff contender (which we are) should have a 40 year old DH. I also don’t think Thome would cost more, and wouldn’t go for spliting DH/minor league.

But there’s no way to argue when that sudden drop will come. So we’ll have to see.

by OnlybuyBeaneJerseys on Jan 14, 2011 7:25 AM PST up reply actions  

I'm in favor of signing Johnson to a small Major League deal.

For the rare games he is healthy he’ll improve our offense. We can either sit Matsui or run him out to LF.

If it had been entirely up to me, the A’s would have kept Rajai and Cust and passed on Jackson and Matsui, then brought Johnson aboard.

I consider Johnson a good enough player that when is he actually healthy, the team should play him and worry about corresponding moves later.

"We've come a long way, and I'm not talking about Virginia Slims, either." - Art Howe

by EastCoastA on Jan 13, 2011 3:02 PM PST up reply actions  

whose spot

would he take on the roster?

by oakballnack on Jan 13, 2011 10:07 PM PST up reply actions  

Someone could be optioned down if he's actually ready Opening Day.

I’d cross that bridge when I got there.

"We've come a long way, and I'm not talking about Virginia Slims, either." - Art Howe

by EastCoastA on Jan 14, 2011 9:22 AM PST up reply actions  

Well, there goes the marsupial.

Qualls is close with Padres one year 2 million and a club option for 2012.

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 13, 2011 1:29 PM PST reply actions  

I'd be opposed, even if I thought he was better than I do, because of the poor likelihood of successfully gaming the system to get draft picks

If you’re going to sign a reliever to a one-year deal, do it with a guy who might luck into a Type A classification.

"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.

by PaulThomas on Jan 13, 2011 4:27 PM PST up reply actions  

this

You don't need a religion, you have the A's. - My girlfriend

by designatedforassignment on Jan 13, 2011 5:07 PM PST up reply actions  

Ugh, I'm just hoping the A's have something in the works...

Whether it be Balfour or Blanton or something else…they can’t be satisfied with the current roster going into spring training. Maybe they’re still catatonic from losing Beltre…

"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 13, 2011 5:11 PM PST up reply actions  

I think the loophole is fast closing

It’s not going to be much longer that players will see relievers like Soriano struggling to get a good contract as a Type A, not to mention a Balfour or Juan Cruz. As soon as teams offer arbitration in the future, relievers might very well start accepting.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Jan 13, 2011 8:41 PM PST up reply actions  

are there any relievers

currently on the roster that could leave as type a or type b free agents in the next year or two? Wuertz? Ziegler? I’d think that either of those guys would be at least type b if they posted a decent season this year.

by oakballnack on Jan 13, 2011 10:11 PM PST up reply actions  

Ziegler cannot become a free agent until after the 2014 season; he's not even close

Wuertz is the only realistic possibility, barring some kind of blow-your-mind ace year out of Harden.

"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.

by PaulThomas on Jan 14, 2011 9:59 PM PST up reply actions  

more likely a

“blow-your-shoulder ace BANDAGE” year out of Harden in ’11.

by oakballnack on Jan 15, 2011 8:53 PM PST up reply actions  

Balfour's marsupial enough for me

It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 15, 2011 10:24 AM PST up reply actions  

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