Colby Rasmus has requested to be traded (OMG)
by PL78 on Sep 5, 2010 11:30 AM PDT
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PrintIn this thread we shall talk about what players we would trade to attain this marvelous young superstar in the making.
I will be the first to offer my opinion of: literally any single player we have. Or anyone on the farm. Really, who do we have any single player that is of more value than him? Gio? Maybe Barton? I cant think of anyone else. However, we do have plenty of pieces that combined, should be enough to get him. We could throw any 5 players we have at them and that should get it done....
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I would very much like to acquire Colby Rasmus, please
Thnx.
"I've made a huge little mistake." - G.O.B.
rasmus gets bonus points for not getting along with tony larussa
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones."
-BB 07/27/05
However, that doesn't fit into the plan of luring Tony LaRussa back to Oakland.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 6, 2010 10:39 AM PDT up reply actions
If TLR doesn't like Rasmus, he damn shouldn't be in Oakland.
I like teams with good young players. The A’s will have a lot of them next year.
Needs moar dingerz.
And, benching your best players in a pennant race for reasons of
“he needs to improve his game” is absolutely unacceptable.
Rasmus is hands down the 3rd best non-pitcher on the Cardinals, behind Pujols and Holliday. If he was getting benched for approach issues, while being an above average major leaguer, there’s a HUGE problem.
Needs moar dingerz.
Yes please!
But do we even having anything that could get it done?
If we could get it done, I’d move him to left or right and sign him to an extension pronto.
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
According to the article, Rasmus asked for a trade his rookie season as well
Plus TLR could be let go after this season. Point is, I’d be surprised if any trade came close to fruition.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
They will only trade him if Larussa comes back and they would still be asking for the moon.
It would take probably Gio or something similar to acquire him. (See Young for Garza)
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 11:44 AM PDT reply actions
I'd do that though
Gio or Cahill for Rasmus straight up. We need Rasmus like Sean Penn needs cocaine.
Id also give any 5 or 6 guys in the minors for him. Or Anderson & Bailey. I think we have enough parts to get him, it would be a giant haul but honestly, totally worth it. We wouldnt need to sign Crawford or Werth too.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Why? Hes been worth less than Gio or Cahill this year
hes got less control than Gio (though Gio will probably be a Super 2).
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:04 PM PDT up reply actions
I'd give any combination of 4 minor leaguers in the system for him.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Sep 5, 2010 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions
Carter Green Krol and Taylor/Donaldson?
really?
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:07 PM PDT up reply actions
I probably would too, but that says more about how much the farm system has fallen apart than anything else
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
That's pretty dumb. The net result is that you wouldn't be improving your overall team.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Sep 5, 2010 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
right.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:07 PM PDT up reply actions
You dont think we have pitching depth to cover Gio?
We are Oakland, all we ever have is pitching depth. What we dont have enough of are young star everyday position players. Im saying the downgrade from Gio to Mazzaro/Outman/Mortensen is going to work out better than having Sweeney instead of Rasmus.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Also it frees up money so we can make a run at Cliff Lee instead of Crawford.
lol jk
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Gio is our best health pitcher
the downgrade would be significant.
Also Rasmus is probably only ~ 1 WAR better than Sweeney.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:12 PM PDT up reply actions
Right now the A's need more than one outfield upgrade
They need two. Or really two and a half, because I’m not keen on counting on Coco Crisp to remain both healthy and good next season.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Im fine with Crisp/Davis as one of the OF positions.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:30 PM PDT up reply actions
And Sweeney as a second?
You’re one chill dude if that’s the case. I’d rather start the season with Sweeney and Davis on the bench.
If Rajai Davis is getting starts against righthanded pitchers, your outfield situation sucks.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
This should be our #1 priority this offseason
Make sure that Davis and Sweeney are nowhere near a starting job. Crisp has done enough to get a spot, but we need 2 more to take that final leap to genuine contenders. Whether its Ordonez, Werth, Crawford or Rasmus, we need players of that caliber to get us to the top. We are agonizingly close, but if we waste regular everyday starting jobs to our current band of mediocrity, we are doomed to play as such.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Im looking for options that don't cost talent.
The A’s problem is that they lack talent to contend over the next three or four years but have to contend because thats when the nucleus is ready/affordable.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:45 PM PDT up reply actions
If you have the opportunity to upgrade your talent
then you should take it even if it costs you some from elsewhere on the roster.
Right now Rasmus looks like a 3-4 win upgrade per season over the essentially replacement-level chaff the A’s have listed under “outfield.” Even if you give up 2-3 wins per season to get that, it’s a trade you should make.
Borrowing from Peter to pay Paul actually makes sense if the interest rate on Peter’s loan is a lot lower.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I don't think hes a bad target. I just think the interest rate on Peter's loan is higher than Im willing to pay
when I can just get a job and pay Paul back with my money (FA). If you can sign Crawford/Werth then I guess Id be willing to give up Taylor/Green/Donaldson/Krol. But if you have to fill 2 OF spots with out signing Werth or Crawford then I think you have to try to diversify and pick up a McLouth or Soriano’s contract and rely on Carter/Taylor providing one of the OF spots.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 1:02 PM PDT up reply actions
I dunno man the unemployment rate is pretty high
it might be hard to get a job when your clothes are pretty outdated and you dont have that many friends.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Sorry, I thought we were still talking about the Gio swap
As far as the minor leaguers go, I’m just not sure the A’s have time to wait around for them to (maybe) turn into good players.
I doubt it’d cost that much talent though. Not with him in the doghouse— that’s the whole point, right? I think the A’s could potentially land him for Sweeney (weren’t the Cardinals high on him at one point?) plus like two of those pieces.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Green, Sweeney and Taylor?
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions
Seems reasonable
I’d do it.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
It'd be nice to cough up pitching rather than the few hitting prospects left in the system...
"I've made a huge little mistake." - G.O.B.
Which pitching prospects would anyone want?
I guess Fautino, but he’s a reliever. That’s not going to be enough to replace Green. If you mean Fautino instead of Taylor, maybe.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions
You don't think they'd want anyone in the low minors?
There are some interesting options down in Stockton. In any event, I’d prefer a deal in which only one offensive centerpiece gets traded— and if that’s Green/Carter/Taylor, so be it. I’d be willing to fill in around him with whatever minor league pitching they’d want.
Then again, I echo the sentiment of others that a straight-up trade for one of the starters seems reasonable.
"I've made a huge little mistake." - G.O.B.
If they want anyone in the low minors I'd give him to them.
I wouldn’t want any of those guys.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:30 PM PDT up reply actions
I suppose you're right
I should also say I have a hard time seeing them trading the kid.
"I've made a huge little mistake." - G.O.B.
Id do that for sure.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions
Sign me up.
Much better than Gio…..although I still stand my position of doing ANYTHING to get Rasmus.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
I think Gio is worth more than 2-3 wins.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
I agree with this.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:15 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm thinking of using this as my sigline
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 2:38 PM PDT up reply actions
what I agree with this?
is that like I endorse this statement, signed DFA?
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:39 PM PDT up reply actions
This response amuses me
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 2:46 PM PDT up reply actions
im glad it does, though I don't see why.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:48 PM PDT up reply actions
um wat
Sweeney has no knees and had a flukey defense-aided good WAR year.
Rasmus is a 5 tool player who was named #14 in MLB’s highest trade value list. Rasmus will be throwing up 4-6+ WARs very soon. Sweeney is so broken he might not be in the game by that time…
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
His RoS Zips is a .337 WOBA
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:32 PM PDT up reply actions
Yet he's at .360
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 12:34 PM PDT up reply actions
its a rest of the season projection.
so yes it would be lower for some players. Im not seeing your point.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions
I was under the impression that you think he's more of the .337 wOBA player
than the .360 he’s put up thus far this year
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Young players can stall out too look at Jay Bruce
I think hes more of a .345 wOBA guy and that Sweeney is more of a .330 wOBA guy.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:58 PM PDT up reply actions
I would hardly describe Bruce as "stalled out"
He was 0.8 WAR at 21, 1.6 WAR at 22, and now 3.5 WAR at 23, with an impeccable minor league track record (actually more so than Rasmus).
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
yeah but a ton of that this year is defense.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 1:23 PM PDT up reply actions
This is true according to their ZiPS projections but Bruce has to
have more upside than Sweeney.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Im not saying hes that much of an upgrade
but Im also of the opinion that the A’s have absolutely no pitching depth.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 1:23 PM PDT up reply actions
They don't really have any depth anywhere. The farm
is terrible. It might be that signing an FA pitcher, like Ted Lilly, is more feasible than signing Carl Crawford though. And you won’t find a stronger proponent of signing Carl Crawford than me.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:29 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, ZiPS sees a lot of upside in Bruce. Hasn’t ever really been that excited about him – projections unusually lower than CHONE.
Wow Szymborski replied to my comment.
I need to bookmark this page.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:13 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, I think sweeney won't ever reclaim the value
he has produced in the past.
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
Just curious
Where did this fatalism surrounding Sweeney’s condition come from? Yes, his knees bothered him this year. And I suppose it’s likely that he won’t return to his astronomically good defensive performance of a year ago. But it’s very possible that he could play just a very good RF.
"I've made a huge little mistake." - G.O.B.
OK, but if he's say a +5 in RF, that's a below average defender:
+5 – 7.5 = -2.5
If he’s an average offensive player, he’s an average overall player, and that ain’t gonna get us to the postseason.
OTOH if he sucks as bad as he did this year, he’s totally worthless.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions
I, uh... yes
I agree with that. We need something better than an average overall corner OFer. And I really like the idea of acquiring somebody that would make Sweeney the 4th man and Raj a pinch runner only.
Question— can you clarify your subject line? I was positing that he could still be very good in RF, so what do you mean by “that’s a below average defender”?
"I've made a huge little mistake." - G.O.B.
RF is an easy position to play, so being good at it isn't as impressive
as being good at another position. You have to be really awesome, like Sweeney was in 2009, to be a defensive asset in RF. If he’s just “very good”, like a +5 or +7, that’s still not a defensive asset.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:28 PM PDT up reply actions
Indeed.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:31 PM PDT up reply actions
Sweeney was awesome last year because he was a CF playing RF.
Now he’s definitely not a CF anymore. So where’s his value? He cant hit so he’s pretty worthless as of now.
But hey if comes to ST and hits 8 HRs then by all means stick him in RF on opening day, but I dont see that happening.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
The small sliver of hope for Sweeney, as I see his situation,
is speculating that his knee (which was a problem in 2009, as well) might have started affecting his hitting before it ruined his fielding. If the surgery really fixes the problem, he might be able to use his legs more at the plate and hit for more power.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
That's not a sliver of hope:
That’s an excuse to keep believing he’ll hit for power. Kind of like waiting for Crosby to recognize a slider or for Chavy to be healthy. We must move on!
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Hitting for power is not something that is required to be a valuable player. We need more good players, not more power hitters.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 5:22 AM PDT up reply actions
Sweeney isn't good with the bat regardless of his (lack of) power.
His only skill that makes him a non-fourth outfielder is one we can nebulously measure.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
He is a league average bat and is still young
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 10:20 AM PDT up reply actions
Since when is average good?
Average is average. It must the the grade inflation with you youngins. :-)
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
no average is good
especially in the talent spectrum for MLB baseball players.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 11:43 AM PDT up reply actions
I fail to comprehend this.
Perhaps I’m missing something. Woudn’t a team of exactly average players go 81-81? That’s not good, that’s…average. Or, Oakland.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
Try this out.
The A’s have a .696 OPS as a team. If the A’s offense consisted entirely of Ryan Sweeneys (.725 OPS), we would rank eighth instead of 13th. And don’t we all kind of agree that a middle-of-the-pack offense would be all it would take to put this team in contention?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 7, 2010 12:44 PM PDT up reply actions
Yes, that's still average.
Whether or not it’s done by a team that’s good at pitching is irrelevant.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
there are very few players who are valuable enough to be average
If we had league average offense with our pitching we would be better than 81-81
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 1:46 PM PDT up reply actions
which part?
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 3:19 PM PDT up reply actions
Think of it this way:
For most cases, any kind of talent distribution would resemble a bell curve, where average is, well, average. Baseball player talent isn’t like that. The talent isn’t normally distributed—players are artificially selected for their talent, so the baseball talent distribution resembles the far, far right end of a bell curve.
In that case, average is actually pretty valuable, because by far, most players are below average.
Yeah, but the average Major Leaguer is, by definition, average
I think the disconnect here is between the terms average/good and valuable. jeepers never said average wasn’t valuable, just that it wasn’t good (when compared to the Major League hitter population). He’s not wrong.
www.zekeishungry.com
by thejd44 on Sep 8, 2010 12:36 PM PDT up reply actions
It comes down to median vs. average.
It’s a similar thing to house prices—medians are usually listed instead of averages, because averages get skewed because of the few very very expensive houses.
In baseball, you’ve got a small handful of players who are amazing, and a huge dump truck full of guys who are bad enough to the point of being essentially worthless. The median level of production? Not good. Average, though, is good.
by danmerqury on Sep 8, 2010 12:48 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Also
Even if I get over this notion of average being something other than average, he hasn’t shown any kind of offensive improvement over three full big-league seasons. I am inclined not to care how old he is if he isn’t growing.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
Is hitting .300 really league average?
Or were you referring to OPS (in which case, yes, he’s right around the MLB average and a little below the AL average.)
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 7, 2010 12:41 PM PDT up reply actions
It's not going to happen because he purposely doesn't swing for the fences
Last of the Ninth - Photography
I don't think Daric Barton does either
but he has eight HRs anyway, with a good chance of reaching double digits. Sweeney had one before he died for the season.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 7, 2010 12:46 PM PDT up reply actions
There's a fundamental difference I see, though
Ryan Sweeney’s entire game seems to be predicated on him slapping the ball to left field.
Daric Barton can and does hit the ball wherever it needs to be based on how he’s pitched.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
Time for Dale to be a teacher.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 7, 2010 2:37 PM PDT up reply actions
I despise that inside-out swing of his
It’s really vile. He’s giving up all his natural advantages with that thing.
I mean it is what it is, like Rajai hacking at everything, but I don’t have to like it.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I think that swing is a good example of why hitting is coachable and changeable.
I don’t think anyone instinctively hits that way from cradle to grave. He was taught how to be a slap hitter, and at some point became overreliant on it. Maybe he was at a level of pro ball when it was more important to be able to go opposite field.
But he could be coached to swing that way only when it was necessary, or when he saw that hole in the defense. He could even swing that way 75% of the time. But I think he can re-learn to hit more conventionally when it’s appropriate. He’ll get some power back and become a more complete hitter.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 8, 2010 12:05 AM PDT up reply actions
It's actually a really terrible example of that
because Ryan Sweeney has chopped at the ball for, going off his minor league numbers, at least as long as he has been playing professional baseball.
I suppose it’s possible that he was “taught” it in high school or Little League or T-ball or something, but we don’t know that.
On a macro level, it would probably be possible to reboot his swing completely from scratch, but a. it would take a LONG time, and b. we have absolutely no idea whether the end product would be better or worse. He might fall off a cliff like Travis Buck.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
As to the rebooting the swing part, you're definitely right
And on top of that, it’s too late to really try. Like you said, he’s been doing it this way for years and to just suddenly change it, you’re looking at him needing to do it in the minors first and we’re not going to see that happen.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
nice post
"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball
He can hit
He’s basically league average as a hitter. Or has been, at any rate.
He hasn’t hit for power, but that’s not necessary to be an average hitter.
Let’s face it, having him be even a league-average player would be a hell of an upgrade from what the team has put out there this season.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
And league-average is really all the offense needs.
We have three guys who are both alive and at or above league average OPS (Cust, Barton, Crisp), and Cliffy should probably be in the same category but he’s hampered by an atrocious early month. Larish is OPSing around league average in the smallest of sample sizes, as were Rosales and Sweeney before they died.
But basically, our lineup for the rest of the season is generally going to have a lot of well-below-average bats in it. At least five, sometimes six or seven.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 7, 2010 12:50 PM PDT up reply actions
That's assuming a lot of things...
Namely, Sweeney having 2 healthy knees.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Im fine making that assumption. I like Larish in the OF too so you have Sweeney/Larish/Carter/Hermida/Taylor/Davis options
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:05 PM PDT up reply actions
Larish and Conor Jackson are bosom buddies in the "why does anyone think this guy is any good?" cubbyhole in my book
Most of those options suck and even if they don’t, it’ll take months of suck to sort out the small number of non-suck players. When you’re rebuilding, that’s fine, but the A’s aren’t rebuilding at this point.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
ZOMG CONOR JACKSON HAD A LOW .800s OPS 3 YEARS AGO
nevermind that that’s not very good for a corner outfielder….
Pam liked my old sig better.
Why don't you think Larish stands a chance to be a decent player?
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 8:01 PM PDT up reply actions
He has no track record of ever having been a decent player in the past
He’s a 5th round pick who’s consistently played like a 5th round pick, which is to say, like someone whose career is likely to stall out in AAA. 1B with indifferent defense and MLEs in the low .700s do not rock my world.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Low .700s is roundabout league average.
Since we’re on the league-average discussion elsewhere in the thread and all. As noted by you, by me, and by others, league-average is a 40-point improvement over A’s-average.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 7, 2010 12:55 PM PDT up reply actions
League average varies per position though.
Finding a SS who can OPS .700 and a 1B who can OPS .700 have very different degrees of difficultly.
A's Fan in Sweden
Even so, if everyone on the team OPS'd .725, we'd be a better team.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 7, 2010 2:38 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah
He’s essentially a replacement level 3B or outfielder. The A’s already have that. What they lack are guys who can actually play well.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
by PaulThomas on Sep 7, 2010 6:56 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
The pitching depth right now is pretty thin in the minors
Right now Mazzaro is hanging on to a 5th spot and if you get rid of Gio you’re probably pushing him to the 4th spot unless you replace Gio with someone of relatively equal quality.
Outman is a non-factor until he’s actually able to go out and pitch again.
I’m not sold on Mortensen ever being more than an occasional 5th starter, either.
At this stage losing Gio weakens the staff overall and they don’t have anybody ready to bring up from their organization to replace him.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
What about these guys though?
Bronson Arroyo (34) – $11MM club option with a $2MM buyout
Erik Bedard (32) – $8MM mutual option
Jeremy Bonderman (28)
Dave Bush (31)
Bruce Chen (34)
Kevin Correia (30)
Doug Davis (35) – $6.5MM mutual option with a $1MM buyout
Jorge De La Rosa (30)
Justin Duchscherer (33)
Jeff Francis (29) – $7MM club option
Freddy Garcia (35)
Jon Garland (31) – $6.75MM mutual option with a $600K buyout
Rich Harden (29) – $11MM mutual option with $1MM buyout
Aaron Harang (33) – $12.75MM club option with a $2MM buyout
Hiroki Kuroda (36)
Cliff Lee (32)
Ted Lilly (35)
Rodrigo Lopez (35)
Kevin Millwood (36)
Sergio Mitre (30)
Brian Moehler (39)
Jamie Moyer (48)
Vicente Padilla (33)
Carl Pavano (35)
Brad Penny (33)
Andy Pettitte (39)
Nate Robertson (33)
Jeff Suppan (36)
Hisanori Takahashi (36)
Javier Vazquez (34)
Brandon Webb (32)
Todd Wellemeyer (32)
Jake Westbrook (33)
Dontrelle Willis (29)
Chris Young (32) – $8.5MM club option
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
the best pitcher that is cheaper than Crawford is Kuroda who is 36 and will probably get a 3 year deal
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:16 PM PDT up reply actions
I wouldn't mind signing Kuroda if it was just a 2 year deal
He’s the real deal, no matter what metric you use to evaluate his performance.
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 3:59 PM PDT up reply actions
Kuroda is probably my favorite of the realistic FA pitching crop (aka the non Cliff Lee variety)
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 4:09 PM PDT up reply actions
He's the nost underrated SP in baseball right now, IMO
I mean, I doubt he’ll even get equivalent yearly value in his next contract that he is now (3 years/$35.3M), yet he’s worth it.
He’s a pretty sure bet for around a 3.5 WAR
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 4:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Well considering you would be paying him 12m when hes 39 that contract would scare me
and I love the guy.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 4:38 PM PDT up reply actions
Why does that scare you?
I’d sign him for 3/$36M if Crawford turned out not to be an option.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 5:17 PM PDT up reply actions
39 year old pitchers aren't going to pitch like 36 year olds are
2 years for 22-24M is the most he should be signed for.
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
by cuppingmaster on Sep 5, 2010 9:40 PM PDT up reply actions
OK then I'd take Lilly. I'm basically indifferent between the two.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:44 PM PDT up reply actions
Fair enough
He’s probably cheaper, too
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
by cuppingmaster on Sep 5, 2010 9:49 PM PDT up reply actions
Lilly is 35
and pitchers don’t decline as fast or predictably as hitters, either, so… eh. I’d be okay inking either of them.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Kuroda is a better pitcher, IMO
And will probably cost around the same, if not less.
Also, check out his PitchFX page on Fangraphs.
http://www.fangraphs.com/pitchfx.aspx?playerid=3283&position=P
He’s essentially abandoned his 4 seamer this year in favor of his 2 seamer, which has gotten faster, and added back his splitter.
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 10:19 PM PDT up reply actions
Lilly's pitching style makes him a candidate to have a long career IMO.
A's Fan in Sweden
i think Lilly's gonna be type A
Why don't you make like a tree, and get out of here.
by thelincolndude on Sep 6, 2010 10:47 AM PDT up reply actions
I doubt the Dodgers would offer arbitration if he were
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 6, 2010 12:08 PM PDT up reply actions
ah, good point
Why don't you make like a tree, and get out of here.
by thelincolndude on Sep 6, 2010 12:34 PM PDT up reply actions
Just age. Hell be 39 when youre shelling out 12m for him.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 5:25 AM PDT up reply actions
Correia scares me
if he has an ERA above 5 at Petco, God help him.
Fun Fact: Jonathan Sanchez threw his first no-no on my 13th birthday.
Kuroda, not Correia
Kevin Correia kind of sucks.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
As I said:
“If you get rid of Gio you’re probably pushing (Mazzaro) to the 4th spot unless you replace Gio with someone of relatively equal quality.”
Need I remind you you said the following?
“You dont think we have pitching depth to cover Gio? We are Oakland, all we ever have is pitching depth.”
Not if you have to replace him with someone outside the organization, we don’t.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
I dont get it.
Im saying that replacing Gio with Rasmus is easier than trying to convince Crawford or Werth to come here. I’m just listing options. Anderson-Cahill-Braden-Mazzaro-Outman/Mortensen/Ross/FA is not going to hurt the team as much as running AAAA replacemATTs out in the OF spots every day.
Im just listing options. We can not sign a FA SP and try out Ross/Morty/Outman or we can even go get Brandon Webb. Either way losing Gio isnt going to completely kill us if we have Rasmus batting 3rd and playing CF everyday.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
That's fine
But I wouldn’t dangle Gio in that trade. I think he’s got the stuff to be at least a #2 in this rotation.
The thing to keep in mind here is if Rasmus is adamant about being traded that puts other teams in the position of dealing with power, not the Cardinals. The other teams know Rasmus isn’t happy there and the Cardinals would be looking to move him, so they don’t have the freedom to just say no to anything if they really want him out of there.
I believe Rasmus could be had in that case without a team trading one of its better pieces.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
By the by, here's what you're more likely to see:
La Russa gone at the end of the year, Rasmus remaining in the middle of the Cardinals lineup.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
As noted below, I think it comes down to what Pujols wants
They will take whatever actions are necessary to ensure that he signs a contract extension— keep LaRussa, get rid of LaRussa, keep Rasmus, get rid of Rasmus— he’s the man whose opinion will carry the day.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I doubt he "wants Rasmus traded."
Sounds more like he wants Rasmus to shape up or ship out. I’m sure both options are fine with Big Albert.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Listing a bunch of names is a lot different than listing a bunch of viable names.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
Especially since a good number of them generate "No way in hell" reactions
Last of the Ninth - Photography
most are worse than that.
Erik Bedard (32) – $8MM mutual option
Jeremy Bonderman (28)
Dave Bush (31)
Bruce Chen (34)
Doug Davis (35) – $6.5MM mutual option with a $1MM buyout
Justin Duchscherer (33)
Jeff Francis (29) – $7MM club option
Freddy Garcia (35)
Jon Garland (31) – $6.75MM mutual option with a $600K buyout
Rich Harden (29) – $11MM mutual option with $1MM buyout
Rodrigo Lopez (35)
Sergio Mitre (30)
Brian Moehler (39)
Carl Pavano (35)
Nate Robertson (33)
Jeff Suppan (36)
Hisanori Takahashi (36)
Todd Wellemeyer (32)
Jake Westbrook (33)
Dontrelle Willis (29)
Are if Billy signs them to legit MLB deals I will shave my head its so bad.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:35 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, and the majority of those won't come anywhere near to replacing what Gio ought to give the team next year and beyond
And that, to me, is the key. I don’t want to settle for a revolving door out of the 5th starter spot while bumping Mazzaro up in the rotation at the same time. No matter what Rasmus may or may not do, that weakens the starting rotation as a whole.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
The question is not whether those guys are as good as Gio
The question is whether the gap in performance between Gio and those guys is greater than the gap in performance between Rasmus and the other A’s outfielders.
You have to give up talent to get talent, unless a GM is really losing it. Trading from an area of relative depth to fill an area of relative weakness can improve your team even if the two players are of exactly the same “objective” skill level.
In this case I happen to think Rasmus is actually much the better of the two, so that makes it even more obvious that the A’s would want to do that move. Getting Rasmus for just Gio Gonzalez is the kind of opportunity that would never even be on the table absent this kind of locker-room apoplexy.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Maybe the A's should reacquire Bonderman
He’s pretty terrible, but the Coliseum might mask his deficiencies to some extent. At the very least he might stop running an ERA that’s half a run higher than his FIP is.
Although oddly, while his BABIP is higher than normal, it’s not outrageous or anything. That gap seems to be mostly caused by his hideous career baserunner strand rate (67.4%). That’s so bad (over a large sample) that it makes me wonder whether he tips his pitches from the stretch or something. If so, then the Coliseum won’t do anything for him.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Maybe Curt Young could work his magic on him?
I can’t believe that dude is only 28.
Pam liked my old sig better.
Curt Young?
Wow, then he looks good.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Willie McGee
Now there was a handsome man.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 8:03 PM PDT up reply actions
Holy cow -- he's lopsided!
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
According to BR
Donald Louis Mossi (The Sphinx and Ears)
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 9:32 PM PDT up reply actions
He looks like a cartoon....
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:34 PM PDT up reply actions
Only if you think that Gio and Rasmus are equally likely to be good next year
That’s a really bad bet. I’ll take Rasmus every single time on that gamble, as I would almost any young position player in a situation where they are posting similar WAR numbers to a pitcher.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Rasmus will probably be, at most, one win better.
Which just goes to show how pointless swapping Gio and Rasmus is, if your goal is to improve your overall team.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
Completely disagree
Rasmus could be a 5+ WAR guy as early as next year. Gio is likely to stand pat as a 2-4 guy. Plus replacing Gio via FA is less risky than trying to convince Crawford or Werth to come here. Pitchers like Brandon Webb would love to build value in Oakland rather than Texas.
I also believe in Mazzaro, Outman & Mortensen coming through as a 5th SP more than you I guess. This is Oakland, we got good years out of Eveland, Smith, DiNardo and types like that, we dont need 5 aces when it comes at the price of upgrading the offense.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
I'm not following you here at all
Do you think Gio will continue to improve? If so, why in the world would you be so high on the potential of Rasmus’ WAR going as high as 5+ by next year but think Gio’s won’t change from 2-4?
Not so sure I’d buy your “good years” bit from the pitchers you mentioned, either. They were all mediocre at best.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
So I'm supposed to believe that Rasmus is a 5+ WAR guy going forward when he's put up 2.6 WAR this year.
While, Gio at 3.2 WAR so far this year, is only a 2-4 WAR guy going forward?
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
this this this
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:35 PM PDT up reply actions
It's basically saying at the best, Gio stays the same and is more likely to regress
Not buying it.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
Why? OF are usually more likely to retain their value and improve than pitchers
What’s special about Gio that he’s more likely to improve than another 3 WAR pitcher?
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 2:40 PM PDT up reply actions
what other 3 WAR young pitcher with Gio's stuff are we going to get to replace him?
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:42 PM PDT up reply actions
Why does it have to be a "young" 3 WAR pitcher?
Basically I’m saying that Rasmus and Lilly isn’t a bad Plan B to Crawford and Gio
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 2:45 PM PDT up reply actions
Id much rather have my position players make the boatload of money and my pitchers be team control and cheap.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:47 PM PDT up reply actions
Right. That's why it's not Plan A
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 2:50 PM PDT up reply actions
Why?
A win is a win. Who cares how you come by it?
If the pitchers aren’t cost-effective, buy more position players instead.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I'd rather pay more for position players because I believe
pitchers to be injury prone and therefore I’m less comfortable signing them to long term big dollar contracts.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 8:36 PM PDT up reply actions
Shrug
Either the market accounts for that risk properly or it doesn’t. If it does, you’re getting value for money. If it doesn’t, then buy more position players. You’ll have a somewhat one-sided team value-wise (though not necessarily from a RS/RA standpoint if the players are defensive whizzes), but as the Yankees this year have shown, that’s hardly an insurmountable problem.
The A’s can trade for Rasmus and still have room on the diamond to spend FA money on not one but TWO free agent position players. Surely this is not yet running up against the law of diminishing returns.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I was figuring a Crawford/Rasmus/Crisp OF
with Orlando Hudson at second.
Surely that’s enough funny-money spent to bust your hypothetical budget.
Pretty damn good team, though, even if the rotation is a little suspect.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
That's a heckuva defense if you keep
Kouzmanoff. You’d just need a pitcher who limited BB and let the Coliseum limit HR….like Jon Garland or Carlos Silva.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:04 PM PDT up reply actions
It's basically the 2009 Mariners with a better offense
Sign Jarrod Washburn!
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I hear he's waiting for Billy's call
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:14 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm all for trading for Rasmus and signing
Crawford and Kuroda or Lilly or whoever.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:02 PM PDT up reply actions
Think LA keeps them both?
Kuroda’s name keeps floating around here lately. I think he’d work well.
Pam liked my old sig better.
Basically what Waddell said.
Your supposing that we know that pitcher x and player y are both worth 1 WAR and therefore it doesn’t matter who makes more if youre just switching salaries you still have 2 WAR. The thing is that when you sign contracts, you know that position player y and pitcher x are both projected at 3 WAR not that they will be 3 WAR and that projection is far more certain for a hitter. Also its easier to trade a hitter after a down year for value than it is to trade a hurt pitcher.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 5:53 AM PDT up reply actions
For me I'd agree with DFA and add that I'd prefer a young 3 WAR pitcher we'd have for a while over an older one...
…you’re just going to have to replace again in another year or two. You can do it, but my preference would be having more stability than that.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
Especially 23-year-old outfielders
once rated the #5 overall prospect (or whatever it was— definitely top 10).
Gio is not likely to improve because no pitcher is particularly likely to improve (or more accurately perhaps, they’re equally likely to decline as improve).
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
WTF does Jeremy Hermida have to do with anything?
He was once good. Now he isn’t. There are several years of horrible, horrible baseball between him and his high ranking. You might as well compare Rasmus to Brandon Wood.
Colby Rasmus is good right now. He has put up 2.6 WAR in like 60% of a season’s worth of plate appearances.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
and now he's throwing a temper tantrum, asked for a trade, and has the best player in baseball saying he should get dealt.
Pam liked my old sig better.
Yes
That’s why an offer like “Gio Gonzalez straight up,” which normally would draw a response on the other end of the phone of either hysterical laughter, obscenity, or a dial tone depending on John Mozeliak’s mood at the time, could conceivably actually be listened to now.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
It damn well better.
Gio’s gonna be a 3.5 WAR guy in his first full season starting, and he’s only a year older than Rasmus.
Pam liked my old sig better.
I wouldn't say no pitcher is particularly likely to improve (or not)
I think as far as pitching goes, you see improvement all the time in how much better a pitcher gets at hitting his spots, overall command of each pitch and the experience that comes from facing more and better hitters as you progress. Or at the least, those who don’t figure that stuff out don’t last very long.
If hitters can get better at what they do by repetition, if fielders can improve their defense by putting in the extra work (Barton as one example, and most people who worked with Ron Washington here), pitchers can get better as well by doing it and learning more about why they do this here or that there.
Or maybe you’re talking about something different if you’re coming at it from the angle of who’s more likely to improve or not? I could see where you’re coming from if that’s the case, but I’d say hitters have to work on their own things the same as anyone else or they’re going to fail as well.
Maybe I’m misunderstanding.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
I think he's weighing that kind of improvement
with general risk of injury, etc. On balance, pitchers tend to get worse.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Yeah, mostly
Pitchers probably do improve over time if you eliminate the catastrophic injuries from the sample size.
Gio Gonzalez does strike me, though, as someone who (while he could improve into an ace, for sure) could implode even without a catastrophic injury. Rich Hill was awesome for a couple of seasons too, remember.
There’s a tendency with that kind of boom/bust player to just keep him and hope for the best, but I don’t think that tendency is a rational one. It’s just a psychological desire to avoid “the one that got away.”
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
What makes you say that?
Gio Gonzalez does strike me, though, as someone who (while he could improve into an ace, for sure) could implode even without a catastrophic injury.
Pam liked my old sig better.
Well, really, it's the uncanny resemblance that his pitching bears to Rich Hill's
more than anything…
I dunno, it seems like those high-walk, high-strikeout lefty types are most at risk for Steve Blass Disease. Rick Ankiel was kind of in that mold too. Maybe I’m overgeneralizing from a small sample, though.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
He's walking over 1 batter less per 9 this year than last.
It’s not like he’s Kazmir and has no idea where the ball is going.
Pam liked my old sig better.
Nitpick:
Kazmir’s problem hasn’t really been the walks (not that his control’s improved), but rather the fact that he’s lost something like 3 MPH of velocity on his pitches and has stopped striking people out. He posted four seasons striking out more than 9.8 batters per nine innings––this year he’s at 5.62.
This is very accurate, and basically what I said last year.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 8:46 PM PDT up reply actions
Speaking of psychological, that's Gio's biggest obstacle
It’s always been about trusting his stuff, which is already exceptional. If he fully harnesses the mental side of the game he can be among the elite pitchers around. If he doesn’t, he’ll always have good/bad stretches where we talk about how “He’s got all the potential, but…”
Last of the Ninth - Photography
I do think Braden has helped him a lot with this
But I also agree with PT that he’s a “gaaah!!!” candidate just for being so volatile and so affected by how he’s feeling.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Yeah, and I think it's both self-fulfilling and self-defeating
As in, the better you do the more confidence you’ll have and vice-versa. If he ever gets to the point where he’s on an even keel no matter what’s going on, watch out.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
Yeah, I used to think he'd be a #3
Now I think maybe he’ll more like a “#1 or #5 but not in between.”
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Hes far more likely to have a major injury and not produce than Rasmus.
but I love Gio’s upside.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:41 PM PDT up reply actions
This is definitely the point when you trade a pitcher for a position player
It’s possible for a position player to suffer a career-ruining injury out of nowhere (e.g., Jason Kendall’s thumb, Dickie Thon getting beaned, possibly Carlos Santana’s injury) but it’s way more likely for a pitcher to ruin his arm and go from excellent to worthless.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Also position players tend to improve along an age curve more than pitchers
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 2:47 PM PDT up reply actions
It's "pointless" to add a win at no cost?
Huh?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Yes, because the goal isn't to add one win, it's to add 8-9 wins to surpass to Texas.
If you swap Gio and Rasmus and you add someone like Crawford, you’re still necessitating one more move because the net result of those two moves is something like +6 WAR. That one more move is going to have to cost additional money and/or talent.
(Btw, I’m starting to see that adding one of Crawford/Werth is pretty much necessary for the A’s going forward)
Now if you keep Gio (3 WAR), trade prospects for Rasmus (4 WAR), and then add someone like Crawford (5 WAR), you’re adding something like 9 WAR. In the first scenario, you’re giving up more (Gio, along with minor league talent and/or money) to achieve less than what you’re giving up here: money + minor league talent. This is why I’m willing to trade any combo of 4 prospects for Rasmus. I want to maximize and keep my big league WAR at all costs even if it hurts my minor league system, because I believe that 2011 is a perfect “go for broke” year.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
The problem is that I don't believe the Cardinals would ever accept a trade of just A's minor leaguers
unless Rasmus really makes his name mud there.
Even then, there are 15 or 20 teams that can beat what the A’s are offering.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
The A's have an advantage over most of those 15-20 teams in that they can offer a top shelf SS prospect whereas most of those teams can't.
You don’t think the Cardinals will be intrigued by a package of Weeks, Green, Cardenas, Taylor/Brown? That’s a crapload of up the middle help, something they desperately need.
I’m well aware that Green has issues but I think the only teams that could potentially beat that offer with a top SS prospect of their own are the Dodgers (Dee Gordon) and Red Sox (Jose Iglesias). Gordon and Iglesias also have major problems of their own.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Sep 6, 2010 10:38 PM PDT up reply actions
I don't think, assuming they do their due diligence, that they will consider Green a shortstop
And there are plenty of other good shortstop prospects in the minors. Chris Nelson of Colorado leaps immediately to mind, and he’s both more MLB ready and a better actual shortstop than Green. Seattle could potentially deploy Nick Franklin. Tampa could trade Reid Brignac, Sean Rodriguez or even Tim Beckham.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Why would Colorado want to trade Nelson + other minor league talent
for an outfielder when their outfield is their biggest strength? And why would St. Louis want a package centered around a 25 year old shortstop with a history of injury issues and inconsistency and who wasn’t even considered one of Colorado’s top 20 prospects before this year?
Franklin is a better shortstop prospect than Green, I’ll give you that. But the Mariners are in no position to give up their minor league talent right now especially if Rasmus is going to cost Franklin, Pineda +
I’ll grant you that Tampa is a logical suitor for Rasmus, especially if St. Louis is willing to receive a headcase in turn (Upton). Still, that’s only three suitors besides us for Rasmus. Not too bad considering that acquiring Rasmus is a shot in the dark proposition anyways.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Sep 7, 2010 12:29 AM PDT up reply actions
Those were literally just off the top of my head
It’s easily possible that there are more SS prospects out there.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Not really.
Shortstop is a ridiculously bare position right now, in both the minors and majors.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Sep 7, 2010 11:49 AM PDT up reply actions
Thats obviously the ideal situation
Trade nothing but prospects for Rasmus & sign Crawford, & keep all of our big leaguers.
Odds that happens though? Not good. We need to offer players that will make STL call us back. I dont see Taylor, Weeks & Cardenas doing that. But maybe Im wrong, Haren & Escobar were traded for pretty much nothing, maybe Rasmus really will just require prospects. The rest of baseball is so into over-rating their prospects right now it might be the time to go the other way and let them raid our cupboard, because we have such a young core of excellent players up now we could go from .500 to contenders in only 1-2 moves, really. Anything else would be icing. Do we need to have a strong farm? Yeah always, but now is probably the best time to be bare. Why do we need 23 year old minor leaguers when we have 23 year old major leaguers? Injuries? But in an ideal world these young guys are going to hold it down for 3-5 years and thats how you should play when we are in this phase of rebuilding. Rebuild, consolidate and re-asses what we have, win.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
What's so great about Rasmus that we should give up one of our top pitchers or just about anyone?
Am I missing the boat, or is this you over-exaggerating?
Last of the Ninth - Photography
This
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions
He hits HR’s, steals bases, plays UNREAL defense and is going to be an all-star on the regular.
I mean, fangraphs has him at the 14th best trade value, but why would you listen to them?
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
He's had a decent season so far but it sounds like you're going all in on his potential
That’s fine, but based on what he’s done this year you’re looking at about 25 homers and 14 stolen bases over a full season. Solid, especially at 23 years old, but not someone I’d say “I’ll trade ANYONE we have for him!”
Last of the Ninth - Photography
Its funny, because everything we say about Barton's bright future because of his age
goes triple for Rasmus.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Hey, I'd like to have someone with that potential but part of the problem is the A's are so thin offensively that...
…pretty much anyone else looks awesome.
I wouldn’t give anything to get Colby Rasmus, let’s put it that way. If you want him, make a smart trade. Don’t just say “Take your pick, guys!”
Last of the Ninth - Photography
But....Rasmus is already awesome.
He plays defense in CF better than anyone we have and hits HRs and steals bases. He is a massive upgrade to our pissweak OF corps.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Being a big upgrade over what the A's have in the OF right now is still not a reason to say "I'd trade anyone we have for him!"
You must have an odd definition of awesome, too. I see a guy who’s having a solid year overall and yes, the signs are there that he ought to continue getting better, but we’re not talking about a guy that’s hitting bombs all over the place and running wild. He’s got 19 homers and 10 steals, and his SB% is only 67%.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
The reason to trade anyone we have for him is that no one we have is all that great
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:42 PM PDT up reply actions
Right. I can't think of a single 5 WAR player in the organization
top to bottom. I guess there’s Ynoa, but he’s now even less likely than before he started pitching.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 2:41 PM PDT up reply actions
Daric Barton says hello
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 4:03 PM PDT up reply actions
Hi Daric.
Are you a 5 WAR player now? CHONE and ZiPS both have you around a 3-3.5 WAR player. I realize you have 4.2 WAR now, but I’m going to need to see another year of improvement before I call you a 5 WAR player after your performance in 2008 and 2009.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 5:13 PM PDT up reply actions
No. I'm saying he's more of one than Barton or
anyone else on the A’s
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 8:34 PM PDT up reply actions
That is factually untrue
Barton has a 4+ WAR season under his belt already. Rasmus does not.
Pam liked my old sig better.
He might have that, but that doesn't make
it factually untrue. I’m looking to project what a player might do. The fact that Jose Bautista has had a 5.8 WAR season doesn’t make him more likely to have a 5 WAR season than Buster Posey, who’s never had one.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 8:41 PM PDT up reply actions
Actually, it does. Because he's had one.
I find it strange that you discount Barton because of his rookie year (but not Rasmus, though his WAR was defensively and position adjustment fueled), and then also discount him because he was hurt last year and the team idiotically put him in the minors because they decided Jason fucking Giambi might be good again off steroids and in his late 30s.
Barton has steadily gotten better. .301 wOBA, .343, .365 this year, and his defense has also. Rasmus had a .311 wOBA last year and it’s skyrocketed this year, but he’s -3.9 so far defensively. That’s a major 1.4 win swing from his +10 last year. He’s probably better than that, but I’m not understanding why you want to project Rasmus as a 5 WAR guy but not Barton.
Pam liked my old sig better.
Because for a 1B to be a 5 WAR guy
he has to hit like a HOF for a year. I don’t see Barton as that type of hitter on a consistent basis.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 8:55 PM PDT up reply actions
Plus he can do the splits......
which is cool!
"By the end of the year, I'll have Dallas throwing right-handed'' -Ben Sheets
Regression on Rasmus's defense
would suggest that he is in fact more like a 0<x<+5 defender in center field. Assuming he’s boosted by 5 runs from defense and position and plays more or less a full season, he has to be around 22 RAA with the bat to be a 5 WAR player. He’s actually on pace to do that right now.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I think they are both 5+ WAR guys in 2012
That is why we should trade for Rasmus. Having multiple 5+ WAR guys mean your team is winning. I like winning.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
So you lament the fact that there isn't a single 5 WAR player in the organization
Yet Daric Barton will either reach it or come close this year, but because projection systems don’t think he’s that good he’s not one?
No, projection systems only do so much when a guy, you know, actually does something that’s pretty friggin impressive.
Daric Barton is a 5 WAR player, plain and simple.
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 8:08 PM PDT up reply actions
I didn't particularly lament it. I just said that there isn't one
and therefore there’s nobody particularly great in the organization. I do think Rasmus is a better bet to get there and stay there than Barton is, and the projection systems agree. Obviously you have a right to disagree.
FWIW CHONE and ZiPS are well aware of what Barton’s done this year — at least thru July. They’re also aware of what he did in 2008 and 2009.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 8:33 PM PDT up reply actions
Barton had a .343 wOBA in 54 games in 2009. What's the issue there?
2008 was his rookie year and he had a .301 wOBA.
Rasmus’ wOBA last year (his rookie year) was .311
Pam liked my old sig better.
You seem to be using Fangraphs so I'll work with
ZiPS here. Barton projects as a .357 wOBA hitter, which is about 20 BRAA, which is about 2.8 WAR as a 1B before defense and non-SB baserunning. For him to be a 5 WAR player he’d have to add 22 RAA in those two. That’s mighty hard to do.
Let’s say he’ll maintain a +7 defense and average baserunning. The latter is a stretch since he’s a slower than average runner. If he does, he’ll have to improve his BRAA by 15 runs. He could do that, but he’ll probably have to add power, because his OBP is already very high. Defense and baserunning tend to decline as a player ages so he’ll have that going against him as well. It’s not impossible, just really hard.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 8:50 PM PDT up reply actions
At what point do you figure the defense and baserunning begins to decline for the average player?
Because Barton’s almost exactly a full year older than Rasmus, so I don’t think that’s too great a concern for either of them right now.
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Apparently it starts for defense around
24-26.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 8:55 PM PDT up reply actions
Christ, that's at or before they get into the bigs, most of 'em
"I've made a huge little mistake." - G.O.B.
Then they'll both be going through it around the same time
Though Rasmus will still be faster.
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He's 25, not 30.
I think it’s a bit premature to talk about him declining, even defensively.
Pam liked my old sig better.
He could hit for a higher average
either by upping his BABIP (unlikely) or cutting his strikeouts (more likely).
That would add both SLG and OBP, without increasing his isolated power.
I agree that reaching 42 BRAA with an ISO of .133 is probably impossible. Ichiro topped out at about 35 RAA in 2004 (when he set the hits record) and could have reached something like 46 with a .133 ISO. So basically we’re talking about one of the all-time great singles-hitting seasons of all time to reach 42 RAA without increasing his power.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
In the same vein, I'd need to see a lot more out of Rasmus before I'd consider him a lock for a 5+ WAR
He may be on the road to it, but until he does it…
And even then, he’d need to continue to prove he can do it – just like Barton’s going to need to prove next year.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
Nobody said he's a lock for 5+ WAR. I do think
he’s a better bet to get there than anyone currently in the A’s organization.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 8:34 PM PDT up reply actions
I think PL78 was getting at that, though
Saying Rasmus could be a 5+ WAR guy as early as next year says, to me, he figures if he’s got a good shot at doing it by 24 he’s all but guaranteed to do it soon after that if not next year.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
I wouldn't go that far. He's not Buster Posey
or Matt Wieters or in their class. He’s a level below, but still a better bet than Barton.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 8:53 PM PDT up reply actions
If he's not even in the Posey/Wieters class
then it makes even less sense to take the anyone-they-want approach. The A’s have such a strength in pitching because it’s almost top-to-bottom rock-solid. Vinny dropped off, but even so, our fifth starter spot is a lot better than most. I’m fine with borrowing from Peter to pay Paul as a concept, but if Peter is fundamentally integral to our success in a pitchers’ park, I think that’s not the way to go. Ship out our entire infield minus Barton plus prospects and Rosales if you want, but not our pitching.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 6, 2010 7:54 PM PDT up reply actions
But right now, this isn't true
The A’s have such a strength in pitching because it’s almost top-to-bottom rock-solid
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 7, 2010 2:26 AM PDT up reply actions
I guess
I mean, the guy was universally regarded as a genuinely elite prospect. And now he’s playing like one. How much more can— or should— a guy have to do to be treated as a future star?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Not really
Barton topped out at #28 on the BA list. Rasmus? Try #3.
- is not elite. It’s B+ territory in Sickels-land. #3 is a straight A.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
;jweros;dfj
Such a stupid autoformat glitch. People do like to start sentences with numbers, oh benevolent SBN head honchos.
For 1. read “#28”.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
:)
http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/prospects/rankings/top-100-prospects/2009/267698.html
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 10:20 PM PDT up reply actions
I recognize that name at #4...
http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/features/060223top100c.html
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 10:47 PM PDT up reply actions
#17
: /
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Yeah, that one too
I remember being at a Spring Training game in 2006 where he homered twice against the A’s in Phoenix.
That was the same game Swisher had to contend with a hornet’s nest being disturbed.
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Huston we have a problem
“His last outing in instructional league, when he was throwing 96 mph at the knees with a hard curve for strikes and mixing in a changeup, you could see the light bulb going off.”
—Brewers roving pitching instructor Jim Skaalen
No wonder he can’t teach our batters to hit
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 8:56 PM PDT up reply actions
I know right?
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 10:26 PM PDT up reply actions
Ah, okay, looks like a typo or something.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Skaalen
Looks like he’s never been a pitching coach, but he’s been a hitting coach all over the place.
I don't know.
Why do they have a hitting coach talking about a pitching prospect?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 8, 2010 12:09 AM PDT up reply actions
That's got to be their most embarrassing list in recent memory
Their #1, #3, and #4 players have played a combined total of about 6 seasons’ worth of games and produced a combined total of 1.6 WAR.
That’s stunningly bad.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Shrug
He’s still quite terrible. UZR is the defensive metric that LIKES him and he still comes out at “bench player/starter on a bad team” skill level.
You don’t even want to know how bad BB-Ref thinks his career has been.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I was gonna say, he's been terribly bad defensively
And, as I expected, he’s fallen apart in August and September after an insane July…
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 6, 2010 2:19 AM PDT up reply actions
A healthy Brett Anderson will approach that level
I would hesitate to trade him for Rasmus, but he’s the only one I would.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Barton.
4.2 WAR so far in his age 24 season. I could see him topping 5 WAR at his peak.
Anderson as well, I agree.
Pam liked my old sig better.
Sure at his peak. But when I said 5 WAR I meant
someone who projects as 5 WAR, not someone who projects at 4 WAR and could have a great year.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 8:38 PM PDT up reply actions
He'd have to hit at a +60 BRAA to do that
That’s Miguel Cabrera territory
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 8:58 PM PDT up reply actions
Where are you pulling that from?
Youkilis was a 5.9 WAR player last year and was a 34 BRAA hitter (statcorner).
I must be looking at significanly different numbers than you are.
Pam liked my old sig better.
He played a bunch of 3B. His positional
adjustment was -5 rather than -12. Also I screwed up by saying BRAA rather than BRAR.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:08 PM PDT up reply actions
So true. He wouldn't have to be Miguel
Cabrera, but rather Kevin Youkilis. It’s possible, but he has to add power.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:10 PM PDT up reply actions
That's Coliseum power. It's Carter
power.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:16 PM PDT up reply actions
There was a long foul in there.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:21 PM PDT up reply actions
It's not as bad as the numbers would indicate
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:22 PM PDT up reply actions
In fact he was pretty impressive
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:27 PM PDT up reply actions
He was indeed awesome.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:30 PM PDT up reply actions
Believing that 1 year of good UZR last year followed by a not good year outweighs someone like Crip's career of good defensive data is absurd.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 1:53 PM PDT up reply actions
Nine monhs ago
Fangraphs also thought Mariners were the sixth most awesome franchise going forward. Dave Cameron is not an oracle.
"Rollins helps them with the small ball when he's not in the lineup." - Joe Morgan
Dave Cameron is actually one of the lesser writers for that operation too, IMO
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 1:25 PM PDT up reply actions
I remember at the start of Spring Training when everyone thought the Mariners were going to be such hot stuff.
I wondered what Kool Aid people were drinking. I didn’t see it, and it’s nice to have been so completely correct about something.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 6, 2010 7:59 PM PDT up reply actions
What's so great about our pitchers that we shouldn't trade them for All-Star caliber OFs?
I mean a real all-star, not a token one.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:12 PM PDT up reply actions
Our entire team's winning phillosophy is based off of good pitching
I don’t see why trading our best healthy pitcher is a good idea.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 1:25 PM PDT up reply actions
Two reasons:
1) Outfielders are a surer bet to retain their value going forward than pitchers
2) Signing a FA starter might be cheaper than signing an FA OF this offseason.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:32 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
WC sniped me
Both points are exactly perfect.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Generally I agree about pitching vs position but I think Gio has more upside than Colby
Also I think the FA starter market might be cheaper in absolute $ but I think will be worse in terms of WA(internal)R over the life of the deal.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 1:58 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm not proposing ignoring Crawford for Ted Lilly. I'm proposing Ted Lilly
in case you don’t get Crawford.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 2:42 PM PDT up reply actions
I think people overvalue Mazzaro as a trade chip.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:44 PM PDT up reply actions
I see his value as a trade chip about the same as Octavio Dotel
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 2:49 PM PDT up reply actions
what are your thoughts on Lambo and McDonnald?
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:51 PM PDT up reply actions
B-/C+ prospects
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 5:13 PM PDT up reply actions
Eh?
James McDonald is way better than a B-/C+ prospect. I’d trade Mazzaro for him straight up at least nine days out of the week.
The Dodgers were absolutely taken for a ride in that deal.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
What's his value in your mind, then?
Honestly curious. The WHIP and SO/BB rate to this point at the major league level don’t strike (pun) me as particularly impressive.
"I've made a huge little mistake." - G.O.B.
WHIP is a useless statistic, first off
Just for future reference.
The guy has an FIP of 3.81 in the majors and has mostly exceeded that in the minors. He has above-average velocity on his fastball and two rock-solid offspeed pitches. He works up in the zone so I’m a little worried about HR tendencies, but a. this is the Coliseum we’re talking about, and b. he’s done a good job limiting that so far in his career.
I’m not worried about the control hiccup in 2009 because it looks like an aberration and because he spent a good part of that season injured IIRC. Generally his command has been good. He’s getting absolutely slaughtered on BABIP this season, while actually pitching quite well.
If he was still eligible for prospect status I’d probably put him at a B+.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
statcorner has him at a 2.87 tRA. Wow.
tRAr has him at 4.84 which is consistent with a 4.50 ERA ZiPS projection. CHONE has him at 3.75 as a reliever, which is pretty consistent with the above or maybe a bit worse. He’s certainly doing well with Pittsburgh though.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:40 PM PDT up reply actions
Is WHIP truly useless, or just less than ideal?
I can see how the “hits” part is at least partly/perhaps almost wholly based on the performance of others. Are you suggesting it’s better to remove the hits part of the equation and just look at the various rates (K/9, BB/9/ HR/9)?
"I've made a huge little mistake." - G.O.B.
I would say yes
Especially in a guy like Cahill’s case, where his BABIP is ungodly low.
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 10:21 PM PDT up reply actions
WHIP predicts ERA worse than ERA does
Why not just look at ERA?
It has neither retrospective NOR prospective use. There are strictly better stats for each function. It’s truly useless.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
That's interesting. What makes you like him that much?
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 8:30 PM PDT up reply actions
That's why he's valuable as a trade chip.
People are going to overvalue him. He gets some of the shine off of the rest of the rotation, his stats are bolstered by the Coliseum and his defense, and he’s young. In trade, he’ll fetch more than his value.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 6, 2010 8:11 PM PDT up reply actions
by people I mean ANers, not GMs
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 6:06 AM PDT up reply actions
It would be really nice if the A's were able to do it without giving up Major League talent.
Though that seems like a long shot with the Cardinals, who are pretty much always within earshot of a division title.
Odd time of year to ask
seeing as how it can’t happen right now.
Let’s wait and see what transpires in the next two months.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
He asked months ago.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 6, 2010 8:11 PM PDT up reply actions
Late July, apparently
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 7, 2010 2:26 AM PDT up reply actions
Albert Pujols's new quote
“We have to find a way to get him out of here”
WOW
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
remember when pujols didn't say anything and he was likable?
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
you mean like before he hung out with Glenn Beck?
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:07 PM PDT up reply actions
Gross
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 12:35 PM PDT up reply actions
No, I don't think he was there
Though maybe his offense was. No one’s seen that all season.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
heh
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 12:44 PM PDT up reply actions
I think it's a not-his-first-language thing
Otherwise it would be about the most hostile thing I’ve ever heard a baseball player say about a teammate.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Pujols went to HS here, its not like Ichiro said it right after coming to the US
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:08 PM PDT up reply actions
This is an Occam's razor thing
Which is more likely: that he deliberately decided, what the hell, I’ll totally destroy our team chemistry and make one of our outfielders hate me so that… what, he might be traded in the offseason?
Or that he said something that came out wrong in a language that isn’t his first?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
perhaps
I mean look at what people said about AJ Pyzinsky (sp)
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions
I think this is TLR at his most evil.
Like, the only reason why Rasmus is complaining is because he isnt playing everyday and TLR hits him at irregular places in the order. His OPS+ is 124, that means he’s a heart/top of the order guy, not a 7th guy. When Randy Winn starts playing over you on a semi-regular basis, you can see why he’d be mad. It’s the typical TLR overmanagement that Rasmus is frustrated with.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Where are you getting that Rasmus has been a 7th guy in TLR's lineups?
This season, of his 418 PAs 26 of them have come from the 7th spot in the order. 203 have come in the 5th spot, another 70 #2 and 68 more #6.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
well then i have misread it.
my bad.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Funny thing, though
And SSS of course, but Rasmus has been at his best this year batting 7th. Heh.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
So basically Facts 3, PL78 0
and youre mad at me for pointing out that you were misrepresenting facts. LOLz lets recap
1) Facts: Rasmus is late gets chewed out and threatened with a demotion so he asks for a trade vs. PL78: Tony La Russa is a crazy asshole and Rasmus showed up late cuz he wanted a trade.
Conclusion: I don’t know about you but my employer doesn’t let me show up late. Sounds like Rasmus is being a “whinny bitch”. Also im not sure why showing up late because you want to be traded makes it any better.
2 PL78: TLR hits Rasmus 7th, proving hes a crazy asshole and Rasmus is right to want out vs. Facts: Rasmus hits #5 in the order most of the time.
Conclusion: If youre a second year player and are complaining because a HoF manager is hitting you 7th for 26 PAs youre a “whinny bitch”.
3 PL78: We have enough pitching depth to trade Gio for Rasmus vs. Fact/PL78: Wed have to go out and sign a pitcher to replace the pitching production lost if we trade Gio.
Conclusion: well you contradict yourself and basically the last part is the truth.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:32 PM PDT up reply actions
calm down dude
way to waste all that writing on someone who doesnt respect a word youve ever said.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Im not writing it for you. Youre a charlatan. Im writing it for people that might read your garbage and not know that its crap.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 3:51 PM PDT up reply actions
Im sure most people would rather read my crap than your condesending, hateful, know-it-all garbage.
get off your high horse, you arent better than anyone. you put words in my mouth and belittle other posters at any opportunity over the most minor, pissy little things.
I wish you didnt post here. get a life.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
by PL78 on Sep 5, 2010 7:16 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
If I had to choose I'd rather read him over you
He usually makes a lot more sense.
But this is past the point of being useful.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
Piling on necessary?
How about we all forget our troubles with a big bowl of strawberry ice cream? Or just stop bickering, anyway.
"I've made a huge little mistake." - G.O.B.
no, it never is.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Why is it
that I have this sneaking suspicion that the reason you “wish he didn’t post here” is that he makes you look bad by blowing your credibility to hell and gone?
In the interests of full disclosure, I flagged this post. If you’re wondering why I didn’t flag his, it’s because attacking credibility is different from other forms of “personal” attacks. If you lack credibility then what you say is less likely to be true (which is not true of, say, someone lacking a nice personality).
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
That post
really shows some true colors. PL78 starts some good debates but too much time is devoted to making him support his statements or back up exaggerations. When cornered the result is hostility.
Was dfa's essay about my misreadings in this thread necessary?
Absolutely not, mostly because I owned up to all of them before he posted this. When people kick you after you admit you make a mistake, then thats when I might get a little mad.
FWIW I took a chill pill and walked away from it. Again, this entire aside was totally unnecessary and had nothing to do with the original topic: explain how it has to do with who we should trade Colby Rasmus for? It doesnt. Its a personal attack plain and simple.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Why does anyone have to be "credible"?
This isnt CNN or even gawker. Its just a bunch of fans talking about their fave team. Some fans are more into putting lots of time and effort into research, others like to blow off steam and make off-the-cuff comments. All are valid as long as they arent making direct attacks against another poster. Who cares if I dont research every single thing? And why just target me? Did anyone flag the “whiney bitch” comment? No? Why not? There’s nothing “credible” about it at all.
I will continue to post my personal opinions on this site no matter what. Sure they might not all be 100% watertight and take hours of my life to study and write an essay over, but its just fun to talk about, okay? If Im wrong, Im wrong, I have no issue being wrong. My problem with dfa’s post is that I already admitted I was wrong and he proceeded to pile on anyway. I think THAT is showing true colors.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
by PL78 on Sep 6, 2010 8:54 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Why would I flag a comment about Colby Rasmus being a whiney bitch?
If we flagged every comment that insulted a player, there’d be no posters left here by next Tuesday.
As for the rest, it is helpful to other posters to be made aware of the fact that you routinely misread, slant, or simply ignore inconvenient truths. When you “admit you’re wrong” about virtually everything you’ve said on a thread, it’s hardly out of place to comment on that. Displaying this level of fast-and-loose behavior with facts calls any future statements you make into serious question.
You want to be free to spout bullshit without suffering any of the consequences that normally happen to people when they spout bullshit. Well, sorry. Not going to happen.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
The thing is...
I hardly am even “spouting bullshit” (I thought we were cutting down on swearing on here?)
Here is what happened:
1. I misread the mlbtr piece about how Rasmus asked about the trade, as no where in the mlbtr article did it bring up how he was late due to bad weather.
2. I state that as being true.
3. dfa posts the being late because of the weather story and calls me out for being wrong
(btw NONE of this has anything to do with anything. Its 100% unimportant, but any chance dfa has to belittle someone for being slightly off about something, he will take it. The topic is what players should we offer STL, not why Rasmus asked for the trade. Its OT because for no reason at all, dfa is apparently against getting Rasmus)
4. Whats funny is then he posts this long rant where he even proves me right! Look:
1) Facts: Rasmus is late gets chewed out and threatened with a demotion so he asks for a trade vs. PL78: Tony La Russa is a crazy asshole and Rasmus showed up late cuz he wanted a trade
He was late due to bad weather and TLR chews him out because he is a crazy asshole. THAT is the truth. Its a mix of both.
Then there’s this:
3 PL78: We have enough pitching depth to trade Gio for Rasmus vs. Fact/PL78: Wed have to go out and sign a pitcher to replace the pitching production lost if we trade Gio.
We do have the depth, but we can also go out and get a FA, just like we did with Sheets this year. Tyson Ross, Josh Outman & Clayton Mortensen arent an upgrade over Gio, but a healthy BA is. In any case, if you use the Dan Haren & Yunel Escobar are barometers of the trade market, we wouldnt even have to give up Gio anyway. The fact that dfa thinks that this is something to talk crap on me about just makes him look bad. Im not actually full of shit. The only mistake I made was quickly looking at bball-ref and thinking Rasmus hit 7th all the time when it was 5th.
The only thing I was off about was the batting order thing. Im not just ripping facts out of thin air. The mlbtr article never once mentioned the being late due to bad weather thing. Not my fault.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
It's not off-topic at all
If Rasmus is routinely late for team events because he’s off griping about something, that’s a reason that suggests that he is not as good a player as he might otherwise seem to be.
Maybe not a great reason (I happen to think it’s outweighed by his obvious talent) but it’s clearly relevant.
If anything, the story as it came out is more supportive of Rasmus’s behavior (and especially so if we believe that he wasn’t the one who leaked the situation to the press). But it’s less supportive of the “TLR goes off on random people for no reason” theory which you seem intent on advancing.
I don’t know why you keep talking about “fault.” No one gives a crap about whether it’s “your fault” that you screwed up facts. When it comes to facts, carelessness is very nearly as bad as outright lying.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
wut
“keep talking” about? I mentioned it once. I read mlbtr and they didnt state the being late to the team meeting because of the weather thing. Why would I research something thats already been summed up?
I guess I shouldnt really take mlbTRs shoddy writing at its word.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Correct
That old saw about “assuming” exists for a reason.
And it’s especially important when dealing with rumor-mill sites like MLBTR and Rotoworld.
If you want people to take you more seriously (and who wouldn’t?) then, frankly, you need to do a better job at fact-checking things before you start relying on them to draw inferences.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
You mean the saw that
it makes an ass out of you and ming? That’s why I never date the Chinese.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
not funny and not cool, Nico youre better than this.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 6:10 AM PDT up reply actions
Huh?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 7, 2010 12:59 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yah he was 100% right tho
"The A's have to be setting some record this year for simultaneously maximizing team quality and player anonymity. I guess that’s sort of their thing though." - Luke in MN
by hero66 on Sep 6, 2010 5:29 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Pujols isn't being misconstrued here
"If he doesn’t want to be here next year, we need to figure out a way to get him out of here and find somebody that wants to be here and play," Pujols told Yahoo! Sports before Sunday’s game against the Reds. "That’s a reality.
"That’ll show you right there a young player that doesn’t respect what he’s got," he added. "He needs to find out the talent and ability that he has and pretty much keep his mouth shut and play the game. Let the organization make those decisions, not himself."
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
pujols is just trying to restore honor to the cardinals clubhouse
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones."
-BB 07/27/05
by xbhaskarx on Sep 5, 2010 12:36 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Looks like Pujols needs to STFU
like Donny.
"I thought it was going in," Warriors center Chris Hunter said. "It looked like the invisible man tipped it away at the last second."
I'm with Albert
Rasmus needs to STFU and play….Pujol’s didn’t need to say that publicly but thats his way of giving Rasmus the message, I’m fine with it.
That said I’d like Rasmus in an A’s uniform, sure, sounds like he might need to mature a bit though.
Gas to Chicago- $23.87 A's/White Sox Tix- $28 Watching the A's whipping the Sox in July 05'- Priceless
Yeah he should definitely mature enough to know when his flight will be delayed by bad weather
sheesh. TLR = psycho. Rasmus = not.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
I wouldn't call La Russa a psycho
the guy has rightfully earned the respect of his players. Whatever you think of his managing strategy.
by Billy Frijoles on Sep 7, 2010 11:22 AM PDT up reply actions
Me too, but I'm not that impressed with the conduct of either
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:41 PM PDT up reply actions
OK, we've got a fuller quote now
It’s not a first-language thing, but it definitely sounds less outrageous as a full quote.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Still, this could pretty much seal Rasmus' fate this offseason.
Think about it.
Albert is unhappy. Management will and should do whatever they can to keep him happy.
Bye bye Colby.
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 12:36 PM PDT up reply actions
That sounds like a good Idea
let a player dictate who is on the team
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
if its Pujols its not the worst idea since if he leaves your franchise is fucked.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions
Exactly
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions
Look where that got the Cavs.
"I thought it was going in," Warriors center Chris Hunter said. "It looked like the invisible man tipped it away at the last second."
Pujols is a thousand times the man LeBron is.
Pujols is a ballplayer in the old mold, a throwback to the days when Jackie Robinson would retire rather than let himself be traded to the Giants, or Ty Cobb couldn’t be moved to leave the Tigers (for the Athletics!) except by a pretty big scandal.
If Pujols and the Cardinals ever part ways, it won’t be because Pujols wanted it to happen.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 6, 2010 8:25 PM PDT up reply actions
I sure hope so
Hey, it got the Jays Yunel Escobar for a bag of used baseballs, right?
Soapy intrigue FTW! (That should be the AN motto, actually.)
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
They need a 3Bman, so throw in Kouz
Mazzaro, Sweeney, Kouz: A fair haul for an unhappy player who has worn out his welcome to where your franchise player just called him out? Now add a replacement 3Bman (Beltre?) and a FA starting pitcher (De La Rosa, Webb, or Kuroda?), rock and roll!
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
that probably won't work since Kouz is likely to have his back amputated.
at least that’s what I’m assuming after today
Pam liked my old sig better.
I like all of this :)
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Serious question:
How much do the A’s stand to lose if Larish took over for Kouzmanoff? I imagine the drop would be noticeable, but is it precipitous?
"I've made a huge little mistake." - G.O.B.
My soft human brain finds this hard to believe
Because it isn’t very impressed with the relatively small sample of plays it has seen Kouz involved in. But I believe you.
"I've made a huge little mistake." - G.O.B.
Kouz has been an above average 3B his whole career.
I don’t think he’s a “gold glove” caliber guy, but his defense combined with his ‘meh’ hitting make him a net positive player.
Larish seems like a left handed version of Fox, only not as craptastic defensively.
Pam liked my old sig better.
Or offensively, in that he'll accept a walk.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Oh, I get what you're saying
And what the stats tell us. I believe both of you, like I said. It’s just that after watching Chavez smoothly glide through every play at 3rd, Kouz looks like one-legged man at a waltz competition.
And THAT DIDN’T EVEN MAKE SENSE.
"I've made a huge little mistake." - G.O.B.
He's actually NOT been above average his whole career
Unless his rookie season doesn’t count. At this point, maybe it shouldn’t. But “above average” is what I’d call him.
What’s really weird is that as Kouzmanoff’s offense gets worse and worse each year, apparently his defense gets better, thus balancing out his WAR. Thing is, guys who have been playing a position forever don’t typically make such drastic defensive improvements as they move into their late 20s. Something’s up with him.
www.zekeishungry.com
by thejd44 on Sep 6, 2010 9:31 AM PDT up reply actions
Wait, are you talking about the 16 games
that he mostly spent as a DH with the Indians?
I’d not be surprised that DHing Kevin Kouzmanoff would produce a below-average player…
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
No. I'm talking about his first year with the Padres
When he was a below average fielder, which is what I was talking about. He was actually an okay hitter then.
I do find it interesting that as his defensive apparently improves beyond all reason and logic, his offense continues to get worse and worse. At this rate, in 4 years he’ll be an all field, no hit shortstop or something (I’m joking there, but the trends are interesting still).
www.zekeishungry.com
by thejd44 on Sep 8, 2010 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Are there "defensive PEDs" now?
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 6, 2010 10:20 AM PDT up reply actions
If Larish and his bad defense can't hit as well as Kouzmanoff, he should be playing in the Northern League.
www.zekeishungry.com
by thejd44 on Sep 6, 2010 9:29 AM PDT up reply actions
I would think yes.
From “very good” defense to “very poor” defense, with a bit more power and a bit more OBP, but not really that much.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Reason #1874565 why TLR is a douche like most big name managers.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
well apparently it was because he was showing up late and La Russa threatened to option him to AAA
seems legit to me.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions
I heard it was because he took hitting advice from his dad instead of McGwire.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Sep 5, 2010 12:11 PM PDT up reply actions
Crosby did both.
Worked for him.
A's Fan in Sweden
"Sosa had me caught up in the magic, and I feel like an idiot. I don’t say that often, but I feel like an idiot because of Sammy Sosa." -Jay Mariotti
No thanks
Rasmus sounds like a whiney bitch.
by HCF from Oakball on Sep 5, 2010 12:29 PM PDT reply actions
Thats what TLR wants you to think
But im sure if you an awesome 5 tool player and you get benched for Randy Winn all the time youd be “whiney” too.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
He showed up late...
…the manager justifiably got in his face, then he cried to the GM requesting a trade.
Whiney Bitch.
by HCF from Oakball on Sep 5, 2010 12:45 PM PDT up reply actions
He showed up late because he was requesting the trade
Its in the mlbtr article.
Why the hell would you ever bench a 124 OPS+ guy is pretty stupid IMO. Im on team Rasmus here. This would be like if we never traded CarGo but then benched him for Travis Buck on the regular. Stupid overmanaging by TLR.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
+1 for Team Rasmus.
What you fail to understand in your joyless myopia is that baseball is the key to life-- the Rosetta Stone, if you will. If you just understood baseball better all your other questions your, your... the, uh... the aliens, the conspiracies they would all, in their way be answered by the baseball gods.
This is not true. Dude can you please read the articles youre linking to?
After Rasmus arrived late to the park due to travel complications created by an early morning downpour, La Russa chastised the player in a closed-door meeting. La Russa threatened Rasmus with an option to Triple-A Memphis, according to the source.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 1:04 PM PDT up reply actions
I seriously cannot believe the attitudes of some posters on here
are you guys just massive LaRussa stans or what? TLR is a psycho who over-manages his team to the point of infuriation where STL games are nearly impossible to watch, he benches Colby Rasmus for Randy Winn.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
There might be more to this than meets the eye. LaRussa isn't normally that stupid.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:18 PM PDT up reply actions
He's hit Rasmus 7th all year when he's not benching him for Winn.
He’s not a #7 hitter.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Yes, but there might be some reason for that which we're not privvy to
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:26 PM PDT up reply actions
Hahahaha! If you only knew!
No, dude. I hate Larussa. NEVET understood the “Dugout Genius” thing. TLR is the most over rated man in baseball.
No. I’m not a fan.
by HCF from Oakball on Sep 5, 2010 2:51 PM PDT up reply actions
How is he overrated?
he’s one of the most winningest managers in baseball history.
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 4:08 PM PDT up reply actions
How does he rank...
…in losses?
Of course he is one of the winningest managers. He’s been employed longer than any other manager since Connie Mack.
by HCF from Oakball on Sep 5, 2010 4:53 PM PDT up reply actions
3rd most wins, 2nd most losses, 22nd best winning percentage among the 55 managers with 1000+ wins
Last of the Ninth - Photography
Yup.
So in other words, middle of the road. ie, over rated.
by HCF from Oakball on Sep 6, 2010 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions
well either way, he's not a "whiney bitch"
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
You consistently blatantly misrepresent facts. Please stop.
It makes this site worse.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 1:26 PM PDT up reply actions
oh please
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
I started this thread
you are more than welcome to not post in it.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
So people should not say anything when they think you're wrong or misrepresenting things?
Last of the Ninth - Photography
But the thing is, I dont do anything of the sort.
“Blatantly misrepresent facts”? The MLBTR article linked says:
Rasmus came to GM John Mozeliak with his request during the Cards’ July 23-25 series against the Cubs at Wrigley Field, according to a source familiar with the situation. After the center fielder arrived late to the park, La Russa threatened to option him to Triple-A in a closed door meeting. However, when talking to Rasmus, Mozeliak assured him that he would be staying put.
I read that as being Rasmus making his request, then arriving late to the park because of that request.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
I don't see anything about it that mentions being late because of a trade request
Though that would’ve been bad, too.
What I saw said he was late because of weather complications. If La Russa blew up at him over that, I don’t think it was justified. If you’re late because of things out of your control what are you supposed to do?
If he WAS late because of making a trade request then yeah, La Russa laying into him was justified.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
I read it as “Rasmus came to GM John Mozeliak with his request during the Cards’ July 23-25 series against the Cubs at Wrigley Field”
“After the center fielder arrived late to the park, La Russa threatened to option him to Triple-A”
I mean, I was wrong because it was a weather thing, but dfa was (typically) way out of line in calling me out like that. He makes the site worse and unreadable by pulling stunts like that, not me.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Reading comprehension shows that you were blatantly wrong
and when I brought this to your attention you said whatever and proceeded to claim we were all TLR bffs. Get your facts right.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:03 PM PDT up reply actions
well I wasnt directing that at you
I was directing it at the “Rasmus is a whiney [sic] bitch” posters who were clearly taking TLR’s side over Rasmus, when Rasmus is clearly 100% in the right here.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
It's possible to believe La Russa handled things the wrong way while also acknowledging Rasmus isn't completely blameless in the whole thing, you know
Last of the Ninth - Photography
LaRussa
Looks like Tony is wrong in that he is taking the Cards recent collapse out of first on Rasmus. To tell a player you will be optioned down for being late when you have a excuse is out of control. TLR is highly competive and knows the Cards most likely not make the playoffs. The only fault I see in Rasmus is waiting till the off season to ask for a trade.
Not gonna dispute that
And from the reports out there it’s sounding a lot like TLR has given up on things this year as it is, or just doesn’t care any more. Not sure how that fits in with the Rasmus situation, though.
But a 2nd-year player demanding a trade because he got chewed out by the manager is pretty childish, no matter the reason.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
I don't know if it's childish,
but it’s certainly unwise.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
What I want to know is,
how did the press first hear about this?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
this I agree with.
seems like something that tends to happen behind closed doors.
Pam liked my old sig better.
Maybe he's a female dog who thinks he's a horse?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
There were problems before that happened
TLR was benching Rasmus for guys like Randy Winn and Nick Stavinoha.
In other words, benching Rasmus for guys who were outright bad at baseball.
Needs moar dingerz.
It's obvious we don't have the full story here
All we know is that Rasmus has not played a normal full season this year, that he was unavoidably late to work at least once, and that he asked for a trade after being disciplined somewhat harshly for that lateness.
The full reasons behind Rasmus’s lack of normal playing time are opaque to us. They may be good or terrible— we really don’t know.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
And he's denying asking for a trade too.
Choosy Feebas choose Leopold Bloom nipples
Daring. Sensual. Invigorating. Squirrel.
BLOOM. For men.
If the eggs actually hatch I made more than a mistake, I made some scientifically impossible crime.
Also true
He probably just said something like “If you’re going to bench me for this nonsense, why not just trade me?” or something like that. He’s a young guy who got frustrated at his situation. It has to happen a hundred times a season in MLB clubhouses, but this one got leaked to the press.
I suspect LaRussa, personally, though obviously the source is anonymous and the reporter’s not going to disclose it.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
In this case La Russa actually said it in his interview
So I wouldn’t be surprised in the least bit if it was exactly as you theorized.
Choosy Feebas choose Leopold Bloom nipples
Daring. Sensual. Invigorating. Squirrel.
BLOOM. For men.
If the eggs actually hatch I made more than a mistake, I made some scientifically impossible crime.
Whiney bitches who can play >> gritty gamers who can't
Sorry, Matt.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
by PaulThomas on Sep 5, 2010 12:47 PM PDT up reply actions 4 recs
Will he ever make it?
His numbers are amazingly similar to Jeremy Hermida’s at the same age.
he is what the A's need
What the Cards need is a replacement Cfer which would be Ryan Sweeney and a 3b in Kouz. The A’s would get back someone on the trade. Maybe Craig. The Cards would jump at it since it fills to spots on their team. Go do it Beane.
The Cards don't need a hurt OFer and an ok third baseman for a rising OF star.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions
If only it were true that Sweeney+Kouz would get Rasmus.
What you fail to understand in your joyless myopia is that baseball is the key to life-- the Rosetta Stone, if you will. If you just understood baseball better all your other questions your, your... the, uh... the aliens, the conspiracies they would all, in their way be answered by the baseball gods.
Yeah, you'd have to add Gio, Cahill, Bailey or Anderson to make that happen.
and yeah, I’d still make that deal.
I should probably add at this point Im a massive Rasmus fan. Always have been. He’s like the second coming of Jim Edmonds but can steal bases. We should give up whoever STL asks for him.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
*one of those 4
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
Colby is striking out more than Edmonds ever did though.
I’m not sure he’s going to be as good a hitter as Edmonds turned out to be.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:25 PM PDT up reply actions
Not a Starting pitcher
remember it is St Louis that needs to trade so you have them on the short deal. Cody is also coming off a average season so he is not on the sell high mode. I can see throwing bailey in the deal but would not trade a starter for him since he is not a allstar or a player with producing allstar numbers. He is only a 250 hitter with 25 homerun power not worth selling the farm for.
He was an All Star this year
And he was putting up very worthy AS numbers when the time came round to pick…
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 2:11 PM PDT up reply actions
my bad
just looked at his stats and he has bombed since allstar break.
Yeah, his 2nd half has been pretty rough
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 5, 2010 4:12 PM PDT up reply actions
Mazzaro, Taylor and Bailey?
Too much, not enough?
"Rollins helps them with the small ball when he's not in the lineup." - Joe Morgan
I'd do it. Cards don't seem the type to over-value a reliever though.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions
This is where I hope the Cards love Mazzaro
Or Braden.
But Rasmus should become our top priority now, at least on the trade front. If the Cards are asking for the moon then you hang up the phone but a deal centered around Mazzaro/Braden, Weeks/Cardenas, and someone else seems like a good starting point. I’m not giving up Green or Carter and I’d need to be persuaded to sell low on Taylor.
"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin
I don't think the Cardinals are even going to shop Rasmus to begin with
Mozeliak: “Colby is young and may not always understand how to handle the media”
Mozeliak, on Rasmus: “He is a tremendous talent and we are going to give him every opportunity to do it here.”
http://twitter.com/JeffFletcherAOL
Last of the Ninth - Photography
La Russa leaving is far more likely than Colby Leaving IMO
Duncan has pretty much said hes gone and I think TLR will follow him out the door. Duncan would be an interesting managerial choice BTW.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 5, 2010 2:37 PM PDT up reply actions
I'd love Duncan.
Or that pitching coach at CWS who apparently teaches all his pitchers a cutter?
A's Fan in Sweden
Mike Maddux is pretty good as well.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 5:14 PM PDT up reply actions
Even if LaRussa leaves, I can easily see Rasmus being traded if Pujols is speaking
for a majority in the clubhouse. See Yunel Escobar.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 5:15 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, that could go one of two ways I'm thinking
- Rasmus shuts up and figures it out, or
- Rasmus doesn’t get it and winds up traded
Last of the Ninth - Photography
Wouldn't there be some risk of clashing philosophies between him and Curt Young?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I would think so
We also don’t even know if Duncan is “manager material” — he certainly knows what the job entails, but it’s unclear whether that’s his thing or if he’s more just a pitchers’ guru.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I don't know, isn't Curt somewhat a product of Duncan?
I wouldn’t go with Duncan as a manager just because his only real strength as a coach is pitching. There’s no indication that he has any other qualities that he brings to the table.
Hire Rickey.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 6, 2010 8:34 PM PDT up reply actions
Maybe so, but you still don't want the manager micromanaging the pitching coach's job
and if you want any of the putative benefits of Dave Duncan, isn’t that what he’d have to be doing?
[To preempt grover’s inevitable comment referencing the other thread: I think pitching coaches actually do something useful, unlike hitting coaches. Not the same thing.]
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Why?
Pitchers have 30 seconds to think about what they’re doing. Batters have 1/100th as long.
They’re profoundly different activities.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
That doesn't make hitting coaches irrelevant
Timing mechanisms, better approaches, etc., worked on in the peaceful atmosphere of BP can make those 1/100ths of a second end better when the pressure’s on.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Exactly.
That’s what I think is missed in the dismissal of hitting coaches. That 1/100th of a second is very coachable. The example I will continue going back to is Rajai Davis. You can teach that guy to take pitches. Someone out there has the ability to teach him that. It is not Jim Skaalen.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 6, 2010 9:53 PM PDT up reply actions
Well, Billy Beane disagrees with you
I mean, don’t you think someone has (at some point) probably mentioned this to Rajai?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
The problem is what works for one player won't necessarily work for another
So one hitting coach at best might be really useful to a couple of players and irrelevant to the rest.
Choosy Feebas choose Leopold Bloom nipples
Daring. Sensual. Invigorating. Squirrel.
BLOOM. For men.
If the eggs actually hatch I made more than a mistake, I made some scientifically impossible crime.
Billy Beane also thinks Bob Geren is a manager.
And honestly, I don’t know if anyone has mentioned it to Rajai. The emphasis on OBP that this team used to have seems to have completely disappeared. The old Billy Beane would have loved a guy like Daric Barton and would have been quite pleased with Jack Cust this season. The new Billy Beane says Daric Barton is “getting there,” doesn’t mention Jack Cust, and seems to have some weird faith in Kurt Suzuki.
Besides, mentioning it to Rajai is not the same as working hard with him in the offseason to teach him a fundamental aspect of baseball.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 6, 2010 11:19 PM PDT up reply actions
The old Billy Beane might never have acquired a Rajai Davis in the first place
but he certainly didn’t entertain a belief that the zebra could change its stripes. He talks about it during the Scott Hatteberg winning-streak game.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I think you're right
At least at the time, the old Billy Beane didn’t seem to care about having fast baseball players.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
Probably, so at some point it becomes a matter of how coachable Davis is
When I was driving to a River Cats game last week I had the A’s on the radio and a comment was made about how many bunts for hits A’s players have (I think Pennington led with four). Davis had one in spite of all his speed, and it was mentioned that Davis had said the reason for it is he would rather just swing the bat instead of bunting.
That’s not all of what makes Davis a poor hitter, but you can see it even when he tries to lay down a sacrifice bunt. He’s just not that good at it, so it makes me believe he doesn’t work on it. That’s on the A’s to coach him if that’s what they want him to do, and if he refuses to then they need to decide what to do about it.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
yeah I dunno who has coached Rajai's bunting
But he is the ugliest most terrible bunter I have seen in a while. Cust and Ortiz lay down prettier bunts.
by Billy Frijoles on Sep 7, 2010 11:45 AM PDT up reply actions
Right, and to be clear I'm not saying this based only on his inability to bunt...
…but some people have wondered why he doesn’t try to bunt for base hits more, considering his speed. Apparently the answer is “Because I don’t want to.” If you can’t coach him that way, it’s not going to be that easy to coach him to even just swing better.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
It also doesn't sound like they've been coached much on bunting though.
At least not until recently. Tye Waller talked about it in the Chronicle (or some lesser Bay Area rag) as something he wants the team to start working on in the future.
Rajai probably doesn’t like bunting because he doesn’t know how to do it and hasn’t been taught.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 7, 2010 2:41 PM PDT up reply actions
My point is that I (and Billy Beane if we take the Moneyball quote seriously) don't think plate discipline is coachable
You have it or you don’t have it. Maybe the player will change inwardly, but I don’t think hectoring him will be any help at all.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
There are a few guys who seem to learn it
There are probably other examples like this, but I think they’re pretty rare. Still, it does seem possible.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Learnable =/= coachable
A GM trying to get a player to stop hacking is like a parent trying to stop their kid from taking drugs by giving them one of those bullshit lectures they’re always spouting off in anti-drug ads. It’s useless. They’ll either figure it out on their own, or not.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Yeah, that's a little bit what I was getting at.
The only thing Duncan knows is pitching, and so it’s not only redundant to have him on staff (especially considering that he and Young are probably very similar as pitching coaches), it’s going to lead not to a clash of philosophies but to micro-management (especially considering that he and Young are probably very similar as pitching coaches.)
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 6, 2010 9:52 PM PDT up reply actions
Thinking about WAR and checking out the A's, here are their hitting and pitching leaders per season this decade
It only seems to go back to 2002 on Fangraphs, though.
Hitting:
2010 – Barton, 4.2 (and counting)
2009 – Sweeney, 3.8
2008 – Suzuki/Ellis, 2.9
2007 – Ellis, 3.9
2006 – Swisher, 3.7
2005 – Ellis, 4.4
2004 – Chavez, 5.5
2003 – Chavez, 3.9
2002 – Chavez, 5.4
Only Chavez topped the 5 WAR mark over that period.
Pitchers:
2010 – Gonzalez, 3.2 (and counting)
2009 – Anderson, 3.8
2008 – Duchscherer, 3.0
2007 – Blanton, 5.6 (and Haren was 4.9)
2006 – Haren, 4.0
2005 – Haren, 4.0
2004 – Hudson, 5.2
2003 – Hudson, 6.3
2002 – Hudson, 5.3
Definitely had some great years out of Hudson, which we should all remember anyway.
But just looking at that, it’s going to take a pretty damned solid year in most ways for a hitter to put up a 5+ WAR here. Chavez was certainly helped by his defense, which would be a plus for Rasmus as well. If he hits and runs like he seems to have the potential to, I could see him push a 5 WAR no matter where he plays. Not going to deny him that. He’s not there yet, though.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
Joe Blanton had a 5.6 WAR year? Wow.
That’s the 2nd best year of anyone on the team since 2002.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:20 PM PDT up reply actions
Yes, but I think of Ellis as having had 5 WAR potential in a healthy year.
Not any more of course.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:29 PM PDT up reply actions
I never thought he'd hit enough.
I mean, an .860 OPS second baseman is just unheard of.
Pam liked my old sig better.
We did have Eddie Collins once
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:33 PM PDT up reply actions
Even before that ...
We had two season of Nap Lajoie. Collins was absolutely fantastic and stayed in an A’s uni longer, but for single season 2B greatness take a gander at Nap’s 1901 campaign.
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball." - Connie Mack
Man, this franchise has had some greats.
14 HRs! And that was when 14 HRs could easily lead the league (and, in fact, did lead the league that year.)
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 7, 2010 2:43 PM PDT up reply actions
It's my impression that the AL in 1901 was not a particularly high level of baseball
Collins might have improved his stats from 1900 in the NL to 1901 in the AL because the competition was so lousy in the new league.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Hm
+20 defense and +2.5 position, plus 22.5 or so replacement runs— he’d only have had to OPS about .775 over a full year to be plausibly in that range during his defensive prime.
Easily doable.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Yeah, I'm not sure how he did it
I mean, it can be calculated but on the surface it doesn’t make sense.
To put it in perspective, Blanton’s high past that is 3.3, which is also the only other time he’s been higher than 2.5.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
statcorner has Blanton at a 5.4 WAR in 2007 so it's not a batted ball thing.
He just pitched a ton on very good innings.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:26 PM PDT up reply actions
BTW Rich Harden was a 4.4 WAR player in 2008 with the A's and Cubs.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:35 PM PDT up reply actions
Good catch
Looks like the breakdown was 2.4 here and 2.0 in Chicago, though the time split between the two was nearly equal.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
We traded him for basically nothing during the better of his two healthy years.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:41 PM PDT up reply actions
Thinking of someone we traded not so long ago...
Carlos Gonzalez is sitting at 4.8 with most of the month to go.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
Matt Holliday's at 5.3
BTW he was at 5.5 in 2009.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:45 PM PDT up reply actions
Yes it was a surly 5.5
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 5, 2010 9:46 PM PDT up reply actions
But it shows that Holliday was about the same here as in St. Louis.
www.zekeishungry.com
by thejd44 on Sep 6, 2010 9:33 AM PDT up reply actions
We should be the front runners in landing Rasmus
sending Rasmus to Oakland would be St.Louis’s way of getting back at him – baseball’s siberia, so to speak. It’s also in a diff league, another plus. And, I’m sure Holliday has given his .02 on how crappy it was playing here.
Lot's of intrigue with this news...
As has been posted above, TLR could be done managing in St. Louis after this year (which would largely seem to “solve” this issue from the Cardinals’ standpoint). However, the fact that Pujols has been so outspoken on the issue seems to aid the hope of making a trade for Rasmus a real possibility. Correct me if I’m wrong here, but isn’t this off season the one St. Louis will REALLY try and push to get a new contract extension done with Pujols? 2011 is going to be his final year (an option one) on his current contract…I would think the Cards want to do everything they can to get him signed before he has an opportunity to “see what’s out there”. If getting rid of Rasmus would, for some reason, appease Pujols, I think they’d give it some serious thought. And hell, if somehow TLR manages them again next season it would seem to only help our cause.
I have a few players I WOULDN’T trade from our MLB squad as well as our farm. Here they are…
MLB
Trevor Cahill
Gio Gonzalez
Brett Anderson
Daric Barton
Cliff Pennington
MiLB
Chris Carter
Grant Green
Ian Krol
That being said, I would offer up a package of Vin Mazzaro, Michael Taylor, and Jemile Weeks in a heartbeat.
…and FWIW, this is the sort of trade I wish we would have still had Sam Demel for. He would be a nice piece to have been able to add to give the offer more quantity with a touch more quality.
You know you are big-time when people chant your name while you pee. - 67MARQUEZ
I don't think the Cards are gonna exercise Pujols' option...
AN: Where you will be an A's fan or Dallas Braden will show you the repercussions of your actions.
by stranahanahan on Sep 6, 2010 2:21 AM PDT up reply actions
I like Pennington and all, but if St. Louis wants him for Rasmus, well, bye bye, Cliff.
www.zekeishungry.com
by thejd44 on Sep 6, 2010 9:34 AM PDT up reply actions
My only concern would be
Who do we have that could replace him? Rosales isn’t a full-time player IMO…his value lies in his ability to be a really useful/solid utility player. Can/could Tolleson handle the everyday SS job? …I wouldn’t really want any of the FA SS options available this off-season.
You know you are big-time when people chant your name while you pee. - 67MARQUEZ
by bakerbeachboy on Sep 6, 2010 9:52 AM PDT up reply actions
We could make them throw in Brendan Ryan and give them Kouzmanoff
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 6, 2010 10:15 AM PDT up reply actions
With all due respect
Brendan Ryan is terrible. I wouldn’t want him to sniff a 40 man roster spot with us.
You know you are big-time when people chant your name while you pee. - 67MARQUEZ
by bakerbeachboy on Sep 6, 2010 10:38 AM PDT up reply actions
Well, to be fair, Ryan is pretty good defensively.
He’s just terrible offensively.
"You're all like big fat failure turtles." - Edge
by Rated-R Superstar on Sep 6, 2010 11:52 AM PDT up reply actions
Yes, he's like Adam Everett, but on a groundballing staff that might be OK
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 6, 2010 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions
Well, the old Adam Everett anyway
He’s thoroughly washed up now. Ironically, the A’s killed his career…
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Point taken
You know you are big-time when people chant your name while you pee. - 67MARQUEZ
by bakerbeachboy on Sep 6, 2010 3:52 PM PDT up reply actions
Derek Jeter!
LOL
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
heh
Wonder how much more ESPN coverage the A’s would get if that ever happened.
You know you are big-time when people chant your name while you pee. - 67MARQUEZ
by bakerbeachboy on Sep 6, 2010 3:53 PM PDT up reply actions
You know what the worst part of that would be?
Not the money, not the pain of having an ex “true Yankee”. The worst part would be that we sign a bat (Crawford) and then Jeter, become a good team, and hear allllll about how “Derek Jeter’s leadership led this team to the top”.
A's Fan in Sweden
hahaha
Truth right there.
You know you are big-time when people chant your name while you pee. - 67MARQUEZ
by bakerbeachboy on Sep 6, 2010 4:35 PM PDT up reply actions
I'll take it.
1) It would be so great to dismantle that “true Yankee” BS like that. The Yankee mystique is the most tired cliche in sports. The Philadelphia Athletics won the first professional baseball championship in 1871. We’re the only baseball team with an NFL Championship (look it up.) I could go on for pages and pages. Our mystique is older by decades and is WAY more interesting.
2) If Derek Jeter’s leadership is what it takes to win, I’ll swallow that pill in a New York second.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 6, 2010 8:41 PM PDT up reply actions
My problem with Derek Jeter is that he isn't very good anymore
His bat speed is reportedly well down this year. I doubt it’s coming back.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Right, we'd overpay for him.
I do think he would bring a certain leadership and presence to a young team, as cliched and hackneyed as that sounds. And he’s still a better hitter than a lot of our guys.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 6, 2010 9:55 PM PDT up reply actions
Let's analyze what the Cards need and what do we have plenty off
Starting Pitchers: They only have 3 guarantee spots on their 2011 rotation (Carpenter, Garcia and Wainright) so we can offer them a number 4/5 rotation pitcher, MLB ready, and get an FA pitcher to replace him. I’m thinking Mazzaro.
Midle Infield: Schumaker and Lopez are average 2Bs at best, and their shortstop position needs an upgrade as well. Let’s take care of that need by sending Rosales, and take Ellis 2011 option.
Lead off hitter: We need to create room for Rasmus anyway, so let’s send them a good leadoff hitter, 3rd in the AL in steals on Rajai Davis, and that would give them a true leadoff hitter and won’t hurt us.
From the 3, the only 1 I would feel sad not to have it on the club is Rosy, the other 2 are average to above average players for the role they’ll fill in St Louis.
Now THAT will get you the Mozeliak laughter/cursing/dial tone trichotomy, all right
Three filler players for the former #3 prospect in baseball, who’s already about as good as all three of them put together?
Ok.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
The best idea I've heard so far is Rasmus for Kemp.
We’d have to top that in Mo’s eyes.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 6, 2010 10:16 AM PDT up reply actions
You'd prefer them to Kemp? I wouldn't.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 6, 2010 10:21 AM PDT up reply actions
I would not do that deal if I was the Cardinals
Kemp’s potential surplus value is fairly low because he’s two years from free agency. The Cardinals would lose badly on that trade from an objective standpoint.
I don’t think I would accept those three A’s guys if I was Mozeliak, but I know that I would not accept just Matt Kemp. Of course the Dodgers could sweeten the pot with their own prospects, but their farm system is even more threadbare than Oakland’s right now.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Matt Kemp is not a CF though.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
True, but they could move Jay to CF and Kemp to RF
Paul’s point on contract years remaining is valid, but the Cards are a “win now” kind of team. I do think they’d prefer Kemp to three minor leaguers just for that reason.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 6, 2010 12:12 PM PDT up reply actions
I don't think Jay's that good.
A's Fan in Sweden
He isn't, but he is their starting RF
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 6, 2010 12:14 PM PDT up reply actions
They may think that, though, considering how good he has been at the plate.
He’s batting .327/.379/.480 in 248 PA even though his career Triple-A OPS is only .781.
"You're all like big fat failure turtles." - Edge
by Rated-R Superstar on Sep 6, 2010 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions
He can also play CF at an approximately average level.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 6, 2010 12:19 PM PDT up reply actions
Really?
Everything I’ve read has said he’s not great defensively. And by everything, I mean one comment I can vaguely recall. Is he pretty good defensively?
A's Fan in Sweden
CHONE has him at +9 in RF, and he looks fine in CF to me
in the few times I’ve seen him play there.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 7, 2010 12:28 PM PDT up reply actions
I always liked that guy
I remember arguing that the A’s should trade for him a few years ago.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Yeah I argued that we should have gotten him in the Holliday deal last year when he wasn't hitting well
PS Daryl Jones, boy does he suck.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 8:33 PM PDT up reply actions
More so or less so than Shane Peterson? : /
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I was surprised they caved in with Wallace, even though I never liked him
once you get the center piece you are looking for I think that they probably weren’t going to budge on the rest.
What we’re asking is for people to stop pretending that ipse dixit counts as a "source." When you make a claim about baseball, you should be willing to put some reasonable amount of effort into explaining why it’s correct if someone asks you to. That’s basic respect for the other poster. - PT
by designatedforassignment on Sep 7, 2010 10:25 PM PDT up reply actions
With a .371 BABIP.
He might be a guy with a naturally high BABIP, but not that high.
A's Fan in Sweden
They may be win-now,
but they also have 10 players departing to free agency and lack a ton of payroll room. I grant you that most of those players suck, but if your problem is that you have a few superstars and can’t fill out your roster, getting a large quantity of cheap players (with some upside— they won’t want that pile that was suggested at the base of this subthread) may look better (even from a win-now standpoint) than one better, but more expensive player.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Mazzaro and Taylor would do it
Probably would require a throw in, but Weeks would be too much. Davis would do it.
I don't think that would do it.
However, if that deal does acquire Weeks, we should do it. Weeks shouldn’t be keeping us from Rasmus.
"You're all like big fat failure turtles." - Edge
by Rated-R Superstar on Sep 6, 2010 11:53 AM PDT up reply actions
Cards want to win now. They're going to want major leaguers back in any trade.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 6, 2010 12:13 PM PDT up reply actions
there's a lot of discussion about trading Gio for Rasmus
And not much of Cahill for Rasmus. Just wondering, is this because people think that Gio is more likely to get the deal done or that Cahill’s better so we should try to keep him?
Cahill’s having an incredible year, but going forward I think Gio’s the better pitcher. I’d be all for selling high on Cahill this offseason, and if that meant getting Rasmus (maybe by also including one prospect from below AAA), well, that would be a pretty incredible steal.
There are plenty of mid-range SP options available that will be much, much easier to sign than the two position players, Crawford and Werth, who are anywhere near what Rasmus projects to be going forward.
Why don't you make like a tree, and get out of here.
I used Gio as a starting point because I knew he'd get it done.
But by all means if they would take Weeks, Mazzaro & Taylor for him please do that. I like Gio, but he’s probably our most valuable mlb level piece not named Cliff or Daric right now.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
I'd consider Cahill and Gio interchangeable
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 6, 2010 12:14 PM PDT up reply actions
Some random thoughts...
1) Back in the early days of the rebuilding, I seem to recall many people saying we could stockpile pitching talent and trade some for offense if necessary. Well, we’re here, and it’s not an unreasonable idea. Yes, one can say you can never have too much pitching, but this team does have enough that it would still do fine… maybe even better… if it had something resembling a balanced team with a decent offense. We can spare an arm, if it gets us to the greater goal.
2) I would not give up “anything” to get Rasmus. He’s good, and he would certainly help us, but he’s not that good.
3) Yes, we need two bats, at least. But to shoot down this idea because it is only one is, well, short-sighted and ridiculous. We’re not going to upgrade our offense in one fell swoop. Get one, then work on getting the second. One step at a time.
4) I can see where some players would have issues with LaRussa, but… if this guy is this difficult, it makes me leery of what kind of a-hole he’ll be in any clubhouse. Sometimes it doesn’t matter… sometimes it does. Having said that, I’d give it a shot, myself.
I've come to the conclusion that the two most important things in life are good friends and a good bullpen.
~Bob Lemon, 1981
Are you sure he's not that good?
Pre-2008, Rasmus was ranked as the number five prospect by Baseball America. Pre-2009, he was number three. He just turned 24 last month.
"You're all like big fat failure turtles." - Edge
by Rated-R Superstar on Sep 6, 2010 12:11 PM PDT up reply actions
I kinda think he is that good as well. But I agree with Leo that a guy who's in the manager's
doghouse is a risk.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 6, 2010 12:15 PM PDT up reply actions
That is why I think we should put only 1 type A prospect
Mazzaro with Taylor should do it. If we put Weeks or a similar prospect on the deal, BB needs to ask for a prospect in return, otherwise we would be giving too much.
That’s my idea, since what we need are proven offensive weapons, and I’m not sure Rasmus is proven just yet.
Who is the "A" prospect there?
Our “A” or “A-” prospects are Chris Carter and Grant Green by my count.
"You're all like big fat failure turtles." - Edge
by Rated-R Superstar on Sep 6, 2010 12:30 PM PDT up reply actions
Michael Taylor (ranked 29 in all baseball by BA this year)
And if you add an MLB pitcher in Mazzaro, that should be enough.
Is Taylor even in the top 100 anymore?
"You're all like big fat failure turtles." - Edge
by Rated-R Superstar on Sep 6, 2010 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions
No
Carter and Green are not A-grade prospects either though. The A’s don’t have any A-grade prospects right now.
In fact, they might not have a single player that even grades as a B+ on the Sickels scale— that’s how bad this season has been for the A’s minors. Everyone has serious question marks.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Except Taylor sucked this year and probably fell off the top 100 list alltogether.
Mazzaro, Taylor, and it would have to be another good prospect on top of that, or a solid big leaguer.
Honestly it’s too bad Conor Jackson sucks/is hurt and Ryan Sweeney is hurt, cause I think IF HEALTHY adding one of those two would probably get it done
Pam liked my old sig better.
For me, I don't trade "anybody" based on going after someone with potential at this point
He may reach it and he may not. There’s always a risk inherent in that when you go after someone who hasn’t fully matured yet as a player. Obviously if you’re going after a fully matured player that’s really good the price will be higher, but Rasmus hasn’t shown he’s an elite player yet. He’s showing he COULD be, but he’s not yet.
That’s the trick in deals like this. If you’re trading for someone’s potential, you have to be damn sure he’s going to reach it.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
OK
but the A’s don’t have any elite players anyway. Saying the A’s will trade anyone for Rasmus is not the same as, like, saying the Rays would trade anyone for him. They obviously wouldn’t because they have Evan Longoria, who is already a superstar. The A’s have no superstars.
The A’s don’t have to be “sure” that Rasmus will reach his potential— they just need to think it’s more likely that he reaches his than that the players they are trading reach theirs. And given the likely candidates, it’s hard to believe that will not be true. There is nobody on the A’s who is even close to as likely to reach star status as Rasmus is other than, maybe, Brett Anderson.
Rasmus would, right now, become at least the second-best player on the A’s and possibly the best, and he is not done growing. This is not pie-eyed speculation about some Latin 17-year-old here. Rasmus is better than Oakland’s players.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
"Anybody", "anyone", "anything".
Close, but not necessarily the same thing. Somebody above said they’d trade “anything” to get Rasmus, meaning any combo if players. Basically, that person would be willing to overpay. I wouldn’t trade “anything” the Cardinals would want. There would be a limit. Having said that, I also wouldn’t make “anyone” off-limits, either.
I've come to the conclusion that the two most important things in life are good friends and a good bullpen.
~Bob Lemon, 1981
Duly noted
I would not trade any combination of players for Rasmus. There are even certain pairs of players that I would not do it for (like Gio+Cahill).
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
You wouldn't trade Gross, Carson, and Tolleson for Rasmus?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 6, 2010 9:55 PM PDT up reply actions
ISWYDT
A more formal-logically precise way of phrasing that sentence would be “there exist some number of combinations of A’s players such that I would not trade those combinations for Colby Rasmus.”
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I'm with you on this
Yeah, it’s a small but key distinction. When I wrote against the “trade anyone” concept that’s what I was getting at. There are definitely combinations I’d do and others I wouldn’t.
Last of the Ninth - Photography
By "anyone" I meant any one player. Obviously not all 40 guys on the
roster.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 7, 2010 12:29 PM PDT up reply actions
I really, really want Rasmus.
Him + one 2B FA pushes this team a LONG way forward.
I really, really don’t like the TLR doghouse issue being a point against him.
He got in TLR’s doghouse because TLR was playing guys like Randy Winn and Nick Stavinoha over him. Guys who, umm, suck. You’re a contending team. YOU DON’T DELIBERATELY SET YOUR TEAM UP TO LOSE.
The end.
TLR is done.
Needs moar dingerz.
He's a good player...
But I would be hesitant to trade any major talent. Gio by himself seems a bit high for me.
Wade Hines
I don't think it's high
I might not do it, and I might do it, but I’d say it’s a fair trade.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Here's the thing:
most people who are not wearing green and gold colored glasses would (really, go inquire about the consensus on minorleagueball or similar sites if you don’t believe me) say that that trade is grossly favorable to the A’s, and the only reason why the Cardinals might even consider it is that Rasmus is making an ass of himself.
Most of the proffers in this thread don’t even come close to getting it done. I suspect they would probably demand Gio plus another of the team’s (relative) top prospects like Taylor, even now.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
It's hard to evaluate how much a "doghoused" player requires in a trade.
You’re evaluating this rationally while the situation itself may not be rational. It’s pretty pointless to assume that any deal mentioned will or won’t get it done. Remember how much people thought it’d take to acquire someone like Yunel Escobar? All the stats-favoring posters thought that something like Anderson+ would be required. In reality, it took half a season of Alex Gonzalez.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
Exactly
The reason to “buy low” is that when the buy is low it’s not as high as it should be but it is as low as it is. If you understood that, please seek help.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I thought I just said that
the only reason why the Cardinals might even consider it is that Rasmus is making an ass of himself
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
You think "doghoused" Rasmus would still cost Gio + Taylor?
If so, then no dice.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
Un-doghoused Rasmus was like the 14th most valuable player in baseball
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
How valuable was Yunel Escobar last year?
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
That trade was a stunner.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 7, 2010 12:30 PM PDT up reply actions
Having been to minorleagueball recently...
I haven’t seen any comments that support your claim re: the Gio scenario.
The real problem I see in a Gio for Rasmus swap is I’m not sure if the Cards would really be looking for SP if they put their CF on the block.
The monster at the end of this blog.
If Colin Corherd is to be belived...
…which is always suspect… then what might appeal to the Cardinals would be getting a quality young pitcher that is cost-controlled for a few years. With Holliday’s and Puhol’s upcoming contract they won’t be able to afford the good pitchers they have now when they reach free agency.
IOW: looking at the team’s overall picture down the road, a trade like this would be a win-win for both teams.
I've come to the conclusion that the two most important things in life are good friends and a good bullpen.
~Bob Lemon, 1981
Carpenter and Wainwright are team controlled through 2012
Jaime Garcia doesn’t hit arbitration until 2012, the same year as Gio. They can probably get Westbrook (or a SP of similiar ilk) to sign for less than the $11 million annual Westbrook is making.
So I just don’t think SP is their top priority.
Middle infield, however, is a black hole as is RF.
If they shop Rasmus (and assuming they feel comfortable with their internal replacement) I think they’ll be looking for immediate infield help with maybe a developmental arm on the side.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Heck, they might like Gio and Pennington...
but I don’t like Rasmus THAT much.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
You're right, that would be too much for Rasmus alone
The Cards would have to send a 2nd player back to even things out. More than likely, the final package would be a 3-for-3 deal similar to the Young/Garza trade a couple years ago.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Not only would that not improve the team.
But that deal would probably actually make the team worse by ~2 wins.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
Doesn't hit FA until after 2011
Entered 2010 with 4.164 days of big league service time…
The monster at the end of this blog.
shit, I didn't look at his service time, just that it was his 3rd arbitration year this year
Pam liked my old sig better.
I'd be mildly surprised if he isn't non-tendered
www.zekeishungry.com
by thejd44 on Sep 8, 2010 12:49 PM PDT up reply actions
Then he becomes a option
Until then, I’ll challenge anyone suggesting his services in Oakland for 2011 to the same question.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Aren't they still paying a zillion dollars to Kyle Lohse?
The Cardinals don’t have a ton of room in their budget.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
And I kinda wonder if they'd be willing to part with Rasmus
if someone was willing to take on Lohse’s contract in the process.
The monster at the end of this blog.
I know those kinds of deals make sense from an economic perspective
but I’ve rarely seen them actually happen in real life.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
that one also included the corpse of Guillermo Mota
who then rose from the grave and has pitched for the last 5 years
Pam liked my old sig better.
Well the Beckett trade is one off the top of my head
And plenty are done basketball but there’s a salary cap there. And prospects plus cash has grown increasingly common. The recent Taveras trade by the A’s is another.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
So maybe something like Gio, Weeks and Corey Brown?
That might actually get the phone ringing.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Maybe?
If I’m the Cards and I’m shopping Rasmus I’m looking for immediate help up the middle.
But that’s me.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Weeks isn't immediate enough?
Assuming he’s healthy he’ll be playing for an Opening Day spot with the A’s. Can’t see why it’d be any different for St. Louis; if anything, they have less in his way.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
That's an assumption I'm unwilling to make
Plus a 267/335/403 line in AA doesn’t scream to me “Opening Day job!!!”
The monster at the end of this blog.
Shrug
I think the A’s have a sufficient number of reasonable “help up the middle” type players if they don’t like Weeks. Hell, give them two of them. The A’s don’t have room on the roster for all of them anyway.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Sure, I can see the A's giving Weeks a shot
But I don’t see why St. Louis would be eager to trade their starting CF to do the same.
The monster at the end of this blog.
MLBTR update
Rasmus on trade request:
"I never did that," said Rasmus following today’s game. “I don’t know where that’s coming from. I just want to play baseball and have fun…I love being here. I love the fans. I’m moving forward and just trying to play hard and I’m happy we won today.”
Tony La Russa also addressed the topic in today’s post-game press conference. The manager insisted that he doesn’t have an issue with Rasmus and that he will see significant playing time down the stretch.
I’d love to see him available but I’m sensing this is a non-story. Too bad.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
Or it's in the Cards' interest to make it seem like one.
The fact is, he hasn’t played much considering his pedigree and production. Something’s going on.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I think both the GM and the player are frantically trying to make this go away
Notice who does NOT have an interest in turning this into a non-story.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I suspect he said something along the lines of
“Well if I’m not playing, why am I even here? I should be playing for a team that values my contributions instead” all while in the heat of the moment. That could easily be taken as “please, play me” or “please, trade me.”
Choosy Feebas choose Leopold Bloom nipples
Daring. Sensual. Invigorating. Squirrel.
BLOOM. For men.
If the eggs actually hatch I made more than a mistake, I made some scientifically impossible crime.
Could be.
But… it’s also not unheard of for players to backtrack after they’ve been “educated” on the stupidity of their actions or statements, too. Plausible deniability is SOP in MLB.
I've come to the conclusion that the two most important things in life are good friends and a good bullpen.
~Bob Lemon, 1981
If the Cards did shop Rasmus
Do they have an internal replacement for CF?
What would they be looking for in return? (SP, SS, etc.)
The monster at the end of this blog.
Jon Jay would become our CF, I imagine
He’s not a great option, but I guess he could do it. He’s playing way over his head at the moment, if you ask me.
I think Brendan Ryan is our SS for the time being, so we’re probably fairly set there. We lack long-time sure things at 2B, 3B, and RF. And, of course, we can always use pitching.
Hopefully we’re not shopping Raz, though.
another thing to keep in mind
Even if Rasmus is in the doghouse, the Cards won’t be selling low because there will be a LOT of bidders.
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2010/09/potential-trade-destinations-for-colby-rasmus.html
Why don't you make like a tree, and get out of here.
The Rays might be another possibility. Also Texas....basically anyone would want him.
I hate Bob Geren and his peanut brain so much -- lenscrafters
by WaddellCanseco on Sep 7, 2010 12:34 PM PDT up reply actions
(wet) Dream Team 2011:
LF: Crawford
1B: Barton
CF: Rasmus
DH: Cust
RF: Crisp
2B: Hudson
SS: Pennington
C: Suzuki
3B: Kouzmanoff
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
That's not a Wet Dream Team.
If you replace Suzuki with a Lando/Donaldson platoon, that’s a pretty attainable team. All it costs is money for Crawford and Hudson, and some combination of two or three prospects, Vin Mazzaro, and Kurt Suzuki.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Sep 7, 2010 2:46 PM PDT up reply actions
Us outbidding anyone for Colby Rasmus = wet dream.
I just remembered the Rays have a much deeper farm system than us and have Crawford coming off the books. They could get him a helluva lot easier than we could.
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
All is not lost however
This offense will win lots more games for us too:
LF: Crawford
1B: Barton
RF: Ordonez
DH: Cust
CF: Crisp
2B: Hudson
SS: Pennington
C: Suzuki
3B: Kouzmanoff
-Yeah, I just posted that, but my opinion is apparently "wrong" a significant portion of the time though, so take it as you will.
True, though odds are that lineup will only play 30 games together
Actually, I take that back. Combine the A’s training staff with Hudson, Ordonez and Crisp and you’re lucky if they all make it through spring training.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Who are you trading for Rasmus in that scenario?
I mean, the Cards have been running Felipe Lopez and Peter Happy out to third base for half the season because Freese had season ending surgery.
Perhaps Kouz could help sway them in a deal, and then we throw money at Beltre and Crawford this offseason, plus pick up Hudson for cheap.
Pam liked my old sig better.
I wouldn't trade Gio for Rasmus....
Why would we trade $12mil for $10mil? Silly PL78 :)
I’d trade Kouz+, or some minor leaguers, or Cahill.
Gio>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Cahill
We could build an all-malcontent OF………Beltran/Rasmus/Kemp………git er done Billy!
Is this the real life-
Is this just fantasy-
Caught in a landslide-
No escape from reality-
Gio is that much better than Cahill?
I respectfully disagree
Some late points
St Louis is not the type of team to “rebuild”. They have expensive, quality players like Pujols, Wainwright, Carpenter, Holliday all ready to contend next year. They have a loyal fan base that expects a decent, competitive team. They will not trade Rasmus for prospects only.
Pujols resigning/extension is beyond critical in St Louis and if keeping LaRussa is necessary to keep Pujols then that will be done in a heartbeat.
Rasmus will likely be moved for another major league part this winter – maybe someone like Kemp of the Dodgers. If the A’s want to be considered in the Rasmus bidding they will have to offer some MLB talent.
by kimo from kauai on Sep 8, 2010 11:35 AM PDT reply actions
I guess I may have missed something
but I saw a few people placing high value on Pennington in this thread and was wondering why. I know he’s a plus defender and has shown flashes of being a good hitter, but is there some statistical evidence that he’s a future stud?
SS is such a weak position throughout both leagues.
A's Fan in Sweden
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