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Around SBN: The MMA Hour Is Back

Just give him one more day

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I think it's to keep payroll costs down

Those extra few days of guys on split contracts not getting paid a major league salary adds up

www.zekeishungry.com

by thejd44 on May 1, 2010 3:17 PM PDT up reply actions  

So why don't Pittsburgh and Florida use that strategy?

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

by iglew on May 1, 2010 3:28 PM PDT up reply actions  

Moneyball, baby!

The new market inefficiency: Paying less money to AAAA players when someone gets hurt.

www.zekeishungry.com

by thejd44 on May 1, 2010 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

Not really

145 days at the league minimum salary is like $320,000. That’s peanuts…

Arthur Dent: You know, it's at times like this, when I'm trapped in a Vogon airlock with a man from Betelgeuse and about to die of asphyxiation in deep space, that I really wish I'd listened to what my mother told me when I was young.
Ford Prefect: Why, what did she tell you?
Arthur Dent: I don't know, I didn't listen!

by PaulThomas on May 1, 2010 4:17 PM PDT up reply actions  

I would kill to make that in 145 days.

SIG SPACE AVAILABLE FOR SPONSORSHIP. INQUIRE WITHIN.

by mikev on May 1, 2010 9:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

Become a hitman.

He steps to the left, he steps to the riiiiiiight. That Amos Roberts, he'll make you look shite!

by OldhamA on May 2, 2010 3:34 AM PDT up reply actions  

You're probably right

I’m just trying to find SOME logic behind it. They seem to be the only team that does it, and the process is really fucking stupid. I’d almost hope they just wanted to save a few hundred thousand dollars a year, because nothing else makes any damn sense at all.

www.zekeishungry.com

by thejd44 on May 3, 2010 4:39 PM PDT up reply actions  

Thanks for this.

It is nice to have some numbers to help think about what is, or is not, unique about the A’s experience.

A Ballade [for the Angels Fan], by Eustache Deschamps: "We are cowardly, ill-formed and weak / Aged, envious and evil-spoken. / I see only fools and sots / Truly the end is nigh / All goes ill."

by paris7 on May 1, 2010 3:11 PM PDT reply actions  

Very cool, elcroata.

I’ve always kinda wondered if any other teams deal with this same crap as we do.

The selfish, they're all standing in line, faithing and hoping to buy themselves time.
Me, I figure as each breath goes by, I only own my mind.

by danmerqury on May 1, 2010 3:18 PM PDT reply actions  

Only 9 DL trips, really?

Duke, Copeland, Devine, Chavez, Casilla, Ellis, Garciaparra, Buck, Giese, Sweeney, Outman, Giambi, Braden, and Crosby all had at least one DL trip last year. I’m not sure if Tomko ever went on the DL at the end of the year when he got hurt.

They definitely had more than 9 DL trips in 2009, and about half the guys listed there were on the 60-Day DL.

www.zekeishungry.com

by thejd44 on May 1, 2010 3:26 PM PDT reply actions  

Yeah, I don't mean to crap on elcroata's hard work here

But something, for some reason, is not quite right.

For what it’s worth, I could find no transaction for some of those guys going ON the DL, but found transactions for them coming off the DL. Perhaps that messed things up?

www.zekeishungry.com

by thejd44 on May 1, 2010 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

So they could be second or even first!

Wait that’s bad.

But baseball! Fuck yeah! -- lynnzgal

by WaddellCanseco on May 1, 2010 3:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

I believe we're second.

In a recent post I mentioned that we used the DL 70 times from 2007-2009, but I have to check where I found that. I spent a long time looking for the info that elcroata has posted.

I'm here to talk about the past.

by 67MARQUEZ on May 1, 2010 4:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

Thanks thejd44!

The number looked very low to me, too, but I was too tired to double check it. MLB changed the format in which they publish the transactions in April 2009 – I made two versions of parsers, but now I see it had some problems with it.

I will update the post with correct data, here is what 2009 looks like now:
player dlType date
Mark Ellis 15 Day 4/29/2009
Nomar Garciaparra 15 Day 4/29/2009
Vin Mazzaro 60 day 9/18/2009
Joey Devine 60 day 4/4/2009
Dallas Braden 15 Day 8/8/2009
Daric Barton 15 Day 7/27/2009
Jason Giambi 15 Day 7/20/2009
Bobby Crosby 15 Day 8/21/2009
Nomar Garciaparra 15 Day 5/27/2009
Ryan Sweeney 15 Day 6/8/2009
Dan Giese 15 Day 5/18/2009
Santiago Casilla 15 Day 5/2/2009
Eric Chavez 15 Day 5/1/2009
Josh Outman 15 Day 6/24/2009

These are the announced moves for placing people on the DL. Ben Copeland was announced as activated on May 5th. They never announced placing him on DL. Travis Buck does not appear in MLB transactions at all. Perhaps he was on a MiLB DL?

by elcroata on May 1, 2010 11:20 PM PDT up reply actions  

Also Duke missed all of 2009

And as he went on DL in August of 2008, I guessed they just kept him on the DL for the 2009.

by elcroata on May 2, 2010 12:03 AM PDT up reply actions  

There is no DL in the offseason.

By the way, I used espn.com’s team transactions page. I’m pretty sure that one had Buck coming off the DL but never going on.

www.zekeishungry.com

by thejd44 on May 2, 2010 8:10 AM PDT up reply actions  

Copeland was already on the minor league DL

in the Giants system. The A’s claimed him in the Rule 5 draft, and I’m not sure if that means he was on the Oakland DL, or still minor league. I remember hearing that there are special rules regarding injured players selected by Rule 5.

Then they activated him, didn’t give him a single at bat in the Majors, and gave him back to the Giants. Yay!! That made a lot of sense, right?

by colin on May 2, 2010 5:01 AM PDT up reply actions  

I wonder if there's a correlation between number of days spent "day-to-day" and re-occurrence of injuries.

You look at the teams who have suffered the least and how few “retroactive” days they had it maybe that’s because they simply DLed them and let them rest before the injuries became serious. Since they knew they’d be out 15 days, they rested and took it easy and slow instead of constantly trying to push the injured body part of choice every couple of days to see if it’s really hurt or not.

Ask me about my squirrel.

by DMOAS on May 1, 2010 3:56 PM PDT reply actions  

Nice post, elcroata.

I'm here to talk about the past.

by 67MARQUEZ on May 1, 2010 4:22 PM PDT reply actions  

Very good post.

I wonder if Billy el al have established this "wait and see " and “play short handed” as a policy or not. Blez: add this to your possible list of questions next time around with Billy.

by robertmelvin on May 1, 2010 6:55 PM PDT reply actions   1 recs

Yes, definitely.

That’s a great thing to ask Beane. He won’t answer it directly, of course, but he still would probably dance around it in a way that sheds some light on the whole situation

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

by iglew on May 2, 2010 12:21 AM PDT up reply actions  

BB Response

“At the end of the day, when you’re a small market club, you have to make decisions that other clubs don’t necessarily need to make. I don’t think we are doing anything different than most small market clubs…” blah, blah, blah (me) …. Anyways, it’s just been an unfortunate situation. Until we get a new facility, it will, in all honesty, be the same set of circumstances and obstacles we always need to push through".

The End.

by Colorado Fan on May 2, 2010 8:32 AM PDT up reply actions  

I would love to see the code you used

Is it Perl? I’ve been trying to get completely up to date on the edge of sabermetrics but I must say parsing data using something like Perl is by far my biggest weak point.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on May 2, 2010 12:03 AM PDT reply actions  

No Perl, actually script was not the correct word

I made a small C# application. It is not all that pretty, but you can of course have a look, if you are still interested – my mail is in the profile

by elcroata on May 2, 2010 12:07 AM PDT up reply actions  

My piano is missing a key,

so I made a C# application but it was denied.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on May 2, 2010 8:40 AM PDT up reply actions  

You have to submit a Db application.

Lots of red tape that way.

The selfish, they're all standing in line, faithing and hoping to buy themselves time.
Me, I figure as each breath goes by, I only own my mind.

by danmerqury on May 2, 2010 12:15 PM PDT up reply actions  

Milwaukee Brewers- Fewest Injuries

    There are many factors as to why players end up on the DL. Some of the reasons are what I call casualties of the game. Crisp’s fracture sliding into 2nd base had nothing to do with his shoulder injuries which I would classify as injuries that occur due to repetition which medical/training staffs should have a more control over. The most obvious examples of repetitive injuries involves shoulders and forearms, i.e. rotator cuff injuries and tendinitis respectively for pitchers. Please don’t bring up Duke, he’s an entirely different matter.

   Brett Anderson is an example of a pitcher who has a history of tendinitis in his forearm and as we saw in his performance against the Indians, his velocity and the sharpness on his curve/sliders was not there. The ability for the staff to act upon or anticipate a compromise of the structure / function of a player’ s body parts eg L forearm in this case is the greatest challenge.

   Perhaps, with Anderson just getting the big contract, he was reticent to admit anything and thereby stayed quiet hoping it would go away. We now as fans are in a position where we really don’t know how long his recovery will take. I will refrain from my input at this point.

   The reason I titled this the way I did is because I have interacted with some of the medical staff for Milwaukee recently at a conference I attended. The Brewers use of osteopathic physicians , trainers and surgeons was enlightening with regards to the frequency they are used during Spring Training and the season. While their lag time was 1.37 days which is middle of the road compared with other teams, they may have an advantage over other teams with the type of treatment they are providing.

    While no team can’t prevent the rare injuries that occur such as the one to Crisp (maybe blame Rickey for inspiring him to dive head first into 2nd) or the one to Barton who recently suffered a distal volar fracture (but hasn’t prevented him from playing). There are factors that have to be identified which may help prevent an “older” player such as Ellis and his hamstring from getting strained to the point of landing him on the DL.

   I truly can’t knock the A’s and criticize their current methods of identifying proclivities toward chronic injuries because I don’t have access to that information (nor would I share it if I did). But Bob Allejo recently described the system-wide process necessary at all levels of the organization that take a few years to implement which we are only in year 2 of since his return. We can only hope that the frequency of injuries decreases as the recognition of musculo-skeletal strain patterns depending upon which position a player plays, increases so that further injuries can be reduced.

"I've been accused of using too many words...I suppose that's like accusing Mozart of using too many notes." Bill King

by Gerard on May 2, 2010 8:11 AM PDT reply actions   4 recs

I love the drawing!

Particularly the lizard regrowing its tail.

It's the fans that make the game fun. -- Rickey Henderson, July 26, 2009.

by Englishmajor on May 2, 2010 10:49 AM PDT reply actions  

Thanks!

It will make my wife happy and my job easier next time I need her to put my ideas on paper in a way people can recognize what’s drawn.

by elcroata on May 2, 2010 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions  

She's got skills

Ask me about my squirrel.

by DMOAS on May 2, 2010 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah, the cartoon sums it all up perfectly...

I especially like the Larry Davis book on the shelf.

"The only way I'm going to get a Gold Glove is with a can of spray paint." - Reggie Jackson

by the_rozeboom on May 3, 2010 10:31 AM PDT up reply actions  

But why are Billy and Bob in Europe?

Note the telltale electrical outlet.

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.

by iglew on May 3, 2010 2:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

Football.

Ask me about my squirrel.

by DMOAS on May 3, 2010 4:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

Off to White Hart Lane...

"The only way I'm going to get a Gold Glove is with a can of spray paint." - Reggie Jackson

by the_rozeboom on May 4, 2010 8:37 AM PDT up reply actions  

I assumed

that it was because elcroata’s wife is Croatian.

by el generico on May 4, 2010 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

No, I'm Croatian, she's Spanish

and we both forgot about that detail :)

by elcroata on May 4, 2010 1:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

Bingo

My mistake. But that would explain the outlets!

by el generico on May 4, 2010 3:38 PM PDT reply actions  

Argh

reply fail. This was to elcroata.

by el generico on May 4, 2010 3:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

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