Spring Training News and baseballgirl's Attempt to Explain Options and Waivers
Update: Thought you guys might find this interesting:
3:00pm EST: A’s blogger Christy Hofmann of AthleticsNation.com stops by to chat about the A’s offseason moves, and to preview the 2010 season. Topics will include new additions Ben Sheets and Coco Crisp, how the club will look to contend against the Angels and much-improved Mariners, and much more.
Just for us this year, MLB Network is going to air five Athletics Spring Training games:
March 7 vs. Angels
March 25 vs. Giants
March 26 vs. Cubs
April 1/2 vs. Giants
It's like Christmas!
Be sure to read this ESPN article on Ben Sheets; it's a good one if you want to get a personal look at our new player.
I also have some pretty pictures for you.
And last, but not least, the quote of the offseason (fanpost here):
I'm not sure there's a team's fans I enjoy more than A's fans. There might not be very many of them, and particularly not very many of them who live in Oakland (the A's are unique in having a fanbase that's almost geographically free-floating), but, from my experience, they're among the most intelligent, passionate and zany in all of sports. I mean, they're making fanposts about sock puppets over there. I want to hire an A's fan to be my friend.
Up until this week's interesting discussion about Jake Fox being out of options, I have to admit that the phrase "out of options" didn't mean a whole lot to me. Basically I knew that it meant that the team couldn't send him down to AAA without having him clear waivers or somesuch, which means that if he's any good or could have value to another organization, they could take him away from the A's.
Don't get me wrong; unless this is a specialty of yours (and that does apply to several ANers who I hope will chime in), you (including me) won't understand the entire system. And with the incomplete records of Major League/Minor League transactions out there (as we found out this week), you might not be able to research this easily, even if you wanted to. Almost everyone I know, even those well-educated in baseball, waits to be told that player either has an option or is out of options before he/she starts calculating roster moves. I certainly do. And it wasn't until this week that I realized that I wouldn't know exactly what to look for if I was trying to figure out a player's status on my own.
So I did a little research (thanks to grover, Wikipedia, Baseball Prospectus, Susan Slusser, Rob Neyer, and the MLB Collective Bargaining Agreement):
When a player begins his career; i.e. he is drafted or signed, his "clock starts ticking". We've heard this expression a million times, but it means that after the player's first three professional seasons (in the minor league system), his team has to put him on the 40-man roster or he is subject to the Rule 5 draft, which allows teams to draft players from other minor league systems. However, if a team adds a Rule 5 player, they have to leave him on the 25-man roster all year, or give him back.
Note from Danny:
Players who are 18 or younger don’t have to be added to the 40 man roster until 5 years after they sign, and players 19 or older have to be added within 4 years after they sign. The latest CBA added an extra year for both groups.
As we all know, there are two rosters for each major league team: the 40-man and the 25-man. Once a player is put on the 40-man roster, a second clock starts to tick. The player is then said to be on "optional assignment"; his organization can shuffle him between the major league team and the minor league team at will. The 25-man roster is the active major league roster; every player on it can play in a major league game.
"Options" refers to the following: If a player is on the 40-man roster, but NOT the 25-man roster and has spent 20 or more days in the minor leagues (each season), (Note from Danny: If a player is on the 40 man roster but not on the 25 man roster, he’s on “optional assignment.” This can be in AA or any other minor league.) he is out of options and cannot be sent back to the minors without clearing waivers. This player can be brought up and down as many times as necessary during the three option years, and even if he never plays in a major league game, he still uses an option if he is on the 40-man roster for the season.
There is an exception to this rule, which I think Slusser was referring to in her Jake Fox update:
It would be nice if MLB just provided full information about option status every spring so we could avoid all this; I remember one spring telling Dan Meyer that he had a fourth option and how upset he was to learn that. He'd had no idea. Safe to say, that ruined his spring and probably a lot of his year. Options are one of the trickier bits of business around, which is why I usually just ask the experts.
As far as I can surmise, Dan Meyer and his agents knew that he had been on the 40-man roster for three seasons, and had spent the required 20 days down in the minors each year, but there is another clause they clearly didn't know: If a player has less than 5 years of professional experience, he may be optioned to the minors in a fourth season without having to clear waivers. So if you come up young, then you have a fourth option.
Note from slusser:
I think with Meyer it had something to do with injuries, which also can give teams another option year on a player.
Note from Nick:
...there’s an exception for rehab assignments — that is, a player coming off the DL can’t refuse to do a rehab assignment in the minors, and you can send a guy to the minors for a rehab assignment even if he’s out of options without exposing him to the waiver wire.
There are plenty of other quirks to the system, as well.
Even if a player has remaining options, he must be ineligible for free agency in order for the team to option him to the minors.
If the player has at least 5 years of major-league service, he cannot be sent to the minors without his consent.
Options are of particular importance to a team; allowing them more flexibility with the roster during the season.
As Nico pointed out in yesterday's thread, the Cubs seemingly burned an unnecessary option on Fox in 2007; after keeping him in the minors only 19 days (just one shy of burning an option), they moved him back down right before the rosters expanded, thus using the option.
Note from Danny:
If you want to talk about Oakland players who are out of options because the Cubs unnecessarily optioned them in 2007, you should be talking about Eric Patterson. Like Fox, Patterson was added to the 40 man roster during the season when he made his debut on the 25 man roster. Like Fox, he was optioned back down to the minors, but was then recalled before 20 days had passed. He was optioned down on August 14th and recalled on September 1. Patterson then showed up late to a practice, and the Cubs optioned him back down to AA on September 3. They could have just let him rot on the extended September bench, but they burned his option to “send a message” or something.
With me so far? What else am I missing?
Things get particularly sticky once waivers are introduced. BP quotes DePodesta:
Waivers are the single most complicated rule in baseball, even more complicated than the balk rule. Even the people in the front office don't know all the waiver rules. "You know the rules you've come up against, but there may be other things that you don't know about until you have to deal with them," says DePodesta. "We know about 90% of the rules, but we call the Commissioner's Office to get rulings on things we don't know about."
So what does happen when a player is out of options?
To avoid a player being stuck in the minors forever, the waiver system was put in place. The team must keep a player who is out of options on the 25-man (active) roster, or he has to "clear waivers". This type of waiver is called the "outright waiver". This means that any other team can claim him and the previous team loses him (irrevocable). If no one claims the player (this always makes me sad, like he's friendless), he has said to have "cleared waivers" and can now be taken off the 40-man and put in the minors. This is called "outrighting" and can only be done once without the player's permission.
From BP:
The other type of waivers, major league waivers, are the kind you usually hear about around the July 31st trading deadline. Many teams put a large number of players on waivers near the deadline in order to clear room on the 40-man roster and give themselves more flexibility when it comes to making last-minute trades. If a player clears these waivers, his team can then trade him or outright him. Unlike outright waivers, major league waivers are revocable--if a player is claimed, his team has the option of "pulling him back" and not losing the player. If this happens, though, the player cannot be traded or sent to the minors for the duration of the waiver period.
Along the same theme, what happens if you want to get rid of someone on the 40-man? This is the infamous DFA option, "Designated for assignment". The player is removed from the 40-man and the team has ten days to decide what to do with the player; trade, outright release, or put on waivers.
Anything to add? Does this help? On a scale of 1-10, how excited are you for baseball games?!
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Some quibbles
When a player begins his career; i.e. he is drafted or signed, his “clock starts ticking”. We’ve heard this expression a million times, but it means that after the player’s first three professional seasons (in the minor league system), his team has to put him on the 40-man roster or he is subject to the Rule 5 draft,
Players who are 18 or younger don’t have to be added to the 40 man roster until 5 years after they sign, and players 19 or older have to be added within 4 years after they sign. The latest CBA added an extra year for both groups.
If a player is on the 40-man roster, but NOT the 25-man roster and has spent 20 or more days in AAA (each season), he is out of options and cannot be sent back to the minors without clearing waivers
It doesn’t have to be AAA. If a player is on the 40 man roster but not on the 25 man roster, he’s on “optional assignment.” This can be in AA or any other minor league.
There’s an exception for rehab assignments.
As Nico pointed out in yesterday’s thread, the Cubs seemingly burned an unnecessary option on Fox in 2007; after keeping him in the minors only 19 days (just one shy of burning an option), they moved him back down right before the rosters expanded, thus using the option.
It wasn’t really unnecessary. They traded for Craig Monroe, and they had to add him to the roster before September to make him eligible for the postseason. They ended up leaving him off the playoff roster, but that was the idea at the time.
If you want to talk about Oakland players who are out of options because the Cubs unnecessarily optioned them in 2007, you should be talking about Eric Patterson. Like Fox, Patterson was added to the 40 man roster during the season when he made his debut on the 25 man roster. Like Fox, he was optioned back down to the minors, but was then recalled before 20 days had passed. He was optioned down on August 14th and recalled on September 1. Patterson then showed up late to a practice, and the Cubs optioned him back down to AA on September 3. They could have just let him rot on the extended September bench, but they burned his option to “send a message” or something.
Wow, thanks Danny...this is exactly what I wanted. :-)
I was wondering about the age of the players; 3 years didn’t seem like a long time for the 18 year olds.
Excellent…I’ll add the changes in.
And…wow! I had no idea about Patterson!
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 9:30 AM PST up reply actions
BBG OMG
"I have to admit that the phrase “out of options” didn’t mean a whole lot to me. " Didn’t you just get engaged? I hope your soon to be husband does not read AN!!
Beane's World!! Excellent!!! Rock On, Beane! Rock On, Geren!
I did just get engaged!
And he does…haha, he’s a regular poster. :-)
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 9:43 AM PST up reply actions
Regular is a bit strong.
Bring back Hammer.
by OaktownPower on Feb 26, 2010 2:05 PM PST up reply actions
Hi ;-)
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 2:07 PM PST up reply actions
Yes, Chavvy does indeed look very svelt in that photo...
Let’s try to remember him while he still has all of his body parts!
"By the end of the year, I'll have Dallas throwing right-handed'' -Ben Sheets
Agreed!
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 9:31 AM PST up reply actions
Svelt. Mmm.
The funny thing about baseball is that people will believe what they want to believe. -Joe Posnanski 8/29/09
Yum, indeed
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 11:42 AM PST up reply actions
January 2010. All year round.
The funny thing about baseball is that people will believe what they want to believe. -Joe Posnanski 8/29/09
Haha...poor February 2010.
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 12:50 PM PST up reply actions
What's with the big hole in his shirt on the left side, there?
The A’s can’t afford to buy him a new shirt?
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Can't he afford his own damn shirt?
What happened to the $66 million!?!
by andyinfremont on Feb 26, 2010 1:18 PM PST up reply actions
No kidding.
But you have to give him props for being in such great physical shape, especially for a guy who hasn’t played in three years. I hope the guy still wants to play, more so since this is a “contract year”.
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
I think he's always wanted to play...
…maybe too much in fact (to the extent that he’s made some injuries worse). The guy deserves a healthy season; let’s hope he actually gets it.
by andyinfremont on Feb 26, 2010 1:36 PM PST up reply actions
Agreed.
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 2:12 PM PST up reply actions
he looks like a Spanish Conquistador!
Or, “Hello! My name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father. Prepare to die!”
You have to include smiley faces - Poppy
;- ) :- ) :-O : -> : -] : -}
Wait for it...wait for it...
(waiting for someone to pull out the old Chavez jokes ;-))
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 11:42 AM PST up reply actions
This is AN, we don't recycle jokes......
oh yeah, he isn’t Mexican enough by the way
by theblackpearl on Feb 26, 2010 12:22 PM PST up reply actions
THANKS!
I love that you got the set up ;-)
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 12:49 PM PST up reply actions
I think with Meyer
it had something to do with injuries, which also can give teams another option year on a player. (I’ll try to check on that later.) I feel like I need a cheat sheet every year to try to catch all the options possibilities, so this will be a helpful thread. :)
It's crazy hard to understand...there are SO many little "but in this case"s
Thanks!
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 9:31 AM PST up reply actions
Hey Susan!
If you have time in your busy schedule, can you ask Chavvy how he’s coming along for all of us? And tell him we love him and we’re all pulling for him to come back and kick some ass! Thank you! :)
"By the end of the year, I'll have Dallas throwing right-handed'' -Ben Sheets
"Chavez to 15-day DL With Sprained Toe After Delivering Ass-Kicking on Behalf of Mrod"
Said the A’s erstwhile 3rd-baseman, “I have no regrets. The Rev deserved it.”
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Nice! I'm LMFAO Nick!
:)
"By the end of the year, I'll have Dallas throwing right-handed'' -Ben Sheets
That was awesome!
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 10:05 AM PST up reply actions
And if you do talk to Chavvy,
can someone please get a definitive answer on whether his daughter is “Dulce” or “Dolce”?
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Yeah, it's the same rule
If a player has fewer than 5 professional seasons, he’s eligible for a 4th option year. A professional season is defined by having spent 90+ days on an active roster, which is the deadline Meyer fell just short of in 2006.
One quick note on time in the minors
is that there’s an exception for rehab assignments — that is, a player coming off the DL can’t refuse to do a rehab assignment in the minors, and you can send a guy to the minors for a rehab assignment even if he’s out of options without exposing him to the waiver wire.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Your note has been added...
…thanks! I’m learning a ton.
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 10:08 AM PST up reply actions
Someone else probably knows all the details about how long a rehab assignment can be, because I know there's some kind of limit
And congrats on the hotstove appearance! Is that a text chat or a webtv thing?
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
They're calling me, so it's over the phone, not chat.
I think just radio?
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 10:48 AM PST up reply actions
That was very cool BBG!
Except the guys don’t know how to pronounce the name of my favorite A’s player. And the one guy sounded almost exactly like Woody Allen which was really funny……who knew?

"By the end of the year, I'll have Dallas throwing right-handed'' -Ben Sheets
I haven't seen any rules
but I recall that players have been kept on “rehab” seemingly long after they should be healthy enough to be activated.
I believe it's 20 or 30 days
www.zekeishungry.com
by thejd44 on Feb 26, 2010 12:55 PM PST up reply actions
It's both
A club may send a player on the DL to the minor leagues for a rehab assignment lasting a maximum of 20 days for position players and 30 days for pitchers.
by andyinfremont on Feb 26, 2010 1:33 PM PST up reply actions
Chavez is doing great, he'll be happy you asked
So I looked up Meyer’s fourth option story in the SFGate archives, and it was only two springs ago! Man, it seems like it was ages ago. I’ve clearly been doing this too long.
Here’s what I wrote then:
The A’s have optioned Meyer three times, in 2005, 2006 and 2007, but in 2006, Meyer didn’t play enough at Triple-A Sacramento for that season to qualify – 90 days is needed, and a shoulder injury forced Meyer out of action in late May. He had surgery in July, ending his year, and the timing of that procedure robbed him of an option year, according to Meyer.
Poor guy, gets hurt and then loses an option as a result. Although I can see the flip side, too…..team loses an injured guy and then loses him because the options run out? That would equally stink.
I love the self-editing.
“That would equally [stink]”, she said.
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Disagree, in part, with the Will Leitch/Deadspin article you quote
It stands to reason, then, that the team you’re watching right now, the one with the green uniforms and tarp on the upper deck that makes it so much harder to get stoned there, it will someday cease to exist. Unless they’re the Raiders, no team keeps the same identity when they move. There’s no crossover between Thunder fans and NOOCH fans. The Ravens just pretend their time in Cleveland never happened. Most people I meet in Arizona don’t even know the Buzzsaw lived in St. Louis at all. (To be fair, neither do most people I meet in St. Louis.) When a team moves, they not only break their fans’ hearts, which is bad for them, they erase a part of our history, which is bad for all of us.
In fact, some teams that move keep their identity; some lose it. Certainly the Giants and the Dodgers had a real sense of continuity (there are still a handful of New Yorkers who root for each of them). Teams that change their names (Twins, Rangers, Brewers, Thunder, Ravens, Nationals, Clippers) almost certainly have less continuity than teams that don’t. The football Cardinals never had much identity in the first place (Leitch doesn’t even mention Chicago).
Despite Finley’s substantial rebranding of the A’s, I think A’s fans do feel some continuity with the team’s distant Philly and KC past. I very much doubt that this team will change its nickname if and when it moves. The Athletics are a durable AL brand that has no inherent connection to its current home (not that such a connection stopped the Lakers or the Jazz from keeping their nicknames). Certainly an intra-Bay Area move won’t be a vast identity changer. A move somewhere else is a bit more dicey. But I still think a green-and-gold-wearing Portland Athletics squad would retain the loyalty of us NRAFs…and probably many of the new Bay Area NRAFs, too. What else would they do? Root for the Giants?
There is no "i" in Teamocil. At least not where you'd think.
by GreenNGoldSooner on Feb 26, 2010 10:42 AM PST reply actions
Also: the Betrayal Factor
Teams whose old fans feel betrayed by the move are less likely to follow the team after it moves. This is certainly the case with Sonics fans and the Thunder, as well as with Baltimore Colts fans (though I think Indy fans feel a sense of franchise continuity despite this). Partial exceptions to this rule seem to exist in the case of the Raiders and the Dodgers.
I think A’s fans are pretty accepting of the fact that the team will be leaving Oakland (not that we all like it), so at least an intra-Bay Area move won’t result in any sense of betrayal. Whether fans ever forgive Jerry Brown is another issue.
There is no "i" in Teamocil. At least not where you'd think.
by GreenNGoldSooner on Feb 26, 2010 11:01 AM PST up reply actions
actually, many A's fans are turned off by the constant threat to move the team
I know many fans who used to attend regularly but have stopped because they feel like the team has already left them. There are of course fans who accept the A’s leaving as a “done deal” regardless of if and when it happens or to where; believe it or not, some still hold out hope that some combination of factors will work out to keep the A’s in Oakland. In either case, I think the “sense of betrayal” is already there.
They never should have left Philadelphia in the first place.
"The rich people want what the poor peoples got, and the poor people want what the rich peoples got. You can never please anybody in this world"- The Shaggs, "Philosophy Of The World," 1968
by Gaijin_Suketto on Feb 26, 2010 11:16 AM PST up reply actions
Oddly, if fans would actually go to games they might actually not move.
Well, it might be too late now. But a sure way for the team to leave is to not show up.
www.zekeishungry.com
by thejd44 on Feb 26, 2010 1:02 PM PST up reply actions
Fans Don't show up because we've been living under the threat of relocation since Schott/Hoffmann bought the team
Ownership has never tried to lure the fans in and show that it is willing to spend to be a consistent winner. Ever since Haas sold the team it has been clear that ownership has wanted to move out and has seemed to do everything it could to create a good excuse to move — insult and disrespect the fans, attendance goes down, and then they can say they have to leave because there are no fans. Little problem with cause and effect with that. It’s amazing that so many do not get that, despite what Wolff repeatedly says publicly.
I holding out hope for Dubuque, Iowa
Iowa doesn’t have any major league teams, we would have a close drive to games in Chicago, Minnesota, Kansas City and not-so-bad commuter hops to Detroit and Cleveland, and we could actually play just a few miles west at the Field of Dreams in Dyersville.
I think attendance would be about the same, too.
by BoyHowdee on Feb 26, 2010 5:51 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
"I think the "sense of betrayal" is already there."
SoSneaKyrU is weeping somewhere while trying not to be shot at or mugged….
too soon?
"By the end of the year, I'll have Dallas throwing right-handed'' -Ben Sheets
Ask a Laker fan to point out the lake they were named after.
“No its not the one in Echo park, buddy”
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - danmerqury
for lack of looking like a complete basketball ignoramous
which lake is the Lakers named after?
by rollierollieOxenfree on Feb 26, 2010 8:24 PM PST up reply actions
Psst
They used to be in Minnesota. . . pass it on.
by el generico on Feb 26, 2010 11:21 PM PST up reply actions
pfft!
Yeah, right!
And Grizzly Adams had a beard!
sock puppets have never successfully defended castles. -nm
by Leopold Bloom on Feb 26, 2010 11:56 PM PST up reply actions
Abigail?
My impression was that Abigail would not have been a very good beard, she was quite the randy First Lady. Or maybe I just watched the “1776” musical too many times. . .
Saltpeter!
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Look at it this way
the last time there was any actual Jazz in Utah was a Lawrence Welk concert…so one cannot have everything.
I'll have a sandwich and a draft(sic). - Bill King (RIP)
Miles Davis is turning in his grave somewhere
Jazz? In Utah?…….oy!
"By the end of the year, I'll have Dallas throwing right-handed'' -Ben Sheets
It was a very nice comment about the A's fans
But other parts of the article totally turned me off. To me, Leitch comes across as a smart-ass who assumes it is a given that the A’s will move out of Oakland and maybe even out of CA — the more people state this as the reality, the more “acceptable” it will be. I know many will strongly disagree with me — that is one of the saddest things about this whole stadium issue — it pits A’s fans against A’s fans.
I think it's a given that the A's are moving out of Oakland in the near future
I think most people who don’t live in Oakland think that. I also don’t think me believing it’s a given has anything to do with whether it actually happens. And why isn’t it acceptable? The A’s will likely be a better team/organization with a new stadium (which almost certainly won’t be in Oakland).
www.zekeishungry.com
by thejd44 on Feb 26, 2010 1:04 PM PST up reply actions
When you say the A's will likely
be a better team/organization with a new stadium, what do you mean by “better”? More profitable company? Better win/loss record? More popular with fans?
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Yeah, like Pittsburgh, San Diego,and other teams with new stadiums
They are certainly not good teams. It’s a myth that a new stadium will necessarily result in a better team. It will increase revenues, at least for the first several years, but there is no guarantee that they will use that money to sign our good players to long-term contracts. I actually do support a new stadium since it will be exciting from a fans’ perspective, but I am not under the delusion that the owners will vastly improve the team if it happens. And it should be in Oakland, which is in the center of the Bay Area and most accessible to the most fans.
Thanks Baseball Girl
I’m bookmarking this page. A bunch of us have a round-robin e-mail exchange that occurs during the off-season and during the season. Now we have a reference page.
I’m still trying to figure out how a front office such as the A’s, working with player salaries and multi-million dollar budgets, makes trades without ensuring they fully understand the option status of the player they’re trading for. I mean, given that there are incredibly complex sabermetric formulas designed to assess a player’s true capabilities, one would think a team would have a simple spreadsheet available with a complete run-down of any given players’ time in the major and minor leagues, with an easy algorithm to determine that player’s option status. These kinds of mistakes should not be happening in this day and age.
I think that's true
although in this case Slusser has said that she thinks that the problem was someone mistakenly telling her that Fox had an option left, when the front office actually knew that he didn’t. That does lead to the question of why no one bothered to correct the mistake for a couple of months, though.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
I'm just guessing
but I bet Billy Beane and David Forst knew exactly what status Fox had.
Or could it be...
that only fans of franchises like the A’s even care about options? Do Yankee’s or Red Sox fans even know such things exist?
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
My guess would be yes
How many options does Phil Hughes have, or Joba Chamberlain? These are big questions.
It's possible the Yankees have a similar number of "core" fans
(though, obviously, not as cool or smart as us…), but there are so many more non-core fans that the average Yankee fan doesn’t know or care about those kinds of questions.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
the cubs front office doesn't know options exist.
apparently.
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - danmerqury
yes, thank you Ms. Hofmann
BTW, are you related to Trevor (former PAdres closer)?
I learned alot from all of this, akin to pages of dungeons and dragons texts or law school books.
Thank you,
Another A’s fan (and fan of “the rules”)
by rollierollieOxenfree on Feb 26, 2010 8:25 PM PST up reply actions
BBG IS ON THE PHONE
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
Oops -- they asked her about Desme as a prospect!
Evidently they don’t subscribe to Commonweal.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
I laughed...
…good thing I knew that!
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 12:33 PM PST up reply actions
Is Tomko even on the team!?!?!?!?
I honestly don’t know!
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 12:33 PM PST up reply actions
You should have had me on Instant Messenger to feed you answers.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
NO joke...I was like...where the hell did Tomko come from
I wasn’t actually sure he was still in the organization.
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 12:49 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah, where did THAT come from?
I know he won some games in September, but he’s a journeyman coming off arm surgery.
I didn’t hear the whole interview — did they ask about Outman or Cardenas?
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Neither.
Honestly, the only thing I couldn’t answer is if Tomko was a factor. Well, I guess I DID answer that, I said he’s not in the A’s plans.
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 12:48 PM PST up reply actions
Those guys didn't seem to know too much
For having their own web show. I think a lot of us know more about other teams.
And Tomko is not on anyone’s team I don’t think. Should be a FA.
Nice article!
Note that most of the information on options can be found in the CBA rules here.
Bookmarked...thanks so much!
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 26, 2010 2:08 PM PST up reply actions
Awesome job, Christy!
I really enjoyed listening. You’re a natural! And I LMAO when they screwed up on Desme. Somebody clearly didn’t do his homework. After you finished, they were doing mea culpas all over the place.
Losing this team would be a huge failure for this city and an affront to Oakland’s great sports legacy.
So is Desme!
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
ok
Just listened, BBG.
1. You’re a superstar. You did AWESOME.
2. Those guys…it’s nice they had you on, but, among other things, “A’s fans are sooo patient…” Um, we were in the ALCS three seasons ago.
sock puppets have never successfully defended castles. -nm
Nice job BBG
I can’t give you awesome status ‘cause you didn’t tell those two that Desme was on a mission from God.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Father Desme Is Displeased.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
I ALMOST said He was drafted by God
but then I thought…oh crap, does that sound like he died?
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 27, 2010 12:34 PM PST up reply actions
and thanks!
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Feb 27, 2010 12:34 PM PST up reply actions
These guys support that statement grover...

"By the end of the year, I'll have Dallas throwing right-handed'' -Ben Sheets
Chavy is looking good
he has a Benjamin Bratt kinda thing going on there.
I'll have a sandwich and a draft(sic). - Bill King (RIP)
HotStove.com
I knew I would pay the price for the Grant Desme gaffe I booted. Sorry about that A’s fans. We had a lot of fun with Christy on the call and we look forward to having her on again. Thanks for not making fun of Tom and I too much! We’ll keep working hard to make things better. It’s not as easy as it looks, especially when you’re covering 30 different major league teams. But it’s a ball covering the game we love. Good luck to the A’s team and fans this year, and be sure to look for announcements on when Christy will be coming on again! She was great!
Paul Rubillo
HotStove.com
Co-founder and Woody Allen sound-a-like! LOL!
Actually, I think the Tomko gaffe was worse
(He’s a free agent, not a member of the A’s organization!)
You guys lucked out that I was unavailable. Baseballgirl is excellent, p-plus she ddddoesn’t have the st-st-stttt-stutter that I d—d—d—do.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
That's so awesome Paul!
I really enjoyed the interview and it’s great that you have such a good sense of humor.
Rock on!
Martin’ Rodriguez
MRod
“General Shit Disturber…!”
:)
"By the end of the year, I'll have Dallas throwing right-handed'' -Ben Sheets
My other favorite gaffe
was “Dirk-shner”
Just call him “Duke” and you’ll always be safe.
"By the end of the year, I'll have Dallas throwing right-handed'' -Ben Sheets
Well, "Dorke"
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

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