We Wish You A Merry A's Christmas: One Like Every Other
by Tyler Bleszinski on Dec 9, 2010 7:01 AM PST
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PrintIt's status quo this holiday season with the Red Sox signing Carl Crawford to a seven-year, $142 million contract and the Yankees likely to go above and beyond to sign Cliff Lee. And the A's likely once again shopping in those bargain bins at the front of the Target stores. Someone get that Christmas Shoes kid on the line so this year isn't a complete disaster.
I'm frustrated simply because I truly feel like the team from Oakland is really close to being among the elite teams in the AL. And I don't think that Hideki Matsui is that player that will put the A's over the top. Yes he's a nice complementary piece if you have other players around him but he's not the thunder in the middle of a lineup you need. Despite his Godzilla nickname he's not the one who is going run over Tokyo for you anymore.
And let's face it, Adrian Beltre is going to wind up with the Angels. Despite all that superagent Scott Boras claims,Beltre was always using Oakland to jack up other offers from destinations he wanted to go to, places like Boston and now Anaheim (since the guy already owns a home down here). Angels owner and fine mustache connoisseurArte Moreno also isn't a big fan of missing out on something he prizes so expect him to come to Beltre personally with a big, fat check in hand and Boras will have once again been the mastermind of getting his player exactly what he wants.
The A's choices are now limited. You could go with Vlad Guerrero, which I personally really like even if I'm worried that his stats were better because of the hitter's haven in Arlington, but he seems to really want to go back to Texas. Or possibly even the Angels if they somehow miss out on Beltre.
It's an interesting dynamic going on in the AL West, with the four teams essentially playing trade a DH. Matsui, who was with the Angels last year, is rumored to be coming to the A's. Guerrero is also rumored to possibly be coming to the A's, Angels or Rangers. And our boy Jack Cust wound up signing with the Mariners earlier today. It's like the teams in the AL West have fallen so in love with each other's designated hitters that they can't look anywhere else. Not towards Manny Ramirez or Jim Thome or Adam Dunn (despite his claiming he wouldn't DH the White Soxconvinced him to do just that with bucketloads of cash).
I was pretty excited heading into this offseason and I suppose there is time to salvage things still but it once again looks like the A's will be left with the scraps of the free agent period. If you forgive the analogy, we're once again getting the Gobots for Christmas instead of that Transformer we put on our list because Mom and Dad weren't willing to get trampled by the mob to get it. At the same time, we can't blame Mom and Dad for valuing their safety or in this case, the A's for losing out on players going for $140 million plus.
And just like when we miss out on that favorite toy, we're going to love Mom and Dad any way. Even when we're stuck grudgingly playing with that lame Gobot for the rest of 2011.
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if they are healthier than in recent years they will certainly do better
even in the worst of the years since 2006 the fewest games they’ve won is 76….and they have a better rotation now.
OK, 76 it is!
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 8:41 AM PST up reply actions
Put me down for 88-74 and the division title.
Then, let the pitching dominate. Lather, rinse, repeat.
"Burt Reynolds witnessed the conception of his own dad, and frankly, that's what's wrong with him."- TPDMTD!
by Gaijin_Suketto on Dec 9, 2010 11:32 AM PST up reply actions
Too bad the A's don't actually have "dominating" pitching, or anything close to it
The only playoff team with a worse rotation last season was the Cincinnati “NL Central Affirmative Action Babies” Reds.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
by PaulThomas on Dec 9, 2010 11:43 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Brett Anderson, Gio Gonzalez and Dallas Braden
Are a really good 1-2-3, I do not agree with your assessment. They can, at times, indeed dominate.
Soon to be followed with a signing of Brandon McCarthy...
….when does Billy sign this beanpole and tell us how he will bounce back this year?
by three team parlay on Dec 9, 2010 4:37 PM PST up reply actions
What about him?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:33 PM PST up reply actions
And I imagine there's no countries.
Nothing to kill or die for…a brotherhood of man, you might say.
However, there will always be nation-states, and Trevor Cahill is not a #2 starter, no matter how much you and I might wish otherwise. Check out tRA and FIP for more on why that is.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:09 AM PST up reply actions
You can credit the defense all you want
There’s still a definite art to being able to pitch to contact and get players to ground out as opposed to constantly knock double after double.
Clearly Anderson has the best ‘stuff’, and I like Gio but Cahill has performed and you can’t understate that.
Oh and his sinker is nasty. Try hitting that and you’ll ground to kouz too ;)
by tafkasam on Dec 10, 2010 9:13 AM PST up reply actions 2 recs
None of this appears provable, though.
You can say you like him all you want; I like him too, and I want nothing more than to see the guy throw 32 perfect games in 2011, but there’s a difference between feeling and fact.
Pitching to contact is dangerous, because even with a great defense, balls will get through. The thing that always bugs me is that the same people who credit Cahill with “pitching to contact” (contact=bad for the hitter) are the people who get mad at Cust for not being a contact hitter (contact=good for the hitter.) I’m not trying to troll a Cust debate, just pointing out one of the typical problems with the more emotional/gut-based form of evaluation: it’s inconsistent, and all that’s really being said is that you like or dislike a player, for less than rational reasons.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:25 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
if paulthomas were here, he'd simply ask...if his sinker is so nasty why does it get hit at all? it doesn't have an unusual swing and miss rate. if the ball gets hit, there is defense and luck.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
by stm72 on Dec 10, 2010 2:27 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Brett Anderson gets grounders and pitches to contact too
He’s got a higher GB rate than Cahill and a lower walk rate.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
by PaulThomas on Dec 10, 2010 2:36 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Does he get Wins though?
Because real pitchers get Wins. You want to find out how good a pitcher is, look at his Wins. Because that’s the name of the game – winning.
It’s the only thing you need to look at. And Cahill does it.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 3:45 PM PST up reply actions
Good point.
I think, too, that getting a bunch of wins is also predictive, so that you can be sure a pitcher with a lot of wins will pretty much get those wins the next year, too.
Your poem here.
Wily Inchoate Nasty Spit
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 5:16 PM PST up reply actions
Whispered Infidelity Never Secret
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 11, 2010 11:38 PM PST up reply actions
Roy Halladay, is that you?
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 10, 2010 6:29 PM PST up reply actions
{pssst: sarcasm}
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Then, let the pitching dominate. Lather, rinse, repeat.
He seems to be talking about playoff performance here. He could say “Then, let the total team run prevention dominate” but it’s reasonable to use the more common baseball terminology for what he means. Not exactly technically accurate, but we all know he means: get into the playoffs, get on a hotstreak in preventing runs (no matter who actually gets credit), and get enough offense to win.
Maybe
I thought the BPro study on “beating” the playoff crapshoot talked primarily about ace pitching, but they did seem to find a correlation with fielding well, too, so perhaps it really is “overall run prevention” that’s the better playoff strategy.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Nate Silver's secret sauce formula only found three things:
Rotation K rate, a strong closer, a strong defense.
Ah ok
I didn’t know much about either of these studies. I really enjoy this part of AN. I’m going to do some googling, but would love any links you might have.
Nate Silver apparently didn’t account for managers who don’t play their strong closers….cough…Wash….cough
I love those kind of studies.
He just threw a bunch of playoff teams in a giant pot and looked for what rose up to the surface.
The one I'm looking at is in a book, Baseball Between the Numbers
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
You could look into Mathletics
It’s not great with baseball stats (not terrible either) but it’s a great introduction to other sports.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
It's a little dated at this point, certainly, but the writing is pretty standout
and it’s got the best clutch-hitting study of the ones I’ve seen. Also some nice data on the monetary value (as opposed to the free agent price) of winning a baseball game and making the playoffs.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I've used it a number of times when I've talked about the problems that the A's have
in cost-justifying large free agent contracts.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Yes and you're still wrong most of the time on that topic
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 6:09 AM PST up reply actions
The problem with that view is that not everyone thinks sports teams should be purely business-oriented.
Teams have fans. And fans want to see their teams win. And ideally, owners would be fans of their teams. So a team might make less money by not choosing to monetize wins and deciding to pay more per win than the win was actually worth, but the team might also perform better, which would be nice for the fans.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:11 AM PST up reply actions
and it might raise franchise value...
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 3:46 PM PST up reply actions
what is this "book" you speak of?
Thanks for the info, I think I’ve heard of that one. I’ll have to take a look at that one.
The Bible, silly
Check out the passage about Sodom and wOBA.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Ohhh, so Bill James is King James? That's why all the love for him.
He is a good translator. I get it now.
Bill James doesn't get much love from the real stats crowd
I mean they all acknowledge his historical contributions but he really hasn’t been a relevant figure for several years.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 9:15 AM PST up reply actions
when I was at my parents house over thanksgiving
I was poking though my brothers copies of the 83 and 84 Bill James Abstract, and there are some really goofy things in there, like garbage about team winning streaks and such.
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
yeah he started the movement but really isn't in the same league as people like Tango and MGL
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 12:18 PM PST up reply actions
What did he say about team winning streaks?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:26 PM PST up reply actions
he was trying to show that the brewers had a problem
because they only won 2 of 6 on the road or something. I probably should have taken them back with me to read more.
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
Clearly not gamers.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:53 PM PST up reply actions
I wrote something similar on here a few weeks ago and was taken to task, but it's true.
He helped the movement make gigantic strides…but he not currently the leader in the field.
Someone cited his 2011 projections for Berkman, and I was dismissive and then I was taken to task. But his projections for hitters are overly optimistic every year, and still they do not get revised.
So I would never cite something as good data that everyone generally acknowledges is perpetually optimistic.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 3:50 PM PST up reply actions
To be fair he doesn't do the projections. In other news I agree with everything else you said.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 10:02 PM PST up reply actions
That's like saying it isn't Thomas Kinkade's fault that all his paintings suck
because he doesn’t actually paint them.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 11, 2010 11:39 PM PST up reply actions
"The Book" is a different book, written by Tom Tango, MGL, and Andy Dolphin
all of whom have at some point, I think, worked in the stats departments for MLB franchises.
BBTN is a Baseball Prospectus item; you probably know the cast of characters there by now.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Trade Cahill. Bailey and Ziegler for prospects. Hope Anderson stays healthy for 1/2 year and do the same in July
Build around Gio, Braden, Carter, Green, Barton and Choice. Trade Taylor for Beltran and cash and hope Carlos becomes tradeworthy in July. Sign Matsui and trade him in July.
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
i suspect this crowd will hate whomever the manager is
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
by stm72 on Dec 9, 2010 9:01 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I didn't hate LaRussa
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 9:03 AM PST up reply actions
That guy that bats his pitchers 8th?
What is with the TLR love?
A's Fan in Sweden
"Some of us know him as the a-hole who piled into Ray Fosse in an All-Star game (it's why Ray is the way he is folks)" - OptimistPrime
I like that he bats pitchers 8th
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 6:10 AM PST up reply actions
I think it's very typical TLR.
Overmanaging just to overmanage. And eventually, it hurts his team.
A's Fan in Sweden
"Some of us know him as the a-hole who piled into Ray Fosse in an All-Star game (it's why Ray is the way he is folks)" - OptimistPrime
In what way does that particular thing hurt his team?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:43 AM PST up reply actions
He makes substitutions all the time, taking his best players out of the game.
There was the whole Rasmus thing, although I’ll be honest and say I don’t remember the details. And the DUI thing on top just makes me not like the guy as a manager.
A's Fan in Sweden
"Some of us know him as the a-hole who piled into Ray Fosse in an All-Star game (it's why Ray is the way he is folks)" - OptimistPrime
Lots of people get DUIs.
And lots more people probably should have gotten a DUI once or twice. Doesn’t make him a bad guy or a bad manager.
But I’m just wondering how the pitcher in the 8-hole, specifically, makes the team worse.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:27 PM PST up reply actions
IIRC, isn't that like a little stat-guy fantasy?
I can’t remember the whole reasoning behind it (separating the poor hitting pitcher from the best part of the lineup makes some sense, but I’m just projecting), but I think it’s something generally thought of as forward thinking lineup management.
A full time A's fan in Portland who spends part of his time on AN.
Not so much tweeting as squawking: http://www.twitter.com/yusebio
I think there's a lot of difference of opinion about it.
Sometimes it works really well, sometimes it doesn’t. I think it makes sense to do it either way, largely based on whether you hit McGwire 3rd or 4th.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:54 PM PST up reply actions
It only works if the hitter we're talking about is abysmally bad.
Like your average pitcher. In that case, it actually works out to a net positive. Even though you’re giving him more PAs in the 8 spot, you’re helping the leadoff guy when the lineup goes around.
But it doesn’t work when he’s only a little worse than your 8th best hitter.
Why doesn't anyone bat the pitcher spot first on the road...
and burn a pinch-hitter with the opening hitter of the game?
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 3:57 PM PST up reply actions
Isn't there a specific rule banning that?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Ah, there's always rules against the fun stuff.
Like cocaine. Or Eddie Gaedel.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 5:10 PM PST up reply actions
Bill Veeck is probably resposnible for most of them.
"We don't see things as they are, we see things as we are."
~ Anais Nin
He invented cocaine, actually.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 11, 2010 11:39 PM PST up reply actions
I don't think so....
The A’s did in ST with Frank Thomas playing SS, but obviously the rules can get stretched in ST.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
I'm pretty sure you can do it with position players
Just not pitchers.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Huh
Well, you learn something every day.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
I thought what happened was just that
Thomas was the starting SS in an away game, got an AB in the top of the 1st inning, and was replaced in the bottom of the 1st by a regular SS.
You could do that in the regular season if you wanted; the reason teams don’t is that it means the hitter gets only one AB and is then out for the rest of the game.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
No, it's a general rule
That when you bring a pitcher in a game (starters included) he has to face a minimum of one batter.
.
PxP: Self-promotion - How it works, Bunting, Pitch Counts, Managing, Run Expectancy, Streaks, Coors Effect
They can pinch hit, pinch run, and defend without facing a batter...
Unless there’s a specific rule about the first inning, I don’t see how it could be the case.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
In that case they are not a pitcher
.
PxP: Self-promotion - How it works, Bunting, Pitch Counts, Managing, Run Expectancy, Streaks, Coors Effect
To further clarify
It is not what your trade is, but what position are you brought to play in.
When Nick Swisher enters the game at the position of pitcher he IS a pitcher. He has to face at least one batter. When Micah Owings enters as a pinch hitter, he IS NOT a pitcher. He does not have to face any batters.
If somebody enters the game (and lineup submitted to the umpire is entering the game in the first inning) he IS a pitcher if he is listed as such. He then has to proceed to face at least one batter, as any other pitcher brought into the game at any given point.
.
PxP: Self-promotion - How it works, Bunting, Pitch Counts, Managing, Run Expectancy, Streaks, Coors Effect
is that true? can't you change a pitcher, wait for the other team to change the hitter and then change the pitcher again (at which point the hitting team can't pinch hit again)?
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
Correct. You cannot do that.
The pitcher must face at least one hitter, a rule that does not apply to hitters (you can immediately pinch hit for a pinch hitter).
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
What if you did a double switch... would that work?
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 11:16 PM PST up reply actions
No, it wouldn't
Double switches only have special effect on batting order. As far as positional replacements, they are treated as two normal substitutions.
And as soon as a players enters the game as a pitcher (regardless if he actually enters the game or changes his position from a position player to a pitcher), he has to face at least one batter.
That is 3.05(b) from the OBR:
(b) If the pitcher is replaced, the substitute pitcher shall pitch to the batter then at bat, or any substitute batter, until such batter is put out or reaches first base, or until the offensive team is put out, unless the substitute pitcher sustains injury or illness which, in the umpire in chief’s judgment, incapacitates him for further play as a pitcher.
.
PxP: Self-promotion - How it works, Bunting, Pitch Counts, Managing, Run Expectancy, Streaks, Coors Effect
Does that include warmup pitches?
Like, as soon as he throws a warmup pitch, he’s locked in for a batter? Or can he still be subbed out during warmup pitches?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 11, 2010 11:40 PM PST up reply actions
It's as soon as he is announced as entering the game
as a pitcher. So, actually, it is even before he throws the first warm up pitch that he is “locked in”.
.
PxP: Self-promotion - How it works, Bunting, Pitch Counts, Managing, Run Expectancy, Streaks, Coors Effect
As I wrote somewhere else
It matter if he is on the lineup card:
OBR 3.05(a)
The pitcher named in the batting order handed the umpire in chief, as provided in Rules 4.01 (a) and 4.01 (b), shall pitch to the first batter or any substitute batter until such batter is put out or reaches first base, unless the pitcher sustains injury or illness which, in the judgment of the umpire in chief, incapacitates him from pitching.
.
PxP: Self-promotion - How it works, Bunting, Pitch Counts, Managing, Run Expectancy, Streaks, Coors Effect
This is why it's so important
to know how to fake a heart attack.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Because the visiting pitcher has not faced their minimum of one batter yet?
"We don't see things as they are, we see things as we are."
~ Anais Nin
I think DUIs are worse for teachers, coaches, and professions of that ilk
You’re a role model. The most important part of the job is that you represent yourself and the organization well, and model appropriate conduct.
I would be way harder on a teacher or coach who had a DUI than I would for a student or player. I’m not sympathetic to Ron Washington for the same reasons.
A baseball coach doesn’t make a huge difference in the wins column; the least he can do is model what it means to be professional to a bunch of rowdy, swashbuckling 24 year olds.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 3:55 PM PST up reply actions
The numbers say that "professional" is the very definition
of the average cocaine user.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 4:41 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I wouldn't hate Wash...
he’d get way more out of this team.
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
by the_rozeboom on Dec 9, 2010 11:12 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
He's really a dumb guy
Like, I have no doubts that he can teach people how to field if that’s his job, but the guy is just not sharp at all. His lineup and gametime decisions are baffling at the best of times. Starting Vlad in the outfield in the World Series… I mean, it was comical, but only if you were rooting for the Giants.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Wash and Geren are both dull tools.
However, I’d run through a cheesecloth curtain for Wash and so would a lot of his players.
Geren, on the other hand…
"Burt Reynolds witnessed the conception of his own dad, and frankly, that's what's wrong with him."- TPDMTD!
by Gaijin_Suketto on Dec 9, 2010 11:35 AM PST up reply actions
There are PLENTY of player complaints about Washington
The guy was almost fired midseason last year because he had lost the clubhouse.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
He was gettin down with the White Wizard all year!
He was partying with that that nasal nookie, that booger sugar, that yayo, that snot snow, that blow, that ooey looey jooey wooey mclooey, that devil’s dandruff, that Hollywood happy powder, he was skiing in summer, he’s a big fan of actress Amy Locane.
HE DID COCAINE.
by PL78 on Dec 9, 2010 1:13 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I still don't understand why this is such a big deal.
by danmerqury on Dec 9, 2010 1:19 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I should add...
…I’m not all that worked up about it, either, but it is still illegal.
Billy Beane... What have you done for me lately?
I HAVE IT ON GOOD AUTHORITY THAT BUCK SHOWALTER JAYWALKS.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
no wonder he's got such a high
cross-street percentage.
He’s like the Barry Bonds of crossing the street.
"Burt Reynolds witnessed the conception of his own dad, and frankly, that's what's wrong with him."- TPDMTD!
by Gaijin_Suketto on Dec 9, 2010 6:10 PM PST up reply actions
There are PEDs for street-crossing?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:10 PM PST up reply actions
Duh.
Why do you think they’re called PEDestrians?
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Lawl
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:11 PM PST up reply actions
When your #1 by a mile MVP star player has massive drug problems.
The worst thing his manager could do is get busted for doing what nearly ruined his life. Rob Washington is a terrible manager and I dont miss him one bit and he is definitely not an upgrade over Geren.
I mean, if it were up to me I’d hire Bobby Valentine.
So now Ron Washington has to live his personal life according to Josh Hamilton's weak-kneed inability to say no to his baser proclivities?
Nice.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 2:04 PM PST up reply actions
Josh Hamilton is an adult.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 2:18 PM PST up reply actions
This is about the dumbest thing I've read on this blog
and there are plenty of samples to choose from.
"Not in your wildest alcoholic nightmare would you ever imagine such events unfolding!" Bill King
by Buck Turgidson on Dec 10, 2010 10:41 AM PST up reply actions
Yep
Judging someone by a vice that many people struggle with is incredibly unfair.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 11:09 AM PST up reply actions
I could give a damn if you judge me
But don’t like go to rehab and be all born again and then piss and moan because you can’t party like a gentleman. If you abused the privilege you have nobody to blame but yourself.
"Not in your wildest alcoholic nightmare would you ever imagine such events unfolding!" Bill King
by Buck Turgidson on Dec 10, 2010 11:29 AM PST up reply actions
I agree.
I quit smoking, but I would never tell someone else to put out their cigarette because it makes it hard for me to stay quit. And I am still totally opposed to the laws that ban smoking in public places. I wasn’t able to take care of myself w/r/t tobacco use, but that doesn’t mean I get to judge everyone else and blame them for my failings.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:30 PM PST up reply actions
Judgmental non-smokers make me want to do the same thing...
…and I’ve never been a smoker.
"We don't see things as they are, we see things as we are."
~ Anais Nin
Smoking gives me headaches (and cancer, but we'll focus on the headaches)
People who think that they have a right to give me headaches for no apparent reason make me want to hurt people. Specifically, them.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
by PaulThomas on Dec 10, 2010 2:40 PM PST up reply actions 4 recs
Rec'd
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 2:50 PM PST up reply actions
Don't stand next to them.
Gosh, that was hard.
Official Athletics Nation Rotating Tagline Editor
Pam liked my old sig better.
by mikev on Dec 10, 2010 2:51 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
You think I don't make an effort not to stand near people who are smoking?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Those assholes chase you down, do they?
Official Athletics Nation Rotating Tagline Editor
Pam liked my old sig better.
We're like cats and people with allergies, actually.
We can sense weakness, and pounce!
Your poem here.
What about people in clubs or bars or in line at the A's game?
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 10:07 PM PST up reply actions
They walk by me on campus all the time
I shouldn’t have to avoid the smokers; they’re the ones polluting the air. If I was walking around wearing nothing but a Borat thong, would it be my responsibility to cover up, or would it be everyone else’s responsibility to cover their eyes?
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 3:27 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I might need a cigarette just thinking about it.
And I don’t even smoke.
A full time A's fan in Portland who spends part of his time on AN.
Not so much tweeting as squawking: http://www.twitter.com/yusebio
It actually would be everyone's responsibility to cover their eyes.
A full time A's fan in Portland who spends part of his time on AN.
Not so much tweeting as squawking: http://www.twitter.com/yusebio
Not in public
That would likely be considered indecent exposure. It would be my responsibility to cover up.
I do find it amusing that everyone bypassed the actual argument in favor of trying to pick apart my analogy.
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 3:42 PM PST up reply actions
A gas enema?
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 3:44 PM PST up reply actions
Actually, nobody has any particular responsibility in the thong situation.
Your choice to wear it, my choice to respond or not respond.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 4:44 PM PST up reply actions
It's a bad analogy
Let’s just all agree on that
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 4:49 PM PST up reply actions
-
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 5:12 PM PST up reply actions
Responsibility wouldn't enter into it
Consider my eyes covered.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Take aspirin.
People with obnoxious little children give me headaches; I’m not trying to ban obnoxious (read: all) little children.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 4:43 PM PST up reply actions
Obnoxious little children do not cause a physiological reaction of pain
You’re speaking metaphorically. I’m speaking literally.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
by PaulThomas on Dec 10, 2010 4:51 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
You don't know how much I hate kids.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 5:13 PM PST up reply actions
you'll like those kids paying into social security pretty soon
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
I'll be paying into Social Security before they are.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 11, 2010 11:42 PM PST up reply actions
Hella rec ed
I was forced to breath cigarette smoke against my will for 18 years, why should i have to do it now?
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 10:06 PM PST up reply actions
Cuz you're addicted?
Buuuuuuuahahaha….
-Philip Morris
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
The smoking ban isn't meant for ex-smokers to not want a cigarette
It’s for non-smokers who don’t want to literally cough and hack when they walk outside a Starbucks. My throat stings every time I breathe in cigarette smoke. People are more than welcome to hotbox their car with their cigarettes. Think of it like porn…you’re more than welcome to watch porn in private, but when you’re in public, keep your pants on. Even people who are addicted to porn can prevent themselves from “indulging” in public.
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 2:50 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Speak for yourself.
Sometimes I take a gander at “Nico’s Latina Heat” in public places.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 4:00 PM PST up reply actions
Did you say pubic places?
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
If you want a society filled with enraged smokers who have been disallowed from doing the thing that keeps them sane,
I guess you’re welcome to it.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 4:46 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
They can do it all they want
Lots of places have designated smoking areas. They can also smoke in their cars. If someone is smoking nowhere near a major walkway or a business, I’m totally cool with that. If I happen to be heading that direction for some reason, I’ll go another route. When I’m walking in a mass of people at school and can’t really go another way, and a guy is smoking in front of me as we’re walking, that’s pretty lame.
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 4:52 PM PST up reply actions
deal with it. also Id like to be reimbursed for all of my taxs spent on the healthcare of asshole smokers who cant avoid the rest of us.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 10:10 PM PST up reply actions
Smokers shouldn't have healthcare?
Everyone should have healthcare and the tobacco industry should pay smokers’ premiums. Just like McDonalds should pay the premiums for anyone who is overweight, and AN should require monthly dues to pay for my healthcare. And the A’s should sign Neifi Perez because his first name is just way cool.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
No just the ones that want to insist on making us breath their filth.
More seriously the problem with things like smoking is that they don’t internalize the externalities of the act. A long time ago I read that the true costs of smoking to society is about ~25 bucks a pack. What we need is Pigovian taxes, taxes that bridge the gap between the cost of production for the producer (the price they charge) and the cost of consumption to society which is much greater. That way a smoker has to bear the full financial burden of their actions. Same with McDonalds and soda makers etc.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 3:25 PM PST up reply actions
We gonna do that with cars, buses, airplanes, houses, electricity, everything that runs on electricity, paper, wood, metal, clothing...
Are we gonna do that with everything? Because if we’re not, it kinda starts to look like your personal animosity toward a group of people who have a disease.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 11, 2010 11:45 PM PST up reply actions
Freedom is overrated.
Sounds good to me. When we all get chipped, all of our actions can be physically recorded. That way, they can be uploaded into a database, and the societal cost of whatever action that might be can just be withheld from our paychecks.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
Oil should absolutely be priced to internalize the externalities of its use
… instead of subsidized.
But we’re veering into non-site-friendly space
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
Dude, we don't live in the UK.
What taxes are being spent on health care?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 11, 2010 11:43 PM PST up reply actions
Have you ever heard of Medicare/Medicaid?
or do you have no idea where 9% of your income goes?
Also COHS like Health San Francisco, public hospitals, public funding for the research of treatments of lung diseases, etc.
Its a ton of money. Just look at the states’ suit against the tobacco companies for a cost basis, which at this point is more.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 2:16 AM PST up reply actions
Yes, but...
On the other hand, 2/3 of that 9% goes to SSA, 1/3 to Medicare. People who smoke, or who are overweight, tend to ‘underperform’ their peers w/r/t taking delivery of SSA. People who are ‘healthy’ (people who don’t smoke or overeat) tend to outlive their brains, while drawing SSA until they die.
For all the costs of tending to the unhealthy, there are concomitant costs attendant to tending to the healthy, plus additional SSA costs attendant to their longer lifespans
Dying from unhealthy lifestyles is expensive. Currently, dying from healthy lifestyles is also expensive. Until we get a grip on Alzheimer’s/age-related-senile-dementia, as a society (where everyone dies (eventually*, we haven’t gained any cost-savings. [When the timeline is infinity, it doesn’t matter what the costs per year of life are, since the last year of living costs the society in excess of $100K, whether the decedent dies at age 105 or age 65] (not to mention, the additional costs of SSSA, which is not health-dependant, but is only ‘alive-dependant’.
Yesssss, smoking sucks, and it is expensive to treat the consequences, but it is also cheaper, mortality-wise, when considering SSA.
I know this is complicated, but ignore it at your peril.
My father was the very first person I ever knew in my life who was a ‘health nut’. He had but one weakness: he salted everything. Guess what? He developed high blood pressure. He was given large doses of diuretics, with the aim of lowering his blood pressure (since high blood pressure is associated with stroke). The net result was that he had a massive stroke, due to a bleedout in his brain, which was probably caused by the thinning of his blood. The net result was that his last year of life, in a ward for the ‘memory impaired’, cost him (or society, matters not) well in excess of $100K, even though he had paid premiums for long-term care insurance for in excess of 20 years.
The bogus idea that if we could get the ‘health impaired’ (i.e., smokers and the overweight) to forego their self-destructive lifestyles, then we would be ‘in the black’ is just that, bogus…
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 13, 2010 7:17 PM PST up reply actions
I find it amazing
that the tiniest wisp of smoke causes instantaneous and cripping effects now, when it didn’t just a few years ago.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
Its about not wanting to breath carcinogens
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 10:06 PM PST up reply actions
Proof of second hand smoke causing cancer does not exist.
You would have to be chugging it constantly, in concentrated doses. You’re going to die of secondhand smoke at about the same time you die of THC poisoning.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 11, 2010 11:46 PM PST up reply actions
yes it does.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 2:16 AM PST up reply actions
Recent evidence as reported in Science News
Suggests that for some unknown reason, those whose only exposure is second-hand-smoke are manifesting effects in excess of those whose primary exposure is soley “first-hand” smoke…
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 13, 2010 7:21 PM PST up reply actions
So did John Lennon, people still seem to dig the music.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 2:03 PM PST up reply actions
Since we're pulling names out of a hat...
…I want Sparky Anderson as manager.
I don’t care that he recently died… he’d still be better than Geren.
Billy Beane... What have you done for me lately?
I want Connie Mack!
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
ahahaha
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 10, 2010 8:44 AM PST up reply actions
No, you need to defend your attack on everyone who ever used cocaine.
You can’t just lob grenades like that and not defend them. A lot of people have used cocaine. They’re not sinners, or bad at their jobs. They’re human beings. So defend your attack on them.
Frankly, I’m not sure I care for the racial overtones, either, of accusing Ron Washington of being a bad influence on Josh Hamilton.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 2:20 PM PST up reply actions
what part of that was racial?
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 9, 2010 2:33 PM PST up reply actions
The part where Washington is somehow the bad guy for doing coke,
while Hamilton is the poor defenseless innocent baby who can’t possibly keep on the straight and narrow with the crazy manager tempting him.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:13 PM PST up reply actions
That's one way of looking at it
But that’s not racial.
Also, I’m pretty sure cocaine use is negatively correlated with high-functioning people.
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 10, 2010 6:47 AM PST up reply actions
That's not necessarily the case at all.
I think the current numbers show that it’s most popular among young single adult professionals with a lot of discretionary income (this is excluding crack.)
Regarding the racial angle, a lot of sociologists would disagree with you that there’s no racial tinge to deciding that one coke-user, who happens to be black, is a bad influence, while another coke-user, who happens to be white, is an innocent victim.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:18 AM PST up reply actions
If by professionals you mean
people who have any high-paying non-manual labor job (sales maybe?) then okay.
If you meant instead “a high proportion of accountants/lawyers/doctors/professors” then I don’t agree with this. The latter is more of what I was getting at.
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 10, 2010 9:42 AM PST up reply actions
Not a whole load of difference, is there?
How many high-paying non-manual labor degree-required jobs are there, other than accounting, lawyering, doctoring, and professing? There’s a LOT of coke use in those professions, by the way. Even accountants, which is very weird to me. I didn’t know they liked fun.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:31 PM PST up reply actions
QFT.
accounting, lawyering, doctoring, and professing? There’s a LOT of coke use in those professions, by the way.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
I'm a professor, but nobody has offered me cocaine for years.
I guess I shoulda been an accountant or a lawyer.
Your poem here.
mid-level management
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 10, 2010 6:34 PM PST up reply actions
C'mon, man
I’m sympathetic to your general point, but in context this is crazy. Hamilton is an addict. He’s not some innocent babe in the woods, but he does have an illness. Wash is in a management position. It is reasonable to suggest that his casual cocaine use is especially problematic when the star player he is supposed to be managing is a high-profile addict. I’m not sure it is that big a deal, but it is reasonable to bring it up without some sort of racial undertone being suspected.
The black-white/crack-powder disparities, which I agree are seriously problematic in our criminal justice system, are irrelevant here.
by Glorious Mundy on Dec 10, 2010 9:55 AM PST up reply actions
Nobody's talking about Ron Washington's heroic ability to overcome cocaine and manage a baseball team.
Everyone’s talking about what a good Christian hero Josh Hamilton is for overcoming cocaine and becoming the MVP on the AL Champion team.
But to borrow a concept from Patton Oswalt, where’s the love for the guy who actually maintained his self-control in the first place? Where’s Ron Washington’s ticker-tape parade for being mature enough to handle a couple of sneezes and not turn into a VH1 special?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:36 PM PST up reply actions
I watched the first season of Celebrity Rehab on Netflix recently!
It was truly awesome.
Your poem here.
Where the fuck did you pull this from?
I never said anything about Hamilton being a good christian hero, he’s the best fucking player in baseball and he has a disease that a GOOD manager would know to set an example over.
Seriously, stop trolling. Its getting fucking annoying.
Stop throwing out f-bombs
like they’re ceremonial first pitches.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Im sorry but I get heated when I get accused of racism.
Serves me right for dealing with a troll whos already been banned once.
I generally do not throw out f-bombs (at least not on a mikev level, no disrespect), but StJoe is being really irrational and accusatory.
OK, now you've gone over the 'line' for me, such as it is on AN
Yesss, STJoe has a black mark from his first days on AN, and apparently you don’t.
And, by the way, I think you were not attempting to be racist.
And, yess, (note fewer ss’s), I understand that you take it ‘personal’ for being called a racist. It’s kinda like, in this society, being called a racist is almost the worst insult possible, nevermind that we all constantly betray the fact that we harbor some embers of racism/classism/ethnicism within our thought processes, we just hate being called out on them.
There is substantive evidence that many of us (including our government by classifying crack as somehow much worse than powder cocaine) routinely use racist arguments when discussing the dangers of cocaine.
Regardless of whether STJoe got tossed at the very beginning of his tenure at AN, he has proven himself to be a worthy addition by now, and yu should stop tarring him with the ‘troll’ handle. Sometimes, you’re the troll.
Sometimes, I am.
Hell, sometimes, Nico is (which is sort of impossible, since to Nico we complain about ’trolliness").
However, it is pretty much never ok to accuse a regular of being a ’troll". I hasten to add, it is OK to say something along the lines of:
“This post of yours is trolling”. Distinguish between the post and the person, OK?
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 13, 2010 7:38 PM PST up reply actions
Is there some sort of "morals" clause that applies?
One would think that committing a felony (not simply an infraction) would qualify. Enforcement of these things does seem to be selective, at best.
Then, we get to discuss convicted vs admitted vs merely accused.
Billy Beane... What have you done for me lately?
Plenty of things are felonies that aren't really that bad.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:14 PM PST up reply actions
Uh...huh.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
You know, like espionage.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:34 PM PST up reply actions
like possession of cocaine
or transporting Marijuana, or
felony vandalism (over $400)
etc
Yeah, bad, but not that bad
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
There are way too many felonies in this state/country
Seriously, someone needs to take a hatchet to the Penal Code and cut that thing down to size. It’s ridiculous. Even lawyers can’t possibly know everything that’s against the law.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Agree on this
In the police academy I had to carry that dumb thing around everywhere. Its a very dated redundant document. Good example is all the obscure livestock penal code sections. Basically any crime involving livestock is a felony, because they date back to a more agrarian California.
It's amazing Nico hasn't been put away for life.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 12:10 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Oh COME ON.
You do one thing to one chicken…
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Oh, come on, fella
Chicken, my ass!
What part of your elementary school confession about ‘my penis in a goat’ do you not understand?
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 13, 2010 7:54 PM PST up reply actions
I'm uncomfortable with the words hatchet and penal in the same sentence
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 6:12 AM PST up reply actions
ONLY BECAUSE YOU HAVE SOMETHING TO HIDE
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:19 AM PST up reply actions
Henny Youngman strikes again.
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 13, 2010 7:55 PM PST up reply actions
As in, if you're NOT uncomfortable you have NOTHING to hide....
rimshot
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 13, 2010 7:56 PM PST up reply actions
wow
I didnt “attack” anyone. Ron Washington did cocaine under his tenure as the manager of the Rangers. This is fact. Ron Washington played Vlad Guerrero in RF during the WS, therefore he is not a good manager. Ron Washington has a junkie as his (and the league’s) best player. Therefore a man supposed to be a manager and mentor to his players doing something that would so obviously harm that relationship with his best player, is not a man I want running my team.
That’s all I’m saying.
It's fact that he did cocaine?
Have you a link/citation for this?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
OK, fair enough
I couldn’t remember whether it had gotten past the rumor stage of things.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
But he only did it once.
And amazingly, he failed the once-a-year(?) random drug test that he takes on the one occasion that he did it.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 12:11 AM PST up reply actions
He did use other drugs when he was
a Player . I could have sworn he later admitted to doing it more than once as a manager, but i can’t seem to find the article.
And the 1988-1992 A's used to have crazy sex parties.
Celebrities do nutty things.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:20 AM PST up reply actions
its not just celebrities... have you seen a CT thread?
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 9:19 AM PST up reply actions
Are you saying we're not celebrities?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:36 PM PST up reply actions
I am.
"Burt Reynolds witnessed the conception of his own dad, and frankly, that's what's wrong with him."- TPDMTD!
by Gaijin_Suketto on Dec 10, 2010 2:23 PM PST up reply actions
This is the guy that deliberately sat his best hitter for no apparent reason at all.
Official Athletics Nation Rotating Tagline Editor
Pam liked my old sig better.
Yes, yes, I know that Wash is not the best manager...
I was just saying that I wouldn’t hate him, and I think he would get more from this group of players.
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
by the_rozeboom on Dec 9, 2010 11:53 AM PST up reply actions
+100
Who’s the second most popular guy in any town (behind the backup quarterback, of course)? The guy you didn’t hire for manager.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
What's Art Howe doing these days?
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
by the_rozeboom on Dec 9, 2010 11:50 AM PST up reply actions
Yes, because that worked so well for us before.
Half those players mentioned are the great prospects we got before.
Disclaimer: Venting post.
Billy Beane... What have you done for me lately?
It's not my Plan A and I think it sucks to perpetually rebuild. Plan A was to sign Crawford
and trade for a RF using Carter and Green. Since we’re not getting Crawford or any other 4+ WAR player that I can see, I think you gotta aim for a year beyond 2011….say 2014. Otherwise go for Pujols in 2012.
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 8:58 AM PST up reply actions
Pujols isn't signing anywhere but STL
Cards are over the barrel to sign him to basically whatever he wants. ARod money + more.
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 9, 2010 9:07 AM PST up reply actions
They're already negotiating...
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
by the_rozeboom on Dec 9, 2010 11:13 AM PST up reply actions
You heard it here first
10 years/$300M. Book it.
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 9, 2010 12:20 PM PST up reply actions
No one will accuse you
of not having a bold alternative. I appreciate that.
Shopping at Target?
Man, that would be nice. The A’s are shopping at Goodwill at this point.
"Ain't no man can avoid being born average, but there ain't no man got to be common." - Satchel Paige
no
Dollar store. What can we get for a $1. Damn not even a rule 5 cost a dollar.
hell
I find lots of good stuff at the dollar store and goodwill
the A’s get there stuff off the “Free” area on craigslist. Stuff that looks good in pictures and when you pick it up. But after you use it a few times, it breaks
Zooey Deschanel!
Cluck 'em all and let the Chick sort 'em out - DMOAS
You're worried that you'll come off as nerdy as frack? On AN? That’s like being ashamed of your alcohol use at a meth convention. - danmerqury
by ChickenStanley on Dec 9, 2010 8:12 PM PST up reply actions
Don't remind me.
I got a Duchscherer from some jerk on Craigslist. Three years in a row, actually.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Hey!
He might be coming back again!
Zooey Deschanel!
Cluck 'em all and let the Chick sort 'em out - DMOAS
You're worried that you'll come off as nerdy as frack? On AN? That’s like being ashamed of your alcohol use at a meth convention. - danmerqury
by ChickenStanley on Dec 9, 2010 8:30 PM PST up reply actions
Well Boston and NY are shopping at the Hermes
Slegna and Texas Nordstrom…..I think we are closer to Macy’s or JC Penny…..
A's shop at Little Outlet
“Check out this tie: Ralph Lauren…regularly $80…small tomato stain; you can barely see it…FOUR BUCKS!”
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 9, 2010 9:37 AM PST up reply actions
flea market... for sure.
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
by the_rozeboom on Dec 9, 2010 11:15 AM PST up reply actions
Macy's and JC Penny are not similar...
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
by the_rozeboom on Dec 9, 2010 11:14 AM PST up reply actions
Hey, I just scored a beautiful new-used couch at Goodwill
for 200 bucks! Maybe Beane can do the same.
"You're early, but hang around; we'll have a fight for you sooner or later."
-John "Blue Moon" Odom
The good news
We are not in the AL east. Think how O fans, Blue J fans, and Ray fans feel today. Beltre will go to the Angels unless Texas trades Young. Just be glad Crawford is not in LA. More the reason to keep strong starters and a strong bullpen because you can’t compete with the redsox or yanks without it.
Neither our starters nor bullpen is particularly strong
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 7:47 AM PST up reply actions
OK if the starters aren't strong and the relievers aren't strong
How’d we end up with the best ERA in the AL?
Are you one of those “the A’s got lucky with ERA because their FIP was higher guys?”
Can a whole team get lucky for a season? Seems like 162 games x 9 innings would really be a big enough sample size to say the A’s pitchers really were the best in the AL.
by barryzitoforever on Dec 9, 2010 9:37 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
The defense was strong.
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 9:38 AM PST up reply actions
When did it get weaker?
Is it cuz Cust is gone or DDJ is now here?
by Pop N' Locktapus on Dec 9, 2010 10:12 AM PST up reply actions
Who said it did?
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 10:36 AM PST up reply actions
Nobody.
I’m just suggesting that that for all intents and purposes we can assume our pitching will be perceived as strong again this year due to great defense. Not a shot at you.
by Pop N' Locktapus on Dec 9, 2010 12:15 PM PST up reply actions
I get your point but
I can’t get my head around the idea that the pitching wasn’t particularly strong. It appeared to me to be “particularly strong”. And when I investigate the stats it still looks strong. I think you need to pick and choose your stats quite a bit to try to make the case that it wasn’t strong. Not only was it strong, it was exceedingly young, with Cahill and Gio only 22. I can see the top 4 starters, if Anderson can stay healthy averaging 15 wins each next year. And if you want to play the “wins don’t matter card” try to find a team with 4 starters winning that many games which didn’t have a 90+ win season. Usually teams with starters like that go to the playoffs.
by barryzitoforever on Dec 9, 2010 6:27 PM PST up reply actions
Do you think a single person on AN wouldn't like to believe that the pitching was strong?
You don’t honestly think we enjoy having a mediocre team, do you? Don’t you think that if there was a reason to believe something nice was going on, we’d cling to it like a lifeboat?
Nobody’s picking and choosing anything.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:17 PM PST up reply actions
Wins don't matter, age doesn't matter very much at all, and it is, if anything, the people making the rotation out to be great
who are picking and choosing stats. The ones which correlate better with next year’s ERA tell us the rotation was middle of the pack at best and the bullpen was really bad.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Our rotation had less wins than:
MIN, TB, NYY, BOS, PHI, STL, SD, and CHW. White Sox only won 88 games. Red Sox only won 89. Cardinals only won 86.
Not that this means anything.
I think our starting lineup's lack of run support adequately shows
that wins don’t mean much to show a rotation’s strength/weakness. The teams you listed also were in the top for team wins.
...
Can a whole team get lucky for a season?
That’s a gross misrepresentation of what happened. Some players outperformed their FIP, and others underperformed it. The ones that outperformed it just outperformed it by more than the underperformers underperformed.
In addition, relievers seem to outperform their FIP more often than starters, likely due to the fact that they only pitch an inning or a few batters at a time.
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 9, 2010 9:42 AM PST up reply actions
Not a believer
FIP is over used stat. I read up on those pitching stats and there are to many factors in baseball to support it as a true way to value pitching. I know some AN people here believe in it to the point that anything other than FIP is useless but it is not the holy book on pitching. Pitchers pitch differently in different situations. Baseball is a thinking man’s game not about stats only. If stats were the only factor the Giants would not have won the world series or even made the playoffs.
Too many factors in baseball to support FIP, but you believe in ERA?
The Giants made the playoffs because they played in a weak division, and they won the World Series because the playoffs are a crapshoot.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 10:25 AM PST up reply actions
Perfect example of a "lucky" team... damn them.
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
by the_rozeboom on Dec 9, 2010 11:16 AM PST up reply actions
They may have had some luck
but you have to give their pitching props. They were pretty damned good.
"You're early, but hang around; we'll have a fight for you sooner or later."
-John "Blue Moon" Odom
For sure...
I just don’t think they could ever duplicate that season in a million years.
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
by the_rozeboom on Dec 9, 2010 11:55 AM PST up reply actions
Ya, it would be very hard to repeat winning the Series
but their pitching, like our little Muppets, will almost always keep them competitive.
In fact out of all the teams that Texas had to face in the layoffs, I felt like the A’s were the closest thing to the Giants, in terms of pitching, that they had seen.
"You're early, but hang around; we'll have a fight for you sooner or later."
-John "Blue Moon" Odom
they almost didn't make the playoffs. it took a near epic collapse by the padres.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
they almost didn’t make the playoffs. it took a massive late regression to the mean by the not good padres for them to make it.
Lets face it, SD were lucky to win so many games last year.
A ten game losing streak regression to the mean?
After trading for Ludwick and having him suck mightily in the clean up spot?
Nope. It’s called pitching and defense. It’s the only reason you didn’t lose 100 yourself. The main reason we won more games than you is a shut-down bullpen in a favorable park.
It’s also why we owned the Giants.
"Never have a motto, that's what I always say" - Me
http://marcel-oehler.marcellosendos.ch/comics/ch/1986/05/19860506.gif
Because, of course, hitting is SOOO much more imprtant than pitching
Oh, right, that’s sarchasm
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 13, 2010 8:05 PM PST up reply actions
They would have won the wild card anyway
by Glorious Mundy on Dec 9, 2010 2:14 PM PST up reply actions
it took the braves having their infield break in half
lots of luck there too
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
"Playoffs"!
Spelling fail!
"You're early, but hang around; we'll have a fight for you sooner or later."
-John "Blue Moon" Odom
More lucky than a crap shoot
Both Atlanta and Phili were ridiculously banged up
Crapshoot=lucky
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:18 PM PST up reply actions
...
If stats were the only factor the Giants would not have won the world series or even made the playoffs.
Yeah, because the Giants didn’t have players with good stats /facepalm
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 9, 2010 12:04 PM PST up reply actions
Defense.
Our defense lowered our pitchers’ collective ERA by a lot more than you’d think. And it’s a lot more than just errors.
We still have that defense and still play in the same home park
So what’s the problem going forward — plus a pitching staff that young should be generally expected to improve, not get worse or level off.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Ex-fucking-actly.
"Some field has fences, and sometime, the field cant hold a player, but most of the time, a field cant hold Domingo"
www.domingobeisbol.com/Domingo/Home.html
I've always preferred "Eg-fucking-zactly."
Feels a little bit more betterness.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:18 PM PST up reply actions
I originally had it as "ex-fucking-zactly"
Then realized that it isn’t spelled “exzactly”, so I changed it in the hopes that the grammar nazis wouldn’t get me.
"Some field has fences, and sometime, the field cant hold a player, but most of the time, a field cant hold Domingo"
www.domingobeisbol.com/Domingo/Home.html
At the point where you're putting "fucking" into a word, you don't need to worry about us.
Also, this might come across dickish, but I really don’t like it when people trivialize the Nazis that way. The Nazis killed 12 million people; all I do is correct people’s grammatical errors.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:35 PM PST up reply actions
Apologies
That comment was made in jest, by the way. No hostility towards you.
Looking back at it I could’ve made that more evident.
"Some field has fences, and sometime, the field cant hold a player, but most of the time, a field cant hold Domingo"
www.domingobeisbol.com/Domingo/Home.html
I don't mean to say you were calling me a believer in the tenets of National Socialism;
I just mean that I don’t think it’s great to equate anything with Nazism that doesn’t actually equate to Nazism. DFA gets irked by the over-use of “rape”; the over-use of “Nazi” irks me.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:23 AM PST up reply actions
OK, I just decided NOT to tell the story after all
about how I violated a German last night.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
As long as you're not trying to be funny...
and as long as the German wasn’t a chicken…
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 11, 2010 11:47 PM PST up reply actions
german Goat, sorry to say
He pretends to be into chickens, just to deflect the Goat criticism.
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 13, 2010 8:08 PM PST up reply actions
I've been trying to make this point
In various comments to various posts for a while now. But it seems to fall on the deaf ears of most of the naysayers. Or else it is my lack of ability to put together clear posts and comments. The future looks bright for the A’s.
by barryzitoforever on Dec 9, 2010 8:10 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Unless we have to bat
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
hehe
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 10, 2010 8:52 AM PST up reply actions
Two problems:
A, That defense may very well regress. Should, even. And B, having the defense do most of the work means that it’s far, far harder to upgrade the offense. If it was the pitchers doing all the work, we could go buck wild. But since it was the defense, we can’t upgrade our offense without taking a hit on our run prevention.
Well, I guess Kouz 'should' regress. Reason #1 why I still support overpaying for Beltre while realizing we won't do it
UZR had Pennington as a way below average defender in 2009. what makes that stat any more accurate than the way above UZR he had for 2010.
Barton shows a nicely-scaled improvement from year to year.
Ellis is Ellis, with the exception of his 2009 UZR, which is maybe an outlier.
We can upgrade our offense without taking a hit on our run prevention, but we will have to beat the LAAA’s to do it. If Beltre is only a ‘league-average-ish’ hitter in the Coli, he’s as good a defender as Kouz, and a better hitter. Is that worth $90M? I think so, but the A’s probably won’t.
Then we can trade Kouz to someone, and let them have Encarnacion.
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 10, 2010 9:02 AM PST up reply actions
Well, for starters, the A's don't have "that defense," certainly not in the sense that it's going to post a teamwide efficiency of .720 again
There’s going to be regression to the mean there.
Second, that value is, as far as the starters are concerned, phantom value. The park affects everyone, and assigning the value of fielding to, you know, the fielders is simply proper accounting. Yes, the A’s still have a good defense. They also “still” have an average rotation. That’s the whole point.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
But what if they signed Cliff Lee to an eight year, $175M deal?
They’d have a great rotation then.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 12:14 AM PST up reply actions
Let's try and find out
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 6:15 AM PST up reply actions
Yep, it must really, really, really suck to be in that division.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
If the Angels only offered
Crawford 7 years and just over $100mm, are they really that likely to give Beltre 5/75 or more? I’m not sure I see a GM being able to offer Beltre the same annual amount as Carl Crawford and people within the organization, and baseball world for that matter not going, huh??
I’m wondering if its possible that Crawford being LAAAA’s top target was a misconception the entire time, and their big target all along has been Cliff Lee? That offer to Crawford just makes it seem as though the slegnA were only semi-serious on him.
They might go huh, but I think they'll do it anyway....if they don't get Lee
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 7:48 AM PST up reply actions
Last season
There was rumors of the Angels owner having money problems then after the season saying he was planning to spend big. From everything I have read nobody have heard much from them.
I don't like the thought of facing Cliff Lee and Haren all year.....
I have a gut feeling NY will up an 8 year offer for him….
He probably isn't that good
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 8:37 AM PST up reply actions
Still, it's like slegna is becomming the Angels
Seeing Haren play against us, strikes the same emotional chords as seeing Giambi in pinstripes….
Really? Haren seems more like a Cardinal to me
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 8:39 AM PST up reply actions
I'm probably irrational....
I went to a lot of games during the Harden/Blanton/Haren era….Always loved watching Haren pitch at the Coiliseum…..
I just tend to care more about guys who came up through the system
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 8:46 AM PST up reply actions
To me yes....but I'm not a purist on this.
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 9:20 AM PST up reply actions
You might be right..
I mean he Lee was great in the playoffs until the world series, but maybe he just happened to be on a hot streak. That doesn’t mean you can count on that being the case if he’s in the playoffs again. During the regular season wasn’t his ERA higher than even one of the A’s starters? How did that happen if he is god?
I agree that Lee is very good, but the contract he’s about to sign is crazy. How many pitchers have a 7 year stretch were they continue to be among the very best? It is rare. But those teams can throw away money.
Hi ho.
Not just any 7-year stretch, but the 7 years after turning 32. Post PED's
Because Roger Clemens counts as one, but had a little help from his ‘friends’.
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 10, 2010 9:11 AM PST up reply actions
Randy Johnson
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 2:56 PM PST up reply actions
that works
It was a gazillion years ago, but Bill James once had a piece in the pretty much pre-PEDs days about the fact that true ‘power pitchers’ tended to age more slowly than other types of pitchers, and Randy was surely viable for 7 years after he reached 32. The point mde by danh and myself is still viable in the main: most pitchers don’t age as well from 32 to 39 as position players, and few maintain a WAR worth the kind of money Lee will command for 7 years’ running.
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 10, 2010 6:37 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah
Especially in light of the fact that this offer is significantly less valuable than the one given Werth. That just doesn’t make any sense if you’re seriously trying to land the guy. It’s odd, because from what I read, everyone at the winter meetings were thinking that Crawfard to LAAAA was a essentially done deal.
I guess Arte's definition of throwing however much money it will take doesn't meet the current market
Pr else, his accountants got to him before he could ruin himself
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 10, 2010 6:38 PM PST up reply actions
Or, not Pr
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 10, 2010 6:38 PM PST up reply actions
Agree with this statement.
…I don’t think that Hideki Matsui is that player that will put the A’s over the top. Yes he’s a nice complementary piece if you have other players around him but he’s not the thunder in the middle of a lineup you need.
One thing in our favor, though, is that nobody else in the AL West has significantly improved, either. Yet, at least. Even if the Angels do get Beltre, he alone is not such a difference maker that they could be awarded the division title before the season starts.
Billy Beane... What have you done for me lately?
I wonder why we haven't heard anything out of Manny?
I just hope LAA doesn’t sign ManRam and Beltre!
Every man for himself...
Boras said
Manny might sign for a 1 year deal for a big amount. No team listed or no info about a team going after him. Maybe he has some weddings to take care of at this time.
Manny
I think Manny will lucky to sign with anyone for the amount he wants. Only a few teams need a DH and fewer teams are willing to put up with his attitude if he is not hitting 30-40 hrs.
ogallalabob
One million dollars plus incentives? Pretty cheap contract.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 10:26 AM PST up reply actions
The A's were much, much worse than the Rangers at the start of the offseason
The failure of anyone to improve much means the A’s are still much, much worse than the Rangers right now.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
How much is "much, much worse"?
5, 10, 20 games? Honest question.
Also, does this include Cliff Lee on the Rangers?
Sorry, I’m not sure where the best place to look for total team projections
My guess is something like eight to ten games
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
with or without Lee?
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 10, 2010 6:39 PM PST up reply actions
I'll say seven without him and ten with him
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Wood?
Isn’t that Jack Hannahan’s younger brother?
Let me add to your sense of frustration, Blez
Beane has come out and said the A’s were going to boost their payroll for 2011.
With the roster they have right now they’re sitting between $10 – 15 million under what they spent in 2010.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Scott Downs FTW!!!
.
PxP: Self-promotion - How it works, Bunting, Pitch Counts, Managing, Run Expectancy, Streaks, Coors Effect
I'm sure Ben Sheets will take another 10 million to mentor our young arms, while he rehabs his injury...
We can also re-sign Chavez to DH???
Every man for himself...
Mine too. Now they're not.
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 8:39 AM PST up reply actions
$$$$ - Extensions
Valuable Free Agents aren’t coming to Oakland. We must invest within, and buy out some arbitration years for our young pitching staff…
- I would think Cahill will get extended this offseason.
- I know it’s early, but maybe extend Gio before he has a serious breakout year in 2011 (I have a good feeling this may happen)
- What about buying out Andrew Bailey’s arby years?
- Extend Breslow on a Wuertz-ish (less money) type deal.
- Brandon McCarthy will probably happen
- Scott Downs could happen
I don’t mind spreading this money around at all. Beltre would be nice, but I don’t like putting 50% of our eggs into the Chavez Basket.
Which of these guys is really all that great?
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 9:49 AM PST up reply actions
I guess....he's a 4 WAR player in a prime year (not peak). He's pretty good
but you need at least one more as good as him to be a World Series contender
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 10:38 AM PST up reply actions
So
There aren’t anymore “Great” players to choose from. Why not sign some “pretty good” players to some short term deals? You can always deal guys like Wuertz, Breslow, and Downs at the deadline. If not, just call Kevin Towers with all 3 relievers and ask for Justin Upton.
Because there's no reason to
They’re under team control anyway. Why lock yourself into a corner when you don’t have to?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Ask Joe Blanton.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Why are we wanting to waste money on mediocre pitchers like Bailey, Breslow, McCarthy, and Downs?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 10:27 AM PST up reply actions
All of those guys seem like year-to-year guys to me
I could be persuaded otherwise on Gio if they’re convinced he’s not going to melt down like Rich Hill. Otherwise, really not interested at all.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
If Scott Downs happens I will be pissed
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 9, 2010 12:05 PM PST up reply actions
Scott Downs doesn't just "happen". You have to make it "happen"
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 12:27 PM PST up reply actions
He worded it as "happen"
I guess I should’ve put “happen” in quotes
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 9, 2010 12:37 PM PST up reply actions
I need a non-serious font
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 6:16 AM PST up reply actions
you would use it more than a serious one
plus I think its funnier when people react wrongly
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
Well, A, the offseason isn't over yet,
and B, they’ve thrown money at people. It’s not like they’ve been clammed up all season.
There were only a handful of guys worth throwing a boatload of money at when the offseason started.
There’s even fewer now.
The monster at the end of this blog.
I mean, just put the snit aside and go sign Beltre, for fuck's sake
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
by PaulThomas on Dec 9, 2010 11:36 AM PST up reply actions 4 recs
Yo tambien'!
"You're early, but hang around; we'll have a fight for you sooner or later."
-John "Blue Moon" Odom
Maybe the only one left.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
Yeah, 2011 is not looking good.
Any trades possible? FA look lame at this point.
Drink what you know, drink regularly rather than in binges, avoid needlessly exotic booze, and leave the table while you can still stand.
Mike doesn't like RF....after the incident
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 8:27 AM PST up reply actions
Not really, I think we make Mike suck it up and play RF
Offer to pay for therapy
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 8:38 AM PST up reply actions
Yes
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 9:49 AM PST up reply actions
Keep posting Blez....it is the silver lining in the storm clouds of this off-season.....
At least the AN community can smile a bit more, remembring the good old A’s that you used to contribute so much material to…..
Matt Guerrier
for a nice RP signing. Consistent, great inning eater, one of better clubhouse guys. Nobody i assume cares but he would be great.
I'd like Jesse Crain to sign here
Just cause I know his brother in law.
Official Athletics Nation Rotating Tagline Editor
Pam liked my old sig better.
Not worried about free, but some awesome seats would be nice.
Official Athletics Nation Rotating Tagline Editor
Pam liked my old sig better.
The Crain Wreck!
"Everybody in the building is standing except for people in a wheelchair." - Doug Woog
"It’s like the lost burrito of Atlantis." - jeepers
by Where's My Burrito? on Dec 9, 2010 9:36 AM PST up reply actions
I know Ryan Braun's sister-in-law. Can we get him?
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
by the_rozeboom on Dec 9, 2010 11:21 AM PST up reply actions
Yes, please.
What you fail to understand in your joyless myopia is that baseball is the key to life-- the Rosetta Stone, if you will. If you just understood baseball better all your other questions your, your... the, uh... the aliens, the conspiracies they would all, in their way be answered by the baseball gods.
I'll work on it.
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
by the_rozeboom on Dec 9, 2010 11:26 AM PST up reply actions
OK, worked on it. No can do. Damn.
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
by the_rozeboom on Dec 9, 2010 11:27 AM PST up reply actions
It was worth a shot.
What you fail to understand in your joyless myopia is that baseball is the key to life-- the Rosetta Stone, if you will. If you just understood baseball better all your other questions your, your... the, uh... the aliens, the conspiracies they would all, in their way be answered by the baseball gods.
I know Mark Ellis' wife's cousin.
Can we get him?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 2:06 PM PST up reply actions
Is the cousin twice-removed?
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
Don't suppose I'd know.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 2:20 PM PST up reply actions
But you know everything!
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
well, I know one of Vlad's best friends
Zooey Deschanel!
Cluck 'em all and let the Chick sort 'em out - DMOAS
You're worried that you'll come off as nerdy as frack? On AN? That’s like being ashamed of your alcohol use at a meth convention. - danmerqury
by ChickenStanley on Dec 9, 2010 8:35 PM PST up reply actions
I know someone who is friends with one of his "girlfriends"
And yes, he is married. And yes, I said girlfriendS
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 11:15 AM PST up reply actions
Well we know he'll hack at anything.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Trades and Stuff
These things start happening around Dec. 15th – 18th. Next week will be a busy week for Beane and company. Bats will need to come via a trade.
Possible Targets:
- JD Drew
- Mike Cameron
- Josh Willingham
I'm frustrated by this offseason, but also annoyed...
Annoyed by the defeatist/reactionary nature of the current A’s regime. I appreciate the way Wolff and Beane support AN and are available to us to discuss the issues at-hand, but I’m also not going to let that openness suppress my feelings about what’s going on.
I realize that the current stadium situation is a deterrent to signing free agents…we all know that and so does the rest of the league and the commissioner’s office. But I have a strong feeling that there are other issues that are deterring free agents from signing here, such as:
1) Player discontent with Bob Geren as manager
2) Player concern with personnel/playing time/roster management decisions
3) Player concern with medical staff issues
4) Player concern with stability of franchise
Mychael Urban has intimated in various reports that players don’t really have great things to say about Bob Geren as manager. Also, the Cust/Buck/Mazzaro situations from last season, plus the overworking of a guy such as Suzuki, probably contribute to an unsettling clubhouse atmosphere with regards to how the roster and playing time are managed. The well-documented medical issues over several years – and the subsequent legal action by Dallas Braden upon the former team medical provider – also must resonate in the clubhouse. And as for “stability of franchise”, a lot of free agents are older players with families that may want to go to a place where they know they can live for 5 to 6 years without worrying about being traded in a year or two for the hottest prospect available.
As Beane or someone else said recently, players from different teams talk to each other all the time and I’m sure concerning issues get shared around. If I was a player thinking about signing with Oakland, even for a lot of money, I’d probably start asking current or recent former A’s about their experience in Oakland and see what they say. I doubt, unfortunately, that a lot of them – maybe excluding Mark Ellis – would actually have markedly positive things to say. And if that’s what I got from the players, I’d be more inclined to be affected by that info than I would be with the park factors or clubhouse amenities, with money being equal, that is.
Basically, I’m just really upset that the stadium issue has pervaded everything and become an excuse for the mediocrity of the on-field product as well as an excuse to let other pertinent issues fall by the wayside.
Earlier this decade, Oakland seemed like a fun place to play. A laid-back clubhouse, great pitching, and a solid medical staff. It wasn’t Yankee Stadium or the Big-A with all the glitz and showbiz stuff, but it didn’t seem like cholera-infested Haiti either. Somewhere along the line, things have fallen apart. Beane has made some bad trades, bridges have been burned with players/government officials, the medical issue was perpetually ignored and the team just hasn’t been very good in awhile.
All of these issues, I believe, are fairly independent of the stadium issue. I think that if the current regime spent some serious time and money to address them, it might increase the likelihood that apremium free agent or two would sign with Oakland in the near future.
I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!
by Taj Adib on Dec 9, 2010 9:54 AM PST reply actions 13 recs
This would be a good fanpost
"You know, a long time ago being crazy meant something. Nowadays everybody's crazy."
-Charles Manson
by kaweahkaweah on Dec 9, 2010 11:37 AM PST up reply actions
Maybe 1 and 2 are valid
For 3, they have hired new people and a new trainer. So, you can’t say they are unaware of it.
For 4, the biggest issue for this franchise isn’t Adrian Beltre. It’s a stadium, which ties into the stability of the franchise. That it’s a messy issue or that it brings up strong viewpoints shouldn’t cloud the cold reality that this team needs a new stadium. Our division rivals will likely have $100M+ payrolls, and we will be middling somewhere around $60M. You don’t think a new stadium would help with that, and, subsequently, the stability of the franchise?
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 9, 2010 1:10 PM PST up reply actions
Can Someone explain to me why the fuck were taking righties with shitty strike out rates who haven even gotten to Low Fuckin A for more than three games?
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 9, 2010 9:54 AM PST reply actions
... in the rule 5 draft
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 9, 2010 9:55 AM PST up reply actions
I missed that it was in the AAA portion. but still
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 9, 2010 9:57 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
how does that differ from the major league portion of the draft? they have to stay in AAA for the full year?
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
No...there are basically no requirements on how long you have to keep them where
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 10:39 AM PST up reply actions
To offset the loss of our 2 RHPs we lost, Sattler and Friend?
rebuildingseason.blogspot.com
by Rebuilding Season on Dec 9, 2010 10:42 AM PST up reply actions
Scott
Must be a fox news watcher. birthers = easily brainwashed
It's one thing to say you want a whole team of Democrats (that team would probably be pretty terrible)
It’s another entirely to say that you just don’t want anyone on your team who is a crackbrained fascist loon.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
PT IIRC you have made the statement that professional athletes players
are on the whole authoritarian-esque and on the whole on the right wing conservative side of things. What if he becomes our “crackbrained fascist loon”, and say in 5 years Will Ferrell does a follow up show on Showtime features our version of John Rocker. I am beginning to miss the Zito Chris Isaak appearances, or even the Swisher CMT countdown appearances….
Did you read it? Seems like PT's assessment is pretty accurate...
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 9, 2010 12:15 PM PST up reply actions
Accusing the President of being a criminal is crackbrained.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 2:08 PM PST up reply actions
Not that I agree with anyone here
But lots of Presidents have been accused of being criminals and a few actually were…
I'm referring to this President specifically, since there's no evidence that he is one.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:21 PM PST up reply actions
well...
Saying he was born in another country is crackbrained.
BTW, even if Obama was born in Kenya he would still be a US citizen and could still be president.
"Not in your wildest alcoholic nightmare would you ever imagine such events unfolding!" Bill King
by Buck Turgidson on Dec 10, 2010 10:59 AM PST up reply actions
I don't believe that is true.
You have to have been born IN the US.
(I forget how or if military dependents born overseas are excepted)
Billy Beane... What have you done for me lately?
I don't believe they (military) are
I have close friends in the military whose kids were born in France and Germany. I remember having a conversation about it with the husband and I believe he said that they would still have to be born in the US.
Now I’m curious though, so I’ll have to ask him again…
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 11:17 AM PST up reply actions
In a little quick research I did...
…there was a minor controversy over Barry Goldwater’s candidacy because when he was born Arizona was a territory and not a state.
Not that it ended up being a disqualifying issue, of course, just an interesting little factoid I thought I’d throw in.
"We don't see things as they are, we see things as we are."
~ Anais Nin
Not true
You just have to be born as a US citizen, in other words, not naturalized. You can be born on the moon as far as the Constitution is concerned if your parents are US citizens.
Text helps
No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.
It’s clear enough. You have to be a citizen by birth, not naturalization; you have to be 35; and you have to have lived within the US for fourteen years.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
um you can totally build a time machine go back in time ratify the Constitution and then back to the future to run
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 10:15 PM PST up reply actions
There is no evidence that the President has committed a crime.
He hasn’t committed fraud or anything else.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:38 PM PST up reply actions
He did go back in time
He did take a time machine and traveled back in time and placed his birth announcement in a Hawaiian newspaper. That is the funny thing about the birther thing. If he was born in Kenya why would you travel to Hawaii and place birth announcements in the newspapers. This question was asked to Chuck Norris which he replied that’s a good question and I don’t know why.
note to self... before making a bad time travel joke read the whole thread to see if anyone else has first.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 10:16 PM PST up reply actions
-
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 11, 2010 11:51 PM PST up reply actions
Easily brainwashed = good.
Luuuuke… the Coliseum is your friend. Trust The Force, Luke.
Billy Beane... What have you done for me lately?
by UncleLeo on Dec 9, 2010 10:39 AM PST up reply actions 2 recs
I think I just smiled for the first time all morning...
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
by the_rozeboom on Dec 9, 2010 11:22 AM PST up reply actions
Also easily brainwashed...
I wish I could say it. But again political rants are only allowed in one direction here.
You're welcome to go hang out at, like, the Ole Miss blog if you don't like the atmosphere here
The purpose of the ban on politics is to prevent discussions from veering off-topic into areas not related to baseball. It is NOT— I repeat, NOT— to enforce some kind of neutrality rule where everyone has to pretend that everybody’s political opinions are equally valid
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Comments on people's political opinions are not permitted, period.
That represents “comments that bring politics, or other highly inflammatory non-baseball related topics, onto AN (which is a non-political blog).”
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
Flagged
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 11:18 AM PST up reply actions
Flagged
"Not in your wildest alcoholic nightmare would you ever imagine such events unfolding!" Bill King
by Buck Turgidson on Dec 10, 2010 11:32 AM PST up reply actions
Touche
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 11:51 AM PST up reply actions
Sorry, that wasn't clear.
Political opinions aren’t supposed to be expressed on AN. The content of those opinions is immaterial.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
From the CG: non-baseball related topics
its because they aren’t related to baseball and piss people off. If they are related to baseball theyre all good. The stadium is hella political but guess what we talk about it because its baseball related.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 12:23 PM PST up reply actions
It references politics specifically for a reason.
Because it’s an non-baseball related topic that especially pisses people off. Mentioning something Luke Scott said is technically OK, but if you’re doing it to start a long meta-discussion about Fox News and what you think of it, you’re violating the community guidelines.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
if fox is a news organization, why is mentioning it off limits?
Rhetorical.
Seriously, fox news viewers are the only ones that question the Hawai’i birth certificate, so it isn’t like it is unrelated
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
The Hawai'i birth certificate of itself is a topic that doesn't belong on AN.
Any discussion of it beyond the fact that it came out of Luke Scott’s mouth doesn’t belong, and even that only belongs in a dubious, letter-of-the-law sort of way. And painting people in broad stereotypes in the fashion you just did isn’t fair to people, either.
The more this gets discussed, the more it’s clear that DrDoom couldn’t be more right about an anti-right wing bias on this site, and having been here a long time, I’ll say it’s enforced that way too. Even mods and site admins interject comments from time to time that invite political discussion, but since they’re left-wing, nobody cares.
As someone whom most would characterize as left-wing, I find the institutional bias annoying and hypocritical, and I sympathize for those like DrDoom that feel it more acutely than I do.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
I didn't post a link to the original HardballTalk note when I saw it
because I thought it would degenerate quickly. Looks like I was right.
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
Yeah...I'm feeling pretty foolish for my fanpost now.
A full time A's fan in Portland who spends part of his time on AN.
Not so much tweeting as squawking: http://www.twitter.com/yusebio
I didn't think it would be that bad
its a fun topic. I liked the title.
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
Thank you.
I think it’s a combination of a frustrating and combative political climate in general meeting with an issue that sits right on the line of being more political than baseball related.
A full time A's fan in Portland who spends part of his time on AN.
Not so much tweeting as squawking: http://www.twitter.com/yusebio
I went into it a little in the DLD,
but your original post seemed fine to me. It was the comments that went over the line.
I don't think you're to blame, exactly.
Funny, I hadn’t clicked on your post until now, and had no idea that shitstorm existed.
Asking whether or not Scott’s recent comments might make him a cost-effective acquisition for the Oakland Athletics is very on-topic. Discussing what that cost would be as a result of the comments, and whether or not, in a very generic sense, they could affect his production in Oakland also makes sense.
Unfortunately, most people can’t discuss the question you posed without discussing the comments themselves, something that’s completely unnecessary to answering the question you posed—and something which does not belong on AN.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
It is 100% necessary to answer the question he posed
The reason that I do not want Luke Scott playing for the Oakland Athletics is the content of Luke Scott’s comments. It is impossible to make anything other than a completely unwarranted statement of opinion (“I hate Luke Scott! Why? Nobody knows!”) without actually discussing the comments.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
But that isn't what you did
You said that and then you started belittling other users to make your point… that is when the thread devolved and that was why others spoke up against you. The discussion there become a discussion of you as much as anything else.
I'd say your comments at this point are baiting
You can stop calling people bullies because they have a strong opinion.
"Not in your wildest alcoholic nightmare would you ever imagine such events unfolding!" Bill King
by Buck Turgidson on Dec 10, 2010 4:01 PM PST up reply actions
I said why I call him a bully
And it isn’t because he has a strong opinion. I appreciate his strong opinion and the strong opinions of others. My reasoning is literally right above your comment.
I don't see the belittling
If you say something that is demonstrably false and you get called on it and your response is well “we have a difference of opinion” and you continue on with the same line – well it’s just tiresome. And you should be called on it. Repeatedly.
"Not in your wildest alcoholic nightmare would you ever imagine such events unfolding!" Bill King
by Buck Turgidson on Dec 10, 2010 4:32 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I did nothing of the sort
Saying someone can stick their head in the sand if they want to, but that they’re ignoring real issues, is not “belittling” them. If anything, it’s telling them to take adult responsibility for their own choices.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
by PaulThomas on Dec 10, 2010 4:56 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Nobody ignored issues
in terms of baseball. You said that he would reject Luke Scott as a member of the A’s due to his comments. Others said they didn’t think the comments were not relevant to Scott’s ability to play baseball for the A’s. You insisted that they were and that people who thought his comments were irrelevant to his baseball-playing ability were being ignorant. As WaddellCanseco said, “willful ignorance is not the same as indifference”. It’s just your OPINION that his comments are relevant to his ability to play baseball; that is absolutely not a fact.
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 5:01 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
It's not my opinion that his comments are relevant to his ability to play baseball
It’s my opinion— well, actually, no, it’s just a fact— that his comments are relevant to my willingness to pay money to watch the Oakland A’s play baseball.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
by PaulThomas on Dec 10, 2010 5:04 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I have no problem with that whatsoever
It’s a perfectly valid point of view. I think the issue in the other post was that people just don’t like to be called ignorant when they aren’t being ignorant.
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 7:04 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
this.
Its just like if we signed Bonds. Whether steroids should be allowed by society or whether he should be prosecuted are absolutely political discussions that should occur on this blog.
No one disputed Scotts opinion of Obama’s performance, just the birth certificate portion which has been disproven time and time again.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 10:23 PM PST up reply actions
No he didn't. He said choosing to ignore the comments is willful ignorance.
Which it certainly is.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 10:20 PM PST up reply actions
You must have missed "in a very generic sense"
There’s no need to discuss them substantively.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
It was a good fanpost
And lots of people posted safe, reasonable responses. Then the bullies showed up and I challenged them. I am sorry it devolved, but I won’t let that kind of behavior go unchecked.
Nobody bullied you.
You want to argue with people and have them shut up and not say anything back. Sorry, but that isn’t how it works.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 4:48 PM PST up reply actions
You still haven't actually demonstrated any "bullying."
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 11, 2010 11:52 PM PST up reply actions
At what point can we stop "respecting a viewpoint" that is crackbrained?
Do I have to ‘respect the viewpoint" that Jews control the world’s money supply?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:42 PM PST up reply actions
Did you have to bring it up in the first place?
"Burt Reynolds witnessed the conception of his own dad, and frankly, that's what's wrong with him."- TPDMTD!
by Gaijin_Suketto on Dec 10, 2010 2:29 PM PST up reply actions
Dang. Above-thread, I discovered I am a professor without proper access to cocaine.
And now I find I’m a Jew failing to control the world’s money supply.
What’s wrong with me!!!??
Your poem here.
Is there like, um, a phone number or something?
“Hello, international banking conspiracy? I’m one of your peeps, and I want my share!”
Your poem here.
"P.S. I'll take my share in cocaine."
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
We have an office in Los Angeles. You should stop by.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 4:50 PM PST up reply actions
um if you control the worlds money supply you really should be able to find proper access to cocaine.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 10:24 PM PST up reply actions
See, that's the point! I'm 0-2.
At least I have cigarettes, which I pledge to smoke well away from you on any ticket lines.
Your poem here.
You don't have to respect it
You just can’t post anything inflammatory. That includes talking down to people who disagree with you or elaborating as to why a certain political viewpoint is not worth your respect.
So any ridiculous concept is now a legitimate, protected political viewpoint?
I will elaborate as to why I disagree with the viewpoint that Jews control the world’s money supply. I will elaborate as to why I disagree with the viewpoint that the federal government blew up the World Trade Center. I will elaborate as to why I disagree with the viewpoint that Barack Obama isn’t a US citizen. Because those aren’t viewpoints. They’re demonstrably false lies.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 4:51 PM PST up reply actions
Ok let me be clear
Saying Luke Scott is crazy is fine. Saying you don’t like him is fine. Saying you don’t want him on the A’s is fine.
Calling someone willfully ignorant for still wanting Scott on the team if we can get a good deal on him is not ok in my opinion. The mods can tell me I am wrong if they want but that just sounds like being mean and unnecessarily aggressive to me. Just say you don’t agree and that his views are too much for you to overlook, but leave the mental state of other users out of it.
I extend this to baseball arguments as well. Someone who does not like Jack Cust isn’t a moron. I disagree with them. I will ask how they can ignore the stats. I will implore them to reconsider. But I will not resort to name calling.
Relating an opinion you see as crazy to being a fox new watcher is also not ok in my opinion. Lots of people on AN watch fox news and these people do not appreciate the negative associations a small group of people make. Shall we just decide which groups of people we can and cannot belittle?
A lot of you accept your views as facts and just talk like its a matter of course. I bring up the popularity of the opposing view only to let you know that in fact there are many who don’t agree and take offense to the casual acceptance of your biased preconception. Things like Fox News and Bush have been mentioned more than a few times in a derogatory manner. No harm is meant I am sure but you must acknowledge it has no place here.
There are a lot of political ideas I have come to accept as basically fact but I know they are not adopted by everyone despite what I see to be a significant amount of evidence. I wouldn’t dare throw around my beliefs in casual conversation here or talk down to anyone who mentioned otherwise. I wouldn’t even bring it up because I know better and it has nothing to do with baseball.
by DrDoom on Dec 10, 2010 5:52 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
See, this makes me feel like you wanted to see bullying.
Lose the persecution complex.
Calling someone willfully ignorant for still wanting Scott on the team if we can get a good deal on him is not ok in my opinion.
What about calling him willfully ignorant for saying, “I don’t care what he said, it’s not important to me”?
leave the mental state of other users out of it.
Who called anybody insane?
Relating an opinion you see as crazy to being a fox new watcher is also not ok in my opinion.
When a “news” network has been proven, time and time again, to be the least impartial news source since yellow journalism, I think it’s OK to call them out for it. And when they employ a lunatic who spends every broadcast theorizing about easily disproven conspiracy theories and showing close-up focuses of his eyes, I think it’s OK to talk about whether or not there might be some paranoia or instability running through that programming.
Bottom line here: most of us do talk about our opinions as being opinions. But what we don’t respect are paranoid, delusional crazies. What I expect from adult human beings is RATIONAL THOUGHT. If people want to run around screaming about insane conspiracy theories, that’s fine, but don’t expect me to respect it.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 12, 2010 12:00 AM PST up reply actions
Thanks jeepers
Glad to know I am not alone in seeing this clearly. And for the record, Future Ed, your post is also offensive.
Bringing up the most popular cable news network in the country with the intention of making a negative political statement about those who watch it...
Is not a good idea. I think that would violate the ban on politics based on it’s intent.
Attempting to spin it as "the most popular cable news network" is an attempt to make a positive political statement about those who watch it
and would, by your standards, violate the ban on politics based on its intent.
See where this leads?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
by PaulThomas on Dec 10, 2010 2:52 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Pizza Hut claims to be...
…“America’s Favorite Pizza”. I’m sure because they sell the most, or something like that. Of course, “biggest” or “most purchased” doesn’t not automatically equate to good or best. It’s not my fault America has low standards of taste.
"We don't see things as they are, we see things as we are."
~ Anais Nin
Um, it is called ratings
Its fact… I guess I could have said most watched… that is what I meant. I wasn’t passing judgement. Keep bullying though…
You see? You're calling him a bully for disagreeing with you.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 4:52 PM PST up reply actions
No I am calling him a bully for fighting with me
When I wasn’t even posting anything provocative. Ratings are ratings… I was just trying to explain how the previous post was offensive to me and others. Why do you get to decide what is offensive and I don’t?
Right, for disagreeing with you, even though you said something you think is absolutely 100% true.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 12, 2010 12:01 AM PST up reply actions
So, now saying "facts" are okay
but only if they’re facts that support the right-wing agenda. So I guess we’re clear on that.
God knows, saying the “fact” that the President is not, in fact, a communist Muslim terrorist alien degenerate— well, THAT would be politics!
You could have said “Fox News.” Instead you said “the most popular cable news network.” That is a positive slant. If you are serious about the notion that any political slant of any kind is a CGV, then that comment is a CGV. If not, then stop abusing the CGV process to advance your own agenda.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
by PaulThomas on Dec 10, 2010 5:01 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
All facts are great
I am not defending Luke Scott or his beliefs. I happen to think he is wrong. Your facts are great and I appreciate them. I am not pushing any agenda except for being nice to your fellow A’s fans, even the ones that disagree with you.
I added the most popular thing to point out that there are a whole bunch of people that might take offense to what is being said. You cannot ignore their feelings because it is inconvenient to you or you disagree.
This is pretty basic stuff… Can’t we play nice?
I don't pull punches
The fact of the matter is that sometimes it leaves people with bruised feelings.
If it means anything to you, I can tell you that nothing I say on this site— or anywhere, really— is ever intended to insult people. (Well, there might be an exception if someone is really just so hostile that I lose my temper. But that’s not really reason talking, just anger.)
Fact is, when you make statements intended to force people to think about their way of thinking, as I did on that thread, sometimes it’s going to cause offense. It’s often misinterpreted as a character attack, but it’s not.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Why are you offended should be the question.
1. Fox news even says they are opinion news not real news. That is a difference. Same as you watch MSNBC which is opinion news. How is that offending.
2. This is not a political posting. There is no mention of political parties.
3. This is the problem with everything in America if you don’t agree with my side I am offended or I will put you down. This is the reason nothing has gotten done in Washington over the last 10 years.
4. The reason fox news came up on the post was because it was fox news that has pushed the birther agenda and it is their person Huckabee that has promoted it. All other news organizations know that it is a bunch of BS. even the courts have thrown out the ladies lawsuit. Plus you can view his birth certificate online so why would someone say he is not a citizen. If Luke Scott says something stupid he should be called out on it not ignored. Look what happen when someone said something stupid and was ignored it caused WW2.
This is all opinion
1. False. It has news and it has opinion… all media does this. Fox new does in fact claim to be real news.
2. It is political but even if it wasn’t you don’t have to be political to be offensive.
3. True
4. False to the Fox News part. I’m not gonna defend the birthers or Luke Scott… never was my intent. By all means call Luke Scott stupid. Please do not relate your feelings here to WW2… it demeans us all.
Its really not opinion
There have been plenty of studies of how Fox intentionally conflates news and entertainment.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 10:30 PM PST up reply actions
More than studies. There have been internal documents that show it.
Apparently another one came out recently that I haven’t seen yet.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 12, 2010 12:03 AM PST up reply actions
South by Southeast
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 9, 2010 12:19 PM PST up reply actions
That's OK, the noreasters are mighty cold though
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 12:25 PM PST up reply actions
Dr Doom it has to do with what came out today's news
Came out that Fox news used the government run health care as a catch phrase to opinion viewers toward hating the health bill. I used to be a mass communication major in college and it is easy to change any story into your opinion. It happens everyday on TV/radio by both sides. Fox news is opinion news just like msnbc is too. Most news is not. There is no drive by media as they quote just a way to get you to watch their show only.
Something came out in today's news about this?
When I said the other day that I’ve given up on the state of the nation, I wasn’t kidding. I really have kind of stopped reading the news.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:23 PM PST up reply actions
newspapers are all ads now days
Once in a while a story worth reading comes out. There was a story about a memo from fox news boss to their news team how to call the health plan government run health care so people would think their health care is controlled. Another story last week about how health care HMOs made up fake consumer groups and flooded the media with phony stats and stories. Most of these stories make back news because most people only care about what is happening with Lindsay Lohan rehab or who John Mayer is dating.
Same
News media is completely pointless. If it’s important enough, it will show up in history books in a few years’ time. If it’s not, who the hell cares? And it takes a while to get proper perspective on an event anyway.
RIght now it’s just biased, pointless hoopla to sell advertising.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
As of October, I was way committed to leftism/socialism/progressivism.
As of right now, I still believe all that stuff, but I’m not going to waste my time on a nation—and a world—full of people who refuse to look at the facts. The enemy is no longer a group of intellectuals who have done their homework and found my convictions to be not for them; the enemey has become an angry, terrified mob of 90% of humanity, lurching insanely between this way and that, whichever way the wind blows, believing whoever’s propaganda is strongest, steadfastly refusing to learn even the most basic facts.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:26 AM PST up reply actions
"Enemey"?
It’s spelled “Enemy.”
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:26 AM PST up reply actions
It is hard to debate anyone who holds your view
I understand why you hold it… but as frustrated as you are with simple folk like me, your world view is equally frustrating to me as it is hard to penetrate the wall you are putting up… Which is why we shouldn’t bring it up on a baseball blog that we all visit for fun.
If we all got into this I am sure we would all think everyone else here is nuts. How hard is it to just not post things that are offensive? Even if they are just offensive to right-wingers…
I wasn't trying to start a debate. I was explaining why I don't care to debate anymore.
The scared masses have drained and exhausted me. Can’t deal with them anymore. Sorry to disappoint. Keep up with your persecution complex, but there aren’t any Romans here, and no one’s crucifying you. If you’re offended by the fact that Barack Obama was born in the United States of America, I really can’t do anything about that.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 4:58 PM PST up reply actions
I wasn't attacking
I appreciate your honesty. I feel the same way sometimes. I don’t believe I am being persecuted and I am not offended by anything that has to do with Obama. I haven’t said anything negative about him.
I have no beef with you at all… I just want people to stop the name calling and dropping casual anti-right wing messages. You don’t have to… but I will call it out when I see it. And you are free to ignore me when I do.
All news is opinion news
Fox News is no more at fault than CNN, MSNBC or the major networks. They have more opinion-based shows, but I am just talking about the news part. To think you can get unbiased news in this day and age is a fallacy. But I am getting off topic… You related watching fox news to brain-washing or at the very least to Scott’s views that you aren’t a fan of… that is flag worthy.
You might think it is ok but that is because you are biased. It clearly is not.
Actually, there is a mountain of research that shows you're incorrect.
The difference between the real news media like NYT, WSJ, CNN, NPR, NBC, ABC, MSNBC, CNBC, WaPo, SFChron, etc., and the fake news media like Fox News is that in the real news media, Opinion and News are kept separate. On Fox, no matter what O’Reilly likes to say, that isn’t the case. You can find dozens of examples of opinion statements in “news” reporting on Fox PER DAY. Real news outlets do make mistakes, and they make them more frequently than they used to, but they run retractions when that happens. I myself made a couple of mistakes in a recent article I wrote for a major newspaper, and the paper had to run a retraction when we realized our mistake.
It doesn’t matter what the editorial slant of the paper is. The Wall Street Journal has been conservative forever, but their news coverage is impeccable.
Also, let’s be clear on something: I didn’t bring up Fox News.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 5:02 PM PST up reply actions
I don't want to have this fight
But there is plenty of research showing the opposite to be true and plenty of nefarious activities at the other news outlets. A lot more calories are expended attacking Fox News though. This will always be a matter of opinion.
We aren’t going to agree on this and this isn’t the place for debate. I am not here to defend Fox News. I am just trying to explain that you shouldn’t be able to just trash it and those that watch it with impunity on this site. If that is what this site is for then please let it be known and I will shut up.
brainwashing is done all the time
How many times are we told by ESPN that the yanks and redsox are the only teams that matter. How many times are we told Gammons is expert on baseball even though he picked Bobby Crosby for MVP.
The brainwashing in the post has to do with the news that came out the same day that Luke made his comments. A news channel was told by their boss to use the word government run health care instead of health care bill. That day all of their reporter used that term and has done so since. Repeating a word over and over to make someone’s have a unfavorable opinion of that word is brainwashing.
First of all, there isn't much research supporting any actual liberal bias in other media.
The closest anyone can come is the study that shows the majority of reporters to be liberals, and the majority of editors to be conservatives. And when a real media outlet DOES make a partisan screw-up, they get embarrassed and apologize for it. Usually, they OWN UP TO IT before anyone catches them. Not so with Fox; when Fox gets caught making partisan screw-ups (multiple times per broadcast), they get angry and defensive and never admit to having made a mistake. Seriously, it’s happened like twice.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 12, 2010 12:06 AM PST up reply actions
You should flag it
It pretty clearly represents “comments that bring politics, or other highly inflammatory non-baseball related topics, onto AN (which is a non-political blog).” And if it doesn’t result in a warning of some kind, you’d be right. To be honest, I think you’re right anyway. I am glad I’m not in that minority.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
by jeepers on Dec 10, 2010 9:27 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Relax the A's will be fine
Crawford noting going to the Angels is great news… let’s just hope they don’t get Beltre. We just need to at least pick up Matsui or maybe even Vlad….. but I’m not the least bit worried about the A’s in 2011. This is the first time since 2006 I felt they have a real shot.
Yay for dead guys in the middle of the order!
Let’s sign Babe Ruth while we’re at it.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 10:35 AM PST up reply actions
He could be our 5th starter, too.
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
by the_rozeboom on Dec 9, 2010 11:24 AM PST up reply actions
More like 1st starter
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 12:25 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah, I know his ability...
The fifth spot is the need at the moment.
At one point in my life I liked Dave Kingman more than Rickey Henderson. I was stupid.
Wait really you feel we have a real shot..?
Hmm in 2006 we had Frank Thomas and Milton Bradley. Nick Swisher was still on the team, Eric Chavez had a decent season that year. Dan Haren was our ACE that year, Zito had has last good year..
Frank Thomas had 39 HR, OPS+140
Swisher had 35HR, OPS+125
Bradley had 14HR, OPS+114
Chavez had 22HR, OPS+ 104
We had 4 guys who had OPS+ over 100..The 2011 version, I don’t see anyone on the team that will be putting this kind of OPS+..
The Red Sox signed Crawford?
To pair with Gonzalez?
Oh yay.
What’s the point of competing in baseball again? The rich only get richer.
"Nah, you look like Elijah Wood." - danmerqury
Also the A's should be rich.
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 10:40 AM PST up reply actions
It seems to me that trades are the only way to make any significant improvements to the team at this point.
I don’t think they have the minor league talent to land anything more than DDJ-quality players though, unless they’re willing to additionally take on a bad contract.
I think this is almost the way to go
I think if we pool a decent package and shoot for someone who’s been a good slugger but perhaps hitting the 2nd half of their contract could be our way out.
Maybe someone like Scott Rolen?
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
Why the heck would the Reds trade Rolen and why the heck would he want to go to Oakland?
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 12:22 PM PST up reply actions
not a matter of what Rolen wants (unless he's got a no-trade clause)
i’m saying that for us to make a move for a 4+WAR player seems like we’d have to pull of a Holliday-esque trade and take on a player already making a large salary.
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
Meh
Sometime this year I realized I was no longer very worried when Vlad came up to bat.
I could get behind something like “Finding the ‘A’ in Toh-may”
Also: Gobots? Best analogy ever.
YEs!
I frick’en LOVED gobots! of course my parents could never afford to get all 6 of us transformers, so we were strictly a gobots household. Those things ROCKED. I loved my mo-ped that turned into a fighter jet that turned into a quasi robot/fighter mo-ped.
I had the scooter/helicopter....loved it.
Hooray for growing up poor and not having transformers!
A full time A's fan in Portland who spends part of his time on AN.
Not so much tweeting as squawking: http://www.twitter.com/yusebio
A's need to overpay for Beltre
I see no reason why not.
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
He's the toga party of free agents
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 10:41 AM PST up reply actions
I think I'm beginning to understand why Beane is so terrible with Free Agents
He’s literally spend the last 2-3 years learning how to negotiate. Seriously, did he have any real experience before then? I mean, come on, the guy never had the resources to even bother negotiating with any of them besides when his own players went to Free Agency, and even then he couldn’t keep him.
I’m not excusing the fact that he doesn’t understand that lowballing these guys is just plain dumb, but honestly the guy has been with this organization. No one else.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
I have a feeling that culture comes from the top -- Wolff and his Right Hand (in every figurative sense of the word), Crowley
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 12:21 PM PST up reply actions
Okay
Here is the situation.
Right now, the A’s are essentially facing off against the Angels for Adrian Beltre (that is to say, assuming the A’s are actually interested, which, well, if they’re not interested in actually improving the team, something is very wrong here). The Angels have a crappy 3B situation right now: mostly Alberto Callaspo, since we can’t assume that Brandon Wood will be so lucky as to get another shot at a big-league roster. Callaspo, at third, is likely to produce something like a 90 wRC+. He’s also not a particularly skilled fielder, though he has been better at third than second, so let’s call him a 1.25 WAR player.
Wood is terrible, so we’ll exclude him completely.
There’s also Maicer Izturis, who will probably be needed many nights for utility duty, but might chip in some at third. Izturis is a little better hitter than Callaspo, and also fields better. Actually, they probably should just give him the starting job, cause he’s not a bad player. But whatever. He’s likely around 2 WAR over a full season. Adding up the two, let’s say the Angels are at 1.5 right now.
The A’s, with Kouzmanoff and the various replacements lying around, are in a similar position. Kouzmanoff was better than that last season, but that’s probably based on unsustainable fielding. Assuming he’s a +7.5 guy, true talent wise, with the positional bump, he’s probably around 2 WAR for a season.
Now, Adrian Beltre is much better than that. Entering next season, he’s likely around +12.5 with the glove and +10 with the stick, putting him at around 4.5 WAR. We can probably add in another half a WAR to his value to account for the benefits that either team would achieve by either trading, or using as a backup, the guy who would otherwise be starting.
For the A’s, that means that Beltre represents a 3.5 win upgrade. Okay, you say, so he’s worth around an extra $17M next season, but that’ll likely drop off in future years. Who wants that kind of long-term commitment?
The problem is that he’s actually worth more than that, for two separate reasons. First, if he is playing for an opposing team in the same division, you will face him 19 times (give or take the occasional day off) a year. That in and of itself punishes you because you suddenly face a more difficult schedule. 19 games is about one-eighth of a season, meaning that about 1/8 of the boost in Angels WAR will come directly at Oakland’s expense. Now the win swing is up to almost 4 WAR.
Second, he’s helping a division rival who competes for the same playoff spot. Baseball’s pretty random, in general, but it’s clearly not a good thing to have ones rival improve heavily at ones own expense. Both teams are trailing the Rangers by a good margin at this point, but I’d guess (albeit there’s a lot of speculation here) that the Angels’ acquisition of Beltre alone would lower Oakland’s playoff odds by something like 10 percent. That’s the equivalent of taking away a healthy number of WAR from the Oakland roster, probably around 1.5.
We are now talking about a total swing in value of something like 5.5 WAR. That’s A-Rod numbers, folks. Some claim that the A’s cannot afford to get into a bidding war with the Angels. The simple fact is that the A’s cannot afford NOT to. If the Angels sign Beltre, you can more or less kiss any hope of winning the division goodbye, because the A’s will be trailing two teams in the same division in both on-paper major league talent and talent in the farm system.
Getting lucky and overtaking one rival is not that unlikely, but two? It’s just not something that anyone can feasibly hope for. And no, getting a handful of Gothic Lolita girls from Harajuku to buy some tickets is not going to make up for that. Get off your ass, Beane. This is not the time to play the jilted lover. Scott Boras read the market better than you did. Get over it.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
by PaulThomas on Dec 9, 2010 12:12 PM PST reply actions 21 recs
Ummm.....can I rec this a million times?!?
Seriously, somehow get this to Beane, Wolff, Forst, whoever.
As ridiculous as this sounds, and barring a game changing trade (which is next to impossible), Beltre is our only shot at this division for the next 5 years.
Wow.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 9, 2010 12:18 PM PST up reply actions
Thanks for reminding me of the Gothic Lolita girls from Harajuku
(smiles)
And Rec’d.
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 12:19 PM PST up reply actions
I agree with all this
but isn’t that last 1.5 WAR kind of double counting?
by DrDoom on Dec 9, 2010 12:19 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Never mind he was on a roll
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 12:19 PM PST up reply actions
groll
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 9, 2010 12:24 PM PST up reply actions
I don't THINK so...
Value to A’s if signed +
Loss of value if signed by Angels as a result of A’s losing more games +
Loss of value if signed by Angels as a result of Angels winning more games =
Total net swing in value
Actually, if anything, I might have omitted the value that the A’s get if they sign Beltre from the Angels losing more games.
I’m not wedded to the calculations at all, so anyone’s (seriously, I mean this) welcome to critique it so that I can tweak it to better approximate reality.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I think of it as 4 WAR
With additional non-WAR benefits. I don’t know if the Angels losing more games where they aren’t facing the A’s should impact the A’s WAR. But the point is we should go all in on Beltre especially if the alternative is year after year of one year crappy $10m aging rental players.
"Additional non-WAR benefits" need to be monetized if you want to use the information to make an informed decision
on exactly how far, salary-wise, you’re willing to go to sign Beltre.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Well it is like with Matsui
and the additional income and Japanese attention… Does that mean Matsui is worth more WAR than his stats show? I think the better bet would be to take the 4 WAR and convert it to dollars and then estimate the financial benefit of the Angels sucking leading to us having a better chance of making the playoffs and add that to the total dollars Beltre is worth.
But the point is the same. He is worth it even if you stop at the 4 WAR upgrade.
Isn’t it fun when we agree?
I think it was on an Athletics After Dark podcast a few days ago
Where someone said that the Angels PR guys said the additional attention and ticket sales from Japanese sources paid for Matsui’s contract and then some.
Just throwing that out there.
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 9, 2010 4:32 PM PST up reply actions
?
6 million additional dollars of revenue doesn’t seem right. That’s way too much in one season.
I heard it was more like 1 million.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
perhaps they were throwing in the cost of free advertising?
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 9, 2010 4:50 PM PST up reply actions
Extrapolating on this...
I think we should also block LAA from getting Soriano. At this point, I’m giving Beltre 5/85 and Soriano 3/40, based on the fact that those 2 make the Angels MUCH better than they do for us, but also as well as making us a little better too. I like the idea of Soriano closing and Bailey setting him up. You can even flip the two or use Bailey as a reserve closer, Bailey also has the injuries so Sori looks like a good pickup in my view.
The worst thing that would happen is the Angels finding their own Bailey, the best would be finding their own Arthur Rhodes.
Soriano is a good closer,
but I just don’t see him being much more than a 1 win upgrade for them.
I also think Jordan Walden will be a stud, so either way I think they’re pretty set up at closer…
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 9, 2010 1:33 PM PST up reply actions
I don't think WAR is a good measure for relievers
I just want the Angels to have zero joy this offseason. I want them to sign Matsui and no one else.
I think that's because they're not worth very much, in reality.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 2:15 PM PST up reply actions
Not worth it
Spend that money on Thome/Manny instead. Sure, it’d be great if they had a crappy closer, but it’d be worse if we get left with Conor Jackson DHing.
Better bet would be to try and make sure they don't get a good DH
I am pretty sure we are in on so many of these DH names just to drive up the price. If we weren’t in on Vlad, Texas might get a deal. We start talking Matsui and all of a sudden the Angels want him back. In reality we probably only want one guy and it will be the guy we aren’t talking about (Manny/Thome).
It also assumes there are no other wins to be bought
If the A’s get Beltre, the Angels will likely use the money that would have gone to Beltre on something else. So they get 2-3 fewer wins from 3B, but they still have $17M to improve the roster elsewhere.
The same thing goes if the Angels get Beltre. The A’s would have Kouz and his ~2.5 WAR at 3B instead of Beltre’s ~4.5 (and whatever they could get for Kouz in a trade), but they also retain a pile of money to spend. They could get 3 WAR from DH, RF, 5th SP, or somewhere else for that money
How so? What other options on the FA market, after Beltre and Lee are gone, warrant that kind of money?
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
It doesn't have to be a single FA
For the A’s, they could grab any of Manny, Matsui, Lee, or Thome to DH. They could get Magglio for RF. They could get a 5th starter and/or a couple relievers. They could also take on salary in a trade, either now or later. A 2 WAR upgrade at DH, .5 at 5th SP, and .5 in the bullpen for $17M seems quite feasible.
There are still some wins to be bought, and there always will be. Beltre represents the surest and splashiest way to add them now, but the loser of the Beltre bidding will be much more likely to add wins elsewhere. The accounting in the original post only works if neither team can use their money elsewhere, which isn’t the case.
Fair points.
I agree that getting/not getting Beltre is not the be-all, end-all of the final WAR count.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
It's pretty close to it for Oakland
Players don’t want to come here. Not decent ones, anyway. Ordonez seems destined for Detroit, and there are surprisingly few other mid-tier (~2-3 WAR) corner outfielders. Damon might be one but he’s not exactly expressing a great deal of interest in another stint here either. Andruw Jones, maybe?
The Angels can probably find an outlet for the money, but Moreno may be unwilling to commit money to something other than elite talent if he knows that it’s going to push the team into the red in the short term.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
It's not at all clear that either team has a great many opportunities to improve other spots on the roster
The A’s have enough ready money that I don’t think a Beltre signing would preclude stopgap signings at RF/DH, 5th starter or for the bullpen.
The Angels arguably have a spot for a 4th outfielder and for a 5th starter, and they may be more budget-constrained (It’s hard to tell because the media keep contradicting each other on the issue), but again, there just aren’t a lot of expensive, effective upgrades out there other than Lee.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Now let's all flag it too!
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 9, 2010 12:20 PM PST up reply actions
Assuming that there is no other way to accumulate 5.5 WAR from the remaining FAs
I’m down with this.
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 9, 2010 12:23 PM PST up reply actions
Even if it's really 4, I'm still down with this....
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 9, 2010 12:24 PM PST up reply actions
Nicely done, PT.
Another angle here to consider: Rangers are looking for ways to get rid of Michael Young. If they were to do that, I can guarantee that they’d have really strong interest in Beltre, too.
It’s obvious that Beane just needs to offer Beltre far and away more money and years than the other guys, and not simply a (relatively) trivial amount more.
With the yo-yoing with the stadium issue and other associated things, this window right now is maybe the only shot this organization might have at contention for 10 years. Plus, by the time Beltre’s contract (let’s just say like 6 years and $90 million) starts becoming burdensome, there is a high likelihood that another ownership group would responsible for the end-year payments.
What have the A’s got to loose? They have the money and the need to desperate…so just be desperate…
I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!
Are they? The way I understood it, Colorado came to Texas asking for Young and were rejected.
Official Athletics Nation Rotating Tagline Editor
Pam liked my old sig better.
I'm not sure about who came to who...
but I imagine they would get into the Beltre bidding if they moved Young and didn’t get back a stud 3B in the trade.
I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!
I can't see them being able to move young
he is still owed $40M
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
$48M, actually
Not to mention, he has almost total no-trade protection. The Rangers can only force a trade of him to eight teams.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
(Colorado is one of the eight)
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
10 years?
I thought rebuilding took 4? So 2 cycles would probably get us in a similar position…
Not that I'm saying that we should rebuild...
Just saying that this isn’t the only time we will be able to contend and the rest of the decade will be filled with mediocrity or being terrible.
It can take 10 years to lose enough to get enough high draft picks to actually assemble a large corps of elite talent
The current A’s are still, essentially, in the dying embers of a cycle of competitiveness which arose out of the production of six homegrown star players (some of them through very high draft picks) during the period 1996-2000.
There’s a difference between short-run rebuilding, where you trade off top players for prospects and look to return to competitiveness within a few seasons, and long-term penury, where you’re just praying that enough stuff comes together all at once that you’re able to make an upward move. The Royals are just now trying to climb out of a stretch that’s lasted for 25 years. The Pirates have been in one for 18, and they’re a long, long way from getting out of it. I’m not sure the Orioles have even hit rock bottom yet.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
We're already 40% there
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 6:19 AM PST up reply actions
The A's haven't been losing nearly enough to qualify
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Damn underachievers
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 3:01 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah, we've been just mediocre enough...
to get a string of No. 10-15 overall draft picks, instead of Buster Posey and Friends.
Awesome.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 4:08 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
It's tough, the A's really need to add 4 players. Beltre, a right fielder, a DH, and another starter.
And the market will probably leave a few bargains behind, but the A’s are not in a position to take advantage of that.
Beltre, Kemp, Thome, and ya got me on the last one.
Official Athletics Nation Rotating Tagline Editor
Pam liked my old sig better.
Dunno about that either.
Webb and Pavano seem sought after, and there’s not much worth pursuit after that. I mean, I suppose they could convince Duchscherer back, but he probably needs a change of scenery. Or they could go after Andy Pettitte, but I mean, c’mon, he wants to be a Yankee.
I'm still pissed we didn't grab Zach Duke
That being said, I think there are other options out there…
Chris Young?
I can’t really think about anyone else right now, but even via trade I think we could find someone undervalued…
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 9, 2010 1:36 PM PST up reply actions
If healthy, he very well could be
The projection systems think he could rebound. There’s no doubt he’s got talent, he just needs to be healthy…
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 9, 2010 1:41 PM PST up reply actions
Getting healthy and staying healthy are two different things.
Padres blogs talked about him “just needing to get healthy” for something like 4 straight years.
I liked Young, but he’s a worse bet than Erik Bedard at this point.
A full time A's fan in Portland who spends part of his time on AN.
Not so much tweeting as squawking: http://www.twitter.com/yusebio
"We are now talking about a total swing in value of something like 5.5 WAR."
I’ve been saying this since the beginning of the offseason. Adrian Beltre is critical.
Rec’d.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
Follow up question:
So what would you conclude if the A’s continued to show no further interest in Beltre, thereby metaphorically handing him to the Angels on a silver platter?
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
I would conclude that Beane has again validated his ego at the expense of his duty of loyalty and competence to the team
as he did with the Cust/Jackson situation.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
That sounds pretty unsubstantiated to me.
There could be a variety of reasons beyond “Beane’s ego” to explain why the Cust move, the Jackson move, etc happened.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
I mean, it's difficult to untangle ego from business judgment
but the stuff that’s come out about Cust is pretty damning. At some point I stop giving him the benefit of the doubt.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I agree here
This Cust business really upsets me.
Remember all that crap about how Beane doesn’t want to get to know his players because of the attachment?
Fuck him.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 11:21 AM PST up reply actions
I'm starting to wonder if it's a bad thing that Beane has ownership stake...
For about five major, important reasons that are probably worthy of their own stand-alone fanpost, when I get some time.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 4:10 PM PST up reply actions
I've been wondering the same thing
Then again, I suppose he’s no more conflicted than any of the zillions of other corporate executives who have a piece of their own action.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Maybe he's taking a page out of those other CEOs' books
Tank the company so you can get bailed out by the federal government Blue Ribbon Committee!
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 7:06 PM PST up reply actions
All I know is that his getting an ownership stake,
and his making dumb decisions instead of smart ones, seem to have come at about the same time. What the two actually have to do with one another? I have no idea.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
If this happens
I will fully jump over into the Beane sucks and doesn’t want to win camp. Right now I am firmly on the side that thinks he knows what he is doing.
I am not saying we have to sign Beltre but LAA damn better overpay.
And here I was told that's nothing more than a conspiracy theory.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
I still don't believe Beane is INTENTIONALLY losing
But I could totally buy that his ego has gotten the better of him and the A’s are losing because of it…
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
Who said anything about intentionally losing?
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
That's what I remember arguing with you about
That he lowballed Iwakuma and was putting in second best offers for FAs to give leverage to go to San Jose. Am I misremembering?
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
My stance has always been that Beane/Wolff's efforts to attract top free agents have been insincere.
If you believe that Beane’s ego is causing him to demand that top free agents be signed on his terms only, is that not similarly an insincere effort considering that top free agents rarely sign on terms that are very favorable to you?
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 9, 2010 5:00 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
When faced with the choice of incompetence and conspiracy
I believe incompetence every time.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
Not quite
As far as I know, there’s no conspiracy here (in the sense of a bunch of people getting together to do something sinister).
Conspiracies don’t normally work— and should, thus, be disfavored as an explanation— because someone always blathers about them.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
THIS
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 10, 2010 6:53 AM PST up reply actions
When the conspiracy is like five people who all agree on the plan,
it’s probably easier to keep it a secret.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:29 AM PST up reply actions
Of course, if you want to explain it as "incompetence" related to Beane's ego,
you have to believe that an entire front office of scouting staff, executives, stat guys, etc, widely regarded as one of the best in the league, were either duped into believing that Beane wasn’t making poor decisions because of his ego and none of them raised any sensible objections whatsoever or that they clearly aren’t as smart as you are and didn’t realize that Beane was making mistakes in the first place.
While I wouldn’t be surprised if you believed the latter, you’d also have to believe that a general manager who’s been tenured for the better part of 14 years, 20+ years in the front office, and who’s regarded as relatively competent if not near the head of the class, inexplicably is incapable of reading the free agent market anymore and that none of his subordinates again, either spoke up or all of them just plain misread the data, or at least, not as smartly as you did.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 10, 2010 2:32 PM PST up reply actions
I don't think it's either a conspiracy or incompetence
I think it’s Beane taking actions which are personally interested rather than in the interests of the team.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
So all this haranguing was over nothing?
You do realize that’s
I think it’s Beane taking actions which are personally interested rather than in the interests of the team.
exactly what I believe too? We just disagree on the specific thing he’s “personally interested” in. Both are unsubstantiated speculation. But the difference is that I wouldn’t discredit your views as “conspiracy”.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 10, 2010 3:06 PM PST up reply actions
I'm not the one who called it a conspiracy
That was vignette17.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I am fine with personal actions based on ego, bias, whatever
classified as incompetence. I just don’t believe that Beane is purposely trying not to sign FAs.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
Exactly.
I believe FAs are purposely trying not to sign with the A’s, and are doing a bang-up job.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Or that they're not nearly as smart as everyone believes...
I don’t believe I’m necessarily smarter. I just think those with the most authority are no longer as smart as we would like to believe.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
Excellent
Let’s hope the A’s are following your plan.
"You know, a long time ago being crazy meant something. Nowadays everybody's crazy."
-Charles Manson
Don't judge me, but when I read "Okay, here's the situation," my mind went straight to
“My parents went away on a weeks’ vacation…”
Is it wrong that I kinda prefer E5 at DH?
Over Matsui/Vlad/Johnson/Lee/Manny…I seriously feel like we’ll get 1/3 of a healthy season from these guys. Matsui/Vlad=bad knees…Manny=old with a bad attitude/former juicer…Lee=bat speed falling fast from what braves/cubs fans have said…Johnson=made of glass. I honestly think we had the 2 best DH options available and didn’t tender either a contract so these guys are what were left with (and they will cost more)…whats the logic here?
by Po' Boy on Dec 9, 2010 12:52 PM PST via mobile reply actions
Touche
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 9, 2010 1:25 PM PST up reply actions
May I just say that
The highlight of this offseason was that one scouting report on Iwakuma that said he was “nothing special, just a guy”. I would hereby like to have “justaguy” used in regular AN vernacular. Nico, thoughts?
That would be a great SN!
It’d be such an inside joke though, that very few would get it…
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 9, 2010 1:37 PM PST up reply actions
Nico erased himself earlier today.
I think Bloomie’s in charge now.
"Burt Reynolds witnessed the conception of his own dad, and frankly, that's what's wrong with him."- TPDMTD!
by Gaijin_Suketto on Dec 9, 2010 2:39 PM PST up reply actions
That is correct
-LB
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
You can't automatically say 900 OPS
with the ages these guys are at…true edwin is not the best guy in the league to DH BUT he’ll give you the 25HR decent avg/obp that were looking for in a DH..with regards to Manny, it was less about bad attitude, more about age/former juicer..any of these guys could be out w injuries by May, leaving our offense f*cked, I don’t get that feeling with E5 and I’d feel comfy with him in the 5 spot…
by Po' Boy on Dec 9, 2010 1:47 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
I'd like an E5 platoon with someone like Branyan
It should be as productive as any other single player option. Of course Thome/e5 is better.
Thome/E5 would be great
I would rather Thome/Carter though.
Plus, it’s cheaper
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 9, 2010 1:38 PM PST up reply actions
I don't want Carter using up service time
as a platoon guy against lefties. That is throwing money away.
I do, if it means winning a World Series.
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 6:21 AM PST up reply actions
I don't
because we can get a different righty who mashes lefties with equal or greater production on a one-year contract
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 10:31 AM PST up reply actions
Carter service time
I think service time protection is not as important in the current environment as it was a few years ago. Expanded revenue sharing has left even the Nationals able to give out nine-figure contracts. The A’s seem to be able to extend everyone they want to a seventh season, and Carter with no fielding value doesn’t project as a superstar, a Carlos Pena type bat is a more likely successful outcome. The A’s biggest problem in the next couple years (after the stadium, though it’s related) isn’t money, it’s that they can’t get free agents at equal or slightly superior offers.
by vk on Dec 10, 2010 1:11 PM PST up reply actions
The Nationals have far more consistent and reliable revenue streams than the A's do
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
by PaulThomas on Dec 10, 2010 3:00 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Carter
I do not think service time should be a big issue. He is going to be 24 years old, we have his peak years locked up. The bigger situation is what is best for his development. Sometimes sending these guys back to the minors only stunts their development. He has had 21/2 years of AAA and really has nothing to prove in AAA. At some point next year he needs to be in the majors. If he can help the team in a platoon and pick up a few other ab’s why not. The A’s need to show they can compete with Angels or Texas if they are going to be taken serious by FA’s
ogallalabob
It's always an issue
It’s a full year’s worth of control. Bringing him up accomplishes pretty much nothing, especially because he really needs to work on his defense.
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 3:43 PM PST up reply actions
He has had 21/2 years of AAA and really has nothing to prove in AAA.
The first part of this is patently, obviously false. The second part is, too, unless you think that a DH with a major-league equivalent OPS in the low .700s has nothing left to prove.
And the notion that a free agent will look at the number of Chris Carter ABs in deciding whether to sign with Oakland… I mean, seriously?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
He's had 21/2 years in AAA?
10.5 years????
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 12, 2010 12:08 AM PST up reply actions
This just isn't true.
Expanded revenue sharing has left even the Nationals able to give out nine-figure contracts
1-The Lerner family is arguably the richest ownership group in baseball.
And, Ted Lerner is 85 years old and wants to win NOW.
2-The Nats’ payroll was reeally low last year. And they only have like 30MM committed to 2011, a bunch of arb cases but the only huge one will be Willingham.
3-DC is also one of the largest markets.
MOAR SPARTACUST. NOW.
by Blicks on Dec 11, 2010 9:20 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
strongly rec'ed
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 3:25 PM PST up reply actions
The connection between 40 platoon games of Chris Carter and winning a World Series is so ridiculously attenuated
that this effectively amounts to the old rule about a false proposition implying any proposition.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
The point is if you're in it to win it this year, you put your best foot forward full stop
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 3:03 PM PST up reply actions
Someone should tell that to the 2010 World Series champions
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I mean platoon at DH with Thome against lefties
It doesn’t prevent him from still being 4th OF/backup 1st…
If this was his position he’d still get 400+ ABs
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 11:23 AM PST up reply actions
I kind of wish we had considered Russell Martin
As backup C/1B/DH.
We could get him a good number of ABs and I don’t think he’s done, I just think he couldn’t take catching 140+ games 3 years in a row…
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
I like this too
But I don’t like people saying we need players that can play 1B. I’m penciling in Barton for 155-162 games, and I do not know why others arent doing the same. If he gets hurt, we put Carter there. If he needs a day off, we put Rosales there. We don’t need more “1B-types”.
I would like to see what we could get for Suzuki though….
Seriously? The guy had two seasons of wOBA hovering around .300
He would be a consideration if the A’s traded Suzuki, but that’s it.
I'm saying pretty much remove him from catching more than once a week or so
There is really no explanation for his severe drop off other than overwork at Catcher.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 9, 2010 1:39 PM PST up reply actions
Russell Martin is completely worthless as a player if he's not catching
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
So you're saying his offensive totals from '06-'08 are useless?
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 9, 2010 3:28 PM PST up reply actions
Didn't he, like, fracture his hip or something?
I’d say it’s a HUGE mistake to think he’ll be the same player again
Official Athletics Nation Rotating Tagline Editor
Pam liked my old sig better.
Torn Labrum in his hip
Did not know that.
My mind is definitely changed now
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 9, 2010 4:10 PM PST up reply actions
Stop hatin on Zook and White Rabbit
Ok, I really understand why everyone is down on Suzuki and Cahill. Yes, Suzuki had a below par season last year, but how many times have we seen a player bounce back from a shitty season to have an outstanding season the next year? With Suzuki’s work ethic and commitment to the game, I expect Suzuki to be one of our better hitters next year. In regards to Cahill, why is everyone buying into the assumption that Cahill will have a significantly worse year next year? Yes, he did have a low strikeout rate and he did record a lot of outs on balls hit in play, but that just speaks to how great our defense is. Our defense will likely be better or relatively the same next year depending on whether or not we get Beltre, so it is not a stretch to assume that our defense will convert on a large percentage of balls hit in play. Also, Cahill is still really young and his strikeout rate is likely to improve.
It's unlikely the A's defense will be as good next year
Simple regression to the mean would indicate as much. Barton and Kouzmanoff in particular will not match last year’s UZR numbers. They’re good, but they’re not that good.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Not neccessarily
For regression to the mean to be relevant, there has to be a large enough sample size. In the case of Barton, Pennington, Sweeney, Suzuki, and our other young players, they have not played enough seasons to determine that they will l regress defensively next year. I think that Barton, Pennington, and Suzuki our outstanding on defense, and it is not so far-fetched to assume that they could even be better defensively next year. After Chavez won his first gold glove, people thought that he would not be able to repeat his stellar defensive season but he continued to do so.
by Rygoslinglover on Dec 9, 2010 2:08 PM PST up reply actions
That's exactly the opposite.
If there was a large enough sample size, we wouldn’t have to regress to the mean. Regressing to the mean is what we use when we don’t have enough data. Is it possible Barton, et al, remain amazing defensively? Of course. But it’s much more probable that they regress somewhat. Since we don’t have enough data to know, we have to regress.
My bad
I needed to refresh myself on statistical definitions, and I do understand why you are skeptical. I don’t think that Barton will have the UZR rating of 14.2/150 games next year, but, at the same time, I don’t expect him to regress that much. I don’t think that we will look back at Barton’s career when it is all said and done, and see that his 2010 defensive season is just an outlier. I expect Barton’s UZR rating to be slightly lower than what it was last year for his whole career. Even if Barton does slightly regress, I don’t expect it to make a significant impact.
by Rygoslinglover on Dec 9, 2010 2:29 PM PST up reply actions
Going straight by the math, the regression is just what we have to do.
But my eyes agree with you. He’s a terrific 1Bman, and I’m expecting a pretty heavy positive number for next year.
Barton had a lot of errors
that pulled down his UZR number. I am hopeful that number can get better, but I do agree the league leading (or close to it) range cannot be expected to continue
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
Barton's broken finger certainly didn't help with his defensive stats
I can recall one or two throwing erros within a couple of days of the finger fracture. IIRC he told Fosse that he was adjust his brace daily to get a good feeling fit for the field.
There just aren't enough 1B chances, IMO, for anyone to ever sustainably post more than about a +10
Now, a true-talent +10 will have the occasional season where he spikes to +15 or +20, but that’s just a short-run hot streak.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Yeah, I don't expect +10.
Picks and scoops aren’t counted, so +10 is really, really hard. But a +5 seems doable.
Let's just do the count
Barton +5
Ellis +5
Pennington +5
Kouzmanoff +5
Suzuki 0
Crisp +5 (ish, depends on playing time)
Jackson -5
Sweeney 0 (guess, depends on health)
DeJesus +10
I’m looking at around +30 overall as compared to about +45 last year, or a loss of a third of the defensive runs above average.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I'm assuming this is pretty conservative, yes?
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 11:24 AM PST up reply actions
not really... Id be surprised if we outperformed +30 by more than 5-7 runs
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 10, 2010 12:26 PM PST up reply actions
No, I think it's very middle of the road
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Looking back at the numbers
yeah, I think it’s about right.
For some reason I just figured that Crisp is a lock for at least +10, but his career UZR is really inflated by a couple unbelievable years…
Pretty much, yeah, I had to go through the list again.
Barton, yeah that’s about right, Ellis is getting older, and Pennington is coming back from the shoulder surgery (which I literally just remembered).
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 5:09 PM PST up reply actions
It's more like, Crisp is probably a +10 over a full season but he's only likely to play half of one
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
That's why I don't get trading Rajai
You KNOW you’re going to need a backup CFer for a bunch of games. Take the CFer who’s also a great pinch runner and solid defensive replacement over the bleah fielding COFer who can’t stay healthy.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
by Nico on Dec 10, 2010 7:47 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
meh
I think jackson has a higher upside as a pinch hitter. Raj could steal bases, but wasnt a great baserunner. If coco goes down there is DDJ, to a lesser extent swingles and a host of Matts. I don’t think they are going to be substantially worse than Rajai for the short term.
I am not here to argue the package they got for him
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
I don't think Jackson has much upside as a pinch hitter
The pinch-hitting penalty, combined with the fact the A’s have Rosales from the right side, makes me less than enthused about the value of having Jackson in that role.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Do you know anything about Fangraphs' scoops stat?
I just noticed it recently, but I couldn’t figure out where they get it from. It’s on their standard fielding stats page.
FWIW, Barton led the AL last year—though it doesn’t mean much without knowing the number of opportunities.
Huh.
I’d never noticed it either, but apparently MGL wrote something on the topic last year.
http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/first-basemen-scoops/
And because defense requires such a large sample size,
a substantial element of regression to the mean is ALWAYS going to be part of any proper defensive projection. Getting “enough” data on a guy takes so long that by the time you’ve assembled it all, he’s probably a different player. That means you have to discount the distant-past data significantly. It’s like Sisyphus pushing the rock up the hill— you never quite get there.
I don’t know what the practical minimum percentage of a defensive projection has to be regression to the mean, but it’s got to be a pretty hefty amount.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
By the same token
I think it’s unlikely that Cahill DOESN’T improve next year.
"Some field has fences, and sometime, the field cant hold a player, but most of the time, a field cant hold Domingo"
www.domingobeisbol.com/Domingo/Home.html
He could "improve" and still post a worse ERA
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 6:22 AM PST up reply actions
I think using UZR numbers here is missing the larger point --
Kouz, Pennington, Ellis, and Barton are all very good fielders with good (in specific cases) range, arm, fundamentals, etc. That basic fact won’t change, which means that most ground balls will get fielded, most turnable DPs will get turned, and so on. How one of their specific UZRs will look is kind of beside the point.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
That's a really good point.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:26 PM PST up reply actions
Not really
The specific UZR numbers are required to know how much different next year’s defense is likely to be from this year’s defense. Just saying “they’re pretty good” isn’t good enough. How good? How good were they this year? How good can we reasonably expect them to be next year? And how much will the team suffer (or gain, but in this case suffer) based on the differential?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
But remember, we prefer a larger sample size.
A one-year sample of UZR isn’t trusted for a reason. I think we can be reasonably confident that, although Daric Barton’s UZR will be at least slightly different in 2011 from what it was in 2010, he will be largely the same defender.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:34 AM PST up reply actions
If the team UZR is worse, it means that fewer ground balls are fielded and fewer DP are turned
That’s not beside the point.
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 6:23 AM PST up reply actions
But say hypothetically
2 or 3 starters at each INF position, because of variance, fielded a higher percentage of balls in their defensive zones. Our INFers field the same percentage of balls they fielded last year. Wouldn’t our INF UZRs go down simply because the league did better as a whole? And if this was true, it’s not like our INFs true-talent levels changed.
I think that’s what Nico is getting at.
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 10, 2010 7:01 AM PST up reply actions
Sure but then our defense would really be nothing special.
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 3:04 PM PST up reply actions
What I'm getting at is that the collective UZR of the infield
means more than the UZR of any one, and looking at who the 4 fielders are there’s reason to believe that they will, collectively, be about the same: very good.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
No, not really
Three of them are likely to regress toward the mean and the fourth is likely to be about the same.
That means it’s likely to be worse next season. Still good, but worse.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I am not
I totally expect Cahill to do what he did last year. Dominant performances will happen against bad teams. Teams like the Red Sox and Yankees will probably eat him alive. He will continue to dominate the AL West.
Suzuki is a gamer and a leader. He knows he sucked last year. You can bet he’s working his ass off this offseason to become the player he was in 2008-2009.
Please bet me money on this
Give to the United White Bar-Passage Fund— an overstated claim is a terrible thing to waste.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Your Fund seems to change its name once a week.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:27 PM PST up reply actions
Assuming we strike out on Beltre...
and we have to turn to trades my plan would be….trade Ross+Donaldson or whoever for Casey McGhee…then trade Kouz to the Rockies for Seth Smith (throw in swingles if you gotta). Sign McCarthy to 5th starter, pick-up one reliever. Defense at 3rd would take a hit assuming Kouz sustains that UZR (which isn’t gonna automatically happen) but the offense would be greatly improved. A line-up of Crisp, DeJesus, Barton, McGhee, DH, Smith, Suzuki, Ellis, Pennington looks good to me, and best of all, they are young and controlable for a few years. Thoughts?
by Po' Boy on Dec 9, 2010 1:58 PM PST via mobile reply actions
Seth Smith?
Seth Smith really doesn’t do much for me. He only hit .246 last year, and he was playing in a hitter’s friendly park. Giving up Sweeny and Kouz for Smith is too much. Sweeney alone has more value than smith. I would rather us find a way to trade for Beltran and sign Matsui to be our Dh.
by Rygoslinglover on Dec 9, 2010 2:11 PM PST up reply actions
Yes his avg wasn't great but he has power and is in good healt
So I don’t really see how sweeney is more valuable then him, not to mention he’s not a downgrade on defense so there goes that arguement. Either way, taking swingles out of the trade, would you make that trade? P.S….Kouz+Sweeney+Beltran+Matsui’s contracts is a lot more money than I had propositioned, and youd still need a RP and 5th SP.
by Po' Boy on Dec 9, 2010 2:24 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
yeah
Well, I think that the 5th Starter can come internally. Outman, Ross or Cramer are all viable 5th starter options, and they would come a lot cheaper than anything on the market. I am really not too excited about the A’s going after McCarthy because I don’t think that he is necessarily better than the three aforementioned pitchers. We could find some good Relief pitchers from that Rajai Davis trade, so we may not have to spend too much on relief pitchers. I do love your proposal of getting McGhee. Maybe a trade of Kouz and Outman for him?
by Rygoslinglover on Dec 9, 2010 2:39 PM PST up reply actions
I'd do Kouz and Outman but they wouldn't I dont think
They are looking for pitching so maybe, but Outman I’d rather hold onto since his value is at an all-time low. For that reason I’d go with Kouz and Ross, but I’m not sure they’d want Kouz which is why I kinda broke it up into two seperate trades since the Rockies need a 3B and the Brewers want piching. I’d like Donaldson to be included in any trade since there isn’t a spot for him as long as Suzuki is around, he has good value and seems like the perfect trade chip…Oh yea, look at Seth Smiths amount of PA’s, he could do some serious damage with that power and everyday playing time.
by Po' Boy on Dec 9, 2010 2:50 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Definitely
Yeah, I agree that trading Outman now might not get us much in return, so it does make more sense to package Ross and Donaldson for McGhee. I am slightly reluctant to trade Ross since he is so young and promising, but we do have a lot of good young pitching already. I would trade away a good young pitcher if it meant getting a good young hitter like McGhee. Do you think the Brewers would trade away Corey Hart for Ross and Outman? I know that they just gave Hart an extension, but the Brewers desperately need pitching.
by Rygoslinglover on Dec 9, 2010 3:09 PM PST up reply actions
i don't think ross or outman will be ready to go early in the season.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
at a minimum neither will be effective even if they're healthy
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
Eh, I wish they would but I don't see it happening
I think they would be willing to part with McGhee for young pitching, you’d have to include Krol to get Hart probably and that may be an overpay. I’d be willing to do Donaldson, Ross, and Krol for him but I’m not sure many would think thats a smart move. Basically, I think the chances of aquiring McGhee without overpaying are more realistic then going after Hart, partly because of the extension and partly cuz he’s a better player then McGhee.
by Po' Boy on Dec 9, 2010 3:36 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
True
I would aboslutely love for us to snag Mcghee and then trade for Beltran. The Mets seem like they will move Beltran without expecting too much in return, and Beane’s relationship with Sandy Alderson makes a trade for Beltran that much more likely. I don’t think that the A’s will have to give up much more for Beltran than what they would have to give up for Seth Smith. Who would you rather have at this point? We could then get Matsui, Guerrero or Branyan to Dh so our lineup would look like Crisp, Dejesus, Barton, Beltran, Matsui, McGhee, Suzuki, Ellis, and Pennington. That looks like a pretty solid and realistic lineup.
by Rygoslinglover on Dec 9, 2010 4:00 PM PST up reply actions
McGehee
McGehee
McGehee
McGehee
McGehee
McGehee
McGehee
McGehee
McGehee
It’s three syllables, not pronounced like the name from the Janis Joplin song.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Prick, 1 syllable...
Just kidding, just kidding
by Po' Boy on Dec 9, 2010 5:16 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
I thought it was "PURR-ick."
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
ha!
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 11:24 AM PST up reply actions
It's two syllables, actually
It’s pronounced exactly like Willie McGee’s last name.
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 9, 2010 10:27 PM PST up reply actions
Well, stomp on frogs and shove a crowbar up my nose
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
As fun as that may sound,
the frogs are tastier barbecued, and Bloomie forgot the crowbar.
ChickenStanley has some cookie hazing ritual you’re going to have to go through, though.
"Burt Reynolds witnessed the conception of his own dad, and frankly, that's what's wrong with him."- TPDMTD!
by Gaijin_Suketto on Dec 10, 2010 12:28 AM PST up reply actions
Holy crap!
Did you just quote a Garfield comic from like 20 years ago that I somehow remember word for word?
www.curveballcity.com
by CurveballKing on Dec 10, 2010 10:51 AM PST up reply actions
These are the precious moments in life.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:44 PM PST up reply actions
I think he did.
I think Garfield was still funny then, or I could’ve just been too young to know better.
A full time A's fan in Portland who spends part of his time on AN.
Not so much tweeting as squawking: http://www.twitter.com/yusebio
Garfield wasn't ever REALLY funny.
But Jim Davis was less of a sellout hackneyed corporate goof.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:56 PM PST up reply actions
Yes
Impressive.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I swore I remembered that line
Now that you mentioned that it was Garfield, I do remember it. I actually remember laughing so hard I cried when I read the line originally, for some reason.
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 3:24 PM PST up reply actions
Casey McGehee/nsj Trivia
One of two current major leaguers to hit a homer off me in high school.
The other?
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 12:26 AM PST up reply actions
gotta narrow it down a little
Division?
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 10, 2010 7:02 AM PST up reply actions
Wow
Yeah, I really wanna know who the other is…
Ok, so McGehee went to Soquel High near Santa Cruz from around ‘99-’03, so I’m gonna say it has to be someone who played in the SCCAL I’m assuming (unless you played him in a non-conference game).
Hmm….I’m getting warmer…
Carlos Torres played for Aptos around the same time, but he’s a pitcher (did he hit in high school?)
So, if it was within division then I say Torres.
If not, then I have no clue…
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 11:47 AM PST up reply actions
pitchers were usually good hitters in HS
we are looking for someone born around 1982
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
Torres was born in 1982
That’s why I do think it was him…
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 12:58 PM PST up reply actions
where did you find the high school data
I looked at B-R but didn’t see anything.
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
I just figured what conference Soquel High was
And then looked at the high school.
Searched each school on Wikipedia to see who the “notable alumni” were.
Yeah, now I feel like a creepy sleuth.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 2:34 PM PST up reply actions
Wow, good research, now I feel bad because I realized it was basically unguessable by those means.
McGehee graduated in ’00, I believe, as I did.
The other guy was Chris Dickerson, who was a stud outfielder for Notre Dame-Sherman Oaks in Southern California. We played them in a tournament in the South Bay though (it was at either Washington Park or Buckshaw, can’t remember which). So, kind of an unfair question because he’s an out-of-area guy.
Dickerson (Reds OF) crushed a ball that probably went 400 feet. It’s pretty rare for a high school hitter to be scary, but facing him felt like the way I do in slow-pitch softball when I pitch – like I’m just a sitting duck if anyone hits a hard comebacker. Facing a guy who is a very good hitter who still uses aluminum is a helpless feeling.
Would have been a better question if both guys were from the same area. I did not know Torres was local. We never played Aptos though. Never played Tulo at Fremont, either.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 4:23 PM PST up reply actions
So I went to check and see if any of the MiLB prospects I played against in high school have made it to the bigs,
and I was surprised to find out that Joey Devine and Brad Ziegler are from Kansas. Did not know that. It’s even possible that I played against Devine, since Junction City isn’t terribly far from where I lived.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:51 PM PST up reply actions
Only one I've got was Aaron Poreda
I played with him once in High School….
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 2:34 PM PST up reply actions
That's a fun game - looking up old teammates and old opponents
Guys like flipgatey who have juco experience or higher probably have tons of “six-degrees-of-separation” contacts like that.
I think it’s a powerful to see the guys who you were certain were the most talented in hs who end up having shorter careers than their seemingly much more talented teammates.
This guy was the 27th man on our 27-man varsity roster my senior year. He was about 5’0 at the time. Always a very hard worker with good fundamentals, though.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 4:30 PM PST up reply actions
5th starter options leave much to be desired right now
I’d say there is a fairly good chance: Braden/BAnderson/Cahill go on an unfortunate DL sting next year. Does any fan really want Cramer or Moretenson as a 4th and 5th starter. I want to believe Outman will be a factor, but have a feeling he will be out all year like Devine.
No thanks to McGehee.
Defense is good.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 2:18 PM PST up reply actions
Offense is JUST as good
And thats what McGhee provides. Kouz will regress some defensively, and even if he doesn’t, McGhee is a BIG upgrade on offense, and avg to a little below avg defensively…Kouz was a little below avg offensively and has been on the decline the past 3 years.
by Po' Boy on Dec 9, 2010 2:27 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Not to mention
There is a better chance that a player (McGhee) will improve on defense than there is that a player (Kouzmanoff) will improve on offense.
by Po' Boy on Dec 9, 2010 2:38 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Wouldn't that be funny
Kouz has a break out season and hits 35 home runs while batting 280/350. Just in time for his free agency. Just once like to see him hit to the opposite field.
He still has 2 more years til FA
So don’t count on it just yet
And there's also a good chance that McGehee will regress on offense too
I don’t understand why everyone is so pessimistic on Kouz’s defense, but won’t believe that he can have bounce-back year.
He can have a bounce-back year.
He’ll bounce all the way back to a .300 OBP.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:35 AM PST up reply actions
Kouz will also regress offensively.
And McGehee’s offense isn’t good enough to outweigh the creation of a huge hole in the infield defense.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:29 PM PST up reply actions
Reason why we need Manny/Why Manny is awesome vol 87235
"I’m not sure Manny knew about it. In fact, I know he didn’t know about it because we were all surprised. I don’t think Manny felt anything affected him during the season. It’s just the fact that when you find out you’ve got a situation where you’ve got to have surgery for a hernia-like situation, you obviously know it’s impactful."
—
Scott Boras on Manny Ramirez’s offseason hernia surgery. Only Manny Ramirez, a player so in his own world, could have a significant enough injury to affect his on-field play as well as require surgery, while having no idea that he was ever afflicted.
(h/t Hardball Talk)
So that explains Manny’s power outage last year. I’m going to really hate Beane if he gets us Matsui instead of Thome or Manny. Thome and Manny absolutely have to be our best 2 options at DH in 2011.
Agreed
Although, I have always been really annoyed by Manny. Undoubtedly, that has a lot to do with his dick getting sucked by the plethora of obnoxious Red Sox fans and media outlets, but, if we were to sign Manny, I really hope that A’s fans would not use the tired old phrase “It’s just Manny being Manny!”
by Rygoslinglover on Dec 9, 2010 3:05 PM PST up reply actions
Just FYI, I'm flagging this comment
Please read the CGs if you need clarification on what ways of expressing yourself cross the line on AN.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Heh
wow
"Some field has fences, and sometime, the field cant hold a player, but most of the time, a field cant hold Domingo"
www.domingobeisbol.com/Domingo/Home.html
Yea?
There’s throwing in an f-bomb now and then, and there’s using offensively graphic phrases for no reason. The latter is a clear CGV.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
You know, A's fans invented that phrase.
Used to be called “Rickey being Rickey.”
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:32 PM PST up reply actions
A player's own agent's word should not automatically be taken at face value.
Billy Beane... What have you done for me lately?
Besides, even IF Boras was completely telling the truth in good faith,
we have no idea if it caused his power to drop or not. He’s 38. These things happen. To latch onto the first reason that pops up and stick causality on it is silly.
+1
He’s 38 and could break pretty early in the season. It’s not 04’ dude, and I really don’t see Manny being Manny going forwarf. AND I don’t believe a word outta Boras’ mouth.
by Po' Boy on Dec 9, 2010 3:43 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Manny has been healthier in general than Matsui
or Vlad. All these guys have flaws. I think Manny has the most upside.
So what you're saying is, Manny's in the best shape of his life?
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 9, 2010 8:30 PM PST up reply actions
He probably lost 35 pounds
And gained 15 pounds of muscle.
And had laser-eye surgery.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Dec 10, 2010 12:29 AM PST up reply actions
I should do that
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 6:25 AM PST up reply actions
me too.
except the laser surgery part. I have to actually have corneal transplants instead.
Official Athletics Nation Rotating Tagline Editor
Pam liked my old sig better.
I just got
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:37 AM PST up reply actions
A dancing squirrel?
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 10:33 AM PST up reply actions
Well you can see all kinds of things, including dancing squirrels, better when you're wearing glasses.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:51 PM PST up reply actions
It says "Image Not Available" on a fake MTG card
and has a picture of a dancing squirrel
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 3:25 PM PST up reply actions
Crap, it showed up for me before.
It was supposed to be Glasses of Urza.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 5:08 PM PST up reply actions
That's weird
If I copy the link for the pic and paste into my browser I can see the pic. However, this is what I see right now:
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 7:09 PM PST up reply actions
on a fake MTG card?
They should have at least given the squirrel TRAMPLE.
"Burt Reynolds witnessed the conception of his own dad, and frankly, that's what's wrong with him."- TPDMTD!
by Gaijin_Suketto on Dec 10, 2010 2:40 PM PST up reply actions
There are positives to the A's being low budget
When we win, it is that much sweeter. see David v. Goliath.
It is easier for us to buy cheaper seats and sneak into better ones.
We get to watch future superstars develop before they go on to sign massive contracts elsewhere.
Hi ho.
Which future superstars are we watching develop?
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 6:25 AM PST up reply actions
We get to watch historical superstars centuries AFTER they went on to sign massive contracts elsewhere.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:38 AM PST up reply actions
By that logic, how about Adam Everett?
Totally and utterly right-handed.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Huh?
Is Adam Everett super interesting? When you are talking about all these old DH guys it’s a crapshoot. Nobody can know if Manny or Matsui performs better. So why not pick a guy that best fits line-up needs. Vlad is probably the best option. Is he an option?
Thome is just far and away a better bet than any of the rest, IMO.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
agreed
if he weren’t already in bed with the Twins, I’d say go after him HARD, but he’s in Min. next year, for sure, it seems.
If he's really in bed with twins I doubt that he'd be interested in Beane going after him hard
It's because he derived his torque from the buttocks -- cityplANner
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 10, 2010 6:26 AM PST up reply actions
Twins can be guys too, you know.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:39 AM PST up reply actions
Well, then we'd be talking about Bean going after him hard
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 10:39 AM PST up reply actions
Isn't Beane in bed with twins pretty much right this second?
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Twins?
A full time A's fan in Portland who spends part of his time on AN.
Not so much tweeting as squawking: http://www.twitter.com/yusebio
Dude, you just got played
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Line-up needs=GOOD HITTERS
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:38 AM PST up reply actions
O/T Question regarding contact lenses and if anyone here has had dry cornea?
This is long but here goes…
I have been wearing contacts for about 10 years. I was a moron and wore extended wear lenses for extended periods of time without taking them out. I would say that I developed an infection about 10 times over those 10 years that would clear up within a few days. My eye doctor would comment on the scarring on my right eye caused by these infections and tell me to be more careful which I am now. For the last year anyway.
I now take my lenses out every night without fail and shower first thing and insert them every morning. Discarding them when I am supposed to. I suffer from allergies and get itchy eyes and they dry out etc. About two months ago my right eye stayed red for days on end and the vision became blurring and it even affected my reading. My left eye needed reading glasses but the right was fine. After about four weeks the right was way worse than the left, watering at night when watching TV and very sensitive to light.
I go to the eye doctor and she gives me one day disposables that are better suited and she schedules an exam for me. Two weeks ago she checks my eyes out and said my right eye was covered in allergy bumps and she put me on a steroid/antibiotic and told me not to wear a lense for 10 days. I go 12 days without a lense and I take ALAWAY drops for allergies as well and the red disappears instantly. My eye looks and feels much better but I continue to walk around half blind and not put a lense back in. I run out of the allergy drops and with half a day the eye is watering, red and irritated. I run down to Target and get the drops and bingo, No red eye. I called up to make a follow up appointment so she can check it out and decided in my infinite wisdom to put a lense back in two days before the appointment so I can report how the eye feels. I put the lense in and have all my sight back, my reading is back to where it was 6 months ago and I think, GREAT, everything is fine.
I go in for my appointment and she is not there as she’s sick so I get a different doctor who looks ant my right eye and shits himself. “Your right eye is really bad, twice as bad as when she looked at it, there is a huge dry spot on the cornea and other dry spots all over the eyeball”. Then he tells me he has no idea what is causing them and I told him she said allergies and problems from infections and he kinda disagrees but cannot give me the answer. He was going by what she wrote on the chart from 10 days ago and what he sees. So now he tells me NO CONTACTS in the eye and I have to lubricate the eyeball like 10 times a day with a lubricant.
He did kinda look at me when I told him I never uses rewetting drops or lubricants and that I just shove lenses in and ignore them.
After this mile long description, Has anyone else here had any sort of problem like this. My sight itself has tested the same for four years in a row so it has not deteriorated. It is bothering my to hear I have DRY PATCHES ON MY CORNEA. Just wondering how common it is.
I take new antibiotics without the steroid they gave me and I see here in 3 days. I just hope the dry spots have disappeared a little. My left eye has them but nowhere near as bad and he said I can wear a lense in them. I did find one thing that causes the eye to dry even more and that is using antihistamines like benadryls especially if I take two or three at once like three times a day (LOL)
Any thoughts appreciated
PS: Sorry about the off topic
I know this is supposed to be about baseball but I figured enough of you will see this and maybe one or two of you have some advice.
Thanks
No prob - AN is a community, too.
I wear contacts but they’re 2 week disposables and I don’t know anything about dry cornea.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I wear those as well
But I think I am going to go with the Acuvue moist 1 day. They are supposedly for alleries as well. I guess I will find out when I go back on Monday.
I'm more of a glasses kind of guys...
poking myself in the eye and sticking something there doesn’t seem comfortable. My brother had a huge infection/bacteria bubble in his contacts and my eye doctor freaked out when he saw it. (we have the same doctor) He took pics of it since he said it was the biggest bubble like that he has ever seen, but he may have been kidding. Doesn’t seem like a good idea to have contacts in for too long. Sorry that I can’t really answer ur question tho.
I recommend
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:40 AM PST up reply actions
If we're posting MTG cards, this one will help for next season
"Burt Reynolds witnessed the conception of his own dad, and frankly, that's what's wrong with him."- TPDMTD!
by Gaijin_Suketto on Dec 10, 2010 2:45 PM PST up reply actions
Man, has WotC run out of any idea that doesn't involve themed creature decks at this point?
Still, those were always a lot of fun to play. Wish I’d stayed active (but also I don’t wish that, because $$$.)
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 5:09 PM PST up reply actions
Well no one in the division has gotten much better so far this off-season
The Rangers have acquired Yorvit Torrealba via free agency and have lost Jeff Francoeur. Additionally, Texas will probably lose Jorge Cantu and Cliff Lee to free agency while Vlad appear less likely to re-sign with them.
Angels: They signed Hisanori Takahasi, who was a “roaver” between the pen and rotation for the Mets. He did put up a nice ERA, but isn’t all too great. Other than that not too much coming from the Angels, except for the probable loss of Godzilla
Mariners: They aren’t in the league of the three other teams in the division, but they have been pretty active. They have acquired Jack Cust and Miguel Oliva; not bad, but also not enought to contend.
While the A’s have only been able to bring in David DeJesus and a couple minor leaguers, i have confidence that Bean and Co. will do what is needed to upgrade. The rest of the division haven’t been able to at this point, and i am not sure they will.
"He who lives on hope will die fasting" Benjamin Franklin was a fool
"If we are thinking playoffs, why not look towards the mountaintop"
I like my quote better
by nocal81(Vincent) on Dec 9, 2010 11:59 PM PST reply actions
The good news is that the Rangers won't "improve" even if they resign Lee
Although one could argue that a full season of Lee could be good for a few wins.
True
However, even if the Rangers re-sign Lee, which is unlikely, they won’t be much better.
Colby Lewis was 31 this last season, and had his best year by far, however, don’t expect a repeat performance in 2011. His best ERA prior to this season was 6.29 and his career WAR total prior to 2010 was -0.9 in 72 career appearences (34 starts).
CJ Wilson had started 6 games prior to 2010, and led all American League starters in BBs (93). However, i see him somewhat matching his 2010 performance in 2011, but not completely equaling what he did last season.
Add the fact that if the Rangers lose Cliff Lee, they will most likely replace him in the rotation with Feliz, leaving a glaring hole in the back end of the bullpen.
Additionally, losing Molina, Cantu, and Vlad will not help their offense. Minus a big addition this off-season i see Texas falling back and struggling to hit .500
"He who lives on hope will die fasting" Benjamin Franklin was a fool
"If we are thinking playoffs, why not look towards the mountaintop"
I like my quote better
by nocal81(Vincent) on Dec 10, 2010 12:42 AM PST up reply actions
Plus I find it hard to believe that Hamilton can repeat his 2010 numbers
by Furyan on Dec 10, 2010 12:46 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Also
we will be getting a healthy Brett Anderson into the fold. All of this doom and gloom about the A’s makes no sense. It isn’t like we are in the AL East, and its still only December 10th. A’s fans seem to have a short memory in regards to what Beane and Co. can do with a small payroll.
Texas would have gotten better if they had signed Crawford or Beltre, and re-signed Lee. At this point none of those seem realistic. Additionally, they have some players coming off of career years. The Angels are nowhere near a scary as they once were, and Seattle, well they are Seattle
"He who lives on hope will die fasting" Benjamin Franklin was a fool
"If we are thinking playoffs, why not look towards the mountaintop"
I like my quote better
by nocal81(Vincent) on Dec 10, 2010 1:03 AM PST up reply actions
Well I don't think it would be wise to look too much into +/- over last year
For example, some people believe that pennington, ellis, crisp, etc. ‘s 2010’s were flukes and will regress next year. But at the same time, an argument can be made for the kouz and suzuki regression, and that they will improve a bit. These might about cancel out.
The same can be said with a possible Cahill/Gio regression opposed to a full season of Anderson and without half a season of Sheets. Or with injuries.
We can’t make little +/- WAR projections for everyone we, the Rangers and the Angels have. What we must start at (assuming we sign only mid-level players) are the 2010 records of each team. If we use the Pythagorean records, we should start at 5-6 games behind Texas. So, we should hope for that difference on team growth, signings, midseason trades and pure luck to account for that difference. I guess I don’t understand why people are panicking that we are going to be a 70-75 win team, when we’ve only lost one player. (I’m not saying that Cust isn’t worth anything, but it’s not like he holds the team together.)
This "method" doesn't work...
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I don't buy it.
Colby Lewis is a completely different pitcher than he was before. And losing Molina and Cantu isn’t exactly a bad thing. They’re a high-80’s win team without Lee.
Performance Impact of "Settling"?
I’m not a huge stats guy, but I’m wondering if anyone has ever done an analysis on how contract impacts performance? Or is that something just way too subjective to quantify?
I guess what I’m getting at is, while we use all of this data to determine a players worth, and whether he’d be a worthwhile addition, is there means of interpreting whether we’re going to get the player we’re expecting? Is a guy locked into a 20mil/7 year deal going to exhibit the same effort as a guy signed later in the off season at 12 over 3? Will the, just cast off from his long time team one year reclamation project with something to prove put in a greater daily effort than a 3rd year of a 6 year deal guy?
Do we assume these are finally tuned professional athletes who truly give 100% day in and day out, or can we expect that an Adrian Beltre that “settles” for Oakland after all his other opportunities have evaporated will be the same Adrian Beltre who was in Boston with something to prove.
I don’t have a strong opinion either way, but am curious what other’s might think.
There is no reason to believe that a grown man with dignity and self-respect who gets paid millions of dollars to play a game that he loves to play will just up and decide not to perform.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 8:43 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
This.
Think of some of those AWFUL Bavasi teams he played alongside of in Seattle, all while playing in a park that made him look worse than he is while being called a massive bust by a large section of the fanbase. He still flashed mad leather game after game and put together respectable seasons with the bat despite playing in Safeco.
If he didn’t give up when he played on a team that featured Jose Vidro as DH and Miguel Cairo as 1B after Sexson got DFA’d, I don’t think he’ll quit on a young, competitive team that needs his glove and his bat like we do.
A full time A's fan in Portland who spends part of his time on AN.
Not so much tweeting as squawking: http://www.twitter.com/yusebio
Well you did mention Beltre.
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:56 PM PST up reply actions
At the end of the day though, they are still human beings.....
So I don’t think it’s entirely unreasonable to think that their performance could be impacted by a myriad of outside influences, not the least of which may be whether they feel they are being paid what they feel they deserve, or are in the situation they desired most.
Nitpicky, but "myriad" should not be followed by "of."
It’s “myriad outside influences,” rather than “a myriad of outside influences.”
"I wasn't able to extend so I had a serious lack of extension."--Dallas Braden
by StJosephBurningTheOakTreesToTheGround on Dec 10, 2010 1:53 PM PST up reply actions
Potential Matsui acquisition so frustrates me
When there are better DH options out there just waiting for someone to sign them.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
It's like getting a day old loaf of bread
"You know, a long time ago being crazy meant something. Nowadays everybody's crazy."
-Charles Manson
by kaweahkaweah on Dec 10, 2010 11:58 AM PST up reply actions
So if Matsui doesn't hit
we can just feed him to the pigeons and be done with it, right?
A full time A's fan in Portland who spends part of his time on AN.
Not so much tweeting as squawking: http://www.twitter.com/yusebio
The more I think about it the more I think Manny is the best option
Even over Thome.
- Hits lefties and righties well
- Better than Thome 2 years ago and 3 years ago and wasn’t bad last year. We are judging Thome based on 340 ABs after a couple years where he appeared to be on the decline.
- He is younger than Thome
- We need a RH bat in the 4 spot
- He is comedy gold!
All this is with the assumption that Thome is better than all the other DH options including Matsui. I don’t know why no one is talking about Manny at all and yet we hear about Matsui, Vlad and Thome every day from the media.
Tweeted by Rosenthal by the way
I can’t link from my work computer due to blockage of twitter. 3 yrs / $15M. I am fine with this.
I'm more than fine
They just gave up a 2nd round pick and $5 mil a year for a currently-solid going-to-be 35 year old reliever. Sounds great to me.
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
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Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 3:41 PM PST up reply actions
It's the Angels, are you really surprised?
They throw money around to relievers at a humorous rate.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 10, 2010 5:04 PM PST up reply actions
I'm about as surprised as I was when I heard the Francoeur Royals deal.
Not really surprised, just…really amused.
Royals Review had been predicting Franceour to Royals for the better part of 2 years now.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 10, 2010 5:16 PM PST up reply actions
They also signed Melky Cabrera today
look out now.
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 10, 2010 6:52 PM PST up reply actions
It's like a passport stamp for every crappy outfielder in the league
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
I hope so, but I doubt it.
They’ve picked Takahashi as well. The holes in their bullpen are, for better or worse, closed.
I think it’s more that they realized they wouldn’t be able to afford Soriano + Beltre, so Downs + Beltre is the next best thing.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 10, 2010 5:18 PM PST up reply actions
This may indeed be a Beltre precursor
It was widely assumed they had the money for 1 guy… They offered 6/108 to Crawford or $18M a year. As that offer was very low it might be safe to assume that is as much as they are willing to spend. Though there is also their DH need to consider…
Now they have spent $5M on Downs. That would leave $13M of the money they had earmarked for Crawford. Our last offer to Beltre was $12.8M per year. I really hope we come in and offer at least $14M per year. I don’t want them getting Beltre at 5/$65M
Downs was a type A too so they are out their second round pick already.
Agree
To me, if it is really between the A’s and the Angels at this point for Beltre, I would like to see the A’s up their offer. I just think that it has come to the point where the A’s really need to get him, unless they are going to get some other star in a trade, which I doubt. I’d like to see the A’s raise the offer to 70 or 72 over 5 years. Have to get it done, I think and at this point I see no problem over-paying a bit.
by longtimeasfan on Dec 10, 2010 6:28 PM PST up reply actions
the A's have to steal beltre away
they cannot compete for the next 2-3 years if the angels get beltre
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
Yup
But, to what level. Above, I suggest 70 or 72 million over 5 years. SHould the A’s reach to go actually above 75 million for 5 years, more than 15 million a year to ensure that they get Beltre. I would guess that if they over 75, that is the best he will get and will have to take the offer or take less. Do they need him that much – to go up that high? I would tend to say yes, particularly since they have a good amount to spend and there doesn’t seem to be many more free agents out there where they would have to spend that much.
by longtimeasfan on Dec 10, 2010 6:35 PM PST up reply actions
at some point you would thin a 5/75 would cripple the angels as well
so there may be a utility in stopping somewhere.
But I personally don’t think 5/75 would stop me if I were the A’s
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
I agree. We should also consider the alternative
The A’s made it clear last year that they will spend the money they have. If we don’t get Beltre we will probably throw $10M at Soriano or overpay our DH or resign Ben Sheets or something…
Agreed.
I’d go up to 5/80 for Beltre.
Let’s see if a red-faced Moreno to throw ~90 million to Beltre and cave in to a gleeful Boras.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 10, 2010 7:09 PM PST up reply actions
is willing*
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 10, 2010 7:09 PM PST up reply actions
Crippling the Angels isn't a win for the A's
Texas just walks home with the division in that case.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Of course it is
Otherwise crippling Texas only means the Angels win the division.
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
This
is EXACTLY why Boras didn’t take the A’s offer in the first place. Now the A’s HAVE to raise the offer if they want him. And that’s why Boras is great at his job.
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 7:10 PM PST up reply actions
You don't have to like him, but you gotta respect him.
Boras, that is. It’s not like his tactics are secret, and anybody can see them coming a mile down the road… but he still gets what he wants.
"We don't see things as they are, we see things as we are."
~ Anais Nin
by UncleLeo on Dec 10, 2010 9:31 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Apparently, Beane didn't.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 10, 2010 9:36 PM PST up reply actions
Didn't see his tactics coming from a mile away...
Assuming that’s why the A’s acted so “surprised” that Boras rejected their market value offer that they put an early December deadline on.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 10, 2010 9:48 PM PST up reply actions
It seems as though it was, in fact, higher than market value
Certainly he’s yet to see better.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Or...anything.
Kind of odd how no other team has seen fit to make him an actual offer.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
And how we can't even attract free agents when there's no competition.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
The point is that Boras is only going to let a top tier client sign that early if the offer is "Jayson Werth" amazing.
Seeing as the A’s offer wasn’t that, the A’s would be complete dunderheads to assume that their offer had any shot of getting Beltre.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 10, 2010 10:00 PM PST up reply actions
Not really what I meant, but ok.
I meant Boras’ reputation in a general sense to get what he wants for his client even in the absence of competition.
As far as Beane, I do believe he was looking for other options after he pulled his offer, but I wouldn’t be surprised if he also purposely did it so he wouldn’t be bidding against himself in the mean time. It might actually be that Beane did see it a mile away and is attempting to counter Boras while also keeping his other options open. The withdrawal might really be a pull back and watch.
Time will tell whether Beltre will fall in line with Boras’ historical record of virtually always getting the bigger deal in the face of little-to-no competition, or not.
"We don't see things as they are, we see things as we are."
~ Anais Nin
My first thought when Beane pulled the offer
was “ok, he’s got teams dropping off like crazy, Beane must see no need to keep an offer that high on the table at this point”. Then I got on AN and saw a lot of people assuming we were completely out of it and went “oh shit, maybe I was wrong”.
Maybe it’s just blind optimism on my part, but my gut feeling is that Beane probably was a little deterred by Beltre/Boras blowing their offer off, but also saw this coming down to a couple teams and saw an opportunity to get him on a lower offer or shorter term contract. I’m not sure he thought we would be bidding against the Angels, but that should be all the more reason to go a little above and beyond to get this thing done.
The team obviously had enough set aside to make both Beltre and Berkman strong offers (somewhere in the neighborhood of $21mm annually) so I see no reason they can’t still use that money on Matsui for $5-6mm, and Beltre for $15-16mm. I just don’t see Beane not getting back in on this, and if he doesn’t i’ll start seriously listening to the people claiming Beane swings and misses on FA’s on purpose.
The Angels don't need a DH
Abreu is going to primarily DH next season. They might need a fourth outfielder, but they can get that on the cheap, you’d think.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
If they need one, they can call us - we have seven.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
This is really, really puzzling
If the Angels wanted to spend big on relief pitching and give up a draft pick, why not give it to Soriano, who doesn’t really have suitors anyway. Who has cash to burn and needs a closer. The Rangers if they move Neftali Feliz to the rotation, but that’s about it off the top of my head. There’s not a team that’s going to give him big money besides the Angels.
I mean, who’ll sign Soriano now? There isn’t a larger market team that needs a closer, hell, I can’t even think of a small market team that needs a closer.
Or,(and this would be AWESOME news if true), Arte Moreno’s distaste of Scott Boras is more intense than imagined.
MOAR SPARTACUST. NOW.
Or, the fact that the slegnA were in the red last year is catching up to them.
MOAR SPARTACUST. NOW.
Maybe they'll get both
And they now have leverage against Soriano? Oh lookie there! We aren’t as desperate to get you, and I don’t see anyone else clamoring after you…..Half Price!
Blue Jays
Fantasy Sports Columnist for Big Cat Country
Follow me on Twitter if you feel like it.
Formerly Gallagher's Watermelons and Player To Be Named Later
by CaliforniaJag on Dec 10, 2010 7:12 PM PST up reply actions
NEW THREAD UP
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
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