Let's Do This! Carlos Quentin Anyone?
by nocal81(Vincent) on Dec 11, 2010 1:59 PM PST
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The A's have a glaring hole in their lineup, power of course. However, Carlos Quentin has regressed since his breakout 2008 season. Should we attempt to acquire him? My answer is yes! Following a 36 Home Run, 100 RBI season in which he finished 5th in the AL MVP Voting, Quentin has dropped off a lot over the last two seasons. He has missed 94 games and only hit .240 over that span, while garnering a simple WAR of -.04, becuase of his defense. However, Quentin is only 28 and owns the power we so need.
Let us look at it this way
His homerun total each of the last three seasons would have led the A's. Additionally, he doesn't strike out much and puts the ball in play. His defense is absolutely horrible, there is nothing anyone can say that can defend these following stats: A negative defensive WAR of 3.0 over the last three seasons, and 17 errors over the same period of time. This is something we don't need when the A's pride themselves on defense. However, no one said that we need to actually play him in the field. What about DH? If not, are we willing to sacrifice some defense for offense? I would say so at this point! Additionally, his contract isn't absurd. He earned 3.8 million in 2010, and will make just about the same give a few hundred thousand.
The "Booty" Quentin would require
The Whitesox are said to be looking for a package including a reliever. What reliever are we talking about? Are they looking for a closer to replace Bobby Jenks? Or a young middle/late ending reliever? They are said to be okay with Matt Thornton closing games in 2011, but i am not 100 percent sure about that. So, there is a chance they would ask the A's for Andrew Bailey, who has made two consecutive all-star games. Is he a player we are willing to trade for Quentin? Not entirely sure. Consequently, i am not sure they are looking to add a closer as i noted above. Either way, the A's would have to add another player or two to the equation.
Possible Trades
1. A's send RP Andrew Bailey and C Josh Donaldson to the White Sox for Quentin
Or
2. A's send RP Michael Wuertz, OF Ryan Sweeney and SP Clayton Mortensen to the White Sox for Quentin
Personally, i would like the second trade the best. Chicago is looking for a 4th outfielder, and that would come in the form of Ryan Sweeney. Additionally, Wuertz could end up being their main set up man for Thornton. Mortensen adds a rover type pitcher that can alternatve between the rotation, and the pen.
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I'm sorry,
but those are both godawful trades for the A’s when there are DH options out there who are better at hitting, will cost about the same in terms of dollars, and won’t require giving up players.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 11, 2010 2:05 PM PST reply actions 2 recs
Trades are horrible
I completely agree with lenscrafters here. The trades that you set up are back for the A’s. I could see a Ziegler/Quentin trade straight up since White Sox need some bullpen help.
by scorerunsplz on Dec 11, 2010 2:10 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
Thanks for the Critique
I am not entirely sure what Chicago would ask for Quentin, and how they value him. Sweeney, Wuertz and Mortenson doesn’t seem too horrible of a trade if you ask me. If you look at the fact that Sweeney will be a 4th OFer for us this season, Wuertz will be a mid inning set up man and Mortensen projects as nothing more than a #5 starter.
However, i could get on board with the Ziegler/Quentin trade, however, not sure if Chicago would accept that
"He who lives on hope will die fasting" Benjamin Franklin was a fool
"If we are thinking playoffs, why not look towards the mountaintop"
I like my quote better
by nocal81(Vincent) on Dec 11, 2010 2:23 PM PST up reply actions
Sweeney is likely to be worth more than Quentin all by himself.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 2:44 PM PST up reply actions
as long as his knees aren't chopped liver
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 11, 2010 4:33 PM PST up reply actions
even if.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 4:35 PM PST up reply actions
If Chicago wanted Sweeney, they would have kept him the first time.
Sweeney has been basically everything Chicago figured he’d be, which isn’t a bad player, just not one they had any interest in keeping, and that was four years and two bad knees ago.
Oakland Athletics * St. Bonaventure Bonnies * Green Bay Packers * Buffalo Sabres * New York Knicks
by RyanFromBonas on Dec 12, 2010 1:09 PM PST up reply actions
I'd do Bailey for Quentin straight up but thats about it
There are a lot more solid relievers in MLB then guys with 30HR bats, plus I like that his $$$ is low. The scenarios that you suggested are huge overpays, and I’d rather not give them sweeney back though I’m sure they would take him back with open arms. Quentin at DH would have the lineup pretty much set for the next two years, especially if we could get beltre. I’d be ok with Bailey for Quentin or H-Rod+Donaldson for Quentin, preferably the H-Rod trade. A lineup of Crisp, Barton, Beltre, Quentin, DeJesus, Suzuki, Sweeney, Ellis, Pennington looks good to me.
by Po' Boy on Dec 11, 2010 2:29 PM PST via mobile reply actions
Why would you do Bailey for Quentin
instead of signing Matsui and keeping Bailey?
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I'd much rather do H-Rod +Donaldson but if that was the only way a deal could happen I'd do it
Quentin has his flaws and his strengths, and his main strength is something we need, power. Matsui would cost 5mil+ for 1yr, Quentin would be less. It seems like an inexpensive way to fill a gaping hole, by dealing from a position of strength. Good relievers are plentiful, 30+HR bats are not. (Still, I would rather not trade Bailey and I can see Kenny Williams going for a H-Rod+Donaldson package).
by Po' Boy on Dec 11, 2010 3:55 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Good relievers aren't plentiful
Decent DHs who can put up Quentin’s numbers are more plentiful than relievers of Bailey’s caliber (and salary).
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Yes, but, H-Rod's caliber?
I can think of lots who throw hard with control issues. 30+HR pop for that price…who can you think of?
by Po' Boy on Dec 11, 2010 5:17 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
OK, first of all Quentin doesn't have 30+ HR pop
He has “30+ HRs once at US Cellular Field” pop. And pitchers of H-Rod’s caliber are a dime a dozen. Would I swap him for Quentin? Absolutely. Bailey? No way.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Its all about the Park Effects.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 8:13 PM PST up reply actions
ehh I like the sweeney signing more.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 4:50 PM PST up reply actions
If your goal is to make the team worse this is a fantastic idea. Otherwise not so much.
You gave away the A’s best trading chip for a player who’s production is replaceable for ~$5m on the FA market? Seriously?
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 2:44 PM PST reply actions
Dude I didn't say I'm dying for this trade to happen or anything along those lines
All I said is the other proposals were overpays, and I’d prefer to not give up Sweeney (or Bailey). H-Rod and Donaldson for Quentin doesn’t seem unfair to me…Reliever with control issues and a catcher with an OK BAT and at best, OK defense for a big bat with no defense seems fair to me. Fills our DH hole for two years and monetarily will be cheaper than any FA option currently on the market. If this comment was directed at the author of the post and not me, then whoops and sorry.
by Po' Boy on Dec 11, 2010 3:47 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
I'm sure it was, since it wasn't in reply to anyone.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
My bad DFA, on phone at work and not paying much attention
by Po' Boy on Dec 11, 2010 3:58 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
no worries... when its on a mobile device sometimes its hard to figure out who is replying to who.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 4:42 PM PST up reply actions
You're talking about the phone?
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Generally I reply to the comment I am critiquing.
I still think your trades are poor. Quentin will be overvalued in arbitration and is a worse hitter than Matsui. Makes no sense to give up anyone for him.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 4:41 PM PST up reply actions
plus quentin is a righthanded hitter playing in a park that favors right handed power hitters, while oakland is a park where right handed power hitters go to die.
the artist formerly known as inbillywetrust
Best trade chip? Who
I said that i wasn’t in favor of the first option, i just posted it as something the Sox may demand
"He who lives on hope will die fasting" Benjamin Franklin was a fool
"If we are thinking playoffs, why not look towards the mountaintop"
I like my quote better
by nocal81(Vincent) on Dec 11, 2010 4:39 PM PST up reply actions
I was more interested in this tweet
that said they’d explore moving Viciedo if they couldn’t find a deal worth moving Quentin for. He doesn’t walk and he’s a bad defender and his body is in bad shape, but he’s only 21 and has massive power. Platoon him at 3B with Cardenas or something.
Well heck,
if the A’s want someone who doesn’t walk, is a bad defender, and whose body is in bad shape, I’m most certainly available.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
This
And you are hired!
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 11, 2010 4:20 PM PST up reply actions
I don't work weekends.
And I’m gonna need next Tuesday off.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
too many injuries
do not want more on this team
You have to include smiley faces - Poppy
;- ) :- ) :-O : -> : -] : -}
by micdog2001 on Dec 11, 2010 3:25 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
2nd trade looks good
A’s need to take some chances to aquire power bat. Would not give up Bailey.
by BlueMoon on Dec 11, 2010 3:40 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
If we need to take chances to get a power bat
Why don’t we get someone who’s actually good and isn’t one of the biggest defensive liabilities out there…
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 11, 2010 4:21 PM PST up reply actions
yeah, it's as easy as offering them more money just like we did out new 3b beltre
oh wait… that didnt work.
I guess we could have exclusive right to a player and then nickel and dime them in said negotiations. oh… wait….
ugh
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 12, 2010 5:39 PM PST up reply actions
We should not give up Bailey, how about Ross and Sweeney for Quentin?
Lets go Oakland, boom boom boom boom boom
by section119a'sfan on Dec 11, 2010 3:59 PM PST reply actions
No
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 11, 2010 4:22 PM PST up reply actions
More than the failure to distinguish a good hitter from a bad one?
Jack Cust, Hideki Matsui, Carlos Gonzalez, Michael Taylor: Find the two good ones!
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Its 2 and four right?
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 5:22 PM PST up reply actions
MLBTR says KW wants a "Carlos Lee return"
Which means the A’s should absolutely do this deal. All the Sox got for Lee was Podsednik, Luis Vizcaino, and a nothing ML OF/1B (who was out of baseball a year later).
Conor Jackson, Michael Wuertz, and, I dunno, Jeremy Barfield or something should get it done.
www.zekeishungry.com
by thejd44 on Dec 11, 2010 4:13 PM PST reply actions
Hell, if thats all it'll take
then I’m VERY on-board with this plan
by Po' Boy on Dec 11, 2010 4:30 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Oh, in which case, yeah, I'd favor that.
Getting Conor Jackson off the A’s already makes the deal great.
MOAR SPARTACUST. NOW.
"didja hear we traded Conor Jackson?" "Great trade! Who'd we get?"
"Feel so bad, feel like a ballgame on a rainy day"-Lightnin' Hopkins
by justANotherAsFan on Dec 12, 2010 10:52 AM PST up reply actions
Carlos Quentin is terrible
Plus, he’d be moving from a homer-haven park for RHBs to an HR death trap at the Coli. Rather have Matsui and/or Magglio for $$$ only.
!#%&$#@&%&% antioxidants! - pam
needs moar bacon
by cuppingmaster on Dec 11, 2010 4:36 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
I wonder why people have such a negative response to the 2nd trade option
You have to give up something worthwhile to get a good bat. People talk about Quentin’s injury problem, but don’t want to give up Ryan Sweeney and his injury problems. Doublestandard if you ask me. Quentin has MUCH more power than Sweeney. Additionally, Maggs and Matsui are way past their prime. Quinten isn’t even 30 yet.
"He who lives on hope will die fasting" Benjamin Franklin was a fool
"If we are thinking playoffs, why not look towards the mountaintop"
I like my quote better
by nocal81(Vincent) on Dec 11, 2010 4:37 PM PST reply actions
The problem is just that
Quentin is nothing more than a good bat. Maybe even worse.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 11, 2010 4:47 PM PST up reply actions
And Sweeney is, by himself, a better overall player than Quentin.
I’d consider a Sweeney-Quentin trade, but only if more was coming back from the White Sox.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
It is looking more like Chicago wouldn't want an OF back for him
They have Teahan to be the 4th outfielder.
I would like to add another more “viable” trade option with the Whitesox.
A’s get: Carlos Quentin and 3B Dayan Viciedo
White Sox Get: Brad Ziegler, Henry Rodriguez and either Clayton Mortensen or Josh Donaldson
The A’s are said to be interested in top relief pitchers via free agency, so the loss of Ziegler and Rodriguez wouldn’t hurt that much.
"He who lives on hope will die fasting" Benjamin Franklin was a fool
"If we are thinking playoffs, why not look towards the mountaintop"
I like my quote better
by nocal81(Vincent) on Dec 11, 2010 5:43 PM PST up reply actions
Not a big fan of Viciedo: total lack of walks + shaky defense = meh.
If I were CWS, with Mortensen I wouldn’t consider that trade. With Donaldson? Maybe.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Plus
we don’t have a need for Donaldson right now. Viciedo is a young player with upside that we can platoon in 2011 with maybe a Cardenas at 3rd
"He who lives on hope will die fasting" Benjamin Franklin was a fool
"If we are thinking playoffs, why not look towards the mountaintop"
I like my quote better
by nocal81(Vincent) on Dec 11, 2010 5:48 PM PST up reply actions
The way I see it
Viciedo has the same, if not worse value as Kouz. He’s got less skill with the glove but the potential for better power and somehow he walks less than KK.
Plus, I can guarantee you Viciedo would cost a helluva lot more in arbitration because the power numbers tend to be rewarded better by arbiters…
So why bother trading for this guy, having to give up players of some value, and having to pay him more eventually?
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 11, 2010 6:45 PM PST up reply actions
Arbitration Rewards Are Subjective
However, if he puts up the numbers i have no problem with the A’s paying the reward. If he doesn’t put up the numbers, he won’t get a raise.
I believe your logic is foolhardy here. Good players get good arbitration rewards. Under your theory lets have a bunch of lower tier players that won’t get good arbitration rewards. That really doesn’t make much sense to me
"He who lives on hope will die fasting" Benjamin Franklin was a fool
"If we are thinking playoffs, why not look towards the mountaintop"
I like my quote better
by nocal81(Vincent) on Dec 11, 2010 7:29 PM PST up reply actions
No
I’m saying if we are to go by WAR to value players, and we have 2 guys with, let’s say 3 WAR, the guy with 30 HRs and 100 RBIs who cannot field for shit is going to get much more than the guy who puts his numbers up by consistently performing well defensively but has less gaudy offensive numbers.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 11, 2010 8:05 PM PST up reply actions
Because he doesn't turn 22 until March.
He’s not better than Kouzmanoff right now, but his potential is a lot higher.
I disagree, but to each their own
I don’t see Viciedo ever being anything more than a 3 WAR guy at his peak.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 11, 2010 8:06 PM PST up reply actions
His upside is pretty much Edwin Encarnacion
"Some field has fences, and sometime, the field cant hold a player, but most of the time, a field cant hold Domingo"
www.domingobeisbol.com/Domingo/Home.html
Agreed
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 12, 2010 5:40 PM PST up reply actions
Naw they already have Flowers and Pyrimagiantassholeski
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 8:14 PM PST up reply actions
I would Love Dayan
mlb says if he cant get a Carlos Lee haul he may look to move Viciedro. HROD for him and lets move !!!
Power young and has options. May or may not be able to stick at 3rd all things the A’s need.
Get it done
The problem is Viciedo doesn't walk.
Like, at all.
I mean, a 1.9 BB%??!!
That is terrible.
Plus his numbers with the WS this year were BABIP inflated.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 11, 2010 5:06 PM PST up reply actions
It's really pretty astonishing, isn't it
When you make Howie Kendrick look like a patient hitter… I mean, there’s a serious problem there.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Yep
I mean, seriously. In 2 years of pro baseball, the highest BB rate he’s had is 4.3% in 500+ PAs in AA?
He’s nothing with the glove, either. I seem to recall that was considered to be the “knock” on him when he first defected and yet he can’t take a walk.
Personally, I never really liked him. Now I don’t want anything to do with him…
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 11, 2010 10:46 PM PST up reply actions
He's kind of like Pablo Sandoval without the plate discipline.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Ouch.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 12, 2010 12:31 AM PST up reply actions
He is 21 yrs old
Another year in AAA won’t hurt anyone.
The A's need guys who can hit it out of the park 30+ times a year.
He has the power to do so along with Carter to form the middle of the order for next 5-6 yrs
reply button. learn how to use it.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 5:14 PM PST up reply actions
Like I said
I think a Ziegler/Quentin straight up trade is best for both sides. Quentin definitely has power but he has had some health issues and would have to DH. Ziegler has decent numbers, but Ziegler has REALLY struggled against LH.
funny, Quentin and Jackson were once possible trade candidates
to Oakland, when they were still minor leaguers, in exchange for Byrnsie (the year before the A’s actually traded hiim).
{flagged for being too depressing}
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
As opposed to Kennedy or Witasik? Theyre both better returns, even now.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 8:16 PM PST up reply actions
I Don't Get The Knocks On Quentin
I understand that he is injury prone, but it is a risk worth taking. I hate his defense, but i am a big fan of his low SO rate (15.6%), he puts the ball in play most of the time. I can easily see him combining for 60-70 extra base hits in 2011. It isn’t like we would be giving up the farm for him
"He who lives on hope will die fasting" Benjamin Franklin was a fool
"If we are thinking playoffs, why not look towards the mountaintop"
I like my quote better
by nocal81(Vincent) on Dec 11, 2010 5:46 PM PST reply actions
It's not so much anti-Quentin as it is
that he’s only useful as a DH — where Matsui is not only as good and doesn’t cost prospects, but he’s also about to sign. In a few days, this will all be moot.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Do you have a link on Matsui?
I am all for giving up nothing, but i really don’t think Matsui<Quentin
"He who lives on hope will die fasting" Benjamin Franklin was a fool
"If we are thinking playoffs, why not look towards the mountaintop"
I like my quote better
by nocal81(Vincent) on Dec 11, 2010 5:49 PM PST up reply actions
No one link, just paying attention to everything that's been said --
I expect him to sign with the A’s within a week.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I Have Two
was just wondering if you had a link. My best references are Pro Sports Daily, ESPN Insiders and MLB Trade Rumors. Are there any other ones that you would recommend?
"He who lives on hope will die fasting" Benjamin Franklin was a fool
"If we are thinking playoffs, why not look towards the mountaintop"
I like my quote better
by nocal81(Vincent) on Dec 11, 2010 6:10 PM PST up reply actions
I don't really follow other sites
I just note things that are referenced here, and news I see here and in the Chron.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I dont agree with matsui.
he’s a one year stop gap. and a poor one at that. he might still have something left in the tank but his game has shrunk year after year
Yeah, it will be moot.
The A’s are going to sign the guy who was easily the worst possible realistic DH option (outside of Carter).
I still don’t understand why the A’s are trying to get worse at baseball. This desire to sign guys who are much, much more likely to fall off a cliff than to be productive when other options are available is annoying.
Something like .250/.320/.405 from Matsui wouldn’t surprise me at all.
This team is going to really suck in 2011 (this guarantees they win 97 games).
www.zekeishungry.com
by thejd44 on Dec 11, 2010 6:21 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I think you're too bearish on Matsui
His US career is amazingly consistent in terms of OBP — right around .360 every year — and just last year, playing in a park that isn’t some “hitters paradise” he put up a line of .274/.361/.459.
My guess for him for 2011 in Oakland would be more like: .260/.355/.435 with 20 HRs. Not my first choice, but not a disaster.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Why would you expect a drop in BA without a corresponding drop in OBP?
I think that isn’t a good projection at all. If you are going to drop BA by 15 points you should drop everything by 15 points .260/.345/435 is a better looking number if you just want to eyball it, which i disagree with anyway.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 8:20 PM PST up reply actions
Well, other than his first year in the Majors
Matsui has never had an OBP below .360.
I’m thinking that’s where Nico is going with the line?
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 11, 2010 10:48 PM PST up reply actions
Because...I think he'll walk more?
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Why would he walk more than usual?
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 2:18 AM PST up reply actions
Why would you throw him a bunch of strikes
if you’re a RHP and Kouz or Suzuki is on deck? Look, if you don’t like the discrepancy, then give him a .270 BA. I’m just saying he’s likely to OBP around .360, based on his career.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I don't believe in lineup protection.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 1:36 PM PST up reply actions
You can believe whatever the heck you want
I think Matsui will have about a .360 OBP next season.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Because you don't want men on base?
Why would you throw him a bunch of strikes if you’re a RHP and Kouz or Suzuki is on deck?
Official Athletics Nation Rotating Tagline Editor
Pam liked my old sig better.
I think Matsui will be lucky to get to 15 home runs next year with Oakland.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 12, 2010 12:12 AM PST up reply actions
Lefty HR park factor isn't too bad in Oakland
91 recently I believe?
I think that’s comparable to Slegna stadium…
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 12, 2010 12:30 AM PST up reply actions
Just a hunch.
Quick, name an “annual old dude” Beane brought in on a short term contract who managed at least 15 home runs and a league average wOBA, not counting Frank Thomas.
You’d have to go back to the days of John Jaha.
I really don’t trust his judgment in these cases.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 12, 2010 12:52 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah, but outside of Giambi
How many were lefties?
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 12, 2010 1:04 AM PST up reply actions
I think there is a difference between Matsui and some of Beane's recent "old guy" signings
With Matsui we don’t need to hope that he rebounds from a down year, or an injury. He was productive last year. Sure he’s 36, but there is no magic age when players fall off a cliff. Sure he could, but the best indication of that would be a recent decline in batting skills, not age.
"Juuuuust a bit outside" - Harry Doyle
by ArunisArun on Dec 12, 2010 8:17 AM PST via mobile up reply actions
I think 12 HRs on the road, 8 HRs at home is totally reasonable
Or 11/9. It’s not a stretch to see him hitting 20.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I don't understand why people believe Matsui's in decline
The last four seasons, from 2007-2010, his OPS+ is 123, (108), 123, and 124. Very consistent, practically identical in 2009 and 2010. His career OPS+? 123, which is basically what he did in 2009 and again in 2010.
From 2007-2010, his OBP is .367, .370, .367, .361. His career OBP? .369.
Sure, he might start declining right this moment, but has he shown signs of declining yet? Not really.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Rising K rate is a big part of it.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 5:24 PM PST up reply actions
Gaaaaaaaaahhhh, strickouts!!!!!
{runs screaming}
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Serious question:
I looked it up and you’re right, the K rate has suddenly risen in a troubling way. But his BABIP hasn’t suddenly risen over that time, and his overall OPS+ has stayed steady. What explains this? In other words, how is he doing just as much overall while striking out more?
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
hes had a fluke ISO spike.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 6:57 PM PST up reply actions
Why is it a fluke?
Guys who strikeout more and hit for more slugging sound like guys who are focusing on slugging — basically the anti-Sweeney. Maybe he’s had a fluke K spike. Or maybe not every fluctuation is a fluke.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Not really.
Some of Beane’s “old guy” signings were coming off productive years before they joined the A’s:
Jason Giambi wRC+ 133 (‘08)
Mike Piazza wRC+ 125 (’06)
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 12, 2010 7:13 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah I mean Carter can be a replacement level DH why bother with Matsui?
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 11, 2010 8:17 PM PST up reply actions
no hes not. hes projected to be a DH
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 1:36 PM PST up reply actions
Low K rate is useless when you have as terrible a BABIP as Quentin
It’s just a recipe for hitting into lots of double plays.
"We don't want our people to be preoccupied with seminude, crazy men jumping up and down who are chasing an inflated object," said Sheik Mohamed Osman Arus, head of operations for the Hizbul Islam insurgent group.
Hot damn!
I’m finding all sorts of stuff out today!
He’s got a career FB% of 44.9% AND it’s steadily increased every single year he’s been in the bigs.
Yeah, he’s definitely swinging for the fences and it’s not looking good moving forward….
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 11, 2010 10:52 PM PST up reply actions
"I hate his defense" understatement of the year
He was pretty much the same as matsui last year, worse the year before and better the year before.
I don’t see why he would better than Matsui next year.
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - dannycakes
I'm sure some people are going to argue with me on this....
but I think we can get Quentin’s results, if not better in Derrek Lee. They both have “30+ HR” potential in a hitter-friendly park(20+ in ours), Lee would have a better average, better defense if we need him, and rarely gets hurt. AND he doesn’t cost us any players!
I'd agree with you
If healthy, Lee is a better bet.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 11, 2010 6:46 PM PST up reply actions
By that logic
Jim Thome doesn’t hold a candle to me.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 11, 2010 10:52 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
D. Lee is like, twice the player Quentin is in every other aspect of the game.
I’d take him on this team over any other DH option….but the problem is he actually plays pretty good defense so he won’t want to be a DH.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 12, 2010 12:11 AM PST up reply actions
D.Lee
is not twice the player quentin is since his power ceiling in Oakland’s ballpark would be 15 hr’s max. Quentin is injury prone but he he does make contact. which is more we can say for guys like cust. the white sox play in park that was once considered a band box. who knows, maybe with a more spacious outfield a few more hits fall in leading to RBIs
because it doesn't fit my meme?
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 5:25 PM PST up reply actions
good point, and every player get dinged for Oakland's park
I’d just rather have quentin since we already have an excellent firstbasemen. defensively, offense he has room to grow.
This is just terribly incorrect
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 12, 2010 5:41 PM PST up reply actions
damn thats generous.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 6:57 PM PST up reply actions
I just don't have the energy...
But my favorite part is the end. I would love to know how moving from a band box of a ball park where one is more likely to hit HRs is suddenly going to get more RBIs when those homers drop for hits instead
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 12, 2010 9:11 PM PST up reply actions
This is utterly incomprehensible.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Dec 12, 2010 7:14 PM PST up reply actions
Where'd you get 28 from?
If you’re going by best HR year, Lee has Quentin beat with 46 in 2005. He’s also hit 30+ in other years. Both have been on the decline since then, so I don’t think comparing those numbers is the best reflection of how they will do next year.
He's talking about age.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 12, 2010 11:04 AM PST up reply actions
And that Lee's highest number of HRs is actually less than Jamie Moyer's age.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I dont like that ".240 batter" is the reason why not to sign him
when there are many varied and rich reasons that prove far worse things about Quentin than his batting average. He is such a completely awful player and I have no idea why you think Bailey++ is worth him. I have a sneaky suspicion Bailey is worth as much as Soria, and there were rumors the Yankees were offering Jesus Montero for Soria.
This post is almost troll-worthy. At least have us get a semi-decent player that isnt a downgrade in your massive overpay trade scenario.
2 players i’d kick tires on: Ellsbury & Cameron. Probably could be had for nothing much and are a little better than Kneeless Swingles.
by PL78 on Dec 11, 2010 11:30 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
You have no Idea what value is if you think that Bailey is worth as much as Soria.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 2:20 AM PST up reply actions
Wait, why is this? Honest question.
Soria’s career FIP is 2.76 and Bailey’s is 2.70. Soria’s peripherals are slightly better but there aren’t any wide discrepancies. They are the same age. Is it just the experience factor or am I missing something else?
Bailey injury history this year
Both have 4 years left of team control but Soria’s contract looks like an insane value ($4M next year, then 3 club options of $6M, $8M and $8.75M)/
Soria has already proven himself to be a model of consistency while Bailey’s injury history is pretty concerning.
Soria’s trade value is probably the highest of any reliever in baseball. IMO, it’s much highers than Bailey’s.
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 12, 2010 12:47 PM PST up reply actions
That's hardly insane value for a reliever
when they have to be balls-to-the-wall good to have a 3 WAR season. I’d be incredibly upset if the A’s paid any reliever $8M for a single season. I understand your points though.
Well thats what Baily will command or more in Arby.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 1:38 PM PST up reply actions
Which was my point
If he hadn’t signed that deal, he’d be looking at Papelbon money right now…
All I can say about stats is…
SCOTT BROSIUS!!
by stranahanahan on Dec 12, 2010 2:20 PM PST up reply actions
Soria can start or relieve.
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 1:37 PM PST up reply actions
Soria hasn't started since he was pitching in Mexico in 2005
and that was just five games. Bailey’s started as recently as 2008, and made 48 starts over his professional career.
why? they're both small market closers
and if they were traded to a contender likely would become expensive set up men
Yeah, sorry, but I really, really wouldn't want to trade anything of value for the guy.
The problem with the “we need power, not good overall hitters” line of thinking is that it ends up at places like Carlos Quentin. I want a good hitter, not necessarily a power guy.
no.
Mira mi pinche pelo guey!!! Pinche piernotas que tengo de jugar futbol soccer todo los dias con mis camaradas!!!
by MudkipzGetHYPHY on Dec 12, 2010 1:44 PM PST reply actions
yes! yes! yes!
TRADE SWEENEY, WUERTZ, BLEVINS AND A MINOR LEAGUER
FOR
CARLOS QUENTIN AND DAYAN VICIEDO.
THEN SIGN MATSUI.
WITH THESE THREE, PLUS DE JESUS, A’S HAVE SOME HOPE OF BEING A DECENT OFFENSIVE TEAM FOR NEXT FEW YEARS…
BUT WILL THEY FIGURE OUT HOW TO TYPE WITHOUT THE CAPS LOCK ON?
Taurus Apr 20-May 20
Honey or vinegar? That’s kind of the universal decision we have to make all the time, every day. Are we going to get what we want by being nice or being a dick? And you know what, Taurus? Every situation is different, there’s no one way to do things. Know what else? Honey and vinegar go together in a nice salad dressing.
by designatedforassignment on Dec 12, 2010 4:52 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I completely waffle to the other side of this argument
Carlos’ park splits at the coliseum changed my mind. .154 avg .231 slg. those are brutal.
Now you're on the right side of the argument...
but for entirely the wrong reasons. I mean…single season single park splits? Aside from the fact that park splits are basically meaningless…it’s a single season. That’s 20 PA.
by danmerqury on Dec 12, 2010 7:10 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
PAT BURRELL SUCKS!!!
Of course I only caught the World Series this year.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
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