The "Ben Sheets: yay or nay" post.
by PL78 on Jan 21, 2010 3:11 PM PST
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PrintAccording to Buster Olney, only the A's and Mets are the teams left who can actually afford Ben Sheets's demands. I ask you, fellow AN reader, would you pull the trigger on this signing? Lets say 1/$9MM gets him.
Obviously I would do everything to get Sheets in the green&gold, throwing a rotation out there of Duke-Anderson-Sheets-Braden-Gio, in addition to our arguably best-in-mlb bullpen as well as plus defenders at every spot, we would pretty filthy and would *gasp* perhaps finally silence those who can't fathom us being in a pennant race in 2010.
Reasons why Sheets is a good signing:
-Despite some people thinking we are on some kind of budget (I dont think its been said anywhere "A's to stick with $50MM payroll in 2010" or something like that) we can afford to splurge a bit on Sheets. All reports from his "showcase tour" were overwhelmingly positive: he was hitting 91 MPH with his fastball (he normally tops out at 92) and the low-70s with his curve. He showed he was good to go and had no problems with his injury.
-Sheets is nothing less than a massive upgrade over Eveland, Mazzaro or Cahill. His WAR has ranged from beyond dominant (8.0 in 2004) to still pretty decent (2.2 in an injury-plagued 07). Generally he's been a 3.5-4.5 WAR pitcher. Pitching in a friendly park like ours will get him the best numbers out of anywhere out of the possible suitors, and get him a better deal next offseason, when we wont need him anymore anyway. It works for both sides.
-Funnily enough, the Mets are actually in MUCH worse shape than us and our "quiet" reputation might work to our advantage. The Mets are owned by a total psychopath and have no real idea where they are going as a team. Jeff Francouer is in their starting lineup, think about that...I'd be picking the A's 10 times out of 10 if I were Sheets unless the Mets doubled what the A's offer, which wont happen. He also wont have to pitch to Ryan Howard, Chase Utley, Hanley Ramirez and Adam Dunn a bunch of times a year.
-He is indeed injury prone, but what have we got to lose if goes down? A 1 year deal where he's going out of his way to play for a contract generally means he's going to ignore the nagging injuries and pitch through pain, regardless we have Cahill, Mazzaro & Eveland amongst many others who can step in if he cant stay healthy.
-Say he comes back and just mows down everyone ala 04, if that happens....well I'm sorry to those covering their ears and shutting their eyes and screaming "2011! 2012! WE CANT THINK ABOUT THIS YEAR!!!" you are going to have to open your eyes and put down that prospect guide and look at what we have going right NOW, because this suddenly becomes a very win-able looking division.
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No reason not to sign him to a 2 year deal.
A’s payroll is low and it wont hurt us to give him 8mil a year.
"Carter's 25-game hitting streak isn't any normal streak. He's 46 for 97 (.474 average) during the run, adding 16 walks and compiling 81 total bases in the process. I'm out of superlatives for what he's doing." - Kevin Goldstein
sheets might not want 2 years
He might be looking to have one dominant and not injured (ha!) year, so that he can turn around and get a 3-4 year deal at $12M per. I don’t think that would be a very smart strategy for him, but maybe he’s deluding himself into thinking that he will repeat 2004.
someone send Blicks a heads-up about this development
He’ll come in and dominate this thread…as for me, I don’t think there’s any question it’s a yay. Sheets, Anderson, Duke, Braden, Gio (in that order) + bullpen + defense = not a whole lot of RA. Sheets has been underrated even when healthy; now that he’s missed a year, he’s completely undervalued. He has one of the highest K/BB ratios ever among pitchers with a certain number of innings (I’ll try to find a link to help me out with that very vague claim). Hopefully he’s a little more open to signing with Oakland than say Furcal or Beltre. If so, bring him in
Part of the reason why Oakland is unattractive to
FAs like Furcal and Beltre works in the opposite direction for pitchers.
If Beltre picked Boston in part because he wants to pad his stats with good hitting numbers before going back on the free agent market again, then the pitcher-friendly Coliseum was a bad choice for him. But if a pitcher wants to boost his reputation with gaudy numbers, the Coliseum should look more attractive.
I don’t know enough about Sheets to have an opinion on signing him. In general, I’m fine with signing a good but injury-risky pitcher for a short contract at a decent price. Is he likely to go for a decent price?
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
it depends how many teams get involved
The 1 yr/$9mill that PL throws out there seems like a reasonable ballpark figure to me. As for how far it strays in either direction of that starting point, well, the rotowire blurb on the left column makes it sound as though interest is kind of limited, but one team that has shown interest that rotowire doesn’t mention is the Cubs, and although your point about hitters’ parks/pitchers’ parks has merit, I’m guessing he’d pick the Cubs over the A’s at the same price, perhaps at a discount. He mentions in the espn.com article to which I linked that he has many friends on the Brewers (makes sense given that that’s where he played), so signing with the Cubs would give him a shot to face them in a few starts. So if it came down to the A’s having to overpay to get him, then I don’t think it’s worth it, but even then, it would be a more worthy target than the last time I can think of the A’s getting into a mini-bidding war for a free agent pitcher—Esteban Loaiza.
by Cutthemullet on Jan 21, 2010 3:45 PM PST up reply actions
cubs got no money
In a perfect world... spammers would get caught, go to jail, and share a cell with many men who have enlarged their penisses, taken Viagra and are looking for a new relationship.
Why? Because Zonis mispelled "penisses?"
Otherwise, there’s very little humorous about the continual entrenchment of a cultural mythology around male rape patterns in prison, said mythology mis-representing the nature of sexual violence in prisons and thus promulgating it. If that’s your view of appropriate justice, save it for your sfgate comments. Otherwise, download Thunderbird and stop worrying about spammers.
by paris7 on Jan 22, 2010 1:06 PM PST up reply actions 4 recs
Citi Park is also a pitchers haven however and with more media attention that would increase marketablity next offseason
"Since other people actually read these threads, though, probably best that your particular brand of wrongness not go completely unchallenged." - PT
There are differing opinions on me. According to Iglew "DFA is PT with a sense of humor. PT is DFA with introspective self-doubt. I like them both" but according to sirbed Im "The Stats Killer"
by designatedforassignment on Jan 22, 2010 9:39 AM PST up reply actions
doubtful
consider how poor the Met’s defense is. marketability won’t be a problem, i’m sure GMs keep very good tabs on potential FA signees. This isn’t college football where a big media market means that much.
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
yeah that doesn't mean that his starts won't be shown on sportscenter before 3 am
"Since other people actually read these threads, though, probably best that your particular brand of wrongness not go completely unchallenged." - PT
There are differing opinions on me. According to Iglew "DFA is PT with a sense of humor. PT is DFA with introspective self-doubt. I like them both" but according to sirbed Im "The Stats Killer"
by designatedforassignment on Jan 22, 2010 12:39 PM PST up reply actions
I thought i saw it in a Kurkjian column
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/hotstove09/columns/story?columnist=kurkjian_tim&id=4824942
“In 1,428 innings, he has 1,206 strikeouts and 313 walks; his 3.85 strikeout-to-walk ratio is the fifth-best all time among pitchers with 1,000 innings.”
by Cutthemullet on Jan 21, 2010 3:36 PM PST up reply actions
You beat me to the punch here PL78!
I’m glad you put up a post about this since I’m totally on board with signing Ben Sheets. One year deal is a perfect fit and if Big Ben does indeed sign with the A’s that rotation of ours is going to be a bad ass mothaf*&#r! Whew!!!!!!!!
Gitter dun Billy!
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
Will signing sheets get us to the playoffs in 2010?
My guess is no….+ it moves Vin, Trevor or Gio to the pen/AAA….we have depth in young pitching, I would rather “bank” that cash if possible and save hit for some hitters
Lance "you sunk my" Blankenship
My guess would be the Mets...
wow + Blanton getting 24 million over 3 years….I like Joe B, but that fat boy isn’t worth 8 million is today market
Lance "you sunk my" Blankenship
that's a lot of cupcakes
"You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take.
-Wayne Gretzky"
-Michael Scott
by scatterbrian on Jan 21, 2010 4:40 PM PST up reply actions
Hopefully it moves Cahill to AAA and saves a year of service time
"HARK! BUT LOOK OVER HERE, IT'S A COST CONTROLLED COCO CRISP! DOES MY USE OF ALLITERATION HYPNOTIZE YOU?" (PL78)
by CaliforniaJag on Jan 21, 2010 5:24 PM PST up reply actions
My first thought.
He really needs to get that knuckle curve back.
Always the summers are slipping away.
Find me a way for making it stay.
Or, really, just (re)develop a breaking ball of any kind
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
Cahill in AAA = a good thing.
If we could get him on a one year deal, do it. Shoot, we paid Piazza 8 million for one year to suck, at least Sheets probably won’t suck, if’ he’s not injured.
"I am happy because I do not have unrealistic expectations"- Karma Ura...or an A's fan.
Yea, seriously.
I’d suck twice as hard for half as much money. Sign me, if someone has to suck.
by LoneStranger on Jan 21, 2010 3:53 PM PST up reply actions
That's, uh, what she, uh
You know what. Nevermind.
we in the losin baseball binness. and cousin, binness is a boomin.
by walk off bunt on Jan 21, 2010 5:04 PM PST up reply actions
thanks for, you know, not making that awkward, haha
"I am happy because I do not have unrealistic expectations"- Karma Ura...or an A's fan.
by DyeLongJustice on Jan 21, 2010 6:22 PM PST up reply actions
“He also wont have to pitch to Ryan Howard, Chase Utley, Hanley Ramirez and David Wright a bunch of times a year.”
Wade Hines
batting practice
In a perfect world... spammers would get caught, go to jail, and share a cell with many men who have enlarged their penisses, taken Viagra and are looking for a new relationship.
Yes, Yes, Yes
2 year deal, option for a 3rd….who would seriously complain about having a surplus of pitching talent. If we are struggling than we flip Sheets/Duke at the trade deadline for more prospects.
I'd take him
1/10mil sounds fine. Fangraphs just did a very strong post on him. If its true Wins are going for 4 mil each, and if Sheets pitches 140 IP, he’s just about a lock for 2.5-3 WAR. I have no problem with that.
140~ IP of 3.50 FIP? Yes please.
Not just athletes, Athletics.
I am for it for so many reasons.
I don’t think it will take 1 year at $9M. Maybe I am overly optimistic, but based on what a healthy Joel Piniero was able to get, I think $8M per year is the number and its likely going to be heavily based on incentives.
Something like $5-6M base with another $3-5M in incentives. Toss in a low $ player vesting option of some sort. I’m fine with the max value being pretty high if he meets incentives. I’d pay him $12M if he pitches 200 innings.
Keeping Cahill and Mazz down right now is the best part. They aren’t going to give much major league value this year, while they accrue a year of service time. We could keep them in AAA and then get an extra year of them on the back-end when they will be much better players most likely.
With the Cahill, Mazz long-term value gains, Sheets pays for himself.
And our SP depth means we can sign guys like Duke and Sheets and be ok if/when they get hurt.
More wins now, more wins later = get it done!
I agree with all of this
except maybe your optimism on what it would take to land him. It sounds like there is pretty strong interest – I wouldn’t be surprised if he gets $9 or $10M guaranteed.
Change of Heart
After initially being against signing Ben Sheets, I’ve been persuaded. I thought $8 million was a little too much, but I’d be willing to give him that much since Joel Pineiro got that much.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 21, 2010 4:00 PM PST reply actions
Wait, who did Pineiro sign with? ANd for how much/years?
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
unless dave duncan is attatched to the signing, this is a terrible move
"They (The 1989 A's) are the best team I ever saw"- Mike Krukow
Piñeiro was a really good pitcher early in his career,
and he really had a very strong 2009 season. But … I wonder how he’ll respond to throwing 214 IP last year.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Back in AL
and away from Dave Duncan he will get plastered as he used to.
You mean back in the AL and away from Dave Duncan,
where his first two seasons he was 14-7, 3.24 ERA and 16-11, 3.78 ERA? Before getting hurt, he was a very good pitcher.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Aw fuck! Really? that sucks!
Now we definitely need to sign Sheets!
Thanks grover..
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
Yay
1 year deal at 7 million + incentives with mutal option for 2nd year at 10 million, agree to not offer arbitration if option is declined.
Rotation:
Duke
Anderson
Sheets
Braden
Cahill
Gio in the bullpen, to come back to rotation when of the above inevitably becomes injured. Cahill is a better pitcher than Gio. Outman comes back to rotation in July.
Gio was a better pitcher in 2009 than Cahill.
"The A's get some action but they do not score..." -Glen Kuiper
"Anyone who calls themselves the Angels Angels should have to start over and ride the short bus." -timmeh from McCovey Chronicles
I'm pretty high on Gio right now
Maybe it’s because of how much time we have had since that blowout in Minnesota, but I keep focusing on the fact that he can really strike out major league hitters. That’s a very good skill for a young pitcher to have.
He improved greatly from 2008 to 2009
I’m excited to see what he does next season.
"The A's get some action but they do not score..." -Glen Kuiper
"Anyone who calls themselves the Angels Angels should have to start over and ride the short bus." -timmeh from McCovey Chronicles
Gio might be more erratic
But when’s he’s on, yeah, he blew Cahill out of the water. And when he was off, he was pretty much on par with Cahill. And comparing their overall season last year Gio was the better pitcher. If somehow both pitchers were in a position to be in AAA (meaning we had better pitchers in the majors) for more seasoning, it would be great, but Cahill needs it more than Gio.
CuttheMullet, from "The Thread":
"Whenever I’m about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing."
Gio didn't dominate AAA at Sac
the first time around. I feel like it’s the same way with Oakland. But I have faith he’ll get there, and be at least an average MLB pitcher.
"I am happy because I do not have unrealistic expectations"- Karma Ura...or an A's fan.
by DyeLongJustice on Jan 21, 2010 6:17 PM PST up reply actions
Starting Rotation
- Justin Duchscherer
- Brett Anderson
- Dallas Braden
- Ben Sheets
- Gio Gonzalez
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 21, 2010 6:26 PM PST up reply actions
It's pretty drooly to consider Dallas Braden as the #4 starter
behind Sheets, Duchscherer, and Anderson.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
He might be behind Gio as well.
But baseball! Fuck yeah! -- lynnzgal
by WaddellCanseco on Jan 21, 2010 6:53 PM PST up reply actions
Not really sure why
It’s basically what he is. His peripherals, notwithstanding the wild gyrations in his BABIP and strand rate, are completely consistent on this point.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
I find that kind of noise interesting.
Since baseball players are not robots, I firmly believe they can make that noise through mental makeup and approach, but that’s obviously difficult, or even impossible, to prove. I guess you’d have to create a cohort of players who you believed possessed those qualities and follow them long enough to have good data, but it would still be largely subjective.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
It's quasi-tautological
The way people measure “good composure” is through things like strand rate, implicitly if not explicitly.
In any case, though, we know roughly how future-predictive BABIP and strand rate are (very minimally so). So why pretend they have meaning? Even a cursory look at the compiled data is enough to tell any reasonable observer that conclusions drawn from that area of pitching “skill” are complete hocum.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
And yet, that skill still exists.
I love there are real things that can’t be quantified.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
Not really
People keep quantifying more and more of it. Pitch movement appears to explain most of the variation in BABIP skill. Strand rate is pretty much 100% a function of a. luck, and b. how good the pitcher is at controllable things (pitchers who are good at controllable things get more outs and thus strand a higher percentage of runners).
I think that BABIP skill will be essentially completely explained within 10 years. Strand rate is already pretty much a non-issue.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
That rotation=drool....
Man, that would be something….
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
spend a lot of time on the DL?
I suspect that you think tilting at windmills means something other than what it does.
Jon Garland
He wouldn’t be a terrible choice if they miss out on Sheets, probably will cost less too. Especially if A’s intend to bring in a veteran starting pitcher. Garland prefers to pitch on the west coast, so at the moment his teams are limited. He’s always healthy and good for 30+ starts, 200+ innings, double digit wins, low-mid 4’s era.
no
no
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones."
-BB 07/27/05
For once we agree on something, xb!
I’m no Garland fan either…..
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
Don't we already have Eveland?
Always the summers are slipping away.
Find me a way for making it stay.
Too bad their career xFIPs are virtually identical.
With Eveland’s tRA outshining Garland’s by 40 points or so.
Not saying that Eveland’s a good option at all. Just that Garland isn’t a good one either.
Always the summers are slipping away.
Find me a way for making it stay.
I don't think Garland's a good option, either.
But at least there’s reason to think what he does is repeatable.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
I definitely like the idea of adding Ben Sheets
I would be a little concerned about guaranteeing $9 mil to a pitcher with his injury history and would be much happier if it was closer to $5 mil with incentives but I don’t know how receptive Sheets would be to that.
What it really comes down to for me is opportunity cost. If signing Sheets means the A’s off-season spending is done and the roster is set, I would be all in favor of the move. If signing Sheets means the A’s have a few million less to spend on the draft and international signings, I think I would pass.
I really dont understand the thought process of being scared to spend money
Is it because of moneyball and our situation in the early oughts? Its vastly different now, wanting to save $5MM for risk reasons is admirable but it wont get the job done in getting him here. Its not like that 4 or 5 mill extra thats “wasted” on Sheets is going to come back and haunt us.
People might not like Lew W, but the dude has money and isnt scared to spend it.
Spending in the long term is scary because it can cripple the team
A one year big deal, not so much. So I’m with you.
CuttheMullet, from "The Thread":
"Whenever I’m about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing."
Well, it's not so much the money spent that concerns me as the opportunity lost
That’s the point I was trying to make in the second paragraph. If there is room to fit $9M in the projected budget without affecting money that could be spent on the future (ie. overslot draft picks, international signings) then I am all for it.
As for the first part of my comment that was mainly making the obvious point that with his injury concerns if you could get him for $5M guaranteed instead of $9M guaranteed that would be preferable. I mean for a guy who is just as likely to pitch 2 innings next year as 200 it would probably be smart to try to get some of his contract to be incentive based.
While I believe that the reasons for it are basically dated and stupid,
it is nonetheless a fact (assuming the team isn’t lying about it, which would make little sense) that the A’s do not roll extra money from the amateur budget into the MLB budget or vice versa.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
by PaulThomas on Jan 21, 2010 11:33 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Paul, when you say the reasons "are basically dated and stupid"
this seems to imply that you know what they are. What are they? I didn’t know they’d discussed this (publicly), and I have no clue. To my way of thinking, the rational approach would be to say, “Billy, here’s the personnel budget. Players, draft choices, mid-season acquisitions, all of it (maybe even including his own staff such as Forst, Zaida, Lieppman, et al). Allocate it as you see fit.” The A’s value rationality, so I’m damned if I know why they don’t take that approach.
Assuming they don’t, of course. Which brings me to a second question. Where exactly did they make this statement about having their budget sliced up in inviolable silos like this? I vaguely remember some reference to it, but to me it has the smell of a relatively oblique comment that has been blown up into an Absolute Company Policy. Are we sure they do it that way?
I agree that that would be the rational approach.
For whatever reason, the A’s have made it very clear that their approach in this area is irrational.
To be honest, I don’t remember specifically, but I know it’s come up in some of the interviews Beane has given with various media (probably here, but he’s given plenty of interviews that I’ve read elsewhere too). And it’s been repeated enough times that I no longer doubt its accuracy.
As for what the reasons are, I imagine it’s some combination of organizational inertia and a way of putting amateur-talent budgets “out of easy reach” of being raided for the MLB payroll, in much the same way that a dieting person will put the cookie jar on the top shelf of their kitchen cupboard.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
Why is putting the cookie jar out of reach an irrational act?
The concept of living within one’s means (i.e. a budget) strikes me as a very rational act.
The monster at the end of this blog.
It would appear to me that the A's have some cash to work with
in their respective budgets in as much with them being in both the MLB sweepstakes for Beltre & Scutaro, and now possibly Sheets…and in the intnl player/draft being a finalist in the Chapman talks. I think it’s a good thing that the organization keeps a budget for the ML team and the amateur draft, seperate.
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
I can understand wanting to take unused cash from the ML team
and dumping it into the draft or international FA, but I’d never want to see the flow head in the other direction. As long as the coffers for the amateurs gets filled first (and to the depths desired) I can’t complain about how the overall bundle is parceled.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Because a rational person would say "gosh, I could eat a cookie, but that would be worse than not eating a cookie"
and not eat a cookie.
Similarly, a rational person would say “hm, returns on amateur spending are like 8 zillion times better than returns on MLB spending. Therefore I will spend as much as plausible on amateur talent.” The reasons why teams do not do so are, essentially, irrational (publicity of signing big free agents, excessive “win-now” mentality, and the principal-agent problem of GMs trying to feather their own nests).
When it comes to amateur spending, there is no such thing as “living within one’s means,” because every single MLB franchise could, if it wanted to, spend as much money as every other franchise in the amateur arena. The price of competitive amateur signings is like $10-15M a year. There’s pretty much no excuse for not spending that money.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
I guess I'm saying something between what the two of you are
I’m all for spending money that’s within a team’s “big league roster budget” ie.. signing Sheets if the money is there, as long as it is not being “funneled from the amateur draft budget”, because that would be damaging and foolish.
I think we can all agree that Beane and Co. are and have been pretty committed to spending their money in the amateur draft to build the team’s future as well as building thru trades and spending at the big league level.
I’d still like to see if Beane can pull off a trade for an above average SS with the depth of pitching he has been hoarding over the last several years.….
Now that would really make me a happy camper!
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
JJ Hardy!
Grrrr…He shoulda beena A.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Yeah, I know.....Escobar would be super-fantastic!
However, at this point, I guess we’re stuck with Money Penny.
Oh well, a brother can dream, right?
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
Eppur' si muove.
In fact, for many people the cookie jar trick does work, whether you think it is rational or not.
If you design business practices around the assumption that human beings behave rationally, you’re not just being a lousy businessman, you are willfully and unscientifically turning a blind eye to the reality of human nature as abundantly demonstrated by centuries of empirical data, just because it doesn’t conform to your simplistic model of how you think rational human beings should behave.
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
by iglew on Jan 24, 2010 10:09 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I know it works
It works by appealing to another sub-rational part of the brain— the “laziness” module.*
That being said, it’s really not appropriate for major league baseball franchises to build their strategy around the kind of thinking that helps Aunt Josephine keep the pounds off. There are other ways of countering the problems that I listed in my last post, most notably close oversight by management representatives over what the baseball ops team is doing. That has its own costs, but they’re tiny compared to the opportunity costs of not signing the maximum possible amount of amateur talent. The current system is simply a bad way (in the context of $100M companies) of accomplishing the goal of coping with the lack of rationality of its actors.
*Warning: All scientific claims in this post are solely for humorous intent, and should not be etc etc etc.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
Obviously your mom made bad cookies
The monster at the end of this blog.
by grover on Jan 25, 2010 5:55 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Actually her cookies are rather excellent
Personally, since I like cookies and am not overweight, I would say that eating a cookie is better than not eating a cookie in most circumstances.
I would also say that the diet/crash/diet cycle that so many Americans seem to constantly be on is unhealthy, silly and does little or nothing to help the basic problem, which is eating more calories than you burn off.
But that’s neither here nor there.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
I agree with you on the diet cycle.
I believe that the studies that measure bad health correlated to obesity are measuring four things: (1) effects of the up-and-down yo-yo cycle, (2) effects correlated with being socially stigmatized, (3) effects correlated with being socially disengaged, and (4) actual health effects of being obese.
The fourth category is real and it dominates the bigger end of the spectrum, but as “obesity” gets defined downward to include people who are slightly overweight or just naturally built heavier, it gets very diluted. The 2nd and 3rd are both connected to the fact that our society hates fat people. If you want to be successful and loved it behooves you to make yourself thin if you can. Those who can’t are punished in all sorts of ways, and those who could but don’t care enough to bother are likelier to take less care of themselves in other ways. A lot of these are controlled for in the better studies, eg, by controlling for income, but I’ve seen enough critiques to be convinced that a lot is being missed. And of course the simplistic “ZOMG, fat people have more health risk” stories that dominate the news aren’t so careful.
Our culture is collectively stupid about weight, but the conventional wisdom is too powerful to be budged, not just the food industry but large parts of the medical industry and the media and just millions of ordinary people invested in the idea. Not unlike baseball in the 1970s, come to think of it. The Bill Jameses are out there, both inside and outside the medical community, but they’re mostly dismissed as cranks. And given that there really are a whole lot of cranks, too, it’s hard to know the difference.
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Setting aside the quick punchline...
This argument doesn’t necessarily support your original position that the A’s should roll money between the amateur and pro budgets. In fact, if you’re so insistent that the A’s should be spending $10-15 million annual on amateurs than that should be a fixed cost, and money shouldn’t be allowed to go from the amateur piggy bank towards pros. The amateur budget should get first priority, set aside that $10-15 million for the amateurs and the rest goes towards free agents and maintaining the 25 man roster.
The monster at the end of this blog.
I don't know that it supports the notion of treating amateur talent as a fixed cost
so much as it supports the idea that given two possible expenditures, if one is amateur talent and the other is MLB talent, the amateur talent should be preferred in 99.9% of cases.
The natural outcome of this will be to spend a lot of money on amateur talent, of course.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
Would Be Interesting From a Moneyball Perspective
To sign the guy the A’s passed on in the 1999 draft for Barry Zito. I still remember all the discussion about that decision in the book.
Cust is the new Jaha.
by johnjahafanclub on Jan 21, 2010 4:40 PM PST reply actions
If We Sign Him, Less Curveballs
In 2008, Sheets “threw curveballs 33% of the time, more than any other starter in the major leagues. At the end of the season he incurred a tear in his right elbow and did not pitch in the playoffs.”
Im guessing 33% curveballs contributed to the injury.
People keep talking about how the next moneyball statistics are defense and speed. I think it should be studying statistics on keeping guys healthy. We do a pretty good job on pich counts but we need to do more studies and figure out more about how to keep guys from getting hurt.
I think the A’s medical staff should read the section of Soccernomics (basically, Moneyball for soccer) about the AC Milan lab, which has discovered statistical methods for limiting players playing time to keep them healthy. That’s how AC Milan is able to dominate with a bunch of 31-34 year old players even though that is way past their prime.
Cust is the new Jaha.
by johnjahafanclub on Jan 21, 2010 4:46 PM PST reply actions
I dunno if that would translate so well to baseball
But it couldn’t hurt to explore, I suppose.
we in the losin baseball binness. and cousin, binness is a boomin.
by walk off bunt on Jan 21, 2010 5:12 PM PST up reply actions
Well, they're partly able to dominate in Italy because of the slower and more technical nature of the game there
which suits older players. Plus, they’ve been handed the league recently through, um, shenanigans by Juve and others.
In Europe? they’re less successful, I’d venture
I suspect that you think tilting at windmills means something other than what it does.
Oh Come On
Milan have had by far the most success relative to the age of their roster out of any team in the big 3 leagues in Europe. Just look at the mileage they’ve gotten out of Maldini, Inzaghi, Seedorf, Nesta, Gattuso, Zambrotta, Oddo, Jankulovski… it’s ridiculous. Most big european clubs are lucky to have one guy their age performing at that high a level. I am by no means a Milan fan but I think they are on to something with regards to statistics and players’ health.
Also, they made it into the final 16 in the champions league this year even with all these 34 year olds. So I don’t know how you can say they are “less successful” in europe than Serie A. They’ve done better than 99% of the other clubs in europe this year.
Cust is the new Jaha.
by johnjahafanclub on Jan 21, 2010 11:21 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah, no
I’m wrong on this one
I suspect that you think tilting at windmills means something other than what it does.
I'd like to read that section of Soccernomics
if Borders would ever have the g***amn book when I walk into their stores…
That being said, using an n of 1 to claim that curveballs cause elbow injuries is not useful.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
Consider that leg injuries and recovering from leg injuries
and all injuries peripheral to hunting “on foot” and running, have some “path of recovery” or "path of sustain’ inherent by evolution. “Throwing a rock” with incredible repetition has no same basis in the human evolution of things….
…which reminds me when I see runners chugging mile after mile on unforgiving concrete: where in Africa were our ancestors running on bare naked rock, hour after hour, day after day, in pursuit of game?? We are not built for that unnatural pounding on aggregate (cement or asphalt).
Borders in the death throes. Don’t expect much.
Awaiting the start of the 2010 season!
by One won lost won on Jan 22, 2010 11:47 AM PST up reply actions
"That being said, using an n of 1 to claim that curveballs cause elbow injuries is not useful."
Yeah that is a good point, which is why I think the A’s or some sabermetricians need to do some more statistical research on whether or not certain kinds of pitches are more unhealthy than others. If all pitches are equally bad for your arm, then a flat pitch count should be fine. But if we find that curveballs or sliders or screwballs are more dangerous than fastballs and changeups, then maybe we should adjust pitch counts accordingly.
I’m just hypothesizing that this is true, I just have no way of backing it up with evidence other than empirical examples like Sheets with curveballs, Liriano with sliders, and Jim Mecir with screwballs.
Cust is the new Jaha.
by johnjahafanclub on Jan 22, 2010 11:58 AM PST up reply actions
I'd jump at Sheets for $9-10M/year,
because you get what you pay for and you don’t get Sheets’ ability for pennies. He’s had injury problems, but he’s also made 30+ starts 4 times (in contrast to Duke, Harden).
If he appears to be healthy and throwing great, he’s worth every bit of 9-10M / year. Really good starting pitching is as valuable a commodity as there is.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
plus, do you know how many new puns he'd bring in?!
"I am happy because I do not have unrealistic expectations"- Karma Ura...or an A's fan.
by DyeLongJustice on Jan 21, 2010 6:18 PM PST up reply actions
Especially if he punched a fan at some point
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
or if it was a windy day
"I am happy because I do not have unrealistic expectations"- Karma Ura...or an A's fan.
by DyeLongJustice on Jan 21, 2010 6:20 PM PST up reply actions
Or if I were really drunk
that’d never happen, though
I suspect that you think tilting at windmills means something other than what it does.
3 Sheets to the Win: How the A's Won in an Alternate Dimension
A book by Bizarro-Marquez.
"Smokey, this be not the foul jungles of the darkest East Orient. This be ninepins. We are bound by laws."
by Joey C. on Jan 21, 2010 8:56 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
With the current state of our offense, can we afford not to?
I’d be willing to pay him 2/$19M to outbid someone, but after that it’s got to be strongly incentive-ladden. If it’s between us and the Mets, for once, we look like the obvious choice: the Coli, other good pitchers in the rotation, strong bullpen, no crazy investment losses like the Wilpons.
Huge upside for both parties here, and he can leave as an FA after that if he wants.
"Do I talk to myself? No, I just remind myself of what I'm trying to do. You know, I never answer myself so how can I be talking to myself?" - Rickey
Eh, why not
I’d give him a year and 8-10 mil or whatever. Unless the money comes out of the draft/international signing budget (which I find unlikely, since we had enough money to get rejected by everyone under the sun this winter).
And if you can do the mental gymnastics that allows you to envision a full healthy year out of Duke and Sheets, combined with Anderson and Braden/Gio being serviceable to some extent, and if Kouz has a random mini-breakout or something…..you can kind of squint and see us in the playoffs.
So, hell, why not.
we in the losin baseball binness. and cousin, binness is a boomin.
maybe even without a full healthy year from duke or sheets
cahill could be ready in a few months, and outman should be back mid-season.
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones."
-BB 07/27/05
also, big yay if he's back to his peak
outstanding pitching can get you to the playoffs with a weak offense. i look forward to a new small ball era for the a’s.
"We're Menudo," -BB
With an innings pitched/ incentive based contract?
Hells Yes!
I think something along the lines of what we signed Duke w/ ( contract not $) would be brilliant.
About the A's budget...
Wuertz is the only A’s player who’s multi-million dollar salary is still undecided. Figuring the two sides compromise and split the difference at $2.4 million the the total payroll will be at ~$42.5 million in guaranteed money.
Basically, unless Beane has a hard cap of $50 million on his budget that includes all possible bonus moneys there doesn’t seem to be a fiscal reason why the A’s wouldn’t be able to afford the $4-6 million base salary (probably) necessary to sign Sheets.
As to whether or not the A’s should sign Sheets… that depends on what the next move would be. I don’t think the A’s sign Sheets unless Beane has the framework of a trade already in place, one that would probably send one of his young pitchers away to land a SS.
And no, it won’t be Atlanta’s Escobar!
The monster at the end of this blog.
I'm really hoping we keep Wuertz.
Also, that we spend and not trade from here on out.
Well unless its Miles, or McPherson to a lesser extant.
I’m willing to give Pennington a shot, there’s always the ASB if we’re possibly contending and want to upgrade.
How does signing a high risk, high reward starter for a year make any of our starting pitchers expendable?
If they already are expendable, then go ahead and do said trade, but I don’t see how one need/should be connected to the other.
CuttheMullet, from "The Thread":
"Whenever I’m about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing."
You're right, it doesn't
An hour commute gives one time to ponder…
Signing Sheets probably sends Mazzaro and Cahill back to AAA, which creates a bit of a log jam in the rotations of Midland and Sacramento. OK, so the A’s deal with that until July when they can trade off Duke and Sheets for high upside/lower level talent. Some duo of Cahill, Mazzaro, Ross, Mortensen, Simmons and who knows who else replace the Reclamation Righties in Oakland’s rotation.
The monster at the end of this blog.
If Duke and Sheets are healthy mid-season
I think the A’s will be in the thick of things. You’re looking at a front end of Sheets, Anderson and Duchsherer, plus (at least on paper) the best bullpen in baseball, and a very good defensive team.
Pitching and defense are more important than offense. You’re still missing that one big batter in the middle that takes the pressure off the others - but still, I’m looking at a team that by mid-season should still be in it. There won’t be an unloading.
That's a possibility
But just being in the thick of things doesn’t work for me. If they’re more than 5 games out of the division lead by the end of July than I say make the deals. Neither Duke or Sheets have pitched in roughly a year and a half, I’m a little worried about their stamina over the full 6 months of a season.
If the A’s have a 5 game lead in the West, then I’d certainly be more inclined towards keeping the rotation intact.
Duke and Sheets currently offer little if any help to the A’s beyond next season. Realistically, if the A’s kept both pitchers all year the best they could hope for (long term) would be to add a couple Sup1 draft picks. I’d prefer to get more of a return for that if possible.
The monster at the end of this blog.
NOt that there aren't attendant problems but
there is the expectation of outman being back mid season. So there could be a relatively easy way to keep a five pitcher rotation and have 3 pitchers taking two of the turns.
I know it means that three pitchers that are coming off serious injury are taking those spots, but in theory ot could work if stamina was the only concern.
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - danmerqury
I think Mortensen's time here is hanging by a thread
poor performance + off field issues + too much depth = potential release.
Wow, I hope not
I’m not a big believer in Mortensen but I think that would be awfully short-sighted. Duke and Sheets both missed all of last year, Braden and Mazzaro finished last year on the DL, and Cahill and Anderson both threw 40 or so more innings than they have ever pitched in a season at the age of 21. With these facts and the A’s recent health history I would think that there is no such thing as too much pitching depth.
I don't think he's in line to get released anytime soon, as he still has options remaining
That being said, Mortensen is really a pretty piss-poor pitching prospect. (It’s alliterative AND true!) Not really any better than pre-shoulder-injury Shane Komine.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
Off field issues?
one DUI? Is that case even over? did he plea?
I really hope its doesn’t come down to a guy picking up a misdemeanor and getting fired from his job.
"The ego, the super-ego, and the Ed" - danmerqury
I'm in agreement there
DUI’s are inexcusable and require terrible judgment but the political ‘one size fits all’ enforcement policy is nonsensical. If Mort was swerving all over the road running red lights and knocking over telephone poles that is one thing but if it’s a .08 DUI with no issues and he loses a job for it that is retarded.
"-i never said half the things i said." --Yogi Berra
It seems like he's more apt to lose his job
for not being all that good at it. I don’t think the A’s are over-moralizing here; the guy is a very fringe-y prospect in an area where the A’s have some depth.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
More to the point,
there is absolutely no evidence of any kind that he is “apt to lose his job” in the first place. He is not the first guy on the point of being released if the A’s make another signing. The mere fact that he has options remaining puts him ahead of someone like Eveland.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
Is the depth chart really that thick with pitching?
Genuine question. I figured the A’s would be fine bumping the 5th guy in the AAA rotation to the bullpen if Mazzaro/Cahill needed a spot.
Yes, it is
I’d post the follow-up to my line-up depth chart if the A’s would quit changing their roster!
The monster at the end of this blog.
Well, maybe Sheets is that route to a trade for a young SS / 3b
If he’s pitching well, and the A’s are terrible, then there’s always going to be interest at the trade deadline
I suspect that you think tilting at windmills means something other than what it does.
But but but
Urban says maybe……
If I’m the Braves it would take a ton to get him. They’re built around an aging Chipper, Hudson, Lowe and an in-his-prime McCann.
For the A’s, I’d offer Pennington, Mazzaro/Gio, Weeks, and Desme. Maybe add a guy like Buck if you want. From a WAR standpoint, the Braves will get more during the duration of the contracts. Still, I probably don’t make the deal if I’m the Braves.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
If you're the Braves...
Why did you trade SP Javier Vazquez for CF Melky Cabrera if you weren’t flush with starting pitching to begin with?
I neither like nor dislike Urban and I’m willing to believe that his information regarding league interest in Buck and the A’s interest in Sheets is accurate. But his analysis/speculation that the A’s could go after Escobar is poo.
The monster at the end of this blog.
It obviously had to be money reasons
They had to get rid of Vasquez or Lowe. Which actually brings up an interesting point. What if the A’s were to take on Lowe’s entire contract as well as Yunel for a similar deal. Given how much Lowe is owed, I would not be surprised if he had little or negative value.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
Money reasons?
If it were purely a question of economics they could have just let Huddy go as a FA.
They had 6 SP in their big league rotation and for various reasons they weren’t going to option any of them down to AAA. They had to move one and no one wanted to pick up Lowe for the next 3 years.
The monster at the end of this blog.
There’s chatter about the minor leaguers the Braves got back. I don’t know how they affect the equation, but they’re in there.
The prospect package is secondary to why the Braves had to make a trade
They had 6 guys for 5 spots, and the guy they most wanted to move (Lowe) had the least attractive contract… thus lowering his trade value.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Or Milwaukee's, either, now that they traded J.J. Hardy...
Not seeing why the “framework has to be in place” for a trade though. Pennington isn’t the greatest thing since sliced bread, but he’s probably good enough to at least make the position not a sucking black hole.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
How did the Brewers get into this conversation?
As for the framework bit, I backed off that stance about an hour and a half later.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Not if he wants a player only option for 2011...
On top of the $10m he’s asking for, as has been reported. Fuck that.
by AgitationStation on Jan 21, 2010 5:53 PM PST reply actions
The same Buster Olney piece links Oakland to Damon
Which makes all of this seem like pure speculation.
Damon would be actually nice....
Have him play DH and then trade Cust across the bay to Giants…
but he will end up being the Yanks starting LF
Lance "you sunk my" Blankenship
I don't see any use for Damon in the A's crowded OF.
It’s still crowded even without Cunningham and Hairston. He can’t play CF any more.
But baseball! Fuck yeah! -- lynnzgal
by WaddellCanseco on Jan 21, 2010 6:57 PM PST up reply actions
That seems like an odd rumor
Buster is just tossing it out there and I can only assume he isn’t intimately aware of our outfield situation.
And Damon can’t have fond memories of Oakland.
Makes no sense.
"Odd" is putting it nicely.
“Pure speculation” was a pun on my part, and is Olney codespeak for “utter bullsh*t”.
And upon further examination, Sheets is only linked to Oakland in this article insofaras the A’s and Mets are teams he sees as having cash available, and Sheets and Damon are two FA’s in search of said cash. He makes the case for Sheets to the Mets, and Damon to Oakland, but not vice versa.
Brewers
After all, Ben Sheets did play for them.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 22, 2010 3:04 PM PST up reply actions
They're probably not a possibility
I tried to find Melvin’s comments that I read, but he said something along the lines of not expecting any more FA signings. He also said that he has maintained flexibility. The local newspaper talked to Dave Bush and he mentioned being ready if he gets cut which was an odd statement. His about 4 million plus flexibility might sign Sheets. Sheets sounds like he’s been adamant about his price. I know they won’t pay him 12 or go multi-year. For the life of me, I don’t know why he wants more than one year.
That’s 1 part parsing and 9 parts wishing on my part though.
"Buster is just tossing it out there"
Now “that” is some kind of rumor….!
:>o
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
seems like we're linked
to every FA now that we have spending money.
by sf drift king on Jan 22, 2010 1:54 AM PST up reply actions
We need a poll for this.
"I am happy because I do not have unrealistic expectations"- Karma Ura...or an A's fan.
From my perspective.....
With a payroll below 50mil and Chavez off the books in 2010, I think the A’s need to make moves like this, and for 2 years, they tried Scutaro, and Beltre, and even Chapman, but you must take some risks and a healthy Sheets and Duke (which is tough to count on) is a great top of the rotation….
The Marlins were getting in trouble for not spending……..and I agree you shouldnt get revenue sharing unless you spend it on your teams players………
by Colorado Booze Hounds on Jan 21, 2010 6:47 PM PST reply actions
No you're right
2010 is the last guaranteed year. 2011 is an option year fir the A’s.
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
if the A's get Sheets
would that give us, the best rotation front to back, bullpen front to back, team defense and team speed in the AL west? I say yes. And with Cahill, Mazzaro etc waiting, we would have serious depth.
The team might only give up 28 runs all season
(and go 79-83)
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
or they might give up 650 runs
and win a lot more than 79 games.
I'd wager to say the A's would have to be considered up there
if indeed they added Sheets into the mix. Pitching and defense would give the current A’s the best chance to win at this point. At least until Carter, Taylor, and Cardenas come up in the ranks.
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
Not best defense
Probably best rotation because of our depth and Seattle’s lack of it. Best bullpen for sure. Speed is similar to Seattle. We’d look pretty similar to Seattle actually. They have the four top players between the two teams and we’d have the better depth.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
No, yes, no and probably no
I say probably no on speed because I’m pretty sure that the hitting of some of the “speed” players in the lineup (most likely suspects are Crisp and Davis) will soon be seen to be so intolerably bad that changes will have to be made. Texas has better speed among players who can actually carry their weight hitting at their positions.
Comparing the A’s rotation to Seattle’s is kind of preposterous at this point.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
Sure we cant front on the best 1-2 in the game
but seattle’s roation is nowhere near as strong after it as we would be if we got Sheets, and Duke+Anderson as a 1-2 is nothing to sneeze at. Do you honestly think Snell and Rowland-Smith are even close to Bradens class or even Gio’s? I dont.
And im the last person to give the Ms credit
Rowland-Smith and Snell both have some upside. Good chance they outperform Gio at least in 2010 IMO
I miss Chad God
Rowland-Smith and Braden are basically indistinguishable pitchers
except inasmuch as Braden recently suffered a severe and possibly permanent medical problem.
I’m not the world’s biggest fan of Snell, but they have plenty of other ~1 WAR options (French, Petit, Fister) at 5th starter if he falls off a cliff. It’s not going to torpedo their playoff hopes.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
my point is
If you talking top to bottom 1-5:
duke-anderson-sheets-braden-gio > felix-lee-r.smith-snell-fister/league/whoever
However Felix&Lee are so good if they manage to sign Garland or someone like that it could easily sway back into the M’s favor. DOUBLEHowever though, if you want to bring bullpens into it we are clearly the stronger 1-12 from top to bottom.
Yeah
Your point is wrong. Seattle could sign any idiot off the scrap heap as a fifth starter and they’d still have a better rotation than Oakland.
Go look at the projections for these guys. Lee and Hernandez have pretty much an average rotation’s worth of WAR by themselves.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
Did you see that CHONE thinks that DiNardo is 1.7 WAR? WTF?
"Since other people actually read these threads, though, probably best that your particular brand of wrongness not go completely unchallenged." - PT
There are differing opinions on me. According to Iglew "DFA is PT with a sense of humor. PT is DFA with introspective self-doubt. I like them both" but according to sirbed Im "The Stats Killer"
by designatedforassignment on Jan 22, 2010 12:43 PM PST up reply actions
It is rather high on him, isn't it...
That said, I’m sure he’d score lower if you took a wider range of projections.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
That site says Duke is only going to pitch in 14 games for us
therefore I hate it and find it stupid.
CHONE's projection of Anderson seems way off
I guess a correct assessment of risk of injury is probably a good thing. But if Anderson is healthy, I think he’ll be better than 2.3 WAR.
Still:
Seattle (straight CHONE):
Hernandez 5.0 WAR (30 GS)
Lee 4.3 WAR (30 GS)
RRS 2.1 (25)
Snell 2.0 (30)
Petit 1.0 (25)
Vargas 1.0 (22)
Total: 15.4
Oakland (straight CHONE):
Anderson 2.3 (25)
Sheets 2.0 (19)
Duke 1.4 (14)
Braden 2.1 (24)
Gio 2.2 (29)
Outman 1.5 (20)
Mazzaro 1.6 (27)
Total: 13.1
The Seattle group makes 162 starts, the A’s group 158. For the A’s to have the same WAR of the rotation, all that would need to happen is Sheets or Duke to be healthy for longer or Anderson to be worth 4.6 WAR over the same innings. He was worth 3.8 over ~30ish more in 2009.
Seattle probably has the better rotation in all likelihood. But if the A’s add Sheets, it’s at least arguable. Plus the A’s will have a lot more upside potential.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
word.....
health is going to be paramount in this equation. You would think the A’s could catch a break in the old health dept. one of thee years!
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
I'm all for it.
If we can sign him to a 1 year deal with a base salary of >$8MM plus incentives, and manage to get 250+ innings out of both him and Duke this rotation will be very solid. An addition of Sheets, and somehow adding a solid SS via trade would put this team in position to contend and save service time on Mazzaro, and hopefully Cahill (unless they go in the trade for a SS). We already have a top 5 defense and bullpen, and with Sheets a potential top 5 rotation. If we can somehow put up and average offense over the course of the season this team is pretty damn good. If things don’t work out, and were out of it by July then we can deal Sheets, among others, and net some more youthful upside. I think it would be a solid move.
Sure, what the hell
Looks like a good reclamation/flip at the deadline project to me.
"Smokey, this be not the foul jungles of the darkest East Orient. This be ninepins. We are bound by laws."
My vote.....
yay….
"I mean, come on, man. I'm a vet. Don't talk to me like that. If they do, I'll just smile." Nnamdi Asomugha
the emperor, after some deliberation, says
YAY (even to a 2-year deal)
Hey, I just bought the team from Lew Wolff... who wants to play third?
by emperor nobody on Jan 21, 2010 11:03 PM PST reply actions
chazbfree votes Yea but not without the eightball shake and consultation with the house cat caramia
a injury prone player bothers me still…..but my vote is still Yea.
" sorry mom I really did run into the post trying to catch the ball and no I didn't do it on purpose"
shake it chazzy!!!
Hey, I just bought the team from Lew Wolff... who wants to play third?
by emperor nobody on Jan 21, 2010 11:50 PM PST up reply actions
"yes our way"
" sorry mom I really did run into the post trying to catch the ball and no I didn't do it on purpose"
dammit I am so old I remember that record
I pulled an Oblique Strategy about Ben Sheets and this is what came up:
Hey, I just bought the team from Lew Wolff... who wants to play third?
by emperor nobody on Jan 22, 2010 12:03 AM PST up reply actions
Dentist appointments are the most important?
"The A's get some action but they do not score..." -Glen Kuiper
"Anyone who calls themselves the Angels Angels should have to start over and ride the short bus." -timmeh from McCovey Chronicles
I interpreted the Oblique Strategy I pulled as referring
to Sheets’ injury history, cuz the most important thing is that we don’t spend millions of dollars on someone who might be a graduate of the Rich Harden School of Disability… so the big caveat with Sheets in January Baseball Bargain Days here is whether or not he’ll be on the field, given his past track record with that.
Hey, I just bought the team from Lew Wolff... who wants to play third?
by emperor nobody on Jan 22, 2010 12:15 AM PST up reply actions
this eno??????
" sorry mom I really did run into the post trying to catch the ball and no I didn't do it on purpose"
I really dig
the Captain’s matching tambourine there, very fashion sensible… Eno and Eddie Izzard almost (almost) convince me that straight dudes make the best cross-dressers.
Hey, I just bought the team from Lew Wolff... who wants to play third?
by emperor nobody on Jan 22, 2010 12:18 AM PST up reply actions
or this eno????
http://www.synthtopia.com/content/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/brian-eno-synthesizer.jpg
" sorry mom I really did run into the post trying to catch the ball and no I didn't do it on purpose"
I met Eno at one of his installations in 1990
It was in the World Financial Center in the WTC complex, which was destroyed in 9/11… the whole thing was essentially a sort of indoor rainforest deal.
It was so cool, Jon Hassell played (Eno mixed it live) in the middle of the thing and there were like 130 speakers all hidden about the WFC, none of which were visible unless you were looking for them. I don’t think Brian knew I was tripping on 2 hits of the ol’ you-know-what when I met him, though.
Hey, I just bought the team from Lew Wolff... who wants to play third?
by emperor nobody on Jan 22, 2010 12:43 AM PST up reply actions 2 recs
you guys have no idea how stoked i am
that i started a thread that ended up talking about brian eno, im a huge fan of his work. Im listening to his ambient stuff all the time and needles in the camels eye is one of my fave rock songs ever.
emp nobody this post is insane and you are one cool ass dude, thanks for the story!
by PL78 on Jan 22, 2010 1:54 AM PST up reply actions 2 recs
aw, shucks PL78... that post wasn't insane
What would be insane would be if your comments were so moving to me that I went and pulled out some way cool Eno rarities (specifically the complete soundtrack for his Prague installation of 1998 — an hour of unreleased piano/synth ambience! + the BBC sessions of Eno & The Winkies — a UK pub-punk band — from 1974) and popped them onto sendspace for you (and anyone else) to grab and enjoy.
HA! That would be insane, yes sirree it would |=)~
Hey, I just bought the team from Lew Wolff... who wants to play third?
by emperor nobody on Jan 22, 2010 6:31 AM PST up reply actions
wowowowow
AN gets cooler by the day. Beane was right: A’s fans have absolutely the best taste in music, and art out of any teams fanbase!
Eno & Lanois together
have made some incredible records. U2 would not have evolved the way that they did without that production tandem. Individually, I’m a huge of both as solo artists as well. I actually got the chance to see Daniel Lanois live at The Independent in SF a couple of years ago. Holy shit, that was such an incredible show! Absolutely mind blowing performance……I would love to see Brian Eno live if he ever did a tour on the west coast. Good music talk going on here…
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
Not to mention that Daniel Lanois as a solo artist is wonderful,
and perhaps the most soulful, beautiful pedal steel player of all time.
"Life is a horizontal fall" -Jean Cocteau
by King Richard on Jan 23, 2010 10:11 PM PST up reply actions
Well, I have heard my share of pedal steel players
and he’s definitely up there. Other than when I got to hear Jerry Garcia play pedal steel with The Grateful Dead, Lanois has been most impressive so far. There are handful of pedal steel players that I have heard in obscure deep country and honkey tonk bands that were pretty amazing as well.
What are your favorite Lanois records King RIchard? Mine are “Acadie” and “Shine”.
As far as records that he has been mostly a “producer”, some with Eno as a co-producer, I’d go with:
“Unforgettable Fire”/ “Joshua Tree” – U2
“Wrecking Ball” – Emmy Lou Harris
“So” – Peter Gabriel
“Yellow Moon” – The Neville Brothers
“Oh Mercy” – Bob Dylan
“Teatro” – Willie Nelson
“Robbie Robertson” – Robbie Robertson
I could go on and on because I pretty much love all of his records but there’s also a ton of early material that is rare or pretty much impossible to find a recording of. I recommend checking out his discography if you want to track some of it down.
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
Yeah, most definitely Acadie and Shine.
Acadie is just an unbelievable album, I adore every song on there.
I’d pretty much agree with that list of his produced albums, though I’d say Time Out of Mind is a much better Dylan album than Oh Mercy.
I also like the stuff that Malcom Burn has produced, a protegé of Lanois’. Like Chris Whitley’s first album, “Living With the Law.” Great stuff. Lanois plays some guitar on that album too.
"Life is a horizontal fall" -Jean Cocteau
by King Richard on Jan 24, 2010 12:42 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah, that Chris Whitley album is pretty kick ass!
When my fiancee’ and I first started dating we went to the record store together and I saw that “Shine” had just been released. I immediately grabbed a copy and said, “Holy shit! It’s the new Lanois album!” She looked at me and said, “Who is Daniel Lanois?”. Needless to say, once she heard the album she was hooked and I introduced her to the rest of his catalog and credits, many of which she was surprised that she knew and had heard….like U@, Gabriel, Neville Bros. etc…
Lanois has been a “huge” influence on both me and my production/musical partner, Rich. If you want to check out some of our tunes, please feel free to check out our page at:
Enjoy….MRod
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
Excellent, that's fun stuff!
I’m actually a classical composer, but Lanois has been a major influence on my music too.
I wrote a piece about a year ago that used quotes from both Still Water and J.J. Leaves LA…
"Life is a horizontal fall" -Jean Cocteau
by King Richard on Jan 24, 2010 3:34 PM PST up reply actions
Wow, a classical composer, eh?
I would love to hear some of tis stuff. You can e-mail me some mp3’s if you don’t mind sharing. Remind me wehn you come out to San Francisco to perform, Dylan. Would love to come and hear you perform. And thanks for taking the time to check out my tunes as well…
-Marty mguez2003@yahoo.com
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
you guys
You’re goin’ hogwild on Danny Lanois, maybe I should sendspace the Sessions At West 54th I have of him and Emmylou Harris for ya.
Hey, I just bought the team from Lew Wolff... who wants to play third?
by emperor nobody on Jan 24, 2010 10:00 PM PST up reply actions
Seriously?
Yes.
"Life is a horizontal fall" -Jean Cocteau
by King Richard on Jan 24, 2010 11:10 PM PST up reply actions
[[looks for it in the archives]]
Hey, I just bought the team from Lew Wolff... who wants to play third?
by emperor nobody on Jan 25, 2010 4:37 AM PST up reply actions
You can just listen to some stuff on the Works page of my website.
My email doesn’t usually let me send files as big as my mp3s generally are…
http://www.dylanmattingly.com/Site/Works.html
Going to Where the Rain Falls is the one that quotes Lanois, though you’ll have to listen very carefully… haha
"Life is a horizontal fall" -Jean Cocteau
by King Richard on Jan 24, 2010 11:12 PM PST up reply actions
Dude!Hook me up with some archive shit!
That would be most excellent!
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
we typically don't spend this type of money
on pitchers, but if we have it and we’re set at SS, then I say why the hell not. We’re not usually in a position where we can afford to buy players. I’m in.
For the right price
The answer is yes of course.
I think we’re a real chance if he’s trying to rebuild his value on a one year deal.
NOBODY wants to play for the Mets, so they’re going to have to overpay to get him.
The only thing that could throw a spanner in the works is if Billy is still standing by his “Paying for veteran pitchers is the worst waste of money ever” philosophy of a couple of years ago.
Is this the real life-
Is this just fantasy-
Caught in a landslide-
No escape from reality-
this doesn't seem
to make a lot of sense, unless Beane has another trade in place, I can’t imagine them signing a guy who didn’t throw a single professional pitch last year to one of the highest salaries the A’s would have ever paid a free agent pitcher. Not unless the price drops, 5-7 million with incentives, can I imagine Beane considering it – Just because the team has money doesn’t mean they’re gonna spend it on a guy who’s shoulder is held together with some duct tape and dental floss.
Hey, duct tape is awesome
okay?
"The A's get some action but they do not score..." -Glen Kuiper
"Anyone who calls themselves the Angels Angels should have to start over and ride the short bus." -timmeh from McCovey Chronicles
Duct tape and WD-40
Ain’t nuthin can’t be fixed with them two things.
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
Except Eric Chavez
"The A's get some action but they do not score..." -Glen Kuiper
"Anyone who calls themselves the Angels Angels should have to start over and ride the short bus." -timmeh from McCovey Chronicles
nobody wants to hit for us
Beane couldn’t get Furcal last year, nor Beltre this year despite offering better contracts. Also Cabrera didn’t sign with us until it was clear he was out of options.
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
wat
there are no good hitters left on the market and our starting lineup is set in stone. The ONLY place where we actually could add a piece would be a high upside/high risk SP to give Cahill & Mazzaro more time at AAA and Sheets fits the bill perfectly. Its also doubtful he would get multi years or $10+MM. Sheets at $9MM = Perfect for us.
Hanley Ramirez
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
before I was thinking Tejada obviously he is in Baltimore now
Thank you Al Davis for Michael Crabtree!!!!!
MET'S AQUIRE Gary Matthews Jr.
according to MLBTR – with the Angles, supposedly, to pick up most of the contract. But at $11M in ’10 and $12M in ’11, guess the angels pick up half?
This will further strap the Mets and leave some room for the A’s to push on Sheets. If the 1 year deal w/ a second year player-option Sheets is looking for can be had for say $7.5M + incentives (possible total of $11M), and a $9M player option I’d go for it.
Beane hasn’t been successful in adding a top FA position player even when outbidding. I bet he’s kinda sour about that. So if he swoops in and grabs the best pitcher still available, he can now trade for the SS. OR keep it all and ride pitching + defense to the most unlikely WS title!
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
This GMJ trade has blown my mind
The Mets already have someone better to fill in for Beltran, who also costs them nothing,
So FAILcoeur and GMJ in the starting OF for the Mets?
LOL
Is this the real life-
Is this just fantasy-
Caught in a landslide-
No escape from reality-
Well, in fairness, it looks like Anaheim only got $2M of salary relief and a sub-mediocre 7th starter in return for him
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
A dumb trade made by a dumb GM
At least the Angels sacked it up and paid the price for their stupidity.
QUICKPOLL****
Who would you rather have as your GM:
Dayton Moore
Omar Minaya
Brian Sabean
Ed Wade
Its thoughts like that that make me love that we have Beane even more.
A dead goldfish
He’d probably do about as well as those guys
"Do I talk to myself? No, I just remind myself of what I'm trying to do. You know, I never answer myself so how can I be talking to myself?" - Rickey
by cuppingmaster on Jan 22, 2010 10:44 AM PST up reply actions
Me.
Seriously. Me. Hire me as GM, and I’ll bring on PaulThomas, grover, et al as my front office advisors.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
I dunno Mike
You might NOT go out and acquire the level of talent that Yuinensky Betancourt, Scott Posednik, Jose Guillen, Kyle Farnsworth, Mike Jacobs & Jason Kendall bring to the table. I dont know if that will be too popular a decision amongst the fanbase.
Dude
Who do you side with when grover and PT disagree? I sure wouldn’t want to have to make that call.
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
I'd have also hired NSJ.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
so I'd have to be the bad guy and settle the FO disputes? :)
On a serious note, I have a tremendous amount of respect for the profession, and every year of being a fan I am learning more and yet continually realizing that there’s a hell of a lot more about baseball that I don’t know than what I do.
At one point a few years ago I naively wrote a few letters to the A’s hoping to work there for free. In hindsight, I clearly don’t have the type of skills, resume, or connections – any one of the three – that get a foot in the door in an ML front office.
That said, I wholeheartedly agree with you that the collective knowledge of AN would outperform the three worst GMs in the game. There’s 26 or 27 organizations that do a completely justifiable, competent job – so much so that I don’t even really criticize any of the A’s moves any more because you can pretty clearly see the rational thought process that led them to each decision, even if you disagree with the conclusion. But the bottom tier shows a huge drop-off, IMO.
(and thank you for the kind words, mikev).
"It’s ideal if your hobby and your living can merge. But you are not going to stop your hobby if you can’t make money out of it. Your hobby is all about trading time for enjoyment. My job is what I do. My hobby is who I am." -Tango
by notsellingjeans on Jan 22, 2010 7:36 PM PST up reply actions
yeah, I never bothered writing letters because I know I'd never get in.
but I’m not sure there’s anything I’d rather do than be a GM for a team.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
Hire Me
I can do paperwork and stuff. I need a job.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 22, 2010 3:07 PM PST up reply actions
Maybe
What kind of cleaning is it?
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 22, 2010 5:24 PM PST up reply actions
The whole shbaang!
Don’t worry bout it…..I’m just messing with ya RRS!
:)
Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox
Sabean
built the best farm system out of the three and actually has won some baseball games in real life.
They all are terrible however.
"Since other people actually read these threads, though, probably best that your particular brand of wrongness not go completely unchallenged." - PT
There are differing opinions on me. According to Iglew "DFA is PT with a sense of humor. PT is DFA with introspective self-doubt. I like them both" but according to sirbed Im "The Stats Killer"
by designatedforassignment on Jan 22, 2010 12:46 PM PST up reply actions
Saving any money on GMJ is a win.
"I generally avoid temptation unless I can't resist it" ~ Mae West
ATTN: ATHLETICS MANAGEMENT AND OWNERSHIP
YOUR FANS HAVE SPOKEN, BRING US THE HEAD (and arm and rest of body etc) OF BEN M. SHEETS (cousin of Andy) FOR A PITTANCE OF ANY 8 NUMBERED FIGURED SALARY, POST HASTE!
So if Beane decides to ink Sheets
and does indeed have plans to trade one of our younger starters + for a SS, what realistic options are out there? Escobar really isn’t an option IMO considering the Braves will be looking to contend, and don’t have any other attractive options so what teams are in rebuild mode or have depth at the position that could be looking to deal for some young talent? Off of the top of my head i’m having trouble thinking of many options other then the D-Backs with Drew, and the Angels with Izturis (who knows if a trade with the Halo’s is even a realistic option). I’m sure there is more out there so any ideas?
I think its more likely he targets a AA or AAA Shortstop
if that’s even the plan. I think that whole theory was Urban just guessing.
I gotta say the most likely option is Jed Lowrie
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
Reid Brignac and Sean Rodriguez are others.
Seeing as Jason Bartlett and Ben Zobrist just decided out of nowhere to be incredible, TB has room to move Brignac & S-Rod. I think their only weak point is the bullpen, and thats a strong point with us, so that would make sense.
I do think Pennington will get 3 months to prove himself at SS though.
I doubt they would bother now, since they picked up Soriano for next to nothing.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
Well, they picked him up for his full salary
That’s not next to nothing, given what he’s likely to make ($7+M).
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
Yeah but they moved Iwamura's 4.25M for Jesse Chavez
and then sent Chavez for Soriano.
End result is an increase of $3M for this year. That ain’t bad.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
if TB trades Rodriguez/Brignac,
its probably for some sort of catching or 1B prospect, namely 1B.
I want to assume Pena walks after the 2010 season, and the best 1B prospect in the wings is Matt Sweeney, and the Rays have like 8000 good pitching prospects.
And it makes sense for the Rays to trade one of the two, as having both is super redundant when 2B and 3B are nailed in stone and Bartlett is really good.
"I generally avoid temptation unless I can't resist it" ~ Mae West
Nay!!!!!!
This team has pitching, it needs run support! If we spend 9mil, then do it by adding a bat! I’m so sick of seeing games lost by 1 or 2 runs dammit, add some bats! Cust is not the answer, Sheets is not either, add some freaking bats!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"We can't stop here... This is bat country."
Who can we add for $9M?
Free Agent hitters don’t want to come to Oakland. And there aren’t any good ones left.
Yeah dude seriously there's nobody out there
"The A's get some action but they do not score..." -Glen Kuiper
"Anyone who calls themselves the Angels Angels should have to start over and ride the short bus." -timmeh from McCovey Chronicles
Damon is really the only above-average unsigned position player remaining
…unfortunately, he plays about the worst possible position for the A’s to sign a free agent addition. The good guys to acquire are simply off the market at this point.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
Also
Damon is a a total pull hitter, the net is the worst for total pull hitters because of all that foul territory.
And his numbers are totally a mirage from that jet stream at yankee stadium
If Sheets wants to pimp his numbers in 2010
A top 5 defense and a pitcher friendly park, surely don’t hurt. Neither does having the best bullpen in baseball hurt his W-L.
On the other hand, a bottom 5 offensive output shouldn’t help his W-L.
A 14 – 10 record, with 3.0-3.5 ERA, would still be helpful to his 2011 plans. Can Beane convince him the A’s may reach the playoffs ?
we have that position covered
like a fat boy on a cupcake.
between Barton, Carter, Fox etc. we have to many for the spot. We really only need a 2B SS and Beane tried throwing $10M a year on that account.
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
True, but
But I am not a believer in Barton, Chavvy will again damage his spleen or something 2 weeks into spring training. Carter wont be ready till June at the soonest (and I am a big fan of Carter). And isnt Fox just as bad defensively as Cust maybe a smidge better. I Guess there is also McPherson
So we have a lot of bodies, but most options leave me wanting more, like a fat boy and a cupcake
The solution to "having a lot of mediocre options" is not "adding yet more mediocre options"
At some point, you lose the ability to actually evaluate everyone’s current skill level fairly. More signings beyond that point are useless.
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
yes and no
While I do agree we need to see who pans out,
I dislike the idea of sitting on our hands until Carter is ready, which could be as late as 2011. I hope its April, but knowing our luck Carter was one of the guys Desme preached to last year and Carter is also joining the priesthood.
Well, considering Carter and Desme were never on the same team...
That would really suck.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
No
Sounds like an injury waiting to happen. Were going to suck so
let’s just suck with our guys.
If anyone can't resist this, please at least use the correct pronoun.
KTHXBAI
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
If we sign Sheets..
that begs the question:
When the A’s play the Rangers, who’s arm will fall of first? Harden’s or Sheets’?
"Twenty minutes," says Jack Sr. "Thank god for Billy Beane."
"Any fan that wants us to do that is going to be disappointed because that just isn’t us." - Wolff
Erik Bedard's
Wait, what?
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
No fair --
His isn’t back together yet.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
his right arm.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
A's Make "comptetitive" Offer for Sheets
According to Michael Urban’s Tweet!
It's just more exciting with Billy Beane running the team.
I hope they didn't misspell their offer, too
Offer sheet: “We hereby offer you EIGHT (9) million dollars per season.”
Sheets: “I accept. Nine million, right?”
Beane: “^&%*”
Shawn Spencer: "I’m receiving a transmission from your husband. Really more of a voicemail, if I'm being honest. A status update. Perhaps a twitter."
Burton Guster: "I believe it’s called a tweet."
Shawn Spencer: "There’s no way I’m saying that."
it said "competitive"
So probably 6M base and 4M in incentives or something.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
Urban's Tweet:
#athletics have arranged a press conference at 1 p.m. today. Sheets signing announcement?
...and confirmation:
Confirmed. A’s have signed Ben Sheets. Presser in Oakland to intriuduce him at 1 p.m. #athletics
by LoneStranger on Jan 26, 2010 10:02 AM PST up reply actions
GREAT
Interesting to see the split between guaranteed and incentive money.
Are there MLB rules for that ?
Could the A’s offer Sheets 2 mln + 10 mln in incentives (e.g. 50K per inning pitched over 10) (irrespective of him being interested in such an offer)
HOLY SHIT ROTOWORLD SAYS HE SIGNED WITH US
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
HOLY SHIT?!?!
Don’t tell me we’ve got another guy deciding to retire and join the priesthood!!!
The monster at the end of this blog.
FATHER DESME IS DISPLEASED WITH YOUR NONSENSE.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
But he took a vow of silence
So all he can do is give me dirty looks.
The monster at the end of this blog.
Oh damn, he's not playin around
bypassing plain old priesthood and going straight to being a monk?!
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
What, we're not allowed to say "HORSEPLAY"?
There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy.
That wasn't really horseplay.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
I AM TAKING FULL AND TOTAL CREDIT FOR THIS SIGNING!!!
nah just kidding, SO STOKED THOUGH!!!!! We going SO hard in oh-10! Screw the Mariners its us thats gunna surprise everyone!
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