A's Post-Holliday
by baseballgirl on Sep 25, 2009 10:49 AM PDT
173 comments
From today's Talking Points: Tim Kawakami on Bay Area sports:
1-Quietly, practically under a self-imposed cloak of invisibility, the A’s have managed to put 724 runs on the board so far in 2009.
I still have to double-take when I type that number out, and now I’ve typed it a few times. 724???
That’s currently the 14th-best run total in baseball, an average of 4.78 per game, and on pace for 761.
Last year, the A’s scored only 646 runs. (The Giants are at 620 so far this year and on pace to score 656.)
There’s a simple answer, of course: We all knew the additions of Matt Holliday and Jason Giambi and a healthy Eric Chavez would get the A’s offense back percolating!
Wait. The A’s offensive eruption has mostly been done since the July 24 trade of Holliday and the Aug. 7 release of Giambi. Chavez never really was there for the A’s, again, this year.
I just went back to July 24, the day Holliday was moved to the Cardinals (for no immediately offensive help).
At that point, the A’s were 40-55, and were averaging 4.35 runs per game.
Since the departure of Holliday, the A’s have gone 33-25 (REALLY), and scored 310 runs, a Yankees-like average of 5.35 runs per game.
I’m here to note it. I can’t really explain it. No stats really pop out, other than the stolen base total, which is of course not a usual A’s/Billy Beane staple.
Team MVP: Davis, of course, with all those SBs and the .811 OPS. Beyond that, I can’t explain the A’s gusher of runs. If they could’ve loaned about 25 of them to the Giants, there might have been a playoff round or two at AT&T Park this year.
Discuss.
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Sorry, poll is fixed now :-)
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Sep 25, 2009 10:57 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
You know, this could be a really good discussion
But the “OMG Matt Holliday wasn’t trying!!!” stuff is just so aggravating. Stop it. PLEASE.
Why is there no mention of Giambi and Cabera being two of the worst hitters in the American League while they were here? Even replacing them with, well, replacement level talent would have been an upgrade. Instead, we’ve got Daric Barton putting up a 112 OPS+ playing every day, and Cliff Pennington with a 111 OPS+
I guess that’s an increase from Giambi and Caberera’s 85 and 87 OPS+ figures, respectively. Meanwhile, Scott Hairston has sucked ass in left field as Holliday’s replacement.
And yes, Rajai Davis somehow channeling Grady Sizemore this season is a huge help to the offense, but come on. This team is not better because Matt Holliday is no longer on the team.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 10:58 AM PDT reply actions 2 recs
I don't think we have had a poll asking it officially
And I don’t think he wasn’t “trying”, I think he was unhappy in Oakland and just didn’t give a sh*t. But I’m curious what other people think. I DEFINITELY don’t think that the team is better because Holliday is gone; that’s ridiculous. I want to know why they are playing so well now, even, like you said, with Hairston as Holliday’s replacement.
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Sep 25, 2009 11:05 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Seems kinda simple to me
1. Giambi sucked. Barton has been good.
2. Cabrera sucked. Pennington has been good.
3. Rajai Davis’ Lonely Hearts Club BABIP
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
And Ellis got better
So did Sweeney
by eliot123 on Sep 25, 2009 11:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kennedy was having the best 6 weeks of his life while Ellis was out.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 11:22 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But haven't AK + Ellis hit better than AK + Miley/whoever?
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 11:23 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Probably.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 11:25 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
So right there that's 3 IF positions with major offensive upgrades post ASB
1B (Giambi to Barton), SS (OCab to OCab on fire to Pennington), and 2B/3B, where Crosby/Hannahan were replaced in the batting order by Ellis.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 11:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can you edit the poll
to include “I don’t care” as an option? Because I’m with mikev on that one: it’s a fundamentally unanswerable question (unless Holliday says, “Yeah, I really phoned it in with Oakland” at which point there’s nothing to discuss any more), and it just doesn’t matter to me.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 11:10 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I give up.
Not even worth it.
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Sep 25, 2009 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
HAH. SO THERE.
Go on, say it. “Mike’s right and I’m wrong.”
You know you wanna. Throw me a bone here, chicks NEVER say that to me! :-D
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 11:13 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Chicks never ask you to throw them a bone?
by jpl on Sep 25, 2009 12:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
no wonder you know so much about Megan Fox...
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Sep 25, 2009 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
well, the word "throw" was not specifically used.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 4:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not trying to be snarky about this one, baseballgirl
but as much as you’re interested in AN’s opinion about Holliday’s level of effort, I’m actually interested in AN’s level of caring about Holliday’s level of effort.
Does that make sense?
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 11:14 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This.
To me, “Holliday didn’t try” is getting to be as bad as “God dammit why did we trade Ethier” or “We should have kept Tejada instead of Chavez” or “I can’t believe we traded away Harang” or other beaten to death “issues” on AN.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 11:16 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Really?
How could someone in AN not care? They dealt what now looks like a stud OF and an excellent reliever for the guy….who flipped a switch literally the second he arrived in St. Louis. I cant even imagine an A’s fan not caring about that?
Bring back Hammer.
by OaktownPower on Sep 25, 2009 11:16 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
and it continues.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 11:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Two reasons
1) It’s water under the bridge. He was here for about 90 games, now he’s gone. While he was here we went over this again and again and again. I think it might be time to let it go.
2) It’s unknowable and unprovable. I’d say there’s just as much proof that Holliday was trying too hard — that he was trying to justify the big trade, trying to prove himself to new fans, trying to get some offense going when Giambi and Cabrera and Chavez clearly weren’t going to. He heaped so much pressure on himself that he stopped hitting, then doubt set in and it screwed up his whole game. Going to St. Louis and hitting in a lineup with Pujols relaxed him, and he’s pounding the ball again.
Or maybe it was McGwire’s fault, or just a random blip.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 11:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I blame Dan Johnson.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 11:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dan Johnson.
"Life is a horizontal fall" -Jean Cocteau
by King Richard on Sep 25, 2009 1:19 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
#2 is very legit and possible.
And could very well be the case. I’m not saying he is a bad person or anything…..but it would only be natural to give that extra bit in front of 45,000 in a pennant race than in front of 8,000 in last place. As for water under the bridge…..yea, maybe so, I am not actively upset, just discussing it from a baseball aspect and I think it is interesting still in that regard, especially while looking at what C Gone and Huston are doing. Not to mention, I am a huge Huston fan, so admittedly some bias.
Bring back Hammer.
by OaktownPower on Sep 25, 2009 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think Holliday tried
and didn’t produce because we all know this league is far superior and he is back in his comfort zone in the NL where he knows most of the pitchers.
I also think he didn’t want to be here but he is a professional so he did the best he could. I think the young players thought he and Giambi would be the saviors and when those two left, the young players seized the opportunity and produced without feeling pressure due to being out of the race early.
by Trainman on Sep 25, 2009 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree with trainman.
He had to try he wanted a big cntract. He just wasn’t used to AL pitching and the big ole coli can be hard to hit in.
by IM4Oakgal on Sep 25, 2009 10:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or...
Once you take into account a bad April and the fact that he’s traditionally a second half guy, and the fact that he’s now in an inferior league, all the bases are covered.
If Matt Holliday were on the team today instead of Scott Hairston, the A’s would have one more masher in the line-up. It wouldn’t have mattered because it’s virtually impossible to go from 15 games under in late July to a spot in the post-season, but I think the A’s would’ve scored even more runs and had an even better record.
by richwol1 on Sep 25, 2009 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He as a matter of fact didn't flip a switch when he got to the Cards, he flipped the switch about a month before the trade,
but everyone here decided they already hated him after april
What you fail to understand in your joyless myopia is that baseball is the key to life-- the Rosetta Stone, if you will. If you just understood baseball better all your other questions your, your... the, uh... the aliens, the conspiracies they would all, in their way be answered by the baseball gods.
by winchester5 on Sep 25, 2009 11:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is also true
His July line with the A’s was .338/.413/.574.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 11:36 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You know
I don’t have time to look it up right now, but I think when the A’s traded Holliday, he actually had started hitting pretty well and was showing a lot of signs of being the player the A’s wanted when they went after him.
I will say that much like people have the impression of someone like Chavy as though he didn’t care, I got that feeling a lot with Holliday. It was clear to me that he never really wanted to be here and seemingly only started to pick it up once he thought he had a chance of getting traded. Course the rational side of me says that it just took him quite a bit of time to adjust to the AL, AL parks and pitchers.
by Tyler Bleszinski on Sep 25, 2009 4:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I looked it up before.
He basically had 3 1/2 really shitty weeks to start the season. He hit .240/.288/.360 in April, and then hit .299/.400/.480 the rest of the season before he was traded.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 5:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Baseball-reference.com is the place to check this stuff out
Their splits page (make sure not to let Barton use this) has month-by-month, but the game log lists a player’s game-by-game stats, and you can select any portion of the season just by clicking on the first and last game of the time you’re interested in, and baseball-reference.com will generate a complete, subtotal line for that period.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 5:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I've got reliable sources from Coliseum waste management
that claim that Holliday actually gave multiple sh*ts.
Also, I’m sure the AL/NL and Oakland park effects have had something to do with Holliday’s numbers.
m*****f***ing c***s***ing peanut butter and jelly!! f*** f*** f***!!!
by JediLeroy on Sep 25, 2009 5:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This
One minor point WRT replacing Giambi and OCab: OCab actually put up a .900 OPS in June, so he was personally responsible for part of the post-ASB turnaround.
I don’t have time now to go through it with a fine-toothed comb, but in principle the question, “How did this team start scoring way more runs than before?” isn’t hard to answer. You look at what the team did in the sucky part of the season, then look at what they did in the good part, and figure out what changed: HR numbers, 2B numbers, BBs, number of pitches taken, opposition errors, ERA of opponents starters, that kind of thing. Then you can look at the hitters who turned their own seasons around and see if their personal line-drive rates and such changed.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
One would think in his contract year
that not trying is ridiculous….but I have watched him a lot in St Louis and this is not the same guy..and I’m not just talking about stats. He runs harder on the bases and int he field without a shadow of a doubt. I dont think he wasn’t trying per se, but with a bad team in front of no fans, it is natural to probably not go fully all out when not needed. He didnt try to get out, but he surely is giving more effort now….great fans and a pennant race will do that, it is just natural. But I really believe he was going through the motions a bit here…..just watch some Cards game..he aint the same guy in actions or in demeanor.
Bring back Hammer.
by OaktownPower on Sep 25, 2009 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
My question for mikev
Are you disgusted about the “Holliday never tried” lament, because you really believe he busted his ass every game for Oakland, or is it that you find the “idea” of baseball players sometimes going through the motions absurd?
I get the feeling sometimes that it’s the latter.
There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that ballplayers often hit better, catch better, and run faster when they move to a team in contention vs. being on one going nowhere. The implication that “they’re all professionals” and play just as hard for Washington as they would, say, for the Yankees? No way.
In my opinion, Holliday knew he wouldn’t stay in Oakland quite early in the season, and his play reflected it. I agree with OaktownPower above … Holliday looks and acts like a completely different ballplayer now. No question.
I needed a team so I wouldn’t turn into one of the eighty million pink hat-wearing Bud Light-drinking mulleted idiots at Fenway.
by Vacafan on Sep 25, 2009 5:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the idea he finds absurd, or at least wildly unproven,
is that “going through the motions” actually has any negative impact on a player’s performance. Baseball is not a game where “trying really really hard” is necessarily a good thing. Hell, I’d figure it’s a bad thing at least as often as it’s a good one. Maybe more often.
Holliday “looks and acts like a completely different ballplayer now” because he is hitting better. These “explanations” are nothing more than tautologies wearing the rhetorical equivalent of three-piece suits.
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
by PaulThomas on Sep 25, 2009 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Several reasons.1
1. It’s a dead horse. Let it be dead.
2. There’s literally nothing that can prove Holliday “wasn’t trying” (that is, aside from Holliday coming out and saying it)
3. It bugs the shit out of me that so many people – not just here on AN, but on other various A’s sites around the intertubes – continue to say it. “Holliday didn’t want to be here” “Holliday didn’t give 100%” “Holliday wasn’t trying” or any other number of things that basically all come to the same point. The problem I have is that people keep saying it OVER AND OVER AND OVER, to the point that they just keep on saying it and nobody refutes it and everybody just assumes it’s true. It’s not.
Oh, and as far as your assumption that player hit better, catch better, and run faster when they move to a team in contention? Tell that to Johnny Damon when he was traded here. He must have missed that.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 5:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm certainly not claiming it's a hard and fast rule, by any means ...
please note that I wrote “often” … I just think it’s human nature oftentimes to put out more effort playing for the “winner” vs. the “loser”. Brad Penny is another exception. He was horrible for the Red Sox, and great for the Giants. Again, I’m not saying it’s automatic - there really are professionals who give maximum effort wherever they play - and it obviously cannot be proven (never understood, though, why because something can’t be proven this makes it immediately untrue), but I felt Holliday stepped it up (in the effort department) somewhat once he went to St. Louis.
I don’t lose any sleep over it, but I don’t think it entirely fair to suggest the idea is complete nonsense. Like you said, “it can’t be proven”, so we’ll never know if it’s true or false.
I guess
I needed a team so I wouldn’t turn into one of the eighty million pink hat-wearing Bud Light-drinking mulleted idiots at Fenway.
by Vacafan on Sep 25, 2009 5:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
oops, have no idea how I crossed a part of that out.
I needed a team so I wouldn’t turn into one of the eighty million pink hat-wearing Bud Light-drinking mulleted idiots at Fenway.
by Vacafan on Sep 25, 2009 5:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's one of those patently idiotic auto-formatting things that was put into SBN 3.0
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
by PaulThomas on Sep 25, 2009 5:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The guys you mentioned both moved from the superior AL to the weak NL....
Keep in mind, of course, that "the best defense of Derek Jeter's life" ranks somewhere in between "the best fiscal responsibility of Mike Tyson's life" and "the best not-getting-assassinated-ness of James Garfield's life." -FJM
by travdog6 on Sep 26, 2009 4:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It is absurd to think that Holliday in a contract year wouldn't bust ass to make tens of millions of dollars
There are differing opinions on me. According to Iglew "DFA is PT with a sense of humor. PT is DFA with introspective self-doubt. I like them both" but according to sirbed Im "The Stats Killer"
by designatedforassignment on Sep 25, 2009 6:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Holliday was/is going "to make tens of millions of dollars"
whether he played great OR lousy. Hell, Holliday could have completely taken the year off and made a lot of money. The notion that he was going to make considerably less money if he had one season of sub-par play is ludicrous.
I needed a team so I wouldn’t turn into one of the eighty million pink hat-wearing Bud Light-drinking mulleted idiots at Fenway.
by Vacafan on Sep 26, 2009 7:53 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Really?
Do you realize how much talk there was before the season about him being a “Coors Field-product”? How many times did analysts look at those home/road splits?
Please remedy my confusion
and thrust me back to the day.
The silence of your seclusion
brings night into all you say.
by danmerqury on Sep 26, 2009 9:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It seems more likely that the team just relaxed more.
Once they were allowed to run free and just play the game with no expectations, they started to have more fun and consequently, played better. It’s not the stolen bases in themselves but what “allowing” them to run did to their confidence, etc.
CuttheMullet, from "The Thread":
"Whenever I’m about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing."
by DMOAS on Sep 25, 2009 11:00 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I think this is a good point.
It’s always easier to take at-bats when they don’t really matter. And the stolen base phenomenon is HUGE. I had no idea how high those numbers really were.
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Sep 25, 2009 11:06 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
That would be an inference based on what the offense did
The guys who are playing now and didn’t before (Raj, Pennington, and Barton getting, I dunno, maybe 80% of their combined ABs after the ASB) didn’t relax more — they just replaced guys who were hitting worse.
We’d have to look at the individual players who’s performance has improved and evaluate that.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
"Dialed in" is usually used to refer to playing extremely WELL, not poorly
“Mailed in” means terrible…
So since more whinging about Matt Holliday bores me, as a conversation starter: why DOESN’T baseball allow player loans? The Giants really COULD have used Rajai Davis, or indeed Ryan Sweeney or any outfielder or second baseman or shortstop or catcher who wasn’t utterly horrible.
In soccer, players are routinely loaned out for a half-season or a season at a time, usually to get them more playing time at a lower level but sometimes just because the team in question doesn’t really need them. (Of course, the fear of being relegated usually keeps all the second-division clubs honest. Might be nice if there was a little of that pressure in baseball. But I digress.)
I don’t know that allowing loans would make baseball a better game. Maybe the confusion and conflicts of interest would make it unworkable. (Or maybe not— you could have a rule which only allows loans to the other league.) It would certainly raise the level of play in the playoffs, though, you’d have to think. Wouldn’t that be a good thing for the game as a whole?
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
by PaulThomas on Sep 25, 2009 11:06 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
It would be pretty sweet, but the Yanks and Sox would just take all the good players on loan.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But they'd have to give up prospects and/or money to do it
which the small-market clubs could then deploy in seasons where they ARE competitive.
Seems better than status quo to me.
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
by PaulThomas on Sep 25, 2009 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
creative thinking, doctor...
but if we’re going to adopt something from European soccer, I’d rather adopt relegation than loaning.
That way, the RiverCats would soon be replacing Kansas City in the AL.
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Sep 25, 2009 11:13 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
And we'd lose all our top prospects
no thanks.
CuttheMullet, from "The Thread":
"Whenever I’m about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing."
by DMOAS on Sep 25, 2009 11:50 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hey, my loyalties are Sacramento first, A's second...
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Sep 25, 2009 1:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
So... the only reason you're able to have a draft, and central contracts, and the like
is because there’s no relegation and promotion. What the league gains in spreading out competativeness, through the draft, they lose in the number of meaningful games at the end of the season. It does, unfortunately, work both ways.
by bobnothing on Sep 25, 2009 4:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not necessarily
You could expand baseball to 40 teams, give each of the 40 a spot in the draft, but have two 20-team leagues with teams moving back and forth.
This would make an interesting article.
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
by PaulThomas on Sep 25, 2009 5:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hell, do it now. Just relegate teams to the NL :D
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 5:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Heh.
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
by PaulThomas on Sep 25, 2009 5:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like that idea a lot actually
It is, in part, what makes European soccer so interesting to me. Nothing like having your team in Serie A getting a key striker, defender or midfielder right at the point to help them immensely.
by Tyler Bleszinski on Sep 25, 2009 4:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Restrict the number of players a team is allowed to receive on loan.
CuttheMullet, from "The Thread":
"Whenever I’m about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing."
by DMOAS on Sep 25, 2009 11:50 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thanks...I had already changed the poll
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Sep 25, 2009 11:09 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If European football teams had extensive, closed farm systems
then they probably wouldn’t loan players, either.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 11:32 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They have youth programs
Not sure how well that correlates to an American-style farm system, but…
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
by PaulThomas on Sep 25, 2009 12:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think that's a little more like what baseball teams do in the DR or Venezuela
Portsmouth can’t put the equivalent of Travis Buck in a youth program.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 1:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Portsmouth would have Travis Buck up front at the moment, I suspect
by bobnothing on Sep 25, 2009 4:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The A's didn't
Though I guess at the equivalent point in the season Buck was in Oakland, but not playing very much (or very well).
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 4:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I really like the concept
Probably would need a bit of fleshing out to work out fair play stumbling blocks, but it would make things interesting, especially around the deadline. A team may be more inclined to make trades annually to give guys a shot knowing they’ll be back next year.
CuttheMullet, from "The Thread":
"Whenever I’m about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing."
by DMOAS on Sep 25, 2009 2:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Relegation is not something that should be brought into baseball.
Some motherfcukers are always trying to ice skate uphill - Blade.
by OldhamA on Sep 25, 2009 5:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It shouldn’t be brought into the NFL, MLB or NBA.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Sep 25, 2009 6:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
College sports are the only place where relegation could happen
In fact, Temple faced a kind of relegation in football from the Big East because they sucked year after year and had no fan base. I think they survived, somehow.
But it would work both conceptually and geographically if, say, the last-place PAC-10 team was relegated to the WAC and the winner of the WAC were promoted to the PAC-10. It would be pretty easy to do this in most of the country with major sports like football and basketball.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 6:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They Pac-10 should become the Pac-12.
North Division:
- Boise State
- Washington
- Washington State
- Oregon
- Oregon State
- Fresno State
South Division:
- Arizona
- Arizona State
- UCLA
- USC
- Stanford
- California
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Sep 25, 2009 6:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But then the WAC would be down to 7
They say nothing is impossible, but I do nothing all the time!
by muffinpryde on Sep 25, 2009 6:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good.
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Sep 25, 2009 6:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It is not the first time a team
has lost supposed stars and performed much better without them. Correct me if I am wrong but didn’t Seattle win 114 games after losing Randy Johnson, Griffey and A Rod. I don’t believe they left at one time but over a two year period. Way too much emphasis is put on one ball player on any given team. If I hear one more time that this or that guy “will carry the team on his back” I surely will throw up. If that were the case the Giants would have won 4 WS with Barry Bonds playing for them. The game is still pitching and defense. The Giants based on their hitting should have lost 100 games by now, but that is not how a team wins.
by Laoren on Sep 25, 2009 11:11 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
The record season was 2001
They won 116 games. It was the first year since 1988 that they fielded a team without arguably the three greatest players in franchise history: Junior, Unit and ARod.
Still had Edgar, however. And some guy from Japan broke in that year.
by eliot123 on Sep 25, 2009 11:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
And Bret Boone did some shopping at GNC.
Bring back Hammer.
by OaktownPower on Sep 25, 2009 11:19 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No he didn't
It was Max Muscle… And the Clomid was for intimacy problems
by jeffro on Sep 25, 2009 12:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
to clarify
“without any” of those three— first it was Griffey (1989), then Johnson (1990), then Arod (1996 as a full-time player). Johnson left at the end of 1988; Griffey after 1999; Arod after 2000.
by eliot123 on Sep 25, 2009 11:20 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's actually called the "Ewing Theory" named after Patrick Ewing...
Click below to read the ESPN article by Bill Simmons:
http://proxy.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?id=1193711
I agree with this theory as a plausible reason why a team produces better results after their superstar leaves the team. When the star player is on the team, a lot of pressure falls on his shoulders. Once that player leaves, the pressure leaves with him, and so do the hopes of success. IF the remaining players decide to try “a little” harder individually, the sum of their efforts are usually far greater collectively than the effort the star player could have ever given the team.
If 9 guys step up even a little bit, they’ll win more ball games than if 1 superstar plays his best. Simple as that.
by A's Fan by Design on Sep 25, 2009 1:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Except in the A's case, we're not talking about the same 8 guys.
As stated before, the entire infield is different now. Kennedy-Pennington-Ellis-Barton is performing ridiculously better than Hannahan-Cabrera-Kennedy-Giambi was. That’s got nothing to do with Holliday leaving, that’s replacing guys playing like crap with guys who aren’t.
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 1:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
totally spot on.
Although I’m still gonna root against Holliday for the rest of his career.
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Sep 25, 2009 1:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What if we sign him this offseason?
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 2:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We won't.
Unless you’ve got an extra $150 million in your couch cushions.
by A's Fan by Design on Sep 25, 2009 6:20 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Oh shit thats where that was...
There are differing opinions on me. According to Iglew "DFA is PT with a sense of humor. PT is DFA with introspective self-doubt. I like them both" but according to sirbed Im "The Stats Killer"
by designatedforassignment on Sep 25, 2009 6:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The circumstances are also way different in baseball than in other sports....
Take Randy Moss and the infamous randy ratio under Mike Tice when he was with the Vikings. Some QB’s might actually perform at a higher level, with inferior receivers, when they are free to make progressions and find the open man instead of trying to force the ball to a certain superstar receiver. As well, in basketball- trying to run the ball through your superstar player and let him do his thing while everyone else watches instead of creating motion and running a fluid offense. Whether the superstar is a ball hog or extremely humble and team-oriented the said “Ewing Theory” can still come into play by the simple fact that the supporting players have less confidence in their abilities to make a play because they consciously/sub-consciously say why am I trying to make the play when I’m playing with somebody twice as good as me who can do it.
But the “Ewing Theory”doesn’t really translate over to baseball because whether or not a supporting player is surrounded by 8 other all-stars in the order or not- when he gets up to the plate, the onus is on him, and nobody else, to produce.
by MAC Attack on Sep 25, 2009 7:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Crazy that a made-up term coined by the Sports Guy a couple years ago
is now regularly used and understood parlance in the sports world
by cityplANner on Sep 25, 2009 2:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because I'm also a life-long Knicks fan
I can tell you with absolute certainty that the Knicks have never come close to being a better team without Patrick Ewing.
I needed a team so I wouldn’t turn into one of the eighty million pink hat-wearing Bud Light-drinking mulleted idiots at Fenway.
by Vacafan on Sep 25, 2009 5:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
True
That’s why it’s called a theory, right?
by A's Fan by Design on Sep 25, 2009 6:21 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
In scientific terms
a theory can be tested and proven plausible. This (Patrick Ewing Theory) is like saying “even though Patrick Ewing proves the Patrick Ewing Theory wrong, it is still plausible.” Which I guess I could buy… More than Intelligent Design anyway.
by jeffro on Sep 28, 2009 4:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, obviously it's because Beane fired that idiot Bob Geren and replaced him with Jim Tracy
Oh, wait.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 11:12 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Jim Tracy?
You can do better than that.
What about Bobby Valentine?
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Sep 25, 2009 11:14 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I give up.
Story has been edited.
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Sep 25, 2009 11:12 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
baseballgirl: the matt holliday of AN?
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones."
-BB 07/27/05
by xbhaskarx on Sep 25, 2009 1:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
(because she gave up)
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones."
-BB 07/27/05
by xbhaskarx on Sep 25, 2009 1:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I feel like less of a person for having missed it before she edited it.
Maybe you can find one made by Go F**k Yourself San Jose... -Poppy
by Leopold Bloom on Sep 25, 2009 1:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It was far more interesting beforehand
Don’t apologize to these louts! It’s just BBG being BBG
by cityplANner on Sep 25, 2009 2:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
We love BBG just the way she is.
Screw those bloggers in Boston if they can’t handle her.
Maybe you can find one made by Go F**k Yourself San Jose... -Poppy
by Leopold Bloom on Sep 25, 2009 2:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I love you.
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Sep 25, 2009 2:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Aww, shucks.
Oh him.
:(
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
by mikev on Sep 25, 2009 2:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I took a few more cheap shots at Matt Holliday plus a poll
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Sep 25, 2009 2:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lol...perfect.
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Sep 25, 2009 2:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Imagine him in our current lineup
Even 1st half slumping Holliday would be one of the best hitters in there. I don’t really buy the “not trying” thing, but there was a lot of pressure, a new league, and no protection in the lineup.
by A'sian on Sep 25, 2009 11:15 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
This is my guess why also...
He has less than no protection.
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Sep 25, 2009 11:18 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Heck
I’d feel confident batting with Pujols up next. Ok maybe not.
by A'sian on Sep 25, 2009 11:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
but no matter what Holliday does
Pujols will just do it better…
by colin on Sep 25, 2009 11:40 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would just like to point out
that Albert Pujols has a brother. His name is Harry.
True story.
by cityplANner on Sep 25, 2009 2:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
There are going to be roughly 10-12 teams in past 40 years
that have done what the A’s did this year. Each of the following:
End up a bit under .500
Play much better the 2nd half.
Hit a lot better the 2nd half.
Outscore their opponents by a lot more in the 2nd half (or at least outscore them at all, essentially a big RDiff movement)
I’ll do up a post in a couple of days about what happened to those teams the next season. And also look at the “wanna-bes” who replicated the A’s 2009 season, but not to the same degree.
by eliot123 on Sep 25, 2009 11:16 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Ooh cool.
Can you give us a preview? What’s the gist of it? They all dominated the league the next year, RIGHT?
by A'sian on Sep 25, 2009 11:20 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What? They all won the World Series the next year?
(dials ticket office to reserve season tickets)
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Sep 25, 2009 11:23 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
All I can say so far
is that they didn’t stay the same.
In fact I don’t there’s been a team in the last 40 years that stayed in the 75-79 win area (and I am leaving out the strike year of 1994 and may have missed a team or two in the shortened season of 1995) for four consecutive years. A’s will be at 3 if they win 3 to 7 of the remaining 9, so I wouldn’t count on another meh season. Might be better, might be worse.
by eliot123 on Sep 25, 2009 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
He just did give you a preview!!
"I'm not going to buy my kids an encyclopedia. Let them walk to school like I did." -Yogi Berra
by brenarlo on Sep 25, 2009 1:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If this team got something from Giambi, Duchscherer or Chavez
They could have won 90 games.
by Manstein on Sep 25, 2009 11:55 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Chavez' numbers probably would have not been that different from...
Kennedy’s. Defense would’ve been better, probably only marginally because of his back issues.
Duke would’ve been nice. 30 starts from him would have made the rotation much stronger, but then again – we might not have seen what Outman was capable of doing. By him being gone for the season, the A’s got to audition/evaluate many of their SP candidates for next year.
Giambi – if used properly, probably would’ve been pretty productive. Based on his bench role in Colorado so far (small sample size), you could argue that he would have provided more benefit for A’s than Garciaparra has.
"just a beating heart ... plasma that we'll put into our uniform." - Billy Beane
by athleticsBB4life on Sep 25, 2009 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Giambi, in Colorado, in the NL.
’nuff said.
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball." -- Connie Mack
by GreenSocks on Sep 25, 2009 12:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kennedy has been playing 3B since June 28
3B was a black hole for three months with Crosby and Hannahan playing there. With Duke, we don’t have to suffer through Cahill’s disastrous first half.
And speaking of Giambi, I think there’s a good chance he would have been more effective as a part-time DH. Entire Giambi fiasco is why I’m opposed to bringing any cheap old sluggers as everyday position players next year.
by Manstein on Sep 25, 2009 1:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe my memory isnt correct but..
havent the A’s played well every sept when they are outta the race the past few years. Pressure is off, and they can relax and play. Then come April when it matters again they suck under the pressure again.
"Carter's 25-game hitting streak isn't any normal streak. He's 46 for 97 (.474 average) during the run, adding 16 walks and compiling 81 total bases in the process. I'm out of superlatives for what he's doing." - Kevin Goldstein
by Syphon on Sep 25, 2009 12:19 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
your memory isn't correct
Past “few” years?/ Few means three or more, right?
Three years ago they won the division.
Two years ago, after a good August, they tanked in September at 9-17
Last year, after two horrible months, they played .500 ball in September at 12-12.
This is a different paradigm.
by eliot123 on Sep 25, 2009 12:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I stand corrected.
It felt like they played well last sept despite the 500 record.
"Carter's 25-game hitting streak isn't any normal streak. He's 46 for 97 (.474 average) during the run, adding 16 walks and compiling 81 total bases in the process. I'm out of superlatives for what he's doing." - Kevin Goldstein
by Syphon on Sep 25, 2009 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Syphon...
your point is well received here. The A’s second-half run was played with little to no pressure. It would’ve been interesting to see how this current group would have played in a pennant race. My guess is that it would not have been to this level.
"just a beating heart ... plasma that we'll put into our uniform." - Billy Beane
by athleticsBB4life on Sep 25, 2009 12:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
That is the Unknowable
Most of our good to very good teams earlier this decade of course played better in the 2nd half, sometimes a lot better. One of the best theories for this is that they were young, particularly on the mound, and thus less susceptible to injury and fatigue in the Dog Days and beyond. This team got better in part because of youth, but also with vets like Tomko, Kennedy and a 29 year old Davis performing well.
by eliot123 on Sep 25, 2009 1:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
there is enormous pressure on theses guys
all of them have this one “shot” to prove they are MLB players and can have a job next year. that is more pressure than division title race.
by Future Ed on Sep 25, 2009 1:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just one more example of the general rule
that psychological explanations of anything in baseball are a. worthless, and b. manipulable to explain absolutely anything.
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
by PaulThomas on Sep 25, 2009 1:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
as are statistics.
Maybe you can find one made by Go F**k Yourself San Jose... -Poppy
by Leopold Bloom on Sep 25, 2009 1:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
b, not a.
don’t mean to throw as much dirt back.
Maybe you can find one made by Go F**k Yourself San Jose... -Poppy
by Leopold Bloom on Sep 25, 2009 1:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
But here's the thing
Bad statistical explanations are usually obvious and easily refuted if anyone takes the time to. There are certain very well-defined “tells” which you can look for (for instance, any argument which relies on cherrypicking a smaller data sample out of a larger context is almost invariably worthless).
Psychological explanations are unrefutable and unfalsifiable. There’s no substance to them.
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
by PaulThomas on Sep 25, 2009 5:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You got it on B,
and you’ve got it on A for now,
but hopefully not forever.
Once sabermetrics reaches the point where 90% of everything quantifiable and explainable is explained and quantified, the new frontier will will be in manipulation of intangibles, which is totally right-brain non-linear mystical shit.
People are not automatons, which is unfortunate to those studying them, because it sure complicates their jobs.
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Sep 25, 2009 2:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Since when is it unfortunate for your job to be complicated?
I think people would be a lot more fun to study than automatons.
"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan
by iglew on Sep 25, 2009 2:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If there's one thing I've learned in my years of working
it’s that if other people can understand what you do in your job, you get paid less for it
by bobnothing on Sep 25, 2009 4:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
hmmm, could be something there.
alaska A residing in northern Idaho.
by ak_A on Sep 25, 2009 5:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is true
Complicated laws are often jokingly referred to as the “Lawyers’ Full Employment Act.”
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
by PaulThomas on Sep 25, 2009 5:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thats what I was trying to get at.
"Carter's 25-game hitting streak isn't any normal streak. He's 46 for 97 (.474 average) during the run, adding 16 walks and compiling 81 total bases in the process. I'm out of superlatives for what he's doing." - Kevin Goldstein
by Syphon on Sep 25, 2009 1:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, I don't know about playing under no pressure
Some of these guys are currently at the crossroads of their careers where they have to establish themselves as MLB regulars or be swept away by the next generation of talent.
by Manstein on Sep 25, 2009 1:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I dunno... Barton seems to have a thing for September.
And Buck a little too.
"Carter's 25-game hitting streak isn't any normal streak. He's 46 for 97 (.474 average) during the run, adding 16 walks and compiling 81 total bases in the process. I'm out of superlatives for what he's doing." - Kevin Goldstein
by Syphon on Sep 25, 2009 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I Just Spoke To Matt Holliday
And he said that he never felt comfortable playing with white shoes on. He thought they made him look like Cousin Eddie from the “Vacation” movies. He figured if he hit below average and played with a vacant stare that the A’s would move him.
Now that he gets to wear red shoes he feels so much better. He did say that his misses the LF bleachers crowd and Dibs.
by KCa's on Sep 25, 2009 12:27 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
but what about the live dot racing!?
"The A's get some action but they do not score..." -Glen Kuiper
"Anyone who calls themselves the Angels Angels should have to start over and ride the short bus." -timmeh from McCovey Chronicles
by Cheezombie on Sep 25, 2009 12:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They need to install Pari-Mutuels,
‘cause that’s where the real income is…
gambling on dot racing!
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Sep 25, 2009 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
i bet you'd like a cold one, Clark?
alaska A residing in northern Idaho.
by ak_A on Sep 25, 2009 5:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
shitter was full!
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Sep 28, 2009 5:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
1-Quietly, practically under a self-imposed cloak of invisibility, the A’s have managed to put 724 runs on the board so far in 2009.
I still have to double-take when I type that number out, and now I’ve typed it a few times. 724???
It should also be noted the A’s are undefeated in the games they score more runs than there opponent
by tafkasam on Sep 25, 2009 1:06 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
That Kawakami article was going just fine till the last line.
He wants the A’s to loan some runs to the Giants??
The Giants can bite me.
"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan
by iglew on Sep 25, 2009 1:31 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Besides
They got tons of offense in that Freddy Sanchez trade right?
"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin
by Helloooo 1st on Sep 25, 2009 1:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sabean's still got that magic touch!
All he had to give away was their #3 prospect!
by cityplANner on Sep 25, 2009 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who had his stuff collapse before he was traded.
It wasn’t a terrible trade for them, just a poor one.
There are differing opinions on me. According to Iglew "DFA is PT with a sense of humor. PT is DFA with introspective self-doubt. I like them both" but according to sirbed Im "The Stats Killer"
by designatedforassignment on Sep 25, 2009 2:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Point is
I’m sure they could’ve gotten a better player than Freddy Sanchez for Alderson.
"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin
by Helloooo 1st on Sep 25, 2009 4:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They probably could have gotten a marginally better player
but I think you are underestimating how much Alderson declined in value.
There are differing opinions on me. According to Iglew "DFA is PT with a sense of humor. PT is DFA with introspective self-doubt. I like them both" but according to sirbed Im "The Stats Killer"
by designatedforassignment on Sep 25, 2009 4:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not buying the whole "Alderson had suddenly turned to crap" argument
I think that’s organizational spin on a so-so trade. The Pirates make their share of bone-headed mistakes, but there’s no way they’d trade Sanchez for Alderson before doing their homework. Giants fans and Giants writers trying to act as if they were the only ones who knew this … bulls***.
I needed a team so I wouldn’t turn into one of the eighty million pink hat-wearing Bud Light-drinking mulleted idiots at Fenway.
by Vacafan on Sep 25, 2009 5:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No look at what grover says in my Giants trade thread
he was absolutely right the degradation of his stuff (which wasn’t outstanding like his pitchability and control) was happening before the trade.
I am hardly a Giants fan nor was it a bad trade for the Pirates if Alderson bounces back its a very good trade for them, there is just no guarantee.
There are differing opinions on me. According to Iglew "DFA is PT with a sense of humor. PT is DFA with introspective self-doubt. I like them both" but according to sirbed Im "The Stats Killer"
by designatedforassignment on Sep 25, 2009 6:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
can they bite you and still win?
Because if so, I’d rather you not be in pain. If it causes them to lose, then I, too, want them to bite you.
Maybe you can find one made by Go F**k Yourself San Jose... -Poppy
by Leopold Bloom on Sep 25, 2009 1:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe Wolff sells them 25 runs for Santa Clara County territorial rights?
by Manstein on Sep 25, 2009 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Heard a crazy stat today
That the gnats have scored two or fewer runs in something like 54 games this year. Ain’t gonna cut it folks.
Obviously, we’d have to give them more than 25…
Looking forward to TV games tonight and the weekend!
"Do I talk to myself? No, I just remind myself of what I'm trying to do. You know, I never answer myself so how can I be talking to myself?" - Rickey
by cuppingmaster on Sep 25, 2009 3:31 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Now that's an interesting idea.....
"Baseball is dull only to dull minds." Red Barber
by BERRYJO on Sep 25, 2009 7:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Going tonight BBG?
Just got tickets front row by the right foul pole.
I am sure we’ll be there tomorrow and Sunday as well.
Hope to see you there.
by easyraider on Sep 25, 2009 3:12 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I'll be there!
I’ll come say hi to you and the family! :-)
"Bobby Crosby at third is a bit of an adventure. And not like, here’s some hidden treasure, what fun. More like, gah! poison ants!" --alea iacta est
by baseballgirl on Sep 25, 2009 4:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Any truth to the conjecture ...
… that Ra-Jai’s given name is really Robert Johnson Davis?
The meaning of life is not so much 'found,' as it is 'made.' --Opus
by The Dogfather on Sep 25, 2009 4:42 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Someone check his flight records.
See if he went to Rosedale over the All-Star break.
Please remedy my confusion
and thrust me back to the day.
The silence of your seclusion
brings night into all you say.
by danmerqury on Sep 25, 2009 4:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Damn slegnA!
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
by Nick on Sep 25, 2009 4:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
the kids are alright
OPS past 30 days:
Ryan Sweeney .968
Rajai Davis .905
Cliff Pennington .872
Daric Barton .867
and Eric Patterson at .984 and old man Kennedy at .825.
Point is not that these numbers are sustainable, but they certainly far exceed what I thought each of these guys could produce. Not many homers, lots of doubles, some triples, and speed.
A far more exciting and fun brand of baseball, and certainly Davis/Sweeney/Barton have been around long enough for scouting reports to get around on weaknesses.
by ojoe on Sep 25, 2009 4:48 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
We could have been even more productive
had Beane and company just given Crosby the chances he deserved.
alaska A residing in northern Idaho.
by ak_A on Sep 25, 2009 5:26 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Hi, ED...
oops sorry were you trying to be here incognito??
"Baseball is dull only to dull minds." Red Barber
by BERRYJO on Sep 25, 2009 7:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hi, I'm Matt Holliday, and I'm in a contract year
But I don’t like Oakland, so I think I’m going to lessen my efforts, thereby decreasing the overall value of my future contract.
Sounds ridiculous, if you ask me. People always want to be able to explain statistical blips with some human element. Do people seriously think that Holliday didn’t try to hit the ball in his plate appearances?
m*****f***ing c***s***ing peanut butter and jelly!! f*** f*** f***!!!
by JediLeroy on Sep 25, 2009 5:31 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Well said...
"What a joke." ~ Booby Crosby
by MMunoz33 on Sep 26, 2009 11:29 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow, Tim Kawakami?
The Ultimate Opportunist
by Rated-R Superstar on Sep 25, 2009 5:40 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Matt Holliday made a pretty major swing change this year.
I don’t get how this isn’t brought up more, but the moment he moved to his old swing he started dominating. Seems simple to me.
Keep in mind, of course, that "the best defense of Derek Jeter's life" ranks somewhere in between "the best fiscal responsibility of Mike Tyson's life" and "the best not-getting-assassinated-ness of James Garfield's life." -FJM
by travdog6 on Sep 26, 2009 4:44 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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