Signs Of Intelligent Life In Oakland
by Nico on May 9, 2009 9:17 AM PDT
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PrintIt's unfortunate that the A's seem compulsive about spotting the division a month of smart play before getting it together, as the prevailing organizational philosophy seems to be, "The first 1/6 of the season is for working hard to put your team in a hole, the next 1/6 is for starting to do what you should have done all along, and the other 2/3 is either for playing .700-.800 ball or trading your good players."
Fast-forward to this week, though, and ignore - as if it were just your worst alcoholic nightmare - April's banishments of Sean Gallagher and Travis Buck, a belief that all running and bunting is "aggressive" and never just "reckless," "desperate," or "flat out dumb," and the conviction that a good insurance policy for a broken player is an even more broken one. There are signs of intelligent life in Oakland right now.
On April 25th, I suggested that in the next two weeks the A's should start working towards a rotation of Braden, Anderson, Cahill, Gallagher, and Gio Gonzalez, because Eveland was neither good now nor was he part of any solid future rotation the A's were trying to build, and because Outman was better suited to throwing hard out of the bullpen than he was throwing "kinda hard but straight" in the rotation. Anderson's blister has complicated things slightly, but with Gio eligible to be called up Monday and Anderson ready to go in the next few days, the A's are now poised to run with this rotation anytime - even as of today, because off days will allow them to use a four man rotation until May 21st, and the rotation is set up with Gallagher, Braden, Cahill, and Anderson poised to make the next four starts.
The lineups are finally making more sense, as Suzuki has been moved up to the #2 spot where he can get 5 PAs a game, and Buck is seeing regular playing time - which he should as a player who offers good defense and does not have large platoon splits in his career. (I'd still prefer to see Cabrera at the bottom of the order, but given how many weak hitters the A's have to start right now I can live with it.)
The bullpen management, which personally I believe has been a strength of Geren's all along in comparison to his lineups, overall use personnel, and offensive strategies, has been smart. A timely example was Geren's use of Bailey for two innings last night. By putting him in at all, the A's were going to lose Bailey's services Saturday anyway and it is always risky to use too many pitchers in a game because of the possibility that any one of them might do exactly what Ziegler did Thursday - which is to "just not have it and allow a crooked number." Rather than rolling the dice with 4 different relievers, Geren let Bailey - who was clearly doing fine - pitch the 9th, and in doing so he has Ziegler available for up to 2 innings today if needed while Bailey rests.
Guys like Dana Eveland, Dan Giese, and Rajai Davis and are "filler" - they're not very good now but they're also not part of any future success the A's will have. This is why it's so crucial for Gallagher, and Gio Gonzalez, and Travis Buck to be in the mix: Because they have just as good a chance of being good now (as however raw they are, they're also far more talented), plus they're the ones who have a chance of being really good later.
The smarter roster, the smarter use of personnel, a smarter brand of baseball - all this could have, and should have, been in place before May 9th. But better now than never and for the first time all season I'm liking what I'm seeing.
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OK Nico....... Let the secret out of the bag
Poochini composed this and you typed it.
This is a good post, it had to have his input?
so whose name did he omit from this sentence?
Dana Eveland, Dan Giese, and Rajai Davis and are “filler” -
AN was so much better before I got here.
All part of the master plan.
Lull the rest of the league to sleep, and then wham. Sure it pisses off the natives, but it’s not like they were showing up in droves anyway.
Timely writing as usual, Nico. Clutch, even.
I'm here to talk about the past.
It's pretty much on the money
Things are starting to look up. I like those 5 in the rotation that Nico mentioned and feel quite a bit better about having Eveland gone and hopefully never coming back. Outman back to the pen where he belongs also will be good.
Now all we need is a couple of players to get healthy (players that will contribute when healthy) and we will be OK in this weak division.
We still have to contend with a manager whose elevator doesn’t go to the top but things are looking better. A few losses in a row may dampen this but here’s hoping for a nice winning streak.
Yep.
Sometimes it needs to be broken before you realize you have to fix it.
I'm here to talk about the past.
Interesting choice of adage
considering Oakland’s familiarity with the disabled list.
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball." - Connie Mack
sounds about right
I’m excited to go to the ballgame today. (No surprise, I’m always excited to go to ballgames).
Gallagher is reportedly on a 75-80 pitch count for his start.
not sure about everyone else
but I’m still willing to give Eveland a chance. Granted, he should take some time at AAA to figure it out but he has shown he has the stuff to be an effective starter. He had a decent ERA last season while getting zero run support in his first full season. I hope he can figure it out and either become a decent back-end option for the A’s or as trade bait to another club looking for some starters at the break. If he can have a good start or two I think Beane can net a decent prospect or two with him in a package with one of the many infielders or something. Dana’s still a guy I’d like to see succeed, in Oakland or elsewhere
I agree, I'd like to see him get his pitching straightened out
if nothing else he might then bring something useful in a trade.
I'm with you
I still maintain that Eveland could be a perfectly serviceable fifth starter.
While he is struggling at the moment, it’s not as if I look at the rest of the rotation and think, “Oh, they’re all so much better.” They’re just not struggling now.
Gallagher hasn’t proven he can be an effective starter, and has obviously irritated the club in some way. Anderson hasn’t really been very good, has a blister problem, and is being rushed into the big leagues at 21. Same with Cahill, who has only had one good start and has been rushed even more than Anderson. Gonzalez hasn’t established that he can get big league hitters out on a regular basis. I’m not going to get all giddy that Cahill was good in his last start, or that Gonzalez did better than expected in a tough situation.
The reality is that I think the A’s will need Eveland to be reaonably effective if they are to have any success this season.
by bear88 on May 9, 2009 10:42 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Really? I don't. I think it's perfectly possible
that Gallagher and Gio could outperform Eveland anyway. I do think 2 of the 4 of Eveland, Gallagher, Gio, and Outman may have to be reasonably effective, but I don’t think it’s a stretch to think Eveland’s the one who won’t be yet 2 of the other 3 could come around.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Possible, not likely
For reasons you have stated, I think Outman is better suited for the bullpen. I don’t see him as an effective starter, at least this season.
Gallagher is a mystery. He shows flashes, I’ll admit, but his overall performance has been bad and management obviously is miffed with him. The only reason he’s on the team now is because of desperation.
The Mariner game was the first time Gio showed me something. Obviously, the kid could blossom – but he might not this season.
Eveland, by contrast, was a reaonably effective starter for most of last season. I understand the arguments against him (lack of an out pitch, less than inspiring demeanor, poor control) but he’s the only one of that bunch who has a track record of moderate success at the major league level.
And you’re not counting the likelihood that the rookies will continue to struggle with inconsistency or worse, or that somebody else gets injured.
I’m not trying to oversell Eveland’s importance. I just think he is still a guy capable of quality starts. After all, he was just doing that a year ago. That’s more than I can say for Gio, Outman, or Gallagher. They’re still unproven.
by bear88 on May 9, 2009 11:34 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I would LIKE to agree with you, but...
the fact that he is even getting rocked at the Triple-A level does not bode so well for him, at least in the short term.
I’m hoping for a similar turn-around from him as we got last season late in the year after his time in the minors, but I won’t really hold my breath. He chewed some innings for the team last season in a transition period, but I’d much rather see Gio or Gallagher in the rotation from now on.
I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!
Eveland is struggling
I know that he got beaten up in his first AAA start but, as you say, Eveland was able to turn things around last year and pitch well after a stint in the minors.
I agree with Nico’s larger point that Eveland is not and will not be a major part of the team’s long-term future.
But he has shown the ability to eat up some innings and not be horrible. Gio hasn’t established that yet. Gallagher hasn’t established that, at least in Oakland. The rookies are rookies. Duchscherer’s return may be a pipe dream.
My point is that the A’s may need the guy this year.
Eveland
He needs to go down to AAA to learn how to control his emotions. He wears his stuggles for all to see. If I were Geren/Beane, I’d tell Dana to work on 1) His demeanor on the mound, 2) Fastball location, 3) 1st Pitch Strikes using Offspeed Stuff.
He really needs to get his head on straight. I just don’t know if he has the mental makeup.
by Colorado Fan on May 9, 2009 11:04 AM PDT up reply actions
BTW
Gio should be told those same exact things. He gets rattled easily, and before he regains his composer, he’s giving up a crooked number. I really can’t believe how much more Anderson & Cahill look like they belong… and Gio and Eveland act like they are 21 & 21, respectively.
by Colorado Fan on May 9, 2009 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions
Personally, I'm hoping he regains Brahms.
Brahms is cool.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I agree with your overall point.
I just really wish he was giving us a little more hope that he can be that guy for the team soon. There’s no doubt that if he could be even REASONABLY effective at the big league level he’d be a help to this team because sooner or later Cahill and Anderson will be shut-down or limited in innings and Braden can’t pitch every single day….
I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!
I'd complain about Eveland's lack of control,
but I’m advocating for Gallagher and Gio, so…yeah.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
PA?
ah…Plate appearance?
what is difference between PA and AB?
I need a baseball acronym glossary sometimes.
"It’s kind of like wishing one of our current players would turn into the second coming of Rickey." 67Marquez. April 28, 2009
PA includes things like walks, sac flies and so on
In other words, things that don’t count as ABs.
Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog
And know a message from Too Much Information
A batter starts with an at bat every time he faces a pitcher; however, the batter gets no time at bat in the following circumstances:
* He receives a base on balls (BB).
* He is hit by a pitch (HBP).
* He hits a sacrifice fly or a sacrifice hit (also known as sacrifice bunt).
* He is awarded first base due to interference or obstruction, usually by the catcher.
* The inning ends while he is still at bat (due to the third out being made by a runner caught
stealing, for example). In this case, the batter will come to bat again in the next inning, though
he now has no balls or strikes on him.
* He is replaced by another hitter before his at bat is completed (unless he is replaced with two
strikes and his replacement strikes out).
"No matter what I talk about, I always get back to baseball." - Connie Mack
Thank for TMI
I didn’t know the second-to-last tidbit. Learn something new every day!
I was going to buy a copy of The Power of Positive Thinking, and then I thought: "What the hell good would that do?"
signs of intelligent life unfortunately don't extend to KTRB
they just cut out completely in the middle of Marty Lurie’s live broadcast of Inside Baseball Saturday at the coliseum. This is not the first time they’ve cut out completely during Marty’s show, but it seems to be the longest such outage.
On your larger point...
I agree.
Suzuki has probably been the best hitter on the team. Moving him to second in the batting order makes sense.
Playing Buck is necessary, because the team needs to find out if 2007 was a fluke or if he can recapture the success of his rookie year. He also, as has been pointed out repeatedly, isn’t a platoon player based on splits. I would rather have him hitting leadoff, especially with Suzuki, a righthander, hitting second. But he needs to establish that he can actually hit consistently before a serious argument can be made for that. [The competition isn’t stiff, though.]
I've pretty much been in agreement with you all along with these things, Nico.
Although, to be honest (and this is not completely rational based on his performance) but I’ve kinda liked what I’ve seen from Dan Giese so far, especially in his spot start. I would not hold out hope that he would ever be permanent or even semi-permanent rotation option for this team, but he might be useful the less of this year and maybe next as a long reliever. He can only really go two times through the order before getting completely exposed, but with a young rotation, it would be nice to have a guy like him around to soak up an inning or two as a bridge between the inconsistent starters and the “lockdown” later inning guys.
Don’t get me wrong here, he’s not a great pitcher and I would never say that he is, but I kind of liken him to Kirk Saarloss of the 2005-2006 times: a guy that, when everything is clicking and he is keeping the ball down, he can be effective and keep you in the game and maybe have a lucky BABIP year or two that props up his ERA.
I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!
Saarloos is a good comp, actually, in that
he was really valuable for a time and then when he “ran out of luck” he fell off the face of the earth entirely. This means you don’t want to get caught up in Giese’s success as boding anything for the future, but there’s nothing wrong with riding the wave as long as the league hasn’t fully caught up with him yet.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Giese
The A’s need long relievers. Giese appears to fill the bill. He throws strikes and doesn’t try to do much. The team is going to have a lot of games where the starter is out by the fifth inning.
He might be a Saarloos, but I’m expecting much out of him as a spot starter.
I'm actually planning to write a post about this -
I think the A’s err by carrying one long reliever and then never using him if they haven’t needed him by the 3rd inning. If they carried two guys who are capable of going 3 IP – say Outman and Giese, or Eveland and Gallagher, or whomever, then they could use their “long man” more freely knowing that they had an emergency option still ready tomorrow if the starter got lit up. That could stop pitchers from getting “Yabued” – as Gallagher was, the latest in a troubling string of unused resources.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Forgot the "not"
I’m not expecting much out of Giese as a spot starter, but I think he has a role on the team this year.
rajai/copeland together is a waste of roster space
also i was encouraged by outman’s stuff yesterday, i think the slider/changeup flashed plus potential. he needs to learn pitch efficiency and fastball command. adding a cutter or 2 seamer would help. interesting in minors he limited hrs and had a solid gb%, but its been the opposite in his mlb stints.
If anyone would benefit from Springer's "Cutters For Dummies" seminar, it's Outman
A little movement would go a long way. (Actually, a straight fastball goes a long way. That’s the problem.)
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
The A's could also just choose NOT to start Outman against the Blue Jays. Ever.
I’m sure that alone would improve his ERA by about 3 runs.
I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!
copeland DFA/petit AAA
kennedy/gray up
feel bad for petit who is an ideal backup infielder than crosby
rajai hangs on!!
Does Copeland get voted into the "Ryan Langerhans Hall of Fame"?
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I'm soria, what?
You’re joshing me.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Interesting...
I’m wondering: when Copeland clears waivers…will the Giants will take him back or will they maybe want to make a trade with the A’s so that they can keep him? He had a fairly bad/mysterious injury during Spring Training and while his brief minor league rehab stint was encouraging, he hasn’t played in a week or so.
On a larger point, I would like the A’s to make an effort to keep Copeland. He hasn’t really gotten a real chance to show what he can do, but all the reports seem to indicate that he’s a pretty good defensive center fielder with speed and he’s a better hitter than Rajai, so he has some upside.
I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!
Is Holliday using PED's?
This is a hot topic GM’s are going to have to start assessing and may be a factor in how the A’s apporach a trade package…
"Where's the beef?"
If I was going to try and trade for Holliday or sign him if he becomes a FA
I’d ask myself if the player was a product of the PED era and whether the chances of the player testing positive or not.
"Where's the beef?"
dont know about peds
but during interviews has anyone noticed how huge holliday’s head is
by Asfan4ever723 on May 9, 2009 11:54 AM PDT up reply actions
I just know this can be a touchy subject and given the A's history of players who used PED's
Beane may shy away from players that could be viewed as tainted…
"Where's the beef?"
Or big-headed?
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
According to the side bar, Jeff Gray and Adam Kennedy are joining
the club, and Petit, goes down, and Ben Copeland, we barely knew ya.
Rotoworld has no love for Kennedy
…which I don’t quite get. He had one lousy year for St. Louis in 2007 at the age of 31, but has been pretty consistent otherwise. He isn’t THAT old, and it’s possible nobody signed him because he fell into the same category as Abreu and Cabrera and a bunch of guys who wound up signing minor league contracts, asking for too much money then finding that nobody would sign him at all for those prices.
The A’s don’t like Petit. They should package him in a trade and let him try somewhere else.
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