Dellums Reaching Out To Congress
by Zonis on Mar 14, 2009 3:03 PM PDT
98 comments
Looks like Dellums is getting serious... wait what?
OAKLAND, Calif. (KCBS) -- A spokesman for Mayor Ron Dellums said Friday that the mayor hopes Major League Baseball will honor the A's commitment to Oakland and that the city will reach out to its congressional delegation in an effort to keep the franchise from moving.
This is a rather idiotic move by Dellums, as it will probably just cost the city a lot of money to get absolutely nothing done. What exactly can he get Congress to do to the A's or Major League Baseball?
Protip: Nothing. Anything they do will likely be shot down in court.
Vertig0/Marine Layer has his take on the subject, including a nice diatribe by an attorney in the comments section.
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What will Lew Wolff's next move be?
I bet he puts gum in Ron Dellums’ hair, or tells the rest of Oakland that he sleeps around.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
by jeepers on Mar 14, 2009 3:22 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
A's to San Jose
If the issue goes to the US congress (heaven forbid), who has the most clout? Oakland or San jose? This is not a rational discussion! It’s a matter of counting the votes. And guess what? Oakland loses!
The only way Oakland gets back into the game is by putting something on the table. And so far, all they’ve been able to do is show that they’ve not been open to the A’s. Had they not had their head’s up you know what, they would not have allowed the Raiders to dominate the issue and build the infamous Mt. Davis. They showed no respect for the A’s then, and they haven’t sense. It should be no surprise that the A’s have decided to pick up their chips and move elsewhere.
On the other hand, I wish the A’s would show some respect for the existing A’s fans (few that we are) and get rid of those awful tarps in the third deck. Every time I see them, I want to vomit on the sacred floor of the ball park. When, Mr. Wolf, do you recognize that you have a failed strategy, and open the ball park up to the fans, to it’s, though limited, capacity? Many of us do like to watch the team and will come to the ball park, watch the game, and even spend a little money on parking, concessions, etc. while we are here. Just don’t shut us out when the A’s play the Red Sox, Yankees, Giants, etc.
RAC
by rcodd on Mar 14, 2009 8:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe, but corporate welfare is out at the moment. A threat by a greedy team to move and break the
hearts of hundreds of fans might not go over well.
It's not the results, it's how you look going about those results -- Tim McCarver
by WaddellCanseco on Mar 15, 2009 11:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
"It's like déjà vu all over again." -yogi berra
by Cheezombie on Mar 14, 2009 3:27 PM PDT reply actions 7 recs
LMAO
sanity is insanities underpants...
by brian.only on Mar 14, 2009 4:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
That is one of the funniest.'shops.ever
"Warm Springs Infernal" - FSU, 2/6/09 DLD
by doctorK on Mar 14, 2009 4:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is sooooooo perfect.....nicely done Cheezombie
"RIP: UserID: 553"
by Masaryk on Mar 14, 2009 4:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
its taken from Vertig0's New A's Ballpark Blog
Chicago. Where the Dead can Vote. Where the Voters of Tomorrow are found in the Obituaries of Today.
by Zonis on Mar 14, 2009 5:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, i stole it
"It's like déjà vu all over again." -yogi berra
by Cheezombie on Mar 14, 2009 5:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
(takes bow)
No biggie, it didn’t take long to put together
by vertig0 on Mar 14, 2009 6:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
love your site by the way
you really put a lot of time and effort into it. I tend to stop by once every week or two in order to keep updated
"It's like déjà vu all over again." -yogi berra
by Cheezombie on Mar 14, 2009 7:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Peeing in my pants with laughter.
"You know, a long time ago being crazy meant something. Nowadays everybody's crazy."
-Charles Manson
by kaweahkaweah on Mar 15, 2009 12:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
If Wolff wanted to force MLB to support the move to SJ, wouldn’t the best way to do that be pissing off Oakland enough to insure that come 2013 when the final option available in Oakland is up that they make it so difficult to renegotiate a new lease so he can throw up his hands and suggest it’s SJ or playing in a college park?
In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!
by DMOAS on Mar 14, 2009 3:47 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
so basically, Dellums is doing Wolff's job for him?
Chicago. Where the Dead can Vote. Where the Voters of Tomorrow are found in the Obituaries of Today.
by Zonis on Mar 14, 2009 3:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Schott Stadium!
:)
My favorite player is whoever is hitting behind Bobby Crosby because no matter what they always look so good.
by supermarc589 on Mar 15, 2009 3:06 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly!
Public transportation! Very close to the Earthquakes’ new stadium! And the seating capacity of 1500 will increase ticket presales by creating demand!
(actually I just went to my first game there yesterday; it’s a 10-minute walk from my residence)
by oblique on Mar 15, 2009 8:03 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
5 minutes if it's cold.
...then Pennington takes over.
by Poppy on Mar 15, 2009 3:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dellums is a moron
Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog
by Flashfire on Mar 14, 2009 3:53 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
this is a joke, right?
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
by xbhaskarx on Mar 14, 2009 5:59 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
If by "this" you mean "Oakland's political leadership", then yes, it is a joke
"Warm Springs Infernal" - FSU, 2/6/09 DLD
by doctorK on Mar 14, 2009 7:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
nice one....
Nice quasi racist stuff guys- all this Oakland bashing and pimping images of our mayor – I have my own issues with Dellums (policing and sleeping his way through the first 12 months in office etc.)but if you have issues with this town and its people and our elected officials take your petty suburban small town attitude elsewhere. Last time I checked this is a forum to discuss our team not small minded biggoted attitudes from a bunch of pissed off ex-urb fans who need something to vent at – thank you again Mr.Wollf for your ill timed and immature response to the City’s letter of contrition… Your are building a hell of aseason and fan experience for 2009.
by piedmont avenue paul on Mar 14, 2009 9:25 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
can you specify which comments are quasi-racist?
“pimping images of our mayor”? you mean john cusack was a pimp in “say anything”? i had no idea.
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
by xbhaskarx on Mar 14, 2009 9:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
so..... let me get this right
By no one in this thread being racist, they are being racist?
Or is it just that you are being racist by calling everyone in this thread a racist for no reason?
Or are you just playing the Dellums Status-Quot and trying to unsuccessfully play the victim card?
Chicago. Where the Dead can Vote. Where the Voters of Tomorrow are found in the Obituaries of Today.
by Zonis on Mar 14, 2009 9:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
your first two comments here have been real winners
are you ever going to tell us about those “seriously bad trades” wolff has made?
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
by xbhaskarx on Mar 14, 2009 9:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wolff made trades?
The monster at the end of this blog.
by grover on Mar 15, 2009 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let's see the racism
Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog
by Flashfire on Mar 14, 2009 10:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nice
Claiming racism for a picture of John Cusak holding a boom box (which is playing “In Your Eyes” by Peter Gabriel, every pimps theme song of course) and then making a generalization about everyone in the suburbs being “petty.”
When you paint anyone with a broad brush, be it black people, gay people, people who live in the suburbs, midgets, Republicans, Democrats, beer league softball players, etc. you really look like a thoughtless jerk.
myspace music
by jeffro on Mar 15, 2009 7:21 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What about gay black midget suburbanites who are too busy playing softball to vote?
Those assholes. Voting’s important.
...then Pennington takes over.
by Poppy on Mar 15, 2009 3:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
by nevermoor on Mar 15, 2009 9:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
just take a look at the picture of Dellums above fella -
Rest my case…
by piedmont avenue paul on Mar 14, 2009 9:58 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Question
Do you have any idea what that picture is about?
Talk about knee-jerk reactions.
by vertig0 on Mar 14, 2009 10:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, obviously Boom Boxes are racist symbols
Because.. uh…. uh…. all the kids in Salute Your Shorts kept making bets that they had to pay with their boom boxes, and none of them were Black! Thats it… oh wait, except Kelly…. nevermind.
Chicago. Where the Dead can Vote. Where the Voters of Tomorrow are found in the Obituaries of Today.
by Zonis on Mar 14, 2009 10:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
haha boy do i miss my childhood sometimes...
"It's like déjà vu all over again." -yogi berra
by Cheezombie on Mar 14, 2009 10:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe Lloyd Dobbler was a racist...
AN: the new twitter of sportsblogs. -Dogfather
by Leopold Bloom on Mar 15, 2009 4:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, for fuck sake...
"You know, a long time ago being crazy meant something. Nowadays everybody's crazy."
-Charles Manson
by kaweahkaweah on Mar 15, 2009 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Look, I'm racist, too!
"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers."
by iglew on Mar 19, 2009 9:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
trades...
Yeah I can ge tout my copy of Money Ball and we can devolve this thread (already retarded to beging with) into an argument of Jamesian stats..
What is going on her ebuddy is real estate economics, politics in the Bay Area, the iron grip of the Last Biggest Trust in America – still protected by one of the worst decisions ever made by the US Supreme Court – and the greed of a few developers who somehow deluded themselves that they were going to make a bundle in the Great City of fremont…
by piedmont avenue paul on Mar 14, 2009 10:00 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
this is about a fanbase divided by a stupid knee jerk repsonse by Wollf to a simple letter
This about a fan base more divided at any time I have seen since mulder and Hudson were traded.. This is poison and the problem was Wollf’s repsonse not Dellums lame letter…
by piedmont avenue paul on Mar 14, 2009 10:02 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
'nuff said on this topic....
see you all at a few games and buy you a beer -
by piedmont avenue paul on Mar 14, 2009 10:02 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
cool
left field bleachies
"...in baseball you wear a cap." -- george carlin
by Hot Cup Joe on Mar 14, 2009 10:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
$8 dollar beers?
"It's like déjà vu all over again." -yogi berra
by Cheezombie on Mar 14, 2009 10:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
by xbhaskarx on Mar 14, 2009 10:14 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
lol awesome
the office?
"It's like déjà vu all over again." -yogi berra
by Cheezombie on Mar 14, 2009 10:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Chicago. Where the Dead can Vote. Where the Voters of Tomorrow are found in the Obituaries of Today.
by Zonis on Mar 14, 2009 10:59 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Chicago. Where the Dead can Vote. Where the Voters of Tomorrow are found in the Obituaries of Today.
by Zonis on Mar 14, 2009 11:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Do the Athletics really have a legal committment to the city...
…after 2010? Does MLB have a legal committment to keeping the Athletics from locating somewhere else?
by LowcountryJoe on Mar 15, 2009 4:36 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
And does the city of Oakland and its taxpayers have a legal committment to funding...
…(or even setting aside a portion of land for) a new stadium to an already wealthy owner of an MLB franchise?
by LowcountryJoe on Mar 15, 2009 8:22 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Alright, then, may the divorce commence.
Preferably on amicable terms.
by LowcountryJoe on Mar 15, 2009 10:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
this has turned into a soap opera
i’d love to see a chronological time line of events from when the territorial rights issue started till now. i dont have the resources or information for this. all i know is that the giants were on their way to TB, if not for the Haas family now ill fated decision to help out the giants getting a new ballpark in SJ which never passed.
interesting article this morning
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/03/15/BAFD16F2U6.DTL
by Asfan4ever723 on Mar 15, 2009 8:54 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
John: I’m leaving you, Marsha. I’ve asked you to be interested in me for years, and you’ve ignored me.
Marsha: What if I publish a love letter, will you come back then?
John: No. That’s really not a change.
Marsha: Well, what if I threaten to sue you, or maybe boil your mascot — will you love me then?
The meaning of life is not so much 'found,' as it is 'made.' --Opus
by The Dogfather on Mar 15, 2009 9:39 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Dellums threatened Stomper?!
Oh. I see.
Nevermind.
AN: the new twitter of sportsblogs. -Dogfather
by Leopold Bloom on Mar 15, 2009 4:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
A's gave up SC County rights; Giants ask $50 million to return rights?
Is this correct that the Haas family gave up Santa Clara county rights to help the Giants stay in the Bay Area? I kinda remember MacGowan 5-10 years ago asking the A’s for $50 million to allow the A’s to move Santa Clara county. Wow, this really makes me mad at the Giants.
Here are two blog posts that I found about the Haas goodwill. I’d prefer to rely on a more trustworthy source since a blog post could say “Joe Beimel is a legend” or some such nonsense:
The Blog says essentially how I feel as a South Bay A’s Fan. The Territorial Rights were a Goodwill Gift from Walter Haas, and as such should not be used in reversed to bend over the A’s. The Giants will probably get Compensation in return. The A’s gave them up for nothing. Maybe they knew having 2 teams in the Bay area was a good thing. Instead of the Tampa Bay Area. Carney was and probably is still a supporter of SB baseball, I just don’t think he’d comment know that he’s paid by the Giants. He should probably be one of the first numbers retired in the knew stadium.
John in Fremont said… A bit of history: When the lines were originally drawn the A’s were given Santa Clara county (San Jose). When the Giants were planning on moving to San Jose in the early 90s then A’s owner Walter Haas gave the Giants Santa Clara county rights. The Giants obviously didn’t move, but the A’s never got the rights back.
by BillyWannabeane on Mar 15, 2009 10:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
To be fair ...
Neither current ownership group was involved in that transaction and both paid a price they deemed fair, given the current territorial rights as they exist. Although they did not pay the A’s, the current Giants ownership group did pay for that territory in that it factored into the value and price of the team when they bought it.
"It's for your own good. Big strong Devo knows whats best for Poppy" -- Mossback
by devo on Mar 15, 2009 11:29 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It wasn't to help the Giants to stay in the Bay Area
It was to help get the Giants out of San Francisco. From Haas’s perspective, it was better to have the Giants 40 miles away instead of 15. The A’s also stood to gain more favorable media coverage if the Bay Area’s media center didn’t have a team. They could also gain some customers from SF and points north who wanted to see major league baseball but weren’t willing to drive to San Jose to see it. The A’s didn’t draw many fans from Santa Clara and San Mateo Counties so they weren’t really losing much by having the Giants move there.
It was a very sensible plan at the time. Now lit looks like a huge blunder because the Giants didn’t move to San Jose and they maintained the rights to San Jose. If Haas and Co. were thinking ahead, they would have put some conditions on that transfer of territorial rights.
Root for the Giants? Not even if they're playing al-Qaeda!
by Monday Fan on Mar 18, 2009 10:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
For better or worse on dollars and cents
the Haas family was the best ownership the A’s ever had, because they put the fans and the team first, and the money second.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
by jeepers on Mar 21, 2009 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
No doubt about it.
They were also the only owners that didn’t complain about the ballpark constantly and threaten to move. They built a tight bond with the East Bay and it paid off with their best attendance.
Root for the Giants? Not even if they're playing al-Qaeda!
by Monday Fan on Mar 22, 2009 12:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Haases were, and are, incredible
I have so much respect for them, I can’t even express it. Wally Haas Jr., by the way, used to take my phone calls personally when I was 15 years old, just because he knew how passionate I was about baseball and the A’s. Unbelievable.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
by Nico on Mar 22, 2009 11:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I've found an academic article on line
that discusses the history of major league territorial rights, including that of the Giants and A’s.
You can find it here.
by OaklandSi on Mar 15, 2009 11:05 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
The A's give SC County to Giants to build San Jose park, then refuse to return SC County to A's
From the superb article, “Major League Baseball Anti-Trust Immunity: Examining the Legal and Financial Implications of Relocation Rules”, posted by OaklandSI:
Steve Schott, former owner of the Oakland Athletics (A’s), had monitored the move of the Nationals into the Orioles’ territory as he had desired to potentially move to Santa Clara County, specifically San Jose, California (Newhouse, 2004b). Santa Clara County was once the territory of the A’s, but in 1992, the A’s permitted the rights to the county to be transferred to the San Francisco Giants with the expectation that the Giants would move (‘ San Jose would like…,’ 2004). Although the Giants were twice unsuccessful in their attempt to garner a tax-payer funded facility in the South Bay, they have remained steadfast in their belief that Santa Clara County is their territory and therefore forever off-limits to the Oakland franchise (Weiner, 2006).
I believe that when Charlie Finley moved the A’s out here, and the Giants were already here, there was no question and no discussions about territorial rights. The only way the Giants ended up with territorial rights was because they were going to build a stadium in San Jose
So, I guess if the Giants have a beef, it is that they never got reimbursed for the A’s moving to the Bay Area. But that was in the ’60s.
The current territorial rules contain some unique provisions for teams in shared areas. For the American and National League franchises in New York, Chicago, and Los Angeles, the defined counties are the same, but in the case of the A’s and Giants, the San Francisco Bay Area has been divided disproportionately (Pappas, 2002a). The Giants territory includes San Francisco, San Mateo, Santa Clara, Santa Cruz, Monterey, and Marin Counties, while the A’s territory only includes Alameda and Contra Costa counties (Pappas, 2002a; Witt, 2005) (Figure 1).
Well, that seems unfair, but the territory is more about where you can build the stadium. Fans from Marin can nearly as easily drive to Oakland as San Francisco.
FWIW, Oakland is more central to the population distribution of the Bay Area (and future expansion inland). So the Giants should be more than willing to give up San Jose, like the A’s did:
On June 14, 1990, the expansion was approved unanimously as the A’s voted to approve the Giants’ move because it would have allowed the A’s to potentially attract the majority of baseball customers from Northern Bay Area counties such as Marin, Sonoma, and Napa (Figure 1). An anonymous A’s executive noted, ‘we were reasonably happy and would have been reasonably happier if the Giants had moved to San Jose. Why would we get in the way?’ (Witt, 2005, para 19).
…but when greedy people smell money, they try to get all they can get.
by BillyWannabeane on Mar 15, 2009 11:39 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
at the time that the A's moved to Oakland
the AL and NL defined their clubs’ territories differently. The kind of “all 30 clubs’ owners” concept of MLB doesn’t seem to have been operative. So it’s not really accurate to apply today’s rules to 1968. The A’s certainly did not violate any rules by moving to Oakland in 1968.
I still believe that the Bay Area should not be divided into territories, but treated just like they are in the NY, Chicago, and Los Angeles areas. It makes most sense to locate a ballpark where it will most be accessible to the entire fan base. As BillyWannabeane says, that place is still Oakland.
Of course, the A’s (and Giants) will do what the owners think is in their best interest — but also subject to the economy. In the meantime it makes no sense to do anything to alienate the fans who attend, have attended, or may attend games in the coliseum.
by OaklandSi on Mar 15, 2009 12:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
HIndsight being what it is...
…the “Goodwill Gift” should have been conditional and included an expiration date.
I could prove God statistically. Take the human body alone - the chances that all the functions of an individual would just happen is a statistical monstrosity.
~George Gallup
by UncleLeo on Mar 16, 2009 1:13 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Much more money in Santa Clara than Oakland...
…so that should be weighed as well. And it might be more important than population distribution.
According to the US Dept of Commerce, Bureau of Economic Analysis
Released April 26, 2007
Average Annual Salary
06085 Santa Clara $71,774
06075 San Francisco 66,398
06081 San Mateo 65,525
06001 Alameda 52,783
06041 Marin 51,595
06013 Contra Costa 51,416
The Sharks success (of fan turnout) always surprised me…and a decent part of that success has to be the amount of disposable income in Santa Clara and San Mateo counties. Of course, the Sharks are essentially the only game in town in San Jose…which would change if the A’s move to San Jose.
The A’s and Sharks in San Jose. The Warriors and Raiders in Oakland. The Giants and 49ers and Giants in San Francisco. That seems like a pretty good distribution of sports teams to me.
by BillyWannabeane on Mar 15, 2009 12:19 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
All California Counties ranked by Average Annual Salary
by BillyWannabeane on Mar 15, 2009 12:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
mean or median?
"It's like déjà vu all over again." -yogi berra
by Cheezombie on Mar 15, 2009 5:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
probably mean
Chicago. Where the Dead can Vote. Where the Voters of Tomorrow are found in the Obituaries of Today.
by Zonis on Mar 15, 2009 5:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah cause i'm' pretty sure Marin is #1 in median
"It's like déjà vu all over again." -yogi berra
by Cheezombie on Mar 15, 2009 7:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, usually when you just say "Average", with out any indicators
it means.
Chicago. Where the Dead can Vote. Where the Voters of Tomorrow are found in the Obituaries of Today.
by Zonis on Mar 15, 2009 7:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's definitely mean
BEA doesn’t have the data to calculate medians. It’s not like they have a list of everyone’s salaries. They measure totals for the county and do some sort of per capita calculation on it.
The BEA data is available here. I can’t match the list the guy posted, since he didn’t document it properly. That’s a pet peeve of mine. He generated a list somehow, but instead of telling you what it actually is, he makes up a description line of his own (“average annual salary”) and attributes it to BEA.
(This boils down to a question of what you think the purpose of a cite is. If you think it’s to help the reader check it out for himself, you make a useful cite. If you think the purpose of the cite is to make the reader take your word for it and not check it out, then you make your cite opaque. But I digress….)
If you Google those numbers you find three or four copies of the same list but all with the same incomplete referencing. I think he’s listing average wage per job (defined here), which is column 30 in chart CA34. His number are very close to the 2005 numbers for that column, but they’re not quite a match, so either he’s done some sort of tweak I can’t identify or BEA has revised since he generated his list.
Santa Clara tops the list because it’s measuring salary and wages. I don’t think that rank would change if it were median. But if you take personal income instead (ie, including investment income, etc), then Marin comes out way ahead, and SF and SM also beat SC.
"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers."
by iglew on Mar 19, 2009 10:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Median Household Income
Santa Clara County has the highest Median Household Income of any county in the state at $74,335 (though the article in that link lists is higher than that using 2007 numbers, the census number is easy to find here).
Alameda County is $55,946
Marin is $71,306
San Mateo is $70,819
SF is $65,519
myspace music
by jeffro on Mar 20, 2009 6:20 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Cool, thanks.
Quick peek at the census page and I see that includes investment income, which the other link apparently didn’t.
"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers."
by iglew on Mar 20, 2009 2:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also, household income vs individual income
If a county has significantly higher couples-to-singles ratio than another that could make a difference in rankings.
"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers."
by iglew on Mar 20, 2009 2:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed about population, incomes, and geographic location (w/ public, private transportation access)
FWIW, there is quite a bit higher population immediately surrounding downtown San Jose since Oakland is bounded on the west by the bay. Freeway access is better to downtown San Jose with 87, 101, 280, and 880 all nearby. That’s a better grid that provides many ways to and from the ballpark.
And with both Caltrain and (soon) BART going to San Jose, that’s at worst a tie for San Jose. And there are many bus lines already leading to downtown San Jose.
San Jose area residents have considerably higher income. All this adds up to me thinking that San Jose is a much better choice if I could freely move a team to Oakland or San Jose.
by BillyWannabeane on Mar 15, 2009 1:09 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I think it also depends on how the A's geographic fan base is defined
San José is not the best location for most of the Bay Area.
by OaklandSi on Mar 15, 2009 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
problem is that the A's geographic fanbse is overlayed with the Giants right now
which gives them a big disadvantage.
Chicago. Where the Dead can Vote. Where the Voters of Tomorrow are found in the Obituaries of Today.
by Zonis on Mar 15, 2009 1:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
it's overlaid in NY and Chicago
and Moreno has attempted to overlay the Angels with the Dodgers
Giants and A’s fans have been overlaid throughout Northern California anyway
by OaklandSi on Mar 15, 2009 1:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
sort of and not quite
I am talking about the local base around the stadium.
In Chicago, if you are in the North, you are a Cubs fan. If you are in the South, you are a Sox fan.
In the Bay Area, though, If you are in SF, you are a Giants fan, if you are in the East Bay, you are split between the A’s and Giants.
I think that if the A’s went to San Jose, it would be South for A’s fans, West for Giants Fans, and East for Giants/A’s.
Chicago. Where the Dead can Vote. Where the Voters of Tomorrow are found in the Obituaries of Today.
by Zonis on Mar 15, 2009 2:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I've spent a fair amount of time over the years in Chicago
and have actually been surprised at how much Cubs and White Sox fans are distributed. you’d think it was pretty much north=cubs south=white sox, but I have found that it’s not that clear cut. For example, in the near north you can find both Cubs and White Sox fans, they’re close to evenly divided in some neighborhood.
I became an A’s fan while I was still living in SF during the 1980;s , and I was far from the only one. I’ve also met quite a few A’s fans who are SF residents in recent years. I think ease of access to the ballpark can be a significant factor for many fans — and particularly for atracting new fans.
by OaklandSi on Mar 16, 2009 11:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What about North?
Or Sacramento? I live in Sacramento and couldn’t even fathom going to San Jose for anything, even an A’s game. Sacramento leans heavily for the A’s, and taking them to the south Bay knocks out a metropolitan area of 2.3 million from even attending an A’s game. I don’t know what I would do, but I certainly couldn’t still be an A’s fan if they play in San Jose.
by may7 on Mar 19, 2009 3:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
You couldn't be an A's fan if they moved 35 or so miles south?
Being able to get to a game or not shouldn’t have any effect on being able to root for the team.
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by Flashfire on Mar 19, 2009 6:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
piedmont avenue paul (PAP)
This PAP smear campaign has certainly livened up an otherwise moderately interesting debate.
Also, should I be worried that the Giants tried to move to San Jose twice and failed both times?
I just remembered I love Eric Chavez.
by Joey C. on Mar 15, 2009 1:41 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I think the Giants move to San Jose failed mainly...
…due to the Giants (at the time) putting most of the cost of the ballpark on the Santa Clara county residents. I believe most of the A’s ballpark would be paid for by the owners. I do think that the residents of San Jose or the county of Santa Clara have to vote for a stadium of this size. But if the cost is much lower, I suspect the ballpark would be approved.
by BillyWannabeane on Mar 15, 2009 1:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The A's wouldn't be using public funds, I don't think
and if there are no public funds being used, there is no vote.
Chicago. Where the Dead can Vote. Where the Voters of Tomorrow are found in the Obituaries of Today.
by Zonis on Mar 15, 2009 1:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Speaking of the cost of a stadium
Considering that the new Bay Bridge is being built in sections offsite and move to the site, then assembled onsite, should not stadium construction get into the modular mode?? Does it always have to be “yankee Stadium-Jr” for costs? I feel, analogously speaking, like we’re in the tube amplifier stage, transistors have been around for some time, but any thoughts of using ICs to build an amplifier is invariably dismissed as “tube amplifiers have better sound…etc…”
Cost per sq ft of houses is always cheaper when factory-built, many construction mega-projects are modularly-built, but sports stadiums??? Nah..“just like Grandpa”. I don’t think there’s been much creative thinking on “big stadium” construction techniques, just more emphasis on “bathrooms per seat” and “non-fan quality experience” (e.g. brick looks good, swimming pool in center field, slide in left center), construction costs be dammned.
IMO they ought to do a partial teardown of the Oakland Coliseum, and rebuild it modularly. And, they ought to take note of what they do in Phoenix, and have sectional fields they can “roll-in-roll-out” so you can have a high quality venue for football on Sunday and a perfect baseball field available Monday night. All IMO better than groundbreaking a new stadium.
'I never predict anything, and I never will.' Paul Gascoigne, footballer
by One won lost won on Mar 15, 2009 3:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sounds expensive
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by DMOAS on Mar 15, 2009 5:00 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Haha!
Gotta rec’ that response!
Very succinct!
'I never predict anything, and I never will.' Paul Gascoigne, footballer
by One won lost won on Mar 15, 2009 5:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
From Investment To Shake-Downs
Under Jerry Brown, Oakland sought private investment. Yes, he didn’t want the A’s at the uptown site that many of us hoped for… but he did want private investment there. Under Ron Dellums, Oakland city government has returned to its kleptocratic roots: shaking down other jurisdictions for money in the hope that as much as possible will stick to the palms of the city insiders involved in the process.
by muscatel on Mar 16, 2009 8:42 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Please Not San Jose!!!!!!
Am I the only person here that would have a BIG PROBLEM with the idea of the San Jose A’s? It’s such a horiible, dismal city. Please either stay in Oakland, move to Sacramento, or choose another location in the East Bay or Northern California that isn’t San Jose. I just can’t root for a team from that city!!
by may7 on Mar 19, 2009 3:12 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
sounds like a personal problem
myspace music
by jeffro on Mar 19, 2009 3:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
your posts are extremely redundant.
"It's like déjà vu all over again." -yogi berra
by Cheezombie on Mar 19, 2009 4:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry, but
if you’re going to call San Jose “horrible” and “dismal” you don’t get to cite Oakland and Sacramento as comparisons.
Do you know the way to San Jose?
by eastcoasta'sfan on Mar 19, 2009 7:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Foster City! El Sobrante!
The swamp behind Codorneces Park!
I got nothing.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
by Nico on Mar 20, 2009 7:56 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
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