Outfield Blooming??
by windyfelix on Mar 10, 2009 12:00 PM PDT
Email
PrintIt's spring!! well, technically not quite, but for the A's young OFers, it sure is. Davis is hitting; Sweeney is hitting; Cunningham is hitting; Denorfia went 4-4 at the WBC yesterday.
What to do? what to do?
Crosby/Nomar or, if Chavy is shut down, Crosby/Pennington/Nomar or Crosby/Hannahan/Nomar will fill out our infield. Barton could still perform well enough this spring to make the squad or they might keep an extra middle infielder given the Ellis injury situation and, if either are true, we're only talking 4 OFs with Cust and Holliday being two unless the A's opt to go with only 11 pitchers.
Buck seems firmly in place.
Cunningham seems like he's bound for AAA.
Sweeney appears to be the starting CFer.
Davis or Donorfia? Or neither?? Or keep them both and either dispatch Barton or go with 11 pitchers? The 11 pitcher option seems sketchy given the youth of our rotation and the paucity of April off days.
And given that Holliday may or may not be here all year, which other OFer would then replace him? Cust, should Giambi be hitting and Barton too? Or Donorfia? Or even Cunningham? Do you want that player riding the pine in Oakland or playing every day at Raley Field??
The thing about Davis is defense. The thing about Denorfia is that he might wind up being a much better all-around player than Davis or even challenge Sweeney for the CF job. neither of them-- nor Cunningham-- nor perhaps Buck-- really has corner OF power.
But Barton or Denorfia-- if packaged with a pitcher-- might yield a pair of pretty good prospects. Is Barton really a secure long-term option for this team anymore given the looming presence of Carter and Doolittle? Do the A's need him to show his ability at the major league level to give him proper trade value? And who else will play 1B this year should Giambi get hurt? Nomar is a spot player not a starter.
And the other way to do this is simply play them all-- either here or in Sactown-- and await the inevitable injuries. But the truth is that the A's have excess starting pitching and excess OFers who can play at the major league level. That is a good problem to have and it gives our GM a lot of fleixibility.
45 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
I don't understand why people assume Denorfia has all this room for growth
He’s a few months older than Davis, and significantly older than Sweeney.
by thejd44 on Mar 10, 2009 12:04 PM PDT reply actions
He drinks a lot of milk.
"I’m Joey Devine, I’m what Joba Chamberlain would be if he was good and nobody had ever heard of him."
His last 3 years in minors
AA and AAA ball, his line was 324-386-493
Maybe he’ll never take the next step. Yes, he’s 27, but that’s the traditional breakout year. Sweeney and Cunningham are better long-term prospects but if you ask me for just this year who might be the best player, I’m not so sure it wouldn’t be Denorfia. Whether or not it was a mistake to go WBC the guy is playing and hitting well there.
He had one good game and one bad game (0-3, 2 BB).
It’s not like he’s over there going 7-9 with a couple bombs.
"I’m Joey Devine, I’m what Joba Chamberlain would be if he was good and nobody had ever heard of him."
It's not exactly hitting well...
Emphasis on the word hitting.
"I’m Joey Devine, I’m what Joba Chamberlain would be if he was good and nobody had ever heard of him."
Many years from now, when his name's recalled
Everyone will say, "He should have passed the ball"
-- Al Stewart, "Football Hero"
I tried to arrange Law vs. You-- Round Two
but was unsuccessful. Can’t wait, though
If you're going to criticize,
at least back it up with some basis for your opinion. This post is completely void of any substance.
—Keith Law
"Good or bad, I don't know. This is awesome." ~Nick Swisher after being asked if it was wise to poor beer on Lew Wolfe's head.
There was an image there
but it seems to have been erased. Too large?
Many years from now, when his name's recalled
Everyone will say, "He should have passed the ball"
-- Al Stewart, "Football Hero"
but he is not making outs well...
If you had a lineup of 9 Jack Custs who hit(Cust career average) .239 AVG, .382 OBP, and .475 SLG, then your team would score 6.12 runs per game-totalling to 991runs a season.The 08 rangers lead the majors in runs score with 901.
according to this table he's doing just fine
that’s only the first two games, 22 pitches seen. In total, he saw 33 pitches over 12 PAs, and he didn’t swing and miss once, and he only swung at one pitch out of the zone.
Small sample, of course, but still pretty cool…
I'm starting to like our bullpen......Wuertz and all.
by scatterbrian on Mar 11, 2009 11:46 AM PDT up reply actions
Good news there
According to Pizza Cutter (a serious analyst, despite the weird pseudonym), no stats converge faster than O-Swing, Z-Swing and contact rate. It only takes around 40 or 50 plate appearances before they reach statistical significance.
This is why I can state with reasonable confidence that Aaron Cunningham needs another half-year in AAA. As for Denorfia, he’s a very conservative swinger (not quite in Reggie Willits territory, but definitely cautious) and we can expect that trend to hold up this season.
I’m still scratching my head at how Rajai Davis’s O-Swing rate practically doubled last season. The guy’s not exactly Mantle out there— what does he think he’s accomplishing?
Many years from now, when his name's recalled
Everyone will say, "He should have passed the ball"
-- Al Stewart, "Football Hero"
0-3 2BB's
=Billy Beane wet dream!
I dream(t) of Fremont and rainbows
by OptimistPrime on Mar 10, 2009 12:58 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm betting this guy wouldn't even be talking about Denorfia
if he went 0-4 yesterday.
"We were s--, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Mar 10, 2009 12:27 PM PDT up reply actions
It's not a question of "growth"
From a talent standpoint, the guy’s been ready for a big league job since early 2006. But first he was blocked, then injured, now blocked again.
Many years from now, when his name's recalled
Everyone will say, "He should have passed the ball"
-- Al Stewart, "Football Hero"
Kinda funny
How the commentators for ESPN were talking during the US/Canada game that whoever lost wouldn’t be so bad off since they’d be facing Italy. Then the US wins and destroys Venezuela while Canada gets shut down by Italy and eliminated.
"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin
but he didn't
And he’s still a pretty good ballplayer with a pretty impressive minor league record. Whether or not he’s in camp.
Track and Field has a minor league system?
Never knew…
"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin
Can you still hit
the UFO (this says it was a bird) if you throw the javelin far enough?
myspace music
I've warmed to the idea of platooning Sweeney and Denorfia
That gives the lion’s share of the ABs to Sweeney to aid in his progression (assuming he doesn’t shift to RF to spell Buck on days against lefties, in which case he would get… well, whatever is more than a lion’s share), and it lets Deno get in there to shore up the D somewhat in CF.
Raj never bowled me over to begin with, but after seeing some pretty underwhelming projections for his CF defense (particularly from BP), I’m not really interested in seeing him kept around.
And oh, yeah, I want Swisher back.
I just remembered I love Eric Chavez.
He looked bad to me in CF and LF last year
bad routes, and slower than one might expect. His total zone in the minors is not very good, for whatever that’s worth, same with his UZR numbers. Probably can’t tell much of anything from the defensive stats at this point, but he looked bad (not really bad, just below average/kinda bad) to me, so kinda bad is my best guess. I also recall scouting reports from around the time they traded for him saying he was stretched in CF, but I could be imagining that.
With stout hearts, and with enthusiasm for the contest, let us go forward to victory. ----Hero Defector Montgomery
I think everyone but Rajai is stretched in CF
This concerns me.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I'm reading it differently.
By UZR, he’s been +5.5 runs in the OF per 150 games, with a bit less than half of his playing time coming in CF. By Dewan’s +/-, he’s been +13 plays per 150 games over his career.
The 2006 BA Handbook says he was a good runner who had the range for center. They say he was an average defensive CF with enough arm to play right.
He may have lost a step due to his back problem, but my guess is a healthy Denorfia is still pretty close to average in CF.
Yeah, that's a better reading, I was just looking at the rows for the different positions
It’s pretty plausible that the big difference UZR shows between 2006 and 2008 was real to some extent, which would also explain why I thought he looked bad. I guess the optimistic view is the back problem that he was playing with part of the time in Oakland hurt him, and he’ll be better without that issue. He certainly would be better than Rajai if he can be an average CF, although I still don’t know that I’d want to let Rajai go.
With stout hearts, and with enthusiasm for the contest, let us go forward to victory. ----Hero Defector Montgomery
Huh?
Per Fangraphs, he’s -12.1 runs per 150 in CF for his career …
link
"It's for your own good. Big strong Devo knows whats best for Poppy" -- Mossback
That's true, but...
If you look at the last line in the fielding section, you’ll see that he’s been +5.5/150 overall in the OF for his career. Playing in LF and RF is similar enough (though easier) to CF that adding it to the sample gives us more information. It’s unlikely that he’s -12 in CF and +45 in RF…
Of course, his whole defensive career in the majors amounts to half of a season worth of playing time spread out over 4 years, so it’s pretty near worthless.
Ah, duh ...
Well, per Tango, CF is 12 runs harder than the corners, flipping him from an above average Corner Outfielder to a poor (worse than below average, better than bad) center fielder … though that’s not quite right, either, since it’s not giving him credit for the 40% of his PT, which was in CF … it should really be more like 7.5 runs, so now we’d have him at -2 runs/150 …
Of course, SSS warnings definitely apply …
"It's for your own good. Big strong Devo knows whats best for Poppy" -- Mossback
I like the CHONE numbers as an estimate
+3/-5 for corner/center.
Many years from now, when his name's recalled
Everyone will say, "He should have passed the ball"
-- Al Stewart, "Football Hero"
i think we need 12 pitchers
But I think everyone needs to remember that spring stats don’t matter. The giants have a billion home runs already this spring. I’ll bet they have more homers this spring than the entire regular season.
If you had a lineup of 9 Jack Custs who hit(Cust career average) .239 AVG, .382 OBP, and .475 SLG, then your team would score 6.12 runs per game-totalling to 991runs a season.The 08 rangers lead the majors in runs score with 901.
I don't really think we do
we always carry 12 pitchers, and that 12th man is NEVER used.
Chicago. Where the Dead can Vote. Where the Voters of Tomorrow are found in the Obituaries of Today.
I think Denorfia gets underrated as a prospect
He has hit in the minors, has good speed and fundamentals, and lost most of two years to TJ surgery. He’s old for a prospect due to circumstances, not due to stalled development. He seems like a solid “platoon starter” who is not quite good enough to be an “everyday starter.” He could help someone – someone like the A’s, or someone else.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Denorfia has NO chance of making this team...
Barton has NO chance of making this team.
Cunningham has no chance of making this team. Period.
Let’s put it to rest, folks. Speculate on something semi-realistic… like two out of the three MAC making the team.
Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...
I've been doing that, too
I agree on Cunningham, obviously
As to Denorfia and Barton— if neither have any chance of making the team— then you are saying that a) the A’s are definitely going with 12 pitchers and that b) aside from the starters, the 4 backups are Nomar, Crosby, Bowen and Davis. Or if Crosby gets dealt, Pennington or Petit. Or if Chavy is on DL Opening Day Crosby and Pennington/Petit.
You might be right. But I would think that Barton or Denorfia— not both obviously— still have a shot to demonstrate their value and make this team. Giambi is hardly a guy to play all the time at 1B— and Nomar has had injury problems, not to mention the possibility of him playing some 3B. And I don’t know if Davis’ skill set outweighs Denorfia, unless you believe Sweeney is primed to play 150+ games in OF as will Holliday as will Buck and he can be a defensive replacement/occasional fill-in.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
