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Around SBN: Tobias Harris signs with Tennessee

2010 Offseason Primer

 

If you’re a lot like me you should probably seek a mental health professional.

 

Wait… wrong website.

 

If you’re a lot like me the 2009 baseball season is dead to you, the post-season and the World Series a mere footnote in your existence. The A’s are sitting at home after their third straight losing season and you want to know what Billy Beane and Co. are going to do to make the 2010 season a more enjoyable experience for you. Winning more than half their games would be a good start and I’d like to tell you how the A’s can make that happen.

 

 

Only one must learn to walk before they can run.

Star-divide

 

What I strive to do today is to lay the ground work for where the A’s currently sit as an organization; from there perhaps some brainstorming will be possible. Firstly, get thee familiar with Cot’s Baseball Contracts as they have to date info on the 2009-2010 free agent class including Type A compensation ratings.

 

Next, I’m going to share with a little project I’ve been working on. I started by ripping off the spreadsheet Jeff uses at Cot’s to display future payroll obligations and modified it to include 2009 service time and to list the remaining minor league options for Oakland’s current 40 man roster. The service time numbers should be accurate to within a day or two of the official MLB count which comes out in the Spring and it is unlikely that any discrepancy would result in a change in a player’s arbitration eligibility or future free agent status.

 

 

Open if ye seek knowledge.

 

 

Guessing arbitration numbers has never been one of my strong suits but I’ll take a stab at it to help bring the 2010 salary figures up to speed.

 

Mike Wuertz: $2.3 million

Jack Cust: $4.2 million

Scott Hairston: $2.0 million

Rajai Davis: $950 K

Joey Devine: $500 K

 

Santiago Casilla is also due arbitration this offseason but I’ll discuss his situation a little later. Kurt Suzuki comes the closest to Super-Two status but he falls about 3 weeks short the likely cut-off. All told my (very) tentative arbitration figures total $9.95 million. Add to that the approximately $7.15 million everyone with less than 2.130 days of big league service time will make in 2010 and the final tally is $36.35 million… but to play it safe I’ll call it $37 million even. The A’s had a $62.3 million payroll to start the 2009 season, I’m going to be ultra-conservative about the A’s attendance projections for 2010 and cut the 2009 figure by 20%. That would give the A’s an Opening Day payroll of $49,848,000 or $50 million to keep with my tendency for rounded numbers. So in theory, the A’s have $13 million in cash to play with this offseason.

 

We need to take a closer look at the A’s roster before discussing how the A’s should spend that money. Oakland (and every other team in baseball) has to submit their Reserve list (aka 40 man roster) by November 20. Any player currently on the 60-day DL gets added back into the mix. There are currently 41 names on Oakland’s 40 man roster, although 5 of those are free agents-to-be Justin Duchscherer, Brett Tomko, Bobby Crosby, Nomar Garciaparra and Adam Kennedy. All 5 are expected to file for free agency even though there seems to be some interest by both sides to see Duke and Kennedy in Oakland next year. That drops the protected list to 36 and the A’s have 6 players that need to be added to the 40 man roster to protect them from the Rule 5 draft in December.

 

Chris Carter and Fautino de los Santos are near mortal locks to be added to the 40 man. Pedro Figueroa, Anthony Recker, Jared Lansford and Cory Wimberly are all at risk of being pursued in December if they are left exposed. Figueroa is a lefty with a pulse and a 90+ MPH fastball; the A’s have already indicated that they plan on protecting him this go-around. Recker impressed the organization with his development in 2009 and a catcher with his power potential would be easy to stash on a big league roster for a season as the back up backstop. Lansford has a power arm but some lingering make-up/health issues. Still, I think there’s a good chance the A’s find room to protect him because he’s Carney Lansford’s son and Dave Stewart’s client… both of whom are former teammates of Billy Beane. But it’s not just sentiment that would drive this decision. When Jared was drafted most teams preferred him as a pitcher but the Lansfords made it clear that Jared expected to sign as a position player. This caused Lansford to drop in the draft until the A’s were able to snag him near the end of the 2nd round when, lo and behold, Jared was more than willing to forsake his bat and signed with Oakland as a pitcher. I’m guessing some quid pro quo is in order this November. Wimberly is a guy the A’s like but I’m just not sure how he fits in an organization that already has Jemile Weeks in AA and Adrian Cardenas in AAA.

 

So how do we fit a minimum of 5 players into a 40 man roster with only 4 available spots AND allow for the A’s to pursue free agents and/or someone in the Rule 5 draft?

 

When I look at the current 40 man roster I see 4 players that I consider nothing more than dead weight. Santiago Casilla has pitched poorly the last two seasons when he’s been available to pitch, he’s out of options and he’s due a decent pay bump via arbitration. The A’s bullpen already has Bailey, Wuertz and Ziggy entrenched, plus Devine coming back and Jeff Gray, Jon Meloan and Henry Rodriguez waiting in the wings. The A’s have RH bullpen arms aplenty; there is no reason to pay more than league minimum to an ineffective pitcher like Casilla. On a similar note: Jay Marshall… why bother? He barely pitched in 2009 and when he did he didn’t do well. He’s buried behind Breslow, Blevins and now Kilby. The A’s can probably outright Marshall to AAA and re-sign him to a minor league contract with an invite to Spring Training. Or he could sign elsewhere and no one would notice.

 

Tommy Everidge has a nice story in 2009, but what he offers as a player is somewhat limited. He’s a 1B with a bit of RH pop and he has the ability to play some 3B without causing a biblical plague to fall upon us. Chris Carter has the same limitations and a whole lot more upside, so why waste your time on the Albertson’s charcoal filtered vodka when Grey Goose is in stock at a lower price? Chris Denorfia is 29 years old, he’s out of options, he didn’t hit that great in AAA last season and his surgically repaired elbow is hurting him enough to make him pull out of Winter Ball. I’d rather have Recker or Lansford protected then keep Denorfia on the 40 man. Releasing all 4 players would create enough space on the 40 man roster to protect Carter, DLS, Figueroa, Recker and Lansford while still leaving 3 spots open for Rule 5 or Free Agent acquisitions and the organization wouldn’t have lost anyone they haven’t already replaced with better options.

 

There are other roster positions to consider as well, as 2010 strikes me as the year that the A’s need to figure out what they have in terms of position talent. Scott Hairston has been called out by the A’s management and while he’s currently the front runner to start in LF next year the organization needs to find out what Aaron Cunningham and Travis Buck can do. They each have 1 option year remaining but they have little left to prove in AAA. Does either one have a future in Oakland? Big league playing time is the only way to answer that question and if Hairston does not show the A’s that he is clearly the superior corner outfielder during Spring Training than Oakland might want to send him packing and let Buck and Cunningham fight it out in LF. Once the A’s know what they have in Cunningham, Buck, Hairston, Rajai Davis and Ryan Sweeney they’ll be in a better position to make informed decisions on the futures of Chris Carter, Sean Doolittle and Jemile Weeks. Will those prospects be needed in the outfield or will they need to find homes in the infield?

 

 

 

I like the 1 year contract the Boston Red Sox gave Brad Penny last year. Sure, he didn’t work out in Beantown but the idea of a 40% cut in his 2008 base salary and incentives to cover if Penny started or relieved has merit. It looks like the A’s are going to shop for a SP during the offseason and I’d be curious to see what kind of traction they could get with a similar offer. The two arms that most intrigue me are Duke and Brett Myers.

 

Justin Duchscherer: $3.9 million salary in 2009

 

$2.5 million base

$500 K for 150, 160, 170, 180 IP

$500 K for 50, 60, 70 G or 30 GF

$1.5 million for 200 IP or 40 GF

 

Brett Myers: $12 million salary in 2009

 

$6 million base

$500 K for160, 170, 180, 190 IP

$500 K for 55, 65, 75 G or 35 GF

$1 million for 200 IP or 50 GF

 

I admit the idea of $6 million guaranteed for a bullpen bound Myers is less than appealing, but I’m not really expecting him to pitch in relief. It might end up that the relief portion of the offer is dropped altogether. In the "Go B.I.G. or go home" method of mayhem, signing both pitchers might be the best expenditure of funds available to the A’s. At $8.5 million guaranteed your maybe getting at least as much reliability (combined) as the Braves are about to get by re-signing Hudson at $9 million annual with the possibility of more production and better trade value. Pencil Duke and Myers behind Braden and Anderson and if they bounce back to their previous performance levels the A’s rotation will be much stronger than it was in 2009. That also means Cahill, Mazzaro and Gio will fight it out for the 5th spot with the losers of that contest being optioned to AAA to work on whatever needs a-fixin’.

 

What about 3B?

 

Chavez is as tangible as a mirage and the A’s are making noises that they’d like to bring Adam Kennedy back in 2010. Which kind of make sense if the A’s believe that Brett Wallace can eventually handle the hot corner in the Show. No sense signing Adrian Beltre to a long term deal if you’ve got Wallace maybe 3 months away, right? Problem is, every time someone from the A’s Front Office gets asked about Wallace’s defense at 3B they do the most exquisite dance to avoid answering the question.

 

The A’s have a plethora of arms in the bullpen and it would make sense for them to try and move some arms to patch holes elsewhere. Still, it’s been argued time and again how fungible relief pitching can be and smart teams tend to find quality arms on the cheap year in and year out. This would, of course, diminish the trade value of someone like Mike Wuertz who had the 3rd highest WAR score of any relief pitcher in 2009. And while there are some teams who suck at finding cheap pitching they’re at least smart enough to hide behind the refrain of searching for a low cost alternative. So I suggest raising the stakes and packaging Wuertz with Breslow. The two combined to throw 134 innings and earned 3 WAR for the A’s. They’re under team control for at least the next two seasons and they’ll cost under $3 million in 2010. There aren’t a lot of teams that are looking for bullpen help who’ll try and pull the low cost alternative argument in the face of that kind of cost and potential production. Breslow is easily replaced by Blevins and/or Kilby while the A’s have RH bullpen arms stacked behind Wuertz.

 

 

 

That’s it from me… you are now properly prepared to speculate about this off-season’s potential moves. Have fun!

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I would never argue with anyone here ever again

If we signed Beltre. He is clearly the answer for us at 3B, great glove/good bat, what more do we need? Wallace can move to 1B, and Carter can play LF until Cust is gone then Wallace goes to DH, Carter to 1B.

That said, would a Wuertz for Iwamura deal make sense? Id hate to decimate our strongest area but Aki at 3B is a great short-term option and we have Meloan who might destroy next year for us.

Anyone catch that weird rumor yesterday? About some AL team in a bad (read: non-east) division making a play for Manny, and how Manny really wants to DH now? And how many pundits were thinking it was Beane? Now there’s a guy Id non-tender Cust for!

Davis
Sweeney
Manny
Beltre
Carter
Wallace
Suzuki
Ellis
Pennington

heart eyes

by PL78 on Nov 3, 2009 9:18 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Isn't Iwamura a FA?

"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin

by Helloooo 1st on Nov 3, 2009 1:08 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

nope

he has an option that tb would be very silly not to pick up. and if you read the trades (mlbTR) he’s about to swapped any minute now….

by PL78 on Nov 3, 2009 1:16 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Confirmed. He was traded to the pirates

"They (The 1989 A's) are the best team I ever saw"- Mike Krukow

by 9Custs on Nov 3, 2009 6:33 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

3rded...

Next please…

Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox

by mrod on Nov 4, 2009 7:20 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Wait...

Beltre does NOT have a good bat. The guy has not posted an OBP over.330 since he was with the Dodgers! Sure he hits 25 HRs a year, but he still only slugs .380! Adrian Beltre is not the answer unless he is going to play for 4 million a year.

I'm the genius who said Chris Carter will slug .650 his rookie season.

by JamesCaprio on Nov 3, 2009 11:27 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

You're forgetting something

Hint: It’s what players spend the OTHER half of their time doing. (Well, actually, more like 90%, once you knock out the time they spend lounging around chewing tobacco.)

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 11:59 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The post he was replying to said

“great glove/good bat”. I think it’s reasonable to question the second half of that.

"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan

by iglew on Nov 4, 2009 12:34 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Sure, and I'd likely have let things slide if he hadn't thrown in that last sentence...

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 4, 2009 8:40 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Ah. Point taken.

"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan

by iglew on Nov 4, 2009 10:47 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Discounting this year because he was injured

The 3 years before that his OPS was in between 784-802. Thats a “good” bat.

by PL78 on Nov 4, 2009 9:23 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

No it isn't!

The guy doesn’t get on base, he hits for a mediocre average at best, 25 bombs is nice but not a “long term solution.” And a 784-802 is not a good bat. That OPS frame is actually below the median for 3B. Yes he plays a great defensive 3B, but you know he isn’t going to play for chump change, and his defense is not THAT good.

Oh, and by the way, his agent is some dude called Scott Boras. There is no plausible way on this planet that he is coming to Oakland.

PT, I would take the guy for 12 million over 3 years. That is a good deal. Wallace could DH then. However, that isn’t going to happen so unless Beltre “falls” to the A’s I’m definitely against bringing him in. Especially with AK willing to play for cheaper and better ( yes, I know not defensively).

I'm the genius who said Chris Carter will slug .650 his rookie season.

by JamesCaprio on Nov 4, 2009 10:10 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Kennedy is better?

This year: .289/.348/.410/.758

by faninphilly on Nov 4, 2009 11:29 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Yes, yes he is.

Those numbers are better than Beltres this year. If you count Beltre’s last full season AK still has him beat in AVG and OBP. Beltre just wins OPS and slugging because he hits 25 bombs to AK’s 11, but then I would argue that AK has 20 SB and can play multiple positions.

Then you consider the fact that he is going to be paid less than HALF of what Beltre is/going to be paid. Yes, I will take AK.

I'm the genius who said Chris Carter will slug .650 his rookie season.

by JamesCaprio on Nov 4, 2009 11:56 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

AK is a butcher at third.

Maybe he can get Bitsy Hatteberg to hit him some grounders over the winter or something…

"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard

by Gaijin_Suketto on Nov 4, 2009 12:28 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

+1

Let the Kids play Billy!! No More Rent-a-Vet in Oakland!!

by s0sNe@kYbUtY? on Nov 4, 2009 7:08 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Throwing a bunch of numbers and irrelevant other factors into a pile, calling it a jumble, and then saying you should sign the cheaper player is not analysis

It is, in fact, the very abdication of analysis.

When you actually quantify the contributions of Kennedy and Beltre, using a reasonable sample size, it’s not even close. Beltre wins in an absolute walkover.

The WAR numbers, and let me emphasize that the fielding component of these is amply backed up by other metrics like RZR (and that Kennedy is by no means a bete noir of fielding metrics— UZR thinks he’s been great at 2B during his career), tell the tale of the tape. In the last four years Beltre has been worth literally four times what Kennedy has. Extend to six years and the difference is 10.6 wins (Kennedy) to 26.5 wins (Beltre).

They’re ridiculously non-comparable players. Adam Kennedy is, at this stage of his life, jank roster filler that you sign because you’re desperate and have no other options available. Adrian Beltre is an All-Star level talent.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 4, 2009 1:40 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I applaud your use of the word jank.

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 4, 2009 1:59 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

I question it and wonder if I've become

jank roster filler myself.

Sock puppets have never been able to successfully attack castles. -Nevermoor

by Leopold Bloom on Nov 4, 2009 1:59 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

+10000000000000

Let the Kids play Billy!! No More Rent-a-Vet in Oakland!!

by s0sNe@kYbUtY? on Nov 4, 2009 7:07 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks for the post grover

I’d like to see the A’s add a power bat and a veteran starting pitcher (not an original thought)

I have no problem with Beane trading away a couple of the bullpen guys as relievers can go from great to awful real quick (Hello Mr. Lidge).

I think it’s going to be an interesting off-season for the A’s and I hope Mr. Beane has a few tricks up his sleeve.

by sirbed on Nov 3, 2009 9:21 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

...and the winner of the 2009 AN Optimism Award goes to...

Sock puppets have never been able to successfully attack castles. -Nevermoor

by Leopold Bloom on Nov 5, 2009 12:04 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Brett Myers... ugh

Not very good. Not a very good person. And made $12M last season (how, exactly, has never been made clear to me).

Considering that he’s worse than Erik Bedard, Ben Sheets, Rich Harden, etc etc etc, equally injured, and made more money last season, I’d stay far far away from that guy. Hell, signing Brad Penny would probably make more sense.

Minor correction: Aaron Cunningham has two options remaining, as he was not optioned to the minors at any point after being called up for the first time in 2008.

Otherwise, I basically agree with this (except for Jared Lansford— he’ll be better protected by NOT being put on the 40-man roster, as no one in their right mind is going to rule 5 the guy).

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 9:45 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Cunningham began 2008 on the 40 man roster

The A’s optioned him to the minors March 10 and recalled him August 30.

To be honest, I kinda forgot about Ben Sheets. Rumors were he wanted to pitch for Texas and that was something that was going to be pursued this offseason. I think there’s enough whispers to suggest that there might be a decent amount of interest in Sheets and I’m not interested in a bidding war. Bedard is a better pitcher than Myers but he’s also a greater health risk… no thanks. Penny’s going to want/get a long-term deal and I’m not interested in a FA who’s going to be around in 2011.

Although I am amendable in principle to a FA SP other than Myers on a 1 year deal.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 3, 2009 10:09 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The Texas rumors

While there’s enough smoke to probably be fire behind them, Texas’ situation changed. Hicks doesn’t have the money to add much, if any, salary. Sheets also has probably the biggest health questions of any of the injured SP, since he didn’t pitch in ’09.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Nov 3, 2009 11:10 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Nor did Duchscherer

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 3, 2009 11:15 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The mlb.com transactions page states "Optioned RHP Chris Gissell, C Anthony Recker and OF Aaron Cunningham to Minor League camp."

I’m convinced, after doing some transactions research, that that line is a typographical error that should read “Reassigned” those players to minor league camp. First, the other two certainly were not on the 40-man roster at the time. Second, when Cunningham was traded from Chicago to Arizona, he was characterized as a nonroster outfielder, and at no point between then and March 2008 was his contract purchased.

All of which squares with logic— since he wasn’t eligible for Rule 5 until December 2008, the only reason he’d be added to a 40-man roster is if the team actually intended to give him playing time. If that was the case, he’d have actually gotten some— but he played his first career MLB game on August 31, 2008.

I’m 99.9% sure at this point that Cunningham still has two options remaining.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 1:19 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Typically when a team pulls a guy from the minors and on to the 40 man

the transaction is listed as purchasing the contract. The August 30, 2008 transaction lists it as a recall, which means that Cunningham was on the 40 man. One typo I can buy, but two is stretching it. If you can find a non-MLB.com source that lists the 8/30/08 roster move as a purchase of Cunningham’s contract and not a recall I’ll change the count.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 3, 2009 1:46 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Rotoworld described the first transaction as a "reassignment" and the second as a "purchase" at the time

See here.

They know the correct terminology, so while I might be inclined to give the tiebreaking nod to MLB.com if we had no other evidence at all that Cunningham was not on the 40-man roster before 8/30/08, there’s a ton of evidence in Rotoworld’s favor here, starting with the complete absence of any “purchased the contract of Aaron Cunningham” transaction in MLB.com’s record at all.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 2:33 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Good enough for me

I’ll fix the error in a bit.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 3, 2009 2:39 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Recker

I’m not so sure where he fits in, maybe if everything goes right he could profile similar to a poor mans version of mike napoli. His offensive numbers for a catcher outside of his AA stint in 07, actually arent that bad. But last yr he repeated AA and A’s were so confident in him that they gave playing time to munson/gallaraga/thigpen etc before injuries hit and recker got another chance. He still has defensive issues and is 26 yrs old. The only upside seems to be he’s caught the majority of these pitchers in the system. The A’s seem to be depleted of upper level catching depth so its possible they keep him around. Or they can give 40 man spot to graham godfrey, who i wouldnt be surprised if he surpasses mortensen/simmons next yr.

by Asfan4ever723 on Nov 3, 2009 10:07 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

I agree on Godfrey being a better bet than Simmons, and probably Mortensen as well.

It's not the results, it's how you look going about those results -- Tim McCarver

by WaddellCanseco on Nov 3, 2009 9:46 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Does he still have those awesome sideburns?

"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan

by iglew on Nov 4, 2009 12:34 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Ya, I would say no thank you to Myers.

Another “veteran” FA agent pitcher I thought about throwing out there in my post was Carl Pavano. He seemed to perform pretty well for the Indians and Twins this past season (i.e. the American League) with an even 4.00 FIP…

He showed great control, pitched nearly 200 innings and seems like a fly-ball pitcher who’d be a good fit for the Coliseum.

He was only guaranteed $1.5 million last season, but earned a little over $5 million total with his incentives. Why not throw the $6 million guaranteed plus escalators you have bookmarked for Myers at PAvano instead, who seems like a better pitcher and human being?

I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!

by Taj Adib on Nov 3, 2009 10:10 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Hmm... Pavano

I gave up on him being worth a damn years ago. I suppose it’s possible he could be healthy two years in a row.

Nah. Couldn’t happen!

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 3, 2009 10:17 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Wuertz/Breslow

I’d have to think A’s got kind of lucky to get great seasons out of them. Though they had solid track records previously. The A’s brought in springer, cameron, schroder, reineke, edg gonzalez etc who had some decent filler upside too which didnt work out as well. Especially w/ the failures and injuries of devine, blevins, brown, casilla, etc early on, i’d have to think the bullpen might have been in shambles w/o wuertz/breslow, nice surprises at least. The one pitcher that got away was the potential signing of Correia who A’swere rumored to be interested in, then opted for hometown SD. Not a guarantee he wouldve pitched as well here though.

by Asfan4ever723 on Nov 3, 2009 10:15 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

nice (lots of) work Grover

I pretty much agree with you on whom to drop from the 40 man roster, but not about Myers.

by OaklandSi on Nov 3, 2009 10:20 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Well, it wouldn't be one of my posts

if I didn’t include one off-the-wall idea!

Please rec, I did research the transaction history of 40+ players.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 3, 2009 10:22 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Yep, and thank you

If I had been a bit more patient I wouldn’t have begged for no reason. If nothing else maybe my patheticness (not sure that’s a word) will inspire others to feed my vanity.

I’m not making myself sound real good, am I? I think I’ll be quiet now.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 3, 2009 10:33 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I appreciate all the work you put into it

I for one don’t have the patience to do this much research into something that I don’t need to do for my job. ;-)

by OaklandSi on Nov 3, 2009 1:57 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

+1

I’m here for the comic relief,

but the left brainers need something to crack out on too!

"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard

by Gaijin_Suketto on Nov 4, 2009 12:47 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I always love your posts Grover! Good stuff, mate.

I’d be in favor of going after a clean bill of health Sheets or Duke if he is mentally/emotionally/physically healthy.
You think Wuertz/Breslow would net us JJ Hardy? Or Simmons/Wuertz would do it?

How about signing Hedeki Matsui to a 1 year deal? He has power, could be a combo DH corner outfielder, and would draw some additional fans from the local Japanese fan base as well.

Zeigler to Geren…."A-Rod? He’s my bitch." -alox

by mrod on Nov 5, 2009 1:28 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Brewers are looking for SP

So while Breslow/Wuertz would work in theory (they’re worth 10 widgets, Hardy’s worth the same) I doubt it would work in practice.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 5, 2009 4:58 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Trade chips

The A’s have a number of guys at their highest level of value going into this offseason. Combine that with some guys in purgatory and these guys could be trade chips:
Wuertz
Desme
Davis
Donaldson
Buck
Cunningham
Hairston
Pennington
Casilla

If the A’s could jettison some of those guys and bring in Hardy, I’d love the offseason. At 3b, I’d love to see Beltre, Glaus, and/or Iwamura. Add one SP and I think the A’s would have a great offseason. Look for some other cheap deals like a minor league deal for Giles and investigate Winn, Cameron, and Alex Gordon’s trade value.

Lineup:
Sweeney CF
Hardy SS
Cust DH
Beltre/Iwamura/Glaus 3b
Suzuki C
Buck/Cunningham/Hairston/Giles LF
Buck/Cunningham/Hairston/Giles RF
Ellis 2b
Barton 1b

That’s the making of a solid lineup with amazing defense. Plus it leaves room for whoever performs at AAA to come up and replace whoever’s struggling.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Nov 3, 2009 11:25 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

I haven't really looked at the Brewers' needs

But a relief arm for Hardy swap wouldn’t be a bad idea as long as it didn’t involve Bailey.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 3, 2009 11:42 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I still think Weurtz is too much to offer for Hardy

Given that Hardy was a 1.4 WAR SS and Weurtz was a 2.4 WAR reliever in 2009.

That said, I’m warming up to it. It’s probably not very likely that Weurtz repeats his 2009, and as volatile as relievers are it may be the opportune time to deal him.

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 3, 2009 12:56 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

It would make a ton of sense for the A's to trade for him

Unfortunately, it sounds like the move will be made before my putative trade fanpost could possibly be finished… well, that’s OK, Tampa will still have seven infielders for (at most) six slots…

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 1:32 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The Pirates?

Interesting.

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 3, 2009 1:37 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

OMG YOU GUYS LET'S START THE ANDY LAROCHE POSTS AGAIN!!!!!!

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 3, 2009 1:38 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

We can paint our nails, and make crank calls,

and have a SLUMBER PARTY!

"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard

by Gaijin_Suketto on Nov 4, 2009 12:48 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

GYMNASTICS?

"If Bowden was a general contractor, he'd build houses with nine bedrooms, six garages, no bathrooms, and half a roof."

by DyeLongJustice on Nov 4, 2009 5:10 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

GIRL SCOUTS!

"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard

by Gaijin_Suketto on Nov 4, 2009 12:29 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Makes sense

I’m guessing the plan is to have Iwamura hold down the fort at 2B until Alvarez gets called up in June, at which point LaRoche shifts over to 2B and Iwamura gets flipped to a contender for prospects.

by CapgrasDelusion on Nov 3, 2009 2:57 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

or do exactly the same thing with Orlando Hudson

only you don’t have to give up whatever it is they’re giving up for Iwamura

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 3, 2009 3:08 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I really doubt that 1 year and 4.5 million is going to get it done for Orlando Hudson

Notwithstanding the patent idiocy of Ned Colletti, there are a lot of GMs who actually realize that Hudson was good this season.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 3:14 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Okay, Eckstein or Loretta or Polanco or whoever

Point being, maybe it’s not the best decision to give up a prospect for a half season of Iwamura just to turn around and flip him.

You know, kind of like the Holliday trade that you were adamantly against.

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 3, 2009 3:29 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

So apparently the trade has gone through

and the price was one mediocre middle relief pitcher.

Remember how I said rentals were fine when the price is only a pile of garbage?

The Rays must really be running low on funds or something, because they just got completely ripped off.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 5:41 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Pirates picked up all of iwamura salary

4.8mill, likely that would be a bit higher than a resign of kennedy.

but i’d rather have iawmura slightly more expensive and w/minimal given up

by Asfan4ever723 on Nov 3, 2009 6:30 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Hey, right?

I mean, Jeff Gray is a better prospect than this dude. And the A’s could punt him without batting an eye.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 9:51 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Sanchez supposedly has a 94-95 mph fastball and a

plus-plus change. Sure he’s raw, but he’s gotta have more upside than Gray.

It's not the results, it's how you look going about those results -- Tim McCarver

by WaddellCanseco on Nov 3, 2009 9:53 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I flatly refuse to believe that assessment

Relievers with that kind of stuff do not struggle to strike out a batter an inning in AAA. Either a scout blew a scouting report, or something’s gotten garbled in translation.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 9:59 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed

and really, Iwamura for a mid level relief prospect? That’s a ridiculously easy deal, and I wish Beane had jumped into that.

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 3, 2009 10:01 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Is the knee injury suppressing his value?

From MLB.com:

Iwamura was limited to only 69 games in ‘09 and needed left knee surgery to repair a partially torn ACL. Huntington said that the Pirates have not independently examined Iwamura’s knee, but that all the medical reports suggest that there will be no lingering issues.

When asked about his knee Tuesday, Iwamura said it has not yet returned to full strength.

“I feel very good, but not 100 percent,” he said. “[I’m] still in the rehabbing process right now. In the offseason, [I’ll] continue to make progress with the knee. For next season, [I’ll] be completely healthy.”

According to Rays general manager Andrew Friedman, the Pirates began to show heavy interest in Iwamura in September. Huntington confirmed that Pittsburgh did have three different scouts watching the infielder during the final month of the season to assess his mobility and range, both of which were determined to be fine. Iwamura was wearing a large brace after surgery, and it hasn’t yet been determined if that will be needed next season.

I don’t know how his defense looked in September, but he struggled with the bat. Given that he says the knee still isn’t 100% and that he may have to wear the brace again next season, I can’t believe the Pirates didn’t take their own look at his knee.

Iwamura’s a bargain if healthy, but his health is far from a given.

by Danny on Nov 4, 2009 10:52 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

This is a quote from RJ Anderson in Fangraphs
Chavez is a right-handed reliever with a plus-plus change and velocity that sits in the 94-96 range. Thanks to that change he has a reverse platoon split, and is exceptional versus lefties. He figures to profile as a late inning reliever with the Rays, although he’s had issues with home runs which, if fixed, could really change the dynamic of his career arc.

Link

It's not the results, it's how you look going about those results -- Tim McCarver

by WaddellCanseco on Nov 3, 2009 11:27 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I know he said that.

To paraphrase Burn Notice:

I. Don’t.
Believe.
Him.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 11:58 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Also, I should point out that their average FB velocity in the bigs this season is identical (94.5)

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 10:01 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Sorry I meant Chavez not Sanchez

Brain fart

It's not the results, it's how you look going about those results -- Tim McCarver

by WaddellCanseco on Nov 3, 2009 11:25 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Well, that's me wrong

clearly, not for the first time

by bobnothing on Nov 3, 2009 7:18 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The Rays

Are indeed shedding money so they can sign their younger stars to long term deals. You know, smart GMing? Its a rare thing to witness these days, sadly.

by PL78 on Nov 4, 2009 9:30 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah, because taking a tiny financial risk so that you can field offers for an entire offseason

totally interferes with signing players to long-term deals.

Wait. Those two things have nothing whatsoever to do with one another.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 4, 2009 1:44 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

huh?

not paying Iwamura that $5M is $5M they can give to Crawford or Pena on a long-term deal. Im pretty sure thats their plan and why they got rid of Kazmir too.

by PL78 on Nov 4, 2009 6:22 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I believe he meant that Iwamura didn't NEED to be traded

there’s basically a whole offseason to field offers for him, and several teams could use a solid 2b/3b type at an affordable price

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 4, 2009 6:36 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Invoking an option contract that says Player X makes $4.5M in 2010

is in no sense the same thing as actually writing Player X a check for $4.5M.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 4, 2009 8:37 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

maybe

they are going to try and re-sign Crawford during the season and see that $4.5MM as $4.5MM that would be better used on Crawford instead of wasting it on Aki (and it is waste, he has no spot and no playing time to add value).

by PL78 on Nov 4, 2009 11:42 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I give up

I’m not going to restate my point for a fourth time. Or a fifth time, if you count the time mikev restated it.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 5, 2009 12:29 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

i only counted 3 times

if you include mikes one.

by PL78 on Nov 5, 2009 10:39 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Do you understand the concept of "payments"

and that they would not have been paying Iwamura 4.5M all at once?

The payments, not unlike paychecks, are spread out over the season.

They could have invoked the option and STILL NOT HAD TO PAY HIM until the season started, or the year turned over, or whatever time they start paying guys again.

Point being, the 2009 season wasn’t even over yet. There was no huge rush to trade him. They weren’t going to have to start paying his 4.5M for 2010 until, like, April. Why not wait and see who misses out on Beltre and Figgins, then offer up Iwamura?

THAT would be smart GMing.

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 5, 2009 7:49 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

okay i get it now

thanks mike. maybe there was an internal memo sent out by Bud to give the Pirates “friendly” deals? hahaha

by PL78 on Nov 5, 2009 10:37 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

What happened there with Hudson?

When Belliard was starting in the playoffs I figured Hudson was broken, then hudson came in. I just don’t know.

by Future Ed on Nov 3, 2009 10:25 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Joe Torre's brain happened

Belliard went on some meaningless hot streak and suddenly he was, despite all reason, anointed the playoff starter.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 10:46 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't want you to spoil the post, but 7?

Bartlett, Zobrist, Brignac, Longoria, Pena, Rodriguez, who am I missing?

by drink on Nov 3, 2009 1:37 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Willy Aybar

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 2:34 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Wow

Totally forgot about him. That is some serious depth.

by drink on Nov 3, 2009 2:42 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

They could always send Longoria down to AAA for some seasoning.

Batting 4th for the 2014 San Jose A's: 26-year-old RF Justin Upton, in the 1st season of a nine year, $250M deal.

by notsellingjeans on Nov 4, 2009 4:24 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Very nice summary

Brett Myers….meh. I suppose if the deal were cheap enough it might make some sense; I wouldn’t be willing to go nearly as high as 6 mil, though. I’m all about bringing Duke back on a deal like the one you propose.

By my reckoning the A’s retain about 80 wins worth of talent heading into next season, and have about $25 million of flexibility with which to procure talent. That puts them squarely on the bubble with respect to which direction they head.

By far the quickest way to catapult this team into contending territory would be to sign Adrian Beltre, as he’d turn a black hole of production into 2-4 WAR, then augment the starting rotation with a safe bet like Duke or Penny, or go the wild card route with Sheets or Bedard. The question then becomes whether or not the A’s are willing to abandon the notion of Brett Wallace as 3B of the future. I’ll say this: if Beltre can be had at a bargain price, it’d be mighty foolish to pass up the opportunity based on the tenuous assumption that Wallace can play a passable 3B.

I also think the A’s should absolutely kick the tires on J.J. Hardy and Yunel Escobar. Everything depends on the cost of acquisition, but count me among those who are just a tad uneasy about the prospect of going forward with Cliff Pennington as the everyday SS.

With some bargaining chips in hand, some payroll flexibility, a shrewd front office, and a bevy of position prospects en route, I feel fairly confident heading into the offseason. BB and his crack team have had me scratching my head a few times since about this time last year, but I still like the general direction.

by CapgrasDelusion on Nov 3, 2009 11:36 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

my thoughts exactly

While i would love to see Wallace play a passable third base, signing Beltre would be the smartest thing to do because it assures great Defense and still at least average Offense and we can give Wallace time to work on things in AAA or give him DH opportunities with cust and have him back up 1st/3rd if needed.

and we might need him to back up 3rd haha, Beltre was the one who got a contusion on his testicle in 09 am i correct?

Also, i feel we should give pennington a shot to see what he can do, he seemed to get thrown in the fire when we traded OCab and did alright for himself. Lets see what else he can do.

by Twan54321 on Nov 3, 2009 2:27 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I think Beane is going to stay with Pennington at SS until Green makes it to the Majors

Also, It looks like the A’s are leaning towards re-signing Kennedy for 3B is Chavy doesn’t make it.. until Wallace gets called up. Also, Barton is a pretty good bet to still be at 1B in 2010 as Carter probably won’t be up until later in the year if at all in 2010.
The SP spot is different. But the A’s have Braden who they seem to view as a veteran to go along with all the youngsters. But if one of these positions were upgraded I think it would be SP.

"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"

by Eastbayjim on Nov 5, 2009 3:35 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Re: Vignette and Capgras Delusion

I think all three of us are kind of on the same page going forward here. It seems like the A’s have some payroll flexibility and some interesting trade chips (that aren’t part of the “core” going forward) and some definite short-term needs…when you combine that with a likely-depressed free agent market, I’m thinking that this off-season could easily be a very productive one for the A’s, provided the team is fairly aggressive and is willing to take a chance or two.

From my perspective, the team needs are: power, defense and starting pitching depth.

In the free agent market, the A’s could grab some power with:
Glaus, Beltre, Nady, Ankiel, Dye, Vlad and Thome

They could improve defense with:
Beltre, Crede, Jack Wilson, Mike Cameron, Alex Gonzalez

Starting Pitching:
Duke, D Davis, Pavano, Penny, Sheets, Tomko, Lowry, Correia

On the trade front they could target:

Hardy, Dunn, Uggla, Kouzmanoff, Iwamura, Byrnes, Teahen? Atkins? Brandon Wood? Reid Brignac, Escobar

The point is…there should be opportunity aplenty to address this team’s needs for 2010 in the coming months. While I realize that this organization is planning more for 2011 on, I see no reason why some effort shouldn’t be made to throw some money at some “upside” plays or move around a surplus reliever or outfielder or two to address a short-teaam hole at position of need (left side of the infield) or to bolster a very young starting rotation.

I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!

by Taj Adib on Nov 3, 2009 12:45 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I'm hoping for Ankiel.

I just have a soft spot for the guy.

Plus, that game where he had the 2 OF assists. Gawddamn.

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 3, 2009 12:57 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Reconvert him to pitcher!

Oh, I wish.

"Life is a horizontal fall" -Jean Cocteau

by King Richard on Nov 3, 2009 7:29 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Iwamura to pirates?!?!

Now lets trade some filler arms like mortensen, gray, blevins,or godfrey for a laroche or walker

by Asfan4ever723 on Nov 3, 2009 2:04 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

He'd be playing second base for them, yo

Not really an issue.

Though I’m sure they’d be happy to get even a decent arm for godawful Neil Walker.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 2:38 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Brett Myers

Sometimes things aren’t as bad as the simple headlines make them sound (as was the case with Corey Brown) so if there’s evidence out there that Brett Myers really isn’t the complete douche that is suggested by the various stories about him shouting profanities at reporters, slugging his wife in public and dragging her by the hair, etc, then I’d be happy to hear about it.

But if, as I suspect, there is no such evidence on non-douchery, then I want the A’s to have nothing to do with this guy, no matter how good a pitcher he is nor how cheap a contract he’s willing to sign.

"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan

by iglew on Nov 3, 2009 2:53 PM PST reply actions   1 recs

Fair enough

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 3, 2009 3:51 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

It's all about nine Milton Bradleys.

"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard

by Gaijin_Suketto on Nov 4, 2009 12:51 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The trouble with 9 Milton Bradleys

is that you still need to go out and get 9 more players.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 4, 2009 8:00 AM PST up reply actions   1 recs

18 Milton Bradleys?

"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard

by Gaijin_Suketto on Nov 4, 2009 12:31 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

We've compounded the issue!

Sock puppets have never been able to successfully attack castles. -Nevermoor

by Leopold Bloom on Nov 4, 2009 12:38 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

You'd also need 18 managers to deal with any temper tantrums erupting

"You know, a long time ago being crazy meant something. Nowadays everybody's crazy."

-Charles Manson

by kaweahkaweah on Nov 4, 2009 1:34 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Way way too many miltons

We would have 18 live balls thrown into the stands with less than three outs in a year,, how bad is that? Has to be a record. And they would all pull themselves out of a game at the same time!

by Twan54321 on Nov 4, 2009 3:43 PM PST via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

I was in Boston when that Happened

Myers did slug his wife. No room for him on the A’s. Let him hang out with Tom Cable.

Wouldn’t waste money on Beltre, let Wallace learn the position. Carter is not ready for the show anyway. If he came up now, he would be a right handed Cust.

I’d try to get Vlad Guerrero to DH, though I doubt he would come here. Cust’s average and swing and miss tendencies are killing us. His silghtly above average OBP dosen’t make up for his deficiencies.

by StewCrew on Nov 3, 2009 5:28 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Leaving aside the low-hanging-poisonous-tree-fruit w/r/t Jack Cust,

why on earth would anyone deem Wallace ready for the big leagues and Carter not?

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 6:15 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

+1

Carter’s MLE OPS was in the high .700s and Wallace in the high .600s.

Then again, if Carter DHs and Wallace plays a -5 3b, Wallace has a 15 run advantage on Carter. Add that Wallace would replace a black hole and Carter would struggle to be equal to the bat he was replacing (even StewCrew admits Carter would be a right-handed Cust, although I doubt he means it the way I do), and there’s a little bit of an argument to make.

Then again, I’d much rather have a .900 OPS Carter seven years from now than the .780 one next year. I’d also rather have the .875 Wallace.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Nov 3, 2009 6:37 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Oh, me too

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Nov 3, 2009 7:27 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I, and I think many fans.... would be excited to see both Carter and Wallace in 2010

Just the thought, the hope for these two would create excitement.

"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"

by Eastbayjim on Nov 5, 2009 3:41 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

A high .600s OPS with -5 defense isn't replacing a black hole

except in the literal sense that it is removing a black hole and putting a different black hole in the same spot…

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 3, 2009 10:02 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

by the "no strings" theory

there is no way to physically tell the difference between two black holes (as long as they share the same mass, charge, and angular momentum)

(insert Wallace mass joke)

by colin on Nov 4, 2009 9:00 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

A B -3X = Swedish girls like chocolate @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 4, 2009 11:11 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm so confused

but I’ll assume it was a .gif demonstrating Hawking radiation

by colin on Nov 4, 2009 11:13 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Nope

link

"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson

by nevermoor on Nov 4, 2009 11:23 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

a few"depth" pitchers to consider

gaudin reunion?
Rich Hill is now a FA after refusing an milb assignment
Lowry has been discussed

Also for 3b if non tendered, maybe Garett Atkins

by Asfan4ever723 on Nov 3, 2009 6:48 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

no on Atkins

colorado product.

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 3, 2009 6:59 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I'd investigate Atkins if he was non-tendered

If it meant trading anything of value or a large amount of money, I’d back off.

Rich Hill could be an intriguing option if 2010 was a completely non-contending year. If the A’s were a team that probably wouldn’t go anywhere next year and had a terrible rotation, I could see going with Hill. You know, a team like the O’s. Oh, wait…

I’ve always had a high opinion of Gaudin and thought he could be a good #3 or 4 starter. He’s youngish, has good stuff, Ks guys, and had a great minor league track record. It seems like most major leagues teams disagree. Perhaps most GMs couldn’t stand the sight of having to look at his facial hair every fifth day. In any case, I doubt Chad would be interested in coming back, he left with a sour taste in his mouth. Bradley or Harden could make some sense to bring back if they were cheap, but neither has any chance to due to the way they left.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Nov 3, 2009 7:17 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Fawlty Towers!

"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard

by Gaijin_Suketto on Nov 4, 2009 12:53 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

{claps Manuel on forehead}

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 4, 2009 8:01 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

(rearranges letters in sign out front)

"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard

by Gaijin_Suketto on Nov 4, 2009 12:33 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

no, they use "K" in England.

"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard

by Gaijin_Suketto on Nov 4, 2009 1:30 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks Grover. This was very good.

It's not the results, it's how you look going about those results -- Tim McCarver

by WaddellCanseco on Nov 3, 2009 9:53 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

(small g)

Sock puppets have never been able to successfully attack castles. -Nevermoor

by Leopold Bloom on Nov 4, 2009 12:40 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks leopold

It's not the results, it's how you look going about those results -- Tim McCarver

by WaddellCanseco on Nov 8, 2009 10:45 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Thoughts

No on Myers. Not worth it.

For Third Base, I’d advocate trying to get Troy Glaus on a 1 year stopgap contract. Glaus can prove he’s healthy, A’s get a stopgap 3B for a time, and if he doesnt work out at 3B, he can either play 1B or DH.

I wouldn’t mind trading Wuertz or Breslow, but relying on Blevins for anything is silly anymore.

I don’t see Recker being worth protecting either. I dont even know if he will crack Triple A again this year, with Donaldson going there, and the possible return of Galarraga.

I do vote for trading Henry Rodriguez if we can to a team that overvalues 100MPH velocity with zero control.

Don't believe in yourself.
Believe in Me who believes in You.

by Zonis on Nov 4, 2009 3:59 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Henry was a lot of fun to watch when he was pitching in games that didn't really matter

(ie, after the A’s had been eliminated), so maybe some team that isn’t going to win anything, but need to become more entertaining?

by bobnothing on Nov 4, 2009 7:30 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

You mean like Oakland?

It's not the results, it's how you look going about those results -- Tim McCarver

by WaddellCanseco on Nov 4, 2009 8:27 AM PST up reply actions   1 recs

LOL

"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan

by iglew on Nov 4, 2009 10:49 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Eh?

Blevins had an FIP of 3.01 in his limited big-league time. (It was actually higher, albeit marginally so, in AAA.)

The only reason he looked bad this year was a horrible strand rate, which is even less of a controllable stat for relievers than it is for starters, since half the time the guy failing to strand the runner isn’t even the same pitcher.

You know how many lefthanded relievers with 20 IP had a better FIP than Blevins last year? Three.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 4, 2009 8:56 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

wow, thanks

I appreciate you posting that information, I guess my confirmation bias was strong with Blevins, but I could have sworn he was much worse than that. It seemed like he couldn’t get anyone out. Then again, I guess this is why it’s bad to run a team based on “lying eyes”.

by el generico on Nov 4, 2009 12:13 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

one reason why

many of us remember Blevins as being horrible for 2009 is because he really was horrible in the 5 games he pitched in April and May. Just looking at the categories relevant for FIP, he had 3 BB, 3 K, and 1 HR in 4.1 IP. So that’s bad (but a really small sample).

Then he was in the minors for most of the season and came back in early September to strike out 20 against only 3 walks and 1 HR over 18 IP. That’s really good (but still a small sample). But we don’t remember it because the A’s were playing meaningless games at that point.

by colin on Nov 4, 2009 1:12 PM PST up reply actions   2 recs

This is what might be called "storyline generation"

People tend to generate mental images of what a player is doing in a given season very early on (based on small samples of play), and then to assume the continuation of that storyline, especially when they don’t hear constant news about how a player is doing.

AN’s storyline for Blevins is that he lost his head this season. Which, in April, was sort of true. He went through a rough patch, which IIRC actually continued when he went to the minors. The thing is, all of it was SSS. Then he sorted things out a bit (or just stopped getting unlucky) and was ridiculously good in the minors for three months before coming up to the majors and being ridiculously good in the majors for a month. Overall, and put in the context of his career to date (where he’s basically been very good for 3 seasons in a row now), the early season results look like a total aberration.

But because they shaped the storyline…

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 4, 2009 1:53 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

another good example

was David Ortiz this season. Sure it was a down year for him, but not nearly as bad as you might think if your opinion got fixed after his horrible first two months.

by colin on Nov 4, 2009 2:02 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

My guess on what happened to Blevins in April

is that he had a similar season arc to Ziegler’s: He got very sick in spring training (we know this) and took longer to fully recover than it took for him to be declared physically ready to pitch, and so he pitched while he was too weak to be effective. And with Blevins, it’s not like he can afford to lose 10 pounds.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 4, 2009 5:37 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

He also developed the magical cutter at some point in AAA...

which could have explained him really taking off in the middle of the AAA season and carrying that over to his big league stint.

I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!

by Taj Adib on Nov 5, 2009 7:32 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Rough measure at best, but the cutter was actually his LEAST effective pitch this season

by Fangraphs’ measure. Another way of saying that is that more bad things happened on cutters than on his other pitches.

I’m sticking with “coincidence,” which is almost never the wrong explanation when it comes to baseball phenomena.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 5, 2009 7:54 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Perhaps the fact that it's a new pitch for him

led to more “mistake” cutters getting hammered?

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 5, 2009 8:23 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I wish

that fangraphs would give the raw numbers for their pitch type chart. Oh wait, they do list his total pitches in the “More Batted Ball” section. So the cutter was 14% of 371 pitches = 52 cutters. I’m going with PT’s coincidence explanation.

Also, does anyone have any ideas about the 35 pitches from Blevins that weren’t classified by pitchfx?

by colin on Nov 5, 2009 9:11 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah

I think this is exactly what happened for me. Well articulated.

by el generico on Nov 4, 2009 2:59 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Well, I can't say anything about that

I was too busy having loads of fun practicing my cite-checking skills and schmoozing with people who one day will make 3-5 times as much money as me.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 5, 2009 7:47 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

pshaw.

The A’s make WAY MORE than 3-5 times as much as me.

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 5, 2009 7:49 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Even major-league minimum

is more than 5 times as much as me :-(

"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan

by iglew on Nov 5, 2009 1:28 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

me too

Matter of fact just last night I was kicking around moving out of the Bay Area. It’s just too fuckin hard to get ahead.

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 5, 2009 1:38 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Have you tried the Tenderloin?

Oh, wait, you said ahead.

"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan

by iglew on Nov 5, 2009 5:47 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I just want to see a team that can actually hit!

Hopefully, our second half team shows up for 2010, but honestly I’m getting bored watching us score no runs and hoping our pitching can old together. Don’t the A’s have any respect for my attention span? Gosh!

"If Bowden was a general contractor, he'd build houses with nine bedrooms, six garages, no bathrooms, and half a roof."

by DyeLongJustice on Nov 4, 2009 5:12 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

If you want the appearance of a team that can hit, you'd better front them several hundred million for a new stadium...

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 4, 2009 8:43 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

2010 / 2011

1A: Chavez
1B: Stop Gap (Glaus)

September: Wallace

2011:

1A: Wallace

by Colorado Fan on Nov 4, 2009 11:02 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Nice work as always grover

Thanks for putting it together.

"You know, a long time ago being crazy meant something. Nowadays everybody's crazy."

-Charles Manson

by kaweahkaweah on Nov 4, 2009 8:51 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Please explain why

Brett Myers is a better option than Randy Johnson? Unit can either start or long relieve, he’s 71 years old and can tell stories about playing baseball in Montreal and what striking out Ryne Sandberg was like, you arent going to find a better “veteran presence” than he.

Or you can sign a lowlife immature coward who punched a woman in the face.

by PL78 on Nov 4, 2009 9:35 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

RE: Beltre

Obviously he’s not the 10-win player from 2004, but he did put up a couple of 4+ win seasons in Seattle. Excellent defense with ~.200 ISO at 3B is pretty valuable, and similar to what Chavez provided when healthy. Beltre was on the DL twice last season (once with a recurrence of a bone spur in his left shoulder, once with an injury that used the words “lacerated” and “testicle” in the same sentence) so his overall numbers shouldn’t be held as a standard going forward.

The problem I see is that he is regarded as a flop based on his last contract, even though Fangraphs has him earning his contract with a few million to spare. He’ll be nearly 31 on Opening Day, and he and Boras are probably eying one more multi-year deal. Depending on the market for Beltre, he’ll either get that contract this off-season, or he’ll sign a short-term contract in an effort to reestablish his value. The A’s aren’t going to be the team to sign him to the long-term deal. Furthermore, Boras knows that Oakland is not the place for a player to go if he’s looking to rebuild offensive value.

"You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take.
-Wayne Gretzky"
-Michael Scott

by scatterbrian on Nov 4, 2009 1:51 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Your last point is a pretty important one.

I think, in general, it’s going to be quite common for the “rehabbing” players to go this route:

If you’re a hitter looking to re-establish value, angle to get a 1-year contract in Texas, Cincy or another launching pad and if you’re a pitcher, angle to get a similar deal in Oakland or Petco Park.

The A’s shouldn’t get into a bidding war with anybody – and especially not themselves – by trying to overpay to get a guy on a “rebound” deal who probably doesn’t want to come here because the environs kind of suck and the stadium suppresses offensive production – the old Rafael Furcal “thanks, but no thanks” type of situation.

On the other hand, they can maximize the opposite effect by stocking up on rehabbing pitchers who should like the low-key atmosphere, solid pitching coach and slugging-suppressing environment.

Like you, I think it’s dubious that Beltre/Boras would even want to come – or think it wise – to Oakland on a 1-year deal. And if he wants more than 1-year anyways, then I don’t really see a solid match with the A’s, who should be able to slot Wallace or Cardenas in at 3rd by 2011.

I would really like the A’s to try to grab Glaus, who’s value is not as closely tied into his defense as it is Beltre and who’s from the West Coast and who’s agent is NOT Scott Boras.

I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!

by Taj Adib on Nov 4, 2009 3:43 PM PST up reply actions   2 recs

just for fun

I looked up Beltre’s splits by stadium, and he’s been terrible in Oakland. In just over 200 PAs he’s hit .240/.293/.365 at the Coliseum. The only places he looks worse are Atlanta, Boston, Milwaukee and Florida.

"You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take.
-Wayne Gretzky"
-Michael Scott

by scatterbrian on Nov 4, 2009 4:32 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I thought he killed the A's historically

Is it only at Safeco? Or am I just out to lunch?

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 4, 2009 5:00 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I also remember Beltre as being an A's killer.

Interesting that the stadium stats seem to contradict that.

If someone takes the time to investigate more thoroughly, I’d be interested in hearing the details.

"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan

by iglew on Nov 4, 2009 6:24 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

not too thorough

but baseball reference has his tOPS+ against Oakland at 87. tOPS+ is just scaling his OPS against Oakland so that 100 is Beltre’s career average. So that would say that he’s been pretty bad against the A’s.

I didn’t try for the double split — vs A’s in Oakland compared to vs A’s in Seattle. Also, looking at his WPA might give a better correspondence to the sort of things we remember. I don’t think fangraphs does WPA splits, though.

by colin on Nov 5, 2009 9:17 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

That's good enough for me

Apparently I was just wrong.

Not like it matters anyway; all of this is just irrelevant trivia.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 5, 2009 11:34 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Is that just for this year, or career?

My main memories of Beltre killing us are from 2008.

But yeah, probably just selective memory.

"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan

by iglew on Nov 5, 2009 1:30 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

it was his career number

tOPS+ (sOPS+) vs Oakland by year:
===
2009 = 87 (72)
2008 = 127 (142)
2007 = 120 (139)
2006 = 65 (69)
2005 = 85 (89)

Difference between tOPS+ and sOPS+ is that tOPS+ compares Beltre vs Oakland to Beltre vs everyone else. sOPS+ compares Beltre vs Oakland to everyone else vs Oakland.

…and iglew’s memory of Beltre killing us in 2008 seems to be pretty much right on.

by colin on Nov 6, 2009 1:55 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Aha, so 2007 and 2008

That sounds about right. Thanks for looking this up for us.

"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan

by iglew on Nov 6, 2009 3:29 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

it there's one thing I got out of the GOG

it was familiarity with baseball-reference.

by colin on Nov 7, 2009 10:49 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

hmmm

should have been “is familiarity”, I believe

by colin on Nov 7, 2009 10:50 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

That's because you let me do the wieters-facts series.

"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson

by nevermoor on Nov 7, 2009 4:31 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

rec'd for so many good reasons and sound logic

Batting 4th for the 2014 San Jose A's: 26-year-old RF Justin Upton, in the 1st season of a nine year, $250M deal.

by notsellingjeans on Nov 4, 2009 4:32 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Both Wallace and Cardenas have other potential positions they can play

Neglecting to sign a good, affordable player because he will “block” prospects who may or may not work out and could play other positions if they do is, I’ll mince no words here, stupid. The A’s offense is unlikely to be very good unless they add additional talent over and above the current group of prospects.

I’d much rather see Wallace relegated to 1B, Cardenas taking second, and Weeks going to the outfield, which promises plus defense at all of those positions (plus third base with Beltre), than the alternative configurations, which are potentially frightfully bad at defense and are unlikely to make up for it on offense.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 4, 2009 5:09 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I appreciate you not mincing words for a change!

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 4, 2009 5:39 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Actually, Paul has minced pretty nicely

for the past several months.

"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan

by iglew on Nov 4, 2009 6:25 PM PST up reply actions   2 recs

mmm minced meat pie!

"If Bowden was a general contractor, he'd build houses with nine bedrooms, six garages, no bathrooms, and half a roof."

by DyeLongJustice on Nov 4, 2009 8:16 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I'll make mincemeat out of that mouse!!!

"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan

by iglew on Nov 4, 2009 11:02 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

i don't buy this

agents like boras don’t show up at negotiations with the latest topps card and say “look, vinnie castilla hit 45 home runs with the rockies.”

the have huge sales brocures that use every available memoriialized tool to show club x WHY Player deserves more money. And All the GMs, even the dumb ones, know playing in Oakland is not the same as Texas.

What they say to the media about “Player can hit you 30 HRs” is just PR bluster.

by Future Ed on Nov 4, 2009 8:23 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Hey, it worked for Frank Thomas
Furthermore, Boras knows that Oakland is not the place for a player to go if he’s looking to rebuild offensive value.

They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick

by mikev on Nov 4, 2009 4:07 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

different than Beltre, however, nobody else wanted Frank Thomas

He signed with us for the minimum, I believe.

Batting 4th for the 2014 San Jose A's: 26-year-old RF Justin Upton, in the 1st season of a nine year, $250M deal.

by notsellingjeans on Nov 4, 2009 4:33 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Are we assuming other teams are incapable of understanding

that put up good numbers in Texas and putting up not-quite-as-good numbers in Oakland are the same thing? You don’t think teams are looking at things like OPS+ and assorted park-adjusted numbers?

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 4, 2009 5:42 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think any teams look at those numbers really

I think its the same and better nerdy numbers that we look at here

by Future Ed on Nov 4, 2009 8:27 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

very true

however, Frank is a Hall of Fame talent. I wouldn’t expect the same out of Beltre.

"You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take.
-Wayne Gretzky"
-Michael Scott

by scatterbrian on Nov 4, 2009 4:34 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Is Chavez insured?

First time post but love the site.
Is Chavez’s contract insured? Can the A’s medically retire him and collect back his salary?
I am thinking of when the O’s did that with Albert Belle a decade ago and ended up saving $30M but somehow kept him on the 40 man roster.

Is there a way this can happen.

by Arsene on Nov 4, 2009 1:54 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Welcome aboard!

"You know, a long time ago being crazy meant something. Nowadays everybody's crazy."

-Charles Manson

by kaweahkaweah on Nov 4, 2009 2:48 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I think the deal is that the A's can medically retire Chavez

but only if they agree to either:

1. have him stuffed
2. mount his head on the wall
3. invoke his living will

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 4, 2009 5:47 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

So, if I understand you correctly, you're suggesting a Chavez death panel, then

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 4, 2009 8:35 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Insurance information is rarely disclosed.

I think it’s likely that there is some sort of policy on Chavez’s contract. Whether the A’s can collect on it (or perhaps already are collecting) depends on the terms of the insurance policy. It’s also possible that Chavez has some sort of insurance policy of his own against career-ending injury. It’s possible that decisions by Chavez or by the team are motivated in part by what counts as a claim on the insurance policy.

There’s a good chance we’ll never know, since they aren’t required to disclose it and probably have no motive to do so. If the team does collect on an insurance policy, it would be a separate reimbursement paid by the insurer to the team. What the team owes to the player would still be paid as normal, so we wouldn’t see it on any of the public records about payroll.

"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan

by iglew on Nov 4, 2009 2:56 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

No one wants to talk about insurance policies because they almost invariably create perverse incentives

If they’re breaching their duties under the insurance contract, publicity makes it much more likely they’ll get sued or grieved over it.

If they’re not breaching their duties, odds are the casual fans (who have no concept of fiduciary duty) will get on them for failing to do so.

It’s a lose-lose situation.

Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving

by PaulThomas on Nov 4, 2009 5:15 PM PST up reply actions   2 recs

Great work, grover. Rec'd.

The service time days work is very time consuming, I know. We appreciate all the time you put in.

I’m gonna have my offseason plan posted by 8 a.m. the morning after the World Series ends, whether that’s tomorrow morning or Friday.

I’m going to attach links in my post to the three A’s offseason plans that I’ve seen written so far at AN since October: yours, Taj’s, and nocal81’s. I’ll also link to Blez’ two-part season-ending interview with Beane about the upcoming offseason.

Batting 4th for the 2014 San Jose A's: 26-year-old RF Justin Upton, in the 1st season of a nine year, $250M deal.

by notsellingjeans on Nov 4, 2009 4:46 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Look forward to it, NSJ.

"Life is a horizontal fall" -Jean Cocteau

by King Richard on Nov 4, 2009 11:02 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Which time zone are you on?

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 5, 2009 4:56 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs


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