Oakland's next Cust plays defense in AFL
by Hang Man on Oct 23, 2009 9:11 AM PDT
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PrintIf Jack Cust, as a Three True Outcome type of player, has a weakness it is his defense. The man is known for his Home runs, Walks, & and Strikeouts. He is also known as a statute with a glove of iron out in the field. But Oakland might have a new Three True Outcome type of player down in the minors, but this one can play defense.
From MLB.com 10/21/09
"Desme turned in his fifth straight multi-hit game, homering in the second and seventh. The former second-rounder has connected in four of his last five games, leads the league with five homers and ranks second with 30 total bases."
He hit another homer again last night. Is Grant Desme the next Jack Cust, plus defense? He is currently playing CF for the Phoenix Desert Dogs down in the AFL. Over the past eight games he leads the league in Strikeouts at 12. That is at a worrisome 34% rate. But he also has the fifth most walks at 5. Finally he leads the league with 6 Home runs. This gives him a .400 / .462 / .971 / 1.433
Over the last three years Cust has K'd 41%, 40%, and 36% of his ABs. Can we live with a 34% K rate from a CF? Does a 34% K rate in the minors always translate to a 42% K rate in the majors? Time will tell.
Desme has only played a total of 145 minor league professional games. In those games he K'd 32% of the time while hitting 33 HRs. Cust has played in 1114 minor league professional games. In those games he K'd 32% of the time while hitting 200 HRs.
I really am enjoying pulling up the box scores for the AFL to check on how Desme is doing. I know the odds of him making it to the majors is poor. For every Jack Cust there are multiple minor league HR hitters who never amounted to much in the majors, such as Calvin Pickering, J.R. Phillips, Graham Koonce, Ivan Cruz, Mike Coolbaugh, Scott McClain, and Chris Hatcher. But could they play defense like Desme?
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No, that is definitely NOT an option on this poll
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
Well
To each his own.
I’m a Desme believer. Anyone who can sit out of professional baseball for almost 2 years, dominate A-Ball, continue to dominate AFL… well, that guy (Desme) has an ability that a lot of others wish they had.
by Colorado Fan on Oct 23, 2009 9:55 AM PDT up reply actions
Yeah... the Raiders to LA
Isn’t exactly a done deal (or even officially int he works) and I hope the A’s play in a new stadium in the Bay Area (San Jose included). So neener neener.
yeah i know i know
but honestly, wouldnt that be the most perfect thing? Either tear down the Colesium and build a new one in the parking lot, or remodel it back to glory and make it a baseball-only park? I cant think about the A’s playing anywhere but there, and you have to think the reason why they keep letting things like Fremont fall over is because the Raiders really are at least thinking about moving. I definitely get the vibe Lew is waiting on the Raiders ownership to see what they want to do. LA already has an insane Raiders fanbase built-in. It makes a lot of sense. The Warriors are also rumored to be moving to SF, that would leave a ton of room to build.
Plus we can officially stop caring about that utterly pathetic franchise and concentrate on the A’s.
Actually
The only plan for keeping the A’s in the Bay Area that I would have trouble getting excited about is keeping them in the coliseum compound. I want a place like Fenway Park of Wrigley Field. An environment with restaurants and bars right around the stadium. Basically, I really wanted Uptown Oakland to happen.
And… the current ownership isn’t banking on or hoping for the A’s being in Oakland at all (with or without the Raiders). In fact, Lew Wolff will be in the South Bay promoting the potential for a stadium in San Jose at the Silicon Valley Chamber of Commerce luncheon on October 26th (Monday).
I'm on the other side of the fence...
I’d hate to see the A’s move into another BS “retro” park.
Doing a complete overhaul/renovation like they did in Kansas City would make me very happy if the Raiders left town.
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Oct 23, 2009 2:56 PM PDT up reply actions
I agree on the retro thing
I hope the new stadium is not a “park” or a “field” but a nicce modern facility that is baseball only. I don’t care where it is.
Sacramento?
or Vegas? would you care then?
Dallas Braden = 209
Gaijin_Suketto = 916
I would love to see the scrappy Sacramento Athletics, with their perpetual $70m payroll, occasional playoff appearances, and slogans like
“Fiercely Small Market!”
and
“Eat The Rich!”
I
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Oct 23, 2009 5:04 PM PDT up reply actions
209 minutes could save you 916% or more on car insurance...
"When you get that nice celebration coming in the dugout, and you're getting your ass hammered by guys, there's no better feeling than to have that done." -Matt Stairs
Much like the Ramones,
everyone on the club will have to change his last name to Eckstein.
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Oct 24, 2009 10:30 PM PDT up reply actions
I am not sure which fence you are talking about
I wasn’t talking about the field dimensions. It could be as circular as it once was for all i care, 330 down the lines, 375 in the gaps and 400 to dead center is fin by me… It’s the area around the stadium that matters to me more than anything.
And I don’t mean to disparage Oakland, or the neighborhoods around the Coliseum for some imagined level of danger (what is it, terrorist threat orange outside of the ballpark?)… I mean to disparage the sea of asphalt around the joint.
I want the baseball themed carnival atmosphere you get on the streets around Fenway on a Monday night!!! But not in Boston, in Oakland or San Jose or Crockett for all I care. And, not in Sacramento, or Las Vegas or Portland.
I prefer the tailgate atmosphere of the asphalt ocean...
I’d rather grill Saag’s and drink Pabst in the parking lot.
How about a mostly symmetrical park with no blatant faux-retro touches,
half surrounded by bars and a vibrant social scene for the upwardly mobile,
and half surrounded by an asphalt sea full of fat people grilling Saag’s and drinking Pabst?
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Oct 23, 2009 5:32 PM PDT up reply actions
and maybe an area in between, for the hipsters to pretend to be working class
without, yknow, having to talk to anyone who is?
As someone who has a nice denim jacket
I would say many hipsters are too poor to own a car with which to tailgate. They do, of course, tend to have other financial priorities – mustache wax, gramaphones, bicycles to show their friends – but I still think they’re mostly working class.
"When you get that nice celebration coming in the dugout, and you're getting your ass hammered by guys, there's no better feeling than to have that done." -Matt Stairs
Fixie-gate?
"Since other people actually read these threads, though, probably best that your particular brand of wrongness not go completely unchallenged." - PT
There are differing opinions on me. According to Iglew "DFA is PT with a sense of humor. PT is DFA with introspective self-doubt. I like them both" but according to sirbed Im "The Stats Killer"
by designatedforassignment on Oct 24, 2009 8:39 PM PDT up reply actions
they can pull bike trailers
like the Food Not Bombs crusties.
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Oct 24, 2009 10:33 PM PDT up reply actions
As a quasi scenester-
I will tell you going to A’s games is not ‘hip’.
The A’s need all the fans they can muster, be they rich, poor, working class, or snooty.
And yeah I would say most hipsters pull in around 15-20k a year, they’re the poor compared to the working class. ;)
Sure, but does that still hold
after you control for age? Hipsters are disproportionately young, and young folk are disproportionately poor.
"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan
How about a stadium (of any sort)
With a nice medium sized park outside of it (say in the outfield) designed specifically for the tail gate scene complete with big ass grills, etc. places of the kiddies to play, maybe even a small view of the game (or the big ass diamond vision as proposed as part of Cisco). Just outside that, you have the bars, restaurants and parking garages within less than a block from the stadium.
CuttheMullet, from "The Thread":
"Whenever I’m about to do something, I think "would an idiot do that?" and if they would, I do not do that thing."
Sounds exactly like Petco in San Diego.
Which is a great ballpark, by the way.
Lay down, black gives way to blue.
Lay down, I'll remember you.
and hot pants!
"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan
Okay, the usherettes can wear hot pants,
and the hitters can enter to music from Sacramento bands.
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Oct 24, 2009 10:39 PM PDT up reply actions
See, I sort of think that is the plan in San Jose
Behind Left Field a “mixed use” district.
Behind the first base side a public park. That park would be much cooler than the sea of asphalt, but just as viable as a barbecuing station.
The point I was making, somewhat obliquely I admit,
is that there is almost no chance that Desme is a 4th outfielder. If he’s good enough to make the majors, he’ll likely be good enough to start.
If, as I suspect, he flames out once he gets to leagues where pitchers can throw offspeed for strikes, then he will also not be playing a 4th outfielder role.
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
This
Brown and Desme are all or nothing players.
Also, I’ve always maintained that it’s borderline pointless to evaluate Desme until he gets to higher levels of MilB (and subsequently face better offspeed stuff). Which is why I’m not salivating over his AFL numbers (which have questionable use by themselves) no matter how tempting it may be.
"We were shit, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."
by lenscrafters on Oct 23, 2009 1:32 PM PDT up reply actions
Of course not.
You helped him make it.
Sock puppets have never been able to successfully attack castles. -Nevermoor
by Leopold Bloom on Oct 23, 2009 3:19 PM PDT up reply actions
I have high hopes too,
but have a lot of trouble focusing on them…
…mostly because I am high
now you see my dilemma…
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Oct 23, 2009 5:33 PM PDT up reply actions
I have trouble focusing on --
woah, now THAT is a shiny —
I wonder what’s on TV tonight.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
I could easily seem his as a platoon bat
and anyway, it seems as likely as anything else that he’ll be good enough to put up something like .220/.290/.450 which would be 4th OFer territory—-or useful platoon bat territory.
With stout hearts, and with enthusiasm for the contest, let us go forward to victory. ----Hero Defector Montgomery
All of which is to say, Chris Young is in fact a 4th OFer
starting for a very bad team.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Well said.
I am more optimistic that he will hit, but totally agree with the all or nothing concept.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
That's an option the poll needs.
I question whether Desme will stick at CF, but if he can manage to bring this kind of hitting to the major leagues, I’d be thrilled to have him with non-terrible defense in LF or RF.
"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan
How is he the next Cust?
You do realize, Jack Cust can’t run or play any defense, and the Jack Cust is a natural 1B, and the Jack Cust probably has never hit over .280 at any level in his life? The only comparison is K’s.
K’s are overrated, an out is an out. You don’t hit into double plays with K’s. The only real thing I find different is moving runners over, and Sac Flies. Other than that its just another out.
I'm the genius who said Chris Carter will slug .650 his rookie season.
I don't think Cust is a natural anything in the field
You have to include smiley faces - Poppy
;- ) :- ) :-O : -> : -] : -}
agreed
I'm the genius who said Chris Carter will slug .650 his rookie season.
by JamesCaprio on Oct 23, 2009 10:59 AM PDT up reply actions
he works very very hard
just to be where he’s at.
If Cust were lazy, he wouldn’t be in the major leagues as well as founding one of the nation’s premier baseball schools and training facilities…
He’d be coaching girls’ softball and drinking himself to sleep at night over what might have been.
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Oct 23, 2009 2:58 PM PDT up reply actions
whoa...
I never said that Cust is lazy. It isn’t an issue of working hard, he just not a good defensive player. You can work as hard as you want, but there is a level that it doesn’t matter how hard you work, you just can’t get there. Not everybody can be an Ozzie Smith or Omar Vizquel.
As for the premier baseball schools, I don’t know about that. So many pros have them, and there are thousands of them across the country that I don’t look into it much.
I'm the genius who said Chris Carter will slug .650 his rookie season.
I'm sorry if I implied that you said Cust is lazy,
because you totally didn’t say that.
I just wanted to emphasize his work ethic, which is mighty.
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Oct 23, 2009 5:34 PM PDT up reply actions
Jack Cust is indeed mighty
100% Athletics, 100% Baseball. 2009 Athletics, 40% Baseball.
The post was designed for discussion, but since your asking me directly...
I think I covered Cust’s “ability” to play defense in the post. As far as hitting over .280
Cust hit .306 in 1997, .345 in 1998, .334 in 1999, .293 in 2000, .285 in 2003, .293 in 2006, and an even .300 in 2007.
I thought about a title like “Desme could be a good fourth outfielder who hits for power, plays above average defense, could steal a few bases, and strike out often.” but it just didn’t roll of the tongue.
The real goal of the post is to share with those who have not read the box scores just how interesting a season, and start to the AFL, Desme is having. I also hoped to foster a discussion as to whether a minor league player who K’s 32% of the time can make an impact in to the majors.
Can't run?
Four stolen bases in five attempts, baby!
"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan
Cust hit .286/.429/.518 in his minor league career and hasn’t played 1B since 1998.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take.
-Wayne Gretzky"
-Michael Scott
by scatterbrian on Oct 26, 2009 10:40 AM PDT up reply actions
I don't think K's are overrated
How often do you see double plays? People who K all the time don’t advance the runner, no sacrifice flies, and don’t “push the issue” by putting the ball in play (i.e. hit and run, forcing errors, etc…). There is a reason Cincinatti (and soon Washington) got rid of Dunn, and why Dave Kingman is not a hall of famer.
On another note, why aren’t I seeing Carter in any box scores in Mexico, is he injured?
Well, I think you could make that initial argument in both directions
How often is a productive out the key component to scoring a run. I haven’t done extensive research but I imagine at least a significant portion of the time when a runner moves up a base on a productive out he still ends up stranded or scores in a situation where he would have scored even if he hadn’t moved up a base (ie. multiple hits in the inning, HR).
This also doesn’t factor in that a walk is way more productive than an out in just about every situation. I don’t dispute the point that a productive out is better than a strike out, but that the actual value of a productive out is so small as to be outweighed by small amounts of better production in other areas.
Dunn being a career .249 hitter,
who averages some 170 very unproductive strikeouts a year, it’s a miracle Cincinnati didn’t get rid of him sooner. Probably kept him around for his defense, he does have a .975 career fielding percentage, after all.
To be hit by Moriyama's fastball is an honor exceeded only by being crushed under the wheels of the imperial carriage
Huh?
How often do you see double plays?
I don’t know what sport you’re watching, but I expect to see one every time I watch a baseball game. Which is emphatically NOT true of sacrifice flies.
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
More than double as many
On an average there were .78 GiDPs and .29 SF per game in MLB last year
To be hit by Moriyama's fastball is an honor exceeded only by being crushed under the wheels of the imperial carriage
You got the decimal point wrong
I watch the A’s and I can confirm that on average there are 78 GiDPs per game.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Kendall and Crosby are gone, Nico.
It’s more like 75 now.
Lay down, black gives way to blue.
Lay down, I'll remember you.
CROSBY'S GONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It can’t be repeated enough.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
walks can advance runners too
and they don’t cost outs!
"You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take.
-Wayne Gretzky"
-Michael Scott
by scatterbrian on Oct 26, 2009 10:58 AM PDT up reply actions
I thought Jack Cust + good OF defense + SBs = Grady Sizemore
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
No, Nick. Cust is not nearly as hot.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
any time she see's Cust up to bat
my girlfriend’s reaction is “he looks like he just wants to eat the baseball!”
qotm
bring it back!
100% Athletics, 100% Baseball. 2009 Athletics, 40% Baseball.
That's what I said
SB=“sexy buns”.
"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s
Question
Is the concern over Desme’s strikeouts in the minors that they’ll carry over to the big leagues and that’ll make him an awful player because strikeouts are bad? Or is it that they’re indicative of a player who will struggle in other aspects of the game when he gets to the majors?
I, for one, wouldn’t mind a player who struck out that much if he continues to hit home runs, get on base, steal bases and play defense. Basically, much much better than Jack Cust.
It's the latter question
It’s difficult to sustain high BABIPs in the majors because the fielders are really good. So if you strike out a ton, odds are your batting average will be low, which in turn drags down slugging and OBP.
It’s not impossible to post very high BABIP in the majors, but it’s not likely, so players whose minor league “skills” are largely in that area are worse prospects than guys whose skills carry over better to the majors.
Once you’re actually IN the majors, an out is basically an out.
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
I'm optimistic about Desme
His skill set reminds me of Jayson Werth. And nobody should care about strikeouts as long as you can hit for power and walk 70-75 times per year.
Taking the contrary point of view...
While I love the promise young shinny prospects bring, my fear for Desme is that he does not have the patience and / or plate discipline, nor the high OBP that Cust displayed in the minors.
Cust OBP in minors: .429
Desme OBP in minors: .365
MiLB stats: avg obp slg ops HR% 2B% R% RBI% SB%
C Pickering .299 .410 .550 .960 0.22 0.20 0.62 0.76 0.02
Jack J. Cust .286 .429 .518 .947 0.18 0.22 0.71 0.63 0.05
Josh Hamilton .292 .340 .472 .812 0.13 0.25 0.62 0.63 0.17
G Sizemore .289 .377 .411 .788 0.05 0.18 0.63 0.47 0.18
Grant Desme .286 .365 .557 .922 0.23 0.23 0.73 0.67 0.29
Chris Hatcher .281 .337 .509 .846 0.19 0.19 0.55 0.65 0.07
What can you make of these comparisons? No compared player had the speed Desme is producing. Is there a comp for this combination of power and speed?
just looking at that
I wonder if people would like Cust more if he called himself JJ Cust?
by bobnothing on Oct 23, 2009 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Reminds me more of Wladimir Balentien... I've been burned by this kind of prospect before
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
Whatever happened to Wlad?
Is he still in Tacoma? I remember when the folks up here were saying there was no room in the organization for both him AND Adam Jones. Huh?
(Admittedly, the 2009 Mariners roster has three or four guys who can play better CF defense than Jones, but still … Adam Jones.)
"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan
He was designated for assignment and then traded for peanuts to Cincinnati
Linda's in the cold ground, won't see her anymore
Somewhere out on the highway tonight, the drunken engines roar
It's just one of those things, one of those things
-- Al Stewart, "Accident on 3rd St."
In memory of Nick Adenhart and all victims of drunk driving
How's peanuts doing?
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
because it's a Charlie Brown Kwanzaa!
"Flea Markets aren't just for blind dates anymore!"- The Reverend Billy Lard
by Gaijin_Suketto on Oct 23, 2009 3:08 PM PDT up reply actions
Option A or Option B
Would you rather have a player that was healthy, but poor performance finally figure it out after a couple seasons and dominate a lower level league. Or missing w/ injury, finally healthy and showing the talent that considered them a late 1st rd pick type. Basically we had no clue if desme was returning or not, he couldve been another snyder, sullivan, robnett, etc. IMO despite his flaws as a hitter any value they get out of him is a bonus even if it might be a 4th OF type/platoon situation eventually. A’s have been on their never ending quest for legit RH power,. which explained the holliday/hairston trades (whether they overpaid or not), even a lesser extent with getting players like murton, kielty too. So maybe desme can fill that role by 2011 or so if he progresses.
Chris Carter?
"Life is a horizontal fall" -Jean Cocteau
by King Richard on Oct 23, 2009 2:44 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
AFL Desme UPDATE!
Desme is 3-4 today with another HR. One walk and no K’s. That is 7 HR in 9 games.
What do you make of this guy?!
he's Christ incarnate.
Sock puppets have never been able to successfully attack castles. -Nevermoor
by Leopold Bloom on Oct 23, 2009 4:57 PM PDT up reply actions
Well, if the Outfield ever floods that could come in handy.
by Hang Man on Oct 23, 2009 5:29 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Too bad the A's are incapable of making a prophet.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
alol
(actually laughed out loud)
"Life is a horizontal fall" -Jean Cocteau
by King Richard on Oct 23, 2009 7:40 PM PDT up reply actions
All lols should be alols
If you don’t alol, you shouldn’t say “lol” at all.
"Go ahead and overachieve, you scrappy Brett-Favre-colored walk-takers." —Rev Halofan
lol
They call their best player "Kung Fu Panda" and they complain that people aren’t taking them or the game seriously enough? -Nick
The report was in error
Desme is listed as a CF on the Dogs’ roster but he’s been playing in the OF corners during the games.
The monster at the end of this blog.
I checked the box scores and you raise a valid point, sort of...
Desme started CF on opening day. In the nine games played he spent three games in LF, three games in CF, and three games in RF. For what it is worth.
Desme just hi another bomb (hr # 8)
nintendo desme is on fire
He is really loving that Arizona weather
It is a hitter’s league that will augment power numbers but if we can take anything away from this small sample size is that it seems pretty likely that power is a legitmate plus tool for Desme.
It’s really going to come down to contact for him. When he makes contact with the ball it goes a long way, and that is a good thing.
Desme 2-3 so far today
Hr to left. Line single to left. Line out to SS.
I think he leads the team in BA, HR and RBIs now. OPS over 1.500.
Even if he doesn’t make it at higher levels, he is fun to watch now. Its been a while since I’ve seen anyone hit like this in any league for any period of time.
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