How do we project players/shameles advertising
How do we project players?
Most of you know about projection systems like PECOTA, ZiPS, CHONE, or Marcel that attempt to predict how a player will perform in the future. If you're a fantasy junkie or a rosterbator, that stuff is a must. If you like hanging out at AN and discussing who to sign, who to trade, and who to DFA into oblivion, having projections around can be helpful.
Projections typically rely on mathematical formulations, and while each projection system is different, most of them have the same inner workings:
- compile stats from the past few years, weighting the most recent stats most heavily.
- regress to the mean.
Projections systems differ in the details: which stats they use as for inputs, how the weights are assigned, whether league and park adjustments are made, which mean they regress toward, etc.
There's a second critical bit about projecting player performances: our eyes. Objective information, even if it is not quantified, can help us make determinations about players. The classic example is injuries. Tim Hudson is projected to have a 4.06 ERA in 150 IP by Marcel, but Marcel doesn't know that Huddy just had Tommy John surgery on his throwing elbow. Sometimes pitchers add a new pitch. Sometimes batters change their mechanics. Sometimes these things can change a player's performance level, and sometimes they don't. It is worth at least thinking about what non-statistical objective information is useful.
That's why I think The Hardball Times 2009 Season Preview is a great book. In addition to over 1000 player projections and all 30 team projections, you get awesome commentary on players and teams. The projections are done by smart analysts. The commentary is written by fans who live and die with their team's every pitch. Jeff Sullivan wrote the Mariners chapter. Justin Inaz wrote about the Reds. It's like an all-star roster of bloggers and fans.
Oh yeah, I wrote the A's chapter.
Here's what the book's editor, David Gassko, has to say:
This is the third year we’ve done this book, and it’s the third year that I can honestly say we’ve surpassed my every expectation. I know my opinion is biased, but our writers have done a fantastic job covering every aspect of the upcoming season.
The projections include all the regular statistics you might expect, plus fielding ratings, three-year projections, a reliability score, projected fantasy values, and depth charts. In other words, no matter what you’re using these projections for, we have you covered.
The book also includes a review of 100 players by an injury expert, commentary on rookies to watch for, and - for the fantasy players - an essay on managing risk in your fantasy draft. Purchasers receive not only the book, but access to a spreadsheet with over 2600 projections.
So I come to you, hat in hand, asking you to consider purchasing what I consider to be the essential pre-season guide to the 2009 baseball season. Your purchase supports THT, which - in my opinion - is the best free baseball site on the internet.
If you do want to buy the book, consider purchasing it directly from ACTA instead of from Amazon. If you purchase it from Amazon, the six bucks you save comes directly out of THT's cut. If you do purchase from amazon, consider donating part of your savings back to THT from the PayPal link at the bottom right of our homepage.
And if you've made it this far, I'll give you a sneak peak at some Oakland projections for next year:
Devine: 3.08 ERA
Duke: 3.82 ERA
Ziegler: 4.41 ERA
Gallagher: 4.49 ERA
Cust: .893 OPS
Giambi: .875 OPS
Barton: .737 OPS
Crosby: .635 OPS
0 recs |
69 comments
Comments
It's a good book.
In the fake online baseball league that I am vice-commish of (speaking of shamless promotions), we have a Secret Santa gift exchange every year. I got it for the guy I drew last year and he really liked the book.
by mikev on Jan 27, 2009 9:43 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Will you buy me one?
I'm here to talk about the past.
by 67MARQUEZ on Jan 27, 2009 10:49 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I think I'll pony up, but here's another THT gem
It’s over there today— an analysis of first pitch fastballs.
A’s have no one on any top or Bottom 10 list— with one very prominent exception. No one on Top 10 of getting 1st pitch FB, not getting them, swinging at them, not swinging at them (!), highest batting average, lowest, lowest slugging average.
The one exception is the guy with the highest slugging average when he swings at First Pitch FBs in all the ML— Jack Cust.
by windyfelix on Jan 27, 2009 10:36 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Well, sure
The only time he ever swings at a first pitch FB is when it’s a meatball down the middle… players tend to do a lot of damage when they hit those…
Many years from now, when his name's recalled
Everyone will say, "He should have passed the ball"
-- Al Stewart, "Football Hero"
by PaulThomas on Jan 27, 2009 10:42 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I think we have our first Law of this offseason
The TINSTAAP-Cust-First-Pitch-Swinging-Delusion (TCFPSD): the idea that, if something good (bad) happens in a small sample, simply increasing the sample by an order of magnitude will make it BETTER! (WORSE!)
A B -3X = Swedish girls like chocolate @('.')@
by monkeyball on Jan 27, 2009 10:53 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Actually, this law works well for chocolate chip cookies
If the first cookie in the sample is good . . .
Ask Joe Blanton, he knows all about this.
For fans, there should be a world drinking classic. Oh, wait, that's AN Day.
by eastcoasta'sfan on Jan 27, 2009 1:10 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Wasn't there a section in Moneyball about this?
Wasn’t it related to Scott Hatteberg hitting something like .400 on the first pitch of an at bat, and being asked why he didn’t swing at the first pitch more often?
by mikev on Jan 27, 2009 1:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
IIRC
Isn’t that why Boston didn’t want to keep him? They had this one stat and kept throwing it at him as an example of why he shouldn’t be patient at the plate.
"Camelot sure fell apart, didn't it?"-Steve McCatty
by 5Aces on Jan 27, 2009 1:18 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
you guys said it, I didn't need to
But obviously when I found this bit of data, I instantly thought “this shows how right Cust is to be patient” as opposed to “why doesn’t he hack more at the first pitch?”
by windyfelix on Jan 27, 2009 3:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
ah, right, yes
A B -3X = Swedish girls like chocolate @('.')@
by monkeyball on Jan 27, 2009 1:39 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
especially when they have a lot of power
Cust swinging for the fences on first pitch fastball = good
Same scenario, but inserting Crosby (or to prove a point, Jason Kendall, Eckstein, insert someone else with less power than a dead battery) = warning track flyball
"I'm on hold for now"- Bobby Crosby
by DyeLongJustice on Jan 27, 2009 12:53 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
If it's anything like the Annual, it'll be fantastic
I haven’t read any of the previous Season Previews, but I love my 2009 Annual.
by JLeverenz on Jan 27, 2009 10:40 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
I think you're overpromising here
no matter what you’re using these projections for …
A B -3X = Swedish girls like chocolate @('.')@
by monkeyball on Jan 27, 2009 10:48 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Sold.
Look forward to reading Salb
Bring back Hammer.
by OaktownPower on Jan 27, 2009 10:50 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Thanks!
I know money is tight these days, so we appreciate it.
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
by salb918 on Jan 27, 2009 11:15 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Yea, but looks like a solid read, esp for fantasy drafts upcoming
I like your work on the site so I imagine I will find some gems in the book.
Bring back Hammer.
by OaktownPower on Jan 27, 2009 12:54 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Can Sal have $6?
A B -3X = Swedish girls like chocolate @('.')@
by monkeyball on Jan 27, 2009 10:54 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
hm, i wonder if i should make our book group read this
it’s my turn next.
i was going to go the ‘the damned utd’ (the film’s out soon, Clough fans!), but i think this might work just as well as a counter to having to have waded through six hundred pages of Naomi Klein
when did we stop using adverbs proper?
by alea iacta est on Jan 27, 2009 11:09 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
"The Damned United" is currently working its way to the top of my pile.
Is it as good as I’ve heard ?
by green star oakland on Jan 27, 2009 11:13 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
i haven't read it yet
but i hear it’s pretty great. if you like that sort of thing.
when did we stop using adverbs proper?
by alea iacta est on Jan 27, 2009 12:38 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I bought it in 2006 and 2007
And was, honestly, a little bit disappointed. There were some good essays, but much of the books looked like they were simply printed right off the web site.
There are enough good writers involved that I’ll give it another try this year.
by Danny on Jan 27, 2009 11:29 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
1st Projections book I buy in my life
and I wouldn’t mine having another one for this season, or maybe another moneyball like baseball book, so any suggestions are welcome, pls hehe
Clear its radiance shine...
by ATarHeel on Jan 27, 2009 12:27 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Depends on what you're looking for
If you want a stat book, by The Book by Tom Tango and others. If you want a comedic book by Fantasyland (though I can’t remember who it’s by). A good history one is The Soul of Baseball by Joe Posnaski. Aces is a good read if you want a little blast of the good times for the A’s.
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
by vignette17 on Jan 27, 2009 1:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
buy Fantasyland
"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton
by vignette17 on Jan 27, 2009 1:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
by Sam Walker
Great and hilarious book!
by HigherPie on Jan 27, 2009 2:54 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
All very solid reccomendations
I feel these are all the top books of each of its respective classes, all excellently written.
Can't get enough of the Oakland A's? Visit Oaktown Awesomer's
by iamawesomer on Jan 27, 2009 3:30 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I think this title should include shamelesS, not shameles...but i could be wrong
"I'm on hold for now"- Bobby Crosby
by DyeLongJustice on Jan 27, 2009 12:56 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
He can't afford a copy editor...unless you buy his book ;-)
Seriously, it sounds interesting. I may spring for a copy of it!
by GreenNGoldSooner on Jan 27, 2009 1:03 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Shameles
the guiltiest Mexican food ever.
"Man is conceived in sin and born in corruption and he passeth from the stink of the didie to the stench of the shroud." Willie Stark
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Jan 27, 2009 1:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Shemales

Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
by salb918 on Jan 27, 2009 1:20 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Well I'm not dumb but I can't understand
Why she walks like Jack Cust with stats like Farhan.
"Man is conceived in sin and born in corruption and he passeth from the stink of the didie to the stench of the shroud." Willie Stark
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Jan 27, 2009 1:32 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
now that's what I call a couplet!
A B -3X = Swedish girls like chocolate @('.')@
by monkeyball on Jan 27, 2009 1:37 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
PECOTA
P-E-C-O-T-A
A B -3X = Swedish girls like chocolate @('.')@
by monkeyball on Jan 27, 2009 1:47 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I stole home just a week before
But I never ever hit a homer before
Giambi smiled, took me by the hand
He said, “Rajai I’m going to make you a man!”
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
by salb918 on Jan 27, 2009 2:00 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
and taking it in an entirely different directon altogether ...
Well I’m not the world’s most physical guy
But when he squeezed me tight he nearly broke my spine
Oh my Macha
M-A-C-H-A

A B -3X = Swedish girls like chocolate @('.')@
by monkeyball on Jan 27, 2009 2:24 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Macha = "Mister Pleasant"
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Jan 27, 2009 3:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I bought the book last year...
and I also have the Bill James 2009 handbook…But I am not going to buy this year it unless Sal fixes the title!
by IM4Oakgal on Jan 27, 2009 5:13 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Projections
What is the margin of error for team projections? Is it a number of games or measured as a percentage? It seems like if teams are within 2 games of each other or so, they can be seen as “too close to project,” like the elections.
by greenpaddedgloves on Jan 27, 2009 1:20 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Just based on luck alone (not accounting for errors in the projections themselves),
I would say that two teams within 6 projected wins of each other are “too close to call.” That’s the margin of error for teams winning to their pythagorean projection.
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
by salb918 on Jan 27, 2009 1:25 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Hey salb918
does the book have any pictures? I read the sample page and it was good but I always find baseball pictures in season previews make it more interesting. i guess I’m simple like that, makes me wonder why I’m considering buying a book written by statheads.
You have to include smiley faces - Poppy
;- ) :- ) :-O : -> : -] : -}
by micdog2001 on Jan 27, 2009 1:30 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Apparently there are, but they may not be the pictures you’re looking for …
A B -3X = Swedish girls like chocolate @('.')@
by monkeyball on Jan 27, 2009 1:35 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
i was hoping for a coloring book
do you have me one of those?
"I'm on hold for now"- Bobby Crosby
by DyeLongJustice on Jan 27, 2009 2:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
An A's coloring book?
SWEET!
reminds me of that old A’s program with Canseco as a superhero.
You have to include smiley faces - Poppy
;- ) :- ) :-O : -> : -] : -}
by micdog2001 on Jan 27, 2009 4:15 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
It has cartoons interspersed.
But no pictures of actual baseball being played. Sorry!
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
by salb918 on Jan 27, 2009 2:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
oooo cartoons!
: -)
You have to include smiley faces - Poppy
;- ) :- ) :-O : -> : -] : -}
by micdog2001 on Jan 27, 2009 4:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Doubtful
Most of you know about projection systems like PECOTA, ZiPS, CHONE, or Marcel that …
I’m pretty sure that most of don’t.
"Dispatch knuckleheadedness with Bond-like aplomb." –74mk
by iglew on Jan 27, 2009 1:45 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Acronym/word association time:
PECOTA → Petco
ZiPS → zipper
CHONE → Figgins
Marcel → Ross’s monkey in “Friends”
by whiteshoes40 on Jan 27, 2009 3:44 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
for some reason
i always associate PECOTA with the organization (PETA) that was up in arms against Michael Vick for dog fighting. i’m pretty sure PECOTAS predictions on Vick don’t speak too highly of his talent
"I'm on hold for now"- Bobby Crosby
by DyeLongJustice on Jan 27, 2009 5:08 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I refuse to use projection systems
that are based on breast milk
Save Rajai Davis
by oakinboston on Jan 28, 2009 6:15 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
mmm tasty
"I'm on hold for now"- Bobby Crosby
by DyeLongJustice on Jan 29, 2009 7:04 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
CHONE and Marcel are deliberate puns on those topics
Many years from now, when his name's recalled
Everyone will say, "He should have passed the ball"
-- Al Stewart, "Football Hero"
by PaulThomas on Jan 27, 2009 6:43 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
...which goes to show exactly how little I know about this stuff.
by whiteshoes40 on Jan 27, 2009 7:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
You're not alone.
Marcel→ Top Chef guy who damn near got his head shaved.
"You have to score to win"~Rickey Henderson
by lynnzgal on Jan 27, 2009 8:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
L. O. L.
"I'm on hold for now"- Bobby Crosby
by DyeLongJustice on Jan 29, 2009 7:04 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Mine:
PECOTA → Dakota
ZiPS → PEZ
CHONE → Figgins, naturally
Marcel → Marceau
by oblique on Jan 27, 2009 10:46 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
mine (and many dudes)
pecota→ boobs
Zips→ boobs
CHONE→ figgins (learn to spell, and boobs also come to mind)
Marcel→ boobs
"True fact: In a global thermonuclear war, the only human who would survive would be David Eckstein" -PT
by travdog6 on Jan 28, 2009 1:24 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Marcel makes you think of boobs?
I don’t know, dude…
by oblique on Jan 28, 2009 9:16 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
CHONE---->Fig Newtons
"I'm on hold for now"- Bobby Crosby
by DyeLongJustice on Jan 29, 2009 7:05 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
sham-what advertising?

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
by xbhaskarx on Jan 27, 2009 5:21 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
OK, we totally need an A's Sham-Wow! Night
RALLY SHAM-WOW!
A B -3X = Swedish girls like chocolate @('.')@
by monkeyball on Jan 27, 2009 6:24 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
you following me, camera guy?
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
by xbhaskarx on Jan 27, 2009 10:24 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I think that shamele is a real shamazel
m*****f***ing c***s***ing peanut butter and jelly!! f*** f*** f***!!!
by JediLeroy on Jan 27, 2009 9:47 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
But Hasenfeffer rules!
We’re gonna do it!
"You have to score to win"~Rickey Henderson
by lynnzgal on Jan 27, 2009 10:00 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I kind of doubt Ziggy will have a 4.41 ERA,
just because of how he’ll likely be used. I imagine if he struggles, the stat that will show it most is a disappointing “inherited runners” percentage, not such a high ERA.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
by Nico on Jan 27, 2009 5:50 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
If Zigs has a 4.41 ERA
and assuming his FIP is somewhere around there, he isn’t going to be worth much at all as a reliever. While he was incredibly lucky last year, and he started to regress at the end of the year, I can’t see him having an ERA above 4. I’m going to go in on a limb here, but I think he’ll have a mid-3 ERA.
"I'm on hold for now"- Bobby Crosby
by DyeLongJustice on Jan 29, 2009 7:07 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
his regression had a lot to do with his stuff getting worse
towards the end of the year, his pitches seemed to have much less movement than they did at the time of his callup. to me, the question is has he re-found his release point and he maintain that and his movement for the entire year. if he can, id guess around 2.85
"True fact: In a global thermonuclear war, the only human who would survive would be David Eckstein" -PT
by travdog6 on Jan 30, 2009 1:44 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs























