B. Abreu

by UniqueDefiance on Jan 10, 2009 11:56 AM PST Comment 60 comments

I know we have a crowded Outfield but I am not sold on Buck, I think he is a far better option then departing Emil Brown, but I would rather want Abreu. He will draw a big contract, but with declining demands, he can be had for a fair price.

Even though Abreu's power has been declining since the home run derby crown win, he is exactly what beane and the A's are all about with an addition occasional stolen bases. His presence behind Chavy or Holliday and replace buck with Sweeney in the batting order would give us that edge offensively.

1.Sweeney 2.Suzuki 3.Giambi 4.Holliday 5.Cust 6.Chavez 7.Abreu 8.Ellis 9. Crosby

I hope we can find someone else besides Crosby for SS and hope Cust won't strike out as much like last year.

Thanks for looking

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if

they did get Abreu, I don’ think he’d hit 7th. Probably 5th or 6th.

They've done studies, you know. 60% of the time it works, every time.

by what_the_crap on Jan 10, 2009 12:02 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

I think they'd either bat him 2nd or 5th.

The question would be who would play where? Giambi at 1B? Abreu at 1B? Cust at DH? Abreu at DH? Cust in the OF?

If we did get Abreu, I would think the lineup would look more like;

Sweeney
Cust
Giambi
Holliday
Abreu
Chavez
Ellis
Suzuki
Shortstop

Granted, that is a LOT of Lefty’s in a row, but also a lot of good hitters.

facepalm.jpg

by Zonis on Jan 10, 2009 12:08 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I'd say bat Abreu second all the way

But I don’t want the A’s to sign him. Buck’s defense is far better, his slugging pct / HR power possibly now equal (Buck has slugged well through thick and thin), his speed better, his contract cheaper, and his future brighter. Plan B is Cunningham, plan C Denorfia (Sweeney to RF), and plan D Cust in the OF full time with Barton at 1B and Giambi DH, so there are plenty of good fall-back options should Buck falter.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 10, 2009 12:13 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

kinda adding to what I was already thinking here Nico.

by mrod on Jan 10, 2009 12:18 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

yeah

i’d much rather have them go SS than Abreu. OF’s not an issue right now.

They've done studies, you know. 60% of the time it works, every time.

by what_the_crap on Jan 10, 2009 12:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

his speed better...

What? Abreu stole 22 bases last year and 25 the year before, Buck stole 1.

by dougald1 on Jan 10, 2009 12:35 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Stolen Bases is not a good indication of speed

because you choose to get SB’s, they don’t just come naturally.

Abreu has always stolen a lot of bases in his career. He likes to steal bases, and his teams encourage him to do so.

The A’s do not, so Buck, who was injured, didn’t.

But we can SEE Buck’s speed. We can see it when he fly’s around the bases for triples. We can see it in the outfield.

facepalm.jpg

by Zonis on Jan 10, 2009 12:45 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

One triple...

Buck had one triple…

I do not wish to be difficult, but ….with a statement “his speed better”. Ok Buck is on the A’s and the do not steal much. And Buck was hurt.

by dougald1 on Jan 10, 2009 1:07 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

like you said, he was hurt

and sb and triples are not a good indication of speed.

"My group runs some frogloks down the hall to finish them off and POP! RASTER! If there was a way to scream louder than caps in EQ I was doing it. Man I am straight panicking because I know I have NO CHANCE soloing and the party has run off. I'm in my hotel room; it's like 5am, and I am straight hollering, in EQ and in real life. Bottom line is the group comes back, heals me, and kills Raster! WOOT!" -Curt Schilling on his favorite memories in the video game "EverQuest"

by travdog6 on Jan 10, 2009 1:54 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

also

abreu got caught stealing 11 times, so clearly he’s not that fast. he’s also declining, horrendous on defense, and would block younger players from geting playing time.

by travdog6 on Jan 10, 2009 1:57 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Abreu is also turning 35 in March

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 10, 2009 2:50 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Grrrr.

"When I was a kid, having someone correct your grammar was a sign that they cared and wanted you to present yourself in the best possible light. That being said, you should really learn the difference between plurals and possessives." -- RS

by oblique on Jan 10, 2009 7:09 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

You have to actually

play for your speed to be good. Not sold on Buck at all…he is too often injured and not on the field. Abreu is a proven hitter and a good base stealer. Let Buck prove himself in AAA for another year.

by IM4Oakgal on Jan 10, 2009 3:03 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Hmm...Buck is 25

Keep in mind that in a year more horrific than anyone could have conjured up in their most alcoholic nightmares, Buck produced a slugging pct of .432. His rookie year, when everything rolled right, it was .474. If that’s the range of his ability to slug in the big leagues, he is going to pretty good whether he hits .240 or .280.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 10, 2009 3:12 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

It may be that the .474

was a fluke or that other reasons may have inflated his stats. If we have a shot at a proven player then I can see no good reason not to jump in that direction. If Buck proves that he can do it this year then play him…it seems to me that having some depth in the field is a great situation to be in. I kinda liked it in football when the Niners had Montana,Young and Bono.

by IM4Oakgal on Jan 10, 2009 3:20 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah. It was too bad about that tree.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 10, 2009 4:11 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Again...

I think the A’s would be better served signing a Sheets and/or trading for a Hardy, while not gutting the farm. Areu is a luxury for a team that actually has more money to spend and I think the A’s need to choose how they spend their remaining funds wisely, friends. Don’t get me wrong, Abreu is still a decent player but he is not a pressing need for this team. I’d rather stick with T-Buck and Sweeney, with Cust being the other outfielder-DH.

by mrod on Jan 10, 2009 12:16 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

abreu is much more than decent

nothing against sweeney/buck but they have proven nothing yet other than a good stretch of 400ab’s with some durability issues.
if abreu can be had for a burrell typee contract or less that seems doable from the A’s end. when holliday is a goner, nothings wrong with having giambi/abreu remain around for an extra yr or two. i’d like hardy, but they’d likely want cahill or anderson, plus ive heard no west coast teams on sheets.

anyways it looks like abreu is still looking for big money. if so then target cabrera (nothing more than 6-7mill/yr) and a couple lower tier fa’s or trades.

Fay suggests Bobby Abreu might fill some team needs. According to Jocketty, “He’s still looking for a big contract,” and thus, Jocketty says he’s “not sure he’s a fit.”

by Asfan4ever723 on Jan 10, 2009 12:32 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I'd rather see them sign Sheets too.

But if they can’t get Sheets …Abreu would be a definite plus.

by IM4Oakgal on Jan 10, 2009 3:04 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I don't think so, only because Cust AND Giambi are already signed

Playing two of Cust, Giambi, and Abreu in the field would be a big problem on a team whose defense already lacks a plus CFer or currently a plus SS.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 10, 2009 3:13 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Well, yeah sure

it would be better if the As can get Hardy without gutting the farm. Why do you believe that they can do so? Keep in mind that Hardy has value not just to the Brewers and the As. If the Brewers decide to actively trade him, practically every team in MLB, with the exception of a few, are going to be interested.

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on Jan 10, 2009 8:06 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

This is Moneyball full-circle if you think about it.

Before, OBP/SLG were undervalued.

Then Moneyball came out, and OBP/SLG became overvalued.

Now OBP/SLG is severely undervalued.

SO LETS LOAD UP =]

facepalm.jpg

by Zonis on Jan 10, 2009 12:28 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

if, as you claim

you would rather want Abreu, then go ahead and want him already! Nobody is stopping you as far as I can tell.

One of the key features of the Giambi signing was that we could shift the Cust-Giambi duo between DH-1B and OF-DH depending on how Barton and Outfielder #3 are playing. In the decent likelihood, therefore, that one of those 2 positions is not producing well, then you get a decent upgrade in Giambi.

If you add Abreu to this equation, you’ve now locked your positions (Giambi=1B, Cust&Abreu = DH&OF) and the chances are greater that the improvement will be pretty marginal.

Finally, you have to take defense into account here. I think it is very wide open for debate how much the A’s (or we as fans) should value putting up a good defense behind our young pitchers, but what is not open for debate is that adding Abreu pushes us farther into the FUGLY range with Giambi cemented down at 1B.

Save Rajai Davis

by oakinboston on Jan 10, 2009 12:44 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

And that doesn't even consider that CF is a big question mark defensively

Putting Cust or Abreu side by side with Sweeney or Buck in CF would be a real problem.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 10, 2009 2:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I don't think it would really be a question mark

you know it’s gonna suck

"It's like déjà vu all over again." -yogi berra

by Cheezombie on Jan 10, 2009 5:15 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

The question mark part

is “Could I make it through the season without barfing?”

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 10, 2009 5:22 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

what are the vegas odds at?

"It's like déjà vu all over again." -yogi berra

by Cheezombie on Jan 10, 2009 5:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Not good.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 10, 2009 5:42 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Abreu

Since we signed Giambi, I wouldn’t sign Abreu. I’d rather go with Buck out there in right field. Shortstop is the biggest need as far as the offense is concerned.

The Ultimate Opportunist

by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 10, 2009 12:45 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Still, if we sign another 1B/DH/OF type

I’d go for Dunn over Abreu.

facepalm.jpg

by Zonis on Jan 10, 2009 12:46 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

I Don't Know

Dunn, Giambi, and Cust? They just seem too similar.

The Ultimate Opportunist

by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 10, 2009 12:50 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Would you object to having a team of 9 Albert Pujols' since they would be all so similar?

I know that was some hyperbole thrown in there as you’re probably talking about the strickouts, but still those guys are awesome (hitters, defense leaves a little to be desired)

Can't get enough of the Oakland A's? Visit Oaktown Awesomer's

by iamawesomer on Jan 10, 2009 1:02 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Dunn/Giambi/Cust

They’re awesome power hitters, but they don’t hit for average aside from their strikeout problems.

The Ultimate Opportunist

by Rated-R Superstar on Jan 10, 2009 1:32 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Runs are runs

Doesn’t really matter how they’re produced.

by CapgrasDelusion on Jan 10, 2009 3:26 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Spoken like a true gastroenterologist

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 10, 2009 4:12 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Haw Haw

That would be a s—-ty outfield

Stomp,em, stomp the piss out of em.Then pound the budweiser after the game. Joe Schultz Seattle Piolts Mgr 1969

by billyball1981 on Jan 10, 2009 5:30 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

slutty?

by oblique on Jan 10, 2009 7:11 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Abreu

Let’s concentrate on either our current problems (shortstop, starting pitching) or long term needs (finding out which of our younger players are keepers). Signing another outfielder doesn’t contribute to either of these needs.

I’m not that uncomfortable with Crosby for another year. Assuming Chavez is really healthy, the A’s have a lot more pop in 2009 than in 2008. My top priority would be another inning eating starting pitcher. Where’s Joe Blanton when you need him?

RAC

by rcodd on Jan 10, 2009 1:00 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Abreu doesn't add much, if anything, to the team at this point

Sign him and suddenly the young outfielders can’t get ANY playing time. And for what— a slight improvement at best?

There’s a limit to the effective depth you can wield, and that’s the limit. Cabrera or a 5th starter would be better options, notwithstanding the various objections to them.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jan 10, 2009 1:16 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

+1

Giambi gives the team necessary depth to absorb an injury to Buck, or to stash one of Buck/Barton at AAA. Anything further seems superfluous. Not to mention that signing Abreu forces both Cust and Giambi onto the field, negating any increased production on offense.

by CapgrasDelusion on Jan 10, 2009 3:30 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Abreu's defense almost entirely negates his offense

signing a starter would be much more effective in dollars/value terms

"I'm on hold for now"- Bobby Crosby

by DyeLongJustice on Jan 10, 2009 1:26 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

what starters are out there?

mainly ones with some type of injury issues, old age, declining production, etc

this ben sheets dream just doesnt seem realistic to me
i’ll take my chance with the A’s finding another scrap heap, useful pitcher than finding offense.

use a chunk of the remaining money to load up the offense and let the depth play itself out.

by Asfan4ever723 on Jan 10, 2009 2:05 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

where would abreu even play? somebody has to play CF.

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Jan 10, 2009 1:45 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

not ideal, but tolerable

lf holliday
cf sweeney or whoever
rf abreu
1b giambi
dh cust

you let buck/barton figure out their own issues and since no one is ever healthy they’ll get their chances
the offense has been that bad, maybe they are willing to sacrifice some defense

by Asfan4ever723 on Jan 10, 2009 2:08 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Abreu would have to come cheap

Abreu doesn’t add that much over Buck or Sweeney but the key thing to remember is both Buck and Sweeney have been going down with injuries all over the place. It’s unlikely both will be completely healthy next year. And with Sweeney’s not so great minor league stats and Buck’s completely strange ’08, Abreu does give us a much more reliable statline to predict. If Abreu has fallen to Giambi levels, it might make sense to sign him (especially on a two year deal to replace Holliday).

That said, if the A’s only have 15 million or so (arbitrary number) to play around with, I’d much rather the A’s target Sheets (I’d love Lowe, but he’ll get a nice deal of 14-15 mil a year) and Hardy or Cabrera. If the A’s get Abreu, Mulder, Zaun, and Denys Reyes for that money I would be disappointed.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Jan 10, 2009 2:25 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

The problem is,

i understand the thinking: obviously, signing a big name hitter like Abreu (even if his defense is godawful) sounds like a good idea, because OF COURSE he’s better than whoever it is we’ve got…

the problem is that it would really be detrimental to the idea of building a team. It’s one of the main differences between real life and playing those baseball simulation games… in those games, it’s good just to sign all the free agents and have a team of all the most famous people you can find.
In real life, you want your younger players to develop.
Sure, Abreu may be better than Buck next year, but if he took all his playing time, how good would Buck be the year after? Buck (or Cunningham) is the future of the position, and what we’d be doing is delaying his maturity.

"Life is a horizontal fall" -Jean Cocteau

by King Richard on Jan 10, 2009 3:56 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

If we could get Abreu cheap for 1 or 2 years that would be good

Would give us for next season an outfield of Abreu Sweeney and Holldiay which would be very nice. I don’t think that Buck is quite ready yet and hopefully he could learn from Giambi and Abreu how to be more patient.

by Athletic on Jan 10, 2009 4:05 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I think it's important to remember that

Buck is 25, with a great major league season already behind him. Cunningham is 22 and had only a cup of coffee in the bigs; Barton was 22 last season and struggled a lot; Gio Gonzalez was 22 and struggled a lot.

Those situations are very different from Buck’s. The future is now for Travis; the others could arguably benefit, or at least not necessarily be harmed, by starting 2009 at AAA.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 10, 2009 4:16 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Not to mention, Buck could easily be better than Abreu in 2009

The issue with Buck isn’t whether he’s good, it’s health.

It's not the results, it's how you look going about those results -- Tim McCarver

by WaddellCanseco on Jan 10, 2009 4:30 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe a little of both -

we don’t know that there were injury reasons for his deep funk in April, 2008.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jan 10, 2009 4:31 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

So apparently you 2 up there don't actually watch the A's

Abreu batted 3rd for the Yankees, no one on the A’s last year could have even batted 7th for the Yankees. Saying Buck is better than Abreu is just ridiculous and makes you guys sound ignorant

by Athletic on Jan 10, 2009 11:16 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

facepalm

"We were s--, pathetic," Guillen growled early in spring training. "We hit too many home runs."

by lenscrafters on Jan 11, 2009 12:05 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

You do realize

that 8 out of 9 hitters in the AL and all 8 in the NL have to spend half their time “in the field” making “outs,” right?

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jan 11, 2009 5:51 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

there's a good probability that one of buck, barton, or cunningham is better than abreu, and that's really all we need

"It's like déjà vu all over again." -yogi berra

by Cheezombie on Jan 10, 2009 5:03 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

7th?

You all know that he batted 3rd all year for the Yankees right? And it wasn’t like the Yankees had slouches in the line-up last year. I think that Abreu is a much more skilled hitter than what many are writting here. Even at Abreu’s mid-thirties age, he’s still a toward-the-top-of-the-order hitter.

All that said, I think that the likely large salary he’d command would go further in another direction — maybe even two directions. That is if the money is even there.

by LowcountryJoe on Jan 10, 2009 6:14 PM PST reply actions 0 recs