As Easy As 1-2-3: The A's Can Shine In '09

Crosby's gone?

Color me elated.

But seriously, I can allow myself to get excited at the picture you’ve painted, and not feel weird about it.

I'm here to talk about the past.

by 67MARQUEZ on Sep 28, 2008 5:54 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I'm sure I don't have the exact "tit for tat-ness" down on the trades

(I basically suck at that), but hopefully close enough for folks to get the idea – which is that those three could be acquired without the A’s trading guys they can’t afford to move. I figure they have Street and a younger “non Cahill-Anderson” pitcher to give and still be fine in the short and long term (and Crosby’s a salary dump, not a loss of talent, as far as I’m concerned).

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 6:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

well, this is obviously the first "hot stove"

season thread.

by OaklandSi on Sep 28, 2008 6:02 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

NO WAY

thats the starting lineup in april 09
chavy and cust are done and those siginings
are a long shot to say the least

Stay calm. I'm a relatively respectable citizen -- a multiple felon, perhaps, but certainly not dangerous

by LosAltosA's on Sep 28, 2008 6:12 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Oh, darn - I thought I had accurately predicted

the A’s 25 man roster 6 months before spring training. Oh well.

I agree that Cust is done – if the guy can only put up a .370 OBP, an .850 OPS, and hit 33 HRs, he should just retire.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 6:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I disagree

But only because he didn’t strickout 200 times. If he had, hasta la bye bye!

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:03 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

That is NOT the proper format for a haiku.

by Rocktopus on Sep 28, 2008 8:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Right-- haiku are supposed to express simple truths

(Emphasis on the “truths” part.)

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 8:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

well, he's got the "simple" part down

It's just something we do. It's not something we like. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Sep 29, 2008 9:37 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't understand the Furcal love

He’s nothing special defensively and has been a just-ok hitter in the NL for his career (and he’s always played in parks that were either neutral or hitters parks*). I guess he’d be a fine stopgap, but he’s still a guy you look to improve upon. Just being better than Crosby doesn’t make him worth the money he’ll command.

The A’s can do better than a .352 OBP (Furcal’s career mark) at the leadoff position anyway. I’d much rather see the Buck who is putting up a .370 OBP in that spot.

Sidenote: Does anybody have an explanation for why Dodger Stadium went from being a big-time pitchers park to being a hitters haven over the past three seasons? I actually wasn’t going to make a park factor point in my argument until I looked and saw that Chavez-Ravine has been very kind to hitters recently.

by thejd44 on Sep 28, 2008 6:12 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Re: His defense

I did a little more looking. Furcal has been very weird defensively as he seems to have improved as he’s aged in a pattern that is very atypical. I don’t think any improvements he’s made will last as he continues to get older, and he’ll go back to being just a slighty-above average shortstop.

by thejd44 on Sep 28, 2008 6:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

.271 EqA

That is Furcal’s career mark.

It’s about 20 runs above the average shortstop with the bat.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 6:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Perhaps people who underestimate Furcal offensively

don’t adequately account for his speed? It’s not that common for a player to hit 15 HRs and steal 25-40 bases, which is what Furcal has done.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 6:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's possible

Just looking at OPS will give misleading analyses of players who are big basestealers (assuming they aren’t incompetent at it, which Furcal isn’t— his career success is about 78% and he’s improved over time).

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 6:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

31 year olds don't typically continue to steal lots of bases at an improved rate

Especially in Oakland.

by thejd44 on Sep 28, 2008 6:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think the climate in Oakland is changing

in regards to base stealing. I feel confident that if the A’s have an accomplished base-stealer they will turn him loose FAR more than they have in the past.

We’ve already seen this some and this year the A’s didn’t really have a true base stealer in the everyday lineup, other than a short stretch of Rajai – who was turned loose – and a short stretch of Patterson, who never got on base.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 6:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think the A's are still unlikely to have many "true base stealers"

but almost all of the outfielders currently on the roster are going to steal 10-20 a year over a full season.

Career highs in steals in the minors:
Sweeney 8
C-Gon 15
Cunningham 22
Buck 11
Denorfia 20
Murton 20
Rajai 57

Other than Jack Cust, all of these guys are competent baserunners.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 7:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's not that I think Furcal is a bad player, it's that I see a 31 yo SS

coming off major back surgery as a big risk — as in a Kotsay sized risk. If you’re talking about a 1 year deal then it’s OK I guess, but not worth getting excited about. If you’re talking about longer than that, then we’ve learned nothing from the Injured Players are Undervalued era.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 8:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

+1

"Lefty relievers are like the different Mountain Dew flavors. New ones keep appearing, and people are willing to buy, but in the end most of them suck." - Gallagher's Watermelons

by scatterbrian on Sep 29, 2008 9:46 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If I'm not mistaken

the A’s led the AL in stolen base percentage this year. They did in fact run alot more this year and I think it’s safe to say that the trend will only increase in the future.

by mrod on Sep 29, 2008 12:02 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I see it a different way

They led in percentage because they don’t run all over the place. They have a lot of good baserunners who can pick their spots, but none of those guys are going to swipe 50 bases.

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:04 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Agreed

However, I still see the A’s leaning towards runnung a little more next year and beyond etc….as long as they have the type of players to get it done. Let’s be honest here, until the team acquires more power, they will need to bleed out runs any way they can.

by mrod on Sep 29, 2008 4:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Unless I'm understanding something wrong

He’s around 25 runs above replacement with the bat. Is the average shortstop really only 5 runs above replacement?

by thejd44 on Sep 28, 2008 6:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The positional adjustment for SS is 11 runs according to MGL and Tango

A .271 EqA over a full season is around 9 RAA (James Loney was 8 RAA this season with exactly a .271 EqA). Hence, 20 runs.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 6:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

So 1 point of EQA = roughly 1 run?

Because .260 is supposed to be league average. For Loney to be 11 points above average and 8 RAA seems a little strange. I guess I don’t see the use of EQA if it’s that close to 1. What also doesn’t jive then is that the SS EQA in 2008 is .255, which is only 5 points below overall average.

I’m not arguing it at this point, I just don’t really understand how this conversion is working at all.

by thejd44 on Sep 28, 2008 6:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

There's a bit of a paradox here because shortstops hit better than second basemen,

yet are also more valuable in the field.

The positional adjustment deals with that problem better than just comparing a player to league-average at his position, because if you just look at players at the same position you end up overcrediting second basemen and undercrediting shortstops.

Without going heavily into the math (which I’m a bit shaky on myself), EqA and RAA are both calculated from the same base stat, Equivalent Runs, which is generated from linear weights. EqA is EqR divided by outs times something (I think it’s a constant). RAA has a similar but, I imagine, more complex calculation.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 7:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I see SS at .255 EqA and 2B at .264

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wasn't looking at this year's numbers, but rather speaking generally

2B were at .264 this year? Really?

Huh. What positions were under .260?

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

SS .255, C .252, P .102

I think the SS thing changed when A-Rod moved and Nomar stopped playing

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

And around the same time, Jeter's OPS dropped from

5.000 to 4.998.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

From looking at it I don't see how .260 is avg any more

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

You're going to have to ask BP about that; I can't figure it out...

Maybe their league adjustments are off-center this year because offense is down across the board.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Maybe these are "adjusted for all time"?

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:19 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

That would explain why the expected average number

of complete games is 53.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The same as life expectancy

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Nope. Doesn't look like it.

Mauer is .316 “adjusted for this year” and .317 on the EqA page. I’ll e-mail them.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

You think Mauer will answer?

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If I ask nicely, why not?

It’s the same principle I use in asking for jobs and dates. Of course I’m middle-aged, unemployed and single.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

You need to DEMAND dates

Of course I’m single and subject to several restraining orders.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Goats have attorneys?

And rights?

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Teeth. Very sharp teeth.

Who do you think eats the restraining orders?

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Why I love AN:

I ask a serious question about what goes into EQA and RAA and (while it was answered) the thread morphs into more Nico/goat discussion. Yay!

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:06 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Middle aged, unemployed AND

single? So in other words, you’re happy?

"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer

by alox on Sep 29, 2008 8:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sure, I've nothing to complain about.

Except the A’s offense of course.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 29, 2008 2:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The average SS is about 16 RAR with about 700 PA if you look at Hanley.

Hanley 689 PA, 70.1 RAR, 54.0 RAP.

The Boston Combo of Julio Lugo and Jed Lowrie are 17.3 RAR and -0.3 RAP. But Jed played a lot of 3B too.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 8:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Dodger stadium

They eliminated a lot of foul territory.

The A's colors are green and gold.

by mikeA on Sep 29, 2008 9:28 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I wonder how much

I also wish somebody would do a study on how many extra outs occur in Oakland because of the foul territory. I bet there’s a way to roughly estimate the average foul territory size of the 29 other parks, then see how many balls were hit farther towards the seats and still caught.

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Don't quote me on this...

But I feel like David Gassko has done a study on Square Footage of Major League ballparks.

It may not be David’s work. But I know I’ve read something along those lines. Anybody familiar with this, or have a link?

"Some of the men didn't wait for the women and children to jump off the sinking ship that is our season." - 67MARQUEZ

by notsellingjeans on Sep 29, 2008 5:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Giambi and Dunn

I like the Furcal and Glaus suggestions. Has anyone figured out approximately how many more wins Giambi and Dunn would have been worth this year over Barton and one of the A’s outfield positions? Giambi, Dunn and Cust would give the A’s three 30+ home run hitters. While it’s hard to know cost, there is a benefit, of course, to not having to give up young pitching to grab another hitter on the market.

by SA on Sep 28, 2008 6:14 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I'm not so sure a year older Giambi

will get that many HRs without that friendly old short porch. He’s also not everyday 1B material.

by OaklandSi on Sep 28, 2008 6:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Money guys!!!

it’s all about the $$‘s with Beane and the guys you listed are above his payroll amount. Firstly, he’s been burned with the Free Agent market aka Estaban Loiaza…I believe we’re still paying that salary too.

As much as I’d like to see Glaus at 3B, it’s not going to happen. He’s not versitile enough, so if he doesn’t play 3B, you can’t put him at DH because Cust is there, where are you going to put him? The OF!?? OMG!!! And Chavez? ya, he’s outta here!!!! Tell Dave Stewart to take the $35 million dollar contract he negotiated for Chavey and smoke it because that’s about what Chavez is worth…old smoke!

Crosby is gone like a bad piece of crystal…see ya, don’t let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya! So there’s Pennington spot, I like him a lot…he got a cannon for an arm and he’s fast, more importantly he’s level headed and dedicated to the game. Furcal??? Are you serious? i’d rather have Tattoo from Fantasy Island play SS than Furcal!!!

Ellis…something tells me he’s joining Crosby…to be used as trade bait to beef up the minor league system.

Pitchers are locked….This year hopefully someone wont mess with Braden and tell him he’s going in the pen and the start of the season and just let the boy do his thing…this kid can pitch and he definitely is the leader now in the rotation…can’t wait for that. But Mazzaro??? This guy is at least a full season if not more away from the bigs…this cat needs to learn to pitch at the higher levels…just not ready! You forget Andrew Bailey who is a up and comer but still, just a season away.

Then you have the pen…they look solid….hopefully the other teams won’t figure out the Zigler really only has 1 pitch…the sinker….maybe they did and that accounted for his late season slump, we’ll have to see. But they look solid, Zigler, Devine, Blevins, and Gray. Rumor mill is that they’re working with Gray to “tweak” his motion a bit, to get more movement on his pitches, that should make him a solid set up guy for Zigler. Hate to say it but Houston, we have a problem…he’s being shipped out along with Embree (took his salary in the shorts as well).

I caught the interview with Beane on Fox Sports…he’s really against going into the free agent market…we’ll have to wait and see!

by jerrymcguire on Sep 28, 2008 6:21 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Oh my.

Bold prediction: Ellis won’t be traded.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 6:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

isn't he about to become a free agent?

by OaklandSi on Sep 28, 2008 6:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yup.

And if the A’s re-sign Ellis, they can’t turn around and trade him.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 6:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

But they could do so if he accepts arb.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 8:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't think he cares for roast beef

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Even though I'm not a big Furcal fan

I absolutely would rather have him playing short than anybody from Fantasy Island.

by thejd44 on Sep 28, 2008 6:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

but... but...

I coulda swore Ricardo Montalban hit .267 for Peoria in the 3-I League back in 1962…

"All managers are losers, they are the most expendable pieces of furniture on the face of the Earth."- Ted Williams

by Gaijin_Suketto on Sep 28, 2008 10:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sure, but his MLEs weren't so impressive

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

we are not still paying for Loiaza

The dodgers are on the bill for that because they took him on waivers last year.
Ellis is a free agent and thus can not be traded.
And its Z-i-e-g-l-e-r.

I could see Huston being traded to several teams and I think that Glaus could be a good target.

Who are Houston and Zigler?

"First Zito and now DJ? The Giants are like A's landfil." - a paraphrase of Since72.
Also, Todd Linden has a .231 lifetime average and a 66 career OPS+, chill Linden fans.

by Athletics fan and runner on Sep 28, 2008 6:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

they are on the A's in the Bizarro world

as have been such stars as Millhouse and Hardin

by OaklandSi on Sep 28, 2008 6:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

All of whom play on Fantasy Island,

where Furcal is king and Cust never stricks out!1111

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 6:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Is that the world in which we swept the reds in 90?

Gosh, I am so bitter today. I love A’s baseball and I have to go through a whole winter without it.

We're screwed. Do what makes you human. For me it is running, being a dad and husband, and rooting for the A's.

by Athletics fan and runner on Sep 28, 2008 6:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

huston traded to several teams

how would that work, do they each get him for one day of the week?

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Sep 29, 2008 12:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

body parts

The tigers get his right leg, the mets get his torso, Cleveland gets his left leg, and so on. As long as his right arm ends up in the NL I think that we will be ok. I would be willing to send his head to any number of posters here on AN so they can admire his face.

We're screwed. Do what makes you human. For me it is running, being a dad and husband, and rooting for the A's.

by Athletics fan and runner on Sep 29, 2008 6:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

is this guy serious?

by pbra17 on Sep 29, 2008 7:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'll come back to this post later

I just wanted to point out that according to the data Cesar Izturis outperformed Crosby as a big league SS. Izturis’ EQA was 1 point lower than Crosby’s but his defense, according to Runs Saved and RZR give Izturis the edge. In fact, RZR has Izturis much higher then Crosby.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Sep 28, 2008 7:25 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Crosby's potential, though, if a team believes that

a fresh start might elevate his performance (which I actually think is a real possibility) is still higher – meaning that he should reliably be “the same or better” than Izturis.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 8:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

one-year swings in defensive stats

Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t the general consensus that, in order to get an accurate picture of a defender from advanced stats, you really need to look at a multiple-year sample of whichever set of data is being analyzed? And isn’t, therefore, a one-year glance at a particular advanced defensive stat not necessarily going to be true?

I mean, I’m not opposed to the notion that Crosby’s range might be shrinking. And I’m as eager to be rid of him as anyone. I’m just not convinced that he’s definitively dropped off as much defensively as some claim.

It's just something we do. It's not something we like. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Sep 29, 2008 9:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It takes about three times as long for defensive stats to converge as offensive ones

so raw RZR, etc is the equivalent, over a full season, of two months’ hitting stats.

I don’t know if BBTF’s OPD is regressed to the mean or not. It seems possible given the relative “sanity” of the fielding run totals, but I just don’t know any of the methodology that’s involved in the stat.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm not sure I buy that

I understand why it’s said (fewer chances), but I think there is a lot less noise/luck involved in fielding a ball that can skew the results.

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not to mention defensive ability changes over a multiple year sample

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 29, 2008 2:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's an empirical fact

You can measure how much a given player’s stats yo-yo around from year to year (or for that matter, month to month or decade to decade) to get a read on how much you need to regress those stats to the mean. The mean, of course, being some combination of league average and that player’s own performance baseline. It involves some statistical calculation of variance that I’m not even remotely close to qualified to talk about how to do.

For whatever reason, and I’m not going to try to guess why, more regression is required for fielding stats than hitting stats.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, I'm not mathy enough to figure it all out

It just doesn’t make any intuitive sense to me. I would like somebody to explain it though. Salb? You’re usually great at taking the complicated and making it accessible. Any help here?

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 9:59 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm wondering the same thing myself.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 29, 2008 10:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sounds like a Staturday topic to me

"Some of the men didn't wait for the women and children to jump off the sinking ship that is our season." - 67MARQUEZ

by notsellingjeans on Sep 30, 2008 1:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If you're a worse player than Cesar Izturis

You should probably stop being a player.

I can’t believe Crosby wasn’t benched in favor of younger players. It’s really inexcusable. Even if Petit/Pennington/Murphy/anybody are truly awful, they still deserve the chance to prove that.

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:10 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The excuse...

a.) He’ll provide a Type B compensation pick next year. Maybe even a Type A, depending on how crappy other AL shortstops are in ’09.

b.) If the team has any hopes of trading him this offseason, he had to play the last two months. I read somewhere reputable (MLBtraderumors?) that an anonymous AL team was scouting him the past few weeks.

"Some of the men didn't wait for the women and children to jump off the sinking ship that is our season." - 67MARQUEZ

by notsellingjeans on Sep 29, 2008 5:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

He was benched late in the year for Patterson, till he got hurt.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 29, 2008 7:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If the A's can get a legit prospect back from the Cardinals, or deal them a guy who is not as good as Street,

this is a pretty solid scenario. One year of Glaus isn’t enough for two of Street. I’d want something on top of it— maybe The Federalist (John Jay) or one of their starting pitchers (Jess Todd? Probably not, but we can hope…).

I’d not bother with the Garko move— he looks like Dan Johnson 2.0 to me, and it seems like the A’s could do just as well by reacquiring the original (note that “just as well” is code for “not very well”). Also, I’m offering arbitration to Frank Thomas, figuring that Chavez is playing first if he accepts (which I think is unlikely) and isn’t clearly “done” in spring training (likely, but not certain).

It’s at least a plausibly competitive roster. It all kind of depends on how the pitching works out. If the rotation is great, the team will be great. If the rotation sucks, the team will suck.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 7:36 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

My prediction on the starting pitching is a lot like 2005 -

I think it will struggle some early, but that by June 1st, the “true best 5” will have emerged and gained enough experience that the rotation will just get better and better. And while I know you hate the idea, I wouldn’t be at all surprised to see either Cahill or Anderson in the push for “best 5” before the All-Star Break.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 8:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

EOY rotation -- Cahill, Anderson, Gio, Gallagher, Mazzaro

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Man, this team will be very lucky

if this is the rotation for five years. I really hope it is.

by ohmangoAs on Sep 28, 2008 9:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sure, it will mean that no one got hurt for five years.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Street to Indians

for Garko and Hodges

by Asfan4ever723 on Sep 28, 2008 7:48 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Don't they sort of need Hodges,

seeing as what they have no competent third baseman at all right now?

Marte is godawful. I suppose they could move Peralta to third and Cabrera to short, but then they end up with Josh Barfield at second, and he looks pretty godawful too. For that matter, Cabrera wasn’t exactly lighting up the scoreboard this year either, although I think he’ll come around.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 8:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

From what I understand, Hodges at 3B is in the same boat as

Peralta the SS, which is that he plays there but shouldn’t.

The Indians have an interesting quandry in that they have considerable infield talent in players who may not be good enough defensively to stay at their current position:

Peralta (SS —> 3B?),
Hodges (3B —> 1B?),
LaPorta (1B —> LF —> DH?),
and soon 22 year old Beau Mills (3B —> 1B?),
along with Victor Martinez (C —> 1B —> C?)
Asdrubal Cabrera (2B? SS?),
and Ryan Garko (1B)

It’s hard to tell who will end up where at this point.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 8:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If I was them, then, I'd sign a glove man to play short

and hope to slug enough from the other offensive positions to make up for it. Maybe try to get someone from the (gulp) Angels. Maicer Izturis?

Getting back to the A’s, if Hodges isn’t a competent 3B the team is back in the same boat as before, except it has one more defensive slouch adding to the pileup. Well, two more, in this case, counting Garko.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 8:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If I were the Indians, I'd move Peralta to 3B,

go for defense at SS like you said, keep Asdrubal at 2B, and figure that out of LaPorta, Hodges, and Mills, you’ll end up with a 1Bman and options for OF/DH.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 8:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

So you want to trade them Crosby?

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If he played defense like he used to,

when he couldn’t hit but could field – as opposed to now, when he can’t do either – I’d say yes.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sounds like they should sign Furcal

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

They could sign Ellis

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree with you in that the A's are far from competing

But Furcal and Glaus would not be high on my list in the fact that, seeing as the A’s set an all-time club record for the use of the DL, a lot of the trades were made towards getting more healthy, more reliable players.

And both of those players are good, but not reliable. I also say “nay” to Garko, because I am a Barton fan, and I think this was his lump year.

by NateHST on Sep 28, 2008 7:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I think if he could DH half the time or more,

Glaus would be a pretty good bet to stay healthy – but who knows for sure? Furcal is one of those “Do you believe he’s ok or not?” deals. If you think he is, he’ll be a relative bargain at a position of true need. If not, don’t sign him at any price.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 8:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If I'm the Cards I'd want Cardenas back in any deal involving Glaus.

Something like Gio, Cardenas and Outman. And Crosby. And Murton. No deal without Murton.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

And J.T. Snow

He was on the Giants, why, just yesterday!

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

For one season?

That’s ridonkulous.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think he's kidding - at least that's how I interpreted it based on

“No deal without Murton.” Have those words ever been spoken seriously?

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well that part, but I would want something Cardenas and a good pitching prospect

and a lottery pick. Maybe Cardenas, Gio and Brown.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

By lottery pick I meant lottery ticket of course

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Your Cards GM alter ego is smoking crack

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Is Glaus really less valuable than Blanton or Harden?

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I sure think one year of him

is worth less than 3 of Blanton or 2 of Harden+3 of Gaudin… on top of which, your package is WAY better than the packages the A’s got for either of those two.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 10:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Is that your counter-offer Mr. Beane?

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 11:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

just bring in Carter and Doolittle next year...

stick ‘em at some position and power problem solved. Lowest payroll in MLB with decent pitching and a puncher’s chance at the playoffs. If Barton and Chavez shine in the spring, maybe no need, but I’m not sure we need anymore old injury-prone guys to be “competitive” next year. Garko is intriguing, though.

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 28, 2008 8:33 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Problem is, if you call those guys up now

they’re likely to fail now and maybe fail later (due to “rushed prospect shellshock syndrome”), whereas if you leave them alone until they’re ready they’re likely to just succeed later.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 8:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

or they could each hit 30 homeruns next year...

which would be good, considering Emil Brown was 2nd on the team with 13 HR’s this year. But, maybe you’re right. Barton looked shellshocked for most of this season.

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 28, 2008 8:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

As did Gio Gonzalez, also called up before truly mastering his current level

(though he had just completed a short run of dominance). In particular, the scouting report on Carter is that he has legitimate potential but is a long way away from being ready. So far from being fast-tracked, the A’s need to be patient with him – which is, I suspect, why he wasn’t promoted to AA despite a 40-HR season.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 8:41 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

which team will have a better record next year...

I was sure who would this year. I’m not so certain about next year.

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 28, 2008 8:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

oh, I guess I should give you the choices...

A’s or Giants?

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 28, 2008 8:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think the A's will, because I think their young talent

is better than the Giants’ young talent – specifically, I’d rather go forward looking for improvement from Buck, Sweeney, Cunningham, Gonzalez, Barton, Suzuki, etc. than Bowker, Velez, Burriss, Schierholz…I do like Fred Lewis, and Sandoval is intriguing in a “poor man’s Vlad Guerrero” kind of way, but ultimately I think Lewis might be the only good player in the bunch.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 8:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree with you... but, I wonder if that is only because...

we’re both A’s fans? Sandoval looks like a better hitter than anybody on our team. I thought you didn’t think much of Sweeney? ;-)

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 28, 2008 8:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm still unsure about Sweeney

Sandoval could be anything from Vlad-lite to a “five week wonder”.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 8:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Funny, I'm way higher on Schierholtz than Lewis

I think there’s a 70-80% chance that this was the best season of Lewis’s career, while I think Schierholtz has a solid shot at being Garrett Anderson with a few (not many) more walks. If they ever give him a chance, that is.

Sandoval is a wild card… maybe he can get away with being crazily hacktastic at the MLB level, maybe not. I’m not putting bets on it, that’s for sure.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I thought Lewis showed surprising power for a guy

who is primarily speed based. In that way he reminded of…well, Furcal.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Fred Lewis is like the anti-Swisher

He has an unexplainably high BABIP which masks what are basically mediocre hitting components.

Look at the top 10 on the BABIP leaderboard and it’s like Holliday, Berkman, Chipper, Pujols, Ludwick… and Fred Lewis. I don’t think he’s quite on their level.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

No, but I do think he's playing in the right park for him

I can see him getting a lot of doubles and triples, as well as 10-15 HRs and 30 SB, to turn an otherwise uninspiring .250-.260 average into a valuable player.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

".250 with a lot of doubles" sounds way too Crosbyesque for my taste

particularly given that, unlike Crosby, Lewis is playing an offense-first position.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

No, that's .237 with a lot of doubles -

Yes, Crosby worked hard to finish this season with an average lower than his rookie year, when he took “LROY” (Lame Rookie of the Year) while batting .239.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:37 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Every time I think Crosby can't possibly get any worse,

he surprises me.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Same here.

I just hope other GMs can’t stand to watch him either, and thus think he might actually be better than he is.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

he'll prolly be batting champ in the NL...

next year.

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 28, 2008 9:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I hope that's true

because it means he’s in the NL.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

yes, but it will also mean...

that the “scrub” Billy gets for him better be half-way decent.

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 28, 2008 9:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Does the scrub have an OPS+ over 76?

Does he play better than mediocre defense?

These are not large shoes to fill.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 10:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

yes to both...

that’s why I said “scrub.”

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 29, 2008 12:30 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'd like to see what Sabean does in the offseason

They have a few guys in the last year of a deal who they should move if at all possible. Winn had a decent year and probably would have some interest around the league. Same for Molina. Dave Roberts might be tradeable if the Giants pick up a lot of the salary a la Kotsay.

The Giants aren’t close to contending, so they really should blow the whole thing up.

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I would be happy if they did that

I would also be stunned, because Sabean never met a veteran he didn’t like…

The Zito, Lowry and Rowand contracts are such ostriches that the team probably doesn’t have any way to get rid of them, but if I was the Giants GM, I’d offload any vet I could and look to trade Matt Cain for a Haren-type goodie bag.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 11:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

ostriches?

It's just something we do. It's not something we like. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Sep 29, 2008 11:34 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

gnu, G-N-U.

or is it emu?

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Sep 29, 2008 11:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Or do you mean

Emo?

by mrod on Sep 30, 2008 12:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Mixed up my giant birds

I meant albatrosses.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 2:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think you had it right

When a team bungles contracts as badly as the Giants do, you have to come up with a new degrading term, even worse than albatross.

You settled on the ostrich.

"Some of the men didn't wait for the women and children to jump off the sinking ship that is our season." - 67MARQUEZ

by notsellingjeans on Sep 29, 2008 5:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

"Ostrich" = "Contract that allows a team to bury its head in the sand and pretend that it has a 'long term answer' at a position"?

Rowand is definitely an ostrich. Not sure about the other two.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 7:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Even if I wouldn't sign Rowand or Hunter to

their current deals, I’d say there are waaaay worse ones out there. They are both, at least, good players signed for non-ridiculous amounts of money. In contrast to Zito and Andruw (not good), for example, or Abreu and Helton (paid soooo much)…

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 29, 2008 7:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I predict the Rowand deal will look like one of those "way worse ones" by the end of it

I don’t think he will age well. I think he’ll end up being a .720 OPS player in a corner with average defense at best by 2012, which is essentially replacement level.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 8:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It would have been a better signing

if the Giants figured to be competitive in 2008-2010, but…

I didn’t think the Torii Hunter signing was as bad as most did, but that’s partly because he’s pretty good now and so are the Angels – so by the time he declines and his contract is an albatrosstrich, the Angels will have gotten plenty from him when they needed it.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 29, 2008 8:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree that the Hunter contract made more sense

particularly if you assume that the Angels had already written off the Matthews Jr. disaster as a total loss. It was a major overpay but it wasn’t totally ridiculous. It did improve the Angels roster by a couple of wins.

The Rowand deal made absolutely no sense other than as PR for the casual fan.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 8:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Or the front office had deluded itself

into thinking they were “this” close to winning the NL West…Which they were, if you just move your thumb and forefinger farther apart. More…Little more…More…There you go.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 29, 2008 8:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh, ignore the comment I made below, because I don't think I understand why you said what you said

Yeah, the Rowand deal was dumb for the Giants (and, I think, a bad choice for him because that park is not going to help him out much). But I think Rowand is a better player, and a better deal, than Hunter based on just the years/money. Hunter just really isn’t all that good.

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 10:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

"albatrosstrich"

I think we used to serve that at the fine dining reataurant I once worked at……….as I recall, I did not care for it much.

by mrod on Sep 30, 2008 12:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I still can't believe the Giants brought back Albatrosstrich Aurilia

It's just something we do. It's not something we like. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Sep 30, 2008 12:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Rowand had a bad second half

But that’s not a bad deal, assuming he doesn’t completely collapse. The guy is an above average player – quite a bit more valuable than Eric Byrnes – who got 3/$30. His 5/$60 is pretty close in line with that. And when you factor in Hunter’s and Jones’ deals, Rowand is a free agent-market bargain, even if he doesn’t live up to the deal.

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 10:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

He posted a 96 OPS+ this year

which is average or thereabouts for a center fielder.

His career mark is higher, but the guy is on the wrong side of thirty, not particularly athletic to begin with, and has a habit of abusing himself for short-term gains that damage his team in the long run. I’m expecting a couple more years of average-ish production (with some injuries) followed by a fairly rapid slide into irrelevance. There’s a reason why the Giants were the only team to offer him five years.

Given that they were the high bidder BEFORE he had a somewhat sucky season, it’s hard to imagine anyone taking on the contract now unless the Giants eat a bunch of it (and a heaping side order of crow as well).

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 10:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

He was a great fielder by UZR, although I've not seen the 2008 numbers

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 29, 2008 10:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly

And I would argue that Hunter will age better because he is a better athlete than Rowand.

I theorize that world-class athletes – the Barry Bondses, Torii Hunter to a lesser extent – age better in their 30s than the Mike Piazzas of the world.

IMO, average athletes fall off a cliff faster (or at a younger age) than terrific athletes do.

"Some of the men didn't wait for the women and children to jump off the sinking ship that is our season." - 67MARQUEZ

by notsellingjeans on Sep 30, 2008 1:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

By "problem solved," I assume you mean

that baseball fans have the problem of “whether to bother watching the A’s for the next five years” solved. In the negative.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 8:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

yes, exactly... that's exactly what I meant...

your keen intellect has resulted in a pefect parsing of my words.

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 28, 2008 9:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

if certain people made preposterious statements just to get a reaction, how would you handle that PT?

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Sep 29, 2008 12:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

badly?

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 29, 2008 1:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

you remind me of bobby kielty

have you ever considered changing your username to foolishkielty23?

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Sep 29, 2008 1:03 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

or maybe...

foolish adult who can afford multiple season tickets but welshes on his bets when he owes $500 to fellow ANers including a 16 year old kid game23?

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Sep 29, 2008 1:23 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

He still hasnt paid that bet??

Bring back Hammer.

by OaktownPower on Sep 29, 2008 9:27 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

nope

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Sep 29, 2008 11:52 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I fully intend to have other people pay that with your tax money...

I’m sure you’re in favor of that.

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 30, 2008 1:07 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

i'm not

but that would still be less shameful than not paying them at all.

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Sep 30, 2008 9:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Frankly, making a bet and then reneging is just lame, IMO

If you’re not good for it, don’t make the bet.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 1, 2008 6:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

With sarcastic witticisms?

It’s my standard operating procedure…

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 1:34 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah but when even that person concedes that he is just looking for a reaction, why not follow one of the basic rules of internet forums: don’t feed the troll.

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Sep 29, 2008 11:52 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

wow... look at all the comments to my one comment!

isn’t that what a blog is all about?

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 30, 2008 12:52 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

my .APC goes up...

yours goes down. Ouch.

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 30, 2008 12:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Sep 30, 2008 10:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Bring back Milton Bradley!!!!

I’m just making my Christmas/ Hanukkah wish list now~!!!

(To Beane) P.S.: Please leave Crosby out of the 2009 rebuilding plans!!!! Thanks for nothing (R.O.Y.)

Women and children can be carless, but not men!

by MMunoz33 on Sep 28, 2008 9:04 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Bradley and Hamilton

Bradley and Hamilton had much better statistics this year at home than away. It was a fairly significant split. I believe Cust had a higher OPS than Hamilton if one compared only their Away statistics. Bradley came in third in average in the American league and batted .358 at home and .290 away. Still, either Bradley or Hamilton would have been nice to have on the A’s this year.

by SA on Sep 28, 2008 9:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The funny part is as

gaudy as Hamilton and Bradley’s stats where, they played the last 6 weeks of the season without their leadoff man Kinsler, their #5/#6 guy Murphy and the their #2 hitter playing with a fractured finger.

Odd fact, Texas set the MLB record for Doubles in a season,….

Its very simple, put players on base in front of Hamilton he he will knock them in. The guy led the AL in total bases (102 more than Cust).

Cust OPS
Home .896
Away .801

Hamilton OPS
Home 1.019
Away .786

Think Hamilton likes hitting in Texas? Just proves that park factor info is fairly precise. Im just curious how Cust’s OPS is lower away when McAfee suppress all power and walk numbers?

by laxtonto on Sep 29, 2008 7:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Try removing Cust's Texas numbers

And Hamilton’s Oakland numbers to get a true comparison since that park factor still exists in away stats albeit in a smaller size. That probably balances their OPS numbers.

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Sep 29, 2008 11:23 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

My guess is that the things about Oakland that make it a pitchers park don't affect Cust much

He doesn’t hit a ton of pop up foul balls, and most of his home runs are high fly balls that can carry far enough to get out of the park.

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:27 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I humbly disagree

I have no doubt Cust would hit more home runs in many other parks. It’s not just the fence distance, it’s also the density of coastal Coliseum air.

"Some of the men didn't wait for the women and children to jump off the sinking ship that is our season." - 67MARQUEZ

by notsellingjeans on Sep 29, 2008 5:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Truthfully

I equate most of this to just irregular data as far as statistical sampling goes. There is to many non-baseball factors that would need to be figured in to try to find a long term answer.

Maybe Cust likes being out of town and is able to concentrate easier away from friends and family…

Who knows why, I just thought it was odd…Most players bat better at home, regardless of park. Just a weird little fact…

by laxtonto on Sep 29, 2008 6:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

This was a real bummer season. I watched very few games and rarely read AN. I guess I’m a bit of a front-runner in my old age.

by Meurs on Sep 28, 2008 9:05 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

That was your big mistake - the right approach

was to watch very few games and read AN constantly.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:07 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

That's my approach, lol

In my defense, I’m sharing a TV with two non-baseball fans.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Suzanne Somers and Joyce DeWitt?

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Actually it's BLAKE DeWitt

and Adam Dunn.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ooh, a gay "Three's Company"

How progressive! Who plays Mr. Furley – anyone on the Giants?

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Roper > Furley

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

You know what Mr. Furley and the Giants ball dudes have in common?

When you hear “Norman Fell!” it makes sense.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Actually, we're metrosexual

It’s the third true outcome.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:44 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs

HAHAHA!!!!!

Priceless wit that the Angels and their shit bloggers could never appreciate or comprehend!

“Nico for President!!”

P.S. Crosby, DFA, and Barton said they were in favor of the financial system bailout so the market wouldn’t hurt the economy and create an even deeper recession in the future!

Women and children can be careless, but not men!

by MMunoz33 on Sep 29, 2008 9:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I read that Emil Brown has "no interest in returning to the A's next year"

The word “darnsies” comes to mind.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 29, 2008 9:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I found that amusing as well.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 29, 2008 10:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

the number 1 reason that i think furcal make smore sense than any other free agent

is that his injury eliminates the risk of giving up a compensatory pick if the dodgers were to offer arbitration.
he’s obviously not a type a or b guy because of his 5 month absence, so beane isn’t risking any precious higher draft picks…

by stranahanahan on Sep 28, 2008 9:07 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

You know what?

“makes more” isn’t nearly as provocative as “make smore”…

{runs out and buys 10 lbs of marshmallows}

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Eh

The A’s first round pick is protected, and they will probably get at least one comp pick this offseason. Losing a second-rounder is definitely not a reason not to sign any Type A free agent, unless the guy is just terrible. The average second-rounder ends up being something like Kirk Saarloos or Jack Hannahan.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

i understand that

but i’m saying this from the perspective of billy beane. he has made it quite clear he would have to be SOLD on a guy to even give up that one pick, as in his opinion that one pick could have huge implications. that’s why i think that beane would be more likely to consider a deal with furcal, than dunn or burrell knowing he would have to give something up AND pay big bucks…

by stranahanahan on Sep 28, 2008 11:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Two words:

Esteban Loaiza.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 1:35 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The only plan I'm feeling is the garko plan

The Indians are stacked at first so they could get rid of him. We would get four years of garko and that would be great. I would deal street and one of our young pitchers (Smith Eveland, Outman, Braden). I don’t think Barton is our future, I’m sorry.
Also I’m not feeling the furcal or glaus plan. they’re both too old for my opinion and they both have back problems.
Another paln would be to get our third baseman of the future, something along the line of Ian stewart.

by HarbirD on Sep 28, 2008 9:07 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

That's too much for Garko, IMO

I wasn’t thinking Street for Garko straight up even. Street’s good and under contract for two years.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sounds good

maybe just one of our young pitchers them?

by HarbirD on Sep 28, 2008 9:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't understand the Garko love. Although I think he's better than Allen Craig.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

He's a good hitter. Not a terrific hitter,

but he knows the strike zone, hits for doubles and some HR power, and he mashes lefties – which is important to the lefty-heavy A’s.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ya but they've already got 342 1B/DH types. We need 2B-SS-3B gosh darnit!

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

One good one would be nice, though

Personally, I think a demotion to AAA would be good for Barton. And I’m pretty confident that Garko will outproduce Barton in 2009.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ya but I've got Chavez in the Barton Replacement spot.

I guess Garko’s OK for the Barton Replacement Replacement spot but I wouldn’t trade Street to get that.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Can't Barton fill the Barton Replacement Replacement spot?

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 9:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

like Crosby has filled the Crosby Replacement spot?

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 28, 2008 9:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh dear, no, we can't have that.

Next you’ll want players playing themselves at other positions. Which is just a couple of words away from “players playing with themselves in other positions.”

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

In how many positions can a player play with himself?

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

wait a minute... didn't you argure against a Barton demotion...

throughout the entire 2008 season?

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 28, 2008 9:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

"argue" even

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 28, 2008 9:29 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I guess I did too, but only because I thought he'd snap out of it.

Boy was I off.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 28, 2008 9:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I missed on Barton too - probably my biggest gaffe on AN.

I knew he’d hit around something ending with a couple of zeros, but I didn’t realize it would start with a two.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 28, 2008 9:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Winter Of Discontent

“I think it’s possibly myself, Crosby, Street, Ellis, Duke – we could all be gone,” Embree said. “There are a lot of variables but, I would expect that our card game (which often includes Street and Crosby) is broken up and that the chess match (Street and Andrew Brown) is over.”

Crosby is the A’s second-longest tenured position player after Ellis, and he will be a free agent after next season. One American League team has sent scouts to Oakland’s past two series to watch the shortstop, but if Ellis were to leave, the A’s would have to fill two middle infield positions, spots that are especially important with a very young pitching staff. Plus, Crosby might not bring back a ton in return after several mediocre offensive seasons and numerous injuries.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/09/28/SPML137Q44.DTL

by Asfan4ever723 on Sep 28, 2008 9:48 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Off-the-wall idea

What about Crosby for Khalil Greene, straight up?

Both guys are free agents after next year. Both had simply awful seasons this year. Both seem like they could use a change of scenery. Greene has a bit better of a track record, but was worse this season. Greene might be able to hit a few more HR in the Coliseum; Crosby’s doubles approach might play better (relatively speaking— no one hits better in Petco in absolute terms) in Petco’s spacious outfield.

Crazy, or crazy like a fox?

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 28, 2008 10:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'd do it - just for the unlimited references to Fast Times at Ridgemont High that become available.

by mikev on Sep 28, 2008 11:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

i would love that

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Sep 29, 2008 12:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

everybody said (including you) how much better...

Greene is than Crosby, so maybe I’ll just take your word for it.

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Sep 29, 2008 12:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Greene might be better than Crosby

But I think he sucks, too. Can’t we shoot a bit higher?

I only want a .304 OBP shortstop if he can field like Adam Everett.

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sure, you CAN shoot higher...

but if Crosby is your collateral, you’re not likely to hit anything…

Also, keep in mind that league average OBP in Petco is .311.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 2:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Greene is definitely better on the road for his career

How does he compare to Crosby defensively? Or, rather, how does he rank overall?

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 10:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I only checked out his RZR for the last few years, but he's been consistently around league average

which more or less squares with what I’ve heard in the media ether.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 10:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

So, assuming they're roughly equal

Would I rather have Greene? I guess so, just because I don’t have five years of frustration built up towards him. I still would like somebody good. Where have all the ~~cowboys /strike> good shortstops gone?~~

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 10:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Note to self

Don’t try to use the strikethrough anymore.

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 10:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well, three of them are in the NL East

but yeah, overall the position is a trainwreck at the MLB level right now.

Apropos, another amazing feature of just how stupid the 2007 Rollins MVP award was: there were 3 better players at his position IN HIS DIVISION LAST SEASON.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 10:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Despite playing very good (I dispute his gold gloves, too) defense at a premium position

I still don’t see how he won the award over Howard, Utley, or Burrell. Even Rowand had better offensive numbers.

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

but, but...

He made a prediction, Dammit! He made a prediction that he’d make the playoffs in the media!

And HE DELIVERED!!! zOMG!

"Some of the men didn't wait for the women and children to jump off the sinking ship that is our season." - 67MARQUEZ

by notsellingjeans on Sep 30, 2008 1:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I like this idea

As a Clemson fan, I would love to see Greene with the A’s. Heck, he might even hit like he was in college if he goes back to wearing white shoes.

"That's not a Sherman tank, it's Frank Thomas!" - Monkeyball

by JLeverenz on Sep 30, 2008 8:15 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

You lost me at the "Play Chavez at 3B for 75 games" part.

I’m all for signing Furcal, but I wouldn’t want to give him more than two guaranteed years, potentially a third year option whether it’s a vesting option based on games played (ie health) or a straight team option.

However, I have to think that we (Hi PT) have got to assume that Chavez is a nonentity for 2009. Is there the potential that he comes back and actually is healthy and can play 3B? Sure, possibly. I don’t know how likely it is, and I think it’s probably not going to happen.

IMO, trading Mazzaro for Ryan Garko would be overpaying. A reasonably high ceiling starter for a(nother) 1B/DH type. Not saying that I wouldn’t want Garko on the team, because I think he’d do nicely at first after Barton converts to 3B (yup.. .where’s monkeyball with that front page post, anyway) – but I’d think that potentially a deal could be made. I wouldn’t give them Street, either, unless more than just Garko was coming back to Oakland (Street/Mazzaro/one of Eveland or Braden for Garko/LaPorta? Drool.)

Potentially:

SS Furcal
LF Buck
DH Cust
1B Garko
CF CarGo
C1 Suzuki
RF Sweeney
3B Barton
2B Pennington/Ellis

by mikev on Sep 28, 2008 10:49 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

i wanted a hello too :(

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Sep 29, 2008 12:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hi FG3!

by mikev on Sep 29, 2008 8:01 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

hey mikev!

we (the royal we) appreciate it. i think

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Sep 29, 2008 8:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

See, this is a correct use of "we"

assuming that by “we” you mean me, you, Nico, Waddell, and everyone else on the thread. We do, in fact, have to evaluate Chavez’s health…

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 1:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Most certainly not.

I meant “we” in the sense of the Oakland A’s and making plans for 2009.

by mikev on Sep 29, 2008 8:02 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh

Well, in that case, you need to be more flagrantly vapid in your use of the term for me to pick up on it.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

This post made me choke on pizza

I’ve always thoroughly enjoyed the word “vapid,” but seeing flagrantly in front of it just triggers this happiness inside of me. That’s a truly delightful combination of words.

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:39 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hey, while you're here...

Go get OOTP 9 and join the GUBA. We have an opening

by mikev on Sep 29, 2008 11:51 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I like the optimism ...it always feel better to hope than to mope.

I would like to see Furcal and Garko join the team. I still like the idea of Kouzmanoff too.

by IM4Oakgal on Sep 29, 2008 12:14 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Optimism?

So I shouldn’t say how everybody will be traded, hurt, or terrible and by mid-season the 2009 A’s outfield will contain Robnett, Herrera, and Corey Brown and the ace of the staff will, somehow, be Kirk Saarloos?

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:40 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Kirk Saarloos, Dan Meyer, and Lenny D...

Back-to-back on short rest all year. Maximizes their innings and effectiveness.

"Some of the men didn't wait for the women and children to jump off the sinking ship that is our season." - 67MARQUEZ

by notsellingjeans on Sep 29, 2008 5:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

somebody should do a study

on the players sports fans want to trade away from their team, like maybe what characteristics they have in common.

mazzaro seems to come up in every trade thread this year, i presume because he’s had one really good year and people think it’s either a fluke or that he doesn’t have much upside either way.

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Sep 29, 2008 1:09 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

People perceive his perceived value to be higher than they perceive it to be.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 29, 2008 1:23 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Angels fans always had that same problem with Troy Percival

It's just something we do. It's not something we like. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Sep 29, 2008 9:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Crosby: He sucks and people want him gone
Mazzaro: He had one breakout year, might not be able to sustain it, but even if he does he’s still probably behind a handful of pitchers. I think people suggest him as trade bait because he’s “enough, but not too much.” Actually, it’s probably flawed thinking from our biased perspective because we’re assuming that Mazzaro can get the job done in a trade, when other GMs might say “one flukey year? Give us Cahill.”

by thejd44 on Sep 29, 2008 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's human nature to want the nicest, shiniest item in the store

That’s part of why I don’t see the A’s trading prospects this offseason. Sure, the team might be willing to part with second or third-tier prospects in a deal for a major leaguer…but what team in the right mind is going to ask for those?

People want the nicest car on the lot. If the A’s show them Mazzaro, they’ll inevitably demand Cahill/Anderson for a deal to be done.

It might actually be easier to make a deal involving Mazzaro if they didn’t have so many other nice pieces. But Mazzaro isn’t a loaded Civic on the Honda lot, where he looks terrific; he’s a loaded Civic on the Bentley lot. Nobody goes to the Bentley lot (#1 farm system) looking for Civics.

"Some of the men didn't wait for the women and children to jump off the sinking ship that is our season." - 67MARQUEZ

by notsellingjeans on Sep 29, 2008 5:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

This is my problem with the Harden trade

The A’s went to the Yugo lot and bought used.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 7:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Josh Vitters resents being called a Yugo. Even a top of the line one.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Sep 29, 2008 8:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The Yugo lot did have a random Ferrari, but it had a bad engine

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Sep 29, 2008 8:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think we need to look at this off season with an objective view

Lets look at what we currently have on our roster and take a look at our needs. I see a lot of people are asking to add a power corner infielder, while I agree we need some power, and 1b and 3b is good place to do that, what I don’t agree is trading away pitching to get it.

Lets look at the Ryan Garko scenario, trading Street for Garko who is under contract for 4 years. So we’re going to stuff away Barton in AAA for 4 years? How does that benefit us in anyway??

We have 4 very talented and very young OF’s in Sweeney, CarGon, Buck and Cunningham. Not even mentioning Denorfia who looked very strong at the end of the year. Buck probably as the lowest trade value right now, so I don’t think we should trade him. CarGon probably has the highest trade value, but of the 4 above named OF’s he has the best power potential, so I don’t think we should trade him. I think Cunningham makes the best trade bait, he tore up the A’s minor’s this year and looked solid during his sting in Oakland. We keep Davis as our 4th outfielder.

We package Barton, Cunningham, and a lower level pitching prospect to go out and get a good power hitting 1st baseman. You guys can debate over who, I have a job, I don’t have THAT much time on my hands.

We can give Baisley a shot at 3rd with Chavez spelling him from to time. Chavez is our DH next year. We can keep Crosby at SS until Cardenas is ready for the bigs. Crosby isn’t that bad of a SS, he’s just not the big league SS we had all hoped he would be. Pennington/Patterson can fight it out over 2b at spring training, either one of those guys can produce at the plate the way Ellis did. I don’t believe Pennington is our SS for the future, he is much better suited at 2b.

If we can pull a deal like I just mentioned above we keep our biggest pitching prospects and we are not creating a huge log jam at the other positions like 1b, 3b, and OF.

by bdemartin on Sep 29, 2008 8:03 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I meant to add, but forgot..

I don’t agree with signing Furcal, we A’s fans have bitched for years about how Crosby can’t stay healthy, now we are all on board with signing an injury prone SS to replace him…what??? Stick with Crosby until Cardenas is ready.

by bdemartin on Sep 29, 2008 8:05 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Furcal is not injury prone; he had one specific injury once

and by all accounts Cardenas may not make it as a SS, though one can hope – but not count on and wait for.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Sep 29, 2008 8:11 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs