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I've lost the will to cheer

I'm out of ways to describe how terrible the A's offense is. Let me sum up: The A's received a hit from Crosby, Gonzalez, and Thomas today, and received three walks. That's the offense they put up to support their brand-new pitcher on the mound, who certainly deserved better than he got tonight.
 
With the exception of the first inning, where he let a two-out rally and a bomb leave him down 3-0, Gio settled in nicely and pitched a gem the rest of the way, pitching into the seventh, and looking good doing it. Unfortunately, thanks to the lack of A's hitters, Casilla, not Ziegler, replaced him, so the one batter he left on base eventually scored, taking him from a 3 run outing to 4. His line finished 6+ IP, 4 H, 4 ER, 2BB, 4K. I thought he pitched better than the numbers indicated, and he may have earned a win for a different team in baseball tonight.
 
Unfortunately, he made his major league debut for the 2008 Oakland A's, and their offense is painful. I'm surprised that pitchers just don't burst into tears having to take the mound for this team. After all, what is the point of pitching well? What is the difference between losing 5-1 and losing 2-1? How much pressure do you want to put on a young pitcher when he knows he can't give up more than a run or he will lose?
 
Despite doing their best to be no-hit tonight, the A's offense finally got on the board in the sixth with their first hit of the game, a solo homerun by Bobby Crosby. In the very next inning, they loaded the bases with no one out (in horrifying shades of last night), and failed to score. Yet again. You would think that even by accident that the A's could have scored in a least one of those situations. But when you score only 17 runs on your nine game losing streak, there isn't a lot of room for lucky and good things to happen to your team.
 
I'm tired of this. I would have rather lost the game tonight 10-9 than have to sit through inning after inning of scoreless baseball. I'm over pitching duels. I want some offense!
 
Duchscherer takes the mound tomorrow, trying to avoid an A's 10 game losing streak, while the rest of us do our best to cheer for maybe the three players left that we want to actually keep in our offense. And fun fact of the day, if you need more: Cust has now struck out 53 times in his last 101 ABs.
 
Same game, same time tomorrow. Hopefully a different outcome.

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"With 16-year-old Dominican righty Michel Inoa in tow, Gio Gonzalez improving at Triple-A and lefty Brett Anderson carving up Double-Abatters along with Simmons and Trevor Cahill, Oakland’s pitching depthis officially the envy of baseball." - BaseballAmerica.com

by Syphon on Aug 6, 2008 6:33 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

we're paying some dues

and many here are not used to it. Yeah, this sucks… you find out how much of a fan you are when you’re team goes through a stretch like this

That seventh inning when the A’s loaded ‘em up and failed to score was absolutely mizzerabull

by Brian in 317 on Aug 6, 2008 6:34 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The seventh inning

was an example of a team that has completely given up. Every game since the Blanton trade has been an example. I was pleading to my TV tonight for just a glimpse of effort from the A’s players, to no avail of course.

by somebodyelse on Aug 6, 2008 8:08 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

.......

Where do people come up with this garbage?

Jack Hannahan hit into a double play because he wanted to?

Should he have stood around at home plate snapping his bat in half to demonstrate “effort” instead of trying to beat it out?

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 8:17 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think that is his first GIDP all year right

For all his faults he has been incredible at not hitting into one until now. The only other DP was a liner or a fly ball DP.

I hate unproductive outs and the A's are producing them at record production

by Trainman on Aug 6, 2008 8:23 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I wouldn't go that far

And stop putting words in my post. I never said Hannamontanahan wanted to do poorly, I noted a lack of effort on this team offensively as of late. I feel like I’m watching spring training games, whereas their focus is on not getting injured more than winning. That’s where people get this garbage.

by somebodyelse on Aug 6, 2008 8:37 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You "feel like" you're watching spring training games

Therefore, the team has given up.

I don’t even want to go to the effort of figuring out how many links are missing in that logical chain.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 8:46 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You are great at

attacking the way an opinion is worded without actually providing a counterpoint. Your comments are nothing but meaningless insults. I’m done with this.

by somebodyelse on Aug 6, 2008 8:53 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

2-17 sure is indicative of a team whose effort is in question.

The RiverCats could do better than that against a big league schedule.

That said, “effort” might not be the best word for it. They can be trying very hard, but if they’re bewildered, demoralized, and lacking confidence, their effort is going to be extremely inefficient. Guys can get doubled off second like a Little Leaguer in environments like that.

It isn’t exactly “not trying.” “Not caring” might be a bettter term. And who can blame them, really? Why should they care?

"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico

by jeepers on Aug 6, 2008 9:15 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No, it's not really. It's just a very bad offense that is even worse than usual...

...combined with some pitching that has begun to falter.

They’re in a really bad rut and you can’t even say they don’t care. They’re just not a good team now. It has nothing to do with caring or not.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Aug 6, 2008 9:16 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Perhaps, but

I would hope folks would acknowledge that the grind of a 162 games, exacerbated by the sudden loss of guys you thought (rightly or wrongly) gave you your best chance at winning, then topped off with a brutal losing streak when nothing worked, would have a negative effect on pretty much any human being. Particularly ones who’d spent most of their lives winning at everything.

It’s silly to claim anyone’s not trying; it seems obvious, to me, that anyone would be demoralized. Which doesn’t help win ballgames, and IMHO surely can help lose them.

They want to steal the land papers which is why they have tried to break in. But they had to give up after being bitten by Chhotu.

by FreeSeatUpgrade on Aug 6, 2008 9:21 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I just don't get how you look at a group of competitive athletes

and suggest they probably don’t care. Yes they’re demoralized, and yes their confidence is shot, but they don’t care? You think it’s bothering you a lot but them not at all? If anything, I’d consider the possibility that some of their recent struggles come from pressing and trying to do too much – which is actually evidence of caring.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 9:18 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Their management told them they weren't good enough to win.

I don’t care how professional or competitive you are, being told you’re not good enough by your employer is going to affect your performance. It isn’t really intended as a slight against the players.

I can’t even find the word for it—”not caring” isn’t it, either. But this recent spate of suck is about more than just not being talented.

"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico

by jeepers on Aug 6, 2008 9:21 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It sounds like "demoralized" is the word,

and I agree they are demoralized. It’s very different from not trying or not caring, but is a problem.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 9:31 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The ability to perform can be crippling even when you're trying your hardest

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by DMOAS on Aug 6, 2008 9:32 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

This sort of thing

happened to the Mariners a couple years ago. We were trailing them by a couple games leading up to the trade deadline and we went out and traded for someone (I can’t remember the exact year/player right now). Seattle didn’t do anything and many players on their team, including team leader at the time Brett Boone, questioned management’s desire to win because they didn’t go out and get that player to put them over the top. They then proceeded to fade fast and we won the division.

"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin

by Helloooo 1st on Aug 7, 2008 1:31 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Again, agreed

I was on a terrible HS Basketball team. We came out early in the season optimistic, but when it became apparent that we sucked, we assumed that identity. It became who we were. The intensity to win was just not important. I know, the MLB is not HS basketball, but I read the body language and facial expressions of the latter half 2008 A’s as a disappointed group who have almost found the cellar and believe it is where they are destined for this season. I love the A’s, believe it or not, and didn’t mean to cause such angry responses. I just think the players have given up on having a winning season.

by somebodyelse on Aug 6, 2008 9:34 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Sure, but they're also professionals.

This is their job. Performing this year (or not performing, as the case may be) could very well make (or cost) them a great deal of money.

Trust me, these guys have reasons to be motivated. Millions of them.

by mikev on Aug 6, 2008 9:41 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I've had this experience with jobs

and couldn’t have cared less about the money when the environment is like that. Actually, I did care about the money, but only to the extent that I made sure to a) keep my head down; and b) hang on and be miserable because severance would be better than quitting.

"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico

by jeepers on Aug 6, 2008 9:44 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

So have I.

But, unless you’re talking about doing something on the professional athlete level, it’s not (potentially) millions of dollars at stake.

by mikev on Aug 6, 2008 10:40 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

T a large extent

I think you are right. But not all players, especially AAA guys, which compose a large part of our team this season, think like businessmen. Even Duke had some veiled unkind statements about where he thinks this team is expected to go given the recent mgmt moves.

by somebodyelse on Aug 6, 2008 9:52 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

All I know is this ...

Dropping names is kinda weak, but for the sake of this discussion … I had a long talk with Troy Neel one night at a dinner party … his words to me when discussing this very subject (whether or not players are apt to “mail in” games when the season is over, for all intents and purposes) were, “Yes, if you’re asking me if some players quit, absolutely. They normally don’t hang around the game much longer, but it’s true.” When I asked if it was possible that some fans “cared” more than some players, he laughed, and said, “I guarantee you some fans care more than some players. There are a bunch of guys who just look forward to their paycheck (especially when the season’s hopeless) and know they won’t play for their team much longer. Passionate fans are more invested.”
Now, I know the conversation didn’t go exactly like that - it was about 10 years ago now, but that’s pretty close.
In my opinion, I think players care most of the time, but I don’t think for a second, that at times like this - with the season “over” and in the midst of a horrible streak—that they don’t take games off in many ways. No way the A’s effort right now is as great as it was a month ago. No way.

I needed a team so I wouldn’t turn into one of the eighty million pink hat-wearing Bud Light-drinking mulleted idiots at Fenway.

by Vacafan on Aug 6, 2008 10:47 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Oh, I most definitely agree with that

And I wouldn’t sit here and claim there may not be a few people on the team mailing it in as we speak.

However, the impression I’m getting is that some people think the majority of the team is doing that and I just don’t believe it.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Aug 6, 2008 10:55 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The majority of the team? No.

Enough of them? Possibly.

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Aug 6, 2008 11:00 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And another thing to remember

is that most posters who believe that some or many of the A’s have “quit” simply mean they think that the mental preparation and effort isn’t there any longer. Very, very few people (if any) would claim that individuals don’t try and get a hit or whatever … and most people who are critical of this view realize that isn’t what most are implying, either. But because the naysayers can’t fathom for a minute that their “professionals” in green and gold would ever, ever, ever consider taking a night off mentally, they’ll just continue to tell you how stupid you are for believing it.

I needed a team so I wouldn’t turn into one of the eighty million pink hat-wearing Bud Light-drinking mulleted idiots at Fenway.

by Vacafan on Aug 6, 2008 11:29 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

+1

Again, my stance, but with much better eloquence.

by somebodyelse on Aug 6, 2008 11:55 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

This IS the RiverCats

... essentially.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 9:28 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

"The seventh inning was an example of a team that has completely given up."

Which part, then? The loading the bases part? The failing to get a run part? Toronto then getting a couple more runs in their half?

If they’d completely given up, you’d be seeing people not even bothering to try to get on base. It’s not like Ellis and Hannahan tried to waste the start they had to the inning.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Aug 6, 2008 8:47 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Didn't you feel like it was a miracle

that the bases got loaded in the first place? I did. How is that absurd?

by somebodyelse on Aug 6, 2008 8:44 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

True - they hadn't accomplished that

for weeks days oh wait they did it the day before. (With equally terrific results.)

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 8:59 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I missed that game, but

I would have thought it a miracle then, too, with equally terrific results.

by somebodyelse on Aug 6, 2008 9:03 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think of it more as...

...an example of Emil Brown playing like an idiot.

by rageon on Aug 7, 2008 6:59 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Wake me when it's over.

I’ve followed the A’s for 40 years, and I can’t remember a more feckless stretch of baseball as we’ve seen since the break. (But then, I can’t remember where I put my car keys when I came home.)

by gregorymark on Aug 6, 2008 6:40 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Rebuilding

I just laugh and turn off the T.V.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 6:42 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The worst A's offense ever.

The 30+ years I have been a A’s fan this is the worst offense team ever. Face it besides Carlos there is no future allstar in the lineup. 1 future hall of famer on his downside. 2 good young players in suzuki and sweeney. Then you have ellis and crosby who are average hitters. Barton would be in AAA on any other team. Cust would be a Ph off the bench. Hannahan a utility player. That is one lame lineup. Our bench has nothing not even a decent pinch hitter or a platoon player. Why patterson was sent down is beyond me. They never gave him a chance and he couyld be the spark plug needed. I am not going to waste my money paying to see some players with no heart and guts on a abaseball field.

by Arcman on Aug 6, 2008 6:43 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

a couple years away

just need to realize that the A’s arent going to be very good until then. Sorry but thats just the reality of it all. Enjoy what you can for what it worth for know.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 6:44 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You're undoubtedly correct....

...and we should consider ourselves fortunate that the A’s were as competitive as they were in the first half.

by gregorymark on Aug 6, 2008 7:03 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Street excuses

Forgot to add that pansy excuse for Street last night. He said I will try to sleep and forget about the lost and wake up tomorrow ready to pitch. He could care less. the pretty boy is sucking and doesn’t care.

by Arcman on Aug 6, 2008 6:45 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

No, he's doing what players have to do, especially pitchers.

If you have a bad game, you have to forget about it before you pitch again.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Aug 6, 2008 6:46 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

CIA finally perfected it's mind-reading drugs, did it?

Can you hook me up with your supplier? I figure it would be pretty useful to have lying around.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 6:47 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

its

not it’s

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 6:48 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I was just thinking that!

"God doesn't pay attention to your cute little hypotheticals." -- Jeff from LL

by oblique on Aug 6, 2008 7:08 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Thats the line

every closer gives following a blown save/loss. It’s the mentality you need in order to succeed.

"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin

by Helloooo 1st on Aug 7, 2008 1:34 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Cust wasn't the problem here...

His at-bat in the 7th inning was terrific—he clawed his way from down in the count and worked a walk, which was (theoretically) huge because it moved Thomas to third, i.e. into scoring position (for him). In fact, since it more or less moved TWO runners into scoring position with none out, it was about as good a walk as a walk can be.

It’s not his fault that Ellis proceeded to have an abysmal at-bat (taking two pretty obvious strikes, then flailing at a ball, barely making contact, and ending up in a force at home) and Hannahan then rolled over on a ball and hit into a double play.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 6:46 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   1 recs

Cust

I like Cust. Just not on our team.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 6:51 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I like him on our team -

just not with these supporting eight.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 6:52 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

OK

I like him on our team this year and next, but not the following.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 7:13 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Great Performance

Not what I expected from a strike out pitcher. I thought he would bring it harder. Whatever works.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 6:59 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Ellis

Not only did he take two obvious strikes, he paid more mind to rolling his eyes at the umpire about them than making the adjustment. The swing at the third one looked like an angry “oh, I bet you’re going to call that a strike too, huh?”

"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico

by jeepers on Aug 6, 2008 9:18 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That was a horrible at bat

OK, he takes strike 1 on the outside. Borderline. The pitcher decides to repeat and he looks at it. How about thinking like the pitcher and taking the ball to right field.

Ellis is very susceptible to pitches on the outer half. You will notice this in that seems to be his weakest spot (cold Zone). The pitcher was exploiting that. Then on the third pitch away he pulls it to SS and grounds out. He would have still had an RBI but for Frank running but that is basically a very shitty at bat IMO.

I hate unproductive outs and the A's are producing them at record production

by Trainman on Aug 6, 2008 9:43 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

And as critical of Hannahan as I have been

I cannot fault his at bat because;

1) He did swing at the first pitch (fouled it back but it was drivable) and;

2) He had not grounded into a DP all year as far as I know.

Yes, he made 2 outs but at least he tried to do something unlike the previous Ellis at bat.

I hate unproductive outs and the A's are producing them at record production

by Trainman on Aug 6, 2008 9:46 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I actually agree with you PT

In the game thread I ripped Ellis pretty good for that at-bat. (To the chagrin of many other posters, who insisted the first two strikes were horrible calls.)
And, I’ll agree that Jack Cust did a good job working a walk there.
But has there ever been a player in the history of the game that get s more credit for working a walk?? On-base-percentage should never, ever be considered on par with slugging pct. That’s why I don’t always drink the OPS Kool-Aid. In Little League, when you yell, “A hit’s as good as a walk!”, it’s because you know the kid can’t hit, and you don’t want him to feel bad for sucking. A walk is rarely ever as good as a hit.

I needed a team so I wouldn’t turn into one of the eighty million pink hat-wearing Bud Light-drinking mulleted idiots at Fenway.

by Vacafan on Aug 6, 2008 10:56 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I dunno how accurate MLB.com's Gameday is but it shows...

...the first pitch was off the plate outside, the second was borderline on the corner, and the one Ellis swung at was farther away than the first.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Aug 6, 2008 11:10 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Even more irritating that getting praised for walking is getting praise for making an out.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 7, 2008 12:47 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You and Henry Chadwick would get along rather well

since both of you are apparently of the belief that stats should reflect moral judgments about players rather than evaluations of whether they’re helping their team win or not.

If that’s your criterion, then frankly you can use whatever stat you want, because I just don’t give a crap. If you’re talking about helping teams win baseball games, there is not the slightest shadow of a doubt that OBP is the most important basic stat in baseball.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 7, 2008 10:14 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

correct: a walk is *not* as good as a hit

But that isn’t the point: the point is what to do on any given pitch to decrease the odds of avoiding making an out (and, yes, absolutely: scoring runs in the aggregate depends on SLG [and, heck, AVG to some degree], which necessitates occasionally doing more than merely “avoiding making an out”).

Earning a walk is definitely a skill (though its value is more in the “not-negative” sense of having avoided making an out), and Cust is really in the 99th percentile of that skillset.

There were a lot of stupid, long confusing words that I’m sure normal people don’t use. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Aug 7, 2008 10:42 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

whoops: *increase* the odds of avoiding making an out

There were a lot of stupid, long confusing words that I’m sure normal people don’t use. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Aug 7, 2008 10:42 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

+1

And, what’s more, Cust’s K looking to end the game was totally without the meaning implicitly ascribed to it by bbg at the end of her wrapup (and by the trollish reactions on the game thread). In that situation, an out is an out is an out - and a BB (forcing the reliever to throw more pitches, thereby exposing his repertoire for the rest of the A’s “hitters” and potentially tiring and frustrating the pitcher) in that situation is possibly worth more than a HR (yes, I know, not according to game outcome-probability charts). Cust’s main job there is to not make an out - and taking borderline pitches, especially for Cust, gave a greater probability of not doing so.

Now, if Cust himself had been the possible tying/winning run, it’s a different story …

There were a lot of stupid, long confusing words that I’m sure normal people don’t use. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Aug 7, 2008 10:36 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I noticed this earlier.

Our five highest paid players in order:

Chavy
Ellis
Crosby
Street
Embree

HIndsight is always 20/20 on stuff like this, so thats why I’m not making any assertions about it. But dang…

What about Barry?
"Barry who?" Forst said, and I felt like I was in the middle of a knock-knock joke.

by KMoAsFan on Aug 6, 2008 6:47 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The truth is.

Lew Wolf cant bankroll this team. He is doing what he thinks may help him financialy win in the future. 1. load up on you talent. 2. hope for a new stadium. 3 Hope the talent is good enough to fill the new stadium.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 6:48 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Strikeouts per AB are pretty useless wrt Cust

and most players really. Strikeouts per PA are much better indicators.

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by iamawesomer on Aug 6, 2008 6:50 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

20 walks in that span....

52 walks in 123 PA is horrid.

Bring back Hammer.

by OaktownPower on Aug 6, 2008 6:52 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It's about 40%

or, about what Cust normally does.

Slightly worse, but well within normal variation for him.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 6:56 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

This number gets my goat more about Cust.

He hits .111 with two strikes.

"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico

by jeepers on Aug 6, 2008 9:24 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The average player hits .180 with two strikes

The average player also hits for a higher average than Cust in every situation, so there’s even less of a gap there than that implies.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 9:30 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

So what you're saying is he's significantly below the average with 2 strikes?

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Aug 6, 2008 9:33 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That would seem clear

I’d bet he also strikes out a lot more on average with 2 strikes than most people do.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Aug 6, 2008 9:35 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Right - basically, if you're just looking at batting average,

most players are decent and become bad with two strikes, while Cust is bad and becomes awful with two strikes.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 9:36 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

But...but...walks!

Seriously, that sums Cust up very well. Great eye, though you have to wonder just how great it sometimes is with all the good pitches he takes. Walks a lot which is great for the OBP but like we’ve said before, his hitting skills themselves leave a lot to be desired.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Aug 6, 2008 9:38 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes, because he strikes out a lot...

which we already knew.

When he doesn’t strike out he’s a good two strike hitter. So saying he has a low average with two strikes is literally identical to saying he strikes out a lot. Which we already knew.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 9:35 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I guess so.

It’s just frustrating to have a batter who’s an automatic out with two strikes, then—and an automatic unproductive out, it seems.

"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico

by jeepers on Aug 6, 2008 9:47 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

ESPN Gamecast said

with bases loaded and no outs, the chances of scoring were 88.9 percent

That’s 10.1 percent chance of failing.

I guess if we look at it tomorrow and are lucky enough to have the bases loaded again with no outs, the percentage will be about 88.5 percent due to our suckiness (LOL)

I hate unproductive outs and the A's are producing them at record production

by Trainman on Aug 6, 2008 9:52 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Make that 89.9

I hate unproductive outs and the A's are producing them at record production

by Trainman on Aug 6, 2008 9:52 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

ah, I was waiting for this

That likelihood of scoring is based on aggregate offensive numbers across all teams for a (presumably) large sample of situations—in other words (and this is a simplification), the average chance for the average offense to score in that situation is 88.9%.

The A’s have a below-average offense, so their likelihood of scoring would be lower in that (or any) situation. And their likelihood of actually loading the bases is pretty low to begin with.

There were a lot of stupid, long confusing words that I’m sure normal people don’t use. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Aug 7, 2008 10:50 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Totally agree with that, Monkeyball

I hate unproductive outs and the A's are producing them at record production

by Trainman on Aug 7, 2008 1:38 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

How is that not saying

he’s good when he’s not bad? I don’t really intend for this to be bash on Cust. But it’s occurred to me that he really may not be as good a judge of the strike zone as he gets credited for. He’s just not that free a swinger so he winds up taking a lot of pitches and gets “lucky”. I mean, in little league et al. I was a horrifically bad hitter, but I sure as hell walked a lot without having to swing the bat. And while that’s not the greatest analogy to Cust, there is a certain comparison that can be made. But based on this season, either he’s just having a bad year (understandable considering the rest of the team) or he’s just a AAAA player who’s only value can be drawn by Home Runs + Walks which on their own don’t look half bad, but in the context of all his plate appearances, just looks meh.

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Aug 6, 2008 10:05 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If you get enough HRs and BBs the other PA don't matter that much.

Think Harmon Killebrew, Jim Thome, Adam Dunn…

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 6, 2008 10:07 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

ugh.

I didn’t know baseball could get me this depressed. THE A’S NEED TO START WINNING!

A book this team desperately needs: Chicken Soup for the Teenage A's.

by #14fan on Aug 6, 2008 6:51 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

THERE'S NO "A" IN...

...”losing”! (There no “A” in “winning” either.)

by gregorymark on Aug 6, 2008 7:06 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

There's an "A" in failing

No “A” in succeeding.

Procrastinators unite....tomorrow

by muffinpryde on Aug 6, 2008 9:14 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

There is an "A" in "Abercrombie" yet none in "Fitch"

I happen to think this is highly significant.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 9:19 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Can I play?

There’s an A in Waddell and and A in Canseco.

What’s my score?

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 6, 2008 10:08 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Only Haagan Daas Chocolate Chip has saved me

tonight. I’m up to 257 pounds but feeling a bit better.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 6:52 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Nico

I thought Gio threw harder then 90?

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 6:53 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I don't know; I've never seen him pitch

I thought he was more 90-92 MPH but I was glad to see him not trying to throw hard so much as to find the two sides of the plate.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 6:54 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I

Have him as throwing in the mid 90’s on his Bowman Chrome/

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 6:56 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I wonder

If he lost some velocity. Since his last trade?

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 6:56 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I've never heard mid-90s

but I was under the impression he had a “good fastball,” i.e. 92 MPH.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 6:57 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Keith Law claimed he threw mid-80s...

but everything I’ve read other than him (and I think he just saw Gio on a bad day) had him at high-80s touching low-90s, which is what I saw tonight.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 6:58 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

His fastball had some life, and when he

hit the outside corner with it the hitters couldn’t touch it. The problem with the pitch to Barajas was that he threw a fastball in a fastball count and left it up and out over the plate. Had he gotten it in to Barajas, or kept it away, or thrown a changeup and come back with a fastball later in the count, he would have been fine. Gio didn’t throw a single fastball off the plate inside today – he needs to learn to go inside, and when he does to really go inside, and his fastball will be plenty good.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 7:06 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Obviously DiNardo doesn't have a tenth of Gio's natural ability

but if he could learn the cutter from Lenny D, it could make him really good. He already (per Fosse) has a 4-seam and a 2-seam fastball.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 7:09 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yeah, I always like to see a pitcher either

have a sinker or a cutter. One thing that always concerned me about Blanton was that for a guy who gave up so many hits, he didn’t have a sinker. A cutter could give Gio an Andy Pettitte level ceiling – what it would do, more than anything, is allow Gio to throw more strikes on the inside corner.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 7:13 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He is a lefty.

He actually covers more of the plate when pitching inside to right handed batters.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 7:16 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I just hope

He can get some run support. you can get 0-6 on this team in a real hurry.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 7:19 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yeah, you need what, 5 starts?

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 7:23 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

5 Starts =

10 Runs. ? E.R.A 3.00 Yeah 0-6 For Sure.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 7:31 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Testify, Joe Blanton, testify!

You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the goddamn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all. ~Earl Weaver

by UncleLeo on Aug 6, 2008 7:55 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

looking forward to seeing you featured on

one of those cable channels “morbidly obese man blames favorite team skid on his present hospitalization…..pan to forklift lifting nico from home reinforced bed to gerry-rigged dump truck ambulance.

alaska A

by ak_A on Aug 6, 2008 7:01 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Gio's Scouting Report

Uncorks explosive low 90’s fastball… Mixes in A wicked over the top curveball and change- up that features a late drop… Good Command.
I guess your right low 90’s.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 7:04 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Geren must go

uninspired baseball
no leadership
bad coaching
bad bullpen management
lack of creativity

Let's have our Piazza and eat the Cust too - SPWC

by closetasfan on Aug 6, 2008 6:52 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Let's see...I'd say:

not his doing
wrong
wrong
wrong
wrong

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 6:54 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Scouting Report

Uncorks explosive low 90’s fastball… Mixes in A wicked over the top curveball and change- up that features a late drop… Good Command.
I guess your right low 90’s. Looking forward to his next start.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 7:05 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Wow!

Not half bad for a backup catcher who last played in 1993.

(Yes, AN 3.0 can go kiss my ass.)

They want to steal the land papers which is why they have tried to break in. But they had to give up after being bitten by Chhotu.

by FreeSeatUpgrade on Aug 6, 2008 7:48 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

i know ppl love hating on AN 3.0

But I think it is the best blog platform I’ve ever seen. A few misplaced posts (is it a bug? It hasn’t happened to me) are hardly a crucial flaw.

by ohmangoAs on Aug 6, 2008 9:40 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It's a running joke

AN can kiss my ass.

They want to steal the land papers which is why they have tried to break in. But they had to give up after being bitten by Chhotu.

by FreeSeatUpgrade on Aug 6, 2008 9:54 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Perhaps, Nico

He’s been set up to fail. I, personally, like Geren, but I wonder how long he’ll last under these conditions.

Stomper is a badass!

by lynnzgal on Aug 6, 2008 7:52 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The main problem I have with Geren, is, he was a catcher, Wakamatsu was a catcher, so

with all the damn catchers on the staff, they can’t teach Zooks to BLOCK THE DAMN PLATE!!!!!!!!!

by theblackpearl on Aug 6, 2008 7:54 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He did, and he will.

I think the thing we have to remember here is that there is little experience left to guide this team now.

Stomper is a badass!

by lynnzgal on Aug 6, 2008 7:56 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The flailing A's

that’s how I see them.

Stomper is a badass!

by lynnzgal on Aug 6, 2008 7:59 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think they have 3 catchers on the staff

and it took Foss the next to day ask him/tell him he should have simply walked off instead of re-tagging a runner on a play at the plate. To me that’s flat out disgusting. While I won’t assume that’s the norm when it comes to this coaching staff, but based on this and that Zukes always seems out of position once the ball goes into play, that’s not a good sign.

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Aug 6, 2008 8:22 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

BB LOVES Geren

He’s not going anywhere unless he wants to. And the front office knows that this season is their creation, not his. I am surprised however of this new negative attitude shown by the players. Maybe he could be handling that situation a little better.

by somebodyelse on Aug 6, 2008 7:57 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It's not his fault...

he has to pencil his choice of Crosby, Ellis, Brown, Hannahan, Barton, and Cust in the lineup.

What about Barry?
"Barry who?" Forst said, and I felt like I was in the middle of a knock-knock joke.

by KMoAsFan on Aug 6, 2008 6:54 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I guess if only he yelled, and disciplined his players every 4 seconds,

like Jim Leyland, the A’s would be having a season playing to their potential like this year’s Tigers.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 6:56 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'd really like to see him yell at more umps

Not for doing a bad job mind you, but to ask for help. I see it looking like this:
G: Oh for the love of hades, how could you call that pitch a strike!
U: Um… it went right down the middle of the plate Bob.
G: So the what? You don’t have to call it a strike EVERY time!
U: Um… kinda do Bob.
G: Well look who’s try to do a good job! Screw you dude! Have you seen the offense I have to work with?
U: Admittedly, they’re pretty offensive Bob.
G: Can’t you help a guy out?
U: Sorry. They suck. I can’t fix suck Bob.

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Aug 6, 2008 8:27 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

LOL QOTM

Procrastinators unite....tomorrow

by muffinpryde on Aug 6, 2008 9:18 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Let's not start

the “Fire Geren Now!” thread for at least a few seasons. He is managing a AAAA team right now.

by somebodyelse on Aug 6, 2008 7:37 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes

But he’s managing it like a AAA team?

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Aug 6, 2008 8:30 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The good news:

Gio looked like 2000 Zito transported forward in time by 8 years. Middling velocity, but movement on the fastball, a great snappy curveball (not often you see Eckstein strike out looking) and a changeup that started a little rough but eventually got a lot of bad swings. I could see him having some of Zito’s problems-particularly nibbling too much, which got him in trouble in the first inning- but the A’s would be thrilled if he had a career like Zito… as long as they aren’t the ones to sign him to his $126 million contract.

It’s probably a little early to start making comparisons to the Big Three, but Cahill, Anderson and Gio are a remarkably similar trio of pitchers…

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 7:06 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I guess the A's aren't going to promote Carter to AA this year

He certainly seems to have mastered A ball pitching. I don’t want the A’s to rush him, but I wonder if he’ll be fast-tracked at any point rather than spending all of next year at AA and all of 2010 at AAA. The A’s could use him any time, fo’ shizzle.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 7:25 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

White Sox

You know, I remember reading that the White Sox always felt Carter was a level-per-year kind of player. I wonder if the A’s could be thinking the same thing?

Sometimes life will strike you out on a curve ball and the only choice you have is to flip off the umpire and walk to first base anyway.

by Threepwood XX on Aug 6, 2008 8:03 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Seems like it to me

The limit on his ability offensively is always going to be his ability to make contact and avoid strikeouts. Rushing a guy typically causes his plate discipline to deteriorate because he struggles to make contact with the better pitches at the higher level.

Considering what Carter’s upside is, i.e. a 50 HR hitter, I’m willing to wait as long as I have to before he comes up if the team thinks it will help his development.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 8:21 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I agree

If only the A’s had signed a power hitting, gold glove third baseman long terms to fill the gap until Carter comes up in two years…

Sometimes life will strike you out on a curve ball and the only choice you have is to flip off the umpire and walk to first base anyway.

by Threepwood XX on Aug 6, 2008 8:35 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Agreed

Particularly on the last point. I’d rather have a guy like that very refined when he makes it to the majors (as much as a rookie can be at least). I feel like this for all major prospects that I rather as much as the growing pains as possible be dealt with in the minors to maximize the time we get of them at the major league level. Watching them spend 2/3 years to figure it out followed by only getting 3/4 years of their good years gets old fast.

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Aug 6, 2008 8:36 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Thanks for saving me the effort.

I was scrolling down to type just that regarding Gio. He looks like Barry Zito with a better fastball. That curve is delicious. It has Zito’s up and down, but more lateral movement, and he can throw it harder.

"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico

by jeepers on Aug 6, 2008 9:26 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I didn't see it drop as much as Zito's

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 6, 2008 10:09 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Dont forget Smith

He was a couple runs short of 15-6 this year. More like the big 4. Simmons is also on the rise big 5.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 7:08 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Too bad

All that pitching and no offense.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 7:09 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Travis Buck

Has Dan Johnson Disease.

Buy Who Billy Drafts Then Sell Them When They Get Traded!

by Triple Eh's on Aug 6, 2008 7:22 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

We are so bad...

I think the Giants can beat us.

"Hey dad my Jack Cust Bobblehead is batting right handed"....."He's not batting right handed he's striking out swinging."

by What Would Rickey Do on Aug 6, 2008 7:24 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Thanks... I really needed that

You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the goddamn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all. ~Earl Weaver

by UncleLeo on Aug 6, 2008 8:01 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

If Susan Slusser's intimations are correct,

and the A’s are looking for a major-league ready 3Bman (yes, please!), any hunches/ideas who that might be?

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 7:28 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

LaRoche!

In other news, I’m selling the cave I’ve been living in for the last six months in preparation for law school. Any takers?

(Speaking seriously… jeez, I’m having trouble with this one. Seems like damn near everyone out there is either a converted shortstop with a limp bat, a future outfielder with a limp glove, or Brandon Wood.)

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 8:30 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Allen Craig! Except on a closer look at his AA numbers

he is hitting waaaaay better at home than away. Is he in a hitter’s park?

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 8:35 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Hm, Texas League, so it's a hitter's league

Park, I’m not sure.

Sickels likes him, so that’s something.

As with shortstop, I’d like to see the in-house options (Guzman and Baisley) get some reps in this season before making a decision in the offseason as to whether the team needs to upgrade.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 8:42 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

firstinning.com

has figures for each of the minor league parks and their park effects.

"Innings eater? Depends on whether you want delicious innings or burnt, moldy innings. Kirk Saarloos is the Hot Pockets of inning eaters." - Gallagher's Watermelons

by notsellingjeans on Aug 6, 2008 9:01 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I have a bad feeling about Baisley

Guzman is nothing if not intriguing – I don’t know how “for real” he could be. I wouldn’t mind if he channeled Olmedo Saenz a bit.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 9:03 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Poor Gio.

Better get used to it, bud, ‘cause if you want to get a win, you’re gonna have to move the team to the NL, pitch a shutout, and hit a homer to provide your own run support. But hey, this guy can get his passport from Miami to Chicago before hopping a flight to Toronto, so maybe he can work this out too.

by whiteshoes40 on Aug 6, 2008 7:35 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Bwahahahahahaha!

HA!

Mark Ellis: sent down from Heaven to rob Evil of hits and hand out rainbows

by Jennifer on Aug 6, 2008 7:38 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That sounds like a victorious evil laugh from a villain.

So this is all your fault. Do you have the A’s offense trapped in your basement or something?

by whiteshoes40 on Aug 6, 2008 7:41 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I wish.

Mark Ellis: sent down from Heaven to rob Evil of hits and hand out rainbows

by Jennifer on Aug 6, 2008 7:46 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

So if we open the offense, bats and raptors will fly out?

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 6, 2008 10:09 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

We already partially opened it

It’s called the Mitchell Report

Green Hulk Fists

by oaklandSMASH on Aug 6, 2008 10:15 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Keith Ginter

I just wanted to point out that it could always be worse.

"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s

by Nick on Aug 6, 2008 7:40 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

which was better ??

Page ellis
gross crosby
piciolo cust
klutts suzuki
armas sweeny
revering thomas
sanguelen gonzalez
dilone hannahan
guerrero barton

by Arcman on Aug 6, 2008 7:47 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Carlos, Cust, Suzuki, Barton and Sweeney are keepers from this year's team

Armas the only keeper off the late 70’s team. Maybe Gross. Mitchell was a shame.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 6, 2008 8:45 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I wish I agreed with that, but the more I see Sweeney

the more I’m convinced he’s a solid 4th OFer and not a “keeper” – I hope and expect Cunningham will be, and Gonzalez definitely is. So you can run Cust out there every day and get a DH who mashes, and be ok, or you can add a masher to your OF and be ok. But I’m not on the Sweeney love train – he still seems to me like more of a .270/.340/.380 hitter than not – basically Jason Kendall in a bigger body.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 9:02 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

A 23 yo who's basically skipped AAA and coming off an injury

with a 100 OPS+ and good defense isn’t chopped liver. Also I believe that a fourth OF is very important to the A’s. They play a lot! Brown has 327 ABs this year.

I’d personally like Buck to be among the starting three, but I’m not convinced Cunningham is even as good as Sweeney.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 6, 2008 10:15 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

well, it's not that he doesn't have value

it’s just that people are seeing him as way above average.

I’m not sure about Cunningham either… but regardless, if Ryan hadn’t been as lucky as he has been, we’d be grouping him w/ Barton. That AVG is the only thing he’s had going

by ohmangoAs on Aug 7, 2008 12:13 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Who is this 23 y/o who basically skipped AAA and is coming off an injury?

Seriously, who? It’s not Ryan Sweeney, none of those things (ok, he’s 23) apply to him.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 7, 2008 10:21 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

That's the point,

add a little improvement, and regress his babip down, and you get his current season as being his future.

People are accounting for/projecting improvement, without discounting for his luck.

by ohmangoAs on Aug 7, 2008 12:15 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Well his low walks and XBH are a cause for concern. It's just that I don't see him

being among our 20 biggest problems.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 7, 2008 12:51 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

if everybody on this team hit like Swooney this year...

the A’s would be in 1st place.

Foolsh, the most insane regular poster on AN since oaktoon left - salb

by FoolshGame22 on Aug 6, 2008 11:13 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I wish a whole team could have a

350ish BABIP too. Unfortunately, it’s usually just one player having a small sample luck spree. Barton had a 368 Babip last season in MLB. Bring that down to his current .276, and you see where he now stands.

by ohmangoAs on Aug 7, 2008 12:18 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Shittttttttt ... MItchell Page was a far better hitter than anyone on that list.

I needed a team so I wouldn’t turn into one of the eighty million pink hat-wearing Bud Light-drinking mulleted idiots at Fenway.

by Vacafan on Aug 6, 2008 11:00 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes, too bad about him.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 7, 2008 12:55 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I read this in the lost and found today

Lost. The ability to hit a baseball with a baseball bat. Other missing items include the ability to touch home plate and a closer named street. If found please contact Billy Beane of the oakland athletics.

by Arcman on Aug 6, 2008 7:54 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Litttle League Offense

This is pretty much what the A’s have right now. It boggles the mind how bad this team is offensively right now. They make “bad” sound good.

by KCa's on Aug 6, 2008 8:08 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Can this be the bottom

Nope we will finsh off the season as one of the worst teams in baseball this year and for what to rebuild (aka get some good young players get them good and then trade em) getting old A’s Wolf how about giving up on moving the team to a shit hole and get us some bats !!!!

ChrisB

by ChrisB on Aug 6, 2008 8:11 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

At this point

I actually wouldn’t mind winding up as the worst team in baseball. Get that very early pick along with the depth we already have. That would be pretty big.

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by DMOAS on Aug 6, 2008 8:42 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Don't worry, there's no chance of that

The A’s aren’t actually the worst team in baseball, and many other (horrible) teams have huge head starts on them in the loss column…

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 8:44 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think they can catch the Giants for 4th worst.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 6, 2008 8:45 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

How?

The Giants offense is just as bad, and their pitching is worse…

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 6, 2008 8:47 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes, but they're not playing .100 ball and they're only 6 games behind.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 6, 2008 8:48 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I don't know

We’re only 11 games out. With our offense, I think we could catch up. We can certainly make a run at it.

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Aug 6, 2008 8:47 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Nevermind

Washington, Seattle & San Diego all REALLY suck.

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by DMOAS on Aug 6, 2008 8:59 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Watched the game and was not surprised by the outcome, took a nap and just woke up

reality sucks.

If this is growing pains, the A’s better have the best record in the league two years from now to validate this shit.

Green Hulk Fists

by oaklandSMASH on Aug 6, 2008 8:20 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I don't care about having the best record

A World Series title would be enough for me.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Aug 6, 2008 8:23 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It's just hilarious at this point

And people thought I was crazy for saying that Seattle would end up above us in the standings.

Might as well Jump! - Van Halen

by sprtsnwyn on Aug 6, 2008 8:21 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I've lived in Seattle. I've see the Mariners. Athletics, you're no Seattle Mariners.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 6, 2008 8:46 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

The ESPN game wrap

Suzuki very impressed with Gio. The kid was happy to put up all those zeros and said he was humbled by the first inning experience.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/recap?gameId=280806114

I hate unproductive outs and the A's are producing them at record production

by Trainman on Aug 6, 2008 8:21 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

But was Gio impressed with Suzuki?

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 6, 2008 8:46 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Minor league notes of note...

- Keith Foulke can’t get AAA hitters out either: 2 IP, 3 ER, 2 HRs tonight. He gave up a HR to Josh Phelps, Phelps’ 27th of the year.
- It looks like Adrian Cardenas has been called up to AA Midland
- Josh Donaldson is 1 for 1 so far tonight, now hitting .409 for Stockton

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 8:29 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Shooting for the lowest of low

Now that I think of it, maybe even the one bright spot, Gonzales settling down after the 1st inning, may be an illusion. Maybe the Jays know that they’ve scored 3 runs, and the game is over, and they just decided to shut it down offensively.

Yes it’s a ridiculous theory, but it’s now a equally ridiculous season.

by asfansince1989 on Aug 6, 2008 8:35 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I thought

that Suzuki’s pitch calling, especially in the first inning, just showed that he didn’t know or trust Gio very well…
for instance, I don’t think he would have called that inside fastball to Barajas for any of his other pitchers, but I feel he didn’t think Gio could throw a strike with anything else.
Gio then showed, however, that he has extremely good command (most of the time) of his curveball, and decent changeup command.
I think once Zooks starts to get comfortable with Gio, we’re going to start seeing some great outings.

"Life is a horizontal fall" -Jean Cocteau

by King Richard on Aug 6, 2008 8:47 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Was I the only one that wasn't that impressed by Gio?

Pedestrian fastball, great curve, solid change up, mediocre control.

Hope I’m wrong, but nothing to really get too excited about IMO.

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 6, 2008 8:49 PM PDT reply reply actions actions   0 recs

My complaint is that it didn't look like Gio was trying

How one actually sees this, I don’t know, but I’ve just decided it must be true because he got the loss.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 9:05 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I wasn't very impressed with what I saw

But then all I saw was that last batter he faced.

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by DMOAS on Aug 6, 2008 9:16 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I totally agree.

He just didn’t care tonight. I think that he should have plunked Scutaro in the face. That would have proven that he was showing some effort. I just decided that too. But, I am now realizing that some opinions are not allowed here.

by somebodyelse on Aug 6, 2008 10:21 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Not especially, no

I liked the fact that he’s already comfortable enough with his change up that he can go to it in fastball situations and his curve ball is definitely legit, but I really don’t think he fooled or dominated the Blue Jays’ hitters as his string of consecutive outs might suggest.

I think he got to face a pretty crappy team and I am really interested in seeing how he does against TB

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 6, 2008 9:24 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Can you give any specific examples?

What I saw, during the string of outs, was that he was consistently hitting the outside corner with his fastball, mixing up his pitches and keeping the changeup down, and that hitters were not squaring the ball up.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 9:34 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Barajas' 2nd AB

where he just missed jacking another one. That one AB where he threw two curveballs back to back that were WAY out of the zone. Marco Scutaro staring at BP fastballs that caught plenty of plate.

Sure, the Jays weren’t squaring up the ball, but as of right now, I think that had more to do with them facing a brand new pitcher in MLB than Gio fooling them with his supposedly great stuff.

Bottom line, Gio does not have dominating or overpowering stuff. For him to have success in this league, especially with that straight as an arrow 89 MPH fastball, he’ll have to learn to make adjustments and become a pitcher’s pitcher.

Am I saying he won’t do that? No, he’s young and has plenty of promise. I was very impressed with his curve ball and his confidence in the change up, but as far as first starts go he did not impress me the way Zito did, for example.

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 6, 2008 9:49 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

As is often the case, two elements will be key:

1. fastball command
2. movement on the fastball

The good news is, the offspeed pitches are probably already where they need to be if the above happens. I’m not too concerned, though, about stuff like the three straight ball curves – that’s overthrowing and par for the course in a major league debut.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 6, 2008 9:53 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

His fastball command was pretty good tonight,

but given all the BBs he gives up, it seems like it usually isn’t that great. And it was not so good in the first. That’s the trouble with having your best pitch(s) be an out pitch(s). If he gets ahead 0-1, he’s in great shape, but if he gets behind, he has to either throw his mediocre fastball with a high chance of getting hit hard, or throw the offspeed stuff which will lead to a lot of BBs.

The A's colors are green and gold.

by mikeA on Aug 6, 2008 10:32 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Isn't everybody's best pitch an out pitch?

He’s gotta be confident in throwing any pitch in any count. I thought he did that tonight.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Aug 7, 2008 12:57 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Few pitchers are comfortable throwing a pitch

that breaks hard in a hitter’s count, because most hitters are not going to swing. He needs the changeup to work for those sorts of counts (or a better fastball). The changeup looked good enough, and that’s the sort of pitch I bet he’ll improve.

The A's colors are green and gold.

by mikeA on Aug 7, 2008 10:42 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

yup

I guess I just wasn’t that impressed because it’s nothing we haven’t seen before plenty of times: a lefty with a good curve ball and a mediocre fastball.

It didn’t impress me, but that doesn’t mean he won’t be a solid pitcher.

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 6, 2008 11:10 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

An average FB is about 89-91 mph.

That’s exactly what Gio was around. So I wouldnt call it mediocre.

"With 16-year-old Dominican righty Michel Inoa in tow, Gio Gonzalez improving at Triple-A and lefty Brett Anderson carving up Double-Abatters along with Simmons and Trevor Cahill, Oakland’s pitching depthis officially the envy of baseball." - BaseballAmerica.com

by Syphon on Aug 6, 2008 11:11 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Yes it pretty much is.

Can you name a Lefty that throws 95+ Consistently? Only one that comes to mind for me is Kershaw.

"With 16-year-old Dominican righty Michel Inoa in tow, Gio Gonzalez improving at Triple-A and lefty Brett Anderson carving up Double-Abatters along with Simmons and Trevor Cahill, Oakland’s pitching depthis officially the envy of baseball." - BaseballAmerica.com

by Syphon on Aug 6, 2008 11:16 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Well Billy Wagner does but hes a closer.

"With 16-year-old Dominican righty Michel Inoa in tow, Gio Gonzalez improving at Triple-A and lefty Brett Anderson carving up Double-Abatters along with Simmons and Trevor Cahill, Oakland’s pitching depthis officially the envy of baseball." - BaseballAmerica.com

by Syphon on Aug 6, 2008 11:16 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think I'd be comparing him to starters only for this, yeah.

Throwing harder for an inning is definitely not the same as for six or so.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Aug 6, 2008 11:25 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

i can name plenty of lefties that throw a faster fastball than Gio

and that throw it above the “average” mark.

CC, Johan, Randy, Sanchez, Miller, Price, Kazmir, Bedard, Parra, Danks

All these guys consistently get their fastball in the low 90s. Gio topped 90 three times out of like sixty fastballs and averaged under 89 MPH for this outing.

Of course, the names mentioned above don’t throw it 95+ on a consistent basis, but I have no idea why you chose that as the arbitrary marker.

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 7, 2008 1:33 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I choose 95 becasue basically no one throws

that hard as a lefty starter other than Kershaw and Price.

"With 16-year-old Dominican righty Michel Inoa in tow, Gio Gonzalez improving at Triple-A and lefty Brett Anderson carving up Double-Abatters along with Simmons and Trevor Cahill, Oakland’s pitching depthis officially the envy of baseball." - BaseballAmerica.com

by Syphon on Aug 7, 2008 11:53 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

no one is asking or expecting Gio to throw 95

but he only hit 91 three times out 60+, never touched 92, and averaged under 89.

If you think that will be good enough the 2nd or 3rd time around the league, with his spotty command, so be it. He’s leaving me, however, with a lot left to be desired.

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 7, 2008 12:21 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Speed doesn't matter as much as keeping hitters off balance.

Last night Barajas said Gonzalez did that well after the first inning because he was willing to throw different pitches in different situations compared to expected ones.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Aug 7, 2008 1:30 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Having the ability to keep hitters off balance

is not something I’m ready to credit a guy making his first major league start.

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 7, 2008 2:48 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I'm not saying that skill isn't important

In fact, I’m saying that’s a skill that Gio absolutely needs to develop in order to have success with his stuff.

However, I’m not ready to say that he can keep hitters off balance. He’s made one major league start. Pitchers usually have the advantage against hitters they haven’t seen before and last night could have been no different.

As I said, I’m eager to see his next start and to see his 2nd and 3rd time around the league. We’ll see how fooled MLB hitters will be then.

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 7, 2008 5:40 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

He'll definitely be in the bottom half of starters in terms of velocity

maybe not as far as lefties.

The A's colors are green and gold.

by mikeA on Aug 6, 2008 11:15 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

really, you wouldn't?

average means mediocre in my book.

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 7, 2008 1:12 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

You got some weird ass book then.

"With 16-year-old Dominican righty Michel Inoa in tow, Gio Gonzalez improving at Triple-A and lefty Brett Anderson carving up Double-Abatters along with Simmons and Trevor Cahill, Oakland’s pitching depthis officially the envy of baseball." - BaseballAmerica.com

by Syphon on Aug 7, 2008 1:18 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

if you consider a thesaurus weird, sure

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 7, 2008 1:26 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

In conventional English usage, "mediocre" does not mean "average"

It is typically used to mean “somewhat below average.”

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Aug 7, 2008 10:44 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

mediocre equals

middling, moderate

average = moderate, in the middle

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 7, 2008 10:59 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

It wasn't right around 89-91. His fastball averaged 88.75

big difference from 90

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 7, 2008 1:23 AM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Majority of his fastballs were 88, 89 and not 91, 92

as was expected. That 2 MPH difference is a big deal.

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 7, 2008 4:04 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I think that part of that is that

Gio has a pretty regular curve as opposed to the big, looping 12-to-6 curve that Zito had. Zito’s pitch was just ridiculous, but Gio’s has more of a traditional break to it. At the same time it appears to break harder than Zito’s, so maybe the chances of him getting hit hard are minimized because he won’t hang as many.

I liked the performance. Yeah I thought his fastball had a little more velocity than it does, but he seemed to be able to work both sides of the plate pretty consistently.

by Blez on Aug 6, 2008 10:04 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

good point about zito's curve vs gio's

"Do you know that the guy really doesn't like baseball all that much?" - J.P. Riccardi

by black beane on Aug 6, 2008 11:09 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

I was also not very impressed

The A's colors are green and gold.

by mikeA on Aug 6, 2008 10:27 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Its not "Much" better.

Gio was 88-92 tonight…

"With 16-year-old Dominican righty Michel Inoa in tow, Gio Gonzalez improving at Triple-A and lefty Brett Anderson carving up Double-Abatters along with Simmons and Trevor Cahill, Oakland’s pitching depthis officially the envy of baseball." - BaseballAmerica.com

by Syphon on Aug 6, 2008 10:55 PM PDT to parent up reply reply actions actions   0 recs

Also reading reports on Gio..

Ones I cant seen to find again. Said his MPH threw the season has differed greatly. Sometimes 88-90 and sometimes 90-03.

"With 16-year-old Dominican righty Michel Inoa in tow, Gio Gonzalez improving at Triple-A and lefty Brett Anderson carving up Double-Abatters along with Simmons and Trevor Cahill, Oakland’s pitching depthis officially the envy of baseball." - BaseballAmerica.com

by Syphon on Aug 6, 2008 11:18 PM PDT