Athletics Nation: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Sports blogs for fans, by fans.
Around SBN: Maryland Fails First Test, Falls to Cincinnati

Can The A's Realistically Improve their Offense Via Trade

It would seem, at first glance, that an offense that seems so bad so often would be easy to upgrade.  However, most of our players are just good enough, young enough, and cheap enough that meaningful upgrades would be difficult/impossible.  In analyzing potential upgrades, I am using the following assumptions:

  1. We can't acquire someone with an obscene salary (Giambi is off the table)
  2. We won't trade youth to acquire someone on the far end of their peak years
  3. All players who can provide an improvement RIGHT NOW are in the Major Leagues.

With those assumptions in mind, here we go:

C: Kurt Suzuki (24 - $395K), .252/.314/.302

He's young, he's cheap, and although a .616 OPS isn't great it is 11th amongst all qualified catchers.  Amongst those better, high salaries eliminate Mauer, B. Molina, AJ Pierzynski, Kendall, V. Martinez, and Pudge.  Additionally, I think it's safe to say that McCann and Martin are untouchable.  This leaves Geovany Soto (25 - $401) and Yadier Molina (25 - $1.8M).  The first place Cubs and second place Cards aren't going to be parting with their young, successful starting catchers.

Possibility of Upgrade: Zero

1B: Daric Barton (22 - $390K), .229/.335/.343

He's young, he's cheap, but unlike Suzuki his performance is awful.  He has the second lowest OPS amongst qualifying first basemen.  Although we're all hoping he pans out eventually, improving ourselves here could do a lot of good.  After we do salary eliminations, we have (in order by OPS)

  • A. Gonzalez (SD is in bad shape, but they need more offense too)
  • C. Jackson (Arizona won't be interested)
  • Youkilis (Boston probably likes their team as is, but they might like Blanton)
  • P. Fielder (Nope, Milwaukee sees him as the franchise)
  • Votto (ditto)
  • Kotchman (Angels aren't trading with us, they have no meaningful backup)
  • Loney (Doubtful, they don't have a backup who can hit)
  • Millar (Old, but maybe)
  • Garko (Indians don't have a backup)

Basically, Youkilis would be a huge huge upgrade, he's only 29, and the Sox have a good backup, but it would take a lot more than Blanton to do it.  I can't imagine that this is possible.  I don't think the Dodgers are looking to trade Loney (although they could certainly use the pitching).  Maybe if they tail off or their starting 5 go down.  Kevin Millar has better stats, but he's 36 and this is the right year to let Barton adjust if he's our future.

Possibility of Upgrade: Very Low

2B: Mark Ellis (31 - $5M), .250/.335/.409

Unfortunately, this might be our last year with Ellis.  He's my favorite A in awhie, so it's hard to be objective, but between his great D and 10th ranked OPS he'd be hard to improve on.  With his salary, we'd have to make a follow up deal after grabbing someone since we can't have a $5 million bench player.  As far as replacements, Uggla isn't going anywhere with the Marlins having such a season, and Texas wouldn't trade Kinsler (or any hitter) for pitching.  The Reds aren't trading Brandon Phillips since every other infielder they own the rights to has been injured playing shortstop.

There is one semi-possibility, however, as Atlanta is in desperate need of quality starters, is struggling through a lot of pretty serious injuries, and has a good young second baseman in Kelly Johnson.  They wouldn't move him for just Blanton, but maybe there's a fit.  He would be an undeniable upgrade with his .290/.357/.471 line as a 26 year old making $430K.

Possibility of Upgrade: Low

3B: Eric Chavez (30 - $11.5M), .279/.340/.419

Since he's newly returned, Jack Hannahan is the A who qualifies at 3B, and he has the worst OPS of any third baseman in the league.  Adding Chavez is all the bump we're going to get, though, as his salary means he's our guy.

Possibility of Upgrade: ZERO

SS: Bobby Crosby (28 - $3.5M), .263/.322/.378

Bobby is 11th in OPS among qualifying shortstops (with the same OPS as Jeter).  Hanley Ramirez, Reyes, Drew, and Theriot are untouchable.  Christian Guzman isn't a player I'd really want anyway.  This brings us back to the Braves, and Yunel Escobar.  The fit here isn't as good, as Crosby is younger than Ellis, Escobar is less of an upgrade than Johnson, and Crosby has a contract for next year.

Possibility of Upgrade: Very Low

LF: Jack Cust (29 - $410K), .253/.416/.463

RF: Emil Brown (33 - $1.4M), .246/.284/.368

RF: Travis Buck (24 - $400K), .160/.235/.321

Cust is a defensive liability, Brown is garbage, and Buck is really struggling this year.  The Chronicle is saying that Buck might be sent back down for R. Sweeney (who, for now, I'll get to in a minute as a CF).  If we're sending Buck down, we have Brown, Cust, Sweeney, CarGon, and Davis up.  Davis is a bench player but worth having to pinch run.  Brown is the candidate for upgrade (we'd probably just DFA him), and getting a good outfielder would allow us to use Cust at DH, CarGon/Sweeney/New Guy in the outfield.  The only problem is finding someone.

Since there are so many outfielders, I'm limiting this list to good, cheap corner outfielders on bad teams with 800+ OPS.

  • Jason Bay: He's the high end of the salary scale, but he would be a major improvement and he's signed for $7.5M next year.  I would love this, and the Pirates might well be sellers again.
  • Xavier Nady: He hits Right and has an .878 OPS.  He'd be arbitration eligible for next year.
  • Luke Scott: He's 29, cheap, and has an .871 OPS.  We could use him.
  • Corey Hart: I've seen his names around AN a bit.  At 26 he's got his career ahead of him.  With an .851 OPS he definitely helps our outfield.  He's even cheap with a $444K salary.  No doubt he'd look good in Green and Gold.

This is the area where we can really get better.  If Pittsburgh decides to sell, they could well make Bay available.  If not, Nady would be a very useful addition.  Scott and Hart would also be nice to have (although it's too bad Scott's a lefty).

Possibility of Upgrade: Possible

CF: Carlos Gonzalez (22 - $?K), .260/.275/.420

CF: Ryan Sweeney (23 - $395K), .293/.353/.407

Young.  Good.  Cheap.  There isn't a reasonable option out there with a better OPS than Sweeney, and we should probably be letting both of these guys play as much as possible since they're looking so good and our corner situation is so bad.

Possibility of Upgrade: ZERO

DH: Jack Cust (29 - $410K), .253/.416/.463

DH: Frank Thomas (40 - $12.5M), .258/.372/.444 (.319/.417/.516 with A's)

With Thomas out, Cust is a good DH option.  When Thomas comes back, we've got a great DH.  His A's numbers would place him second on the OPS list (behind the one we let get away, Milton Bradley) and his overall numbers would place him 4th (also behind Matsui and Ortiz).  There is no reason to trade for a DH.

Possibility of Upgrade: ZERO

Poll
Which Player do you think the A's should target? (taking trade costs/likelihood of success into account)
1B: James Loney
31 votes
2B: Kelley Johnson
8 votes
SS: Yunel Escobar
16 votes
OF: Jason Bay
101 votes
OF: Xavier Nady
38 votes
OF: Luke Scott
4 votes
OF: Corey Hart
57 votes
No one. We scored 15 Runs against the Angels May 1.
61 votes

316 votes | Poll has closed

3 recs  |  Comment 192 comments

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Display:

I think you're making a big assumption eliminating expensive guys

The A’s are way down in payroll. It’s quite possible they could take on an expensive guy for the next couple of years. At least that’s what I hope.

I think what would most improve this team is to cash in a lot of resources for a superstar. If the A’s could trade for a guy like McCann or Hanley, I would be ecstatic despite how crazily expensive it may be. The Braves might possibly in a parallel universe consider moving McCann, as they need a 1b of the future with Teix leaving after the year, have pitching needs (mainly bullpen), and could use a LF upgrade. Cust, Barton, Suzuki (to replace McCann), Street, Blanton, and a prospect or two would fulfill all those needs for the Braves even though they lose a superstar. Of course we would create a hole at 1b and that kind of turnover very rarely happens, especially midseason. But, to me, McCann would be worth it.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Jun 13, 2008 5:36 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Well worth THAT?

I’m sorry, which brand of wacky tobacky are you smoking here?

The A’s do have to actually field a 25-man roster, you know.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 5:47 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

"I don't agree with that trade,

but I won’t insult you for suggesting it.”

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 13, 2008 6:14 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ah, that perfectly conveys my reaction

Wait. No, it doesn’t.

Are you going to start doing this to everyone? Because if not, I’m going to start flagging these for personal harassment. Get over yourself.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 14, 2008 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Not everyone replies to an idea with a comment

that implies the user must be on drugs to have such a dumb idea and then condescendingly suggests the user might not understand the number of players on a major league roster.

No, my quote did not capture what you conveyed – it captured what you are supposed to convey. A better “fix the belittlement” quote would be…”No way – the trade you propose would leave our roster far too short-handed at other positions.”

No need to imply a lack of mental faculties, or a lack of baseball understanding, among your fellow bretheren. Get over that, or you will not be long for AN. We’re about to crack down (in general), because the moderators are sick of it.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 1:19 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

......................

speaks for itself.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 14, 2008 1:32 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hmm...Probably not worth it.

It’s an interesting idea, though. Maybe I’ll sheep sleep on it.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 3:34 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

they really are no different than the snide comments you deride

I think many in the community dislike the bestiality references and have asked you to stop, yet you persist. Beastiality offends the sensibilities much more than sarcasm. Im generally a lurker and quite enjoy Paul Thomas’ wit and sarcasm especially when it is deserved.

Brian McCann’s best win shares above bench in a season: 14
Blanton Cust Street Suzuki and Barton: 24

and thats not even including the prospects that the original poster wants to send to ATL. Also we would be giving atlanta significantly more years of control which would mean that this deal would only get worse over time for the A’s. In a word the idea was stupid.

Some of the most violent things I’ve ever seen were at Raiders games. And I’ve been to jail. - leopold bloom

by designatedforassignment on Jun 14, 2008 9:38 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Beastiality offends the sensibilities?

Geez, don’t have a cow.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 9:44 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

im just saying

there was an entire fanpost about the lack of a family friendly nature of the site and many agreed with the post.

The point was you can either be ridiculously strict which would prohibit you from making the jokes or you can let everybody just chill

Some of the most violent things I’ve ever seen were at Raiders games. And I’ve been to jail. - leopold bloom

by designatedforassignment on Jun 14, 2008 10:14 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

The fanpost was about profanity,

not about the beautiful love that can be shared by a lonely man and a slightly confused goat.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 11:01 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

C'mon, apples and oranges

At this point, if Nico weren’t some hopelessly confused mishmash of schoolteacher, A’s fan, goat lover, and somewhat clueless schoolgirl, no one would know what to make of him. Besides, he’s… probably… not actually advocating man-on-goat action here. I can understand how some could be a little squeamish, but how sheltered should we try to be on this site?

But the key is that Nico’s farm animal fantasies are good-natured. No actual goats – or people – were harmed or even yelled at. The idea behind AN from the time Blez created it is that it is an inclusive community, not a mean little exclusive club in which the cool kids ridicule and drive out all the rubes who haven’t scored at least 780 on their sabermetric SATs.

by Faust on Jun 15, 2008 7:07 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

You forgot

somewhat clueless schoolgoat, but otherwise, yeah, what he said.

No goats were harmed or ridiculed in the posting of this comment.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 15, 2008 8:32 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

People who are offended by the "bestiality" jokes best stay way,

and regular users will be happy if they do so. I’ve been much more offended by some of Nico’s baseball posts, but not for awhile…. (:

The A's colors are green and gold.

by mikeA on Jun 14, 2008 9:48 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Personally

I find Nico about as offensive as Jason Kendall.

"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

--Bilbo Baggins

by kaweahkaweah on Jun 14, 2008 11:56 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

OK, I get you

But for a moment there I was wondering what you had against Nico – by the time Kendall left most of us found him pretty offensive (mostly because of his inoffensiveness)

by Faust on Jun 15, 2008 5:53 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Whatever, dude

If you want to report me for that, go ahead. That’s your prerogative.

I would love to keep posting on AN, but if a comment of that nature is verboten, well, I’m just not going to worry about it that much. I’ve never encountered any internet site which had even close to such a draconian speech code that that would be illegal.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 14, 2008 4:20 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

And I've never visited another site

in which an individual so consistently and frequently posts comments as snide, condescending, and self-satisfied as yours. It’s gotten to be oh so very tiresome. I’ve always wondered whether you’re Randy Bell reincarnated in some opposite form.

I’m afraid I couldn’t restrain myself. So, moderators, fire away.

by Ray of Lite on Jun 14, 2008 5:02 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Thank you, Ray of Life, from the bottom

of my heart, for posting that. There are no victims on this site, just targets, and AN will not be hijacked.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 5:15 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 14, 2008 5:19 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Somehow

I feel like my post just lost something it can never get back.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 6:44 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Recommended - I could not have put it better

had I a cherry on top.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 9:15 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'll probably make it out...

although I suppose it would be odd if I were to show up after having been banned…

And if one stubbornly clings to the notion that they will not change to satisfy the mores and social rules of that community (online or any other) then it’s within the community/moderators’ rights to pass judgement and ban them from participation.

I don’t dispute this. It’s not my website, I don’t make the rules. If the mods think I’m a social poison, I’m gone. That is simply the fact of the situation.

It seems pretty obvious to me that my sixth sense of what “ought” to be offensive is not calibrated to fit the website. vignette, if you were offended by that, I’m sorry. It was not my intent. I thought it was a weird idea… but plenty of good minds have weird ideas, and lord knows I’ve had plenty myself. If you’re out there, I am interested to know whether you felt offended by it yourself.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 14, 2008 9:18 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

PaulThomas = Carlos Gonzalez

Everyone wants to see the kid hitting for a better average, but when he connects, the quality is obvious. It’s more fun to see him in the big leagues, even with the occasional howler, than to watch someone with a fraction of the potential take up space. Plus, we still have him at the league minimum for the next few years….

by Hot Cup Joe on Jun 14, 2008 9:58 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Nico = Emil Brown

I’ll take a bunch of swings and then wonder what the heck just happened.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 10:07 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

From Emil Brown's Player Bio

Hobbies – Breeding livestock.

by Hot Cup Joe on Jun 14, 2008 10:48 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

lol

I wonder what Cust’s hobbies are…i’m going with reenacting gladiator and having tea with Duchscherer

We've never been in that position. We wouldn't know how to operate, I mean, do we get him a corsage?-Billy Beane on signing a high profile FA

by DyeLongJustice on Jun 15, 2008 10:38 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Cust's hobby:

“Batting practice.”

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 15, 2008 10:46 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

too true

actually i’m pretty sure his real hobby is operating the Jack Cust Baseball Academy….which makes me wonder, what are they teaching those kids? we’re going to have “3 true outcomes” all over the place now

We've never been in that position. We wouldn't know how to operate, I mean, do we get him a corsage?-Billy Beane on signing a high profile FA

by DyeLongJustice on Jun 15, 2008 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

"Jack Cust and the Three True Outcomes" would be an awesome band name

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 15, 2008 11:52 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

technically

it should be John Cust and the Three True Outcomes…accompanying/guest starring John Hannahan and James Harden

We've never been in that position. We wouldn't know how to operate, I mean, do we get him a corsage?-Billy Beane on signing a high profile FA

by DyeLongJustice on Jun 15, 2008 12:42 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Covelli & The Crisps,

featuring Daric Barton as Dale Barton.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 15, 2008 12:46 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm more like Jeff Francoeur

I try to be disciplined at the plate, but periodically I just lose it and start hacking at slop all over the place.

And my mistakes are magnified because I insist on playing like 162 games a season.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 14, 2008 11:49 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

This wound up turning into

a mature and good discussion. When I first started reading it, I felt it was going to go all awry. Kudos to everyone in this and especially you, PT. I do agree that you are a great asset to the blog because you write great FanPosts, but your demeanor and approach to some of the members in comments often screams that you think everyone else has fewer synapses firing than you do. It’s clear that you’re really intelligent and I’d hate to lose the great things you contribute to the community. But I also can’t stand to have someone discouraging participation with rude and snide comments.

Again, thanks for keeping this from going nuclear. But also please try and change your behavior in the comment threads so we can make sure we don’t lose a really valuable contributor to the AN community as a whole.

by Tyler Bleszinski on Jun 15, 2008 1:07 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

I'm not offended... really, I'm not...

Let me emphasize—I am not attempting to “play the victim” here. I know I can be a jackass sometimes, and (speaking to everyone here) if my reply to you is jackassy, a quick “Dude, WTF was that shit?” rejoinder is warranted and will probably get results.

I was just irked at Nico. This is now the second time in just a few weeks in which an argument was created out of what would (probably) have been a dead-end thread by his habit of becoming offended on other people’s behalf.

You’re an NHL fan, Blez—I’m sure you’re familiar with the “third man in” rule about fighting. In other words, if two players go at it, that’s (mostly) OK, but the third guy to join in gets major, major penalties (probably a match penalty and a multi-game suspension).

I think a lot of the NHL’s views on fighting are kind of silly and arcane and tangentially related, at best, to the actual game of hockey. But given that fighting isn’t going away anytime soon, I understand the reasoning for this rule, which is that once it becomes a scrum instead of a one-on-one fight, really ugly things start happening.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 15, 2008 10:04 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

PT, here's an olive branch:

from now on I will try to stay under the radar when I’m irritated, or know others are, if you will make a sincere effort to manage HOW you talk to people just a BIT.

I know I can succeed in my efforts, starting…Now.

And for the record, I really do enjoy your fanposts and many of your comments. Let’s bleed green and gold together, shall we?

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 15, 2008 10:25 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

OK

Like Homer, I may be addicted to rageahol, but I’m “on the wagon” for now.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 15, 2008 10:59 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Nice analogy

especially in knowing your audience ;-)

by Tyler Bleszinski on Jun 15, 2008 10:55 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Like Smithers,

I’m loyal to my boss and my romantic preferences are highly ambiguous.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 15, 2008 11:27 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I thought that was "ambaaguous"

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 15, 2008 12:02 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Paul, you want to be a lawyer, right?

You can put together the most brilliant, bullet-proof legal argument, but if the jury hates you, you lose. Same thing, really, in your relationship with clients.

It’s particularly important in your chosen profession to grasp not only the meaning of your words but also the impact of your words.

You’re really good with the first of those, not so hot on the second… probably because you haven’t given much thought to that dimension of things yet.

by Faust on Jun 15, 2008 6:46 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1 .... million .......

I’d like to think i was never as bad as PT can be from time to time …

BUT … from AN’s perspective, i’m sure we have more in common than we have in contrast …

But after many, many, (too) many year … I’m still here … and (I think/hope) a relatively well though of member of this community …

I’m not perfect … and I certainly don’t always keep to this …

BUT I do my best to remember that the point of this whole thing is not flow of consciousness typing but actual communicating - trying to get my ideas and thoughts across - whether for amusement or the greater good - and the key to this, even if I often have the desire (sometime fulfilled … sorry …) to be a snide asshole, is to remember my audience - to remember that being a snide asshole is rarely a good way to communicate anything.

That said …

PT communicates a lot more worthwhile stuff than he does negative stuff. This blog would be worse off if he were gone.

Nico, as a member of this community and, especially, as a moderator who is directed to look out for the greater good, you need to keep the bigger picture in mind. You don’t particularly care for PT … deal with it. No offense, but he contributes a lot more high quality stuff than you do. Granted, he contributes more low quality stuff, too … but most of us are mature and disciplined enough to skip over the stuff we don’t like—until you blow it up and make it a huge thing. Deal with it. Don’t make it personal.

"It's for your own good. Big strong Devo knows whats best for Poppy" -- Mossback

by devo on Jun 15, 2008 4:47 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

devo, this is not about me

I’m speaking for a lot of people, a lot of moderators. The blog will never accept people who contribute a lot and can’t/won’t be civil/respecful – oaktoon was a great example.

I like PT’s fanposts and a lot of his comments. I hope he chills and stays. But everyone needs to be accountable for treating others with a basic respect, and what I articulated above has been expressed privately by many. Please separate the messenger from the message.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 15, 2008 8:41 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Ok ...

Well if it’s an official moderator action it should probably be taking place offline. And by offline, I mean through e-mail … don’t beat up PT …

I’ll take your word for it that you’re just the messenger, but that doesn’t come through at all in what you wrote previously …

"It's for your own good. Big strong Devo knows whats best for Poppy" -- Mossback

by devo on Jun 15, 2008 11:20 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sorry, I thought it was clear

by: “We’re about to crack down (in general), because the moderators are sick of it.” But for the record, there have been recent offline discussions, among the moderators, that were not initiated by me.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 15, 2008 11:30 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

That sounded like more of an aside ...

But, regardless, if the moderators feel they need to make PT fix his behavior, they should communicate with him offline about it—not in this manner, driving a dozen or more generally unpleasant posts.

"It's for your own good. Big strong Devo knows whats best for Poppy" -- Mossback

by devo on Jun 15, 2008 12:07 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Tried, didn't succeed

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 15, 2008 12:25 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think he's rude. I think he's blunt.

Often I feel that tact is simply not telling the truth. Specifically, trading half the team for one player, and not even a Barry-Bonds-in-his-prime-type player, is a really, really silly idea. It’s an idea so silly that responding with an in-depth analysis of the situation is pointless. I probably wouldn’t have responded the way he did, but I was certainly thinking the same thing.

Concerning point 2: If we can’t fix the stupid, can we at least beat them senseless?

http://bocropleasestopswingingatbadpitches.blogspot.com/

by thejd44 on Jun 15, 2008 4:48 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

sigline!

If we can’t fix the stupid, can we at least beat them senseless? @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 15, 2008 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Please don't attempt to speak for everyone

I don’t think PaulThomas is rude. I think he writes in a matter-of-fact style that is misinterpeted as hostile by some folks who don’t like to see their theories and wild speculation shot full of holes. If it weren’t for the postings of PaulThomas, Danny, and a few others, it wouldn’t be worth stopping by here.

Root for the Giants? Not even if they're playing al-Qaeda!

by Monday Fan on Jun 15, 2008 11:12 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think he's rude either.

People need to quit being such pansies, quite frankly.

by mikev on Jun 16, 2008 9:12 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Seriously

Maybe I don’t read as many posts as some people here, but PaulThomas has a lot of interesting things to say.

"These Boston People Are AWFUL"

by Brillz on Jun 16, 2008 9:18 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

Blunt and matter of fact =/= rude. And especially here, I mean really, “which brand of wacky tobacky are you smoking,” does seem to be anything worth getting worked up about. I mean, this site would be worse off if PT switched gears and wrote about nothing but ponies, unicorns, and rainbows. Indeed, honestly, I still miss Oaktoon and think this site hasn’t been quite as good since he left. He cared a lot and was willing to put a ton of work/thought into his posts. Was he abrasive? Yeah, sure, a lot of the time. But, anyone who’s that easily offended probably can’t even sit through a game at the Coliseum.

Someone mentioned Randy Bell up-thread . . . would anyone enlighten me as to what became of Mr. Bell? I’ve seen some off-hand comments which imply that there’s a story there, but I’ve never seen the story.

A kitten bats around a ball of yarn but what he's really saying is, "You know I can't knit, motherf'er." That is one foul mouthed kitten. - Mitch Hedberg (RIP)

by RayRay59 on Jun 17, 2008 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

well said

The A's colors are green and gold.

by mikeA on Jun 14, 2008 9:29 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

If that's true, you don't get out much.
I’ve never visited another site
in which an individual so consistently and frequently posts comments as snide, condescending, and self-satisfied as yours

I’m not defending Paul’s tone here, but if that’s really true — that you’ve never visited another site with an individual who matches or exceeds Paul’s obnoxious tone — then you’re really sheltered. Seriously, any political blog, any Usenet group, pretty much any unmoderated forum with a lot of traffic, has obnoxious commenters much worse than Paul and without his redeeming qualities.

formerly known as mdl

by iglew on Jun 15, 2008 8:18 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Wrong.

I do get around, both in the blogosphere and in the real world. For instance, as a music fanatic/record collector, I spend a whole lot of time on music blogs; as impassioned and arrogant as music fans can be, I have yet to encounter anyone else as over the top as PaulThomas.

And, for what it’s worth, I have been an attorney for almost two decades, so I’ve come across my share of preening blowhards and candidates for Smartest Man in the World. Faust is correct: however strong a case he or she may have, a lawyer can do his or her clients a grave disservice.

One can be blunt without being arrogant and vicious. If not, and if this is the price we have to pay to read a fan’s opinion regarding the likelihood of a certain trade scenario coming to pass or his analysis of a player’s swing, count me out.

by Ray of Lite on Jun 16, 2008 12:42 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm with iglew on this; I don't think PT's that bad.

{starts referendum on how “bad” PT is}

Brainless Automaton #439

by rubin sierra on Jun 16, 2008 1:34 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

how can I resist ...

PT: The Wire of AN?

(Actually, he’s probably more the Deadwood of AN. [Note the ital.])

If we can’t fix the stupid, can we at least beat them senseless? @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 16, 2008 7:01 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well, I agree with Nico and Ray of Lite.

I think a nice 3 month ban might do PT a world of good. But we’re not conducting a poll here, are we?

"He's a misfit. He gets along with everyone." - Reggie Jackson, describing Joe Rudi

by McFood on Jun 16, 2008 7:41 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Awful idea

This site is already swamped with cheerleader fluff, ridiculous trade proposals and opinions that defy any kind of logic. If you remove PaulThomas, there won’t be any cause to think before hitting the POST button. Do we really want to scroll down an endless stream of “Let’s go A’s!” and “Let’s trade Blanton for A-Rod” posts just to find something worth reading?

Root for the Giants? Not even if they're playing al-Qaeda!

by Monday Fan on Jun 16, 2008 8:06 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Let's go A's!!!!!

I know, I just thought of it!

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 16, 2008 9:48 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I like PT a lot.

And I often roll my eyes at all the silly, breathless, excessively punctuated exclamations that populate game threads and (sometimes, though less recently) the fanpost section.

Nevertheless:

You seem to suggest that incivility is simply the cost of doing business for smart posts, that it is somehow inextricable from effective argument, that it is always right and proper and true to denounce stupidity in the most brusque manner possible, and that if PT weren’t around to put all these morons in their place, AN wouldn’t be much more than a blathering muddle of overzealous dunderheads yelling inanities at each other.

Here is a partial, off the top of my head in 45 seconds list of really smart posters who know way more about baseball than I (and, likely, you) do, yet (gasp!) manage to advance their opinions without constantly pissing everyone off:

andeux
BlameChannel53
Taj Adib
notsellingjeans
mikeA
rfloh
Danny
jakarta
Faust
salb918
devo
Nick

The list would be three times as lengthy if I’d spent more time compiling it.

The point (and I’ll be as blunt as possible, since that is your preferred mode of interaction): If you can’t argue without being an asshole, you should either stop arguing or learn to write better. “TRADE DALE HARDIN NOW BECAUSE HE SUCKS!!!” posts aside, AN is filled with knowledgeable, articulate, respectful contributors. If you think all intelligent discourse would be sapped from the site the second PT departed, you aren’t paying attention.

by 74mk on Jun 16, 2008 10:50 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Great. Cindi's been crying for an hour

because she didn’t make the list. Which is weird, because your comment only appeared 30 minutes ago.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 16, 2008 11:22 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think the points we can draw from this thread are:

1. My “style” is a highly and, probably, unnecessarily polarizing one;
2. There are those who enjoy it, but the percentage who do is unclear.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 16, 2008 12:13 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm sure we can clarify point #2 -

They have stats for EVERYTHING nowadays!

I really do think this can have a happy ending, with everyone enjoying your outstanding contributions, you being more “mindful” of engaging with a broad range of people, you feeling less persecuted, and me learning to shut up. That last one’s going to be tricky.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 16, 2008 12:44 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think that's about right.

It would suck profoundly if you got banned because you dispatched with someone’s knuckleheadedness or (baseball) naivete in an unnecessarily disdainful manner, because most of your posts are great.

So: Dispatch knuckleheadedness with Bond-like aplomb from now on, and all will be well.

by 74mk on Jun 16, 2008 1:17 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Exactly.

(and I’ve finally found a new sigline!)

"Dispatch knuckleheadedness with Bond-like aplomb." –74mk

by iglew on Jun 16, 2008 2:50 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Woo-hoo! I'm on the list!

This helps make up for the bitter disappointment of missing Nixon’s enemies list. Of course, I was just a kid and besides that my complete insignificance was working against me, but a guy could dream… Now I am fulfilled.

by Faust on Jun 16, 2008 12:50 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

You, sir, are an awesome poster.

Though now I feel bad for having not offered a more comprehensive list.

I used to think I knew a lot about baseball, and the A’s particularly. Then I started reading AN, and began to comprehend the vast sweep of my ignorance.

by 74mk on Jun 16, 2008 1:43 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

That’s not quite what I meant. Frankly, I don’t find anything in PaulThomas’s prose that’s insulting. Maybe it’s just me but when I express something in a public forum that is baseless, wrong, illogical. etc., I expect to have someone point out the flaws in my methods or reasoning. It’s good to have a sort of peer review. I don’t like it when it comes in the form of “Hey, dumb**, did your mother smoke crack when she was pregnant?” or “Are you the biggest idiot ever?” If Paul Thomas has done this sort of thing, I missed it. I have no objection whatsoever to having my opinions challenged. It works the other way, too. If I see PaulThomas post something I believe is flawed, I will call him out on it just as I would expect him to call me out. Are the egos in this community really that fragile?

Root for the Giants? Not even if they're playing al-Qaeda!

by Monday Fan on Jun 16, 2008 1:11 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Also,

I didn’t mean to infer that PaulThomas is some sort of lone watchdog who keeps the site clear of fluff. I meant that so long as critical posters are known to be here, the posts may be more thoughtful.

Root for the Giants? Not even if they're playing al-Qaeda!

by Monday Fan on Jun 16, 2008 1:18 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Look, you jabbering idiot

I’m kidding. I see your point. And you’re right: PT doesn’t stoop to that sort of name-calling. It’s all about tone, you know? It’s just not conducive to interesting, productive discourse to be quite as aggressively scathing and condescending as he sometimes tends to be – more often than not, it results in bickering and juvenile one-upmanship, and that kind of back and forth bores the crap out of me.

by 74mk on Jun 16, 2008 1:33 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed

Tone in text form is so easy to misunderstand and that may be the true problem here.

Root for the Giants? Not even if they're playing al-Qaeda!

by Monday Fan on Jun 16, 2008 1:43 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Actually, I kind of did do that earlier...

although in fairness to myself, I only implied drug use (temporary), rather than actual incompetence (permanent)...

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 16, 2008 1:49 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think the point has been made

Can we now put an end to the PT pile-on?

"You know, a long time ago being crazy meant something. Nowadays everybody's crazy."

-Charles Manson

by kaweahkaweah on Jun 17, 2008 9:12 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

It would have ended, but for your comment

Now we have to start over…

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 17, 2008 9:27 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Don't make me call you a douchebag!!!

"You know, a long time ago being crazy meant something. Nowadays everybody's crazy."

-Charles Manson

by kaweahkaweah on Jun 17, 2008 9:51 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Call me a douchebag, if you must...

...Just call me!

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 17, 2008 10:24 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

My vote: none

“Rebuilding” and then abandoning the plan because of an unexpected half season has been a hallmark of stupid franchises since time immemorial.

If the A’s as currently constituted are not good enough, that’s a sign that the team should be building for next year—not an invitation to squander valuable resources on a rental.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 5:58 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

That's Why

I’m only talking about guys who are pretty young and could be A’s as the rebuilding kicks in.

by nevermoor on Jun 13, 2008 7:44 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed on a rental

If the A’s were to take on salary, it should be for a young player signed to a lucrative longer term deal.

So it goes.

by jeepers on Jun 14, 2008 7:35 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

This is how Billy thinks

and why there will not be an expensive rental player installed unless we are actually in the lead in the West or the wildcard. Right now the Angels look too good to catch without some luck, and the AL is tough enough that the wildcard is no sure thing.

by Mark Borgschulte on Jun 14, 2008 8:22 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Screw upgrading and adding salary this year.

I would much rather that we throw $$$ at developement this year with our draft picks(possibly signing a couple late rounders for over slot) and the International FA signings. This illusion that we are in contention should not make us divert from the plan of rebuilding for 2010 and the new ballpark when we can make a serious sustained run.

by AthleticsReign on Jun 13, 2008 6:26 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Which is why

The most expensive player I listed is Bay at $7.5M next year (less this year) who has superstar production. I don’t think we need a $15M guy, but someone who can produce, stick around, and cost less than Chavez can’t hurt. Development is great, but proven talent at reasonable prices is better.

by nevermoor on Jun 13, 2008 7:48 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Jason Bay is a free agent after 2009...

and he ain’t coming cheap, either. Pittsburgh was lucky that he somehow survived the Littlefield era, and now can be traded for actual value.

I mean, I don’t see how you can say that Bay is not a rental. It’s only a year and a half of him.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 14, 2008 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

is that really a rental?

does two full years qualify as a non-rental? At least a lease? ;)

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 14, 2008 1:34 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

That seems to be the point for me

where I draw the line between a rental and a long-term acquisition.

Why? I’m not sure…

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 14, 2008 4:15 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

We might not like Blanton as much as fans, but Beane is asking a lot for Blanton

so I don’t think it would be a good player for Blanton, Street, Barton and Suzuki or something like that that people seem to be suggesting.

As for Barton, he’s finally started hitting in June, so I would like to see how he continues before making the jump on him.

The Infield is very hard to upgrade, simply because theres few players to replace them with.

Ellis is a good deal for the A’s right now, as a GG 2B with an average bat. There are very few upgrades for 2B around the Majors, though one, and he’s on the wrong side of the 2B Decline Phase, is one whom we ALMOST acquired but failed to due to Ken Macha shooting it down somehow in favor of keeping an ineffective LOOGY. I am refering to the almost deal of Rincon for Polanco. Polanco is struggling a bit in Detroit, but still has a decent line. He plays good defense as well. And Detroit is sucking right now, and can use pitching. But what do we do with Ellis?

Crosby sucks balls, we all know that, but looking around the league there is no talent in the majors at SS available.

Chavez is injured and expensive, so it will be unlikely we can dump him. The question is if his surgery finally fixed something and he can hit now.

The DH situation is moot-Thomas is here for dirt cheap and good production, and if he isn’t, there’s Cust.

But the Outfield is a different matter. We only have one good hitting outfielder at the moment in Jack Cust. The other two slots are essentially open if we want to contend and do not care for the rookies taking the slots.

But we do care about the rookies and we want them to take the slots. Patrol Craft is doing poorly, but has a lot of promise, and as we’ve seen, is one of the few A’s that hits the ball hard. He can handle CF or RF. Sweeney has had flashes of good streaks, and one right before getting injured, and can also handle CF or RF. Both of these guys can be replaced, theoretically, with better players that would instantly upgrade the offense. But the question is at what cost?

Right now, money doesn’t matter. If we acquire a player like Hanley Ramirez, the price will be in prospects. Same goes with acquiring a player like Jason Bay. The Money doesn’t matter because compared to production, its not a huge issue and our payroll. is very low right now. But sending out talent when we are rebuilding is a big problem. And remember that in one aspect, acquiring a Hanley Ramirez helps in the long term, and a Jason Bay helps in the short term but with added Draft Picks.

If we want to upgrade, we need a Jermaine Dye, a Ray Durham or a Johnny Damon type deal. Fortunetly or Unfortunetly, there are a lot fewer Allard Bairds in the Majors right now, so fleecing will be much more difficult. And guys like Bavasi are in our division and won’t deal with us. Jason Bay, I think, is one of those guys, but Pittsburgh will be smart when dealing him. So who do we target?

Personally, I think we should look at Detroit and see if we can grab anything from them. Acquiring Ordonez would be nice, and Granderson would be awesome. But what would the Tigers want?

Pessimism FTW! ... Wait what?

by Zonis on Jun 13, 2008 6:35 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Gonzalez is doing poorly?

What are your expectations?

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 13, 2008 6:50 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

an OPS above .700

Pessimism FTW! ... Wait what?

by Zonis on Jun 13, 2008 7:44 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

He's looking ok though

The only thing he isn’t doing is drawing walks. I think he can solve that problem as he gets comfortable up here.

by nevermoor on Jun 13, 2008 7:49 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

He's doing fantastic

at least vs. RHP

Most good young left handed hitters struggle against LHP.

if we wanted to “improve” the output right now, we’d work on the platoon split thing.

But then again, the A’s have a ton of guys with reverse platoon splits so far this season.

by jakarta on Jun 13, 2008 11:30 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't want Dye, Durham or Damon

please god, no. I like Sweeney and CG in the outfield, and there is still a chance for Buck, Denorfia, Brown, Davis, etc to start playing like big leaguers (again, in some cases).

Ordonez and Granderson would be upgrades, but unless the Angels melt down, they still would not necessarily be enough. No reason to pay the price.

by Mark Borgschulte on Jun 14, 2008 8:29 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

by Dye, Durham or Damon

I refer not to what they are now, but what they were when we originally traded for them.

Pessimism FTW! ... Wait what?

by Zonis on Jun 14, 2008 10:18 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Yep

I think there are two ways to go about it, and the votes seem to be tracking the two ideas. One is Jason Bay who, as you said, would be Dye II. The other way is to go younger with an above average player we can grow with in Corey Hart.

I personally would go with Bay all things being equal because I think to be an elite team at some point we need to have at least one elite offensive player. Dye, for example, was unstoppable until the freak leg break that started our 5-game series curse.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Im all for rebuilding

Im also for drafting the best available player so that you can make trades down the line. Look at the current A’s roster, its filled with prospects from other Organizations. Barton, Cust, Sweeney and Cargon. The whole young core of the rebuilding A’s were traded for not developed in the A’s system. I dont know if its bad luck, bad scouting or just lack of good coaching but the A’s system has not been good for position players for awhile now. This was the main reason I was against drafting Weeks ahead of Brett Wallace, you take the best player available.The A’s are good at seeing pitching talent that others dont and they also seem to be good at developing good pitchers. I would like to see the A’s develope some of this young pitching, some for the 2011 A’s and some used as trade chips. I would be very open to trading some pitching for a few young stud position players. If this is truly a rebilding year then you may have to trade a Harden, Blanton or Gaudin. Gm’s are getting smarter, it takes talent to get talent.

by asfaninpismobeach on Jun 13, 2008 7:03 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

usual mis-statement.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 14, 2008 1:35 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

not you

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 14, 2008 5:20 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Than who?

(stole the cookie from the cookie jar)

by mikev on Jun 16, 2008 9:13 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pismobeach

(he also stole the cookies)

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 16, 2008 9:22 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

nice work on the diary by the way

You obviously put a ton of effort into this diary while highlighting that it is just plain difficult to find decent hitters who can play catcher and SS.

by jakarta on Jun 13, 2008 11:33 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Yunel Escobar

Renteria was cleared for this guy to shine. I’m pretty sure he’s as untouchable on the Braves as you can get.

by rightbackin on Jun 14, 2008 5:55 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I also question assumption #1

The A’s have plenty of money right now. I would be very much in favor of an outfield upgrade, or a middle infield upgrade. Crosby is a year away from his walk year, and Ellis is a free agent at the end of the season. Ellis could have a lot of value to a team desperate for help at second, as he’s cheap, excellent with the glove, and has legit pull power.

Another key reason why an outfield upgrade is helpful is the continued bad news about Thomas and Senior Sweeney. Cust should really be DHing every day right now. With him in his proper place, you’re choosing between a lot of mediocre-at-best outfield options.

So it goes.

by jeepers on Jun 14, 2008 7:30 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I think we could certainly afford Bay

I don’t think we could afford, say, Helton (2008: $16.6 million, 2009: $16.6 million, 2010: $16.6 million, 2011: $19.1 million, 2012: $23 million club option w/$4.6 million buyout) even though it would be nice to have a 1B with a .293/.416/.434 and he’s probably pretty available.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 8:13 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

wow those are horrible numbers

for a 1B in Coors

Pessimism FTW! ... Wait what?

by Zonis on Jun 14, 2008 10:19 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Actually, his BA is better on the road this year (.311)

He is starting to lose his HR ability, but if he were about $10M a year cheaper I’d love to have him.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 12:45 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

wow they gave him

a ridiculous contract.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 14, 2008 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Unbelievable how bad that contract was

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 14, 2008 11:15 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

word

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 14, 2008 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

The real concern

Is about our talent within the organization we are building around. I don’t think anybody expected our top prospects to perform this poorly out of the gate. The biggest disappointment has to be the performance of Buck, Barton, and Suzuki.

The real question is, do we stick with our current prospects or give up on them. It seems clear to me though, many of the fans just aren’t too thrilled with what we got seeing as we would all shit our pants if somebody actually hit .300 with 30 plus HR’s and 100 RBI’s

I almost think Bowen and Landon Powell need to see some considerable time at catcher. While Barton and Buck may just need some time to work our the kinks. Might as well play R. Sweeney, CarGon, and Buck (AAA) everyday and let them get as many AB’s as they can get.

What about Jack H. at 2B once Ellis leaves? i don’t know if we can get excited about him or Murphy playing everyday at second.

In regards to Crosby, “What you see is what you get!”

Beating LAA or wherever the fu*k they are, Priceless!

by MMunoz33 on Jun 14, 2008 7:30 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I wouldn't call Zook a disappointment.

He didn’t make it to the bigs for his bat. I thought he would show more power based on what he did last year, but otherwise, he’s hitting to expectations.

Barton is hitting .333/.422/.487 in June, so he’s turning the corner nicely.

No argument about Buck, though. I think we should temper our expectations about him. Most prospect publications never viewed him as more than a fourth outfielder, or very average regular, while he was in the minors. It’s entirely possible that’s all he’ll ever be.

So it goes.

by jeepers on Jun 14, 2008 7:33 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

When someone is young and cheap and league average it’s not a reason to junk them. Barton, of course, is nowhere near league average yet but he looks to be figuring things out faster than Carlos Pena did (wouldn’t it be nice if we’d held on to him…)

I think our OF approach was basically to throw a ton of prospects at a wall to see who sticks. Sweeney is sticking. CarGon is looking like he has real potential. Buck, however, not so much.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 8:09 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Buck

Buck was drafted in 2005, hit really well for ASU in the College World Series, signed with us, hit the heck out of the ball in Vancouver and Kane County, starts 2006 in Stockton and kills the ball, is advanced to Midland and does well there too. So last year he makes the club out of Spring Training due to injuries on the roster, does more than impress as a rookie, has injuries cut short his year…

So here he is, fighting through the first major slump of his pro career, maybe first of his life, beset a little with the pressure of trying to take over for Swisher, he’s fighting it, he’s learning.

We don’t know for sure that Buck will be fine, but he probably will, and if he does figure this out, it will be as a stronger player than he has ever been. And he still was better after coming off the D.L.

by jakarta on Jun 14, 2008 9:03 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

We're also not as overflowing with OFers as it seems

With Thomas out for another month, Cust is suddenly a full-time DH beginning next week meaning that R. Sweeney and Gonzalez are flanked by Emil Brown unless we call Buck back up or make a deal. And even calling Buck up gives you three starters but no backup you would want to start – and we have seen, in the last three years, how there is “every day” playing time available for 4 OFers.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 9:31 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Exactly

Emil is 33, has a .650 OPS this year (.721 career). This is bad. VERY bad. Amongst all qualified outfielders in baseball (including CF), he is ranked 65th of 67. Who is he better than? Michael Bourn (25 year old CF who may improve) and Willie Taveras (ditto, but he’s 26).

Every single starting corner outfielder in baseball is better than Emil, and there is no reason to think that’s going to change much.

With Buck at DH at least until the ASB, that means we have CarGon, Sweeney, and nobody. Maybe we’ll call Buck back up after interleague, but he’s going to have to force that by hitting in AAA.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 9:57 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

although

Brown really should be only a platoon bat anyway. This year he is .297/.333/.351 against LHP, still not good but a fair piece better than his overall numbers look.

Also, I like using BP’s EQA for ranking players within a season, as using straight OPS: 1) gives too much weight to slugging and not enough to OBP, and 2) doesn’t take into account park factors.

Not that your overall points are wrong, Brown sucks etc…

by jakarta on Jun 14, 2008 10:27 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

What is Dontrelle Willis' salary playing Class A base-ball?

I heard Beane offered Crosby and Detroit said no!! LOL

Beating LAA or wherever the fu*k they are, Priceless!

by MMunoz33 on Jun 14, 2008 7:32 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

He has a major league contract

And Beane would never do Crosby for Willis

I generally bemoan the profusion of Mr Sabermetric Sporks in the Scrabble ranks who don't know the meaning or usage of 50% of the words they use. -monkeyball

by JediLeroy on Jun 14, 2008 9:30 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Whatchu talkin' about, Bobby?

That never gets old. Or…

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 9:32 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Is Suzuki the answer?

If so then I’m fine with it, but I wouldn’t mind seeing Bowen and Powell getting some time in there to mix it up a litttle more.

Beating LAA or wherever the fu*k they are, Priceless!

by MMunoz33 on Jun 14, 2008 9:45 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I guess Bay or Nady are the best bets, but Buck could solve the problem himself.

My guess is there’s no move made. I also don’t agree that the Angels are uncatchable. They’ve been pretty lucky with run distribution and their bullpen has been invincible in clutch situations. That isn’t likely to continue very long.

by WaddellCanseco on Jun 14, 2008 10:06 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Moneyball

A’s won’t make a trade for a big time player. I was hoping they could make a trade for Griffey as he would increase attendance and bring a big threat into our lineup, but its very unlikely.

It's Been A Great Year! Thanks Warriors!

by ballin on Jun 14, 2008 11:04 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Big threat?

Have you looked at Griffey’s actual hitting stats this year?

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 14, 2008 11:19 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Griffey is a bad player

At this point, only around a league average hitter, can’t run, horrendous fielder in a corner, with a huge salary.

You want a big threat and a big name to increase attendance: Bonds.

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on Jun 14, 2008 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

-1.......868 OPS, 30 HR last year. average no.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 14, 2008 1:38 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sadly

that’s last year. This year he’s another year older and another year slower.

"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin

by Helloooo 1st on Jun 14, 2008 9:42 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think you're arguing for the sake of arguing

Because his June OPS is .934.

This year he got off to an OK start and had a bad last month, but guess what, he did it last year too. Last year his June OPS was .300 points higher than previous months.

Granted he may not be the Griffey of 2005 when he hit .300 and had 35 homers , but to say he’s a “bad player” is off by a mile.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 16, 2008 9:26 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

He is the single worst defensive player in all of baseball

If you need a DH, he’s better than Jose Vidro, and that’s about as far as I’ll go.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 16, 2008 9:46 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Griffey fan?

How about this year, and 2006? Why don’t they count?

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on Jun 14, 2008 11:01 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

End of the year prediction

Blanton sold.

Gaudin sold. (The guy is worth so much more as a starter…)

Harden sold.

Hannahan/Murphy platoon to second for Ellis. Ellis sold.

Get back young pitching, infield prospects. Those four could fetch us a franchise. Harden/Gaudin/Blanton are 3/5ths of a good starting rotation, (assuming Harden stays healthy until the trade deadline). Better than the 1-2-3 of half the teams in the majors. I’d love it if they could re-sign Ellis, but Hannahan/Murphy is almost as good, for a fraction of the price.

I think Billy spends a lot more time thinking about this sort of scenario than how to improve the offense by trading away his prospects. I really like the post, well researched, but it just goes to show that the sort of player the A’s look to build around is just too expensive by the time they are big leaguers.

by Mark Borgschulte on Jun 14, 2008 11:17 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Um

Hannahan/Murphy platoon might be league-average offensively, like Ellis. It would not be even close to as good as Ellis defensively. You’d be lucky to get average defense out of those two, and Ellis is the best defender in baseball. That’s like a 3 win downgrade.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 14, 2008 11:20 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed

it is not a very good the long term answer. They need help in the infield, potentially at every position in the next year or two, and I haven’t loved Hannahan this year. But unless we are going to re-sign Ellis, we might as well let him go by the trade deadline.

Despite their inferior defensive qualities, both Hannahan and Murphy are young enough and have the potential to deserve playing time. Even if there is 25% chance of one of them developing into a starting major leaguer, that is probably worth the drop off in defense from changing from Ellis to one of them, (or a platoon). Throw in the savings on salary (like signing half-a-Inoa or a couple of extra draft picks), and it seems like the prudent play for the future.

I don’t like Hannahan’s low batting average or his swing, but I think hitting lead-off might explain part of his struggles. Is there a consensus on AN about what should be done with Hannahan?

by Mark Borgschulte on Jun 14, 2008 11:52 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

This assumes

Chavy and Crosby stay healthy. A serious if, knock on wood.

by Mark Borgschulte on Jun 14, 2008 12:09 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

only Blanton sold. Makes no sense to sell Gaudin too.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 14, 2008 1:39 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Hannahan is MLB caliber roster filler.

His bat might be tolerable if he could credibly play second, but he’s a disaster at either corner infield position. He’s probably going to hang around for a while, though, since he’s the only backup plan we have at first base. If Mike Sweeney gets better, it should be at Hannahan’s expense.

So it goes.

by jeepers on Jun 14, 2008 2:52 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Mike Sweeney is going to play 3B when Chavvy's tired?

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 14, 2008 3:30 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

No

But couldn’t Petit? I don’t understand Hannahan at all, he’s been completely unproductive at the plate and it isn’t like he’s a gold glove defender. I’d rather have Petit there if he can do it without looking like Miguel Cabrera

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 4:17 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

yes!

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 14, 2008 5:20 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 14, 2008 7:26 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Nady.

Billy has been interested in Nady before. As a right-handed bat that crushes lefty pitching (.982 OPS) but doesn’t completely suck against righties (.831 OPS) and hits for a high average (.311), he could be a nice complement to the offense. He’s relatively cheap ($3.35 million this season), under club control both this year and next, is in the prime of his career (aged 29) and is fairly versatile defensively as he could be slotted into right field, left field, first base or the DH slot.

The problem I have with trying to trade with him is that a lot of his value right now is tied into his abnormally high batting average and RBI numbers. He will not keep up his scorching hot start at the plate and will cool down eventually. If that cool-down happens before the trade deadline, then his trade value might come down to the point where he will be worth what Billy would likely trade for him (probably a minor league arm or two). But if he doesn’t cool down anytime son, then Neal Huntington will likely be asking for a lot more for Nady than he is actually worth.

Nevertheless, I wouldn’t put it past Billy to make a trade for a player like Nady that he’s liked in the past and who would clearly upgrade the offense, even during this “rebuilding” year. Billy’s always looking for ways to improve the club at all times, and since it seems like the rebuilding process has kind of gotten a head start this season with solid performances from some of the young pitchers, there would be no reason for Billy not to look to keep the team as competitive as possible.

by Taj Adib on Jun 14, 2008 11:39 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

This may just be pessimism after two nights ago

But wouldn’t something built around Blanton get us Nady plus something. Not McCutchen/Walker, but not organizational filler either.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 1:03 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm not sure that Pitt would be interested in Blanton.

He’s a league-average innings eater that is the middle of his arbitration years (i.e. expensive for a rebuilding club). There doesn’t seem to be that much upside in Blanton so I don’t really see an organization in an even more drastic rebuilding mode than the A’s show any interest in him.

It’s much more likely that Pittsburgh would ask for a minor league pitcher or two. I’m sure they would inquire about all of our top prospects (Cahill, Anderson, Italiano, Gio Gonzalez, et al) and I’m not sure Beane would consider moving any of those arms for a 1.5-year rental.

But perhaps Beane could pawn off a couple of B-level prospects to get someone like Nady. Guys Beane might consider moving: Vincent Mazzaro, Henry Rodriguez, Dallas Braden, Brad Kilby, Brad Hertzler, etcl

by Taj Adib on Jun 14, 2008 1:25 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Maybe so

But he’d be a salary wash with Nady (if we target Bay instead, I assume we’d have to throw in prospects but they’d cut salary). He’s also a lock for their #2 spot behind Zach Duke so I’d expect them to be interested. He’s way better than Maholm/Snell/Gorzellany and even though Dumatrait has a better ERA, he spent time in the pen and his 1.45 WHIP suggests he won’t be sub-4 for much longer.

I understand that they may not care about this year (and certainly wouldn’t if they’re willing to move Bay), but a team that was willing to throw real money to have Matt Morris around would have to at least consider the same sort of money to keep a better, younger, healthier pitcher around.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 1:53 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Unfortunately...

the Pittsburgh regime that would give up anything of remote value for someone as bad Matt Morris (former GM Dave Littlefield) has been removed and replaced by Neal Huntington, who hasn’t made a major trade yet, so it’s difficult to judge how good of a talent evaluator he is.

I see what you are saying about Blanton. Sure, every team in every market and in every phase of contending could use someone like Blanton. He eats innings and keeps his team in the game, all for a below-market price. But I think Pittsburgh is really planning on rebuilding for 3-4 years down the road, so while Blanton could help them immediately and in ‘09 and ‘10, his presence will probably not got them to where they really want to be. But a high-upside arm that might be ready in a few years and could be a real difference maker in the rotation or bullpen would be a lot more valuable to them.

I foresee that Pitt will field a whole bunch of offers for both Bay and Nady and will pull the trigger only when they get exactly what they want, which, unfortunately, I do not think is Joe Blanton.

by Taj Adib on Jun 14, 2008 3:24 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Fair enough

I suppose it will depend on how the next month goes for them too. Apparently finishing above .500 is a major goal, so if they stay where they are they may not even be selling.

They’ve also, apparently, sent word around that they aren’t moving Bay or Nady. This, of course, means that they’re anxiously waiting by the phone for someone trying to make an offer they can’t refuse.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 4:20 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Have you seen his numbers this year?

If not, I wouldn’t suggest looking at them. Ignorance is, in this case, bliss.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 14, 2008 11:50 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Nady was hurt today

Probably nothing happening on that front anytime soon.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 14, 2008 9:20 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Beyond this?

Jun 14 RF Xavier Nady rested his gimpy left ankle but still played in Friday’s interleague game. Nady, normally the Pirates’ right fielder, served as the designated hitter in a 9-6 at Baltimore. Nady, who went 1-for-4, has been playing with swelling in the ankle for two weeks. “He’s been feeling pretty good the last few days but his ankle’s been a little tired,” Russell said. “This gives us an opportunity to let it mend up a little bit.”

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 9:56 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Err...

Pirates right fielder Xavier Nady left Saturday’s game in the ninth inning when he suffered a left shoulder contusion. A Pirates spokesman said Nady had X-rays, which came back negative. Nady will have an MRI on the shoulder in Pittsburgh on Monday by medical director Dr. Patrick DeMeo.

Wonder how long that puts him out. X-Rays coming back negative is usually good.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 9:59 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Generally, yeah...

but he could end up with an impingement and miss 6 months like Harden did last year…

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 14, 2008 11:52 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think Petit is a good possibility for 2nd or Short long term

From what I have read he has great defensive skills and is a good hitter. I would like to see him get a bit more playing time right now and give both Crosby and Ellis a break now and then. Also I would like to hear more about the possibilities of Guzman in our middle infield in the future.

I wouldn’t mind trading for a right handed OF, he would need to still be young in order to be a long term solution and he would need to have great defensive skills.

Thinking about our teams this decade and where we have excelled is in defense. If we can keep that area up and still improve the offense then it is worth the cost.

"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"

by Eastbayjim on Jun 14, 2008 12:51 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Does anyone know how Aaron Cunningham is doing down in AA?

As I recall he was impressing a lot of people in Spring Training. He is right handed and if he has power then may be an answer for our outfield later on. Again this may not be an answer for this year but we have a lot of power in the minors now and may turn our offense around in the next couple years and keep the good defense.

"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"

by Eastbayjim on Jun 14, 2008 1:00 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Cunningham.

Aaron Cunningham started off hot for Double-A Midland but has really cooled off as of late. He’s still hitting for a high average (.291) but he’s not hitting for all that much power (.411 slugging and only 3 homers). His on-base percentage is decent at .358, but not outstanding, and he’s striking out a lot (46 times in 158 total at-bats). So basically he’s performing about as well as you can expect from a young guy that is probably still recovering from a major wrist injury.

From all that I’ve heard, the A’s brass is looking at Cunningham as a potential centerfielder down the line. If he can play the position everyday at the major league level, he might have a future in the A’s outfield, sine he will probably never hit for enough power to be a plus corner outfielder.

by Taj Adib on Jun 14, 2008 1:19 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

The drop in power could be directly related to his wrist, no?

That’s what I would expect for a little while coming back from a wrist injury – same eye, same bat, but less power.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sounds about right.

Makes perfect sense that would happen. However, even before the injury, the “experts” at BA didn’t think Cunningham had enough power in his bat to cut-it as a full-time, big league corner outfielder. He could still turn out to be a pretty nice centerfielder regardless though.

by Taj Adib on Jun 14, 2008 1:27 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Or make it to AAA late this season and perform well.

If what we expect is to see him in the majors next season.

by Taj Adib on Jun 14, 2008 3:27 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

No, that's his sprained suck

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 10:08 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Johnny Gomes, please

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 14, 2008 2:21 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Ethier or Kemp

Offer Ned Colletti Alan Embry (which clears a roster spot for Santiago Casilla and gives L.A. a top-notch set-up guy with an option for next year) plus one of our young minor league guns (Gio Gonzalez, for instance, who is probably third in line after Simmons and Cahill anyway) for Ethier, who hits for average (,284/.350/.427) with some power. The A’s then have a dynamic young outfield (CarGo, RSweeney, Ethier, Cust) that is under contract for the next few years. If Colletti won’t give up Ethier, we can perhaps swing the deal for Kemp, (.296/.341/.439). If Colletti doesn’t want Gio, give him Landon Powell instead. Guy can hit. The Dodgers will be sitting either Kemp or Ethier when A Jones returns, so they’re basically giving up a back-up.

by richwol1 on Jun 14, 2008 2:28 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

If, of course, Andruw comes back

And gets himself over the Mendoza line. I just don’t think it’s worth making that sort of trade for another sub-.800 OPS guy. If we go after a young guy, I’d much rather have Corey Hart where you can be much more certain you’re getting a keeper.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 4:24 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

No way is Gio in that trade.. He is one of our better pitching prospects.

He may not show it right now but he is one of out top ranked pitchers.

Now, Embry and Braden for either Ethier or Kemp I would do.

"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"

by Eastbayjim on Jun 14, 2008 2:37 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Doesn't Gio have a clause in his contract that says

he has to be included in every trade?

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 3:36 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Anyone would do that ... except the Dodgers, I would hope ... for their sake ...

and that’s for Ethier—Kemp is way more valuable.

"It's for your own good. Big strong Devo knows whats best for Poppy" -- Mossback

by devo on Jun 14, 2008 4:04 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think BB would be very happy to acquire somebody for cash ...

someone who the other team isn’t looking for real talent in return, just to shed the contract. He’d probably even go for a contract that doesn’t expire until after 2009 …

I think he’d be willing to move Blanton or Gaudin in exchange for young-ish, inexpensive-ish MLB offensive talent.

"It's for your own good. Big strong Devo knows whats best for Poppy" -- Mossback

by devo on Jun 14, 2008 4:08 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Yeah

But deals like Frank Thomas don’t come around that many times a season.

It’s true that there’s a lot of room for upgrade in the E. Brown roster spot, but I’d much prefer to see us go after someone to bat 3rd/4th for the next couple years. Unless Texas gets tired of Bradley and cashiers him like we did (which they can’t do while he’s the best hitter in the AL), I just don’t see that kind of talent available in a minor deal.

Unless you think that Detroit is ready for a Magglio firesale (08:$15M, 09:$18M, 10:$15M club option ($3M buyout), 11:$15M club option (no buyout)) or Colorado is ready for a Matt Holliday one (08:$9.5M, 09:$13.5M) there isn’t an expensive outfielder on a bad team I’d really want. A distant third is Carlos Lee, but he has a LOT of years left (08:$12M, 09:$18.5M, 10:$18.5M, 11:$18.5M, 12:$18.5M)

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 4:36 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I can see Holliday becoming available,

but I’m not sure he’s an ultimate match for the A’s, given the salary, his home/road splits (under .800 OPS on the road this season, though he’s generally been a bit over), and what the Rockies would/should want in return (we should not be trading prospects for veterans right now).

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 5:18 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I agree completely

I’d honestly rather have either Pirate, Corey Hart, or Luke Scott (who I like even though he’s a lefty, but no one else seems to).

One thing I’ve discovered poking around the OFers is that most great outfielders are on good/great teams. We have Cust, but he’s more a DH, so it would really behoove us to come up with a second .800+ OPS guy. My point above was merely that we’re unlikely to get one for free.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 6:38 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

great fanpost

I can see a lot of hypothetical trade discussions over the next month ending with links to this fanpost.

I voted for Kelly Johnson, thinking that Ellis will be gone in 1-2 years, and he’s one of the few upgrades that I think would fit into the long term plan. I have no idea what it would take to convince the Braves to part with him though.

by phastphill on Jun 14, 2008 4:46 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Thanks

If the Braves go on a run, maybe Blanton+Ellis is a good start (they should probably be trying to win now while Chipper Williams is doing his thing and they have Tex). I’d like that deal as long as we commit to keeping Kelly Johnson and don’t lose too much else.

I have no idea how much the Braves value him (although, obviously, enough to take more than a pound of flesh) but they desperately need SP if they want to hold on this year.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 6:41 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

blanton/ellis

would be a heck of a haul for them. If they’re really going for it this season (and it seems like they could) then I find it hard to believe that the A’s would have to pony up more than that.

I should add that I would prefer the A’s sign Ellis to any trade—I just don’t believe it will happen.

by phastphill on Jun 14, 2008 7:55 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't really know

Johnson is young/successful/controlled and Ellis would be a rent-a-player (or expensive). LIke I said in my post, Ellis is my favorite A and has been for awhile. This would be a real upgrade now and later though.

I don’t really have a sense of who would have to even out with prospects, but it seems like a fair beginning framework to me.

by nevermoor on Jun 14, 2008 9:04 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Does anyone know anything about

Robinson Tejeda who was DFA by the Rangers. Is he worth taking a gamble on by picking up or is he just what he appears to be a bust?

by A'sfaninNC on Jun 15, 2008 12:30 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

the only trade i see happening as of now

trading Emil brown. hes been coming off the bench this last weeks or so and it looks like he is not in the future plans this season. there is no room for him in the young outfield. He is a dependable and experienced verteran and he will attract some teams. i see billy beane trading him soon.

by Wreckonized on Jun 15, 2008 9:20 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I doubt it

I don’t think there’s a single facet of the game in which Emil is above replacement level this season.

Billy would be lucky to get a bag of maple bats for him at this point.

by phastphill on Jun 15, 2008 10:07 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Let's put it this way

If Emil Brown is claimed on waivers, the claiming team has to pay Oakland $20,000.

That’s about the maximum I could see him bringing back in trade.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 16, 2008 8:04 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I don't think that's right

If we put him on waivers and someone claims him, they eat his salary for the rest of the year.
Unless we can’t put him on waivers (>5 years experience) so we have to just release him (like the Jays did with Frank).
http://espn.go.com/mlb/s/transanctionsprimer.html

I think the most likely result is that we release him, eat his salary, and he rides off into the sunset. We could also package him into a deal since his salary is pretty low, but he’d reduce the value of our side of the deal.

by nevermoor on Jun 16, 2008 8:23 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

You're confusing trade waivers

with iDFA / outright waivers.

Trade waivers, are where the claiming team eats the rest of the salary. They’re used after the trading deadline to trade players.

ZIPS: Milledge: 466 HR, 485 2B, 2282 hits, 278-379-524

by rfloh on Jun 17, 2008 2:12 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to the SB Nation blog about Oakland Athletics.

Community Guidelines ANcillary Terms
Start posting about the Athletics »

Join SB Nation and dive into communities focused on all your favorite teams.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recommended FanPosts

Wishyouwerehere250_small
AFL PitchFX Pt. 1: James Simmons
Imgp0089_editedagasin_small
DLD 11/24/09 - Fine, I'll make another video game dump
Me_at_att_park_small
Greener Grass, Episode 7: Transportation Proclamation
Me_at_att_park_small
Old McPherson is an A, e yi e yi yoooooooo
Depaulbluedemons_small
Community Prospect List #18

Recent FanPosts

Waregroupcheck_small
DLD 11.25.09 - Thanksgiving eve
Pulp_fiction_small
A's interested in Cuban defector Arguelles
Small
The A's Move to Oakland in 1968
Funny-pictures12_small
If Jack Cust Traded, Then To Whom And For What?
Small
Jack Cust Drawing Trade Interest?

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

SPONSORS


Managers

Tyler_at_maya_school_small Tyler Bleszinski

08-_the_author_small 67MARQUEZ

Baseball_small baseballgirl

Poochini-butt_in_box_2_small Nico

As_kings_cal_small louismg

Editors

Countdown_small Taj Adib

Ziegler160px_small Flashfire

527918550406_0_bg_small notsellingjeans