Blanton, A's Need A Win-Win Trade

by Nico on Jun 13, 2008 8:34 AM PDT Comment 144 comments

Put me in the camp who says Joe Blanton has pitched "well enough to win" this year. No, he has not lived up to hopes and expectations, mostly due to an out-of-the-blue tendency to offset five solid innings of work with a lousy 6th. But the problem isn't that Blanton isn't pitching well enough to win. The problem is that he isn't pitching well enough to win for a team like the A's.

Blanton is generally going to pitch deep into games and will give his team a great chance to win if they can score 3-5 runs. He is not, however, going to win a lot of 2-1 games. So on the A's, he often pitches "just well enough to lose," whereas on a team with a good offense but a weak rotation and/or bullpen, Blanton could be a tremendous addition.

The goal of a trade isn't actually to fleece the other team, it is to help both teams. The idea isn't to pawn your overrated players onto a team willing to accidentally give you their most underrated players, because this rarely happens. The idea is to identify trades whose players, by swapping, can serve their new team more than they served their old team.

On a team like the Tigers or Indians, Yankees or Red Sox, Brewers, Braves, or Cardinals, Blanton could be an outstanding performer, winning the games he is consistently losing for Oakland and greatly improving his team's rotation - and we have seen, up close and personal, how important starting pitching is to keeping a team competitive.

I don't think the A's should trade Blanton because he's 3-9. I think a team should acquire Blanton because for them he might be closer to 9-3 for them right now. So why is Blanton still here? Probably not because Beane wants to keep him so much as because other teams don't realize how effective he might be, as is, for them.

In other news...I'm fine with it if the A's decide to go with three left-handed hitting OFers because in Buck, Gonzalez, and R. Sweeney, you have players who are 22-23 years old who are far too young to become platoon players. They need either to learn how to hit lefties well at the major league level or show the A's that they cannot be played full-time, and 2008 is the year to figure this out. Even adding Cust (and Thomas) to the equation, there's enough playing time to go around, with occasional days off for each, injuries, pinch-hitting, and so on. Just let them start against LHP and take their lumps if need be. The alternative is Emil Brown, and the upgrade is marginal, offset by the defense, baserunning, and lack of long-term potential.

Finally...why don't the A's activate Frank Thomas today and send Calero packing? Wouldn't you rather have Thomas available, for each of the next six games, for the late AB of your choice instead of having Calero sitting around for emergency mop-up duty? How nice would it have been to have Thomas on the bench when Suzuki faced Wang on Friday night? I would love to have Thomas waiting to face Taschner or Hinshaw in a key situation. I don't need to have Calero approaching Bowen with a pack of playing cards, looking for a third and fourth for bridge because they serve no other meaningful purpose.

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The flaw in this argument

and it’s a small one, Nico—is the fact that this season there are a lot more 2-1 games because scoring is down. So Blanton’s numbers—mediocre as they decidedly are for this season—are being seen in a different light. Hence, IMHO, the difficulty in Beane moving him.

That said, a team like the Brewers makes a lot of sense. They do mash. With Soriano out the division title, while still remote, is not totally out of reach, and the WC is clearly within reach. We probably can’t get LaPorta for Blanton—- but maybe the next best thing.

I agree with you about the OF (Is Cunningham a righty bat? Are we all going to say: “Heyyyyyyyyyy, Cunningham!” in our best Henry Winkler impression when he comes up? Has Moneyball jumped the shark?) let ‘em play. Just seems like half the league’s starters are lefty these days, but they’ll come a stretch where they won’t be.

by madmongoose on Jun 13, 2008 8:51 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Heyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!

Cunningham is right-handed.

And I agree with you on Thomas—totally. We need the righty bat off the bench more than a lousy mop up guy out of the pen.

by madmongoose on Jun 13, 2008 8:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

My thinking is that the Brewers, with Braun, Fielder, et al,

could lose someone like Corey Hart and vastly improve by bolstering their wobbly rotation. While the A’s would improve greatly to add a good right-handed bat. Same with Carlos Guillen (I’ll find a place for him to play!), or a solid AAA prospect, etc. I just think there are teams out there who would improve a lot by trading a right-handed hitter / hitting prospect for Blanton because they can hit but don’t have the depth they need in the rotation to compete.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 13, 2008 8:56 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It just sure would help

If he put two or three solid starts in a row together.

by madmongoose on Jun 13, 2008 8:59 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Actually, C. Guillen is a bad example

because I have no idea where he WOULD play.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 13, 2008 9:00 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I have no idea where any new A's hitting prospect would play

The outfield and DH are already crowded with prospects and/or the team’s actual good hitters. The rest of the infield has established starting players. The only position where there’s some prospect of a direct improvement is at catcher, and even there you’re blocking Suzuki and, once his BABIP comes around, Landon Powell.

No, the only way a Blanton trade makes sense is if it’s a straightforward rebuilding trade—MLB players for prospects. And right now that’s just not very likely.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 9:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

At the expense of a lesser prospect we already have.

If it means getting a young player that can mash now, such as Corey Hart, Travis Buck can go shag fly balls in Midland (or be included in the Blanton deal).

So it goes.

by jeepers on Jun 13, 2008 2:48 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 3:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I would love Corey Hart on this team...

wait and see between Sweeney and Buck who really pans out

witty remark

by dtownmbrown on Jun 14, 2008 10:11 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Would you love trading Cahill, Doolittle and Devine for him?

I wouldn’t.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 14, 2008 11:57 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I wasn't suggesting trading any of them for him, I was thinking more along the lines of

whoever was posting about trading Big Joe to the Brewers.

I know we couldn’t do that straight up but the thought of having him on our team seems nice enough for me to post about it.

witty remark

by dtownmbrown on Jun 14, 2008 1:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If the deal on the table was

Blanton and Street for Corey Hart, who would say no? Probably the A’s, right? Yet add Hart to our lineup, in the OF alongside Gonzalez, R. Sweeney and Buck, replace Blanton in the rotation with Gaudin and replace Street with Casilla, A. Brown, Devine, Embree, Foulke, and Ziggy, and the A’s look pretty solid for 2008 and beyond.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 5:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Especially considering the fact that the A's

don’t value closers enough to resign Street and Blanton seems the more expendable of the two considering we have more than enough to choose from for a replacement, yes, Corey Hart would be awesome to get out of those 2…PLUS, we probably wouldn’t trade a guy like Doolittle to the Brew Crew because they have Fielder and LaPorta, right?

witty remark

by dtownmbrown on Jun 16, 2008 12:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Could not agree more on Thomas

Calero adds nothing, while Thomas would be available to pinch hit. Should be a no-brainer.

Might as well Jump! - Van Halen

by sprtsnwyn on Jun 13, 2008 8:56 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

+1

We need the big hurt to inspire fear in pitchers and crush some RBIs for us. Calero has outlived his usefulness.

Green Hulk Fists

by oaklandSMASH on Jun 13, 2008 3:24 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

the gambler says...

let Bowen get some pinch-AB’s.

somebody should let him out of the closet for some fresh air.

"You have to have a catcher or you'll have all passed balls."- Casey Stengel

by Gaijin_Suketto on Jun 13, 2008 4:12 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Roster thoughts

I like the idea of bring Thomas up as a PH. Also, I don’t have a problem going with 11 pitchers until Castila gets back.

I think Buck should be sent down (Provided the team believe it needs 2 back up infielders)

Why Buck?

1- There isn’t enough playing time for him. We won’t have Cust as DH probably for rest of year as the next 6 games have no Dh and Thomas will be back. Thus, Cust is back in LF. This leaves 2 spots in OF. Well, R. Sweeney and Gonzalez have played better than Buck. Davis’ spot is one that would not lead to Buck’s development. Buck needs to be playing baseball, not sitting on the bench, which he and Brown would be doing if he stayed on the team.

2- Brown should stay over Buck because he has better production and is right handed. He will probably see a major drop in playing time. I think he will get dumped eventually most likely when M. Sweeney gets back as his benefit of being a right handed PH are diluted.

by Yellowhorse on Jun 13, 2008 9:04 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Did you even look up the production numbers

before making your case for Brown over Buck?

Buck’s OPS for June is .724
Brown’s (while limited playing time) is .542

Emil has looked horrible for a veteran player, while Buck is still in his first full year. Designate Brown.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 9:30 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

btw

I realize Buck’s OPS is slugging heavy, but still….Buck doesn’t need to be jerked up and down between Sac any more than Barton does, ya dig?

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 9:31 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Why send down Barton?

He had a bad May, but he’s rebounded in June with a .306/.390/.472 line.

by VORP is too nerdy on Jun 13, 2008 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Kind of what I was inferring

neither of them need to be sent up and down.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 1:02 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

So Buck is better off on the A's bench then playing everyday at AAA

I think Brown and Buck both have been poor performers that’s why they both should be on the bench when R. Sweeney returns. (LF- Cust, CF- Gonzalez, RF- R. Sweeney as starters).

Putting Buck in the line-up would move Cust, gonzalez or R. Sweeney (all-young, all more productive) to the bench.

Brown would be better off as a reserve over Buck because he is Right handed and would not see his ‘development’ harmed by sitting.

As to Barton, I have advocated benching him when M. Sweeney was healthy. Right now I would be for making a trade to bring someone in to play 1b. I would definately send Barton down or to the bench if M. Sweeney was healthy.

As to production, I don’t place everything on OPS. There are other offensive stats that show that Brown is better than Buck. Buck is hitting under .200. That still counts in my book. I don’t dismiss Brown’s RBIs or think the numbers should be looked at for just one month.

In about 2 hours it won’t matter what I think they will make a move and I will support the A’s no matter what

by Yellowhorse on Jun 13, 2008 1:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

how

can you use the logic that for developmental you can’t rotate Sweeney, Buck, Gonzalez and Cust (when not DHing) but you can rotate Barton in and out to play Mike Sweeney?

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 2:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I am not for rotating in Buck with Gonzalez and Sweeney.

I am for playing Gonzalez and Sweeney as much as possible. Rotating in Buck would just take one of the two young productive hitters out of the line-up and replacing them with a player who is hitting much worse.

I don’t know where you saw that I was in favor of playing Barton. I think he has been a major drain on the offense. Back in May and April I was calling for M. Sweeney to play more. If M. Sweeney’s injury was season ending I would have made a trade to replace Barton. However, since Mike Sweeney will be back in July they might as well keep Barton or start Hannahan at 1B.

by Yellowhorse on Jun 13, 2008 3:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The question

is how can you be in favor of getting Buck the most playing time as possible (whether at AAA or in the Majors) but not Barton?

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 3:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If we had a bunch of guys who could play 1B at majors level then

I would say the same about Barton.

Once M. Sweeney returns I would say send Barton down. They could use Hannahan as a back-up to M. Sweeney.

Heck, if the Big Hurt could play some 1B I would do it.

I am for the team starting the best hitters possible. I think we will have a pretty good line-up once Thomas gets back, even better with an upgrade at 1B

by Yellowhorse on Jun 13, 2008 3:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

MSweeney...

...isn’t durable enough to play the field on a regular basis.

You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the goddamn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all. ~Earl Weaver

by UncleLeo on Jun 13, 2008 5:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

you are really missing

the goal of this season. It’s to get these guys to grow as much as possible, and Barton appears to be turning it around….why would you send him down? For one, Sweeney isn’t durable enough to be a starting 1B anymore, and 2, Barton loses a year of MLB experience if he isn’t in the lineup. He has nothing to prove at AAA anymore, if he goes down to Sac it’s just another year he’s going to struggle in Oakland.

Either you haven’t watched the A’s for the past 9-10 years or you’ve learned nothing from doing so.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 6:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

OK

Are you familiar with the name “Chris Carter”?

How about “Sean Doolittle”?

You may know them as “the two A’s prospects with the most home runs in the season to date.” They are also first basemen.

Trading for a first baseman would be a catastrophically stupid move. Like, half the frigging prospects in the A’s system play first base. Bad enough that you’re apparently willing to punt on a 22-year-old because of, essentially, one terrible month. You’d also be punting on the best hitters in the farm system.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 4:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Nico...

You have such a good head for baseball. All of your points above are spot on. As for Joe, it is very curious to me that his value hasn’t been evaluated properly.

by IM4Oakgal on Jun 13, 2008 9:07 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

He's not evaluated properly

because a lot of the traditional baseball minds still use W-L record as a judgment of how effective someone can be. That and Blanton is really a control righty. He would be a very good addition to any team but that record has to scare off some guys so I’m betting Beane isn’t getting great offers.

The other question becomes, if Harden stays healthy (knocks on wood), then do you deal him for a boatload of prospects? I imagine he would bring back a ton if he can prove he can stay healthy.

by Blez on Jun 13, 2008 9:30 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It would be hard to say no...

if a boatload of prospects were offered. Even if Harden stays healthy this season … You have to worry that the problem with his shoulder will raise it’s ugly head again next year. I bet Beane would snap up a bunch of promising prospects.

by IM4Oakgal on Jun 13, 2008 9:34 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Why are we saying

Blanton hasn’t been evaluated properly again? Because he has yet to be traded?

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 9:36 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm guessing because he wasn't dealt this last offseason

that a lot of teams offered players for him…just not nearly enough.

by Blez on Jun 13, 2008 9:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Just to play Devil's Advocate here

That could just as easily mean that Beane is not evaluating him properly. Perhaps Beane is asking for too much.

by BlameChannel53 on Jun 13, 2008 9:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

yup

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 13, 2008 9:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

he'll get what he's asking for

July 31st

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 9:50 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah, if he's asking for what he got in the Kendall deal

OK, hyperbole.

But he’s not going to get what he was offered last year, let alone what he was/is asking for.

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 13, 2008 10:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

ah but I disagree

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 10:24 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

fair 'nuff

I got no problem with out-and-out disagreements.

But I am curious as to your reasoning.

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 13, 2008 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Because

that’s why.

Actually I don’t feel like Joe’s value has diminished that significantly. Granted his K/BB (should improve at least a bit), WHIP and BAA are all up from last year….

the Braves made a bid earlier this season and as the deadline approaches their offer may be sweetened and hopefully opens some bidding competition. You know how it works

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

so ...

His idiot/non-Moneyball/old-school stats are down from last year.

And his peripherals are down from last year.

And he has one fewer year of cost containment/control.

And Beane is developing somewhat of a (deserved or not) rep as wringing all the good innings out of his starters before trading them.

And Beane was asking the moon, stars, and recently downgraded planetary objects for him last year.

And offense is down this year, putting more of a premium on hitters than pitchers.

How, exactly, does that compute to Beane getting more this year than he would have last year?

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 13, 2008 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm saying that gasp Beane knows what he's doing.

And what pitchers has he wrung all the innings out of? Do you really think that’s Barry Zito’s problem or are you referring to Mark Mulder who went over 220 innings twice in his career? Tim Hudson seems to be fine…..We all go through puberty and hey, some pitchers get injured.

Or are we going back to the all the theory that humans have devolved to developing weaker arms in the past 20 years/since we’ve been counting pitches?

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 11:40 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

please note the parenthetic

I don’t think he’s wrung innings out of pitchers—but that he’s getting a rep for having done so, right or wrong, impacts his public persona and his bargaining position when trying to deal a starting pitcher with a lot of innings under his belt. (I’d guess that the shrewder GMs would not believe the allegation, but would use it as a negotiating point.)

And if that’s your only objection to my argument …

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 13, 2008 12:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

But you DON'T KNOW what he was offered last year

Please link some article where someone with some reputability actually says what was offered, as opposed a wish list some fan or reporter conjectured that we ought to be able to get.

I’ll agree his value hasn’t improved since last summer, but I also don’t know (and I suspect you don’t know) exactly what that value was as measured in concrete offers from other GMs.

by Faust on Jun 13, 2008 1:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

no, of course I don't

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 13, 2008 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

then how can you.........ugh sigh.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 1:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't know what he was offered last year ...

... but I guarantee he’ll get less this year

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 13, 2008 2:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

lols

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 3:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Beane was doing a lot of trading last Winter...

and Joe is still with us.

by IM4Oakgal on Jun 13, 2008 9:45 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes,

But I am going to guess it’s because Beane is asking more than teams want to give up.

I think he isn't changing what he's asking since the Winter, because he knows the heat's going to be on some of these GM's to make a deal for pitching come the deadline. He's probably had his sights on this year's deadline to move Joe since last year's passed.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 9:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't know what happened there

But the jist is what Monkeyball said, to move Blanton, Beane has had his sights set on this year’s trading deadline since last year’s passed. The heat’s really going to be on for some GM’s to pick up some pitching, and they’re going to be pressured to give up more than they would have this winter. Let’s face it, Blanton IS going to get moved this time.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 9:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

if you indent a line one space

that is what happens. Look what happens with a space before “before”

before I write "before"

"I never predict anything, and I never will." Paul Gascoigne, English footballer

by One won lost won on Jun 13, 2008 10:25 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Brilliant! Thanks.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 10:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

on the other hand, maybe he has been evaluated properly

Not by W/L, but by possible widespread opinion that Blanton last year was pretty much already at his ceiling, that Beane significantly overvalued him last year in trade talks, that Beane may be getting a rep as a GM that squeezes innings out of his starters before trading them just when they’re about to hit a wall, and that his control game with no margin for error could/would eventually catch up to him?

Blanton on a team with a better offense wouldn’t be any better of a pitcher. He’d just possibly have more wins. And he’d still be giving up a ton of walks/hits/runs in the 5th/6th/7th innings and running his pitch count up.

Beane missed his opportunity. Sure, if someone gets desperate, Beane should pull the trigger. But I think that’s awfully unlikely at this point. Nico’s argument actually mitigates against trading Blanton, because, real pitching performance aside, his value is at a nadir right now.

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 13, 2008 9:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

A thousand times yes

I said earlier this year that I wouldn’t even ask for a Haren-esque deal for Harden; that a Swisher-esque deal would do. And I stick by that. We all love Harden on the rare occasions when he strings together 3 or 4 starts, but why hold on to a player that everyone agrees can’t be counted on going into every season when you could instead have 3 quality-to-star-potential prospects?

I love Rich. But I’m done with him.

President and CEO of the Ryan Sweeney Apologists Consortium

by Joey C. on Jun 13, 2008 12:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I couldn't disagree more

“Traditional baseball minds” or not, Blanton is not being evaluated by his 3-9 record., It’s all the other metrics that place him at or near the bottom third in the AL among starters this year that are holding up a deal. He simply isn’t enough of a difference maker—IN A YEAR WHEN SCORING IS DOWN—to get what the A’s want for him.

by madmongoose on Jun 13, 2008 12:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

+1

You don’t need to be Bill James to know not to evaluate a starter based on wins and losses.

Brainless Automaton #439

by rubin sierra on Jun 13, 2008 2:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

No, no, and again..no!

Sorry, I am not in the “Trading Harden for a boatload of prospects” camp.

He stays here, especially if healthy. Perod!!!!!

by mrod on Jun 13, 2008 12:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

You do realize

that he’s going to be leaving in a year and a half anyway, right?

I mean, I suppose Oakland could sound him out about taking an extension with incentives-based salaries, but Harden does not strike me as the kind of guy who would take a “hometown discount.”

It just seems like most of the pro-Harden camp is simply unwilling to come to grips with the reality that he will be a free agent, and not an Oakland A, after 2009.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 1:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think

I would like to have harden extended. Maybe even with a risky guarantee. I can’t say what the cap would be, If he’s OK, you got Santana. If not you’ve got Loaiza.

But You’re rght, I Expect HArden to go for the big money.

by Future Ed on Jun 13, 2008 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

At some point soon

we’re going to be able to keep some of the players we assume are goners because of free agency. I’m not saying Harden’s one of them-I think he’s about a year too early-but it’s on the horizon.

So it goes.

by jeepers on Jun 13, 2008 2:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Some, yes, but they have to be players you actually WANT to keep

Even if the A’s had an extra $10 million to play with, I wouldn’t advise them using that money to keep Joe Blanton or Bobby Crosby.

The A’s cannot afford to pay Harden Carl Pavano money for Carl Pavano production.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 3:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

How do you know thomas is ready to come back?

The A’s website says that he’s going to a Dr. in Vegas today. If he’s less than 100% it doesn’t make a lot of sense to bring back a DH for inter-league play, IMO.

Also, if you switch thomas for calero, what do you do when Casilla is ready to come back? I think I would rather switch Brown for Thomas, only if Thomas is ready and then switch Calero for Casilla.

"Last night, Darth Vader came down from planet Vulcan and told me that if I didn't take Lorraine out that he'd melt my brain." - George McFly

by GreenAndGoldFish on Jun 13, 2008 9:41 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Why not Thomas for Calero and Casilla for Brown?

Of course neither Frank nor Santiago is healthy so it’s moot.

by WaddellCanseco on Jun 13, 2008 9:48 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I guess the question isn't who do you want

it’s who do you want to get rid of. Personally I would rather have another arm in the bullpen, even a mediocre arm, than a mediocre 5th outfielder.

"Last night, Darth Vader came down from planet Vulcan and told me that if I didn't take Lorraine out that he'd melt my brain." - George McFly

by GreenAndGoldFish on Jun 13, 2008 9:52 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

yes

Designate Brown. he sucks

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 9:54 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm so glad we get to have this conversation again

and now that Blanton did what he always does again….most of us are seeing the light.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 9:52 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Most of us have an accurate picture of Blanton.

We always have. We know what to expect from him when he is on the mound.

by IM4Oakgal on Jun 13, 2008 9:55 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

4 ERs in 6+ innings

if that’s what he “always does”—is of course not acceptable.

Listen he’s still in or near the bottom 3rd of starting pitchers in the AL in ERA+ this year—wonder why Beane can’t move him? Look no further than that stat. And it’s not an idiot, non-Moneyball, W/L stat.

by madmongoose on Jun 13, 2008 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hmm....No, I don't think Blanton has a career ERA of 6.00

Beane didn’t move him last Winter when he was coming off a solid 14-win, 230 IP, 3.95 ERA season. I still think Blanton will move up in ERA+, and every other stat, before the year is over. Another team could take advantage of having missed his worse half and could get a heck of a lot from him in the second half – especially if they have the ability to score 4-5 runs as often as not, which the A’s don’t.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 13, 2008 2:46 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

that's the wisdom I'm hoping the GM's interested have.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 3:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sine hitting is our problem...

This may not be very popular with everyone since a lot of talk is about trades this person may not be very popular (and old), but why not take a look at Kenny Lofton as a possible lead off solution? Think about it, when Big Frank gets back, Hannahan will be sent to the bench with spot starts here and there and he hasn’t exactly been lighting it up while leading off (.213 avg, .258 OBP). So why not DFA Brown, bring in Lofton and see what he can do? And this way you don’t have to deal an arm (Blanton or Harden).

I also kind of like the idea of Lofton, Crosby, Cust, Thomas at the top of the order.

by mills16 on Jun 13, 2008 10:02 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I'd be surprised if there's a bigger Lofton fan at AN than me ...

... but I think this is a bad idea: Kenny’s been out of action since last season, he’s old, he can’t really field anymore, and who knows what he has left in the tank.

Plus, he’s a left-handed batter who can get on base a fair amount but who has no power. We’ve got plenty of those.

Honestly, bringing Rickey back in a non-ceremonial role would make a lot more sense. And even that has past its sell-by date.

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 13, 2008 10:11 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Absolutely understand what you're saying...

But no matter what he’d be an upgrade over Hannahan, and with Thomas coming back, he’s going to provide some pop to the lineup, and hopefully Chavy can find the power stroke from time-to-time..I just can’t think of anyone who would be available that would be an upgrade in the outfield and in the leadoff spot (well, unless Buck decides to start hitting)

Was just a thought, but absolutely understand your points

by mills16 on Jun 13, 2008 10:32 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Where the hell would Lofton play?

The A’s already have 5 players for 4 slots (Thomas, Cust, Buck, Sweeney, Gonzalez). He’d be seeing even less time than Emil at this point.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

He'd take over for Buck

And send Buck down so that way he doesn’t just sit the bench….

by mills16 on Jun 13, 2008 10:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

then it's a bad idea

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 10:58 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

bad idea to send down

a player who is hitting a staggering .160, .235 OBP, .321 SLG?

Believe me, Buck is one of my favorites, but if he doesn’t start to hit by the end of the month, you have to send him down.

by mills16 on Jun 13, 2008 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

But you don't know that he won't start hitting

So it’s a bad idea. With your logic, why not send Barton down and let Hannah Montana play first?

You do know what to expect from Emil Brown because what he’s doing now is what he does….not getting on-base. His timely hitting has disappeared as it was bound to. Buck has sucked, but he has gotten better and you have to give him the chance to continue improving or sucking. If he continues to suck, fine, send him down and stick Cust back in LF while Thomas DH’s. But Emil has nothing left to contribute and there’s not future left on this team for him.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 11:52 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

which is exactly why

i said if he doesn’t start hitting by the end of the month , which is a little more than 2 more weeks, then you have to start thinking about sending him down…

by mills16 on Jun 13, 2008 12:00 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes,

I do suppose you added that timetable after your initial post.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 1:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I would like to see Blanton traded

and Chad Guadin back in the rotation where he belongs and where he wants to be.

IMO he is being wasted in the pen. We all remember early last season before the injuries rendered him ineffective. His first half was incredible.

Also, (IMO) I would NOT trade Rich Harden. He has strung together a number (Fingers crossed) of starts and we have won everytime he has pitched. I know people want to trade him because we all think he may or will break down again but he is too valuable to this team when he’s out there.

I would take the risk and keep him. He is almost automatic for a team win and I would hate to see him pitching for a competitor and shutting us down. People get excited when he pitches in anticipation of what he can do and has done.

If he stays healthy, then teams are going to off a boatload and I think Billy would have to be blown away to trade him because he knows how often someone of Harden’s talent come along.

by Trainman on Jun 13, 2008 10:11 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Offer a boatload

by Trainman on Jun 13, 2008 10:12 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree that Guadin is being wasted in the pen

I think he should take Evelands place and Eveland should go to Sac. until his confidence/control are back.

"Last night, Darth Vader came down from planet Vulcan and told me that if I didn't take Lorraine out that he'd melt my brain." - George McFly

by GreenAndGoldFish on Jun 13, 2008 10:24 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm against sending Eveland to Sacramento

because it would needlessly use up his final option year and potentially force the A’s to DFA him in a future season. Cliff Lee would not be pitching (and doing great) for Cleveland if he had not had a seemingly “useless” option left last season.

With that said, all that accounting for that would require is for Eveland to take Gaudin’s place in the bullpen instead of going to AAA, which isn’t a terrible idea anyway given that the team currently has only one lefty reliever.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 10:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Fair enough

"Last night, Darth Vader came down from planet Vulcan and told me that if I didn't take Lorraine out that he'd melt my brain." - George McFly

by GreenAndGoldFish on Jun 13, 2008 10:35 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah

either put Gaudin back in for Eveland and keep Blanton in the rotation till a either a trade happens or Blanton starts to turn it around an a regular basis. I don’t see JB being sent to the bullpen because Billy wants him to be seen as much as possible as a starter, although I could see him as a long man if you switch him and Gaudin. Who knows, but I definitely want to see Chad back in the rotation.

by mrod on Jun 13, 2008 1:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Dude

We don’t “think [Harden] may or will break down again.” We know. Players like this don’t magically get better and become consistent. At best you get one brilliant year (i.e., Prior). And unfortunately for Rich, that may have been 2004 when he pitched 189 and 2/3.

I’m not putting this solely on you, but I’m always amazed how fast people pull 180’s on this site. When a player is doing poorly (early-season Ryan Sweeney) or is spending all of their time on the DL (every-season Rich Harden), everyone wants to axe the guy. But when they taste just a little success, everyone acts as if there was never any question about ‘em.

Remember the bad times with Rich. They far outnumber the good times. Let’s throw him to some chump GM for a decent haul and let his fanbase worry about it.

President and CEO of the Ryan Sweeney Apologists Consortium

by Joey C. on Jun 13, 2008 1:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

On Blanton...

....I feel sorry for him and the lack of run support he gets. This dates at least to last year, as well. He is certain to help a team that can score runs (A’s simply can’t for him).
However, he has to be traded for a hitter – a real hitter and not necessarily a slugger. I think if I were Blanton, I would be begging for a trade.

by doubleplayer on Jun 13, 2008 10:14 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Why would he "beg" for a trade?

I think he prefers to play for the Oakland A’s. Most players prefer the “known” for the “unknown”.

He’s a team guy. I’m sure he’d prefer to be on a team that looks to be AL West champs in 2009, maybe playoffs (outside chance) this year, than to go 12-0 the rest of the way for Pittsburgh or the Washington Nationals, getting an “uncanny” number of runs in support.

It’s a team game. He’d probably tell you, he wouldn’t mind a bit if he went 3-20, if the team won 100 games.

"I never predict anything, and I never will." Paul Gascoigne, English footballer

by One won lost won on Jun 13, 2008 10:31 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Blanton would not be going to Pittsburgh or Washington

Blanton is going to command a good haul of prospects/young MLB players in order for Beane to trade him. The only teams that would be willing to pay a heavy price for a solid but unspectacular pitcher are teams that see themselves as competiive this year and 2009. If Blanton is traded he is likely to go to a better or equivalent team, not a crappy one.

by BlameChannel53 on Jun 13, 2008 10:37 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

What about bullpen work?

Does Blaton make more sense as a relief pitcher? He’s got a reputation as a workhorse so pitching multiple days should be no problem and he’s good for 1-5 innings…..

Maybe a trade to someone who needs a solid, reliable 6,7,8 guy. Like the Yankees.

I don’t know if the Yankees have anything we want, or if anyone would be sold on Blanton as a reliever since he hasn’t pitched from the bullpen before. (That I know of anyway)

"Last night, Darth Vader came down from planet Vulcan and told me that if I didn't take Lorraine out that he'd melt my brain." - George McFly

by GreenAndGoldFish on Jun 13, 2008 10:18 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

He was OK in the '06 playoffs as a reliever

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

that was also a thought for me

“the bullpen”. He seems to “go five, then dive”. A shorter stint on the field might be his fit, like Duke in Duke’s early years.

"I never predict anything, and I never will." Paul Gascoigne, English footballer

by One won lost won on Jun 13, 2008 10:33 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I was thinking along those lines too.

Switch Gaudin and Blanton…we might see better results. Joe as a reliever might be the best way to use him…but the problem is that that would lessen his trade value. So that would be the catch. The other problem would be the way Joe would take the news. He’s pretty fiery.

by IM4Oakgal on Jun 13, 2008 10:47 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Geren would never do that to Blanton

Anybody notice how he let him pitch is way through the disaster that was Matsui last night AND left him in for the next inning? Joke city.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 11:02 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Anybody notice how he got three quick outs after Matsui and AND two outs in the 7th?

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 13, 2008 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh, right

The slam couldn’t have been avoided and nobody saw the 6th/7th inning collapse pattern repeating itself again. Yeah, those were real clutch outs Blanton got after giving up the slam.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 11:28 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I was only speaking to the post-Matsui at-bats

As I said elsewhere, Blanton simply didn’t want to throw hittable pitches to Abreu and A-Rod—which put him in the position of having to throw hittable pitches to Matsui (who actually guessed right and hit a not-bad-at-all pitch for the HR).

Geren can’t fix or anticipate Blanton’s unwillingness to let his defense do its job.

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 13, 2008 11:31 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes, he can because he's seen it before.

What’s understandable is that we don’t have the sure-fire bullpen we had earlier in the year thanks to the A’s being the A’s. Then we may have been able to get someone up and in the game (Devine, Casilla et al)....I realize it would be a real quick hook, but what other choice is Blanton giving the team by continuing to blow it after about 80 pitches? Maybe next time, but probably not.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

No manager in the world

would pull an uninjured, supposedly high-end starter pitching a shutout with 80 pitches thrown in the 6th inning.

The option is not even on the table.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Dusty Baker would

Oh, 80 pitches. I thought you said 180.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 13, 2008 12:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

He's not a supposedly "high-end starter pitching"

He’s a #3 starter on a good team.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

True

But a smart manager would have him on a microscopic leash if time and again he showed that 80+ pitches was the end of his effectiveness. Last night they showed a very ugly stat when they broke out the difference between Blanton’s first 4 innings vs. everything after. Do you pull him at that point, no, but you sure as hell better be prepared to pull the very moment he shows signs of faltering and be happy if he doesn’t.

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Jun 13, 2008 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

If the A's actually thought that,

they would need to move him to the bullpen immediately. You can’t have a starting pitcher who can only go 80 pitches. That’s ridiculous.

That said, it’s very obvious that the A’s don’t believe that Blanton can only go 80 pitches.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 1:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

And

he didn’t pitch badly to Abreu or Rodriguez. I don’t think he “lost it” I think he got a little unlucky that his throws were off the plate (or judged that way depending on how you look at it) He threw one aweful pitch to Matsui and the rest was fine.

To me, pitching changes are half circumstance and half Voodoo.

by Future Ed on Jun 13, 2008 1:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Okay

My first point was more in the hypothetical and generally speaking a starting pitcher who only goes 80 pitches is a bullpen pitcher in disguise.

My 2nd point (less hypothetical, but still slightly so) is that based on this year’s performance, he really has looked like a bullpen pitcher. I wouldn’t give up on him just yet, but if those numbers continue to play out, the A’s shouldn’t keep running him out there like that. Now, based on what i’ve seen in the past, once his pitch count goes past 80, generally there are days when he flat out tanks and days when he keeps it up and very little in between. If he starts to falter, based on that, I’d have a pretty damn quick hook by now. Regardless of how they got loaded (and especially b/c of how pissed he was) he should have been pulled before giving up the Granny (i’d have said the same thing even if he got out of the inning instead).

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Jun 13, 2008 2:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

80 pitches? What about Storm Davis?

In the late 1980s, 1990-91 (approx) Storm Davis only went five or six innings regularly. The guy just got torched if he went any further. So LaRussa had a very short leash on him.

Worked though

"I never predict anything, and I never will." Paul Gascoigne, English footballer

by One won lost won on Jun 13, 2008 3:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Storm Davis and Joe Blanton

are both very good 5th starters.

"You have to have a catcher or you'll have all passed balls."- Casey Stengel

by Gaijin_Suketto on Jun 13, 2008 4:01 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

1989 was Storm's year

where he was in for just 80+ pitches on several occasions.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/pi/gl.cgi?n1=davisst02&t=p&year=1989

The A’s averaged 5+ runs per game in support….they cannot do that now!

Davis went 19-7, and the team went 24-7 in his starts.

"I never predict anything, and I never will." Paul Gascoigne, English footballer

by One won lost won on Jun 13, 2008 4:04 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Storm Davis numbers

look a lot like Joe Blanton numbers. But Bob Geren is not Tony LaRussa by a long shot.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 4:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

And I know what you're saying about the post-Matsui at-bats,

but those weren’t the outs we needed. We needed a K and ground-ball DP. None of which Blanton gives you a great shot at.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 11:44 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

what about

K (Giambi)
Shallow foul to left (Cano)
Fly out (MCab)

And Blanton K’d Matsui the prior AB (On a change)

by Future Ed on Jun 13, 2008 1:31 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I noticed.

I am not anti-Joe. I like Joe and think he is definitely a worthy MLB starter. But maybe it really is time to put Gaudin back in the starting rotation.

by IM4Oakgal on Jun 13, 2008 12:05 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Beane would never do that to Blanton

by Sacred#24 on Jun 13, 2008 11:25 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes, my apologies for giving Geren too much authority.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 11:26 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

plus with Joba in the rotation now, the yanks have a gaping hole in late innings

witty remark

by dtownmbrown on Jun 14, 2008 10:49 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

The Problem with the A's

We don’t have any bad offensive starters. Every single player is either above average or a prospect (Emil excepted), so the only way to really improve our offense is to acquire a stud. Studs cost money, which we don’t have.

Blanton should have trade value (as I pointed out last night, he’s #88 for pitcher VORP) but I don’t think he gets a major league hitter who isn’t absurdly expensive but would help. I think it would have to be a restocking the farm system trade. We could afford such a trade by plugging Gaudin in, but then we’re in trouble if Gaudin, Duke, or Harden decides to revert to form and visit our lovely DL (or if Eveland or Smith gets “figured out” by the league and can’t adjust back)

by nevermoor on Jun 13, 2008 10:58 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Low payroll

Actually, because the A’s payroll is so low relative to the last few years, don’t they actually have some financial flexibility?

by Larry E on Jun 13, 2008 4:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yep

I’m waiting for the official go-ahead to form the Pat Burrell Fan Club, Oakland Chapter.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 5:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

{ Googles "Pat Burrell" + Jesus }

Is it prurient? I don’t know what to tell you. I think it’s odd and interesting. It’s part of life. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Jun 13, 2008 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

In five years I will be advocating the signing of Ryan Braun and Yu Darvish

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 5:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Does anyone think Blanton would have better results

if he was to switch places with Hardin in the rotation? Even though being the #1 starter is supposed to be over-rated, it seems like Blanton has been up against pitchers that are a bit above his caliber. Since he is more of a #2 or #3 starter, maybe he would have a little more success (and run support) if he wasn’t going up against other teams superstars.

"Last night, Darth Vader came down from planet Vulcan and told me that if I didn't take Lorraine out that he'd melt my brain." - George McFly

by GreenAndGoldFish on Jun 13, 2008 10:58 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I like it better as is

Sure, the A’s are punting Blanton’s starts… but those are games they likely wouldn’t win anyway. And they won’t have to waste much of the bullpen on them.

Besides, it’s not like you can match up at this point in the season anyway. It’s pretty much luck which of an opposing team’s starters you face on which day.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 12:25 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I partially disagree...

You can’t match up all the time, but you can match up sometimes. Through manipulation of the 5th starter’s starts, it can be done, but more with an eye towards a key series than trying to match up daily.

I don’t like throwing Cupcakes to the wolves, though. I’d rather have him gaining easy W’s and increasing his trade value.

"You have to have a catcher or you'll have all passed balls."- Casey Stengel

by Gaijin_Suketto on Jun 13, 2008 4:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Eh

What he’s lost in trade value, Duchscherer has gained. They’re basically the same pitcher, except that Duke has been better this season (but isn’t as healthy).

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Jun 13, 2008 4:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

harden

not hardin

"It's not my fault your team's so shitty." -Steve Friend, head coach, Chabot College, to Laney College's head coach, who asked why we scored so many runs after we beat Laney 30-3 in 2006

by flipgatey3 on Jun 13, 2008 12:51 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Whoops - can't spel and tipe at the same time

"Last night, Darth Vader came down from planet Vulcan and told me that if I didn't take Lorraine out that he'd melt my brain." - George McFly

by GreenAndGoldFish on Jun 13, 2008 1:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Is Blanton the new whipping boy?

I don’t see Blanton as a problem. The team is losing most of the games he starts but it’s not as if all of the blame can be pinned on him. He hasn’t pitched as well as he can of late but he’ll do better. When the A’s young players improve with age and experience, so will the offense and a lot of Blanton’s losses will become wins. I think it would be a mistake to trade him if he can be locked up long-term at a reasonable price. If Gonads is going to be moved back into the starting rotation, I think Eveland is the one who should make the move to the bullpen. PaulThomas may have suggested this recently and I agree.

Root for the Giants? Not even if they're playing al-Qaeda!

by Monday Fan on Jun 13, 2008 12:28 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Hmmm

We didn’t lock up a Cy Young winner; we didn’t lock up a Cy Young runner-up; we didn’t lock up a guy who was among the top 10% of all starters in the game when healthy; we didn’t lock up another guy who was among the top 10-15% of starters—

and we’re willing to lock up a guy whi essentially is league average?? Is that what Moneyball has come to??

“Reasonable” price—in this day and age, even after Zito and all the rest of the bad signings, is way more than this team can or will afford. No way Blanton is here much longer.

by madmongoose on Jun 13, 2008 12:44 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

reliable + average + inexpensive = good

Are you saying the A’s didn’t sign any of these pitchers to multi-year contracts before they were eligible for free agency?

Root for the Giants? Not even if they're playing al-Qaeda!

by Monday Fan on Jun 13, 2008 1:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sweeney up, Buck down

Emil still with team.

Might as well Jump! - Van Halen

by sprtsnwyn on Jun 13, 2008 3:03 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 3:11 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think E. Brown will probably be on the bench.

Probably only play against lefties. I think he will be done unless he starts hitting better or when M. Sweeney returns.

Maybe he will play some 1B if Barton continues to slump.

by Yellowhorse on Jun 13, 2008 3:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

see above

And also see Barton’s June numbers

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 3:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Good point on Barton he does seem to be hitting better

Then again May was as bad as it could get for Barton. I wonder if Geren kept playing Barton because of M. Sweeney’s knees were hurting even before the trip to the DL.

Either way I only mentioned Brown at 1B as one of the few spots he might see the field.

by Yellowhorse on Jun 13, 2008 3:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Geren kept playing Barton

for the same reason you are advocating for Buck to be getting his AB’s either at AAA or MLB level. Given that reasoning was missed, the Brown at 1B idea and Buck was sent back to AAA, I think this discussion is closed.

"The two of them deserve each other. One's a born liar, the other's convicted."

by SwampyD on Jun 13, 2008 4:20 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

by Flashfire on Jun 14, 2008 7:22 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Yeah - scratch that third point!

I had no idea.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Jun 14, 2008 9:23 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs