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What do we do with the Rotation?

If, as is indicated, Rich Harden comes off the Disabled list after making two rehab starts, and rejoins the team during the Rangers series (may 9th through 11th), the big question becomes; Who gets bumped from the rotation?

Obviously, a healthy Harden is the best pitcher we can have in the rotation. That is a given. But the rotation hasn't been slouching either. All five of the current members of the rotation have been doing well, except for one, whom is the least likely to lose his spot.

1. Joe Blanton - 4.32 ERA, 1.37 WHIP, 3.89 K/9
2. Justin Duchscherer - 2.70 ERA, 1.20 WHIP, 7.20 K/9
3. Dana Eveland - 2.48 ERA, 1.21 ERA, 6.52 K/9
4. Chad Gaudin - 3.38 ERA, 1.08 WHIP, 7.13 K/9
5. Greg Smith - 2.88 ERA, 1.16 WHIP, 7.13 K/9

If you look at that rotation, there is one obvious person to be moved to the bullpen when Rich Harden comes off the DL. Joe Blanton has the worst ERA of the bunch, the worst WHIp and the worst K/9. While his ERA is not bad, it is not Ace stuff, and it would be a good 4th Starter ERA. But, his peripherals are terrible. A 1.37 WHIp and 3.89 K/9 is simply not acceptable. But we need Blanton in the rotation to be trade bait and bring in prospects come July. So what do we do?

So what are our options?

Well, the first option is to send down one of Dana Eveland or Greg Smith. Smith seems more likely, as he has already had an option used and has more remaining, whereas Eveland has only one remaining, and it would be best to keep it.

A second would be to move one of Duchscherer or Gaudin into the Bullpen. Both are perfectly reasonable. Both are coming off major injuries from last year, both have experience in the Bullpen, and it can be argued that it would be best to limit their innings this year if we can, and they will get back into the rotation once Harden gets injured again.

But the Bullpen has been great thus far, with the exception of a shakier than normal Street, whom as someone noticed last game, seemed to have regained movement on his pitches. Would it behoove the A's to deal Street and promote Duchscherer from the rotation to the Closer role?

Or should we simply make Rich Harden the closer, as many have suggested, though Harden has said he does not want to be in the bullpen.

And then there is the option of going with a 6 Man Rotation, which would limit the innings for all pitchers involved, including Harden. This might just be the best strategy, as it would allow Duchscherer, Gaudin and Harden to limit their inning count for the year, would not disrupt the rotation for the period that Harden is healthy and for when Harden inevitably goes down with another injury. It would help protect the arms of Greg Smith and Dana Eveland. And it would allow the A''s to continue to showcase Joe Blanton for a july trade.

And speaking of showcasing, it might very well also be important to keep Chad Gaudin and Justin Duchscherer in the rotation in order to showcase them for a trade, this year or during the off season, when they become more expensive.

Because the potential decision that comes down in two weeks might effect the rest of the year, and the next off season. With the trades the A's have made this off season, and including the prospects already in their system, the A's might have several pitchers knocking on the door to the Major Leagues for 2009.

Pitchers who have the potential to be ready in 2009, opening day or mid season (not September callups, that is) include;

James Simmons, whom the A's have been going slowly with, but is considered already polished and near Major League ready. Simmons, in 17 Innings (4 Starts) has compiled a 1.06 ERA, with 15 Strikeouts, a .235 opposing batting average and a 1.06 WHIP. Simmons should be ready to go in 2009, assuming a mid season call up to Sacramento, which is highly probable. Simmons could become Joe Blanton, or he could become Jason Windsor, who could have become Joe Blanton.

Gio Gonzalez, prize from the Nick Swisher deal, is pitching in Sacramento and was already a candidate to make the team this year. There is no doubt that he will be ready in 2009. In Sacramento, Gio has a line of 2.50 ERA in 18.0 innings, with a 9 K/BB Ratio (18 K's) and a 1.33 WHIP.

Henry Alberto Rodriguez (Hey-Rod?) got called up to Midland after dominating in Stockton, and Rotoworld has speculated that the A's might aggressively promote Rodriguez, making him a potential 2009 Starter or Mid-Season call up. If he can continue to improve his control and develop his secondary pitches, he will be a great starter. If not, he's still Closer material. HeyRod has struggled in Midland thus far, in 2 starts, 8 innings he has an ERA of 6.75, a 2.50 WHIP and 6 K's in 8 innings.

Then there are the usual stalwarts that compete for rotation spots every year. Dan Meyer, Dallas Braden, and perhaps the remains of Jason Windsor.

Then there are the pitching studs who could theoretically make huge jumps in the organization; Trevor Cahill, Brett Anderson, Fuatino De Los Santos, and Craig Italiano.

And then we have the good pitching prospects who show promise but to whom we don't know what to expect; Andrew Bailey, Ryan Webb, Vincent Mazzaro, Jared Lansford and the rest of the Kane County staff.

The team needs offense, and has a surplus of pitching, however fragile. The question is, should we turn that pitching into hitting now or should we do it later? And what do we have to do to make sure that its value continues to grow and not decline.

Poll
What should the A's do when Rich Harden comes back from the rotation? For options with more than one choice, specifiy in the comments.
  • Demote Greg Smith or Dana Eveland, or move one to the Bullpen.
  • Move Justin Duchscherer or Chad Gaudin to the Bullpen.
  • Move Joe Blanton into the Bullpen.
  • Make Rich Harden the Closer.
  • Go with a Six Man Rotation.

  290 votes | Results

3 recs | Comment 75 comments

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Greg Smith

He’s the one who’s most likely to be sent back down to Sacramento. He has pitched well but the option for him this year has already been used so he’s the obvious choice. Harden probably will get injured again anyways so he’ll be back up in no time.

by Coffee13eans on Apr 27, 2008 1:10 PM PDT   0 recs

I love the six man rotation idea.

This situation will work itself out quickly between the injury issues and the young arms.

Hot dogs, get your hot dogs.

by jjham15 on Apr 27, 2008 1:12 PM PDT   0 recs

Don't assume Rich is coming back

You don’t know with him. He could very well be injured again OR he could get injured in the minor league starts. I pretty much assume he’s going down any time he throws a pitch.

by Blez on Apr 27, 2008 1:31 PM PDT   0 recs

You are

right on the money with that comment.

by sf drift king on Apr 28, 2008 1:34 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Harden to the bullpen, IMO

It’s pretty much been proven that he is not physically capable of throwing 6-7 innings at a time, 30 times a year. I don’t know about you, but when I try something and I fail over and over again, I try a different approach. Let’s ask him to throw 1-2 innings at a time, 50-60 times a year. Will that be successful? Eh, probably not, I’m just saying it’s worth trying something new.

Harden has said he does not want to be in the bullpen.

Tough shit. If Employee #40 is unhappy with the A’s handling of him, free agency is coming around soon enough.

by Soaker on Apr 27, 2008 1:35 PM PDT   0 recs

Soaker

you are forgetting that Harden also re-injured himself while coming out of the pen a year or 2 ago.

With that said, I agree that that’s where we put him for now until one of the youngsters begin to struggle. The starting 5 is pitching well, why disrupt things with them. Bring RH out of the pen.

by sf drift king on Apr 28, 2008 1:38 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I think its not going to be a real issue

As the season progresses, just because I don’t see Harden staying healthy for a consistent amount of time. If you base his predicted performance this season, based upon his major league career thus far; I see Harden pitching for a stretch of 5 or 6 games at the most, then being hurt again. I think that all and all we will need all 6 of the above mentioned starters in the rotation this season.

"I Will Not Relent, I Am Driven"... Clutch
Bring Back The Bash!!!

by Shippee33 on Apr 27, 2008 1:37 PM PDT   0 recs

Id say Duke back to pen...

Or hes just gonna get hurt again too. Blanton would be traded at any moment. I see the rotation in June being:

Harden(If not hurt)
Blanton(If not traded)
Eveland
Gaudin
Smith
Gio Gonzalez

If Harden is hurt then Blanton prob wont be traded.

When will then be now? Soon.

by Syphon on Apr 27, 2008 4:13 PM PDT   0 recs

I'm not really sure why the question is being asked

It’s Rich Harden. We’ve been through this before. It’s much safer to assume he’ll be hurt and adjust on the fly if he isn’t than the other way around.

In the unlikely event that Harden and his mangled remnant of a shoulder show up for a start or two, the option that makes by far the most sense is a 6-man rotation. Eveland is going to need to skip some starts in any event to make sure he doesn’t go way over his prior career high in IP. Duke and Gaudin are still probably not 100%. Etc.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Apr 27, 2008 4:19 PM PDT   0 recs

Definitely

Not to mention the fact that neither Duke nor Gaudin has pitched their way out of the rotation. Harden’s bound to get derailed again within 2 starts, so there’s no point in sending Smith back down… unless you want the frequent flier miles.

I’m guessing, though, that the front office will do just that and say they want to give Smith regular work. Oh, well. Nice problem to have.

-JC
President and CEO of the Ryan Sweeney Apologists Consortium

by Joey C. on Apr 27, 2008 4:27 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

And that's not a big deal

Since Smith can be called right back up once Harden’s new arm falls off.

http://bocropleasestopswingingatbadpitches.blogspot.com/

by thejd44 on Apr 27, 2008 5:57 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Frequent flier miles?

Sadly, the A’s wouldn’t even get that… as the AAA affiliate is in Sacramento.

Maybe they can get a 10-ride Amtrak ticket and save a few bucks.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Apr 27, 2008 7:43 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

The A's are on such a budget...

... that dudes getting called might have to take I-80? Poor bastards…

-JC
President and CEO of the Ryan Sweeney Apologists Consortium

by Joey C. on Apr 28, 2008 3:47 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

put Harden in the 'pen?

I dunno… maybe if we limit his use he could be effective as middle relief/set up (see Zumaya, who ironically is recovering from surgery)? I dunno, just thinking beyond the rotation, because… Harden can’t handle it with his body of fucking glass… it’s a waste.

"I hope he arouses the fire that's dormant in the innermost recesses of my soul." - Ichiro on Matsuzaka

by ConditionOakland on Apr 27, 2008 4:44 PM PDT   0 recs

Time to make a trade.

Which means the temporary answer is a Smith demotion until such time that someone can be suckered into taking Blanton or Harden off our hands.

So it goes.

by jeepers on Apr 27, 2008 4:47 PM PDT   0 recs

Don't think anyone's hungry for cupcakes yet

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Apr 27, 2008 6:12 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Nothing too drastic

As we all know, we can’t count on Harden pitching, ever. Therefore, if he happens to come back, whatever the A’s do must be a small, easily reversible move. I think it’d be much easier to send Smith down to Sac to start, then recall him when necessary, than it would be to move any of the starters to the ‘pen, or to trade Blanton. Duke doesn’t want to go back to relief and has earned the chance to stick in the rotation.

Trade Blanton only when Gio is ready to permanently replace him.

by ervance on Apr 27, 2008 4:51 PM PDT   0 recs

Which isn't now, by the way

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Apr 27, 2008 6:13 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Exactly

Maybe Gio will prove he’s ready to be an average MLB starter by July. If so, trade Cupcakes for some 2B-SS-3B prospects. Otherwise keep him until 2009, or (horror of horrors) let him walk as a FA after 2010.

by ervance on Apr 27, 2008 7:11 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

'Tis a pleasant dilema to have

Of all the suggested options, I think demoting Smith is the best.

A six man rotation sounds good but the logistics worry me. You’d have guys going 6-7 days between starts and the pitchers’ throwing programs are designed around a 5 man rotation which means Curt Young would have to modify the between starts throwing sessions to accomodate the change. Sure, more rest sounds like a good thing but you’re talking about experimenting with and changing a structured program on the fly during the season. If the A’s don’t get the tweaks just right on the first try the effects will appear in the Won/Loss column.

Bumping Blanton to the bullpen is just all kinds of bad, as explained by Zonis.

Having Harden spend all offseason training to start, then having him re-hab to return to the rotation AND THEN bouncing him to the bullpen when he comes back is asking for trouble. The Cubs spent the entirety of ST getting Kerry Wood comfortable with life in the ‘pen, Duke got to spend 6 months prepping for a job in the rotation and now we’d consider putting Harden in a job he’s had barely any experience at and expect him to contribute immediately as the closer.

Why not ask him to pitch left handed while he’s at it?

Send Smith back to Sac, wait for Harden to break down again or a trade to happen, and then be comforted by the knowledge that the A’s already have someone ready to fill in.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Apr 27, 2008 6:23 PM PDT   1 recs

You are correct, sir

The A's colors are green and gold.

by mikeA on Apr 27, 2008 6:43 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I don't know what it does for pitchers' psychology or workouts

but for what it’s worth, the data I’ve seen suggest that pitchers on 5 days’ rest pitch better than ones on 4 days’ rest (not better enough, however, to offset the fact that the average team’s 6th starter will cost more runs than the rest for starters 1-5 gains, so the 5-man rotation is still optimal in normal circumstances).

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Apr 27, 2008 7:46 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

That data is limited by... well, you know

Most instances of a SP going on 6 days or more rest are almost random events. What’s being suggested is a system that demands almost a week between starts, especially when you consider all the built-in off days for the next couple months. Right now our guys are trained to do a certain amount of work to keep sharp between starts. That program would have to change if the A’s went to a 6 man rotation.

I’m not saying it couldn’t work, but teams generally try to avoid unnecessary experimentation with their pitchers during the season.

Besides, as soon as all the kinks got worked out in a 6 man rotation Harden would go back to being day-to-day.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Apr 27, 2008 8:05 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Again, you are correct

The A's colors are green and gold.

by mikeA on Apr 27, 2008 8:06 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

5th starters skipped

I’m guessing that 5th starters don’t usually pitch as much on 5 days rest relative to 1-4 starters because teams sometimes use the off day to skip their 5th starter. That may be an inherent bias in the analysis of the data.

by Larry E on Apr 28, 2008 2:49 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I agree

First off, the odds that all will be healthy by the time Harden completes his next start are 50-50 at best—so the problem may be taken care of. The odds of Harden being healthy for any extended period are obviously lower than 50-50.

If somehow both of the above defy probability and we have 6 healthy starters by the middle of May, then:

a) Blanton and Eveland obviously stay right where they are. And the three health-challenged righties stay in as long as possible, leaving Smith the odd man out. Harden must be showcased, Duke needs to get the chance to see if he can routinely throw 100 pitches and get to the 6th or 7th inning, and Gaudin, if healthy and accurate, is too good not to keep as one of the 5.

It’s the next step that’s fascinating. The A’s could either 1) be in contention and roll with it—and delay Gio Gonzalez’ ascension to the bigs and keep Smith on hold or, eventually, in the bullpen or 2) be in contention and trade Blanton or Harden anyway, since Beane, like all of us, wouldn’t mind having his cake and eat it too. Given the health of the Angels’ farm system (Their AAA team is 21-1, at last report) I think we are in a bit of a young talent arms race—and if Blanton and/or Harden can yield 2 or 3 more prospects—particularly a middle-infield position player—I say go for it, or 3) be out of contention, in which case Blanton and/or Harden is definitely gone.

by madmongoose on Apr 28, 2008 10:02 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I wouldn't really panic about the Angels AAA team

There are some quality prospects there—Nick Adenhart, Sean Rodriguez, Brandon Wood—but to a large degree it seems to be filled with guys who they don’t particularly like and “tweener” prospects along the lines of Danny Putnam who are putting up good numbers but are too old to really be thought of as high-upside. (Of course, you could say largely the same of the A’s own AAA team now that some guys have been called up.)

Adenhart’s statistics are baffling. He’s dominating AAA without either striking people out (19 Ks in 30 innings) or any control (15 BBs). Apparently he’s already learned the Angels’ trait of masking not actually being good by being incredibly lucky.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Apr 28, 2008 12:38 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

19k 15bb in 30 innings

that is not so impressive

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Apr 28, 2008 2:34 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

options are not finite

You can send a guy up and down all you want. An option isn’t a finite resource—it’s shorthand for “option years” which means years of service time during which a player can be optioned down without clearing waivers. Therefore, it doesn’t matter whether you option Smith or Eveland, so if you wanted to send down Eveland instead of Smith, that wouldn’t be a factor.

That said, with Smith being a a little younger and less experienced in the bigs, and all around being the “lesser talent” of the two, it makes more sense to leave Eveland in the bigs for the time being.

I think getting Duchsherer or Blanton hot and then traded is the way to go, but playoff experience could be a factor later in the season should they get closer to the season. I’m not a huge subscriber to playoff experience being important, but all things being equal if the A’s find themselves in a pennant push I wouldn’t mind them having guys like Blanton around (though if they can get a lot of value for him I’d trade him of course)

Jeremy was safe. He jumped over the tag.

by mrrickyg on Apr 27, 2008 8:02 PM PDT   0 recs

Eveland has one option year remaining. We haven't used one this year yet.

If we DO use it, then that means that after this year, we can not send him down with out putting him on waivers.

by Zonis on Apr 27, 2008 8:51 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I feel a little differently - I could see Smith

sustaining his major league success more likely than I can see Eveland sustaining. Smith is polished and throws strikes; Eveland is getting by with 5.2 IP, 4 BB performances that could implode on him anytime. My guess is that Eveland will wobble more than Smith this year if they both pitch enough.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Apr 27, 2008 9:32 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

ok can't nitpick really

I honestly don’t know enough about them other than what I’ve seen this year, and see Smith as more of a nibbler with Eveland having the better stuff. Hopefully they are both just awesome and it doesn’t matter who you send down and who you keep because it’s all temporary to unload the vets :-D.

Let’s just say I won’t feel bad whichever one gets sent down.

In other news, Gaudin looks pretty damned good which is exciting. I always remembered him being a decent prospect on the Rays, and he was so good for the half a season last year, it was good news that he was hurt the second year. Healthy now, he’s looking great!

Jeremy was safe. He jumped over the tag.

by mrrickyg on Apr 27, 2008 9:59 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

+1

Smith strikes me (no pun intended) as the real thing. Eveland has the ability to settle in as a Lilly/Lidle-type in the sense that he wouldn’t be bad to have around, and would certainly positively contribute, but wouldn’t be a natural top-of-the-rotation guy either.

Some read stats. Fans actually watch the games.

by UncleLeo on Apr 29, 2008 3:50 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Options are not finite, but option years are

and there’s no reason to use them up when there’s no reason to.

Wait, that’s a tautology. Um. OK, let’s chalk that up to me not getting enough sleep last night.

Anyway, preserving one option year for Eveland would be a very good idea. Cliff Lee would not be pitching (and putting up 4-digit ERA+ figures) for Cleveland this season if he hadn’t had an option left last year.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Apr 27, 2008 11:07 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

i posted this before in another thread but i'll post it again now

from Neyer:

””Options”
After three years as a pro, a player must be protected on a team’s 40-man roster, or he is eligible for the Rule 5 draft (more on that later). Once he’s served those three years, and assuming he is added to the 40-man roster, his club then has what are called “options” on him.

When a player is on the 40-man roster but not on the 25-man Major League roster, he is on “optional assignment.” One common misconception about the rules is that a player may only be “optioned out” three times. Actually, each player has three option years, and he can be sent up and down as many times as the club chooses within those three seasons.

When you hear that a player is “out of options,” that means he’s been on the 40-man roster during three different seasons, beginning with his fourth as a pro, and to be sent down again he’ll have to clear waivers (more on those below).”

I read that as the clock runs for 3 seasons in the majors, 4th season of service teams = out of options. Sending someone up or down does not exhaust them. I don’t think you can keep a guy on the roster for a full season, and then have another option year in say their 5th season. It’s a similar rule to the rule V draft I think—It keeps players who should be in the majors in the majors (or 40 man rosters) by allowing other teams cracks at them before they get sent down (or left off the 40 man roster in the case of the rule V draft.)

And I certainly read the OP to imply that sending him down would use an “option” as opposed to “starting the clock on an option year”.

Jeremy was safe. He jumped over the tag.

by mrrickyg on Apr 27, 2008 11:16 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

but i should have prefaced this with the undeniable fact that...

...I’m wrong a lot.

Jeremy was safe. He jumped over the tag.

by mrrickyg on Apr 27, 2008 11:20 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

In this case, yes, you are

If a player does not spend any part of a season on a team’s 40-man roster but NOT on the team’s active roster, he does not expend an option in that season.

Travis Buck still has 3 option years remaining, because he spent all of the 2007 season (and the 2008 season to date) on the active roster and/or the DL.

Barry Bonds also still has 3 option years remaining, because no one in their right mind would ever option Barry Bonds to the minors.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Apr 27, 2008 11:34 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

huh?

“If a player does not spend any part of a season on a team’s 40-man roster but NOT on the team’s active roster, he does not expend an option in that season.”

Did you mean “does” on the 40 man roster? You have to be on the 40 man roster to be on the 25 man roster. As far as I can tell, once you’ve been on a 40 man roster for 3 seasons, you are out of options, so Barry Bonds is out of options? And the Rule V is like what, for players that have been in the minors for 3 years and are NOT on a 40 man roster.

Jeremy was safe. He jumped over the tag.

by mrrickyg on Apr 27, 2008 11:38 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Perhaps I worded that awkwardly

At any given time, there are basically (hi, bereavement list!) 3 states a player on the 40-man roster can be in:

On the 25-man roster
On the DL
Neither of the above (in the minors, essentially)

If a player spends more than a very small number of days (20, I think) in a season in the “neither of the above” category, he expends an option year for that season. If he does NOT, i.e. he spends the entire year on the DL or in the majors, he does not expend an option year.

Lenny DiNardo was recently optioned to the minors despite having over 3 years’ service time, because in 2 of his 4 prior seasons he spent the entire year either in the majors or on the DL. As such, he still had 1 option year remaining.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Apr 28, 2008 12:17 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Shorter version:

If a guy spends the entire season on the 25-man roster, it doesn’t use up an option that year.

formerly known as mdl

by iglew on Apr 28, 2008 1:15 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Speaking of pitching

Cahill dealt tonight.

7 IP 5 H 1 R 0 BB 12 K 8 GO/1 AO

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Apr 27, 2008 8:23 PM PDT   0 recs

Cahill has put up

absolutely incredible numbers so far.

3.0 GO/AO (would be top 5 in mlb)
4.27% BB rate (half the mlb SP average)
33% K rate ((Double the mlb SP average)
0 HR

Those are mind-bogglingly filthy numbers so far. It is pretty much impossible to pitch better than Cahill has so far.

The A's colors are green and gold.

by mikeA on Apr 27, 2008 8:48 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Cahill: the next Cliff Lee?

Sorry, I’ll shut up about Cliff Lee now.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Apr 27, 2008 11:10 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Cahill is a righty, right?

The way he’s pitching, he sounds like the A-ball Mark Gubicza or Kevin Brown.

"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s

by Nick on Apr 28, 2008 5:10 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Yeah, I really just meant

“guy who’s unquestionably pitching lights-out, but whose stats are so transcendantly, ridiculously amazing that they have to come down to earth at some point.”

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Apr 28, 2008 5:35 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Smith to the pen...

Keeps his innings down (he shouldn’t go over 170 this year) and doesn’t mean he gets sent down. Plus, it’d be another quality arm in the pen (replacing Braden/Lenny/Saarloos).

"Looks like you brought two too many."

by BWH on Apr 27, 2008 9:03 PM PDT   0 recs

Toiling?

Is Joba Chamberlain toiling in the Yanks’ pen?

Smith’s career high in innings is 148. Given that, he shouldn’t go over 170-175 this year, getting him ready for 200 in 2009. Being a reliever isn’t a death sentence for a young starter.

Relief pitcher =/= 4th outfielder.

"Looks like you brought two too many."

by BWH on Apr 27, 2008 9:18 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

tell that to Lenny DiNardo, Kirk Saarloos, or Dallas Braden

The longman or last man on the bench in the Bullpen for the A’s never gets any time, except every three weeks in either a long relief role or when a starter gets injured.

by Zonis on Apr 27, 2008 9:59 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

yeah Chamberlain has sick stuff and got put in an important setup role

Smith wouldn’t have as important a bullpen role in all likelihood, and even if he did it’s a lot to ask of a nibbler. Guys like Smith are better off cutting their teeth at the back of the rotation in low pressure situations, not coming in to get tough important outs later.

Jeremy was safe. He jumped over the tag.

by mrrickyg on Apr 27, 2008 10:01 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

True...

...and if he goes down to Sac to start, it probably won’t be for long, until someone gets hurt or traded…

Formerly known as K56 and SPWC, in case anyone cares...

by Gaijin_Suketto on Apr 28, 2008 10:37 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

This is actually not correct

He threw 186 innings in 2005.

Meanwhile, Eveland’s career high really is around 140, so the argument for having him move to the bullpen for a while is a lot stronger.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Apr 27, 2008 11:14 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

No No No

HARDEN WILL WIN GAMES 1, 4, AND 7 of the world series!

Jeremy was safe. He jumped over the tag.

by mrrickyg on Apr 27, 2008 10:33 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Pessimist

We’re winning it in 6.

I'm here to talk about the past.

by 67MARQUEZ on Apr 27, 2008 10:40 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

now that's the kind of talk I'm looking for!

Optimism rocks!

Formerly known as K56 and SPWC, in case anyone cares...

by Gaijin_Suketto on Apr 28, 2008 10:38 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

And he can still get the 3rd win

We can bring him in from the bullpen in game 6 for a couple innings of relief work, a la Pedro in the ‘99 DS.

by TempletonPeck on Apr 28, 2008 1:43 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Trade Street

Make Casilla the closer, put Duke back in bullpen, or trade Embree, and put Duke back in bullpen.

by jahs34 on Apr 28, 2008 9:33 AM PDT   0 recs

Harden will not last long

If he comes back as a starter. At this point he is just hard to watch.

by butler19 on Apr 28, 2008 11:38 AM PDT   0 recs

People seem to be missing a couple of other bits of information...

Everyone seems to be talking about Harden’s health… Duke has come out of 50% of his starts this year because of injuries. He was hurt all year last year… and still has to prove that he’s of starter material. I’m not saying that that he’s not good enough for the rotation, but i’m saying that he hasn’t shown that he’s a good starter over the course of a season. Both times he pitched he basically only went through the lineups about 2 times. That 3rd time through the lineup is what separates the 1 and 2’s from the 4 and 5’s.

My money is on the idea that at, most, those 6 pitchers will all be healthy at the same time for about 2 weeks throughout the whole season from now on.

"I'm not going to buy my kids an encyclopedia. Let them walk to school like I did." -Yogi Berra

by brenarlo on Apr 28, 2008 3:02 PM PDT   0 recs

Agreed on Duke

He was immensely valuable as a reliever, and he hasn’t proven that he is capable of throwing more than 6 innings.

by mikev on Apr 28, 2008 3:58 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

the guy was a starting prospect

and started a few games and did well a few years back. he fell into the bullpen because of lack of available rotation spots, and stuck because he pitched very well. he deserves a real chance to start.

Jeremy was safe. He jumped over the tag.

by mrrickyg on Apr 28, 2008 4:27 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

I agree he shoudl get a chance...

But my guess is that he’ll either keep getting hurt or he’ll start getting knocked around… just a guess though.

"I'm not going to buy my kids an encyclopedia. Let them walk to school like I did." -Yogi Berra

by brenarlo on Apr 28, 2008 10:26 PM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Duke in the bullpen

With all the hard throwers now in the pen, Duke would be a nice guy to mix in. I’m not convinced that he’ll hold up to starting – but I guess he hasn’t exactly been robust as a reliever, either. The Duke as starter experiment made sense until it became apparent how advanced some of the new guys were. I suppose if they end up moving Blanton, there’s still a role in the rotation for him this season. But I’d be shocked if he’s in the rotation in 2009.

by boilerdan on Apr 29, 2008 6:35 AM PDT to parent up   0 recs

Sure, but why mess with a good thing?

The rotation is pretty