We salute you Mr. Too Lazy To Do Any Actual Real Research Before I Write An Article Man
by since72 on Mar 16, 2008 8:47 AM PDT
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Scott Ostler, reporter for the San Francisco Chronicle, wrote this article in today's paper...Ostler's Article in the SF Chronicle.
The headline reads, "Bats Go Limp"
Under the "Misery Loves Company" file, the Giants Nation are not content to suck on their own, rather they feel the need to throw their drunken arm around their buddy across the bay and proclaim, "Hey, gamers, the A's suck too, it's ok that we suck!"
Pardon me Mr. Ostler, is it not a bit premature to make that prediction? Yes, we traded away one big bat, but the last time I checked we lead the American league this spring with a .311 batting average and have more home runs in the Spring than the Yankees, the Angels and yes, our drunken pal across the bay, the sad sack Giants. Not only that, we are rockin' with one of the lowest ERA's this spring as well. So, how did you arrive at this "gone limp" premise? Wishful thinking?
So Mr. Too Lazy To Do Any Actual Real Research Before I Write An Article Man, this Bud's for you.
And in the meantime, we will just keep being the little team that could.
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not to mention
"20-30 home runs" for jeter? by my calculations, he's only hit more than 20 home runs three times in 13 seasons, with a high of 24.
President of the Joey Devine fan club as of 1/15/08. Accepting applications for other positions. "He has no equivalent." -Paul DePodesta on Jeremy Brown
The Giants lost the greatest home run hitter
of all time, so they will drop a lot, the A's lost Nick Swisher, Mark Kotsay, and Jason Kendall. We can get anyone on this site to hit more homers than the latter 2.
I had essentially the same reaction
Even if you think Eric Chavez will never play another game in an Oakland uniform, which is pretty out there, the team does still have Cust, and it doesn't seem outrageous to expect one of the Buck/Barton/Suzuki troika to develop some power over the next couple of years.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
And then there's this...
With both local professional baseball teams committed to small-ball, and spunk, and both featuring infields that will deal with injuries, inexperience and inconsistency, wouldn't it have been cool if the A's or Giants could have signed that guy Marco Scutaro?
A - The A's aren't committed to small ball. At all. What's he referencing? The fact that the A's no longer employ John Jaha and Matt Stairs? And don't get me started on, "spunk."
B - Nobody signed Marco Scutaro. He was traded, because he cost $2 million, and netted two mid-level minor league arms in return.
Formerly known as hward86.
Scutaro
Where would Scutaro actually fit on this A's roster? Does anybody actually think he's a more valuable commodity than Hannahan or Murphy? There were times in the past where I screamed for him to play over Crosby, but I don't actually believe he's a more talented player.
And if the Giants had offered what Toronto offered for Scutaro, that's where Scutaro would be playing this year. I'm surprised Beane got anything for him, to be honest. He's a dime a dozen player with a fairly large contract.
by thejd44 on Mar 16, 2008 10:41 AM PDT up reply actions
I criticize Ratto because he's capable of better
I resolutely ignore Ostler because he's not.
I wasn't thinking about anything. I'll have to try to do that more often. @('.')@
by monkeyball on Mar 16, 2008 10:31 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Is that why you resolutely ignore me?
Hey, I'm talking to you. Hey!
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
come on Nico
people actually read (and comment on) your posts
(couldn't resist)
I'm here to talk about the past.
I irresolutely ignore you
And as an educator of young people and an equine afficionado, you should be expected to know that hey is for horses.
I wasn't thinking about anything. I'll have to try to do that more often. @('.')@
well said
In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!
Being a great writer in the SF Chronicle....
...is like being the coolest guy in prison. Newspapers are so yesterday, AN is relevant, and Nico is one of the best voices out there. Newspaper reporters increasingly are having to write more over the top and sensationalistic articles to get attention for themselves. It was a drivel piece carried in an irrelevant rag and pissed me off. PaulThomas correctly points out that other than Swisher, we have better bats this season. And apart from an organizational shift to be more aggressive on the basepaths, there is not "spunk-o-nomics" agenda. It is merely the fact that we actually have younger faster guys on the team now. Barton will jack more or at least as many HR's as Johnson, Suzuki's grandmother will pop more than Ken-doll, IF BoCro is in fact back, he has more pop than Scooter at SS, and Cust will get his bombs too.
"Doesn't play well with the other children." Ms. Darias, principal, Broad Ave School
Oh great - thanks to this comment
now when you google "Nico" and "prison" you'll get even more hits.
I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal
Whoa there
I think that you are shortchanging cool guys in prison.
Rickey Henderson: 35, 24, hall of fame!
by Athletics fan and runner on Mar 16, 2008 3:02 PM PDT up reply actions
uh, actually ...
... while the Chron may have its own unique problems in addition to dealing with the newspaper business-model crisis, (a) they've been (appropriately enough, given their location) been one of the better dailies about embracing the web, and (b) they really have an amazing lineup of columnists/beat writers both in and out of the sports section. Sure -- Ostler, Shea, Knapp, and Jenkins are worthless, but they're outweighed by Slusser, Schulman, Matier & Ross, Ratto (!), Stienstra, Carroll, Goodman, King, Asmussen, et al.
I wasn't thinking about anything. I'll have to try to do that more often. @('.')@
Hey Monkeyguy
I wasn't intending to throw the paper under the bus, or in the bushes for that matter. I was merely commenting on A. Newspapers irrelevancy, particularly in the Bay Area, as a source of up to the minute news, and B. That Ostler was a shill of the Giants for trying to drag us into this category of "spunky, non-run producing, scratch out one or two runs a game" teams. I agree with you that there are some stand-up reporters over there, but on a personal note, when I drop 7k on an ad campaign with them and nobody responds anymore, or when I go into their offices and see an ocean of empty desks, it is a reminder that people in the Bay turn to the net and cable for news, and the paper for stories. It was a lame attempt on Ostler's part to be funny I think.
"Doesn't play well with the other children." Ms. Darias, principal, Broad Ave School
Are you serious?
About the 7K part? I've long been of the opinion that the print media is largely irrelevant....but to hear it from a business perspective is....enlightening/shocking? It's a generally accepted axiom that there is a certain political slant to the print media, at least among the circles I run in, however I have held out a faint hope that one day the newspaper business would return to a forum where they are truly unbiased and report facts as they exist....not as they would have them to be. But if they are unwilling to respond to good old fashioned capitalism, then truly their days are numbered. Natural selection in action I suppose....but still, it's sad to see the end of an era.
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
unwilling to respond?
c'mon man, what do you think we do? we are constantly looking to react to the market and adjust our business model, both in print and the web, to find new sources of revenue and make up for the secular decline in classified advertising. I go to meetings all the time where this is the focus. It's a tough challenge, but a lot of other businesses are in trouble too, see Bear Steares.
by vk on Mar 16, 2008 8:16 PM PDT up reply actions
Well, in that case....
you're failing miserably. You might want to consider trying another approach. I suppose there is always the British method, but that would be sadder still to watch. You might consider starting at the beginning by asking why the customers aren't buying what you're selling. It's not that the paper business is inherently incapable of competing with the internet. There is still a place for a hard print media to be relevant and insightful. A good place to start would be to remove the lens from which traditional journalism is viewed. I have little trouble picking out the slant of a given journalists personal opinion from todays written pieces....be they left or right. When I do, I'm pretty much through with that writer. I don't want their freaking opinion, I don't want the selective reporting of "facts". What I do want is the story....in all its gory detail. BOTH SIDES of the story, with as much detail as possible. I'll form my own opinion from there.....I don't need a journalist attempting to shade the story.
That's what makes places like AN superior to the papers. If someone writes something, you can bet your ass that someone else will challenge it with an equally compelling argument. The reader is given competing views which facilitate reaching an informed opinion. It's not that freaking complicated. A good place for a journalist to start would be to understand that the world (and the story) are not likely to be black and white issues. We live in shades of gray, and a good newspaper man/woman has no business trying to influence events and opinions. For heavens sake, the story will tell itself if you let it.
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
Your argument has some merit,
but the dominant factor in newspapers' decline is that classifieds, which were a huge money source, can be done for free on the internet. If the Chron or any other newspaper decided that the road to the black was making sure the reporters were fair, just reported the facts, etc., it would do jack shit for profits. The Chron. is wise to shade to the story selection/editorial content somewhat to the left, just as say, the Dallas Morning News is wise to shade things somewhat to the right, none of which is necessarily intentional. There is a lot of value in actual reporting, which blogs generally don't do, and while daily newspapers ought not be opinion-setters on any topic, they are invaluable because there is no incentive for the general public to do any kind of journalism.
The A's colors are green and gold.
by mikeA on Mar 16, 2008 11:00 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Perhaps it's because I feel that an opporutnity
exists for the print media to very relevant. You're correct that there is little incentive for the public to engage in journalism....so why don't the experts do that particular task rather well? They have the means to do in depth examinations of a story from multiple angles. They don't need to shade a story by region. In fact, they would be better served by examining regional assumptions and bias in all their minutia. The media needs to focus a lot more attention on the "why" part of their stories. A good example would be Iraq. Now in the Bay, it's a given that the population will generally take a leftist view. That's okay.....but why wouldn't the paper put more of an effort in examining exactly what mid east oil production means to the economic life of the bay area? I'm a cynic at heart....so I assume they skip over hard facts when it doesn't serve to promote an agenda or would challenge common assumptions. If that's what they want to do, then fine. But don't expect that I will take them seriously on any other issue. I for one would welcome a print media that challenges my own opinions by doing in depth stories.....but is also capable of checking their own opinion at the door. If they want to sell adds, then they better damn well be able to sell their product to the consumer. I don't buy the paper for the adds, I buy it for content. It seems as though the newspapers have forgotten what business they're really in.
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
Val -- I think there's a general sense that, rel. to the intertubes, newspapers are late with the hard news --
-- not sure what can be done about that. But -- then, when we see dreck like Ostler's column that was Not subject to time pressures and was manifestly lazy and superficial, we wonder whether your guys have just given up. Does he not have access to the same sources we do? Seems doubtful -- then does he just not give a shyt? What's the excuse for crap like that? Seriously, I'm on SFGate all the time, but I'm down to Sunday Chron and feeling guilty that there's so little content per lb of paper. And don't get me started on the CCTimes daily -- it's just awful. I'm very close to canceling it entirely.
The meaning of life is not so much 'found,' as it is 'made.' --Opus
by The Dogfather on Mar 16, 2008 11:50 PM PDT up reply actions
AND, I wanna pick-up on a point made by "cardfark" in the first comment on 'gate --
(smart fella, he) --those of us with paranoid tendencies could easily read Ostler's attempt to lump the 8-run first inning A's with the Gidgets as "homerism" -- trying to minimize the damage to the preferred club by indicating there's no local alternative. There's no Q that's done routinely on THE sports leader -- do we have to put up with it from you-all, too?
The meaning of life is not so much 'found,' as it is 'made.' --Opus
by The Dogfather on Mar 17, 2008 9:33 AM PDT up reply actions
A classic example of what I'm railing against....
denying or refusing to acknowledge the obvious. The A's clearly have potential, while the home town favorites are destined to futility. It's as obvious as the proverbial nose-on-the-face. And yet, it's also totally ignored.
I don't get it. It's not like the "obvious" is even news. What the hell? Why the reluctance to put the facts out there?
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
By the way....
I apologize if my tone is a little over the top. I wasn't quite sure that you're really affiliated with the newspaper business. I'm actually quite fond of the print media....or at least what the print media could potentially be. I am saddened to see that it is proving itself incapable of adapting to a changing environment....especially since I believe that it need only return to its roots to once again be a valuable public forum.
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
Internet rules
I spent 7k for an ad campaign that was largely unproductive. I spend a third of that a month between Yelp and search engine optimization, and that accounts for about 85 percent of my business. I got a free ad from them too, half page, which would have run 3k and it garnered 1 sale and about 9 calls from other advertisers trying to solicit my business.
"Doesn't play well with the other children." Ms. Darias, principal, Broad Ave School
It's not just the Bay Area
The newspaper business sucks right now. It's one of the reason I decided to get a straight English degree and not go with Journalism. They're largely the same thing, but I found that journalism was a little more focused and with people losing their jobs everywhere, I thought the English degree would be more useful. I was right about the Journalism, but apparently an English degree isn't significantly better.
An uncle of mine lost his job with a Chicago paper recently. He had worked there for a few decades. Knowing what went on with him made the 5th season of The Wire really, really powerful.
by thejd44 on Mar 16, 2008 11:05 PM PDT up reply actions
And here I was expecting a response to my latest article ...
"It's for your own good. Big strong Devo knows whats best for Poppy" -- Mossback
We're too lazy.
The meaning of life is not so much 'found,' as it is 'made.' --Opus
by The Dogfather on Mar 16, 2008 7:21 PM PDT up reply actions
Hey Ostler!
Those spunky A's with their wimpy bats managed to somehow with alert and daring eked out 9 runs and 11 hits today.
Now, where you were correct is that your SF Giants, who 100 percent fit your silly little scenario, somehow squeezed 2 runs and 5 hits out of a line up that is made up of hacks, has-beens and upstarts....or gamers.
OK, it is officially Monday now, so, clean slate. Try to look at the stats next article Ostler, and write an article about the great spring the A's are having.
"Doesn't play well with the other children." Ms. Darias, principal, Broad Ave School
Amen Brother...amen
The little team that could-and can- might just run right over all the naysayers this year. The A's have never gotten any respect from Bay Area writers and will always be the stepchild- but that's okay. Quality and class need no introduction...it speaks for itself.
The greenmachine
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