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The Case for keeping Crosby

I know this won't be popular here on AN.  But, that is the least of my worries, obviously.

Anyway, I'm for keeping Bobby Crosby as our shortstop.  "Why?," you may ask?  Because I think he has the most upside and the least downside of all shortstops who are available.

Furcal is a Kotsay-waiting-to-happen.  Sign him to a 4 -year deal and live to regret the last three years.

Sign Edgar Renteria...  bad idea from the start, but let's just say you're a fan...  his 2008 OPS was .699.  Crosby's was .645.  Crosby is younger and, perhaps, better.  If you want Renteria, why didn't we just keep Marco...  he had an OPS of .697 last year.

Miguel Tejada you say?  Ummm...  maybe, if the price is cheap enough.  But, he was #13 versus Crosby's #18 in OPS in 2008, so he better come cheap.

Let's face it, if you can't get Escobar, it's almost not worth the price.  Besides, none of those other guys have the potential of power, save Tejada, and Crosby does...

I'd keep Crosby.

Poll
Should the A's keep Crosby or sign a FA? Or make a trade?
Keep Crosby
42 votes
Furcal... I'm willing to take a chance on his Kotsay-like back
112 votes
Renteria... he's better than Croz
0 votes
I'm for Hardy... and willing to give up whatever it takes to get him
17 votes

171 votes | Poll has closed

0 recs  |  Comment 68 comments

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Holy Crap? You have a Time Machine?

Well, if we KNOW that Renteria will had a .699 OPS in 2009, we at least know what we are getting, right? And we know that Crosby had a .645 OPS in 2009…

facepalm.jpg

by Zonis on Nov 24, 2008 12:33 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

okay, one vote for Renteria

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 24, 2008 12:35 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

My vote

If we cannot land Furcal then I say we turn our attention/money to other positions and go into ST with Pennington, Petit, and Crosby in an open competition for the starting SS job. Who ever does the best wins and the 2nd place finisher gets the utility job while the other is either gone or in AAA. My reasoning for this is that outside of Furcal there is nobody on the FA market I’d be willing to pay to play for us. Unless there’s a trade out there for Escobar or Hardy that does not cripple our minor league system then I’d say it’s better to just keep Crosby.

"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin

by Helloooo 1st on Nov 24, 2008 12:38 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

yes, exactly...

the A’s money is better spent elsewhere than for a FA shortstop.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 24, 2008 12:42 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree

Unless that SS is Furcal who I feel will be worth (withing reason) the money. Renteria, Izturis, and Cabrera won’t.

"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin

by Helloooo 1st on Nov 24, 2008 12:46 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

not even Furcal...

I’d rather spend the money on Teixeira. Then, go for broke and Holliday a long term deal. Hey, we might get both of ‘em, if we throw enough dollars. See, I’m coming around to grover’s way of thinking.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 24, 2008 1:04 AM PST up reply actions   1 recs

"and offer Holliday..."

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 24, 2008 1:19 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Holliday and Teixeria?

Did the A’s win the lotto? Why not get Manny and round it off.

by JamesCaprio on Nov 24, 2008 10:19 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

what?

we’re talkin’ a $100 million payroll with Holliday and Teixeira. Very do-able with the new ballpark coming in Fremont and the Northern California Athletics Sports Network (NCASN) coming the same year. Dollars will flow to the A’s coffers.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 12:19 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

At this point, though, the Fremont ballpark

is somewhere between an idea and a hope – it is not a reality.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 25, 2008 4:33 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

we need a ss, no doubt about it

It is the most gaping hole on the team, without a doubt. Everyone talks about Barton and how disappointing he has been, but how about 4 more years of that from barton? cuz that’s what has become of crosby. he is getting paid above the league average for below average production.
If this is really the year the team goes for it, then snatch up Furcal, you give him $12-14 mil/year for 4 years, as far as I’m concerned, that’s fine. The way I see it, if we dump Crosby’s salary off and sign Furcal, that’s only $7-9 mil this year, I’d pay that for Furcal easily. Besides, Beane isn’t doing a thing until he is guaranteed Furcal is healthy, which it seems they have concluded he is.
In regards to the others, if we could sign Renteria or Cabrera for $6-8 mil for one year, I would do that. It’s an immediate upgrade and it’s not committing for a long time. otherwise, give some guys a shot…

by stranahanahan on Nov 24, 2008 1:43 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

I voted Furcal, but my real preference is to trade for a young SS like Hu or Lillibridge

who can be a significant plus defender like Jason Bartett.

I also don’t agree that Crosby has higher upside than Furcal. He may be less risky but a healthy Furcal is capable of plus defense a 105 OPS+ and 40 SB. I don’t see Crosby capable of any one of those things any more.

It's not the results, it's how you look going about those results -- Tim McCarver

by WaddellCanseco on Nov 24, 2008 3:51 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

I'm inclined to agree.

That is, until, I consider this particular statement of yours a little more carefully:

Furcal is a Kotsay-waiting-to-happen

Might be true but it’s not like Crosby is going to be making a run at Ripken’s record anytime soon. Substitute any ol’ injury for a specific back injury and it is just as likely that Crosby is a Kotsay-waiting-to-happen.

by LowcountryJoe on Nov 24, 2008 3:52 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Crosby is not a Kotsay Waiting to Happen

that has long passed

facepalm.jpg

by Zonis on Nov 24, 2008 3:53 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

As Zonis implied...

Crosby has had some freak injuries. He’s not Kotsay. Furcal may not be either, but I know from personal experience, once you hurt your back, it doesn’t magically go away. It’ll always be a risk… and, over 4 years, he’ll probably be incapacitated for the good part of two. Who’s to say it’s not next year, when Billy’s counting on him.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 12:23 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Potential for power?

7 homers in 556 ab’s, and he was healthy for a majority of the season.

by HRH on Nov 24, 2008 4:14 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

fluke...

Crosby’s got more power than that.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 12:24 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The case against keeping Crosby

First, he couldn’t stay healthy.

Then he got healthy and sucked.

Even if the A’s hadn’t traded for Holliday and were intent on having Crosby play out his existing contract, based on his current level of play (or lack there of) over the past 5 years there is absolutely no reason to think/want/desire Crosby to be back in 2010. We would need a new SS by then and it doesn’t look like we’ve got a homegrown option available. Next year’s FA SS class is even weaker than this year, so Beane would probably have to trade prospects for a big league SS.

Signing Furcal now, as much as the 4 year contract worries me, saves the A’s from having to deal away talent to acquire talent.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 24, 2008 7:47 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

grover

“Signing Furcal now, as much as the 4 year contract worries me, saves the A’s from having to deal away talent to acquire talent.”

I think you’ve correctly explained the A’s motivation.

by LogicRules on Nov 24, 2008 8:23 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

yes, I agree...

I’m sure that’s the motivation for going after him so hard. And, it has a certain logic to it. But, I won’t be disappointed when the Giants outbid us. I just don’t think SS is going to make or break our run for a division title. Crosby is not our biggest worry. Barton, Chavez… a decent fourth starter. I’m kinda counting on Buck, but I don’t know why. Those seem to me to be bigger worries for contending team. If Barton sucks next year, we’re done. If Buck sucks next year, we’re probably done. If we don’t have a decent fourth starter, we’re done.

If we have Crosby instead of Furcal and all those other things are good, we’re in it. And, we can draft a shortstop over the next four years.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 12:31 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

delete this fanpost

the overrated golden boy is a goner!!! enjoy sf, baltimore, stl!!!

by Asfan4ever723 on Nov 24, 2008 8:46 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

?

what

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Nov 25, 2008 5:22 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Yes - Crosby has just been traded

to San Francisco, Baltimore, and St. Louis, in a four-way deal that brought lots of players to Oakland. I’m telling you, Billy Beane is masterful.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 25, 2008 7:11 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

We just covered that situation in my Civil Procedure class...

It doesn’t end well for the A’s.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Nov 26, 2008 12:33 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I trust the discussion was, at least, civil.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 26, 2008 12:03 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Crosby already had his chance so...

now it’s time to move on because he just isn’t going to put it all together!

The 4yr / $48 million offer to Furcal signals where we are heading.

"What do we do with Crosby? Well, in my neighborhood, trash goes out on Mondays." ~ Nico

by MMunoz33 on Nov 24, 2008 9:07 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Is that the offer?

Really? He’ll be making more than Chavez next year? Great. We’ll have a left side of the infield making 40% of the payroll and being on the field 40% of the time. I’m enthused.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 12:54 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

1) the ladies think he’s cute

that’s it, that’s the list.

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Nov 24, 2008 11:07 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Blind ladies

So the list is even a bit shorter, i.e., “salbier,” than you suggest.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 24, 2008 4:23 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

All I can say is

NO, I never want to see him wear the green and gold again.

There is no case.

Sorry, I know you put some time into making a post and you would like to keep him but I cannot stand him.

If he paid Billy his $5,000,000 to keep him for next year, still NO

by Trainman on Nov 24, 2008 11:18 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Move Ellis to short...

…and re-aqcuire Ginter to play 2B.

by LowcountryJoe on Nov 24, 2008 8:18 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

You know Ellis can't play SS anymore

And you’ve been around long enough to know whom to thank for that.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 24, 2008 9:18 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

"The Case for keeping Crosby"

is known as a “hearse”.

It’s funny because it’s mean.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 24, 2008 8:27 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I wasn't aware there was a case for keeping Crosby.

"If I've got baggage, he's got a whole set of Louis Vuitton." ~ Milton Bradley on Barry Bonds

by UncleLeo on Nov 24, 2008 9:11 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I thought we'd go with cremation

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 24, 2008 9:17 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The hearse is what carries Crosby

the Coffin is the Case for keeping him.

facepalm.jpg

by Zonis on Nov 24, 2008 9:26 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I thought the hearse is what I spent Friday night with

Maybe it was a dunkey.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 24, 2008 9:34 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

That would be a hearse of a different color

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Nov 24, 2008 11:19 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

If Tania had married a Black Panther ...

… then we’d have had a Hearst of a different color.

I also have a pretty high shame threshold. @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 25, 2008 7:48 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Crosby's 2009 line...

.303/.380/.500 with 30 HR’s… you know that’ll happen once Beane dumps him.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 12:37 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

More like .400/.500/.800

(I’m assuming once Beane dumps him, Crosby plays in a slow-pitch softball league.)

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Nov 25, 2008 12:55 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

you assume Beane initially overestimated his talent...

maybe that’s true. Maybe it’s not. Crosby is just a late bloomer… like Carlos Pena. You can spot Beane’s bad moves a mile away… extending Kotsay… signing Kendall. If Furcal’s name started witha “k,” it’d be easier to see, but that’s a mistake, too.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 1:00 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Crosby's name sounds like it starts with a K.....

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Nov 25, 2008 1:02 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

but, he's homegrown...

Campy also sounded like it starts with a “k”

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 1:05 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Personally

I’m hoping the next homegrown guy who sounds like his name starts with a K to start in our infield is Cardenas. But I’ve always been sour on BoCro.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Nov 25, 2008 1:12 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

hey, then, we're in the same camp...

so, you, no doubt, voted keep Crosby… because Cardenas will replace him. Getting rid of Crosby and replacing him with Furcal at $12 million a year is NOT the answer to getting this team over the top. It could be the reason they remain in the cellar. But, it won’t put them in 1st place next year.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 1:15 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Actually I'm thinking more of replacing Chavvy after 2010

I think the best mode of action is signing Furcal and then signing a guy like Adam Everett, a cheap backup who if pushed into a starting role could be league average. Plus he’ll be cheap. Hopefully.

Do the same for Chavvy with a guy like Branyan. Acquiring Holliday means we have to compete this year. To compete the A’s need to make more moves. Signing Furcal, Randy Johnson, Branyan and Everett could make the A’s a playoff team and stay within budget. Maybe add Giambi on top of that if you feel like throwing cash around and he comes cheap.

One of the problems with keeping BoCro is that there will be one less A’s fan. Oh, I won’t stop being a fan. I’ll probably just end up killing the person next to me out of frustration when I’m at a game and he strikes out on a slider low and away.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Nov 25, 2008 1:23 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

signing Furcal is a half measure...

a marginal upgrade. For 4 freakin’ years. But, I’ll bet you’ll buy tickets if the A’s sign Teixeira… You and a bunch of Giants’ “fans.” Holliday and Tex on the A’s? Even the KNBR hometowners won’t be able to talk about the Giants. It’ll be A’s 24/7. How did Beane do it?

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 1:31 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

If Furcal costs the same as Tex....

Obviously I’d choose Tex. But if Tex costs the same as Furcal (12), Randy Johnson (10), Russel Branyan (1) AND Adam Everett (1), I’d choose the latter. Sure Furcal is expensive and risky, but unless Cardenas succeeds AND sticks at short, we have absolutely no one in the organization at SS for the next 3-4 years. At 1b, we have Barton, Dollittle, and Carter.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Nov 25, 2008 1:54 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Randy Johnson?

Are you serious? Please. I didn’t even want the Diamondbacks to sign him last year. And, the only reason I remotely cared is because of Byrnes.

If Beane signs Randy Johnson to even a one-year contract, unless it is totally incentive-laden, I will lose all respect for BB.

But, hey, $23 million per is a respectable offer for Tex. I’d give him 7 years. And, hope he takes it.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 2:00 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Johnson won't be a Cy Young winner next year

But a guy who’s 5 wins from 300 and had a 3.91 ERA last year and a sure-fire hall of famer? Not to mention he’ll come on a one year deal? His contract will probably pay for itself in terms of ticket and jersey sales. He’ll pitch like a 3-4 starter while we have a ton of young pitchers who aren’t quite ready to be stars. He can be a mentor.

You want to hear a crazy idea of signing a washed-up vet? How about Pedro? Or Maddux? If it’s cheap I wouldn’t mind signing any of RJ, Pedro, Maddux, John Patterson, or Brad Penny. Of those 5, RJ’s the best bet to contribute though I could see any of them pitching league average. It all depends on how many of the current A’s pitchers you’re comfortable in on a playoff team. 2009 will be the last year the A’s will have Holliday and maybe Duchscherer. They better win.

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Nov 25, 2008 2:17 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

if it's cheap...

I’d take Pedro, Maddux or Penny over Johnson. Randy is as old as I am…. almost. He’s done.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 2:21 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

shortstops don't make or break a team...

sign Crosby to 3 years for half what Furcal will make. No big.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 2:06 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Oh and add trading for Kielty to that list

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on Nov 25, 2008 1:03 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

zactly

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 1:03 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Beane was always trying to replace Byrnes...

lol

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 25, 2008 1:06 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

This may not be a popular post/idea

But you are my new best friend!!

"He's day-to-day," Geren said. "But aren't we all?" - 5/29/08

by BobbyCrosbysGirl on Nov 25, 2008 3:30 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

i'm on the keep crosby list

Furcal scares the hell out of me – I’d rather have Crosby playing than not have Furcal playing while we’re still paying. Crosby breaks out in 2009, and even though that might not be a huge upgrade, he’s going to be better, and I’d much rather give him that opportunity / play the hot hand if he doesn’t than spend on Furcal.

"He's pretty nasty," Gardenhire said. "The last pitch to Harris, we went and watched it, it's on the black. It cut the outside corner of the plate, the tip of it, and that's pretty nasty."
(Ron Gardenhire on Brad Ziegler)

by catfish hunter on Nov 26, 2008 5:44 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Crosby's always going to break out

in “this year +1”. In fact, he’s just a .300 OBP guy with declining defense and that’s what he’ll probably be next year and the year after that.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 26, 2008 6:18 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

furcal = regret

Crosby ain’t half bad by price comparison. I know you’re invested in this Furcal thing, but… it won’t pan out.

Clowns to the left of me... Jokers to the right...

by FoolshGame22 on Nov 27, 2008 1:59 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

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