Mark Mulder revisited

by Poppy on Nov 22, 2008 12:53 PM PST Comment 44 comments

For the second time in less than 48 hours, AN receives the dubious benefit of my writer's block. You're oh so welcome. My PayPal account is the same as the email address in my profile.

A little over a month ago, this diary... fanpost... diFaNarypOsT... asked whether the A's should have any interest in Mark Mulder. There was a good discussion in the comments, including minor league possibilities, and the poll was pretty evenly split.

Since then, we're down two LHPs (I think). This morning, while following a link to Fox Sports about Rafael Furcal, I also saw this:

Mulder: Coming along

Free-agent left-hander Mark Mulder, rehabilitating from a pair of shoulder operations, is making significant progress in his recovery, according to his agent, Gregg Clifton.

After the Cardinals bought Mulder out for $1.5 million, he began working with two new personal trainers, one of whom is Paul Hospenthal, a longtime acquaintance of Mulder's who is the husband of race-car driver Danica Patrick.

Clifton said that Mulder's shoulder is fine, but that he is just now starting to build "functional strength" — in other words, the muscles that will enable him to pitch successfully again.

Mulder, 31, will not begin throwing until December, but could prove a reasonable one-year risk for a team in need of starting pitching.

If I remember correctly, Paul Hospenthal is the guy who rehabbed Mark Ellis' shoulder following its demolition and subsequent non-surgery in 2004. We know that Ellis didn't regain his full throwing strength (at least not to the point that he would have been able to function again as a regular shortstop), but his prognosis at the time Hospenthal began working with him was horrible. Horrible for an athlete, anyway, as in "early retirement and probable limited use of that arm at all."

So do we think this is just November agent-speak on Mulder's behalf, or could this be an encouraging development where the A's might want to consider taking "a reasonable one-year risk?"

Poll

Following up: Interested in Mulder returning to the Green 'n' Gold?

Yes

118 votes

No

54 votes

172 votes | Poll has closed

0 recs | Comment 44 comments

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

I'd give it a little more credence if the report

weren’t coming from Mulder’s agent, but I could see the A’s taking a no-risk flier on him. I do wonder if he’ll ever be able to pitch 7IP, or 180IP again, but on the other hand he has one hurdle out of the way: He knows how to pitch. On that, the jury’s still out on Gio, Outman et al.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 22, 2008 12:58 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Bingo!

…according to his agent,

"If I've got baggage, he's got a whole set of Louis Vuitton." ~ Milton Bradley on Barry Bonds

by UncleLeo on Nov 22, 2008 6:29 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

"...Mark Ellis' shoulder following its demolition..."

Stupid Crosby.

by whiteshoes40 on Nov 22, 2008 1:03 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

If Mulder is willing to take a minor league deal with a ST invite

Then by all means the A’s should sign him up.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Nov 22, 2008 1:08 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

We definitely have an alarming lack of players

who might be shells of their former selves due to serious injury.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 22, 2008 1:12 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

word, grover.

by mrod on Nov 22, 2008 4:03 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Funny I was just talking to another ANer this morning

about this very topic and I think they should most definitely sign Mulder to a minor league deal. It’s worth the effort.

by Tyler Bleszinski on Nov 22, 2008 5:18 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

On a minor league deal, it wouldn't hurt.

I know that's a pisser, baby.

by Blicks on Nov 22, 2008 1:11 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

+1

Anything else would be crazy

"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson

by nevermoor on Nov 22, 2008 1:40 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I doubt he'd sign a minor league deal.

by OldhamA on Nov 23, 2008 2:32 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Will anything else be offered to him.

He has to prove that he’s healthy in AAA before getting the nod to come on up. I don’t think any team gives him more than that, unless they’re dead stupid.

I know that's a pisser, baby.

by Blicks on Nov 23, 2008 5:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Cue the Giants signing him to a 7 year deal

at the press conference an excited Sabean yells, “This awesome! Now we’re only one away from a complete set!”

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Nov 23, 2008 6:29 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

"Collect all three!"

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 23, 2008 9:13 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

As I recall the A's commercials with Mulder were some of the best. That alone would bring more fans to the games

"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"

by Eastbayjim on Nov 22, 2008 1:45 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

It all depends on what kind of contract Muler would accept. I wouldn’t even mind the thought of a major league deal….incentive based of course. Obviously a minor league deal with a ST invite sounds great in the minds of most but I don’t know that Mulder and his agent would go for that because I do think a major league team will think he is worth the risk and pick him up. I have always been a huge fan of Mulders, I will always love all of the Big 3, and I do hope Mark makes a major league team and his body holds up well.

by ilovegregsmith on Nov 22, 2008 2:34 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

I liked the idea a lot more before the A's got Holliday

I think taking a flier on Mulder made more sense back when we expected the A’s to spend 2009 sorting through all their young players and not really contending. There wouldn’t be much downside to signing him to a short deal and if he works out they gain all the resulting benefits (trade possibilities, veteran presence, etc) and if he doesn’t work out then all it really costs is money.

Now however, if the A’s are serious about contending next year then I don’t know that you want them to spend a month or two (or longer) just to see if Mulder’s still got it. Now if he doesn’t work out it not only costs money, but possibly a few wins too. I just don’t think the A’s want to take that kind of risk with a starting pitching spot given what they are set up to do.

Of course, that assumes he gets a ML contract. If he’ll agree to a minor league contract with a ST invite then at least they can let him prove he can dominate Triple A hitters before trying him out at the ML level.

"That's not a Sherman tank, it's Frank Thomas!" - Monkeyball

by JLeverenz on Nov 22, 2008 2:48 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Holliday makes a Mulder acquisition make more sense

When you’re rebuilding, you want to play the youth at every opportunity possible and give them every opportunity to develop. Mulder would take up a roster spot and possibly a rotation spot, and thus take a spot away from a young guy trying to get his feet wet.

When you’re contending, its more about putting the most optimal team for winning NOW on the field. If Mulder’s healthy and can pitch decently, that really helps the A’s in contending, even if it means one of the younger guys gets sent down to AAA for longer. If Mulder returns, I’d think it’d be as a reliever.

And, this shouldn’t prevent the A’s from targetting another veteran SP (Penny, Unit, etc.) on a 1 year deal.

I know that's a pisser, baby.

by Blicks on Nov 22, 2008 3:06 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I still think he makes more sense for a rebuilding team than a contending team

On a contending team you want as few question marks as possible, and right now Mulder is as big a question mark as there is. Is he healthy? If healthy, how effective will he be? Can his arm, if healthy, stand up to a full season of pitching? I disagree about making him a reliever, at least on this team. The A’s have plenty of bullpen arms and if they need another then it’s probably a lot easier to find a healthy arm elsewhere than it is to convert Mulder to the pen.

Your point about Mulder taking a roster/starting spot from a young guy on a rebuilding team is certainly valid and one that occurred to me initially. Mostly I didn’t feel like going through a whole rosterbation exercise to show where he might fit in that situation, particularly since it’s not even valid for the team now. As a general point however, I think it’s always a good idea to have a couple of vets to put in a rotation even while sorting through youngsters. That still leaves you with 3 starting spots for young pitching and in the event that Mulder doesn’t work out you have a fourth spot to use as well.

"That's not a Sherman tank, it's Frank Thomas!" - Monkeyball

by JLeverenz on Nov 22, 2008 4:08 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

The A's should build their contending roster

expecting Mulder to contribute nothing. They should add the necessary pitching and other pieces to build a 2009 contender. If Mulder contributes, its an added bonus. Any starter to reliever conversions should either take place during spring training or in AAA.

Think David Price and the Rays. Or K-Rod and the Angels in 2002. Nobody expected either of them to contribute to their teams that year to the level that they did.

I know that's a pisser, baby.

by Blicks on Nov 22, 2008 4:51 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I think his value to a contending team is,

if he’s healthy he could make that key difference between 88 and 90 wins – and if he’s not you punt and try another solution (your own rookie, waiver wire, trade). But the chance that he might elevate you from 75 wins to 77 wins is not worth taking because even if he’s good he blocks younger players from developing.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 22, 2008 4:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

The question I have though is how long are you willing to wait to find out if he is healthy and effective?

If Mulder signs a minor league deal then I’ll accept his value to a contending team since he can prove his health and ability in AAA. I think I indicated that previously, but maybe I wasn’t clear enough.

At some point though he’s going to have to be on the major league roster and make some starts, and if he’s not ready he could just as easily take the team from 88 to 86 wins.

"That's not a Sherman tank, it's Frank Thomas!" - Monkeyball

by JLeverenz on Nov 22, 2008 6:01 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Not necessarily.

One start. Short leash.

The Phillies had Adam Eaton out there making how many starts, and they won the division?

Which is also why I say let him start out in the pen in low leverage (aka mop up situations). If he’s effective, gradually bring him into the rotation. The rotation-to-pen transition isn’t as big as some think, many pitchers alternated from rotation to pen several times throughout the course of a season. Pen to rotation is harder though, but since Mulder will be reconditioned in the minors to be a starter, and has spent his entire career a starter, if he can pitch, he should be fine.

Although, with his shoulder, he might be relegated to pen duties due to his inability to throw multiple innings.

I know that's a pisser, baby.

by Blicks on Nov 22, 2008 6:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Mulder thought his shoulder was fine when he tried to come back last year too, and then

it didn’t even last a whole inning. An invite to spring training would be ok, but I’m skeptical of Mulder ever being a successful major league pitcher again.

by Erin6 on Nov 22, 2008 3:03 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

I think that if Mulder returns

it will be as a reliever.

I know that's a pisser, baby.

by Blicks on Nov 22, 2008 3:06 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I could see that more then him being a starter again.

by Erin6 on Nov 22, 2008 3:13 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

If he comes back

I can’t see him not being a starting pitcher. If he’s healthy and can pitch you let him do what he was bred to do……. start.

by mrod on Nov 22, 2008 4:08 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Think Kerry Wood

Very, very effective starter. I really don’t like the Cubs, but many of his starts were beautiful. But, due to injuries, he moved to the pen.

He’s much more likely to come back in a reduced role (no more than 1 inning pitched at a time) than as a starter. I’d like to see him reinvent himself as one of the best relievers in the game, ala Kerry Wood.

I know that's a pisser, baby.

by Blicks on Nov 22, 2008 6:30 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

as a second baseman Ellis would not need for his shoulder

to be as strong as Mulder the pitcher. The bar for Mulder has to be higher, even if what his agent said is true.

Sadly, I don’t see him being signed by the A’s, or perhaps even pitching again. But I’d love to be proved wrong.

by OaklandSi on Nov 22, 2008 6:19 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Since we're talking about veterans...

Garret Anderson hires Boras.

I want GA to sign with the Angels for top dollar.

It helps the A’s, big time.

I know that's a pisser, baby.

by Blicks on Nov 22, 2008 6:58 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

I'm surprised Boras was willing to take him on

"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson

by nevermoor on Nov 23, 2008 10:33 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

I'd do it and sign Mulder to a minor league contract

Let’s assume the A’s sign Furcal, Chavez is really healthy, and Barton & Buck take the next step. At that point, the team has a contender-worthy offense. From a pitching standpoint, the trio of Duke, Eveland and Gallagher is okay, not great. Outman or Braden as the number five guy also works. But unless one of the young guys, Gio or Simmons or Anderson or Cahill or Mazzarro comes out of the gate like a bat out of hell, the A’s still need a number four if they’re going to compete. It’’s really a perfect position for Mulder. If he returns healthy and strong, the A’s have a top one-two combo, and the rest of the rotation fills out as it fills out. If he returns as a back of the rotation guy, he lends stability there. If he doesn’t return at all, the A’s are no worse off than they are now. I say go for it.

Also, a one year deal leaves the A’s in a strong position to bring guys up as necessary during the year, because there will be injuries and there will be ineffectiveness. I find it odd that folks who are down on Mulder would be happy to overspend for Derek Lowe or Randy Johnson.

by richwol1 on Nov 22, 2008 8:37 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

Why? Derek Lowe and Randy Johnson are healthy...

Give me a choice between a 45 year old with a healthy shoulder and a 30 year old (or whatever age you want, really) with a busted shoulder and I’ll take the geezer every single time.

My take on this is simple: minor league deal, yea. Major league deal, nay.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Nov 22, 2008 11:34 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Geezer Power!

The meaning of life is not so much 'found,' as it is 'made.' --Opus

by The Dogfather on Nov 23, 2008 9:15 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

As long as he doesn't

start 99-0 in the first half, and finish the second half 0-99 like he did his last year here

by Dukererer on Nov 22, 2008 9:06 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

cue "so then we trade him at the deadline" post

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Nov 24, 2008 1:47 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Mulder

Let Mulder go somewhere else. He was great when he had the supporting cast he had in 2000-2004. In the past three years, he’s only pitched around 110 innings total. At his prime, he was a great pitcher. To bring him back would only be a pr move and a big mistake. The A’s have some great, YOUNG lefties coming up from the minors. Let Beane do his magic and don’t go backwards thinking Mulder could help the A’s. His shoulder will never be the same! What rhymes with Mulder……..A tired shoulder. lol

I heard Vida’s been throwing with his grandson. Maybe he’s the old lefty we need? I don’t think he has any nagging shoulder problems either. I saw him on the golf course the other day. He looked great! I bet if he learned how to throw a knuckler, Beane would give him a shot! Just think, he could breakout his ole jersey on jersey throwback day and he’d fit right in. Is Dick Williams still alive? We could use another skipper too!

Vida! Vida! Vida!

All kidding aside (I have to say that because we have too many die hards on this site), Mulder, Huddy, and the other guy…..Zito are a once in a lfetime gift from the baseball gods, just like the four we had in the early 80’s, Langford, Norris, McCatty, & Keough.

by A'sfan on Nov 22, 2008 10:01 PM PST reply actions 0 recs

whats the risk?

beane has wasted money before..last yr w/ foulke, calero, etc

heck they signed a depth righty in schroder to a major league deal

sometimes A’s do weird things, not all we agree with

if mulder is willing to take a minimal deal, pitch closer to home in AZ, in a low pressure situation..might take a shot

by Asfan4ever723 on Nov 23, 2008 9:44 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs

Look at the trouble it led to -

Signing those guys was fine, but then the A’s went and let Foulke and Calero actually pitch. In games.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Nov 23, 2008 10:29 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs