A's acquire Matt Holliday for who the hell knows
by salb918 on Nov 10, 2008 1:11 PM PST
Email
PrintNot to trample all over Taj's excellent prospect-watching story from this morning, but feel free to use this as your all-purpose "Matt Holliday traded to the A's" freak-out thread. John Heyman files this report:
The Oakland Athletics have acquired star outfielder Matt Holliday in a trade with the Colorado Rockies, SI.com has learned.
I'm scared. My hands are sweating. Hold me.
Updates as they happen.
[Note by salb918, 11/10/08 2:32 PM EST ] DKNJ and TroyNeelorBust broke the news on AN first.
[Note by salb918, 11/10/08 2:35 PM EST ] Oh yeah: AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHH!
[Note by salb918, 11/10/08 2:46 PM EST ] For those of y'all that wear fanny packs, a few numbers: Holliday was 54 runs above replacement last year (52 offense, 8 fielding, -6 for position), between Brian Giles and Jose Reyes in the NL. A quick projection gives me about +40 for offense next year (although I didn't adjust for park) and Sean Smith projects him as +8 fielding in a corner and +0 in center. That's a good player, folks.
[Note by salb918, 11/10/08 3:03 PM EST ] Robothal reports:
Over the weekend, the teams discussed A's outfielder Carlos Gonzalez, left-hander Greg Smith and reliever Huston Street, according to one source, but it is not known if any or all of those players will be included in the package for Holliday.
...
The A's are not acquiring him with the intention of flipping him or even trading him in July. The team is in position to increase its payroll to as much as $80 million, and plans to contend next season.
[Note by salb918, 11/10/08 3:31 PM EST ] Yahoo's Tim Brown is reporting Street, Smith, and CarGon.
[Note by salb918, 11/10/08 4:08 PM EST ] Beat-writer extraordinaire Susan Slusser says the same.
The A's are working to complete a trade with the Rockies that would bring Matt Holliday to Oakland in exchange for reliever Huston Street, starter Greg Smith and outfielder Carlos Gonzalez, major-league sources said Monday.
[Note by salb918, 11/10/08 4:10 PM EST ] Hey Geren, thanks for killing Huston's trade value last year.
[Note by salb918, 11/10/08 4:11 PM EST ] Oh yeah. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHH!
492 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
AUOTM
Appropriate username of the month
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
Matt Holliday appears headed to the Oakland Athletics in a deal with the Colorado Rockies, baseball sources have told ESPN’s Jerry Crasnick and Buster Olney.
Matt Holliday
Holliday
Final details are being finalized, though the teams have agreed to terms, a baseball source told Olney. The source said the deal may not be finalized for up to 48 hours.
The deal is also pending completion of physical exams.
Although the package coming back to Colorado has yet to be determined, it’s believed that pitcher Greg Smith was one of the players under discussion.
David Forst, Oakland’s assistant general manager, declined to comment on the trade.
"It’s still an on-going discussion,’’ he said.
The news comes a day after reported trade talks between the Colorado Rockies and St. Louis Cardinals fell through. The Cardinals had reportedly offered the Rockies a package for Holliday that was centered around outfielder Ryan Ludwick, who hit 37 home runs last season.
Holliday, 28, finished second to Philadelphia’s Jimmy Rollins in the 2007 National League MVP race. He hit .321 with 25 homers and 88 RBIs this season. But he’ll be eligible for free agency next winter and is represented by Scott Boras, so the Rockies held out little hope to sign him to a longterm deal.
Oakland has been weighing offers for closer Huston Street, but it’s uncertain if he’s part of the Holliday deal. The Rockies have a need for late-inning relief with Brian Fuentes about to leave through free agency.
From Ken Rosenthal
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/8779078/Sources:-A’s-close-to-deal-for-Rockies-star-Holliday
The A’s are not acquiring him with the intention of flipping him or even trading him in July. The team is in position to increase its payroll to as much as $80 million, and plans to contend next season.
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
I don't want to wait 48 hours!
You have to include smiley faces - Poppy
;- ) :- ) :-O : -> : -] : -}
Murton, Patterson, Hannahan, and Brad Halsey
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 11:37 AM PST up reply actions
that would be the biggest steal in history
You have to include smiley faces - Poppy
;- ) :- ) :-O : -> : -] : -}
whaaaaa
sounds bad, but having Holliday on the team would be pretty exciting…
The A's colors are green and gold.
Yeah, I'm sanguine on this being a net positive for the A's longterm...
…but I’m willing to wait for details.
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
Could be ok if they went for quantity (which presumably they did) and took a few of the extra OFs and extra pitchers, we'll see....
The A's colors are green and gold.
That's my hope, too.
Guys like Sweeney, Murton, and Smith can add bulk to make a deal tick, but the A’s need to hold on to their frontline talent.
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
Rotoworld mentions
Street, Gallagher & Buck
by methodrampage on Nov 10, 2008 11:55 AM PST up reply actions
I am content with our existing pitching prospects
Gallagher seems somewhat expendable for a guy like Holliday, who might either be extended or flipped for something equally full of potential as Gallagher mid-season.
See Nevermoor's remark below. It looks like Smith
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
Happy birthday!
The A’s trading for an established star in his prime? Quite an unusual gift indeed!
We probably traded one of Buck/Cgon/Cunningham/Sweeney in this
And honestly, I’m fine with any of them going.
I kind of hope they sold high on Chris Carter. I love him, but I mean his bust factor is huge.
He hasn't been playing much in the HWL the past couple days
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 11:41 AM PST up reply actions
I can see Duke and Mazzaro going, but who else?
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
Duke would make sense
since he’s kind of in the same contractual boat as Holliday, in that he doesn’t have much time left before he gets paid. Dying to know the details here.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
OMG OMG OMG OMG OMG!!!!!!
"I know they're the defending World Champs, but they are the whiniest team in baseball" -Rays announcers
I am totally with you on that!!!!!!!!!!!!
Loves those little teams that can.
by SwisherGirl33 on Nov 10, 2008 11:59 AM PST up reply actions
Any chance they might have included Garrett Atkins
The colorado site said he would be availble if the right deal came along. That would be a monster deal.
You have to include smiley faces - Poppy
;- ) :- ) :-O : -> : -] : -}
Wow.
I’m not familiar with the Chinese or Jewish calendars, but is today the equivalent of 4/1 on either of them?
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
Say what?!
Are the owners going to add payroll and sign him long-term? Because otherwise this seems like a really dumb idea. Holliday will cost a fair amount in prospects, certainly more than the team would recoup in draft picks when he walks.
"It's just a tiny little nick, but it hurts when I get champagne in there."
- Jason Bay, on getting spiked scoring the winning run in ALDS Game Four.
This is probably the most important question.
I don’t care what kind of steal Beane may or may not have gotten here. But if the A’s don’t sign him it’s a really-almost-too-bad-for-words-bad deal
by methodrampage on Nov 10, 2008 11:44 AM PST up reply actions
In Search Of...the details of this trade
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 11:44 AM PST up reply actions
People did a pretty good job of accumulating here quickly
I’m impressed.
Did they send out the StomperSignal or something?
Im going to wait til it is official...
But wow would I be excited….Sure makes 09 more fun!
Bring back Hammer.
Beane
has to be thinking he can extend him. It wouldnt make much sense without and extention. They have the money to do it so let’s hope thats the case.
Doubtful
I think this smacks more of rent-a-player and try to flip him to a contender at the break, getting some more value then.
That would be a terrible idea.
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
It all depends
In theory the idea is neither bad or good. It all depends what players we move to get him and what players we get back (or draft picks).
Makes no sense.
A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. You don’t trade prospect for Holliday in hopes that you can get more back in return in July. There’s no gaurantee he won’t be hurt come the trading deadline, etc.
by methodrampage on Nov 10, 2008 12:40 PM PST up reply actions
Or, looking at it another way
CarGon may end up being as good as Holliday, but there’s no guarantee he won’t be a .750 OPS guy.
A star in the hand is worth well more than two prospects in the bush.
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
I see your point
but this goes against everything the A’s have done personnel-wise the last 3 years.
How am I going to be able to focus on work now!
You have to include smiley faces - Poppy
;- ) :- ) :-O : -> : -] : -}
damn, i wish i was unemployed
at least for the off season….
There's no crying in baseball!
by gigglingone on Nov 10, 2008 12:36 PM PST up reply actions
I wish I could have been given an extreme amount of work during August
"Camelot sure fell apart, didn't it?"-Steve McCatty
If you worked for me...
I would definitely have canned you. Promise.
More than just ANtics: http://www.louisgray.com/live/
I noticed
That SI changed it’s headline from “A’s Trade for Matt Holliday” to “A’s to aquire Holliday”…
Not really sure if that means anything, but it’s worth noting
by GusanoQuemador on Nov 10, 2008 11:46 AM PST reply actions
My take is
They thought the deal is done, now just that finals details are being worked out.
by Athletix Man on Nov 10, 2008 11:48 AM PST up reply actions
I wonder if the deal has a window for Beane to attempt to sign Holliday to an extension?
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
they would have exclusive negotiating rights for a year regardless
if/when he becomes an Athletic, he can only talk with the A’s until he files for free agency.
"This is Rickey, calling on behalf of Rickey."
by scatterbrian on Nov 10, 2008 12:25 PM PST up reply actions
Are we on the VERGE?
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 11:47 AM PST up reply actions
I sure hope we can keep CarGon
I like watching him play. Seems to be the most promising of the bunch to me.
Hmm
Now it reads “A’s Parade in Honor of Madonna’s Holiday…”
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
Word I have
is its CarGon, Greg Smith, and “We Have a Problem”
Only Patrol Craft is a potential big loss, IMHO
Emil Brown...RBI Machine Extraordinaire
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 11:56 AM PST up reply actions
Huston Street.
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
Too much
to give up if Beane isn’t 99.9% sure he can extend him
And I just don't see it,
with Crusty Butthole as his agent…
"I have more questions after these."-WaddellCanseco
by Gaijin_Suketto on Nov 10, 2008 2:12 PM PST up reply actions
yahoo said A's near Holiday
let’s hope they aren’t talkin turkey
Beane's World!! Excellent!!! Rock On, Beane! Rock On, Geren!
ESPN says maybe Greg Smith is gone
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3694100
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
Heard that too
"I know they're the defending World Champs, but they are the whiniest team in baseball" -Rays announcers
by baseballgirl on Nov 10, 2008 11:56 AM PST up reply actions
Thank goodness.
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
So the Mark Mulder trade tree grows another branch
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 11:57 AM PST up reply actions
Yep
And since I’ve always thought Eveland is the better pitcher I don’t mind seeing Smith go at all.
Maybe they went alliteration style with Street, Smith, and Sweeney.
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
Street, Smith and Gonzalez
is what I heard from a pretty good source
Cards Fan Here: Happy it was you guys and not us
They were asking for Ludwick, Schumaker, and Boggs for Holliday from us. That is a shit load of quality cost controlled prospects for one guy. I got to see what you guys give up. I bet it will more than you are happy with.
wierd
A few days ago I dreamed that the Chronicle reported we traded Chavy to the Rockies for Roy Halladay. Didn’t make any sense at the time. Come to think of it, it still doesn’t.
"Don't be an ass!" --Bill King
so close, though soo close...
:-P
Bob Geren, on 8/2/07, on the success of Alan Embree as new interim closer: "What can I say,... he's been our Steady Tremendous Bullpen Man"
by popcornjames on Nov 10, 2008 1:23 PM PST up reply actions
not Greg??
he was my fav greg on the team.
Beane's World!! Excellent!!! Rock On, Beane! Rock On, Geren!
Tell me more.
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
Summer nights....
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
Could be trade bait by the next midseason deadline
Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog
mlbtraderumors is reporting likely candidates as:
Street, Smith, Cargon.
I’m not entirely thrilled about that.
that's probably a bit much
but who knows. I personally don’t have huge hopes for CarGon, Smith is redundant, Street is good. Maybe it’s not too much.
If we trade Street
I bet he goes and pulls a Brad Lidge next year. Maybe not quite that good (especially if it’s in Coors) but still. He’s a solid closer.
Also it doesn't mention if the Rockies are giving anyone else up to us
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
Street is fine, Smith is fine, I could live with Gallagher (I guess)
but I’m going to stab something if CarGon was in the deal.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
Agree
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 12:06 PM PST up reply actions
Would think they'll sign Holliday
I mean why else do this— you want him to help for 3 years as this team contends.
Two draft picks or a trade at midseason works well in the rebuilding plan
I guess
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 12:09 PM PST up reply actions
I feel the same way
It all depends what they move for him
Agree.
I can live with Street, Smith, and Sweeney, but remember, CFs are worth a lot more than corner OFs.
This.
yeah with you
if we give up cargon or gallagher im going to feel a little sick
Save Rajai Davis
by oakinboston on Nov 10, 2008 12:09 PM PST up reply actions
this is for all you people who hated on my post
I knew this wold happend….
The quest is the Highway to the Danger Zone-Kenny loggins
learn english
"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball
He's just so...
…furry…
"A’s baseball….It’s almost better than a stick in the eye." ~ alox
by Gallagher's Watermelons on Nov 10, 2008 12:28 PM PST up reply actions
Car Gon
had a rough rookie season at the plate. His 2009 ZIPS look awful too. he never dominated the minors and isn’t "Justin Upton " young. I don’t mind moving him for a player the caliber of Holliday (who can be flipped if the A’s don’t fire next year).
ditto
He shows no sign of developing plate discipline – it’s going to be very hard for him to really be a good offensive player. He looks good in the field but you can find guys of his caliber out there.
disagree
I think Carlos will get more plate discipline. He has a great stroke IMO, just rushed a wee bit. His OF defense is very top-rated IMO. A keeper IMO.
Sweeney a keeper too.
Officially awaiting the 2009 season.
by One won lost won on Nov 10, 2008 12:44 PM PST up reply actions
We now have an OF, folks
I think this essentially solidifies Sweeney in CF. Holliday in LF. Cust now a permanent DH. Buck and Cunningham to duke it out for the rest of the OF playing time, chiefly RF.
we also still have Denorfia and Davis for CF
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
Wow
i am going to get nothing done at work for the rest of the day until I find out who we traded away.
Goliath, dissatisfied with his size advantage, decided to buy David's sling, which took steroids.
+ a million
we have a complete rollercoaster going on here at work, but I really need to get this trade stuff settled out before I can process anything else.
Fortunately
I just have to work on some database stuff, no big deal.
Goliath, dissatisfied with his size advantage, decided to buy David's sling, which took steroids.
+ a billion to your million
Going through a transition and I have actually had to start working the past couple of weeks, but now today is shot. Glad I have tomorrow off to catch up (on work that is…)
"Camelot sure fell apart, didn't it?"-Steve McCatty
Of course, the real tragedy that no one is talking about
I’m finally going to have to shut up about Dunn.
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
I'd love to get both.....
Goliath, dissatisfied with his size advantage, decided to buy David's sling, which took steroids.
Home/Road Splits
So what were Holliday’s home/road splits last year? Remember that he comes from an extreme hitters park.
vr, Xei
Take into account that most of his road games were played in the three biggest pitcher's parks in the NL
AT&T, Petco, and Chavez Ravine.
This.
Yes
that’s true to some extent. PetCo only supresses HR for LHB not for RHB. Chavez is pretty neutral when it comes to HR, it really supresses the heck out of triples. AT&T isn’t too bad and Arizona isn’t exactly a pitchers park. Nonetheless, he’s a very good player but not as good as his overall numbers say.
vr, Xei
I recall
without looking at the stats, that Holliday was surprisingly good away from Coors. Remember, he played a lot of games in SF, LA, and Petco as well…
sorry misplaced
892 road OPS last year 803 career
But also a consistent trend of improvement not just an aberrational 2008
I remember from when we discussed him before.
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
Still
An .892 OPS is not all that impressive. Jack Cust has a career .969 OPS at the Coliseum.
...and the future is now!
by gio_is_the_future on Nov 10, 2008 12:23 PM PST up reply actions
from metsblog:
In 139 games for the Rockies, the 28–year-old Holliday hit .321 with 25 HR and 88 RBI, while hitting .308 away from Coors Field.
Those are stats I would love to add
and not think twice about losing a young guy like smith or one of the many outfielders, (although please not cargon)
"I was right and you were wrong." - Ray Fosse
Assuming we don't trade any key prospects, Great Move
If we can resign Holiday, he’s young and a star. Great move by the As
Even if not, it’s a good move. We can trade at mid season, and in the meantime we have
Holiday in Left, Cust at DH
which is far better than
Cust in Left, Giambi at DH
At a minimum, we get somebody far better than Giambi for a year.
Wondered the same thing.
Giles is probably unavailable – doesn’t want to leave SD – and has a higher likelihood of flaming out.
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
892 OPS on road last year
Career mark 803, I believe
Holy crap
It’s like a fricking game-thread in here, and I’m not even responsible. Cool.
Oh, and I guess holy crap to getting this Holliday guy, too.
I'm here to talk about the past.
Crosby just stricked out swinging at a low and outside slider
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 12:15 PM PST up reply actions
wait, is this a game thread?
where am i right now? and who is this sleeping next to me?
Save Rajai Davis
by oakinboston on Nov 10, 2008 12:16 PM PST up reply actions
If it's a game thread I can post images
(The A’s finally get a gritty player. What will Joe Morgan say?)
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
Please be some moron reporter jumping the gun.
and not an actual trade.
I still hate this trade.
This.
you dont even know who it's for yet
what if it was Greggles and Matt Murton?
what then!?!?!??!
[head explodes]
Save Rajai Davis
by oakinboston on Nov 10, 2008 12:15 PM PST up reply actions
If its Greggles and Matt Murton, I can live with it.
But still, not the best usage of trade chips.
This.
Wow
Overvalue A’s players much?
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
Not really.
Greggles and Matt Murton is a steal for the A’s. Absolute fucking steal.
I’m just saying that a Holliday trade still isn’t a smart idea for the A’s, period.
This.
It all depends
If they deal from a position of redundancy (league average SPs, 2B prospects) then I’m good. If they’re giving up frontline players (i.e. the Brett Anderson rumor) then it’s starting to get hard to like it.
It's not just going to be them, but if it was it'd be a great usage of trade chips
Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog
Crosby
Any chance Crosby will be added to this deal??!!!
by MoneyManWilliam on Nov 10, 2008 12:15 PM PST reply actions
rockies already have a couple decent SS
You have to include smiley faces - Poppy
;- ) :- ) :-O : -> : -] : -}
Does she go to the Rockies blog
Or get a new ID of “ilovedgregsmithbutnowiwillbeforcedtoacceptholliday”?
"Camelot sure fell apart, didn't it?"-Steve McCatty
Everyone's welcome at Purple Row.
"Never Surrender Dreams" - Inscription on J. Michael Straczynski's bench
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
uh oh
ESPN is saying that Brett Anderson was part of the discussion
Scanners Head Explosion
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 12:17 PM PST up reply actions
oh boy.
nice to get some visitors ’round these parts.
Save Rajai Davis
by oakinboston on Nov 10, 2008 12:19 PM PST up reply actions
Brett Anderson is the A's second best prospect behind Trevor Cahill
Has frontline upside. One of the top 25 prospects in all of baseball(at least most can agree on that). He should NOT be in a Holliday deal.
I will cry if he’s in the deal. And I’m not female.
This.
The deal can be done without either.
Anderson, Cahill, Gallagher should be purely off limits.
The A’s have the depth to make a deal without the 3.
Simmons, Mazarro, Gio Gonzalez, etc.
This.
unless we are getting others back as well
I will soon commence with throwing up a little…
"Camelot sure fell apart, didn't it?"-Steve McCatty
Yeah, that's a much more tragic outcome
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
This whole thing might come down to their evaluations of CarGon.
Tools goof or future star?
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
cargon
well, this same a’s front office did trade for cargon less than a year ago. wasn’t he the top prospect in that trade, too?
what’s his value like now compared to this time last year?
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
Holy crap.
Do employers have any idea exactly how many of their employees lurk on AN?
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
Obama is screwed....
before his first day on the job. Maybe he should hire Beane as Secretary of State.
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
But Central time...
We are in the middle of the afternoon, and still not getting work done.
Goliath, dissatisfied with his size advantage, decided to buy David's sling, which took steroids.
This trade is bad for the economy
Productivity has plummeted
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 12:20 PM PST up reply actions
Why isn't Bobby Crosby ever under consideration?
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 12:21 PM PST up reply actions
If he could
play 2B I might take a chance on him.
"Never Surrender Dreams" - Inscription on J. Michael Straczynski's bench
Purple Row - Covering all your Rockies needs!
Because his OPS+ last year was 76
Goliath, dissatisfied with his size advantage, decided to buy David's sling, which took steroids.
Crosby
Only way he is included in the deal is if Beane, in fact, does not want to make a deal.
"However, at Elias, I think they keep track of the amount of sunflower seeds spit in a dugout each night." - Brad Ziegler, 8/7/08
Crosby aka Deal Breaker
Batting 8th for the A’s.
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 12:26 PM PST up reply actions
The Rockies also have Clint Barmes
He hi .290 with 11 HRs and 44 RBIs in 107 games. sounds better than Crosby.
You have to include smiley faces - Poppy
;- ) :- ) :-O : -> : -] : -}
I retract my earlier statement
I’m fine with them including CarGon if it means we keep Brett Anderson. Jeez, what hath Beane wrought?
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
From Purple Row
It will take 48 hours before the deal has been finalized…so we may have to wait 2 days to find out who we receive in return unless the terms are leaked.
In other words… HOLY SHIT MY WEEK IS RUINED
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
NNNNNOOOOOOO
The one time I need a reporter to leak a story…
Goliath, dissatisfied with his size advantage, decided to buy David's sling, which took steroids.
but with the rest of the team he's got around him,
about all he’s gonna be able to do is leave a bag of flaming poo on the stoop.
"I have more questions after these."-WaddellCanseco
by Gaijin_Suketto on Nov 10, 2008 2:21 PM PST up reply actions
It will be pricey for sure
But i dont think they would trade prospects unless they intended to sign him
"I was right and you were wrong." - Ray Fosse
That's a good trade then.
But I’m not high on Street or CarGon
Goliath, dissatisfied with his size advantage, decided to buy David's sling, which took steroids.
This just ruined my day.
I’ve never been part of the “get matt holliday” group. And now Cargon’s gone…. and Greggles!!??!? I suppose I better go tell ilovegregsmith and brace myself for the explosion…
Awww… Unicorn's optimistic. And a cheeseball. That’s cute. ~Whiteshoes40
Deffiantely could be worse
Worst case scenario we get 1 year of Holliday and 2 draft pics.
I beat them by 32 minutes
see above— but none of us really know
Street, Gonzalez, Smith?
The source believed the A’s are sending closer Huston Street, outfielder Carlos Gonzalez and starting pitcher Greg Smith to the Rockies.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ti-hollidaytraded111008&prov=yhoo&type=lgns
200 comments and three diaries in under one hour on a Monday afternoon in November
and that is without Paul or grover being here for it.
(and I don’t think for one minute it’s a coincidence that this was leaked when they were not here…ok maybe I do)
"Camelot sure fell apart, didn't it?"-Steve McCatty
PT would comment
But he’s too busy eating his hat for one reason or another
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
heard hats go well
with Chianti
Save Rajai Davis
by oakinboston on Nov 10, 2008 12:28 PM PST up reply actions
and some fava beans?
If I don't comment on your comment how will you know you are completely wrong? -Rocktopus
Probably in the process of
failing an exam.
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
Still early for that isn't it?
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
So far, he’s only on the hat-eating hook if:
> Jemele Weeks or Henry Rodriguez plays for the big club next year
> Ryan Sweeney ever OPS’s .850 for the A’s
Though he has to eat his shoe if Travis Buck quintuples his 2008 HR total next year.
Personally, I hope Buck and Sweeney spend their off-season cultivating an underground supply-chain for experimental high-impact steroid pills from a shadowy Tegucigalpan “medical” network, because I think the world needs a YouTube clip of PT chewing morosely on a pair of Rockports (in between equally morose hat-bites).
definitely
those guys are all good but none of them are going to put you over the top. Anderson could be really special.
I still like a stud CF a lot
and think CarGon could be one. He has great potential on both sides. Don’t discount the defense.
Everybody likes a stud CF
I just don’t think he’s going to become one. He is a good fielder, but you can find guys who are as good as he is. I don’t see the bat developing unless there’s some kind of massive movement on the plate discipline side, and that tends to never happen.
I still think he’s good, don’t get me wrong, but I’d move him.
as did mine
I’m Ok with this, Cargon could be a good player— but underline “could”
I don't mind
this package. I would much rather trade Car Gon over Brett Anderson.
Street is still a good pitcher, but is about to get expensive.
Street was gone one way or another
Might as well be for a superstar
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
Totally Agree
Goliath, dissatisfied with his size advantage, decided to buy David's sling, which took steroids.
Totally OT
but how does Joey Devine pick up more ROY votes than Ziegler?
Let's have our Piazza and eat the Cust too - SPWC
Devine is still considered a rookie? that guy's been around since 2005. although the Braves did send
him up and down from the minors a lot.
they each got one vote
Devine a 2nd place vote, Ziegler a 3rd.
"This is Rickey, calling on behalf of Rickey."
by scatterbrian on Nov 10, 2008 12:35 PM PST up reply actions
Cahill?
I would have thought Cahill and his death sinker would have been attractive to the Rockies.
My prediction is that it is more prospects and less ML players that are being thrown around.
Signatures? We don't need no stinking signatures.
Cahill damn better not be going away in a Holliday deal.
Cahill is untouchable. Period. Top 10 prospect, going nowhere.
This.
Holliday plus one if Anderson is included
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
THIS IS FUN
Because I really doubt that anyone from the A’s is leaking information. And from what I have read it looks like they have DISCUSSED several players but the ones it looks like are Smith, CarGone and Street.
I think we are going to have to wait a day or two and probably 2000 more posts to find the final answer.
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
That's the saddest thing I've read in awhile
I want to know YESTERDAY
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
This seems like the A's might have given up on Gonzalez,
selling while he still has a high upside. It scares me because everyone says he’s going to be really good, but to be honest from looking at his offensive numbers I could never really see why everyone was so high on him. I really don’t think he’ll ever learn to take a walk.
by WhiteElephants on Nov 10, 2008 12:35 PM PST reply actions
To get someone good
you have to give up something. And it has to be more than a flaky closer.
by Athletix Man on Nov 10, 2008 12:38 PM PST up reply actions
Because he's "toolsy"
Which still means a lot to people, particularly BA, who seem to be able to ignore the vast dark history of those players and their level of success.
mlb trade rumors says
2:30pm: Brown says the two teams have agreed in principle to a deal that will send Gonzalez, Smith, and Street to the Rockies.
Gonzalez would be a disaster in Colorado
Lefty flyball pitcher? Ai.
Carlos, not Gio
"However, at Elias, I think they keep track of the amount of sunflower seeds spit in a dugout each night." - Brad Ziegler, 8/7/08
Somehow I got confused
I’m used to seeing CarGon mean, well, CarGon, and Gonzalez to mean Gio
Well it appears the confusion has been rectified
Now Gonzalez can mean Gio and CarGon can mean Matt Holliday
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
it's good to have the terminology straight
now we can get back to the bitchin’
and there has to be a reason
they never played him at the end of the year
Beane's World!! Excellent!!! Rock On, Beane! Rock On, Geren!
If one of
Gonzo/Anderson are involved look for Ian Stewart to be packing his bags as well. I don’t see Beane giving up that much for a rental.
I don't see the Rockies moving Stewart and Holliday in the same deal
That’s a lot of bats to give up at once
Well I don't see them actually getting Anderson, so I agree.
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
My guess the 48 hours
is for the a’s to talk about an extension. Its been reported deal as been agreed in principle. Probably now up to the a’s to work on an extension for Holliday
by Athletix Man on Nov 10, 2008 12:40 PM PST up reply actions
PLEASE let this be the case
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
If Street is involved
my guess is Beane/Forst started to realize that trading Street was going to be a tough task. To get maximum value for a guy who has been at times hurt/shitty, but still young would’ve been tough. And rather than trying to jerry rig a multi player deal (on both sides) with him involved, he realized adding him to a group like Smith and Cargon and flipping him for a stud like Holliday would be a lot better avenue to get value. Especially when Holliday would be infinitely times more valuable at the deadline, even as a rent-a-player. Unless of course in 2009 they find that Street is actually made out of pure Jade and Gold.
Payroll increasing to 80 million?
Anyone else excited about this development? I guess they decided something had changed and now is the time to spend spend spend.
Strength of Economy?
Or Obama election? Or maybe BB has wealthy new health care clients in new joint venture with Newt
Obama = Change
it’s happening already
by GusanoQuemador on Nov 10, 2008 12:51 PM PST up reply actions
the story gives that number
Save Rajai Davis
by oakinboston on Nov 10, 2008 12:41 PM PST up reply actions
That was part of one article, that Lew said he'd go up to $80mil
"I was right and you were wrong." - Ray Fosse
I see. If Lew's willing to spend that much
signing Furcal is easy, and they could take a run at Sabathia if they really wanted.
"PECOTA can pretty much kiss my ass."-Nico
Furcal, 2/26
Please?
Procrastinators unite....tomorrow
by muffinpryde on Nov 10, 2008 12:41 PM PST up reply actions
mmmmm
I think this makes that more likely. That or a trade for Beltre.
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
If the A's also sign Furcal & the Angels fail to sign Tex
Who you taking for the AL West?
by methodrampage on Nov 10, 2008 1:07 PM PST up reply actions
the a's, of course
but not because i’ve done any rational analysis. i just like us and hate them
it is not possible to strategize while the ball is coming towards you
by eastcoasta'sfan on Nov 10, 2008 1:22 PM PST up reply actions
Argh.
Angels get a slight edge because of the inexperience of the starting pitching staff…but I wouldn’t be surprised if the rotation pulls a ‘Tampa Bay’ and suddenly becomes one of the better pitching staffs in baseball.
Procrastinators unite....tomorrow
Since the A's were near there before
They have said they could go that high if they want. Not that they necessarily will.
by Athletix Man on Nov 10, 2008 12:41 PM PST up reply actions
Lew needs the team to look attractive to another buyer
If Fremont falls through (and its no sure thing) he might try and flip the team to someone else and get out. This has and always will be a real estate deal for him
"I was right and you were wrong." - Ray Fosse
I was actually thinking Fremont was involved as well...
But more along the lines of now that Cisco Field is most likely a “when” proposition rather than “if” with Wasserman getting re-elected last week they’re probably more willing to spend on the team long term now. Which is good news for our World Series hopes if nothing else.
by athletics68 on Nov 10, 2008 12:47 PM PST up reply actions
I'll bet Holliday is gone before July is over
McGwire belongs in the Hall so put him there
by streetisclosedin08 on Nov 10, 2008 12:41 PM PST reply actions
This will not be
the only move Beane makes. He is obviously trying to compete so I see him signing a FA starter and at least one more bat. I also think Holliday has to be extended to have this deal make sense.
Some quick #s on Holliday
Career Home: .357 / .423 / .645
Career Away: .280 / .348 / .455
Holliday’s career OPS away is .803, while at home it is 1.068. So he’s clearly been a much better hitter at Coors than elsewhere. However, his road numbers have improved every year, which should be good news for the A’s.
Holliday’s road OPS, by year:
2004 – .654
2005 – .729
2006 – .819
2007 – .860
2008 – .892
"It's just a tiny little nick, but it hurts when I get champagne in there."
- Jason Bay, on getting spiked scoring the winning run in ALDS Game Four.
And, don't forget that almost everyone has a better Home than Road OPS
So not all of that is Coors. Some of it is sleeping at home, etc.
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
Not to mention the preponderance of pitchers' parks in the NL West
which surely doesn’t help Holliday’s numbers.
"It's just a tiny little nick, but it hurts when I get champagne in there."
- Jason Bay, on getting spiked scoring the winning run in ALDS Game Four.
if its street, smith, and cargon, i'm going to barf
'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long
by DyeLongJustice on Nov 10, 2008 12:42 PM PST reply actions
From yahoo:
Holliday spoke in the morning with Beane and assistant GM David Forst, according to a source, and now the A’s and Rockies must wait on physicals.
Oh man... Now I am depressed!
I love Greggy! He was my port in the storm when I lost Joe! I don’t know if I can take this! Getting Matt Holliday would be awesome, but not at the expense of Smith. =(
"He's day-to-day," Geren said. "But aren't we all?" - 5/29/08
by BobbyCrosbysGirl on Nov 10, 2008 12:43 PM PST reply actions
Why
I don’t think Smith is going to be more than a #4 pitcher.
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
Why not?
I just love him! I love watching him pitch! He doesn’t have to be the greatest pitcher ever for me to appreciate his talent. And you have to admit, that pick-off move was damn sexy!
"He's day-to-day," Geren said. "But aren't we all?" - 5/29/08
by BobbyCrosbysGirl on Nov 10, 2008 12:52 PM PST up reply actions
Smith did strike me
as one of the more articulate baseball players I’ve seen. Plus he was really nice at Spring Training.
Fair enough
That just has little to do with what the A’s should do with him
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
From ESPN
Sweeney has also been discussed as potentially being part of the deal
"I was right and you were wrong." - Ray Fosse
my day is going from bad to worse.
at least they can’t touch Ellis.
Awww… Unicorn's optimistic. And a cheeseball. That’s cute. ~Whiteshoes40
Now apparently Sweeney is in the mix
If so, I’m much happier
Just that he has been discussed at some point.
But seems that they may have agreed on cargon, smith and street
by Athletix Man on Nov 10, 2008 12:46 PM PST up reply actions
Please make it the three s-es
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
AHHHHHHHHH!
too many details! This is via mlbtraderumors.com
2:39pm: Troy Renck says the A’s had been offering Street and Gonzalez. Meanwhile ESPN adds Ryan Sweeney and Gonzalez to their mix of players discussed.
2:30pm: Brown says the two teams have agreed in principle to a deal that will send Gonzalez, Smith, and Street to the Rockies.
2:24pm: The ESPN report now says Brett Anderson was under discussion as well as Smith.
2:03pm: The ESPN guys talked to A’s assistant GM David Forst, who said, “It’s still an ongoing discussion.”
2:00pm: Ken Rosenthal chimes in. The deal may not be finalized for about 48 hours. Players discussed over the weekend: Carlos Gonzalez, Huston Street, and Smith. Rosenthal says the A’s do not plan to flip Holliday or trade him in July.
1:57pm: ESPN’s Buster Olney and Jerry Crasnick say the two teams have agreed to terms, and believe pitcher Greg Smith was under discussion.
1:51pm: Yahoo’s Tim Brown also says a deal is close.
1:27pm: According to SI.com’s Jon Heyman, the A’s traded for Rockies outfielder Matt Holliday. More as it comes in!
"Who's this Seagon guy? Is he in A-ball or something?" - Billy Beane
Agreed
I still believe Cargon can develop into a Beltran-esque player.
Procrastinators unite....tomorrow
by muffinpryde on Nov 10, 2008 12:50 PM PST up reply actions
Yes, if he gets 3 years older and drops .075 off his OBP
He’ll be beltranesque.
it is not possible to strategize while the ball is coming towards you
by eastcoasta'sfan on Nov 10, 2008 1:28 PM PST up reply actions
oops, I meant ops
http://www.baseball-reference.com/h/hollima01.shtml
it is not possible to strategize while the ball is coming towards you
by eastcoasta'sfan on Nov 10, 2008 1:28 PM PST up reply actions
he's saying cargon --> beltran. not holliday.
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
I'm fine with this
so long as its CGon, Smith, and Huston. We have a glut of good, young OFers so loing Carlos won’t be so disastrous. Smith is very expendable considering our extreme SP depth, and Huston was on his way out anyway so I guess it’s just a shame we couldn’t get a separate deal with another team for Street alone. Now lets get to work on that extension Billy! Any thoughts on what it’ll take? I say 6 yr. $100 MM.
"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin
right, but we could get more selling off those pieces alone
'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long
by DyeLongJustice on Nov 10, 2008 12:48 PM PST up reply actions
really?
I’m not sure. Those guys don’t have a ton of value individually.
in terms of total sum value? i think yes...would get get a holliday for each piece? no.
'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long
by DyeLongJustice on Nov 10, 2008 12:49 PM PST up reply actions
Maybe we couldn't
How do we know? Only Bill and Forst know for sure and our only choice is to trust them on this one and the plan they’ve laid out.
"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin
by Helloooo 1st on Nov 10, 2008 12:49 PM PST up reply actions
so much for rebuilding...hopefully they trade for some good rotation pitchers then, since ours are a little inexeperienced/walk happy
'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long
by DyeLongJustice on Nov 10, 2008 12:50 PM PST up reply actions
I don't think it's over
It all depends what we move. At the very least we’re getting picks back for Holliday, and if we’re trading fairly fungible parts (Smith, Sweeney) then we slide right back into rebuilding. If we’re moving Anderson then it’s probably not a good move. If it’s CarGon then I’d guess he’s probably going for it this year and then will see what the options are. Either way I don’t think we’re derailed here.
Interesting...
I prefer a package for one big guy rather than a bunch of little pieces.
Bring back Hammer.
by OaktownPower on Nov 10, 2008 12:50 PM PST up reply actions
I was thinking in two days they will announce the deal in final and that they have signed Holliday to a 5 year $75 mil extension but I am also open to your 6/$100
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
Slusser:
A source said extending Holliday’s contract is not part of the deal. Holliday’s agent is Scott Boras, who is well-known for driving hard bargains.
That only means the deal isn't contingent on signing him
I seriously doubt 6/100 is enough. I’d expect 6/120 or more.
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
Declined bigger offer
I thought I read where he already turned down a 5yr 85 million deal from the Rockies before last season.
Everybody freaked out when CarGon was going the other way.
Then everybody freaked out even more when Anderson was going the other way.
Now people seem to feel ok about CarGon going. Perspective, eh?
Children, until we have taught them better, will be perfectly happy with a seasonal round of games in which conkers succeeds hopscotch.
i dont want to lose either, especialy if we're already giving up street
'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long
by DyeLongJustice on Nov 10, 2008 12:48 PM PST up reply actions
We like to hoard our prospects
Gimme gimmie gimmie
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 12:49 PM PST up reply actions
please let it be neither!!!!!
if it HAS to happen, then Cargon, but NOT SWEENEY!!!!!
Awww… Unicorn's optimistic. And a cheeseball. That’s cute. ~Whiteshoes40
The Untouchables
While of course understanding that everyone has some fair price, the players who I think of as untouchable now are Anderson & Cahill (because they could be real top of the rotation pitchers) and Cardenas (because he’s a good hitting prospect in the infield, where the A’s are weak). I can understand why some other people might put Gonzalez or Gallagher in that category as well, but I don’t mind trading either one of them for a player as good as Holliday. It’s time to trade away some of that quantity of prospects we now have, for greater quality.
Thanks for tomorrow 'cause I've had enough
It will look pretty silly if they win 87 games next year and Holliday leaves....
The A's colors are green and gold.
Wonder if Holliday...
agreeing to an extension could be part of the deal? I’d hate to see him gone in a year after giving up some good chips.
Sad to see CarGone. (pun intended)
BTW, why are we getting the update times in EST? This is a west coast team!
if we keep him, i'm a helluva lot happier
'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long
by DyeLongJustice on Nov 10, 2008 12:50 PM PST up reply actions
Would be nice..but doubt Boras lets him do that.
Bring back Hammer.
by OaktownPower on Nov 10, 2008 12:51 PM PST up reply actions
I thought everybody who watched sports
lives in Bristol, CT. no?
Save Rajai Davis
by oakinboston on Nov 10, 2008 12:51 PM PST up reply actions
I wonder if that's the 48 hours there talking about.
by Athletix Man on Nov 10, 2008 12:51 PM PST up reply actions
I was hearing the 48 hours was for physicals,
but sure, contract negotiation could be part too.
by LoneStranger on Nov 10, 2008 12:52 PM PST up reply actions
Holliday
I’ll bet Billy Beane managed to squeeze out a 4th outfielder or AA prospect from Colorado as he always does, IE Ryan Sweeney style…..
If they gave up Street, Smith +1 that would be fine, I just really hope they didn’t part w/ CarGon.
Without Cargon
I dont see Colorado agreeing at all. Unless it was someone like Anderson.
by Athletix Man on Nov 10, 2008 12:53 PM PST up reply actions
I'm still really, really worried.
Pitcher Greg Smith, who was 7-16 with a 4.16 ERA last season for the A’s, is one of the players in the deal, a source confirmed to Crasnick. Among the other players who have been discussed were left-handed pitcher Brett Anderson and outfielders Ryan Sweeney and Carlos Gonzalez.
Per ESPN.
Sweeney interest has been “confirmed”, although I DON’T WANNA LOSE ANDERSON PLEASE.
This.
i just cant believe that.
right? how could that make any sense
Save Rajai Davis
by oakinboston on Nov 10, 2008 12:54 PM PST up reply actions
Denver Post
Makes it sound like the original offer the A’s gave was cargon and Street, Then it took Smith to seal things up.
Yep, thats what I'm thinking
Street, Smith, & Cargon.
Pretty good deal
"Who's this Seagon guy? Is he in A-ball or something?" - Billy Beane
by pickinmachine on Nov 10, 2008 12:57 PM PST up reply actions
we almost got B Giles last august...
'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long
by DyeLongJustice on Nov 10, 2008 12:57 PM PST reply actions
Yea I read that
But doesnt makes sense If Boston won the claim and they failed to make a trade. Only way it could have happened is if Boston was going to flip him to us.
by Athletix Man on Nov 10, 2008 12:59 PM PST up reply actions
Chron chimes in
Says Smith is heading to Denver to take a physical.
Also says Huston and CarGo are part of the deal.
Freemont was a baaad choice!!
from that article
“I don’t know how official everything is,” Smith said. “All I know is I’ve been called, and I’m flying to Denver probably tomorrow.”
Two-thirds of the earth is covered by water, the other third is covered by Kotsay...in his prime...like 3 years ago.
I so wish that a mojo thread would work in this situation.
It’s my mom’s b-day, and she’s going to come home to me mad and yelling at the computer. dang.
Awww… Unicorn's optimistic. And a cheeseball. That’s cute. ~Whiteshoes40
in contention = Lose Holliday = 2 draft picks OR resign him
out of contention = trade Holliday for multiple prospects at trade deadline
But will the package received mid-season be better than what we just gave up?
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 1:01 PM PST up reply actions
Who knows?
Probably not quite but close to it, but you also have the added chance of actually winning the AL West with Holliday and another piece here and there. I think that scenario hedges your concern.
vr, Xei
And you can't totally put a value
on the knowledge passed on to the young outfielders.
by LoneStranger on Nov 10, 2008 1:13 PM PST up reply actions
i dont are about street/smith
who cares..lots of pitching depth
but cargon??? disappointed..A’s prefer sweeney i guess
atl east force rocies to include nelson, barmes, or stewart
No Rockies prefer CarGon
And wouldnt make a deal without him. Most likely
by Athletix Man on Nov 10, 2008 1:03 PM PST up reply actions
I doubt it's so much that the A's prefer Sweeney
as it is that the Rockies prefer CarGon.
by WhiteElephants on Nov 10, 2008 1:03 PM PST up reply actions
wow
I’m not quite sure what to think of all this. I’m excited about the possibility of getting a good hitter like Holliday, somewhat terrified at who might be going to Colorado in exchange. If it turns out to be Street, Smith, and Cargon then I suppose that’s not too bad, though losing Cargon would hurt since he seems like the only OF prospect with a legitimate shot at being great.
"That's not a Sherman tank, it's Frank Thomas!" - Monkeyball
Yea But I heard a rumor
That were only going to play 3 outfielders at a time next season. And last i checked we have a lot
by Athletix Man on Nov 10, 2008 1:04 PM PST up reply actions
True, but it's the Rockies
I’m probably out of touch with how competent the Rockies management is, but it seems like they would be susceptible to the Ron Popeil school of trading:
“Why settle for Carlos Gonzalez when you can have Ryan Sweeney and Matt Murton instead? But wait, there’s more! Act now and we’ll throw in a Richie Robnett at no extra charge!”
Maybe not those specific players, but you get the idea.
"That's not a Sherman tank, it's Frank Thomas!" - Monkeyball
Yes, but I don't think it included free shipping
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
Seems like the A's don't specialize in developing...
high upside, high risk guys. But maybe its just chance siding against us as of late.
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 1:07 PM PST up reply actions
Trying to think of this from a Rockies perspective.
I’d be pissed about Greg Smith if I were a Rox fan. Flyball pitcher + VERY unsustainable numbers to begin with + Coors Field + Not great defense= oh no.
This.
yeah but cargon and street
holliday is gone at the end of the year anyways.
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
Is this confirmed yet?
Cargon, Street, and Smith for Matt Holliday?
the multitude of comments is hurting my head.
Awww… Unicorn's optimistic. And a cheeseball. That’s cute. ~Whiteshoes40
What does this mean for the rest of the offseason?
This can’t be it! This move alone does not make sense. Coupled with moves to improve the left side of the infield, that makes sense. Alone, it does not.
JJ Hardy? Rafael Furcal? Adrien Beltre? Hank Blalock? It seems like the A’s would need to target one of these guys or some other impact player to make this deal make sense.
"To me, boxing is like a ballet, except there's no music, no choreography, and the dancers hit each other." - Jack Handey
Please do not trade for Beltre or Blalock.
1. No prospects going to rival teams.
2. Two rental players is a bit of a drain of the farm system.
Furcal IF he comes on a 2 year deal. No 4 year deals plz.
This.
I wouldn't mind Beltre.
I don’t really think it would take a whole lot to get him from Seattle because, well, they’re Seattle.
I also don’t really mind a prospect going to Seattle because, well, they’re Seattle.
I hope Street isn't in this deal.
Only for the simple reason that he could later be flipped to Milwaukee for Hardy.
If Anderson, Sweeney, and Smith net the A’s Holliday and Stewart…
Then Street and Mazzaro net Hardy, and a Giambi addition… We got us a team to watch next year.
Holliday, Stewart, Hardy and Giambi for Sweeney, Smith, Street, Anderson and Mazzaro, adding about $25 million in payroll, and I’m happy.
No
I wouldnt count on any players other than Holliday coming to Oakland.
"Who's this Seagon guy? Is he in A-ball or something?" - Billy Beane
by pickinmachine on Nov 10, 2008 1:14 PM PST up reply actions
I bet there's at least a PTBNL
Or something similar.
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
I'm dreaming...
But if we’re talking CarGon/Anderson, I wouldn’t be surprised. The A’s have been high on Stewart before.
I hope Street isn't in this deal...
but only because it will be next to impossible to get one of my friends to go to games with me if he is gone.
"He's day-to-day," Geren said. "But aren't we all?" - 5/29/08
by BobbyCrosbysGirl on Nov 10, 2008 1:16 PM PST up reply actions
Having Holliday won't make up for that?
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
Dunno....
Huston was awfully pretty.
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
I have an 8x10 and a magnet that now need removal from my cube wall
Not that I’ve taken down my Harden 8×10, magnet, calendar page, travel mug, bobblehead pin, and 4-foot-wide pitching-sequence photo.
I get too busy at work to check on the A's every five minutes
and THIS is what happens?
(Didn’t I say ,expect the unexpected" ?)
I sent you an email and tried to let it down lightly...
But AGGGGGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I’m not happy with this either!!!!!!!!!
Awww… Unicorn's optimistic. And a cheeseball. That’s cute. ~Whiteshoes40
Note to AN Posters:
Don’t ever base your online moniker (or purchase a jersey-T for that matter) for any A’s player that you actually like. It’s a sure way to get them traded within 6 months.
I'm never gonna do it without the fez on!
oops.
should I sell my Ellis jersey then?
Awww… Unicorn's optimistic. And a cheeseball. That’s cute. ~Whiteshoes40
The winter is young...
I recommend you do it now while it’s value is high.
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
No worries
It already happened thirty-seven years ago.
Root for the Giants? Not even if they're playing al-Qaeda!
Yay for laundry!
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 1:14 PM PST up reply actions
How do I change my SN to "CrosbyFan#1"?
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
You don't!!
"He's day-to-day," Geren said. "But aren't we all?" - 5/29/08
by BobbyCrosbysGirl on Nov 10, 2008 1:27 PM PST up reply actions
I was thinking of changing my screen name to PTNL
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
The 40 in my name lasted a good long time....
but not long enough, unfortunately.
by whiteshoes40 on Nov 10, 2008 4:33 PM PST up reply actions
Am I in the minority then,
in thinking that we just got raped? Cargon, Street & Smith for a player one year away from free agency? Granted he is good, and we’ll presumably look to extend. But we gave up WAAAAAAAYYYY to much IMHO.
"Errors of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it."
-Thomas Jefferson
ok...
we all know i am biased…i have a thing for smith. a huge thing. so let me be a biased female for a few minutes ok? I will have to change my name to ilovegallagher and when I recover from losing my man..i will be ok and look on the bright side of things…because I do like Holliday…but at the same time..he will be a FA……i do think its a bit much for a soon to be FA
by ilovegregsmith on Nov 10, 2008 1:23 PM PST up reply actions
Yes and no.
I’m OK with Street and Smith. Smith’s numbers are unsustainable.
I hate the idea of CarGon in the deal though. No please.
This.
Cargon straight up is fine.
Or Street & Smith tandem is fine. All 3 makes this a bad deal for us, I believe.
"Errors of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it."
-Thomas Jefferson
by thinwhiteduke on Nov 10, 2008 1:14 PM PST up reply actions
.280 .348 .455 .803
That is Holliday’s career batting line away from Coors. Is that sort of production worth what we just gave up, considering it won’t come cheap? I really can’t see it that way.
"Errors of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it."
-Thomas Jefferson
by thinwhiteduke on Nov 10, 2008 1:36 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah, but look at the trend:
2005: .256 .313 .416 .729
2006: .280 .333 .485 .819
2007: .301 .374 .485 .860
2008: .308 .405 .486 .892
Plus, he’s in the NL West. He’s played a bunch of games in Petco and Los Angeles, which were the 2 worst hitters parks in baseball last year.
Nothing goes up forever.
He’s almost certainly peaked, although I do think he’ll age fairly well. However, I don’t think that will make much difference to us anyway. I’m beginning to become doubtful we’ll be able to sign him to an extension. Boras will probably ask upwards of $20Mil for 6 years. If that is the price, no thank you.
"Errors of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it."
-Thomas Jefferson
by thinwhiteduke on Nov 10, 2008 3:06 PM PST up reply actions
Raped? Think not.
Street and Smith are totally expendable and offer no real upgrades over players already on the roster. Devine can close and Smith is just a face in the crowd. Cargon is a quality prospect but you’re going to have to give up somthing good to get something good.
by methodrampage on Nov 10, 2008 1:14 PM PST up reply actions
At some point you should just lay back and enjoy it.
"Camelot sure fell apart, didn't it?"-Steve McCatty
This is why every online community needs ladies
I, for example, could never get away with saying this
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
I'm not happy with Gonzales being included
I don’t think I trade him for a year of Holliday straight up. I’m just not convinced of Holliday’s awesomeness outside of Coors, especially on a 1 year deal.
Starting pitching next year
So this leaves us with:
- Duchscherer
- Gallagher
- Eveland
- Gio? Dallas? Outman? Cahill?
Seems like a very thin group, with an injury-prone pitcher at the top. Maybe the next offseason move will be for a pitcher.
It also makes the release of Embree a little more puzzling – Casilla is now the veteran down there!
"To me, boxing is like a ballet, except there's no music, no choreography, and the dancers hit each other." - Jack Handey
Strange to hedge our bets on this rotation panning out into a playoff contender
Maybe a year or two premature
I am Ray Fosse's infatuations with Clay Wood and high-definition television.
by franks a lot on Nov 10, 2008 1:13 PM PST up reply actions
i think this move might have been made by Wolff, not Beane
'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long
by DyeLongJustice on Nov 10, 2008 1:16 PM PST up reply actions
I'm not sure this is a Wolff move
He may have signed off on it, but how’s he going to force it? Trade for Holliday … or you’re fired? BB owns a piece of the team and has massive popular support. I’d guess more that he told Billy he was willing to make big moves and this is what BB found.
The 2009 guaranteed payroll (not including Holliday or any new acquisitions) was around 29MM
Street gone subtracts about 3MM.
2007 was around 60-70MM. I think there’s plenty of payroll room.
This.
I agreed there's room
All I’m saying is that if Wolff has anything to do with this it was him telling Beane that they’d resign Holliday.
by methodrampage on Nov 10, 2008 1:38 PM PST up reply actions
This is what CBSsportsline has
The Rockies will receive outfielder Carlos Gonzalez, left-handed pitcher Greg Smith and closer Huston Street in return, though they may not keep Street. One source said Monday that the Rockies are prepared to turn around and trade him — though to which team he wasn’t sure.
McGwire belongs in the Hall so put him there
by streetisclosedin08 on Nov 10, 2008 1:15 PM PST reply actions
Well I guess that answers my question.
"That's not a Sherman tank, it's Frank Thomas!" - Monkeyball
looking at this from the Colorado point of view
the Rox get a Closer who lost his job (and subsequently his reputation as ‘lights out’), an average, albeit young, starting pitcher with nothing overwhelming in his repetoire, and a young CF who struggled in the Majors (though probably the most valuable piece), in exchange for their best hitter…from that point of view, seems more fair.
'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long
quit making me think about this logically!
by LoneStranger on Nov 10, 2008 1:21 PM PST up reply actions
If I was a Rockies fan I wouldn't be thrilled
None of the guys they’re getting are going to make them better in 2009 (and very possibly beyond) than they were in 2008. Street isn’t better than Fuentes. Smith is meh. CarGon could be a good player but has obvious limitations. I think it’s a bummer of a move for them.
well, the only piece that i think we might miss, now that i think about it, its CarGon
CG has a legitimate chance to make it big as a pro. However, Holliday is a sure thing (assuming he resigns and doesn’t get injured). One for one, you do that deal almost every time (of course there is the whole money thing, but we have some payroll room). Of course, throwing in Street and Smith makes the trade a lot more even, but as long as there wasn’t significant interest for those other two pieces elsewhere, and we sign Holliday, it was a good/decent move.
'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long
by DyeLongJustice on Nov 10, 2008 2:46 PM PST up reply actions
Trading traded players
Are there restrictions on trading players that were just acquired via trade? Could the A’s go out and trade Holliday next week or in December? I can’t imagine it would happen, even if it’s allowed, as it would likely not exactly get the friendliest reaction in the world from the Rockies.
"That's not a Sherman tank, it's Frank Thomas!" - Monkeyball
No, there are none.
You can’t trade someone right after you sign them to a FA contract (ex. the A’s couldn’t go out and sign Manny and then trade him) and you can’t trade newly drafted players until a year after they’re drafted (ex. we couldn’t trade Brett Hunter until June)
This.
400+ comments
"Some of the men didn't wait for the women and children to jump off the sinking ship that is our season." - 67MARQUEZ
by notsellingjeans on Nov 10, 2008 1:18 PM PST reply actions
Question.
Does this trade suddenly make the A’s a more attractive team to the available free agents? It certainly looks like we are serious about contending.
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
Which particular available FAs?
If its Furcal, hopefully he might accept a 2 year deal as opposed to the 4 he’s rumored to want.
This.
except that
Sweeney/Buck seem to injury prone in the green and gold.
Also add to that two other CFs in Davis and Denorfia and Denorfia was great the second half the the AAA season and now.
"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"
Don't stop-- believing--
Chris Denorfia fans are a rare breed, but we have to stick together…
I still think he can be a plus leadoff hitter if he gets consistent playing time and is fully healthy. He’s kind of a poor man’s five-tool player— he doesn’t do anything exceptionally, but he doesn’t do anything badly either.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
That is incorrect, sir
Denorfia does one thing badly…
stay healthy.
The monster at the end of this blog.
He played 167 games in 2005
Prior to the elbow injury he had never sustained any significant injury in his career.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
The best part about all this happening in early November....
…is the speculation that can run rampant in all directions. :)
Speculation....
Never a commodity in short supply on AN.
"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer
wow
If Beane could somehow swap CarGon w/ Ryan Sweeney, I would be really really happy. Unfortunately, MLB GM’s are pretty smart.
Not happy
First, from Slusser:
A source said extending Holliday’s contract is not part of the deal. Holliday’s agent is Scott Boras, who is well-known for driving hard bargains.
So one year of Holliday for 4 years of CarGon, Street, and Smith? That doesn’t sound like much of a deal to me.
booooooooooooooooo
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
Only makes sense as part of a series of moves (especially if no extension)
The current A’s + Holliday – Street/Smith/CarGon is not going to compete with Anaheim. Too many questions in the rotation, too much dead space in the lineup. There has to be at least another bat coming (Furcal?) and I think they need another steady starter. Duke-Gallagher-Eveland-Outman-Gio makes me very nervous.
also
this should hopefully improve jack cust’s production – teams will actually have to pitch to him with someone who can hit behind him.
this year, all time strickout record here we come!
actually, i’m quite excited about this trade. sad to see gonzalez go, will miss the pick off move, but it’s nice to see the a’s on the front page of mlb.com, for a change. remember us, East Coast?
BB should send scouts to watch cricket players.
by alea iacta est on Nov 10, 2008 1:46 PM PST reply actions
will miss the pickoff move
from smith.
just to clarify.
this trade might get me fired, bye the bye
BB should send scouts to watch cricket players.
by alea iacta est on Nov 10, 2008 1:53 PM PST up reply actions
will miss the balk pickoff move
pending a physical, your title should be edited.
not if he does it
against the giants
BB should send scouts to watch cricket players.
by alea iacta est on Nov 10, 2008 7:51 PM PST up reply actions
I actually expect that Cust hit's after Holliday
But we’ll see.
"There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" -Bill Watterson
There's something to be said for batting Cust 3rd and Holliday 4th
because Cust will often extend the first inning with a walk and then a Holliday double can score 1 or a HR can score 2.
I don’t know that that outweighs the general rules regarding lineup construction though.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
from metsblog
…Update…4:34 pm…
According to Scott Miller at CBSSports.com, citing ‘one source,’ if the Rockies end up acquiring Street from the A’s, ‘they are prepared to turn around and trade him — though to which team he wasn’t sure.’
you keep posting stuff from metsblog... what do the mets have to do with any of this?
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
Absolutely nothing, I just check metsblog a lot
Cerrone seemed to be keeping a good summary of things
(Mets are keeping tabs on it because of Street being involved)
(despite the fact that Mets fans were 99% sure the Mets wouldn’t do a deal for Street anyway)
according to metsblog
obama won the presidential election.
it is now 4:43am metsblog time.
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHH!
i just saw this, and my initial reaction is, WTF??
one year of matt holliday and some draft picks for two years of a closer, five years of a #5 starter, and ~5 years of a CF? do. not. want!
and the a’s not only sells low with street, but this doesn’t even solve the 3b or SS problems.
this team is still mediocre, even with holliday. maybe they’ll add one or two of dunn/furcal/giambi and that will change. but until then, giving up so much to improve the team for one year is not worth it.
i have was pro-trade on hudson, mulder, haren, and swisher, but i don’t understand this trade at all.
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05
Guarantee
We will sign a starting pitcher now. Which one? I have no idea. Derek Lowe for a three-year deal? Yeah, he’s getting old, but he seems like the type of guy that just gets better with age until he hits that age-wall. I dunno. I can’t see us going into the season with Duchscherer/Gallagher/Eveland/Braden/Gonzalez.
"A’s baseball….It’s almost better than a stick in the eye." ~ alox
by Gallagher's Watermelons on Nov 10, 2008 2:30 PM PST reply actions
Peavy! lololololol...seriously, there isnt much id want...Koji Uehara, Ben Sheets, Brad Penny
but all of the above have some kind of ‘warts’. I’d want Sheets the most, but he’s gonna cost draft picks to sign, Penny second (but injuries and not that great), and then Koji (who knows how japenese imports who are 34 project). I’d probably rather stick with our cheapy but goody options and see what the kids can do. Hopefully, our rotation doesn’t fall apart faster than you can say Holliday, but with Duke heading it, one never knows…
'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long
by DyeLongJustice on Nov 10, 2008 3:03 PM PST up reply actions
Lowe is really good, despite being a douchebag
I’m all in favor of groundballing righties. The A’s have had way too many flyball lefties lately… works great against the Yankees, but not so hot against a normal roster…
On a related note, Trevor Cahill and Vince Mazzaro are the shit.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
and with ellis at second...
we should have more groundball pitchers.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
Baseball Nation Recent Stories
In Association With
Big League Stew - MLB - Yahoo! Sports
- The Cardinals Hall of Fame can now be found at Bill Clinton’s library in Arkansas (Huh?)
- Will Bryce Harper start the season with the Nationals?
- Mitch Mustain puts football behind him, signs reported rookie deal with White Sox
- Robinson Cano and Denzel Washington face off in Jay Leno’s Yankees trivia contest
- Shane Victorino lands role on ‘Hawaii Five-0′
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
