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Giambi in '09?

In this morning's blog, Buster Olney had this little nugget for us A's fans:

• If the money can be worked out, a reunion of Jason Giambi with the Oakland Athletics might well happen in 2009.

 

Star-divide

Well, let's think about this. Giambi last season had these stats:

32 HR, 96RBI, .876 OPS, .247BA, 76BB

PROS: He could split DH time with Cust, fill out the middle of the order with some left handed pop, and also play some 1B and allow Barton time to hopefully refind his ability to play baseball. He brings a recognizeable name back to the team and helps restart the marketing effort.

CONS: One of the most villified former Athletics, he spurned a $15mil/yr deal in 2000 to go play for the Evil Empire. He went from sitting on a Harley to clean shaven and pushing deoderant in the Big Apple. He is an admitted steroid user, and he is in the twilight of his career at 37. He probably would need somewhere in the range of $8-10mil/yr.

Question: Do A's fans forgive him of his transgression of completely and whole hartedly selling out of the highest order? Is 7 years enough to let bygones be bygones and allow the snake back in the den?

After the enemic offense that was put out on the field this past year, I can't see why this wouldn't be a good signing in order to put a competitive team back on the field next year, especially with 1B being a weakness on this year's team. For a year or two this would be a solid move and who doesn't love a comeback story. For chrissake the A's brought back Canseco and he was way worse than Giambino. I think the money and attention would be worth it. Hell, even I'm ready to forgive.

Please, bring your case to the forum.

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Based on what?

AVG: Giambi .247, Cust .231
OBP: Cust .375, Giambi .373
SLG: Giambi .502, Cust .476
OPS: Giambi .875, Cust .851
BB: Cust 111, Giambi 76
SO: Cust 197, Giambi 111
XBH: Giambi 52, Cust 52
TB: Giambi 230, Cust 229
OPS+: Cust 132, Giambi 130

I’m not even going to make a big deal out of RBI because there’s no question the Yankee offense was better than the A’s, but the two had some very similar numbers in many categories and the only advantage Cust really had was in his walks. Even still, they almost had the same OBP. Giambi’s also had three seasons with more walks than Cust had this year and four more where he was right in Cust’s range, but I know we’re talking about just this year.

I’m not saying I want Giambi here (I don’t) but he and Cust were about as close to equal as you can get this season in a few key categories.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Oct 2, 2008 2:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

Park factors will make Cust's numbers better for 2008.

Eveland rocks! Eveland rocks! Somewhere Drew Carey just smiled.

by miggyk2 on Oct 2, 2008 2:39 PM PDT up reply actions  

and giambi is old, cust is younger...

'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long

by DyeLongJustice on Oct 2, 2008 2:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

you both mentioned two good reasons

NOT to consider Giambi…not to mention that he will be relatively expensive.

by OaklandSi on Oct 3, 2008 7:05 AM PDT up reply actions  

If Cust and Giambi have runners on 3rd with less than 2 outs

I know who I would take in a heartbeat when comparing the two.

I like seeing Cust hit many home runs and get on base but in this department he is awful, awful and awful.

May the Angels have only bad luck in the playoffs and anything bad goes as long as they lose, short of DEATH that is.

by Trainman on Oct 3, 2008 12:29 PM PDT up reply actions  

I see Cust is eliciting the usual flagrant lies from his detractors

His career line with a runner on third, less than 2 outs:

.360/.457/.680.

Jack Cust becomes Albert Pujols with a runner on third and less than 2 outs.

I really find it irritating that people aren’t willing to at least make a cursory check of, you know, reality before they post this shit.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 3, 2008 1:47 PM PDT up reply actions  

PT You know you can't bring reality into this discussion ;-)

"Whether you think you can, or you think you can't, either way, YOU'RE RIGHT !"

by Eastbayjim on Oct 3, 2008 2:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

Wait we had a guy on third base this year

When Cust was up? What was he this year with runners at third, like 1-6? 33 homers at 400,000 is better than 34 at 20 million a year

by pbra17 on Oct 3, 2008 2:11 PM PDT up reply actions  

Um, isn't that a pretty small sample size?

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Oct 3, 2008 2:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

... yes...

I’m not the one who intimated that performance in a given rare situation was meaningful in any way. It isn’t. But really, there’s no need to go to the effort of a systematic critique when five seconds worth of “research” on Baseball-Reference will suffice.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 3, 2008 11:54 PM PDT up reply actions  

Well, yeah

That’s why I went there and found the stats that showed Giambi was better than Cust in this situation both this season and over his career.

True, Cust’s been solid in that situation in his career (though not this year), but Giambi’s been better.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Oct 4, 2008 12:05 AM PDT up reply actions  

in this department he is awful, awful and awful.

Seconded

Forgive me for failing to realize that “awful, awful and awful” actually meant “extremely good, albeit marginally worse than Giambi over his full career.”

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 4, 2008 2:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

He was awful in 2008. Are you denying that?

When you brought up the career totals, that’s when I did more digging.

Now please stop being a condescending ass. Thank you.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Oct 4, 2008 8:19 AM PDT up reply actions  

Wait, did you look up the split for this year before saying "seconded" or not?

I’m not sure which is worse— that you didn’t bother to look it up at all, or that you looked it up and then made a judgment on the basis of a 12 at bat sample size.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 4, 2008 8:30 PM PDT up reply actions  

It was more like 25 PA with the walks and sac flies added in

And he got the run home only 40% of the time. Giambi’s rate was much better than that.

Whether you like the example or not, that was the one Trainman gave and it’s pretty important to be able to get the run home in that kind of situation.

Cust’s numbers may be good for his brief career in that spot but they were poor this season and nowhere near what Giambi did this year or over his career.

We done yet?

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Oct 4, 2008 8:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

You're including walks and then blaming him for "not getting the run home"???

Also, why should anyone use the tiny sample size from this season when they could use the still tiny, but at least somewhat less ridiculous 70 PAs for his career?

I mean, other than the obvious reason that they are cherrypicking.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 4, 2008 9:05 PM PDT up reply actions  

Fine, let's take out the walks

Then we have, what, 16 PA for Cust (12 AB and 4 SF) and 10 RBI. That’s 62.5%. Decent, sure. You can get a few groundouts for that, which he would’ve had to do considering he only had 2 hits to go with those 4 SF.

Back to Giambi. Let’s take away the 2 RBI from the homers he hit and that’s 30 left over. Then you have 28 AB and 7 SF. 35 PA. He got a run home 85.7% of the time in that situation.

STILL much better than Cust’s rate this year.

STILL much better over his career than Cust’s been.

STILL don’t care if it’s a small sample size this season.

The point remains that Giambi’s better in those situations because he was better at putting the ball in play when the situation required it. I’m pretty sure we could look at all situations w/ RISP and less than 2 out and he’d still be ahead of Cust for that fact alone.

End of discussion.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Oct 4, 2008 9:13 PM PDT up reply actions  

I would like to see you state categorically

“Cust is not ‘awful, awful and awful’ with runners at third and less than two outs.” That’s really the only thing I’m getting at here. Admit your first statement was false. (It’d be nice if Trainman admitted that too, but I’m not holding my breath waiting for that.) I don’t care a whit about how good Giambi is in those situations.

What I care about is the act of twisting the truth, not the content.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 4, 2008 9:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

I was wrong about him being awful, awful, awful.

If you want me to admit that, easily done.

I still wouldn’t say he was great in that situation this year, which is what I think Trainman’s really getting at. Would you agree there?

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Oct 4, 2008 10:02 PM PDT up reply actions  

Thank you.

I also would not say that he was great in that situation this year. As I’ve intimated above, I wouldn’t say anything about it at all if I wasn’t prompted to, because I think it’s not useful information. If you asked me whether he was great in that situation this year, I would say “he was Jack Cust in that situation this year.”

The one thing I would note is that his K rate is a little lower (only 25% of PA instead of 33%) in “out → RBI” situations. But this may again be an artifact of the sample size.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 4, 2008 11:29 PM PDT up reply actions  

For comparison, by the way

Giambi was around 40 PA and had 32 RBI, good for 80%. That’s just a bit better, isn’t it?

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Oct 4, 2008 8:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

I really find you irritating sometimes, but I can deal with it.

Not every one of your responses has to be full of the usual PaulThomas “I’m completely right and you’re not” attitude.

This season, Cust had 12 AB with a runner at third and less than 2 out. He hit .167 (2-for-12, both singles), had 9 walks, 10 RBI, 7 K, and had a .607 OPS.

Giambi’s splits this year were much better: .321 (9-for-28), 9 H, 2 2B, 2 HR, 32 RBI, 5 BB, 3 K, .607 SLG, .940 OPS.

Career? Giambi’s hitting .415, has a .449 OBP, .801 SLG and 1.250 OPS in this situation. Cust’s are .357/.457/.619/1.076, not the same as what you had.

Giambi’s still clearly better.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Oct 3, 2008 3:00 PM PDT up reply actions  

+1

2 for 12 is terrible. I stand by what I said. It’s my opinion, I said he’s terrible in that category. It’s what have you done for me lately. Lately is this season.

I said I would take Giambi over him for that reason. I could name 100 hitters who are better than Cust in this department.

Give him 100 AB’s with a runner on 1st and less than 2 outs and I will bet you his average drops 100 points from his so called career at bats. All they have to do is locate the off speed stuff and he’s dust.

May the Angels have only bad luck in the playoffs and anything bad goes as long as they lose, short of DEATH that is.

by Trainman on Oct 3, 2008 4:34 PM PDT up reply actions  

To me it's not that he's "great" or "terrible" so much as

he’s not well equipped to thrive in those particular situations. So be it.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 3, 2008 5:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

Just as a quick add-on...

Sac flies this year:

Cust 4, Giambi 9

That’s probably about equal given how much more Giambi batted in this situation than Cust in 2008.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Oct 3, 2008 6:20 PM PDT up reply actions  

We got four guys to third base this year?

Cool.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Oct 3, 2008 7:13 PM PDT up reply actions  

I must have missed that game

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Oct 4, 2008 11:00 AM PDT up reply actions  

When you think about it

my punchline is the one with more bite.

The monster at the end of this blog.

by grover on Oct 4, 2008 11:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

There needs to be a stat

for moving runners by opportunity. Then that could be broken down to runner on third scoring, etc. That seems more important/valuable than an RBI/sac total, and in the case of runners on, seeing the success of an AB based less on getting a hit or getting on yourself and more on moving runners whether into scoring position or in. RBI/sac totals are worthless because they throw out context, but something like the above would help in comparison of who’s more valuable hitter everything else being equal.

In search of a new signature. Say something funny and you may see your comment here!

by DMOAS on Oct 3, 2008 10:07 PM PDT up reply actions  

Cust's EQA is a few points higher

It’s pretty close though, which is, of course, more reason not to spend a buttload of money on an almost-40 player to split time with his offensive equal.

I wasn’t so much criticizing Giambi as saying that having two of the same guy for the same purpose is silly. Now if you want Giambi and Cust in the lineup, that’s a separate argument. If you’re looking for somebody to platoon with Cust, you want a right-handed guy who kills LHP or something.

by thejd44 on Oct 2, 2008 7:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

More to the point, why would he split time with Cust, who is good, when he could instead "split time"

with one of the A’s many, many terrible hitters?

I guarantee you a team with one of those batting and the other in the field is a better team than any permutation of the A’s with one of them on the bench.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 2, 2008 2:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

"Split time" doesnt necessarily mean platoon

You could have Giambi as DH, Barton at 1B and Cust in LF most days, or have Cust DH, Giambi at 1B, Cunningham/Buck in LF. There are many ways to get them both in the lineup and only have 1 of them in the field

"I was right and you were wrong." - Ray Fosse

by kbtoyz on Oct 3, 2008 11:04 AM PDT up reply actions  

I would love to see Giambi back in Oakland

Sweeney Cf
Cunningham Rf
Cust Lf
Barton 1b
Giambi Dh

Eveland rocks! Eveland rocks! Somewhere Drew Carey just smiled.

by miggyk2 on Oct 2, 2008 2:23 PM PDT reply actions  

OF

That OF is bad. Really, really bad. I hate Sweeney in CF. And where is Buck?

LF – Cust
CF – CarGon
RF – Buck/Sweeney
DH/1B/PH – Giambi

by Colorado Fan on Oct 2, 2008 2:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

I have a feeling Carlos will start the year in AAA

I forgot about Buck. Buck in RF even though I like Cunningham better. Sweeney is the only other option for CF unless you want to put Davis in CF, which is highly unlikely.

Eveland rocks! Eveland rocks! Somewhere Drew Carey just smiled.

by miggyk2 on Oct 2, 2008 2:40 PM PDT reply actions  

I'd like to see how Davis fares in some of the metrics

It’s quite possible that he’s good enough defensively to make up for his 80 OPS+. But for that to work, the rest of the A’s offense would need to not suck.

by thejd44 on Oct 2, 2008 7:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

I will say this

Faced with a choice between starting Ryan Sweeney and starting Rajai in center field, I would actually incline toward starting Rajai. Obviously this only applies if the A’s have 2 corner outfielders who would block Sweeney from otherwise starting there. (As of right now, that doesn’t appear to be the case, as Cunningham could probably use another half season in AAA and they haven’t signed any free agents. Could easily change though.)

Carlos Gonzalez would probably be better than either of them, though.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 2, 2008 10:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

I'd rather have Cunningham in the Emil Brown role than in AAA

Also I’d rather have him than Emil Brown.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Oct 3, 2008 12:11 AM PDT up reply actions  

the earlier season role or the later season role?

because later in the season, the only thing he did was sit on the pine. I’m not sure how that’s gonna help cunningham get acclimated to the bigs or get better with the bat. I’d rather have him play AAA until he can get a decent amount of at bats in the bigs.

'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long

by DyeLongJustice on Oct 3, 2008 7:52 AM PDT up reply actions  

If the A's want someone for that role,

wouldn’t Denorfia or Murton make more sense?

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 3, 2008 8:47 AM PDT up reply actions  

Emil got 402 AB despite not playing the last month. That's enough for Cunningham

to prove himself, and if he does he plays every day, and too many for Murton or Denorfia.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Oct 4, 2008 9:19 AM PDT up reply actions  

I would want giambi back, but i dont like the argument that the

“A’s brought back Canseco and he was way worse than Giambino”. Yes, maybe that’s true, but that’s not exactly affirming Giambi’s talent, more likely its affirming the A’s stupidity in the past, if u can call it that since he still had an OPS of 106. But in the end, yes Giambi would be more of a boon than a bane to this offense.

'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long

by DyeLongJustice on Oct 2, 2008 3:02 PM PDT reply actions  

I don't know. The A's need a good bat, but they need position players more than DH's.

And Giambi would be a DH, no doubt about it.

The Outfield is full already, so we can’t really go there, right?

We need a real 1B, 2B, SS and maybe 3B if Chavez can’t play. The A’s apparently think he will be able to though, but can we even count on Chavy at all anymore?

I think signing Raffy Furcal would be a good choice to play SS, then trade for Dan Uggla, and I guess stick with Barton at 1B for now.

If Chavez can not play 3B anymore, then we move him to 1B, put Uggla at 3B and put Pennington at SS. If Chavez can play 3B, we keep Uggla at 2B and play Barton at 1B.

facepalm.jpg

by Zonis on Oct 2, 2008 4:00 PM PDT reply actions  

Agreed. No more DH types

Or if you get a DH type you have to get rid of one.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Oct 2, 2008 4:30 PM PDT up reply actions  

Is Manny Ramirez in that group?

Eveland rocks! Eveland rocks! Somewhere Drew Carey just smiled.

by miggyk2 on Oct 2, 2008 5:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yep. I don't want Cust anywhere near the outfield

But there’s no way Manny Ramirez is coming here anyway, so it doesn’t matter.

Last of the Ninth - Photography Site / jamesvenes.com - Blog

by Flashfire on Oct 2, 2008 5:18 PM PDT up reply actions  

No more retreads

If we are going to spend for a free agent – get a guy with upside and more than a year or two left. Giambi would only make sense to round out a lineup that was bound for the playoffs – which we are most deffinately not. The conga-line of Thomas/M. Sweeney, Piazza just seemed like, well, lipstick on a pig.

Baja been here

by bajablue on Oct 2, 2008 4:30 PM PDT reply actions  

There's nobody else really on the FA market

that’s better than Giambi other than Teixeria (not happening) and Burrell. I feel more confident in Giambi being productive than Burrell at this point.

"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin

by Helloooo 1st on Oct 2, 2008 7:32 PM PDT up reply actions  

Dunn?

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 2, 2008 10:44 PM PDT up reply actions  

Unfortunately Beane's interview made that seem unlikely as well.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Oct 3, 2008 12:13 AM PDT up reply actions  

Forgot Dunn

Add him to the list. Of all of them Giambi seems the most realistic, unless of course they pick up his option in which case this whole thread can be disregarded.

"Their batters are patient to the point that it's annoying." -Ryan Franklin

by Helloooo 1st on Oct 4, 2008 2:40 AM PDT up reply actions  

I'm all for bringing back to prodigal son to Oakland

It’s been covered here on AN many times and I for one would love to have his bat in the lineup. This would add depth to the A’s lineup and certainly could not hurt the marketing campaign. Barton has not proved to me that he is ready to take the reigns full time at 1st base yet, so having Giambi in there would only help, in my humble opinion.

by mrod on Oct 2, 2008 6:02 PM PDT reply actions  

Bringing back an admitted... well, halfway admitted/lamely pseudo-denied, obviously lying

steroid user couldn’t hurt the marketing campaign?

I know, I know, the marketing campaign pretty much can’t get any worse. Fine. It sure doesn’t seem likely to IMPROVE the marketing.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 2, 2008 10:43 PM PDT up reply actions  

PT

I was not saying bringing back Giambi makes sense “only” for the marketing campaign. It was “in addtion to”, sir.

Steroids were part of Giambi’d resume’ while he was originally in Oakland anyway…………he is still a producer at the plate and always was a good hitter besides……..

What is your main beef with this????

by mrod on Oct 3, 2008 7:13 PM PDT up reply actions  

Nothing

I just find Giambi personally despicable. There’s nobody connected with the steroid scandal, in any way, who behaved more loathsomely than Giambi did.

This has nothing to do with my opinion of his baseball skills, BTW. But then, marketing campaigns rarely do either.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 3, 2008 11:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

Really?

I always thought he was the one that kind of stood up and admitted what he did. Compared to Raffy, he’s almost Honest Abe.

99 MPH with as much control as a deflating balloon - CurveballKing on H-Rod

by Scottbass on Oct 4, 2008 2:03 AM PDT up reply actions  

He never admitted using steroids to the public

only in testimony with the feds, remember?

He said, “Sorry, I made some mistakes”, but never said what he was apologizing for. Still, I think we all know very well why he was apologizing……..

by mrod on Oct 4, 2008 11:25 AM PDT up reply actions  

Probably should have been clearer...

but that’s what I meant. He couldn’t come out to the press and say it, but that “mistakes” line was obviously meant as a wink-wink, nudge-nudge admission. Which, to me, was far and away more than anyone else would cop to. And sort of honorable, from a certain point of view.

99 MPH with as much control as a deflating balloon - CurveballKing on H-Rod

by Scottbass on Oct 4, 2008 5:54 PM PDT up reply actions  

An admission,

but one that was designed to keep his ass out of a legal sling. I don’t blame him one bit.

"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer

by alox on Oct 4, 2008 10:58 PM PDT up reply actions  

I don’t think it’s worth it to bring Giambi back. He is..ok. The A’s don’t need another DH and I much rather have Barton or someone like that at 1st. Not Jason. Barton is developing still. It’s not like Giambi plays a good 1st baseman anyways. His upside on Barton is his power of course….but give Barton time to develop. Giambi is far from what he once was for the A’s

by ilovegregsmith on Oct 2, 2008 6:18 PM PDT reply actions  

i don't agree with the last sentence

and don’t feel it’s really that relevant, but i’m too drunk to post. i’ll get to that in the morning.

"If you hit .440 with 20 bombs, you don't have to do s---. You don't have to bring a glove to practice, just hit and leave whenever you want. You can bring a 40 and smoke a cigarette and call me from the parking lot asking me what time the game is, and I'll tell you. You can even say 'F--- you, Steve!' Actually, don't say that, that wouldn't be very nice." -Steve Friend, Head Coach, Chabot College Gladiators Baseball

by flipgatey3 on Oct 3, 2008 1:32 AM PDT up reply actions  

alright my thing is I was raised a yankees fan so I still watch about every yankees game and Giambi is one of those guys who hasn’t impressed me the last couple of years. At all. He is fine as a DH because he still has power but I don’t like seeing him at first base…but he doesn’t hit nearly as well while DHing as he does playing the field. So for someone who has been pushing for a new 1B for the Yankees…I think it might just be a pain in my ass to see him go to the other team I love lol
I have no issues with the whole steriod situation ..well, I do, but Jason is sorry lol and I don’t think Jason is a bad guy. Just hard for me to want him off 1 team..just to go to the other. No matter where he plays though I will pull for him and hope he has a good season.

by ilovegregsmith on Oct 3, 2008 11:21 AM PDT up reply actions  

id like to have him back.

i dont think he’s a perfect fit, i dont regard it as a move that makes us contenders, and i do realize that the move would have some drawbacks, but i want him back purely out of sentimental reasons.

i know he burned us and sold us out, but i have to say that after a while I felt bad for the guy during his vilification in ny. he was one of the few people that seem to be genuinely remorseful about his steroid usage, and i appreciated the guts he showed in taking that position. ive forgiven him, and i hope he can find success for a few years in oakland.

by oakinboston on Oct 3, 2008 7:56 AM PDT reply actions  

Absolutely.

I'm here to talk about the past.

by 67MARQUEZ on Oct 3, 2008 9:05 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah but if you have to sell SOME tickets to keep payroll up

Wouldn’t it be a good idea to get somebody the fans could get behind around. Let’s be honest, the Fremont deal came to a halt when the housing crisis hit. The entire way that deal was set up was that Lew could re-zone the area residential and build houses. Now there isn’t nearly enough money. If this falls through, and it is likely to, Lew has threatened action.

This team in order to be competitive at all needs fans to show up. And by trading all of the recognizebale players last season the common fan (nobody from this site) stopped coming. THIS IS A HUGE BUSINESS PROBLEM. And at the end of the day, economics are what run sports teams. So yes, Marketing and sentimentality with a fan base MATTER.

"I was right and you were wrong." - Ray Fosse

by kbtoyz on Oct 3, 2008 11:09 AM PDT up reply actions  

Plus

Giambi > Barton … at least for the next 2 years. In fact, I would recommend packaging Barton w/ some prospects to bring back a legitimate Middle Infielder (Uggla) or 3B. One of Doolitle or Carter (or Chavvy) can take over at 1B in 2011.

by Colorado Fan on Oct 3, 2008 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions  

The problem with Uggla...

Is that Billy has already said he doesn’t want to guve up prospects. The two most tradebale commidities on the team are Huston and Crosby, but Florida has no need for a SS or a closer. Hence, Uggla probably won’t be coming to the Bay anytime soon.

"I was right and you were wrong." - Ray Fosse

by kbtoyz on Oct 3, 2008 11:36 AM PDT up reply actions  

wait, crosby is one of the most tradeable? wasn't he TERRIBLE this year?

in a trade, i think he has more negative value than positive value.

'That's something we do...thirteen hits and not score'-Terrence Long

by DyeLongJustice on Oct 3, 2008 12:53 PM PDT up reply actions  

I guess by "tradebale"

I meant guys near the end of contracts, whom Billy is eager to unload. He could attempt to trade a starting pitcher, but I don’t think any of the young starters would generate any more pull than Crosby would.

"I was right and you were wrong." - Ray Fosse

by kbtoyz on Oct 3, 2008 2:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

Not with this fanbase they don't

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 3, 2008 1:48 PM PDT up reply actions  

If you mean AN, then okay

But corporate dollars won’t come in because corporations aren’t going to buy luxury boxes if their clients can’t recognize any player or have no real reason to come.

Also there are lots of casual fans, especially ones with small kids who stopped coming last season becuase of all the trades. That is undeniable. When you’re favorite player gets traded and you’re 6, you’re not going to want to convince Dad to bring you back. And why should Dad bring you if you’re crushed? The casual people who think its fun to go to the ballpark are going to go across the Bay or find other alternatives if there is nothing drawing them in, and frankly as much as I love this young team, they have yet to do anything to generate a name or brand for themselves.

"I was right and you were wrong." - Ray Fosse

by kbtoyz on Oct 3, 2008 2:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

Luxury boxes

In 2006 and 2007 I went to about a dozen games as a guest of various vendors who had luxury boxes. In 2008 I went to one. The vendors found that most guests wanted to come and see a team where they knew players, or had a chance of winning. They used their “customer schmoozing” dollars for other events and activities (I asked).

The luxury boxes are bought by corporations that want to give a treat to their (mostly) casual fans.

I brought my “Hooray for the Who They A’s” sign.

by NotJohnnyDamon on Oct 3, 2008 8:37 PM PDT up reply actions  

It would probably help if there was some luxury in the luxury boxes as well

Not that I give a rip, but they’re pretty much like the rest of the stadium except with a carpet. Or at least they were the last time I was in one, which was 3-4 years ago.

by jdr on Oct 4, 2008 11:27 PM PDT up reply actions  

Which would sell more...

A big name, high payroll team in THIS ballpark or
the 2008 team in a new ballpark?

Enjoy the game

by DCinWC on Oct 3, 2008 3:54 PM PDT reply actions  

If the new ballpark...

was in Downtown Oakland or just North of the current location, then I’d go for the 2008 team.

I don’t think it will matter what team they field in Fremont. If they think they’ll fill the place, they are delusional.

by NotJohnnyDamon on Oct 3, 2008 8:41 PM PDT up reply actions  

You underestimate the power of the tarp.

[Crosby] "Guy that has driven in some big runs for the A's over the years" - Vince Cotroneo

by WaddellCanseco on Oct 4, 2008 9:21 AM PDT up reply actions  

Giambi? No thank you.

The steroid thing doesn’t bother me so much, but I still have hard feelings toward him for the manner in which he left. I glad he still doesn’t have a WS ring.

"If I've got baggage, he's got a whole set of Louis Vuitton." ~ Milton Bradley on Barry Bonds

by UncleLeo on Oct 4, 2008 9:45 PM PDT reply actions  

Call me irrational and silly

but I have been counting the years of Giambi’s Yankee contract and taken satisfaction every time he didn’t even the title he was counting on when going to New York.

His reputation, of course, has taken a deserved beating because of steroids.

I don’t feel a passionate dislike for Giambi. He actually seems like a decent guy, based on the comments of his teammates. His vulnerability has softened my perspective.

I wouldn’t passionately hate it if Giambi came back, but I don’t really see the point of bringing in an old DH whose performance, if good, would raise familiar suspicions.

by bear88 on Oct 6, 2008 11:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

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