Forget "Who's The MVP?" - What's The MVP?
by Nico on Sep 4, 2007 8:09 AM PDT
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PrintMajor league baseball really needs to clarify the intent behind its various awards. The Cy Young award, at least is clear: The award is given to the East Coast pitcher with the best run support. Fine, got it.
The Comeback Player of the Year award, however, needs some work. I keep hearing that Carlos Peña is a strong candidate for Comeback Player of the Year. Remind me again, what is Carlos Peña coming back from? Being a disappointment every single year for five years and then finally not being terrible? Heck of a comeback, kid.
Look, if you want the award to be available to every player, whether or not they were ever injured, or are coming back from anything, of any kind, in any way, at all, then just call it the “Most Improved Player Award”. We all know that award well—it’s the award the clumsy kid gets on youth teams where the league says that everyone has to get an award. Rocco gets the MVP award, Jocko gets the award for leading his team in scoring, Studz gets the award for best defense, and the clumsy kid gets “Most Improved” because this year he didn’t trip Jocko on a breakaway layup.
Carlos Peña can win the Most Improved Player Award, no problem. But Comeback Player of the Year? C’mon. Go stink it up next year, or better yet try to break something, and we’ll consider you in 2009.
All of which brings me (and it only took 5 paragraphs) to the MVP award, in which no one really knows what the “V” part is supposed to mean. If “valuable” means best, then the award should go to Alex Rodriguez, who is the league’s best player this year. A-Rod wins the MBP award: Most Bestest Player. But if “valuable” means “most amazing season,” then the award should to Magglio Ordoñez. Guys hit 50 HRs occasionally, but power hitters just don’t hit .360. Ordoñez wins the MASD award: Most Awesome Season, Dude! But if “valuable” means you had the most value to your team, then the award should probably go to Vlad Guerrero. Without A-Rod, the Yankees are still an excellent offensive team with suspect pitching, and without Ordoñez, the Tigers will still score a lot of runs and the pitching won’t be any worse. Even with these guys, the Yanks and Tigers have a chance to stay home in October. Without Vlad, where would the Angels be? So Vlad wins the…what should we call this one?...ah, the MVP: Most Valuable Player. Though he isn’t most awesome, or bestest. This award needs some work.
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hi nico
going back arbitrarily to 1985, ALCY 11 west 10 east. most improved comeback whatever pretend award who cares. i gave up on MVP awards first when a certain mjordan in another sport didn't win it every year. and, second, when our own jkidd didn't win it every year after his airness retired.
Bigger Question
Who cares who MLB gives the award to? And I don't mean that in a "who cares about baseball, it's just a game" kind of way. I just don't understand why it matters as long as you have your set-in-stone definition and can form your opinions from there.
MVP is always going to have a dozen different definitions. Find one you like the most and stick with it.
For this year, I would give the MVP to A-Rod. He's having his best year as a Yankee and he's doing it under greater scrutiny than anyone else in baseball. On top of that, he's the main reason the Yankees are still contending, despite their injuries and pitching problems.
Put ARod on this A's tem and the A's instantly become playoff contenders. Take ARod off the Yankees and they're battling the Orioles instead of the Mariners.
by black beane and rice on Sep 4, 2007 9:07 AM PDT reply actions
Vlad...
As much as I dislike the Angel's because there is just no way they should be this good, I have to agree with the fact that Vlad should get the MVP award, IF the "v" is truly meaning Valuable. The best way I heard it put was by Colin Cowherd, without Vlad the Angels are just a AAA offensive team.
I completely agree
with both you and Nico. I really look forward to the day when the Angels no longer have Guerrero. Their offense is all about Vlad. Kendrick is going to be a quality player and continue to get better, but most of the rest of their can't miss prospects have done little to make me believe that they're going to be able to survive once Vlad rides off into the distance.
The Angels might just be where the A's are without Guerrero.
by Tyler Bleszinski on Sep 4, 2007 12:48 PM PDT up reply actions
And it's why you don't give up
on a season prematurely during those June, July, August months. The Angels could always lose Vlad and start playing .400 ball for a while. The A's don't have any player nearly as good as Vlad, but they also aren't dependent on one guy as much as the Angels are.
Disagree ...
why does it matter that Vlad's best helpers are pitchers and A-Rod's best helpers are hitters?
With each player, both teams are on track for 90+ wins. Without them, their teams would be closer to .500.
A-Rod is better than Vlad. He is more valuable to his team.
I disagree with, but understand, the idea that in order to be an MVP, a player's contributions need to come on a contender (that isn't on its way to 110+ wins) and that clutch performances (whether due to talent or luck) add to that ...
The Angels would have a wretched offense without Vlad -- true. But they would still have a heck of a pitching staff.
The Yanks would still have a good offense without A-Rod -- true. But it would not be good enough to overcome their sub-par pitching staff.
1962 Mets
In their first season the Mets were 40-122. Howard Cosell was still a local broadcaster doing Mets pre- and post-game shows. The Mets for some unknown reason decided to pick a team MVP -- Richie Ashburn. Cosell questionned whether the Mets could not have won 40 games "...without Mr. Ashburn."
by NoeValley on Sep 4, 2007 10:15 AM PDT reply actions
Cy Young to East coast with run support??
Last 5 years:
- Johan Santana and Brandon Webb
- Vartolo Colon and Chris Carpenter
- Johan Santana and Roger Clemens (Houston)
- Roy Halladay and Eric Gagne
- Randy Johnson (Arizona) and Barry Zito
So exactly ONE East Coast pitcher (Halladay) of the last 10. Where does the East Coast/Run support comment even come from?
I'm still not over Steve Stone
stealing the award from Mike Norris in 1980. Those wounds run deep.
I think you could just say
Best run support, period, ties to be broken by distance from New York City.
Right....
One Met and One Yankee Cy Young in the last 25 years.....Good call.
by OaktownPower on Sep 4, 2007 11:47 AM PDT up reply actions
Friggin Steve Stone....
I loved Mike Norris.
by OaktownPower on Sep 4, 2007 11:47 AM PDT up reply actions
totally deflated
I won Most Improved once...Are those rumors about the Tooth Fairy and Santa Claus true?
That they had an affair?
Yes.
Comeback lost all credibility when ...
... they let a certain performance-enhancing pharmaceutical sponsor it -- and then gave it to performance-enhanced Jason Giambi over Ellis.
Maybe the corporate sponsor would finally deem it fitting for MaEl to win this year, as the player most-screwed by the Award system?
I, for one,
am quite impressed by the fact that Giambi was able to put his confidence-depleting ball-shrinkage behind him and return to form. Ellis did not have to deal with the psychological pain of his manhood being shaken to the core.
Most fitting for a Yankee.
by The Dogfather on Sep 4, 2007 11:56 AM PDT up reply actions
the player most-screwed by the Award system
Perhaps Alyssa Milano should sponsor it.
the idea of a-rod as an mvp of anything is funny
much like bonds, he's an absolute liability to any team with hopes of playoff success. in the meantime, let's not forget just how mediocre a team the yankees are this year, and how much the culture created by a-rod is the foundation of that. if the giants replace one with the other, no one should be shocked when he makes the league transition less gracefully than even zito.
as for 'comeback' player, any one on the whitesox will do. no, wait, that's backwards...
The ChiSox should win the award sponsored by ...
... whatever they give you when you call your doctor after four hours.
by The Dogfather on Sep 4, 2007 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions
Bullshit
"let's not forget just how mediocre a team the yankees are this year"
With 802 runs scored and a team line of .289/.363/.824 (all MLB-leading) we could sure use some of that mediocrity in our batting.
by green star oakland on Sep 4, 2007 3:29 PM PDT up reply actions
I just think it's funny that anyone
is questioning A-Rod's value to a team in a year where he has been so tremendous. The guy is hitting over .300, leading the league by far in HRs, and has put up astounding RBI totals all year. "An absolute liability to any team with hopes of playoff success"? On what planet?
Oh, come on
Everyone knows he chokes when it counts-- in the 9th inning (except this year when he's batting like 1.363) and the playoffs (except for the 50% of the series in which he hits like a man possessed). You know how I know he's a loser? The teams he's on lose like FORTY FIVE PERCENT of their games. What the hell? In fact, that unclutch choker is such a loser no one should even bother offering him a contract.
Unfortunately Billy Beane has decided that choking losers are the new undervalued commodity.
unsupported comments
where are your facts and numbers?
Anecdotal info. The worst kind.
by One won lost won on Sep 4, 2007 5:11 PM PDT up reply actions
refresh my memory
how did a-rod do in his last two postseason series?
Forget that
How did he do in his LAST TWO AT-BATS?
0 FOR 2 ZOMG ChOKER!!!1
Bad, but...
How did A-Rod do in the FIVE postseason series before those last two?
http://www.baseball-reference.com/r/...
Pretty good, I see...
by FormerHuntsvilleStar on Sep 4, 2007 6:59 PM PDT up reply actions
wow, that's a lot of playoff appearances
he must have at least one ring what with all of those great teams and nosebleed payrolls... right?
Get rid of that "valuable" adjective in MVP
and the "Most" too!
Why don't they create some name like "The Conn-Smythe Trophy" for "greatest impact" and other vague words, to be given to one player after the regular season, as voted upon by his peers, NOT friggin' SPORTSWRITERS!!
I dislike reading about these awards, puffed up by the self-important media, and add onto by agents (i.e., extra $100k if you come in 5th in MVP voting, etc).
by One won lost won on Sep 4, 2007 5:08 PM PDT reply actions
I like the idea of getting rid of
the "V" and the "M" but if you just had the Player award, Cal Ripkin would have won it, like, 15 years in a row.
Game lineup is on Yahoo
the A's lineup is the same as it's been for days, except that Bowen will start as catcher (batting ninth).
So be it, but
it's typically American (though MLB players are only by majority, of the "Fifty States Origin" group) to switch to "something completely different...."
So I think players would probably make some interesting picks, year in and year out.
by One won lost won on Sep 4, 2007 7:09 PM PDT up reply actions
The MVP award is a farce...
...or at least the reasoning by many of the voters is. They are looking to find the best/valuable/whatever individual in the league, so they use every TEAM-DEPENDENT statistic available to figure it out, whether it's RBIs, runs scored or wins.
Is it the player most valuable to his team, or the team most valuable to the player?
by FormerHuntsvilleStar on Sep 4, 2007 7:04 PM PDT reply actions
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