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Heckle and Jekyll

I hope you'll pardon me for a more general, not specifically A's-related, baseball issue.

Monkeyball, you SUCK! Go back to your tree!

I myself have never really understood the impulse to heckle players at the ballpark.

Hey, JUNKYball! Yeah, you, FUR-FACE! Haw haw haw!

To boo, sure -- to add one's vocal thrum to the Great Wordless Chorus of Disapprobation for the Opposition; that I can understand.

Unnuhstan THIS, you suckin' monkey suck sucker!

But to go to the ballpark and yodel imprecations at players on the field or in the bullpens? That I just. Don't. Get.

Get BENT, you person not of my ethnic heritage!

Now, to be fair, there is certainly in anyone's (especially, say, my) posting at AN an element of the class clown making armpit-fart noises: the self-aggrandizement of the bon mot, the mal mot, the witty or witless rejoinder -- even the nerdy, numerate natterings of the Sabermetric Sporks among us have at their most base impulse a degree of this.

Hey, SHAKESPEARE! Uh -- SHUT UP! Ha! Ha!

And one could also argue that my privileging of the literate, literary, and logical modes of expression itself represents a sort of prejudicial classism, a sort of poll tax on ballyard enfranchisement.

Hey Professor! Can you spell 'shit'?

There's also the fact that, while heckling is rude both to the recipients of the opprobrium and to the fellow fans in the vicinity, it's a mostly victimless act and one that is certainly less harmful than other traditional demonstrations of (mostly male) catharsis (such as, say, kicking one's dog).

Kick THIS, you epicene, late-imperial Sybarite!

Nonetheless, I personally find heckling to be an activity entirely outside of my worldview.

So I open it up to y'all:

  • Do you heckle? If so, why? If not, why not?
  • Is heckling acceptable ballpark behavior? If so, why is it acceptable at the game but not elsewhere in society?
  • Do you enjoy/appreciate other folks' clever and/or scatological heckling?
  • Do you heckle hecklers?
  • Do you heckle heckler-hecklers?

0 recs  |  Comment 36 comments

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Sometimes I heckle

but its only good if its witty.

by Zonis on Aug 18, 2007 10:55 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I think its fine as long as its in good taste

If thats your thing. That being said, I think it depends alot on the atmosphere of that particular game and situation. I think if you are sitting around a bunch of rowdy college kids drinking beer on a thursday night, that lots of stuff good fly, as long as its not racist or overall vulgar in nature. But I also think that on a Sunday afternoon, little league day, that hecklers should really pay attention to the reaction of the kids and parents around him before he starts blasting the players wife or something of that nature. I always hate it, if im in a section where this is taking place, because I always feel semi obligated to tell the dude to shut up, but at the same time I don't go to A's games to get into fights, I go to relax and have a good time, and watch an exciting(sometimes) team play quality AL ball...

"I Will Not Relent, I Am Driven"... Clutch
Bring Back The Bash!!!

by Shippee33 on Aug 18, 2007 11:04 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

personally, I prefer honesty in hecklers

The heckles I find "appropriate" in their honesty:

  • "Hey, Player X, you're not of my ethnic heritage!"
  • "Hey, Player X, I am envious that your incredible wealth enables you to pork vacuous hotties that are inaccessible to me!!"
  • "I am extremely drunk!!!"
  • "I am frustrated and disappointed by my status in life!!!!"
It's hard to hate someone who helps me pay the rent. ~ mdl @('.')@

by monkeyball on Aug 18, 2007 11:14 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Heckling is like poetry

The 5% of it which is good is brilliant, entertaining and educational and thought provoking.  The other 95% is self-indulgent dreck which makes me embarrassed for the author.

I love a good heckler...if only you had to have some sort of permit first, proving you could do it right.  Call it a License to Ill.

"Ziggy, did you not know?"

by FreeSeatUpgrade on Aug 18, 2007 11:08 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Agree 100%
"We've come a long way, and I'm not talking about Virginia Slims, either." - Art Howe

by EastCoastA on Aug 18, 2007 11:26 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Heckling is an aquired art or skill...

If it's done right even the object of scorn finds amusement in it because it's funny.  I think of it as the sketch artist who does caricatures.  For instance, I give you a line I heard delivered to The Great Jeter.  The Heckler informed Jeter that he had sampled his new fragrance and found that the star and the scent had something in common.  They were both overpriced and didn't smell that good.  

A good Heckler can achieve notoriety...ala Tampa Bay and the fan known simply as the "The Heckler."  It's funny, harmless, and not much of a verbal nuisance to   the fans around him, plus it's not personal in nature to the player.  

Most of the heckling though leaves much to be desired.  A torrent of foul language that is neither clever or witty and fueled by alcohol.  It's more fun to see them tossed from the park.  

As for me, it's a practice I never engage in.  I wold not be good at it.  As long as a modicum of respect and decency is maintained I don't have a problem with it.  

"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer

by alox on Aug 18, 2007 11:11 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

my favorite taunt ever heard at a baseball game

"What are you standing around for?  This isn't an Enya concert!!"

Go A's!!

by Phineas Quinn on Aug 18, 2007 11:17 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

in a similar vein...

Hey, swing the bat!  You're not a statue until you've got pigeon shit on your shoulders!

"The more self-centered and egotistical a guy is, the better ballplayer he's going to be."- Bill "The Spaceman" Lee

by The Pilots Dared Me To Die on Aug 18, 2007 11:27 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

alcohol
makes people stupid

by kvn on Aug 18, 2007 11:30 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Disagree.

Alcohol merely liberates people who are already stupid at heart.  Unfortunately, I can count myself among their number on more occasions than I care to admit.

"You may glory in a team triumphant, but you fall in love with a team in defeat."--The Boys of Summer

by alox on Aug 18, 2007 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well said my friend

Very well said...

"I Will Not Relent, I Am Driven"... Clutch
Bring Back The Bash!!!

by Shippee33 on Aug 18, 2007 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

QOTM!
Truer words never spoken.
Yep. Warm and fuzzy... that's me.

by grover on Aug 18, 2007 6:05 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Alcohol at the games

I've noticed at the last few A's games I've been to that no beer vendors have been roaming the stands. These are also the only A's games where I haven't been sitting far too close to some drunk idiot. Is there a connection?

by Sacko Tomatoes on Aug 18, 2007 2:04 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

There haven't been beer vendors since 1987

in any California stadium, by law.  So the drunk idiots are avoiding you for some other reason.

"Ziggy, did you not know?"

by FreeSeatUpgrade on Aug 18, 2007 4:42 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Nope, didn't know
Not being a beer drinker, I never paid attention until a trip to Wrigley last year, when every other vendor sold beer. Well, there goes my great theory! (And not knowing will give me the bad karma to be seated right next to a drunk idiot next game.) sigh

by Sacko Tomatoes on Aug 19, 2007 3:04 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Pretty much agree with what's been said so far

The occasional good heckle can be a lot of fun; 95% of it is stupid and sometimes offensive.

I am never in favor of being mean. I think good heckling is done in good spirit--might even make the target laugh. Sometimes when Chad Gaudin is pitching, I just want to trot out onto the field and hand him a compass. Not to be mean, just to help.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 18, 2007 11:49 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

My favorite I've heard thus far...

"Hey <Player>, you lucked out with the steroid testing! They don't test for Estrogen!"

by Zonis on Aug 18, 2007 12:13 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Sometimes Heckling helps

Heckling is part of the game. It's gotten worse over the years but that more a reflection of society as a whole. My favorite heckle was back in 1988. Storm Davis, already my least favorite player, had just given up 7 runs in the first inning. I sit right above the dug out and as he walked back to it looking dejected I opined "Nice batting practice Davis". This sent him over the edge. He threw his hat off, pitched his glove into the dugout and unleash a long string of four letter insults at me.

The next morning all the papers had picked up the exchange and wrote articles about it. But my favorite headline was "Fan Storms Davis" in the SF chronicle.

By the way he went on to pitch a no hitter the rest of the game and we won.

by Trainwreck on Aug 18, 2007 12:31 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Heckling

My brother and I went to a game with the Royals in 1984 (I think it was this one), and we sat in the center field bleachers. Willie Wilson was playing CF for the Royals, and had only been re-instated a month earlier after having been suspended for being jailed for attempting to buy cocaine. Some jackass sitting near by was on Willie's case all game:
"Hey Willie, you're looking a little slow Willie, need some 'caine, Willie?"
It was (maybe) funny once, but after a couple of innings I wanted to jam a broken bat handle into his piehole. I actually felt sorry for Willie since he probably had to deal with this everywhere they went that season.

To echo many of the above comments, heckling is fine as long as it is funny, otherwise, STFU.

"Has Kotsay tried using a bat?" - ozzman99

by doctorK on Aug 18, 2007 1:10 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

projectile scatological heckling?
A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Aug 18, 2007 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Heckling

I don't heckle, and I don't enjoy being around people who do. It basically ruins the game experience for me. If I want to show disapproval, booing seems to do just fine. The player usually has a good idea what they've done to deserve it, and if they don't, heckling isn't going to clue them in. (My only exception is the intentional walk, which always deserves a heckle of "chicken!" grin)

As to booing, even that is reserved for special circumstances. A handful of arrogant players rate boos just for appearing at the ballpark. (My currently active list only has four on it, so this is a pretty rare instance.) A really bad call deserves a boo. Intentionally hitting a player with a pitch deserves a boo.

by Sacko Tomatoes on Aug 18, 2007 1:31 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

The biggest reason I only go to 2-3 games a year

To me, there's something cowardly about antagonizing someone who can't or is unlikely to retaliate.  Unless the heckler is in one of the first couple of rows, the hecklee probably can't even tell who is heckling them. It reminds me of an ugly, faceless mob. Gives me the creeps.

Plus, the vast majority of the time, the heckling consists of "You Suck", "You're a girl" or "Go back to ___". Solid.

I was at Fenway as a 9-year-old and this guy behind me kept yelling "Rice, you're a bum!". Eventually, Jim Rice hits a 3-run homer. After the cheering dies down, the guy yells out, "Rice, you're still a bum!". My disdain for heckling was born . . .

Storage is for business, or for family.

by bloodsweatndonuts on Aug 18, 2007 1:36 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree.

To me, there's something cowardly about antagonizing someone who can't or is unlikely to retaliate.

You often hear players say, "If they'd only say that to my face." Most fans will say whatever they want until confronted. Then they're not so bold. Piazza getting hit by the fan comes to mind.

He's not going to try to kill you, I'm just going to try to doink you. -Rex Hudler

by JediLeroy on Aug 18, 2007 2:49 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

If you read history

such as Henry Thomas' "Walter Johnson  Baseball's Big Train" you'll see that heckling was used in the past to play with the mind of the opposing players.  Back then, without music, without PA, the fans were much more involved with the players.  Heckling was an outgrowth refinement of the "tenth man" advantage a home team could have.

What role could the crowd play in the old days?  In the 1903 World Series, the Boston crowd along the RF line was only held back by a rope.  If a Red Sox player hit a fair ball into the right field foul area, the crowd as a group would push the rope right up to the line without getting on the field.  The Pirate right fielder would have to shove his way through the fans to get to the "in play" ball.

Imagine the insults and verbage flying at that player, from mere arms-length away!

If a Pirate batter hit a similar ball, the crowd at the rope pulled back and gave their Boston player plenty of access to the ball.

Small town games were loaded with betting, and so the crowds took every opportunity to "tilt the table".

Consider this passage, page 22, from the above-mentioned book:

"  Four innings into the game Weiser held a surprising 4-0 lead.  As Johnson walked to the mound for the fifth, several Caldwell rooters came down from the stands and walked onto the field, verbally accosting the first baseman, Weiser Deputy Sheriff Lafe Lansdon.  He gave it right back to them, but more fans came over and a shouting match ensued.  Lansdon's brother Bob, the Weiser sheriff and manager of the baseball team ("both fine big western types, " Johnson described the Lansdon brothers), walked over to order them away.  Suddenly Lafe Lansdon was struck in the eye, and he retaliated.  Set upon by two others, he knocked them to the ground, whereupon a general pandemonium broke loose.  "A free-for-all if there ever was one, " Johnson characterized the fight.  He stayed on the mound while the action swirled all around him.  "'You ain't much on roughin' it, is you?' was the remark of a hard-looking customer who walked up alongside of me in the box," he remembered.  "'To tell the truth, my friend,' I replied, 'I just joined the club, and I don't know which are our players and which are yours.'"

That story to me epitomizes the origins of heckling, and the current "long distance" anonymous version is a mere pitiful vestige of a creation from long ago.

Nowadays, it is much more the idea of a fan rewarding his own ego than affecting the play on the field.  The above stories so attest.

"I never predict anything, and I never will." Paul Gascoigne, English footballer

by One won lost won on Aug 18, 2007 1:40 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

we could always pretend we're Angels fans

and throw water bottles instead

Go A's!!

by Phineas Quinn on Aug 18, 2007 2:00 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Well..

I absolutely will never heckle my own team's players. I've always liked heckling the visiting relievers as they warm up in the 'pen. I find that most heckling occurs when I'm actually playing in a game, because my wife is there. She is the best heckler I know. Umps make really bad calls sometimes in our city softball league, and she lets them know it. Many umps have threatened to eject her if she doesn't quiet down. It's funny, because I have a short fuse during competitive sports. Yet I sometimes have to remind her that it's just a game.

I'm really not a fan of the "you suck" chants. I know that these people get paid millions of dollars to perform, but that doesn't mean that they don't have feelings. I wouldn't want thousands of people to chant in unison that I suck.

If you heckle Albert Pujols after he hits a homer, that's one thing. My grandmother hits better home runs! and Hey, Poo Hole, you can take your 1.500 OPS and shove it! are perfectly acceptable to me, because they show that you are displeased with the fact that they are so good at what they do. It feels awful to fail, though, and having fans ridicule you for failure is too much, unless it's obvious that you're not even trying.

He's not going to try to kill you, I'm just going to try to doink you. -Rex Hudler

by JediLeroy on Aug 18, 2007 2:06 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

agree with general consensus

(sp?)

I think there are some really quality hecklers in Oakland, one favorite being shortly after Freddy (i think it was Freddy... no wait, Anthonio?) Sanchez was reinstated after being suspended for failing the illegal substance test:

"Dirty Sanchez!" (clap, clap, clap-clap-clap)...

...totally clean if you're under thirteen, one would hope at least.

Also, my favorite general heckle I learned from the Simpsons' "All-Star" episode:

"DAAAAAAAAA-rryl.... DAAAAAAAAA-rryl.... "

This past May I sat near LF and did that to Garrett Anderson, in part because I was embarrassed for a fan seated a few rows behind me who, in full-A's gear, was heckling Bobby Crosby all game. Crosby hit his 1st HR of the season a few innings later, and naturally once the applause died down, hometown guy shouts "You still suck!"

In the words of Bugs Bunny, what an embarrassmenk.

I can't comprehend loud heckling of the home team. Sure, under my breath I've said many things about certain A's, but heckling them? I just don't get it.

So a few "GAAAAAAAAAA-rrrett...."s later, some other fans joined in, and in my opinion, our solidarity showed up the 'Crosby sucks' guy as genuinely simple as possible. Garrett misplayed a ball later in the game.

Bob Geren, on 8/2/07, on the success of Alan Embree as new interim closer: "What can I say,... he's been our Steady Tremendous Bullpen Man"

by popcornjames on Aug 18, 2007 3:25 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Heckling is good clean fun

I love to heckle, but the best ones are always clean. A few years ago, I almost got tossed for telling Raul Mondesi he had a fat belly. He told security I said something I didn't, but after I and everyone in my section explained, they let me off the hook. Some of the better ones I've heard.....
HEY POO HOLE, to Albert Pujols
I SAW SWORDFISH AND THEY LOOKED GREAT! at David Justice
WHAT'S BJ STAND FOR? To BJ Surhoff
Also, a lady friend of mine called Billy Koch "Cockmaster" right to his face while he warmed up for the Jays....same game I called Mondesi fat, but nobody said word one to her....go figure.

by jzito75 on Aug 18, 2007 4:46 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Absolutely Not!

How can it be helpful to one's home team?  People know when they've screwed up.

And it's not sporting for the opposition.  Heckling has always seemed to be to merely be an expression of the worst part of our natures.

And it tends to have racial undertones (though this is obviously not always the case.)  

Count me out on heckling.

by DiegoSegui on Aug 18, 2007 5:29 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

Forgive me . . .

. . . I've posted this before.  But since heckling is the topic, I'll repeat my favorite.  Early 80s, Tigers in town, beautiful, sun-soaked day, I'm in the bleachers (when we had REAL bleachers), Chet Lemon is trotting leisurely out to center between innings, and this guy holding two lemons in each hand stands up and hollers, "Hey Chet.  I've got your wife and kids here!"  Lemon, to his credit, cracked up (he always struck me as a very classy guy) and so did the rest of us.  Beautiful.  

by camperdog on Aug 18, 2007 5:48 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I saw a similar thing with

Carl Ustcondum, but it wasn't quite as funny.

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 18, 2007 5:53 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

I'm an overeducated urban intellectual heckler

And I'm pro-heckling, or as I prefer to think of it, pro-making witty remarks in a reasonably audible tone of voice.   That's why I generally sit in the left field bleachers, where we have our own standards of decorum.   I don't heckle or boo our own players.  I don't generally join in the boring chants of "Whatsamatta with player X?  he's a bum!" or "X sucks", except of course when it applies to the Yankees.   I have on one occasion yelled at another A's fan for racist heckling.  I consider heckling to be part of the fan's job, like cheering, clapping, playing drums, waving flags, doing silly dances whe you're on the Jumbotron, keeping score, and substituting "and the home of the A's" in the national anthem.  Not everyone needs to do all of these things at every game, but at least some of the fans should do each of them.   It's not Davies Symphony Hall or Grace Cathedral, it's a ballpark.  

Disclaimer: I haven't given up on the 2007 season.

by Englishmajor on Aug 18, 2007 10:20 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

You don't heckle at Davies Symphony Hall?

I sure do. "You call that a violin solo? Sounds more like the sound my cat makes when she coughs up the absurd kind of money they're charging for these seats, you hackneyed concerto wannabe! And whassa matter with the clarinetist? I've passed gas that sounded better than that! BOOOOOOOO!!!!!"

I like Cindi. A. She never pretends to know more than she does. B. She has unbridled enthusiasm for her "Hotties," and isn't afraid to show it. -IM4Oakgal

by Nico on Aug 18, 2007 10:55 PM PDT up reply actions   0 recs

Neither pro nor con

I only like heckling when it's done with wit and without getting too crude or personal. "You suck!" doesn't do it for me, and I usually find attacks on a player's ancestry or personal life to be disgusting.

On the other hand, on Kenny Rogers' first start at the Coliseum after he attacked that cameraman, I yelled just before the first pitch, "Hey, Kenny! Smile, you're on Candid Camera!"

-- Jeff Lichtman, AKA Swazoo Koolak

by swazoo on Aug 19, 2007 12:51 AM PDT reply actions   0 recs

I like clever stuff, and will try to contribute

... some when the spirit moves.  

I'll try to bother some guys -- like calling Sosa "Corky," fer instance.  And when the Angels were all worried about the condition of the mound last season, I tried to keep them focussed on it after every "ball" call.  

Also like telling GMJunior that his Daddy was better ('cuz he was).

Some faves I've heard:

"Hey Franky, take a chair!"  when Francisco was removed.

"Hey Jason, hit it with your wallet!" after a weak ground-out.  

To Palmeiro: "Hey Raffie: Call Alice!"

The meaning of life is not so much 'found,' as it is 'made.' --Opus

by The Dogfather on Aug 19, 2007 12:11 PM PDT reply actions   0 recs

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