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Why I miss Miquel and Ramon

Does anyone else ever miss Miguel Tejada and Ramon Hernandez? I got to thinking about the improbable dream it would be to get those guys back and how to make it happen.  I think the SS and C positon are the weakest links on our team.  Why dream about the future when I can reminise about the past.  

Now we all know we can't afford Miguel.  The Orioles seem to want to shop him every year after there post all-star tank job and I figure why not.  I think a package of Harden, Crosby and (insert 5th starter here) would get the job done.

Star-divide

The Orioles really need the pitching.  They are never going to compete in the East without it.  Athough there team ERA is a middle of the pack 4.5, they get to play the Sox and Yanks 28 more times this year and 36 times every year.  They are never going to consistantly outhit them and will for sure not outspend them.  They really need to take a chance and get a potential Cy Young/Ace in Harden who could win anygame, anytime and an upgrade on there 3rd/4th starter both of whom have ERA's over 4.5.  They would get a SS back, could eat a little of Miguel's contract and still save a little scratch to boot.

Now we might miss Harden IF he stays healthy and IF he turns into the dominate perrinial Cy Young canidate we all know he can be.  But the reality is we can probably plug in another guy with a 3.5 ERA to take his place.  It's also likely his highest value will end up being an 8th inning set-up guy who occasionally closes games for us.  He could become a Rollie Fingers and come in to pitch the 7th inning on when there is 2 men on, no outs and we need 3 strikeouts fast.  But there is no guy like that now and no manager even has seriously tryed it in a long time.

Now Miguel hit .330 last year, hits lots of jacks and averaged 115 RBI's over the last seven seasons.  He never misses a game.  He's was a great clubhouse guy for us and always had a smile on his face.  Bobby, since being called up in late 2003 has hit .240, hit 45 HR's and driven in 156 Runs.....in his whole career.  Where do we get the extra money to absorb his contract? Start with the 7 mill we will save by not (please god) having Kendell on the team next year.

Now Ramon would be easyer (cost wise).  More pitching and a catching prospect ought to do it.  We probably have 2 or 3 guys (out of 5 or 6 prospects) in the minors/bullpen who could start for other teams in the majors.  That's the reality for the team that has the best ERA (around 3.2)in the American League.  It means we are holding people back who would have had a chance with Texas, Tampa, K.C, and many other teams long ago.  The River-cats have the 3rd best ERA in the P.C.L. out of sixteen teams.  It would be up to Baltomore to figure out which 2 or 3 to gamble on.  Or up to us to give up someone more valuable and take that gamble ourselves.  

Last year Ramon hit 29 doubles, 23 HR, and drove in 90+. That's 23 more doubles, 23 more HR's and about 50 more RBI's than Kendall can expect. Do we really want to give Kendell another 400 AB's to find out if his projections are wrong?  Last year Ramon had an impressive 42 caught basesteelers out of 97 trys.  This year Kendell has caught 9 out of 34 and has currently missed 22 in a row.  

How many one run games could we have won with another HR or double here or there. How many games will we lose with 25-50 of the other teams guys on second instead of first over the season as team after team will take advantage of him.  Especially in the playoffs where that one run will be so very crucial and they will be running wild.  We have lost 5 one-run games and 4 two-run games already this season out of 17 losses,  and the season is only 1/5th over.  Jack Cust's daily HR and the offense pretending its great not-whithstanding, we could use the upgrade in these two spots.  Why watch us lose 20-30 games 3-2 or 4-2 if we can help it.  

I know this is just a dream as this is not the A's way.  It's not like we ever won much (Tejada should have been awarded home no matter what he did/din't do or how he did/didn't do it. Screw those umps, at the very least he should have been on third) with them anyways.  The costs probalby wouldn't work out and far beit for the A's to overspend.  It would take one big trade to get them both and with the way the bullpen has pitched latley mabey we would give up too much.  I never appriciated Hernandez when we had him, I always liked Miggy,  but in hind-site we were sure spoiled with those guys.  I don't think the A's miss any other players we let go but sometimes I sure miss those guys.

Poll
Do you think trading for Miguel and Ramon would be good for the A's?
Yes. We would have a shot at the World Series.
3 votes
Yes. Harden, Crosby and all those whiney wana-be fifth starters can get traded for whatever
2 votes
Who cares. Billy would never trade for hi- priced offensive talent. Your a closet Yankee fan
9 votes
I wish we would have found a way to have keep Tejada and let Chavez go in the first place. That guy couldn't drive in a guy on third with less than two-outs if his tendenitious depended on it
3 votes
Stats lie. You picked them all out to make your particular lie sound too good. I think your full of it.
1 votes
No. We would be giving up too much.
10 votes
No. Those guys sucked in the playoffs anyways.
1 votes
No. We should keep all our prospects and projects and see what happens.
6 votes
Yes. We would have an offense that would be truly fun to watch.
4 votes

39 votes | Poll has closed

Comment 14 comments  |  0 recs  | 

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yes.. i really do miss them, especially miggy.  Just knowing that this year, kendall and miggy are making the same amount of money.. it really makes my stomach turn.  For the past 2 years now, i've just been asking crosby to make me forget about miggy, but he hasnt done yet.. i still hope he does.

by Rickeyistheman on May 14, 2007 8:51 AM PDT reply actions  

You Can't Ignore The Money... You just can't!

I hate to rain on your parade, but where are we getting the money from?  You've put a lot of time into reasons why these guys can help the team (decent diary, btw), but you conveniently forget to mention the $$$ aspect.

Hernandez

  1. 6.5
  1. 7.5
  1. 8.0
  1. 8.5 (Team Option - 1.0M Buyout)

Tejada

  1. 12.0
  1. 13.0
  1. 13.0

Harden

  1. 2.5
  1. 3.5
  1. 5.25

Crosby

  1. 2.25
  1. 4.50
  1. 7.0

Tejeda & Hernandez will make 43.5M more than Harden & Crosby over the years final year of their contracts.  

The only way to make up that money is to lose young players like H. Street, Ellis, Duke, DJ, Blanton, Gaudin, etc...

Are you willing to sacrifice good, young talent to bring in 2 players that may or may not take this team to the playoffs?  And after 2009, what are we left with?  We're probably left with an Oakland Teams similar to years 1994 - 1999.  Not good.

by Colorado Fan on May 14, 2007 8:56 AM PDT reply actions  

Well, I did mention dream a few times...

plus a few other things but I wanted to think about it at least

by Hawaii FO on May 14, 2007 12:11 PM PDT up reply actions  

Adjust the trade...

How about:

Hernandez

  1. 6.5
  1. 7.5
  1. 8.0
  1. 8.5 (Team Option - 1.0M Buyout)

Tejada

  1. 12.0
  1. 13.0
  1. 13.0

(Hernandez & Tejada = 61 million guaranteed)

for

Crosby

  1. 2.25
  1. 4.50
  1. 7.0

Kendall

  1. $13.475 (we keep the $5 mil from the Pirates)

Loaiza

  1. 7.0
  1. 8.0
  1. 7.5 (Team Option - .375M Buyout)

(Combined = $42.6 million guaranteed)

Still a $18.4 million difference over 3 years, but at just over $6 million a year, it might be doable for the A's.

Maybe throw in Mike Piazza and his $8,500,000 this year to bring the gap below $10 million (we have Cust/Johnson/Swisher/Melhuse to DH, and Baltimore could move Kevin Millar back to first base or even one of the corner outfield spots).

Sure it's a fantasy, but it would be one hell of a trade....

by andyinfremont on May 14, 2007 3:54 PM PDT up reply actions  

To answer your question: No.

Looking at how Hernandez and Tejada have taken the Orioles to the playoffs every year, I think I'll say 'no'.

The Kendall Shift: 6 infielders and 2 catchers.

by Ozzz on May 14, 2007 9:41 AM PDT reply actions  

ok well let me start off by saying

I really enjoyed this diary.  I really do like it.  So don't take it personally that I'm about to completely refute everything you've said, because I disagree completely.

Miggy was amazing while he was here.  The 2001 A's stole my heart, and slowly it was broken watching Giambi, Tejada, Ramon, Hudson, Mulder and then Zito leave us for greener (read: richer) pastures.  To have all of them on one team now would mean we'd be a Steinbrenner-esque team, complete with salary taxes and expectations.

But one thing everyone always glosses over (which I understand because it's easiest to deny what you don't want to hear cough Bonds fans cough) is the fact that Miggy and Jason both developed massive amounts of muscle mass to their bodies in rapidly short periods of time, and both have been implicated as 'roids users.  As good as Miggy is, the penalties for being caught using 'roids is HUGE now.  He's been implicated side by side with Palmiero, he just hasn't tested positive.  B5 anyone?  Anyways, with that in mind, how good is 100 games of Miggy or 75 games of Miggy and the remainder with Marco Scutaro as compared to 120 games of Bobby Crosby?  I'll take the latter, thanks.

Ramon, well, we did what we had to.  Ramon brought us Kotsay and helped us get rid of Terrance Long.  Jason Kendall, you MUST remember, isn't a drain on our salary because we signed him to that deal - we NEEDED a catcher and we had two horrible contracts in Arthur Rhodes and Mark Redmond.  Look at where they are now.  Bitch about Kendall's futility all you want, but I'll take a 155 game known quantity AND good clubhouse presence over the malcontents that were Rhodes and Redmond.

Also, your supposition that the team's weakest spots are C and SS strike me as pretty naive, no offense.  Catcher we have Powell, Suzuki and Brown in the minors waiting for Kendall's contract to go bye bye.  Shortstop is a whole different can of worms, but let's consider that when this team is 100% healthy, we'll probably have Buck and Cust in AAA with Kielty and Stewart splitting time in LF.  I think that given our health issues and our concerns at other spots, the fact that Bobby is relatively healthy now is actually a boon to the team.  Plus his homer yesterday was ridiculous.

Colorado Bob is right on about the salaries, too.  Miggy's salary would be too much to stomach, and you can't write off Kendall's expiring contract as how we'd pay for Miggy - Billy has already factored in the expiring contract to next year's budget through raises and player extensions.  Next year, Swisher, Haren and any other young guys we have locked up have sizable contract increases.

Idunno.  I understand seeing through green and gold tinted glasses, but you have to understand that what we have right now isn't exactly bad, it's just different.  Billy's doing his best to put a winner out there with a limited salary cap, and he's doing a pretty good job.  Doling out a contract of Miggy's size would basically make our bench depth nothing as opposed to the something it is now (albeit not great).

by noava22 on May 14, 2007 9:52 AM PDT reply actions  

There are a lot of reasons to choose Croz....

...over Miggy, but playing in more games over the next few years is not one of them.

As for trading for Miggy and/or Ramon, I would love it but it'll never happen.  Mostly because the talent required in trade would be too high (especially if we threw in the players needed to make the salaries even).

"Loyal? I'm the most loyal player money can buy." - Don Sutton

by vignette17 on May 14, 2007 6:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

My God....Why Can't People Learn!!!!

Let me show you and everyone else what word is used where...and how...

They're: "I think they're a good team."
Their: "Their team ERA is middle of the pack."
There: "Don't sit over there."

Tryed isn't even a word.

Tried: "No manager has tried it..."

And some bonus one's that you didn't use but are very common:
Your: "Eat your vegetables."
You're: "You're going to be late."

I propose a grammar tutorial requirement for anyone who wishes to become a member of AN or any other blog.

-Adieu

plz kthx lol omg wtf rofl

by AsFan4mFrisco on May 14, 2007 10:21 AM PDT reply actions  

Thank you. I needed the class for sure

i was hoping someone would smack for for it so I wouldn't have to look it all up from my 8th grade english books.  You can sleep better now knowing I'm at least somewhat rependant.

by Hawaii FO on May 14, 2007 12:04 PM PDT up reply actions  

I should make a new login called

ANGrammarPolice and go around posting about errors in peoples' diaries...lol!

plz kthx lol omg wtf rofl

by AsFan4mFrisco on May 14, 2007 3:43 PM PDT up reply actions  

I tried to bait

you by spelling repentant wrong but your not ass good at being the ANspellingPolice. My sixth grade spelling book was never opened...lol. My next tutorial should be on how to use to, too correctly.

Some Random Fatty

by Hawaii FO on May 14, 2007 4:26 PM PDT up reply actions  

Not so fast

"But the reality is we can probably plug in another guy with a 3.5 ERA to take his place."

In reality, 3.5 ERA guys are strongly desired around the league.  We are spoiled by how easily we have snuck in pitchers with smallish ERAs.  

by MobiusKlein on May 14, 2007 11:13 AM PDT reply actions  

I don't miss them one bit...

Tejada was always my least favorite player on the A's...  

As for Hernandez, we got Kotsay for him, and dumped Terrence Long to boot.  Damian Miller did a pretty decent job in 2004...

"Work like you don't need the money. Love like you've never been hurt. Dance like nobody's watching."- former A's pitcher Satchel Paige

by The Pilots Dared Me To Die on May 14, 2007 12:03 PM PDT up reply actions  

least favorite player?

what did you want out of him? that's a lot of C.Singletons, T.Longs, Jeremy Giambis, Ben Greive's etc. etc. to hold over him if he's last on your list.

by Hawaii FO on May 14, 2007 4:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

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