Who Is Going To Pitch?
by Buck18 on Dec 18, 2007 4:01 PM PST
59 comments
I won't bother to go into the storm that may be the A's bullpen, but, for the life of me, I can't figure out who our starters will be. I looks to me like Blanton (since no one is beating down our door for him), Harden (although this is a bad decision---his body can't take the violence of his delivery), Duke (recovering from hip problems), Gaudin (ditto---but even more recent) and....Meyer? Komine? (yeah, I still like him) DiNardo? Of course, all this blows up if Harden can't pitch...and I don't think he will be able to. So---A'sophiles, what is your best guess as to what our starting rotation will be on opening day?
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Doesn't Look Good
1. Harden
2. Blanton
3. Gaudin
4. Duke
5. DiNardo
Now let's be realistic and learn from the past and say that injuries occur (Harden/Gaudin/Duke)
1. Blanton
2. DiNardo
3. Eveland
4. Meyer
5. (Insert AAA Pitcher)
That rotation scares me.
by muffinpryde on Dec 18, 2007 4:02 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
I think your realism is on the money.
Harden is a figment of our imagination, Gaudin was under the knife today and Duke is coming off of a similar hip procedure that made him a non-entity in 2007.
The realistic version is scary. Blanton is a solid #3 on most rotations. DiNardo is a gamer, but no #2. Eveland is a mystery and Meyer looked like nothing but a BP pitcher last year. Christ, the Tigers are going to slip on their drool when they see him on the mound!
Be afraid, be very afraid. But, I still think that given the long-term health considerations of this team, dealing Haren (as much as I hated seeing him go) and suffering the hopefully short-term consequences was the right move.
by WannaBeGM on Dec 18, 2007 6:56 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
With all that drool,
the Tigers shouldn't try to bring back the Baltimore Chop against us.
by Archaeologist on Dec 18, 2007 7:23 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
hydroplaning, dude
by monkeyball on Dec 19, 2007 7:33 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
blanton, harden, duke, gaudin
dinardo, meyer, eveland.
that's a ton of question marks, but really not that terrible.
by xbhaskarx on Dec 18, 2007 4:02 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
It's terrible
BECAUSE it is a bunch of question marks.
Using your reasoning, one could argue that a rotation of Blanton, Prior, Wood, Hampton, Di Nardo, Meyer, Eveland is also really not that terrible.
by rfloh on Dec 18, 2007 11:22 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
we should sign Frank Gorshin
by monkeyball on Dec 19, 2007 7:35 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Gorshin!
Was that for his role as the riddler or maybe for his half-black half-white character in Star Trek?
The question marks are a given but I think between the starters and the bullpen they'll appear more like his Star Trek role this next season.
Whatever happened to him anyway?
by Gerard on Dec 19, 2007 9:32 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Frank has left the building....
....died, if memory serves, a few months ago. a great talent.
by Buck18 on Dec 19, 2007 9:41 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Frank may be gone, but ...
... Frank Gorshin's Memory will Live Forever Through This Web-Site.
(Turns out Frank shared my birthday, and from the looks of this photo, he grew up in the same Pittsburgh neighborhood as my dad.)
by monkeyball on Dec 19, 2007 11:06 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm expecting that Billy
will go sifting through the bargain bin over the next couple of months and add a couple of names to the mix. Last year he found DiNardo and Colby Lewis that way.
It's nice to draw up an Opening Day rotation, but I expect next year will be a lot like 2007, with 8-9 different pitchers filling out the four/five slots in the rotation and the Capitol Corridor busy shuttling pitchers between the Coliseum and Raley Field.
by Soaker on Dec 18, 2007 4:13 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Has anyone heard how Halsey is doing? He seems
like he could be a darkhorse rotation candidate, when/if Harden et al, go down to the annual Obliquetoraliship injury.
by theblackpearl on Dec 18, 2007 4:33 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
WOW, I almost forgot about Halsey
by Masaryk on Dec 18, 2007 6:42 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
After his 'mom and pop' remark, so did Beane. ;)
by OldhamA on Dec 19, 2007 5:33 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Just so happens
That he said the 'mom and pop'remark because Braden got the chance to start because Halsey seemed to have been injured. i don't think we need another injury ridden starter. Meanwhile, I forgot about Dallas Braden, but he hasn't showm much in his performance last season.
by muffinpryde on Dec 19, 2007 4:17 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Even if our bullpen looked good next year
it's going to be crap. The overuse from the early hooks these guys are going to regularly get (assuming the injury version of our rotation) is going to kill a couple of those bullpen arms. I'm expecting a nice little merry-go-round of starting pitchers being shuffled to the bullpen & sac.
by DMOAS on Dec 18, 2007 4:34 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
My vote is for the Anti-Rick Ankiel
which would be Mark Kotsay moving to the rotation from Centerfield.
It could be the feel good story of the year...
by Instant Replay Umpire on Dec 18, 2007 4:44 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
awesome!
kotsay's got a cannon arm....make use of him, in any way possible.
by arch on Dec 18, 2007 4:57 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
What? Kotsay's got a Cannon?
From watching him these years, what I've seen is not a strong arm, but an average arm with great accuracy.
by Zonis on Dec 18, 2007 5:43 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
That reminds me of a left handed version of one
of our hip-ailment suffering pitchers.
by DMOAS on Dec 18, 2007 6:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Or of Vlad Guerrero.
by oblique on Dec 18, 2007 10:22 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I hear Brandon Buckley
Say one time that Kotsay threw a bullpen session one time last year for fun and got it into the low 90's on a few..
by GusanoQuemador on Dec 19, 2007 9:07 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
really
i'll have to ask buck about that
by flipgatey3 on Dec 19, 2007 8:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
kotsay on the mound---sweet!
the best thing about that is that we could DH for him and his .214 average wouldn't kill us....lol
by kitoko on Dec 19, 2007 6:25 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Opening Day Rotation prediction:
- Harden
- Gaudin
- Eveland
- Duke
- Meyer
by SwisherSweet on Dec 18, 2007 5:28 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
We've talked about converting Duke to SP
but what about Street?
by Zonis on Dec 18, 2007 6:16 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
As far as I know,
Huston has never pitched more than 3 innings in any professional game. He didn't even start a single game in college.
If that ship was ever built to begin with, it sailed long before he entered the system.
by PaulThomas on Dec 18, 2007 6:42 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Well
I don't think Street ever has started a college or pro game. I believe he might have in high school (I wouldn't be surprised as very few schools have pens in HS) and it was when he went to UT that he got moved to the pen.
That said, I do recall he pitched something like 8 innings for Team USA (or possibly UT) in a championship-type game. It would probably not be wise to move him now, as we have little idea what might happen. He could be an Escobar or he could be one of the many failed starters who dominate in the late innings. If we are to ever try it, it should be 2008, but our pen without Street (and quite possibly sans Embree) looks very scary, and not the good kind.
by vignette17 on Dec 19, 2007 12:21 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Extending Street past that one inning is a
scary prospect. He'd almost certainly get hammered.
by OldhamA on Dec 19, 2007 5:36 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I think you underestimate his pitching ability
He routinely handles 2 innings in tied ball games. It's not some kind of magic that gets guys out.
It's just a question of stamina to me.
by PaulThomas on Dec 19, 2007 8:16 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
God, why do I have to think about this
The rotation next year is going to be fuggly. It's best not contemplated too carefully.
Um, anyway, my prediction for the rotation on opening day:
Blanton
Duke
DiNardo
Eveland
Meyer
However, Gaudin should be back by the end of April, at which point he'll bump whichever lefty is struggling the worst.
Harden won't pitch more than 10 innings all season. His arm is FUBAR.
by PaulThomas on Dec 18, 2007 6:47 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
harden
I would think that opening day is the one point of the season when you could find Harden in the rotation. Are you predicting a ST injury?
by colin on Dec 19, 2007 9:47 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Nope
He's post-predicting the previous week's Cortisone Shot in the shoulder of Harden.
by Colorado Fan on Dec 19, 2007 10:31 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Exactly
The guy's getting a cortisone shot in the offseason. He's not even pitching right now.
Does that sound like a healthy man to you?
Whatever. Apparently until his chiropractor, his acupuncturist, his herbal medicine practitioner and his faith healer all agree to it, he won't have shoulder surgery.
by PaulThomas on Dec 19, 2007 10:45 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
29th president
Look him up! Important US History lesson.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_...
Just don't let Harden visit Alaska again.
by MobiusKlein on Dec 18, 2007 8:14 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I think these injury predictions are high
Just because we keep getting the shaft on injured players does not mean things will stay that way. I doubt that Oakland will continue to average its record breaking levels of injuries.
Harden will go at least 25 innings.
Duke's solid and slow mechanics make it tough for me to believe that he has just broken down for good.
Gaudin, who knows.
by SwisherSweet on Dec 18, 2007 7:39 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
I don't think Harden will get hurt
I think the odds of him getting hurt are about the same as any other somewhat injury prone player.
The problem is, I'm utterly convinced that he's ALREADY hurt and it hasn't been dealt with. Shockingly enough, it turns out crazy chiropractor quacks can't cure a f***ing tear in his shoulder. He should have had surgery months ago. Now when he gets it, he'll be useless to the team because he'll be a free agent before it heals.
by PaulThomas on Dec 18, 2007 10:15 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
+1
My big concern is that he still IS hurt, and until this whole bizarre "biceps tendonitis" one day, "shoulder discomfort" the next day thing is sorted out for sure... he's just not somebody anybody can or should count on as a contributor.
by still bills kingdom on Dec 19, 2007 9:14 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
rfloh had a post the other day ...
... explaining that biceps tendinitis is a common result of shoulder problems.
by monkeyball on Dec 19, 2007 11:08 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
What a Dump!
To echo Bette Davis, not one even close to optimistic viewpoint---and if it really is Meyer and Eveland, we are in deep trouble for sure. Someone mentioned Colby Lewis!!! As someone who Billy found? Lewis has suddenly morphed into an asset? Halsey? He's mad at us. I think we have enough "fire power" (and I use the term loosely) to score some runs---I actually like Hannahan and Murphy---tough kids---and I think we will hit. But our starting pitching, well, I'm not a happy guy.
by Buck18 on Dec 18, 2007 8:19 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
I didn't say Lewis was an "asset" for Oakland
BB loves to look through other teams' discard piles in February and March and take chances on a few guys who might help out in Oakland or at the very least provide organizational depth in Sacramento. DiNardo and Lewis were the two best examples from last year. Lewis actually did help out in Sacramento last year, making 15 starts there, and was (fortunately very briefly) in the revolving door of starters in Oakland.
I think there will be a couple of DiNardos and Lewises added to the names mentioned above. So there will be something like 12 names in the mix. At any time in 2008, 5 will be in the Oakland rotation, 1 or 2 in the Oakland bullpen, 2 or 3 in the Sacramento rotation and of course the rest on the DL.
by Soaker on Dec 18, 2007 9:37 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I know you're mentioning pitchers but...
The best examples of this bargain bin ability of Beane's are Cust, Hannahan, and Murphy last year. The year before it was Gaudin. It's also how we got Duke in the first place. I think Billy's greatest strength is this bargain bin searching and one of the reasons I think he's still a very good GM (but not a Schuerholz or Ryan).
by vignette17 on Dec 19, 2007 12:26 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
It doesn't matter
As noted above, Beane will probably acquire some guy who's bounced around the league and stick him in the rotation if he's healthy and half-decent.
But really, it's kind of irrelvant, and is actually one of the better arguments for trading Haren. Even if Haren is great, what good would it have done if he doesn't get run support and is surrounded by mediocrity.
But the gloom about the rotation is also a reason why next year is going to be so depressing. Hopelessness is tolerable when you've been bad for a while, or if the team is starting to get better. It's a tough adjustment to go from a perennial contender to the Royals and Rays.
by bear88 on Dec 18, 2007 11:34 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
I think Andrew Brown is a candidate
I'd like to see if Beane can get Igawa on the cheap too
by closetasfan on Dec 19, 2007 8:50 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Igawa is terrible
He's like Zito without the curveball. And with even worse control.
I think the system is already sufficiently full of soft-tossing lefties at this point.
by PaulThomas on Dec 19, 2007 8:58 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Zito w/o the curve ball
lovin' it!
by A s Eh on Dec 22, 2007 6:22 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Eveland #3
Opening Day Rotation:
Blanton
Harden
Eveland
Duke
Gaudin
- Blanton won't be dealt this offseason. He looks more valuable to the Reds, Mets, etc...during a July/August Playoff push. Think the Mets/Minaya want to go through what they went through last September?
- Harden will make it to Opening Day because the A's will only let him throw mulitiple bullpen sessions + 1 Spring Training Start in March.
- Eveland was selected from the Diamondbacks for a reason. Beane & Company think he can be successful in the below-sea-level, friendly confines of McAfee Coliseum. He's #3 because Geren will want to put a lefty in the middle of rotation to save Right-Handed bullpen arms (Or so they'll say).
- Duke will make it work. Gamer.
- Gaudin pitched through pain all last season. I'd be surprised if he wasn't on the opening day Roster, slotting him at #5.
by Colorado Fan on Dec 19, 2007 9:32 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Eh?
Putting a lefty in the middle of the rotation would save left-handed bullpen arms, not right-handers.
If the other team has a righty up in a big spot, you're going to replace your lefty starter with a righty reliever. If the guy up in the big spot is a lefty, you may leave your lefty starter in the ball game rather than calling on a lefty reliever.
Basically teams are much more likely to make a pitching change to a pitcher of the opposite handedness than to one of the same handedness. As such starters will tend to "preserve" guys of the same handedness as themselves.
by PaulThomas on Dec 19, 2007 9:39 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Eh.
by Colorado Fan on Dec 19, 2007 10:29 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Bring back Saarloos for 1 year?
He'll be cheap, always pitched well in the Coliseum, and he's durable.
At the very least he'll soak up innings, taking stress off the bullpen or young guys like Eveland/Smith.
Good #5 for a rebuilding year, IMO.
by BWH on Dec 19, 2007 1:36 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
To continue...
-Gaudin
-Duke
-DiNardo
-Saarloos
-Harden/Eveland
by BWH on Dec 19, 2007 1:38 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
He had a 7.17 ERA last season
Even for Oakland's 2008 rotation, that's godawful.
by PaulThomas on Dec 19, 2007 2:03 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
He pitched in Cincy.
So his HR rate jumped pretty high.
And he was always able to put up a 4.50ish ERA at the Coliseum. Partially due to luck, and partially due to the pitcher-friendly Coliseum.
The 7.17 ERA was only in 42 innings, I'd say he'd be around 5 next year for the A's.
Plus, I didn't say he'd be a Livan Hernandez-style innings eater, just a reliable and durable way to pick up 120-150 innings on the cheap.
I'm not projcting a Cy Young-type year, just a 5th/6th starter for when Eveland (or whoever) needs a rest or Harden gets hurt.
by BWH on Dec 19, 2007 3:41 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
He hardly went more than 5 ininngs
They always pull him early. not an inning soaker. Although I did like him. I remember the game where he had like 10 strikeouts, that was awesome.
by micdog2001 on Dec 19, 2007 3:33 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
When your career highlight
is being part of a SIX pitcher no-hitter...
Whatever. The A's have an ample supply of pitchers who can be terrible for the league minimum. Some of them even might turn out to be better than terrible. There's no reason to hire a guy who's known to be terrible for more money instead.
by PaulThomas on Dec 19, 2007 4:24 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree...
He's not that terrible. He's not good, barely even average. But his GB/FB ratio was still close to 2:1 last year, and he's got a rubber arm. Saarloos is good for spot starting, long relief, overall depth, etc. You can never really have an "ample" amount of pitchers. Especially ones who probably won't be signed for longer than 1 year, at less than 2 million total.
He showed over the course of his tenure with the A's that he really benefited from the Coliseum and solid infield defense.
He's not nearly as bad as 2007 showed (blame Great American Ballpark for that). Plus, who knows, if he has a solid first half, maybe flip him to a potential contender that's weak on pitching depth (i.e. Houston, Milwaukee) for a mid level prospect or undervalued player (i.e. DeNorfia).
In conclusion, you can never have too many MLB-ready pitchers, and I would like to see Saarloos sign a 1-year deal with the A's.
by BWH on Dec 19, 2007 5:44 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd sign Saarloos...
but only to a minor league deal for AAA depth, and even then, I'd probably only use him for Long Relief in the event we get about 5 pitchers injured.
by Zonis on Dec 19, 2007 7:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The A's used Marcus McBeth to get Denorfia
Saarloos got David Shafer, who did but nothing last season.
Look, EVERY pitcher benefits from the Coliseum and solid infield defense. There's no reason to sign a known mediocrity just to "maximize" that advantage. DiNardo is essentially the same thing, except better.
by PaulThomas on Dec 19, 2007 10:36 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
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