Oaktoon's Potential Farewell Open Thread

by rubin sierra on Apr 20, 2006 2:54 AM PDT

Initially I was going to suggest that grover start this thread, since he posted at 12:30 in the morning, a great post at the bottom of the 330-comment comment-a-ganza (comment-a-palooza?) prompted by oaktoon's diary. But though it's only an hour later, now it's safe to assume that all, including grover, are asleep, and grover might very well not receive any suggestion I make that he start a new thread until midday tomorrow, by which time who knows, the A's and Tigers could be tied 11-11 in the 6th, and all community guidelines may have been removed as the community descends into total anarchy due to Zito-angst.

So I'll do it myself. I just wanted to create this space to continue the Oaktoon/CGV soap-opera that so intrigued all of us yesterday. We talk A's baseball here, and baseball in general. We talk television and movies ... we talk players' asses. We get sophisticated and debate steroids. But for all that, nothing really draws our interest like a fight--when the discussion between members gets heated. (And now that I've characterized us all as simplistic rubber-neckers, I have to say that yesterday's thread was so fun to read because of the INTELLIGENT argument--which it could very-well be argued, would descend into unreadable crap without the CGVs.)

My own two cents: Blez's need to police the site goes without saying. But it's interesting how nothing brings about a flurry of activity on AN more than those masters of provocation who tend to disregard the rules. Reminds me of Robb's diaries last fall, which were also prolifically commented-on. Oaktoon also reminds me of Terrell Owens. Though they (O.T. and T.O.) do disregard certain rules, they also appeal to our sense of fairness in claiming that they ought not to be penalized. And their value to their respective teams (or in Oak's case, to the site) cannot be easily dismissed. I think the Eagles bungled the T.O. situation ... but how should they have handled it? Your thoughts?

Poll

Which amendment to the CGVs do you like best?

Making it a CGV to advocate the termination of manager Ken Macha. And making the advocation of such termination "now" cause for an immediate bAN.

7 votes

Give "notice" to the violator, along with the opportunity to defend oneself, probably via e-mail.

10 votes

No more secrecy for those reporting CGVs.

5 votes

Limit CGVs so that only the party insulted may report a given insult.

7 votes

Require that any CGV investigation investigates both the accused and the accuser.

6 votes

Allow one daily thread where more insults are allowed, accepted and expected. Could be called "In Memory of Rez's Love of Oakland" (Saint's Idea; also suggested by BillyBall2005).

4 votes

Narrow the "insult" CGV so that it would describe a smaller subsection of discourse, more specifically describing the type of insults that "cross the line."

5 votes

44 votes | Poll has closed

Tweet Comment 54 comments | 0 recs |

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Comments

I don't want to go to Dallas!!

Please.

oaktoon

by oaktoon on Apr 20, 2006 4:48 AM PDT reply actions

I'm not sure

If TO ending up in Dallas should be called ironic, poetic justice, or just poetic. He goes to the place where he pulled that standing-on-the-star stunt, which was pretty much when TO-as-diva "arrived." A happy ending would now involve TO racing out to the star after every touchdown he scores this season, to the wild cheering of the home fans, 15-yard-penalty-be-damned.

Alas, the whole "Dallas" part of the TO saga doesn't really lend itself to our little saga here. There wouldn't be anything poetic about you having to go become a regular at LoneStar Ball. Hopefully we don't go down that road--to that end, I really liked your diary today.

But to play with that analogy a bit more ... if you're like T.O., and AN is like the Eagles ... would Blez be ... Andy Reid? And Donovan McNabb would have to be ... Nico? Grover?

by rubin sierra on Apr 20, 2006 2:31 PM PDT up reply actions

Grover would be Hugh Douglas

Since he and Oaktoon are always squaring off.

"The first night, we were right there," Bradley said. "All we needed was a couple of touchdowns, and we would have had them."

by jeepers on Apr 21, 2006 12:21 AM PDT up reply actions

I think that just about rounds out the cast

by rubin sierra on Apr 21, 2006 10:40 AM PDT up reply actions

To the sense of fairness issue

It's only 'fair' that if one were to write a farewell letter, that one does not include the word "potential" preceeding it. Just write the damned screed and back away -- back away and do not post again again. This allows the person to bow out as gracefully as possible; one can still read the responses without anyone's knowledge. Of course, if one feels that their personality is such a huge part of the forum, was there much grace to begin with?

However, there's always the "I'm going on a hiatus" approach but then there's the whole ego-in-the-way thing (and not much grace) attached. Besides, I actually tried that once and I couldn't stay away for as long as I had intended to stay away for.

On the Potential Farewell thread someone wrote something that should be taken to heart and rather than paraphrase it, I'll link to it.

4 8 15 16 23 42

by LowcountryJoe on Apr 20, 2006 5:23 AM PDT reply actions

The insult diary is a bad idea

No way will the insults and bad feelings stay confined to that diary.

"Put a Milo on him." -Billy Beane

by kaweahkaweah on Apr 20, 2006 6:30 AM PDT reply actions

If I wanted to read insults

instead of actual discussion and debate on baseball, I would have stayed on the mlb A's fan forum.

by OaklandSi on Apr 20, 2006 6:57 AM PDT reply actions

Simple as this

OT, you need to change the way you talk to people. It's not a matter of who's wrong and who's right, or who's ignorant who's arrogent. You just can't talk to people the way you do.

The whole thing with you saying blez's preview was a yawm was insane, why would you say that to someone who worked really hard to make it? We all have our opinions (except machabot) but you can't go saying all of them outloud.

It wasn't even constructive criticism, so don't even use that as an excuse.

Well my rants done, and I guess i'll be waiting for OT's response instead of him making an apology

"Mommy and Daddy are going to take a nap before the baseball game starts..."

by Devyn on Apr 20, 2006 7:08 AM PDT reply actions

On the topic of bashing writing...

How many times have we seen people here, including Blez, bash Joe Morgan, Ray Ratto, etc. I've seen the words "moron" and "idiot" used in those comments. It goes both ways, and just because Blez runs this site doesn't mean he should be immune to a little writing bashing himself. That's the risk one takes for putting their words out in public, regardless of how "hard they work" on them.

by LD on Apr 20, 2006 11:41 AM PDT up reply actions

LD...

Well my friend, by now I am sure you are aware of the "AN Double Standard". I hate to re-hash, but it's not like anyone was ever going to address that concern anyhow. Sweep this comment back under the rug, and let's all enjoy a nice 4/20! Go A's.

(Pardon any of my bitterness today, it WOULD have been my 5th anniversary today! lol)

"I have nothing against the bunt - in it's place. But most of the time that place is in the bottom of a long-forgotten closet." - Earl Weaver

by PosterNutbag44 on Apr 20, 2006 12:33 PM PDT up reply actions

Ouch!

Bitterness forgiven. Just to cheer you up....

What's the difference between a brown noser and an ass kisser?
-
-
-
-
Depth perception!

by LD on Apr 20, 2006 12:53 PM PDT up reply actions

double standard? not so much I think

You just have to recognize that by only investigating comments that are reported, the current system defines "insults" broadly but then allows the community to define what crossing the line is ... The overbroad CGVs do give the CGV board a lot of opportunity to censure actions that often go unpunished, much as speed limits that everybody violates give cops discretion. But I have litle reason to believe that the panel has abused its discretion. I do think maybe the system should be changed to take away all that extra discretion, maybe by using items #3 and #4 in the poll on this diary.

And LD--if your point is that it can't be a CGV to call blez's baseball preview "a yawn," I agree with you. All of us are writers on this site, and we all make ourselves vulnerable by posting ... that we "work hard" on our posts does not make them immune to criticism, nor would many of us want that. I for one would prefer negative feedback to no feedback at all, and perhaps would hereby like to "report" the entire AN community for not commenting enough on my various diaries.

by rubin sierra on Apr 20, 2006 12:55 PM PDT up reply actions

You got it.

I'll happily bash you if that would make you feel better... (j/k!)

I absolutely don't think it is a personal attack to call Blez's preview a "yawn" you're right. I do also think there is a big double-standard, though, if OT is getting strikes against him for calling people stupid or morons when half of this site including its moderators call Macha, Ratto, Morgan, etc. the same things on a daily basis. Thin-skinned is an understatement for that kind of stance in my book.

by LD on Apr 20, 2006 1:05 PM PDT up reply actions

I do recognize...

And I am not saying there is conspiracy, intentional misuse, or anything like that going on. I am not in any way trying to cause trouble, stir the pot, or even talk bad about anyone. However, a few things that Blez said yesterday in response to Oaktoon really, really bothered me. I won't go all in detail, it's all in there and my thoughts on it. My effort in raising these concerns is to help "fringe" posters like myself, and many others who post a lot less frequently than I, feel more comfortable posting. Knowing what is ok and isn't. Knowing that a simple misunderstanding isn't going to lead to a strike because 4 of 4000 people think so (Granted, I realize they are probably some of the more highly respected members of our community). Check out Hollywodd Oz's post in the previous thread, it may be a good example. Unfortunately, I picked the wrong forum as many people thought I was supporting Oaktoon, bashing Blez, or whatever. None of the above is true. I have concerns and wanted to get them across. I realize not everyone sees it this way, but there are quite a few who do. To me, for the community, as a community, it's worth addressing.

"I have nothing against the bunt - in it's place. But most of the time that place is in the bottom of a long-forgotten closet." - Earl Weaver

by PosterNutbag44 on Apr 20, 2006 1:24 PM PDT up reply actions

heh ...

I guess I did misunderstand you a bit ...

Ultimately, I don't think you or any other less-vocal members should worry about it. Say what you want, be who you are it almost certainly won't be a problem. They have only issued 25 strikes in the 8-10 months that this system has been in place and almost all of them seem to have been to the few people who were banned - plus two for the 'Toon.

I mean, I certainly wouldn't question the validity of our feelings but I really don't understand why anyone would feel the need to worry about it.

Check out the future Mrs. Devo's campaign ...

by devo on Apr 20, 2006 1:39 PM PDT up reply actions

Yeah

I bash Ray Ratto, Joe Morgan and Mike Krukow almost every chance I get, and I haven't recieved a strike yet. I think it's because those guys all suck!

"Using technology to clean up the mess made by technology doesn't seem too intelligent." ~George Carlin

by haren4prez on Apr 20, 2006 4:22 PM PDT up reply actions

I like Krukow, and I haven't reported you!

Those people aren't drinking the Kool-Aid, they're sucking it from a spigot! @('.')@

by monkeyball on Apr 20, 2006 5:15 PM PDT up reply actions

Thanks. Now, here's a case of bananna's....

you never saw this post.

AN is like a conservative think tank, minus the conservatives.

by haren4prez on Apr 20, 2006 5:19 PM PDT up reply actions

If it helps to clear things up any,

I also don't think calling Blez' post a yawner is a CGV, I don't think Blez does, and I don't think any of the committee members would. I think it's unnecessary and I think it was brought up by community members as an example of tone, not as a CGV. It certainly was never reported or voted on.

The sub-committee's job is strictly to look at comments that are reported, look at them in context, and compare them against the CGs as stated in the link. When four long-time users, independently, conclude the same thing--which is what happens 90+% of the time--it's pretty certain that objectively, a stated rule has been violated.

And there is simply no double-standard on AN. No complaint has ever been lodged against Blez, against me, or against any committee member, and if one is, I am fully confident that the complaint will be judged strictly against the stated CGs, and ruled on accordingly, not judged with the complainee in mind. And I think I can speak for Blez and each committee member in saying we wouldn't want it any other way.

by Nico on Apr 20, 2006 1:34 PM PDT up reply actions

Difference in opinion...

To me, it is indeed a double standard when the writer of the rules carelessly breaks them. I have a ton of respect for Blez, the committee and yourself. However, the upstanding "leaders" of this community have the responsibility to act as they would expect us all to act. They have the responsibility to rise above the situation. It's not an issue of wheter or not it needs to be reported, a higher standard should be upheld, not only enforced, by our leaders. You may not agree with that, but that is my opinion.

"I have nothing against the bunt - in it's place. But most of the time that place is in the bottom of a long-forgotten closet." - Earl Weaver

by PosterNutbag44 on Apr 20, 2006 1:40 PM PDT up reply actions

I totally agree with you, PNB44,

and if we were machines, we'd follow our own instructions to ourselves 100% of the time. In general, Blez is (frankly) better than I am at staying out of the fray; both of us probably mean to more than we do. But we're human, and sometimes we react just like the users we sometimes tell "don't react".

The point is, it's ok to call us on it; I would never quibble about being issued a strike if I committed a CGV. It just bugs me when people say "You should be accountable, but I'm not going to report anybody." Well ok then, fine, but...next?

by Nico on Apr 20, 2006 1:51 PM PDT up reply actions

To be accountable for those actions...

An apology and clarification are required. That is being responsible, and accountable for your actions. Doesn't have to be a big deal. It isn't about being handed out strikes, it's about making an effort to better the community and make others feel a bit more comfortable. I don't realize why nobody seems to have quite understood that yet.

"Hey all you AN'ers out there, I made a goof earlier, my apologies to all. As a community we need to.....blah blah."

It isn't that hard. That is rising above and being accountable. That is being a strong leader, even through our human follies. Again, I'll go back to minding my own, it's like we are beating a dead horse anymore.

"I have nothing against the bunt - in it's place. But most of the time that place is in the bottom of a long-forgotten closet." - Earl Weaver

by PosterNutbag44 on Apr 20, 2006 1:59 PM PDT up reply actions

Nobody likes a tattletale...

I'm frankly curious how anyone could take this site so seriously that they felt the need to complain about someone. I'd also be curious if the same people are prone to complain...

I find that beer works wonders to relieve irritation.

by LD on Apr 20, 2006 2:57 PM PDT up reply actions

actually that's a great point

and one I thought about this morning.

whatever else you think about me, I never do that stuff.. or even about our own players, which some also do on this site.

oaktoon

by oaktoon on Apr 20, 2006 4:33 PM PDT up reply actions

i meant call

Morgan a moron or idiot or somesuch.

oaktoon

by oaktoon on Apr 20, 2006 4:33 PM PDT up reply actions

Agree 100%, Devyn

I would love to see oaktoon stay for his baseball acumen and passion about the A's, but no number of excellent diaries or civil comments will outweigh repeated bouts of being insulting, condescending, or righteous. Remove that tone and there is no problem.

No one has ever been sanctioned for stating their opinion or for disagreeing with someone (including someone in "authority"). Heck, the fact that oaktoon and Rubin Sierra can post these diaries is evidence of genuine free speech.

But you ask if someone's last name is "dense," or suggest that their mind doesn't work, or refer to their increasingly thick skulls. Those are all CGVs, and two of them were reported. End of story.

Reporting a violation isn't "snitching" any more than you "snitch" when you stand up for your community's rights by calling the police to report a theft or an assault. But if you think it's "snitching" and don't choose to report CGVs against you, that's fine--but your CGVs are still CGVs when they're reported.

For the sake of AN, I hope oaktoon can go 4 months without a CGV, can stay on AN, and can continue his excellent contributions. But if the choice is to take those excellent contributions along with CGV behavior thrown in, or leave it, it's an easy choice for me. Because the "team" is always greater than any individual, and the stated rules have to apply to everyone for the system to be fair.

by Nico on Apr 20, 2006 8:00 AM PDT reply actions

on the note of "tones"...

Do you see anything presumptuous or borderline "baiting" about the phrase "I'll wait for oaktoon to make a response instead of an apology"? I do.

Sig Mojo worked in Spring Training... so... *MaEl LuvR!*

by Poppy on Apr 20, 2006 8:04 AM PDT up reply actions

At my school, years ago a kid with

anger issues was known to be one more incident away from expulsion. One of his "nemeses," a kid who enjoyed "poking the lion with a stick," provoked the kid with anger issues, and when the kid reacted, the provoker came to the principal to report it and said "he's expelled, right?" The principal and I discussed it, and we agreed the only consequence should be on the provoker.

That's how I feel about intentionally baiting known "easy targets"--and I will admit to not being 100% clean on this with oaktoon, and I apologize for that. Sometimes his tone has set me off and I haven't kept my mouth shut when I should have.

The reason the "bust the baiter" analogy doesn't extend to the situations on AN is that the provoked insists on not reporting any wrongs against him, which is his choice--and he has to accept and live with that choice.

FYI, Blez went out of his way to instruct the sub-committee to be aware of possible baiting and to be ready to act appropriately. But the sub-committee only receives complaints; it doesn't go looking for them. The rules of the blog are clear, and it's up to the community members to adhere to them and to follow procedures if they want to stand up for their rights, or the rights of those around them.

by Nico on Apr 20, 2006 8:34 AM PDT up reply actions

"poking the lion with a stick"

I would like to try this sometime.

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Apr 20, 2006 8:42 AM PDT up reply actions

"bust the baiter"

That sounds like a carnival game. Hey, at AN Day, can we put some AN'ers into a giant "whack-a-mole" thing? ;)

I don't think the baiters should be busted, just that the phenomenon should be acknowledged -- and Blez has acknowledged it, so hopefully that will help (if the committee members weren't already taking baiting into consideration anyway, which they may have been).

My son has actually been "the lion" in his grade-school years... ADHD, superior IQ (or I.moose) but in special ed., and I'm sure that someone in your position actually knows our frequently-agonizing story really well without ever having met us. I'm sure that my own background experiences as a "mother lion" influence the angle at which I examine "the potential baiting of oaktoon," while also enabling me to keep in mind that the final responsibility for staying calm still unfortunately lies with the baitee.

If I may use Devyn's comment above as an example, I actually agree & sympathize with the frustration and anger expressed by people who don't like oaktoon's attitude. But in yesterday's diary, oaktoon was repeatedly admonished that his points might be taken better if he would just leave out things like "are you dense?" or "you have enough trouble with your own mind," etc... Yet Devyn finishes up his own good points with a (very mild) version of the exact thing that oaktoon is being told not to do. And okay, this comparison is pretty weak, but I hope it gets my basic point across.

As for your own flare-ups with oaktoon -- you're actually not one of the people that I think of as an initial baiter. Most, if not all, of your "first responses" to oaktoon (that I've seen) are measured & reasonable, and not looking to start anything other than a conversation.

Sig Mojo worked in Spring Training... so... *MaEl LuvR!*

by Poppy on Apr 20, 2006 9:20 AM PDT up reply actions

what about "bust the 'bater"?

Those people aren't drinking the Kool-Aid, they're sucking it from a spigot! @('.')@

by monkeyball on Apr 20, 2006 5:16 PM PDT up reply actions

Find the sourse

The 'master' baiter. Bust him before he busts himself!

AN is like a conservative think tank, minus the conservatives.

by haren4prez on Apr 20, 2006 5:21 PM PDT up reply actions

source

going.....blind

AN is like a conservative think tank, minus the conservatives.

by haren4prez on Apr 20, 2006 5:50 PM PDT up reply actions

Wow

Get over yourselves and talk about baseball, please.

Frank Thomas=The Big Healthy

by dboysick on Apr 20, 2006 11:21 AM PDT reply actions

Sometimes 346 comments just isn't enough ...

but I think this might be best used as an ass thread ...

Check out the future Mrs. Devo's campaign ...

by devo on Apr 20, 2006 12:10 PM PDT up reply actions

you mean

because it comes at the tail-end of the thread before it?

by rubin sierra on Apr 20, 2006 12:34 PM PDT up reply actions

ah, very punny ...

I remember when Nico was the only one telling puns around here ...

such fond memories ... and I'll leave you all to speculate whether I'm referring to the largely pun free days or Nico's early puns. ; )

Check out the future Mrs. Devo's campaign ...

by devo on Apr 20, 2006 1:11 PM PDT up reply actions

There are problems with the whole CGV process

Lax reporting, questionable phrases, blah blah blah. Some people want to confront their accusers while others wonder why calling someone "dense" is a strike while "moron" sees prolific use.

I agree that there need to be standards, and I'm heartened that Blez has actually posted them for all to see. While I don't know how to solve all the problems, I think I know a way to make the whole situation less arbitrary.

Ask the "victim" of the attack if they were offended by the comment. Have Nico or Blez send them an e-mail stating that a complaint has been filed against so-and-so and they were the intended target. The sub-Committee has decreed that the terminology was offensive and therefore would like to know if they should take action. If the person wasn't offended then there was no CGV, just two people saying whatever. A warning can still be issued to the speaker of foul things. If the victim says "Yes" than go ahead and boil the perpetrator in oil... or whatever it is AN's Silent Sub-Committee does to offenders.

Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Apr 20, 2006 8:29 PM PDT reply actions

Personally, I see no problem

with that; if the community liked the idea, I'd support it. Most of the time, the "victim" is the complainer, but not always. Anyway, I'd be interested if others want to weigh on what they think of your idea.

by Nico on Apr 20, 2006 8:45 PM PDT up reply actions

I've never flagged anyone

and from what I understand oaktoon took a strike because of something he said to me.

And when the "victim" is the complainer than the whole process works just as smoothly as before. At the very least this lets the offender know that they went too far when addressing the person, and they can learn from the mistake.

Remember our little e-mail discussion a few months ago? If I really went off on someone and you chimed in to call me an a-hole do you think I'd take offense to that?! I'd have a smile from ear to ear and take it as a compliment. Yet if someone reported your comment you'd get a strike... for paying me a compliment!

Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Apr 20, 2006 8:54 PM PDT up reply actions

Oaktoon was just theorizing

that it might have had something to do with you .... nobody actually knows except Blez and the fearsome foursome and they ain't telling.

Check out the future Mrs. Devo's campaign ...

by devo on Apr 20, 2006 9:17 PM PDT up reply actions

When you say a bad thing

actually, when you get a strike, you are informed of the offending phrase by the powers that be.

At least I was.

So if oaktoon knows the language that got him busted, it's likely he knows who he said it to.

Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Apr 20, 2006 10:24 PM PDT up reply actions

one of them was definitely a comment to you

Just for the record.

oaktoon

by oaktoon on Apr 20, 2006 10:29 PM PDT up reply actions

We set a record?

I find that troubling.

Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Apr 20, 2006 10:32 PM PDT up reply actions

alrighty ...

I was wrong ... I can admit it.

Check out the future Mrs. Devo's campaign ...

by devo on Apr 20, 2006 11:10 PM PDT up reply actions

Good for you

you Swede.

Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Apr 21, 2006 6:12 AM PDT up reply actions

Clarification re:

"and from what I understand oaktoon took a strike because of something he said to me." As far as I know, nobody has said that. It may have been implied or incorrectly assumed, but those are very different from being accurate.

Still, regardless of these specific past instances, I think your idea is interesting as a general concept.

But people also need to realize that there have been exactly 19 strikes against 15 different users issued in 9 months (plus a handful of "would-be strikes" against users who were deemed trolls and were simply banned for being trolls). Since the system went into place, there have probably been more diaries about CGVs than there have been strikes issued. Complaints are rare, and thus they are rarely about trivial comments. Mostly people do have "thick skins"; eventually, they may get sick of being insulted repeatedly.

by Nico on Apr 20, 2006 9:17 PM PDT up reply actions

Wait a second

You mean he used "dense" on someone other than me?!

I thought that was our special word... :(

Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Apr 20, 2006 10:22 PM PDT up reply actions

Wait, it was "dense"???

The committee thought it was "dens". Nobody should have to go through being called the wing of a house. Now I feel like a total pantry.

by Nico on Apr 20, 2006 10:33 PM PDT up reply actions

for what it's worth

i support this. of the poll options, i'd add this to the first option and go with that. i don't think it needs to be a full-blown trial by jury, but if the person made a comment to sombody they knew wouldn't get offended by it, then there was no damage done.

by Eric in Atlanta on Apr 21, 2006 5:59 AM PDT up reply actions

Why waste any more time

on the mentioned poster and his "methods"...
IGNORE him......he will most certainly go away if his audience leaves......DON'T engage....when the attention is gone, the allure of "stirring the pot" will be lost. Then you will find him posting on Halo's Heaven just to get a reaction. You see, he feels obligated to be an agitator...he cannot stop this approach to life.

Now THIS is Billy Ball

by Masaryk on Apr 21, 2006 8:13 AM PDT reply actions

Problem is, you need

4000/4000 cooperation. 6 users respond and 3,994 are still in the room, don't have to read but can't prevent. I do agree with you, though. Why fight fire with gasoline?

by Nico on Apr 21, 2006 8:33 AM PDT up reply actions

Speaking as a professional wildland fire fighter

Using gasoline (when mixed with diesel) can be one of the most effective fire tools available.

Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Apr 21, 2006 8:43 PM PDT up reply actions

If anyone is serious about leaving AN

They're likely to do it quietly because they simply don't care anymore. Therefore, I doubt the sincerity of anyone who does:

"THIS IS MY FAREWELL DIARY"

"THIS IS MY LAST POST...GOODBYE AN"

JRBH is the only one I know of that made threats to leave and actually did. And even that was after months of teasing.

For myself, I no longer find ELEPHANTS IN OAKLAND a relevant blog. It's extremely negative no matter how good or bad the team is doing, and Zachary's rants about Ken Macha make his AN detractors look like his fan club. In short, I simply found it to be a waste of time.

In my opinion, THAT'S why people decide to leave.

by Rob @ Athletics Nation on Apr 21, 2006 8:54 AM PDT reply actions