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Around SBN: Notre Dame's Turnaround: How Have The Irish Done It?

Free Agent Market Madness

 The players of the free agent class are commanding a ridiculous amount of money this year.  Remember the 7-year 105 million dollar contract that Kevin Brown signed several years ago?  I remember thinking, "yeah, he's an elite pitcher, but what will his performance be like after year number four?  And what about beyond year number four?"  Turns out that I was pretty close.  Today's contracts are even getting nuttier...for God's sakes, does the average player even play seven years any longer much less produce at lofty level for that long?

Now more than ever, Athletics fans should recognize that adding high priced players at such stratospheric valuations is an invitation for letdown and total payroll inflexibility in the future.  I'd be happy watching some prospect get a shot or someone like Kielty playing more, eventually pricing himself out of the market once he turns into an upper-tiered outfielder.

Beane has made a career out of resurrecting people like Thomas and Foulke, turning players like Jaha, Taylor, Isringhausen, Stairs into desirable commodities, and letting players walk like Giambi, Tejada, and Zito after their maturing, early years netted much production on the relative cheap.

Now is not the time to tinker with the model unless the value is there and the contractual time commitment isn't overly cumbersome.  Beane & Co. are quite the baseball contrarians and they will continue to win more than they will lose as long as they operate in that mode.  This is the off-season that everyone will speculate on just what big named player Billy will pursue when this is precisely the crazy time that Billy will nab an inexpensive someone that leaves most people saying, "What kind of shit is Beane smoking?"  I wouldn't be surprised at all if Beane replaces Zito by bumping up everyone in the rotation and signs someone like Tomo Ohka to be the number five guy for two years...and then we all watch Ohka win 16 out of the five slot with mid-four ERA.

We've watched Beane make the value-plays for almost a decade now; to expect something different would be truly shocking...only not half as shocking as scratching your head over a new acquisition at the beggining of the season and the by the end of the season seeing fans coming to games with their dedicated-to-one-player fan endorsing banner.

Who will be the goat-to-hero player(s) for the '07 season?  Stay tuned!

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I agree, the
owners are acting financially negligent. This reminds me of the NBA a few years ago, when owners dished out absurd contracts. The warriors, for example, gave Richardson, Dunleavy, and Murphy major dough.

Good diary.

I Blog: http://www.operationathletics.typepad.com/

by ProfessorOakland on Nov 26, 2006 6:30 PM PST reply actions  

You are right Professor
and in a few years? The owners will want a salary cap to save them from themselves. <w>

by IM4Oakgal on Nov 26, 2006 6:53 PM PST up reply actions  

Everything old is new again...
...this is exactly the reason the luxury tax came to fruition.

"We can't control how much money we're giving to the players! We need new rules to stop us!"

"It's time to blow this team up." - Oaktoon, July 2006

by Ozzz on Nov 27, 2006 10:29 AM PST up reply actions  

Right On
you are all correct. I think Billy should stay the course and not change the way he operates even after the new stadium is built. Maybe he can keep the good young talent (Swisher,Harden, etc) longer because of increased revenues. Other than that, he should never get into bidding wars over players like Carlos Lee, etc.
"Small World, Big Island"

by thebabe on Nov 26, 2006 7:05 PM PST reply actions  

Yes, I agree
but I wish there was some news coming from BB right now.  I love to find out what he is thinking, who he has targeted to be a good player coming off of a bad year, that is how he operates, I enjoy it, but want to get it started now.

by china bob on Nov 26, 2006 7:31 PM PST reply actions  

I think you're correct, but ...
  1. Ever since the beginning of free agency, silly/bad/unwise contracts have come in waves (with alternating waves of <cough>collusion<cough> common sense) -- and we haven't seen any franchises go bust yet. Yes, there's a school of thought (of which most of us are students) that says that overpaying for past performance = bad -- but is there any empirical proof that it actually is bad for a franchise's off-field bottom-line performance?
  2. This is a question for all you fellow free-marketeers out there: if markets are so infinitely wise as Econ 101 teaches us, then how do we explain the continued absence of sagacity/balance (without anticompetitive collusive cartel action) in the MLB free agenct market? My guess is: because of #1 above, it just doesn't matter how much teams pay free agents. Which, perhaps, is an argument in favor of grover's ditch-the-'small market'-approach theorem.
People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 9:18 AM PST reply actions  

Here's why it isn't balanced, like, ever:
Every market is unique. Some need free agents to keep the fans and press happy (New York), some don't (Oakland). Some throw bullion at FAs and get nothing for it (Cubs, Giants) while others spend a little coin (very little) and get huge returns (Florida).

The simple fact of the matter is, right now, it'd be smart for Billy Beane, in a strict business sense, not to sign any free agents. Yes, we could use a bump up in the rotation, and we could certainly use some power hitting, but if it costs you $100m to get it, is the return ever going to be worth it?

That said, the pressure will be on Billy to make just such a move. If anyone can resist that pressure, it's him, being as he's a part owner of the team and the least likely GM to get fired in the entire league - but there's still pressure to do it.

Now, imagine the pressure in Chicago, or Detroit, or St Louis. Imagine the pressure on the Braves and the Mariners. Their local press and fans DEMAND that they get into that loaded market and set some Benjis free.

In strict market terms, Detroit doesn't need free agents. They're good for the next three seasons. But they'll get them, because now there's expectations involved, and a GM that doesn't feed the expectation machine is usually a GM looked down upon for 'not doing his job.'

But just going out to get free agents is not a guarantee of wins, because every team is in different circumstances.

Let's examine Florida and Tampa Bay for a moment. Both struggle to get fans, despite good-sized population bases. Both have low payrolls. Both get no love from the press. Both have, at best, absentee owners (and at worst, Cameron Diaz in Major League). Both have young teams and rely heavily on developing talent - then either using it, or trading it for vets.

Yet Florida has won a couple of World Series and Tampa can't get near the playoffs. Why?

1. Divisional imbalance. To get to the playoffs, Tampa has to be better than the Blue Jays, Red Sox, Orioles and Yankees, who load up their teams with expensive free agents. That doesn't mean those teams get to the playoffs more than the Braves, because they're beating each other to death with those FAs, and not Atlanta. But seriously, how is Tampa supposed to unearth a DH among their kids that can match up to a DH from Boston or New York?

Meanwhile, Florida has to only get past the ever-present Braves, the sometimes hot, most times not Mets, the never-present Phillies and the dying flounder that is Washington/Montreal to get a playoff spot. And from there, it's a crapshoot.

2. History. If you're a free agent and you can choose to go either to Florida or Tampa (rough choices, granted), you're going to Florida every time, if the money is equal. Because they've been to the Series, they win regardless of reputation of their starting lineup, and they might just move to a new city with a big stadium some time down the road. Tampa never will, and they'll forever be the punching bags of the AL East.

I could go on, but the point is this - strict market pressures (IE: The need to win) don't depend on signing free agents. 'Local market' pressures might. Media pressure might. 'Saving the GM from embarassment' might.

But the market relies only on getting past the guys in your division so you can roll the dice in the playoffs, and free agents, as the Yankees will attest to, don't roll dice much better than kids.

"It's time to blow this team up." - Oaktoon, July 2006

by Ozzz on Nov 27, 2006 10:52 AM PST up reply actions  

so, basically ...
... your theory is that once the new ballpark opens in Fremont, and the SJ fans are unloosed from their 20-mile-long 880 chains and flood into the arms of A's fandom, Beane will be forced to sign expensive, unproductive free agents?
People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 11:10 AM PST up reply actions  

Nope.
I'm saying that if he moved to Portland or Vegas, yes, there'd be more pressure to sign free agents.

A move down the highway won't change much in that respect, other than giving him a little more cash so he can sign an FA if he chooses to.

"That's one osteoporitic offense." - Jeepers, on the SF Giants

by Ozzz on Nov 27, 2006 1:58 PM PST up reply actions  

I'm not following
So, the A's will attract new SJ fans -- new fans who will somehow have neither the prejudices (SIGN SOMEONE WHOSE NAME I RECOGNIZE! NOW!!!) nor the influence (>5 years post-new-ballpark, no splashy FA signings = declining attendance) that fans in other metro areas possess?

I'd venture a guess that any new fans coming over from SJ would likely be more prone to such uninformed prejudices than savvy-but-MLB-starved denizens of Portland or Vegas -- if a consumer in SJ is already a baseball afficionado, then s/he either is (a) already a Giants fan, or (b) unduly disincented by the extra 20 minute drive up the road to the Coli.

People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 2:14 PM PST up reply actions  

Bay Area fans already know what the A's are.
And they know the A's win on a shoestring. There's no need to fork out billions just to win another few games in the playoffs, because we're already right in there amongst the elite.

But if you're moving to Vegas, well, you better make a splash. Portland less so, but there are some markets that scream for bright light names, and Vegas, New York, LA, Chicago - those are the places.

"That's one osteoporitic offense." - Jeepers, on the SF Giants

by Ozzz on Nov 27, 2006 2:23 PM PST up reply actions  

But they're not A's fans
According to you, those of us who are currently A's fans but either won't be or simply won't go an extra 20 minutes out of our way to attend many games in Fremont are inferior fans and should be disregarded (at least by A's ownership; and I don't really disagree with that).

What, however, does the corollary say about fans in SJ who won't currently go an extra 20 minutes out of their way to go see a historically consistently good team?

Yes, the Coli sucks and mgmt has been disincenting fans to attend.

But you seem to believe that there's some mythical breed of robofans in San Jose who magically have all the benefits and none of the drawbacks of fanbases everywhere.

People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 2:49 PM PST up reply actions  

I didn't say there are no drawbacks in SJ.
You're basically losing one group of fairweather fans and hoping to gain a much bigger group.

For mine, anyone who says they wouldn't go twenty minutes further down the road to watch the A's is pretty much the kind of fan that has made the move an imperative.

"That's one osteoporitic offense." - Jeepers, on the SF Giants

by Ozzz on Nov 27, 2006 3:12 PM PST up reply actions  

well, if the difference is quantity, not quality
... then why wouldn't the SJ robofans demand flashy, stoopid FA signings?
People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 5:23 PM PST up reply actions  

New stadium gets you 3-5 years of packed houses.
After that, you better be performing.

Thankfully, the A's are already performing.

"That's one osteoporitic offense." - Jeepers, on the SF Giants

by Ozzz on Nov 28, 2006 9:18 AM PST up reply actions  

<Munch painting>
Yeah, and a brand-new stadium ANYWHERE IN THE FREAKIN' BAY AREA would have guaranteed sellouts for the first 3-5 years. Proximity to SJ is immaterial to that matter.

(And for the last time, that's not an argument against Fremont; the Fremont location is by all accounts the best satisficing site that comes closest to optimizing the needs of the stakeholders involved. But the location has zilch to do with attendance the first 3-5 years.)

People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 28, 2006 11:44 AM PST up reply actions  

No.
Proximity to SJ AND Oakland (and Fremont and Palo Alto and whatever else is nearby) has a major impact.

You're moving the place from one city with a small population (comparatively) to another city smack dab between the original AND another (underserved) city with more money and more population.

Big fish, three ponds.

"That's one osteoporitic offense." - Jeepers, on the SF Giants

by Ozzz on Nov 28, 2006 12:47 PM PST up reply actions  

<rolls eyes>
... yeah, basically, so long as the new stadium isn't in the Marin Headlands, a Bay Area stadium will be proximal to ... the Bay Area.
People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 28, 2006 12:49 PM PST up reply actions  

Which is like saying a California stadium...
...would be proximal to California.

Technically correct, but intentionally avoiding nuance.

"That's one osteoporitic offense." - Jeepers, on the SF Giants

by Ozzz on Nov 28, 2006 12:53 PM PST up reply actions  

also ...
... you seem to think that I made some sort of argument in my original post regarding on-field performance, which I certainly did not.
People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 11:11 AM PST up reply actions  

Granted.
But what I'm saying is that on-field performance is the barometer of success, but success alone isn't what compels a team to dive into the free agent market.
"That's one osteoporitic offense." - Jeepers, on the SF Giants

by Ozzz on Nov 27, 2006 1:59 PM PST up reply actions  

agreed, I think ...
... if on-field performance is the barometer of the team's (vs the franchise's) success -- and/or perhaps of the GM's success.

Though Beane's unique situation with an ownership stake complicates that last one.

People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 2:08 PM PST up reply actions  

I don't think there's much doubt...
...that Beane's all about the on-field success. The profits are nice, but they're not his motivation beyond staying within the budget set by others.
"That's one osteoporitic offense." - Jeepers, on the SF Giants

by Ozzz on Nov 27, 2006 2:12 PM PST up reply actions  

Free-marketeer question
I'm not sure what you're getting at with "infinitely wise", but the answer to your question is that the market in baseball players is not particularly free. Or, more precisely, it is not very liquid and not very deep.  I couldn't tell you the equations, but it is a basic lesson of Econ 101 that illiquidity is correlated with volatility in a market.

In the larger economic sense, baseball players are entertainers. Baseball talent per se isn't an economic skill; it's not like you can go out in the fields, hit a bunch of home runs, then bring them back into town to sell at the market. If you're a baseball player you're marketable only to an organization prepared to showcase you in a spectator sport, and there aren't that many of those, especially at the top talent levels.

As for the teams, we like to think of them as independent competitors in the market, but we tend to confuse sports competition with market competition. Economically, baseball teams aren't in competition with one another at all; they are in competition with other sports, other TV programming, other fashion trends, other things to do on a Sunday afternoon, etc.

Addressing questions of cartel and competition within the league is problematic because in many senses the entire league is the economic unit. One can't treat the franchises as completely independent because their profitability is wholly dependent on being in a league. Suppose, for example, that Steinbrenner gets tired of revenue sharing and takes the Yankees out of the league, then what? He could have a great team, but what would they do? Who would they play? It may seem like a pointless competition sometimes, but if there weren't teams like the Devil Rays to be better than, the Yankees wouldn't have any product to sell.

As for huge salaries to top-of-the-line players, it may seem ridiculous to us, but it's not uncommon for this sort of market. We see it all the time with movie stars, pop singers, etc. In recent decades, improvement in information technology has increased the disparity between the earnings of the top few compared to everyone else. If anything, athletes are at a disadvantage in this, because the market for their product is so constrained. Athletes are dependent on the league system in a way that pop singers and movie stars are not. Someone like Eddie Murphy or Drew Barrymore can tell the studios to buzz off, find his/her own financing, and produce his/her own movies for public consumption. Alex Rodriguez doesn't have that option.

Summary: (1) economically, professional athletes produce entertainment, not sports skills per se; (2) as an entertainment product, the few superstars at the top really are worth that much; (3) the pricing of their contracts is erratic and volatile because the market is never deep or liquid enough to settle down.

"...but we're also always open to hearing about other sandwiches if it can make our lunch better." -- Nico, channeling Billy Beane

by iglew on Nov 27, 2006 12:49 PM PST up reply actions  

excellent response
That was pretty much what I was fishing for: an actual informed explanation of why/how the FA market isn't a "normal"/ideal market.

However, the one thing I feel qualified on which to quibble is this:

Baseball talent per se isn't an economic skill; it's not like you can go out in the fields, hit a bunch of home runs, then bring them back into town to sell at the market.

  1. If it's a specific skill (especially one subject to rudimentary quantitative analysis and that at least roughly correlates compensation to performance) subject to recompense, then isn't it per se an economic skill? I mean, Maurice Saatchi (for example) never delivered a tangible good in his life, but I'd certainly call him a purveyor of an "economic skill."
  2. I'd also argue that the FA market for hitters is precisely as you describe it: a batter "harvests" HRs, warehouses them in his statistics, and then sells those statistics (much more so than his projected HR futures) at the market. That's the problem with paying for past performance: you're buying goods that have already been used up.
People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 1:28 PM PST up reply actions  

Another little thought to inject...
...is that the statistics that are kept on players are not linear.  For example, if you were to take the base of the OPS+ statistic (let's call it .750 just to throw a number out there), it is not correct to say that anything above .750 -- assuming the players' fielding is comparable -- should command and equal amount of compensation for every basis point above the base.  We all know that a player with a OPS that approaches 1.000 (or OPS+ .250 in my hypothetical) is going to be significantly more valuable, and compensated much more by relative comparison, than a player with a .900 (or OPS+ .150).  The reason being is that you cannot replace that .100 (that opportunity cost) of going with the .900 OPS player rather than going with the "likely" more expensive 1.000.  This is one of the reasons why Alex Rodriguez, considering relative worth to his team, MIGHT be considered a better bargain than Miguel Tejada is for the money.  

But, personally, I like Beane's approach, assemble teams with more balance (and less flashy/superstar players) with less payroll, develope new superstars, and win while having this constant player churn.  It sucks if you are a player-dedicated fan but if you understand the process -- and get on-board with it -- you may just be able to enjoy the Athletics more because of it

4 8 15 16 23 42

by LowcountryJoe on Nov 27, 2006 1:43 PM PST up reply actions  

true, except that ...
... much like Trotskyists argue that "true" socialism has never actually been put into practice by a state, I'd argue that "true" Beane-ism has yet to actually be put into practice (not that I'm arguing in favor of the former ism): Rhodes, Kotsay, Loaiza, Kendall, the Dye and Hatteberg extensions, etc.

I'm right with you, LCJ, in enjoying the putative method extracted by observers from watching Beane -- I just wish he'd hew to it more closely.

People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 2:03 PM PST up reply actions  

One key point
that I don't think has been mentioned (though LCJ and mdl both hint at it) is the fact that the pool of good players and the pool of roster spots and playing time available are both limited. On a strict dollars per win basis players like Scutaro, Hatteberg, and Saarloos are certainly better values than Soriano or Zito, but you can't simply buy three Scutaros instead of one Soriano, or two Saarlooses instead of a Zito - there are only around 6000 plate appearances and 1450 innings pitched to go around, and a fair accounting of a player's cost has to include the opportunity cost of the playing time that you allot him.

In fact, if you look at the list of leaders in marginal wins per marginal dollar, in many recent years Tampa Bay has been right there at the top with Oakland and Minnesota because they've managed to put together 60 or 70 win teams for near the minimum salary. But you won't find many people who consider Chuck LaMar to be as good an executive as Billy Beane or Terry Ryan. Taking a team to the next level requires paying full price (or close to it) for at least a few very good players, and since there are only a few of those on the market at a given time, the cost per win of those players is significantly more than it would be in a market where "wins" were a liquid commodity. There's just no substitute for top-line talent.

This leaves the A's in a pretty tough spot right now. There are almost no free agents that seem attractive to me right now for the money that they'll command (including those who have already signed). $10 million/year for Ted Lilly or Gil Meche? No thanks. But without someone to replace the production from Zito and Thomas, it's hard to see how this team will finish much above .500. Beane is smart, but he's no magician, and I expect he'll be forced to sign or trade for at least one "bad" contract before the off-season is over in order to try to stay competitive.

In the stands the home crowd scatters For the turnstiles

by andeux on Nov 27, 2006 2:27 PM PST up reply actions  

Excellent points
With regard to your last point, this is why I'm more and more swayed by grover's nexus of arguments around his Vernon Wells obsession -- and in essence ready to pretty much concede '07 in order to save $ for a "bad" contract in '08 by not taking on multiple "awful" contracts in '07.
People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 2:45 PM PST up reply actions  

I'm obsessed?
I thought I just needed an editor.
Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Nov 27, 2006 2:53 PM PST up reply actions  

I was goading
I thought that might draw you out of the woodwork into this conversation ...
People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 2:56 PM PST up reply actions  

I already threw in my .02
Check lower in the thread.
Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Nov 27, 2006 2:59 PM PST up reply actions  

I think I found what's ailing you
grover's disease in the winter
People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 3:20 PM PST up reply actions  

Feeling fine, thanks
Although I am a little bothered that I had 3 diaries going and you didn't give a damn.

Meany.

Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Nov 27, 2006 3:41 PM PST up reply actions  

<yawn>
People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 3:45 PM PST up reply actions  

You know
there's a reason why your kind are going extinct. And it's not just because you're lousy in the sack.

(Yes, your simian inadequacies have reached human ears. And we're all LAUGHING!)

Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Nov 27, 2006 3:55 PM PST up reply actions  

a monkeypox on both your houses!
:P
People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 5:05 PM PST up reply actions  

'per se' = by itself
Maybe I didn't word it very well, but the point I was trying to make is that baseball skills aren't marketable in a vacuum. They're only good as a means to the end of providing entertainment through a very specific (and ultimately arbitrary) type of competition.

I certainly didn't mean to suggest it isn't a marketable skill; just that it has a very narrow market. (The market being the teams that hire, not those of us who watch.) Obviously, any job skill is ultimately dependent on the market for it and the economy in general. I'm just saying that baseball is especially so, and that helps explain why the market for baseball labor doesn't behave as smoothly as the market for more generic kinds of labor.

"...but we're also always open to hearing about other sandwiches if it can make our lunch better." -- Nico, channeling Billy Beane

by iglew on Nov 27, 2006 10:41 PM PST up reply actions  

ah, I see
Thanks for the clarification. Agreed.
People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 28, 2006 11:45 AM PST up reply actions  

I think you are
quite mistaken. With a few exceptions (Bonds, Ichiro), the best way to improve a franchise's off-field performance through roster makeup is to improve the team's on-field performance.  The Angels franchise has dramatically increased in value, due in very large part to the Series victory.  

By what convoluted formula would overpaying for free agents (and thereby hurting the team for the sake of argument) help a team's bottom line more than fielding a winning team?  Are South Bay luxury box-minded tech companies more likely to empty their coffers for a mediocre but Vernon Wellsful team than for a winning team?

The only way I can see your argument making sense is if it doesn't matter that much what teams do with their roster at all.

by mikeA on Nov 27, 2006 1:23 PM PST up reply actions  

uh, actually ...
... I don't think there's any meaningful correlation at all between winning percentage and profits/appreciation. IIRC, there have been multiple SABR studies to this point.

That's why the Royals and the D-Rays continue to make money hand over fist -- and why the Royals have been doing MAKE A MOVE! ANY MOVE! FA signings the last couple of years: it gives the illusion of competition to their fans.

People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 1:32 PM PST up reply actions  

So.....
"the illusion of competition" through bad free agent signings=profit, but actual competition doesn't matter?  The Royals are in the black because they signed Reggie Sanders and Mark Redman?

To the extent that winning percentage doesn't matter, that just goes to the point that I admitted was plausible, which is that roster makeup doesn't make much difference.  If winning percentage doesn't matter, I don't think flashy free agents matter.

by mikeA on Nov 27, 2006 2:26 PM PST up reply actions  

fair point
But a flashy-albeit-stoopid FA signing can have immediate payoffs (in offseason advance-ticket and season-ticket sales), while low performance can take several years to erode attendance.

In any case, though, I think both arguments rely too heavily on the attendance = franchise health canard.

People wanted Washington because he would do a better job of establishing the run. -- andeux @('.')@

by monkeyball on Nov 27, 2006 2:42 PM PST up reply actions  

It's not that the franchises will bust...
The fact is that when one of these waves of overpaying for free-agents sweeps by, the teams that don't participate in the bruhaha end up enjoying the spoils of victory in the following years as the level of competition falls.

As for #2, I'll leave that to the economists.

"It ain't easy chasing a dang Hall of Famer!" -Nick Swisher, reffering to his older brother, Frank Thomas

by The Lonesome Undertaker on Nov 28, 2006 7:54 AM PST up reply actions  

can't disagree:
"Now is not the time to tinker with the model unless the value is there and the contractual time commitment isn't overly cumbersome.  Beane & Co. are quite the baseball contrarians and they will continue to win more than they will lose as long as they operate in that mode."

-exxxxcellent.smithers, release the hounds!.  

"If the fans don't come out to the ball park, you can't stop them."- Yogi Berra.

by bigelephant on Nov 27, 2006 10:41 AM PST reply actions  

And now isn't the time to sign
a splashy FA.

I know that might sound a little weird coming from a guy who just wrote a 3 volume novel about spending millions and millions of dollars but I wasn't talking about this year. There isn't a big ticket player in this year's market that could significantly help the A's. (Well, maybe Lugo if the A's were going to get rid of Crosby but even I doubt that's going to happen.)

2007 is when the A's are going to figure out were they are short. Can Crosby and Harden give the A's full seasons? Which AAA arms are for real? Will the next batch of position prospects make the jump from AA to AAA and be ready for the Show in 2008?

There is no sense spending a bunch of money now when you don't know where the problems are.

Why yes. I am a ray of warm and fuzzy sunshine.

by grover on Nov 27, 2006 11:04 AM PST reply actions  

devalued dollar
Due to the significant decrease over the past 6 years in the buying power of the dollar, a $150 million deal today is roughly equivalent to a $96 million deal in 2000.  2002-2004 were abnormally depressed years when not a lot of cash was flowing, but the point is that today's bigger deals like Soriano's are not as skewed as they seem.

The Red Sox posting fee isn't that large when you consider what Ichiro received, and how much the dollar has decreased against the Yen over that time.

If anyone is helped by the economics of the past 4 years, it is the Blue Jays, who have seen a 25%+ increase in the value of their local revenues against the dollar (I'm assuming their contracts are in US dollars).

So what's my point... these large contracts, while large, aren't nearly as large as they seem.

by dylan on Nov 27, 2006 2:36 PM PST reply actions  

Exchange Rate
has nothing to do with the large contracts flying around.  The devaluation of the dollar does have an effect on the two examples you mentioned (TBJ's and Japanese posting process), but doesn't have anything to do with the rest of the closed US-only system.  

If you want to adjust the contracts to their historical equivalent, you could use a traditional macro-economic measure, such as GDP Deflator, CPI, or PPI.  However, if you want to use a better measure, you could adjust the salaries for the percentage of total revenues players receive versus historical averages.  Since this system is nearly closed, then absolute or even adjusted dollar amounts are meaningless.  It is the sharing of the pie that shows the level of overspending.  

The percentage of revenues that goes to player salaries is set in basketball, football, and hockey and helps to control bubbles.  Based on the new CBA and the cash generation of MLBAV, I suspect that this percentage will be no higher in 2007 (+/- 2%) than it was in 2000.  As the new wave of analytically-trained business people continue to purchase major sports teams, this percentage will likely continue to converge as competitive intelligence and analysis takes hold.      

Signatures? We don't need no stinking signatures.

by jubjub on Nov 27, 2006 3:44 PM PST up reply actions  

was mixing topics
Sorry, I was a little unclear in mixing two points.

The size of the pool available has become inflated with record revenues and the new deal, which is a result of inflation over that time (my point about the buying power of the dollar).

I don't disagree that the percentages of revenue that players receive is roughly the same out of the total, but the dollar amounts are a lot larger.  People seem to be surprised by how much larger salaries are this off-season, but I'm not surprised at all due to inflation and the new labor deal.

by dylan on Nov 27, 2006 9:09 PM PST up reply actions  

Piazza
ESPN is reporting that the A's are seriously talking to Mike Piazza. If this deal goes through, it looks like we're out of the Bonds market. I think. Hmm. What do y'all think of Piazza in white cleats? Personally, I think it could be good. He's still got a decent bat and could platoon with Swish at first on occasion. Lord knows he wouldn't be sharing any catching time with KenDoll...

by AsBrand on Nov 27, 2006 3:32 PM PST reply actions  

it does make some sense ...
 There's a spot between Bradley and Chavez just sitting there for a right-handed power hitter. If you take Piazza's catcher numbers last year and add at-bats for being a DH instead of catching, you're looking at 28 HRs, 85 RBIs.  

by vk on Nov 27, 2006 5:17 PM PST up reply actions  

Hello, I am an A's fan and I live in San Jose
It is crazy to think that sports fans in San Jose don't already know the A's.  Anyone who thinks that hasn't been walking around the malls in SJ seeing all the A's hats.  Right now the A's might be more popular than the Giants, maybe for the first time in Bay area sports history?  The Dodgers out-drew the Angels for the 2 teams first  40 or so years in the same market, but in 2004 it was 3.4 to 3.3 mil.  The Angels have finally competed for the fans ticket money.  I believe the A's move to a nice new park with the added bonus of them being a better team will mean the A's will someday draw more than the PacBell-Giants.  This might be true no matter where the A's new park is.  But San Jose has the highest average income of any city larger than 500K in America.  It seems like a good market to get closer to.

by barryzitoforever on Nov 28, 2006 11:44 AM PST reply actions  

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