DLD 10/19/07: Hug It Out + Diego 3.5
by Apricot on Oct 18, 2006 11:33 PM PDT
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PrintLooks like no quick move is forthcoming on the manager hire. This gives a chance for more people to make completely off-the-wall suggestions as to who should be our next pinata.
Purdy, following up on his "Macha Massacre" blog post, cleans it up for print and adds that all the remaining coaching staff has been told they will be back. I would think an outside candidate would want some say over staff, so either Purdy is wrong or the A's are set on promoting from within.
John Ryan, going out on a limb, says the perfect A's manager is a man not afraid to say "Hug it out, bitch."
Baker patiently waiting to see what's next (AP)
Dusty Baker knows if he is meant to manage again, it will happen. For now, he's back in Northern California tending to all of the things he didn't have time for while leading the Chicago Cubs. On Thursday, he will fly to Detroit to do television work for the World Series. "I don't have a plan," Baker said Wednesday in a phone interview.
(My god, how long will they flog this angle? Dusty is not coming to the A's. No way.)
General love for Wash in the SJMN poll for next A's manager.
In case you missed it...
Zonis and Jeepers held their noses and sent this Griffin article (shorter version: Beane fired Macha for not joining the scary Moneyball cult) to be whipped by the FJM dudes. Sort of like feeding a mouse to a pet snake.
Tim Kawakami remembers a peculiar Beane-Macha showdown.
----
We're almost at the end of Season Three of our carefully plotted romantic comedy, "The Dialogues of Diego Chavez".
- Season One
- Season Two
- Season Three So Far (1. Grover Woos Tapir, 2. Thunderbutt Woos Toilet, 3. Kyli Woos Slusser, 4. Whiteshoes40 Woos Hairy Chins)
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ken-doll willing to give up some money
GOD is Milton's agent?!
Kawakami's blog item
He openly disrespects Macha, in his own office, in front of a reporter, and then re-signs the guy to a three-year contract.
This tells us
a) Billy had no respect for Macha
b) Billy thinks the manager is irrelevant.
Both answers say something bad about Beane. If it's a, what in the world was Beane doing signing Macha to a three-year contract extension. If it's b, why did Beane think it so important to fire the guy and eat his contract?
I was never a big Macha fan, but it's hard not to sympathize with the guy in a situation like that. Macha was a blue-collar baseball lifer from Western Pennsylvania who worked his way up the ladder to get a chance to manage a good major league team. (He gets this chance, by the way, only after Beane denies him the opportunity to interview for the Red Sox job.)
Macha, upon getting the job, has the right to expect a minimal amount of respect. He knows Beane is the designated genius who wants things done his way, but he would reasonably expect to be treated with basic respect, if only because to do otherwise would send the team a bad message.
But does Beane care? No.
This seems like a pretty significant flaw in Beane. He's a very smart and charming guy, qualities I saw at AN Day. He's led to the team to a lot of success. But, it seems, he also treats his managers like crap, and he doesn't even bother to hide it.
How does doing that benefit Beane or the A's?
it's "b"
"If it's b, why did Beane think it so important to fire the guy and eat his contract?"
macha was fired not because managers are actually valuable, but because he couldn't get along with the players. aside from not screwing up, managers need to get along with the players, front office, and media. that's all macha needed to do, and he failed by mismanaging the bullpen and by pissing off most of the players.
it could be a flaw in beane, ego and disrespect, but it could also be that beane is informal and laid back and didn't think it was a big deal to eat in macha's office. is that the case? i don't know, but it's possible.
Beane may be informal...
Everyone knows Beane doesn't place a high value on managers, but there's no reason to rub it in, especially in front of a reporter.
That was the problem with last year's negotiation. If you don't give Macha a raise, he's going to come back unhappy. At that point, why bother bringing him back at all? He had to crawl back for his old job, a spectacle that I'm sure didn't go unnoticed by the players.
You know what?
When you're headed to the playoffs, you wear it.
When you cruise to the ALCS, you wear it.
Gve any of us 'blue collar' lads and lasses a million a year to be Billy Beane's punching bag, and I'm damn sure I'll be there to take the shots.
So managers ARE important
Since managers don't matter, why does the bullpen mismanagement matter?
I'm a good little stathead and all that, but hardcore SABRheads can't have it both ways.
managers
maybe it's not that managers don't matter, but that most managers are competent enough that the difference between one and the next (on teawm W-L record) doesn't really matter very much.
obviously there could be a bad manager: start scutaro in center field, have frank thomas steal every time he's on base, let harden throw 140 pitches, etc.
But what are "most" managers?
Furthermore, to use an example, what type of manager is Joe Torre? Judged not just as manager of the Yankees, but for his career as a whole? Great, good, average, mediocre, horrible? IMO, context matters. Most managers might do well in certain situations, while struggling in others. Added to that, managers are human too. They can grow, improve, change, whether for the better or the worst.
Don't get me wrong, in my humble opinion, the GM is much more important. So are the players.
hamdan v rumsfeld reference!
are there fewer film references this season or am i just missing them?
You're a law student?
You have my deepest sympathies. (Been there, done that.)
-Nick Swisher
by kaweahkaweah on Oct 19, 2006 8:33 AM PDT up reply actions
Advice . . .
technically speaking ...
will the role of hamdan's dog
new IE
but is it killfile compatible?
who has two thumbs and hates todd packer?
by ucla kid on Oct 19, 2006 1:02 AM PDT reply actions
More Diego?
I've tried reading that a couple of times...
Oh yeah...BORING!
You could not have taken this more wrongly!
It's Zonis' link that I find boring.
My fault for not being clear.
I thought you were clear.
I find being called H'Oz boring.
what the heck is this thing you keep linking
its a translated novel
This kind of thing was pretty common, though, so I wasn't surprised.
One by one, the people on the left side of the class started to introduce themselves. They raised their hand, then announced their name, the name of their old school, and other trivial stuff, such as a hobby or favorite food. Some people mumbled their way through it, a few had some pretty interesting introductions, while some tried to tell lame jokes that lowered the room's temperature by a substantial degree. As the different people introduced themselves, my turn was approaching. I'm starting to get nervous! Everyone should understand how I'm feeling right now, right?
After I managed to finish my carefully thought-out, minimal-length introduction without stumbling over my words too much, I sat down, feeling the relief you get after having finished something unpleasant but necessary. The person behind me stood up for her turn and¯ah, I probably won't forget this for the rest of my life¯said the words that would be the topic of conversation for a long time.
"My name is Suzumiya Haruhi. I graduated from East Junior High."
Up to this point the introduction was still normal, so I didn't even bother turning around to look at her. I just stared at the front and listened to her crisp voice.
"Normal humans don't interest me. If anyone here is an alien, a time traveler, slider, or an esper, then come find me! That is all."
Upon hearing that, I couldn't help but turn around.
She had long and slender black hair. Her cute face was filled with daring and challenge as the rest of the class stared at her. Her seriousness and determination shone through her glinting eyes and long eyebrows. Her small lips were tightly pursed. This was my first impression of this girl.
I still remember how gleaming her white throat was-- she turned out to be quite pretty.
Haruhi, with her provocative eyes, scanned the class slowly, stopped to glare at me (I had my mouth wide open), and then sat down without so much as a smile.
Was she trying to be dramatic?
At that moment I believe everyone's mind was filled with question marks, and that everyone was confused as to what their reaction should be. "Should I laugh?" No one knew.
Well, judging by the conclusion, she wasn't trying to be dramatic or funny, as Haruhi always has her solemn face on.
She is always serious.
Kendall might want to stay
That means we could have Catcher turn from a position of weakness to a position of stregnth, with the two prospects sharing time or platooning.
If we do not trade our prospects, we could have another very rookie-intense lineup in 2008, featuring:
C1 Kurt Suzuki
C2 Landon Powell
1B Daric Barton
2B Mark Ellis (or Kevin Melillo)
3B Eric Chavez
SS Bobby Crosby
LF Nick Swisher
RF Travis Buck
CF Mark Kotsay (or Javier Herera)
DH Frank Thomas
That is as many as 5 Rookies in the starting lineup! (Marlin-esque) 6 if Thomas is not around at the time, and Powell moves to DH or 1st Base.
i really hope kotsay isn't around by 2008
I could extend Kendall through '08
'07: $13M/2=$6.5M. (We get $5M from PIT, so in reality, we'd be spending just $1.5M on Kendall next year)
'08: $6.5M
That would give us a lot more flexibility next year--and judging by Nate's recent (and excellent) payroll analysis, we could really use the added flexibility next year.
I think we need to keep in mind that Suzuki being a productive full-time starter in '08 is the best-case scenario. He could get hurt, or he could really struggle in his first year in the bigs.
Wow. Someone's in best case scenario land.
i'm a kendall fan
I have a sneaking suspicion...
I can see Ellis getting a contract extention in 2008, especially with the new stadium seemingly a done deal at this point.
Also, and this is a lession I think we should have all learned by now, although it's warm and fuzzy to think about Buck, Barton, Herrera, Melillo, Powel, and Sazuki all succeeding in the bigs, realisticly about 2 or 3 of them will end up being another Dan Johnson.
by Threepwood XX on Oct 19, 2006 10:25 AM PDT up reply actions
Will you marry me?
OT- <whimper>
one of us!
I had no idea what was going on.
but what did you think about the show?
"Boone!?!?!"
<flips to FOX>
<throws remote across room>
That's it.
I have no self-control.
Where did the unicorns come from?
Polar bear, curse you.
Stop talking about Lost.
I'm sorry.
By the way...
The first half was pretty good, huh?
you should watch "Alien" then
Hmm... maybe someone with time could do a "Shining" on Alien and cut a new trailer...
The complete works of Charles Darwin
In related news
In related news:
<snerk>
Nice.
It was either that or...
Too much?
or Mark Foley's "Emailin' of the Pages"
There's a new Foley in town.
Every day, a new demonstration that Darwin was right.
is it just me, or ...
no way
nico's courting of the geeses?
"No Dog Left Behind"
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Oct 19, 2006 8:53 AM PDT reply actions
You're a copper cylinder?
So instead of Poopyhead
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Oct 19, 2006 9:18 AM PDT up reply actions
Jesus, Joseph and Mary!
Nobody ever had a cloak.
Guess the wait is over.
Beane would be on crack if he went for this ...
Saw this and nearly burst out laughing. I can't imagine anyone in their right mind that would make this deal, except maybe the Yankees themself.
A-Rod to the A's for Chavy and Harden/Haren? And we get to push Crosby to 3rd?
Because THAT's a good idea. Pssh.
Who thinks up these things???
by heartsforharden on Oct 19, 2006 9:32 AM PDT reply actions
Sort of like a recipe for turning into...
Two big ifs
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Oct 19, 2006 9:40 AM PDT up reply actions
It's the theory, prevalent in sportswriters, that:
Of course, evidence has shown the opposite, but like the 700 Club crowd, they continue to be true believers anyway.
Another thing to consider
not crazy
A-Rod for Chavy straight up, I say yes. Chavy may never be healthy again, gold glove or not. They can have Blanton too, but not Har(d)en.
A-Rod used to be one of the better SS fielders... it might be worth pushing Cros to 3b (or trading him to the NL).
Harden and Haren are the only real untouchables, IMHO.
chavy and blanton
yanks
yep but
I'm with xbx
'Course, I've been the lead ox on the trade-Chavvy-for-A-Rod wagon for some time.
but i'd hate to give up haren
how about this
sign mulder.
trade mulder for haren and hughes.
they're easier to find than ...
Yeah, I wouldn't like losing Haren, either -- or, for that matter, losing Chavvy -- or, for that matter, having to deal with the position conundrum of A-Rod (I'd really prefer him at SS, but CRos ain't the answer at 3B, etc) ...
But for A-Rod? No-doubter, in my book.
Not really.
Figure Chavvy never reaches his "potential" but continues to play good D and starts a slow decline in a few years. That's 5 wins per year for the next four years at a cost of 46 MM.
Haren is being paid 18.5 MM over the next four years, assuming he reaches his IP incentive which kicks in the 2010 option. Haren's been worth over 12 wins for the last two years; lets say he pitches steady for the next few years and then hits a little rough patch. That's 22 wins over the next four years.
So Oakland would receive 40 wins for 64 MM in exchange for 42 wins for 64.5 MM. That's a break-even trade if I ever heard it, and that's a best case scenario for the A's. Pass.
perhaps you still do it
we have windsor (moving gaudin to #4) and at 3b we would have... i'm not sure.
who was the 3b in sacto last year?
spanos did well in midland, same with baisley in kane county, but a-rod would probably have to stay at third.
Also,
clarification, please
We are talking about the same oft-injured 29-y.o. Eric Chavez, and the same rarely injured 31-y.o. A-Rod, right?
i don't know if i'd go that far
was that last year?
and don't forget the shoulder ...
"debacle"?
I'll take your word for it on the WS -- but that's always struck me as the most sporkish of the meta stats.
I think he's using
One problem with WARP is that it sets replacement level too low (at least for hitters), so it ends up overrating everyone based on playing time. That's not a big deal if you're comparing two full-time players head-to-head, but it can be misleading in two for one trades. If you correct for that, this one would look a little better.
And, indeed, I'm not a big fan of win shares either, but I checked the stats on the Hardball Times site, and using win shares above baseline, they have Haren and Chavez as worth around 3 wins/year, and ARod before this year as 6-8 wins/year.
On the other side of things, while ARod's season was not a "debacle," of course, he did have a significant decline at the plate, and by most accounts he looked slow in the field as well. At 31, such a decline could very well indicate a real loss of skills. He's still a very good player, but he may not ever have another season like those he had through 2005.
all true enough
It's certainly an open question of whether '06 was the Beginning of the Decline, or a 1-year blip/debacle. I'd presume that a switch rightward (leftward? I can never remember which way the defensive spectrum is supposed to align) would likely be coming up on A-Rod's horizon; and if there's any player I'd expect to redouble his efforts to remain at the top of his offensive game and physical capacity, it'd be A-Rod. But -- yes, he could indeed be on the downward slide.
There's also the issue of his potential opt-out, which would be for me the significant barrier to any trade involving him. If he required an extension beyond his current contract to not opt out -- forget it. A-Rod at $16M/year (or, using "Beane math" if trade Chavvy, $5M/y) for 3-4 more years is fine by me; but as all of your points indicate, I'd have little interest in him beyond his current contract.
our rotation
i'd probably still do it, but that would probably mean having to rely on both gaudin and windsor.
There's a team 3,000 miles from here
Carl Crawford Possible?
I don't know who we'd give up, but it'd probably start with Blanton, Barton, and a pitching prospect or DJ maybe.
Lilly/Suppan would have to be signed to replace Blanton in the rotation, but that might be too expensive...
Anyway, line-up would look very nice if this were to transpire...
- Kendall C
- Crawford LF/CF
- Bradley RF
- Thomas DH
- Chavez 3B
- Swisher 1B
- Kotsay CF
- Crosby SS
- Ellis 2B
- Kielty OF
- Melhuse C
- Scutaro INF
- Perez INF
- Boccachica INF/OF
- Harden
- Haren
- Loaiza
- Lilly
- Saarloos/Williams
- Street
- Duke
- Calero
- Kennedy
- Flores
- Gaudin
by hillofbeanes on Oct 19, 2006 9:47 AM PDT reply actions
Trades are going to be tough.
Huston Street is one of them. Maybe Blanton...but I'm skeptical other teams view him as valuable.
Trades will be tough...
Unfortunately it would leave us very thin in the rotation and we probably would not be able to afford Lilly after taking Crawford's contract (4 more years at $31M)
Ultimately I don't think there will be much activity this winter, but if there's a chance to get Carl, he'd be the one guy I'd go all out for...Very good top of the order hitter, can get on base, hit for power, and can play Centerfield when Kotsay needs a break...also signed to reasonable contract.
Get 'er done Billy :)
by hillofbeanes on Oct 19, 2006 10:11 AM PDT up reply actions
If they could deal Kotsay...
by Miggy on Oct 19, 2006 11:47 AM PDT up reply actions
roster
yes, we all know street will be in the bullpen...
man
i'm just bitter
Ruck the Foyals
Baseball and the Olympics
I can only think of one way to fix this problem, and it's really kind of radical--make baseball a sport in the Winter Olympics.
In some sites
Alternatively, you could site baseball in a totally different country.
On a barge in the South Pacific!
With DeBarge--that would be terrific!
A's contract status
Joe Blanton $327,000 Under 2 years Would the A's trade him?
Kiko Calero $850,000 Salary arbitration Not a free agent until '10
Justin Duchscherer $345,000 Salary arbitration Big raise due for his results
Ron Flores $327,000 Under 2 years Racked up frequent flier miles
Brad Halsey $346,000 Under 2 years Candidate for rotation
Rich Harden $1 million $2 million Signed through '08; team option '09
Dan Haren $700,000 $2.2 million Signed through '09; team option '10
Joe Kennedy $2.4 million Salary arbitration Free agent after 2007
Esteban Loaiza $6 million $7 million $8 million in '08; $7.5 million team option in '09
Kirk Saarloos $354,000 Salary arbitration Swingman would prefer to start
Huston Street $340,000 Under 2 years Long-term extension time?
Jay Witasick $1 million $1.75 million Injured nearly all of '06
Barry Zito $8.25 million Free agent Which big market does he go to?
CATCHERS 2006 2007
Jason Kendall $11 million $13 million He's willing to redo contract (Pittsburgh will pay $5 million)
Adam Melhuse $700,000 Salary arbitration Mired on bench a second year
INFIELDERS 2006 2007
Eric Chavez $9.5 million $9.5 million Signed through '10; team option '11
Bobby Crosby $750,000 $2.5 million $3.5 million in '08; $5.25 million in '09
Mark Ellis $2.25 million $3.5 million $5 million team option in '08
Dan Johnson $330,000 Under 2 years Is he a major leaguer?
Antonio Perez $335,000 Salary arbitration Non-tender candidate?
Marco Scutaro $340,000 Salary arbitration Most valuable sub in ball
Frank Thomas $3.1 million Free agent Both sides want an extension
OUTFIELDERS 2006 2007
Milton Bradley $3 million Salary arbitration Multiyear time?
Bobby Kielty $1,875,000 Salary arbitration Getting pricy for a backup
Mark Kotsay $7.05 million $8 million $7 million in 2008, then free agent
Jay Payton $4 million Free agent Most interesting free-agent decision
Nick Swisher $335,000 Under 2 years Another multiyear candidate
Total $66.5 million $44.45 million
http://www.contracostatimes.com/mld/cctimes/sports/baseball/mlb/oakland_athletics/15795578.htm
Special air from special places
Another good line...
But yeah, "Special air from special places" is pretty much a scatalogical humor slam dunk.
bruce jenkins
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/sfgate/detail?blogid=21&entry_id=9887
i hadn't read the drumbeat since then, so i just saw this. it has to be the worst post of the year:
http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/sfgate/detail?blogid=21&entry_id=9935
of all the stupid colums pushing dusty baker for manager, this has got to be the worst.
jenkins is buddies with baker, baker is looking for a job and wants to return to the bay area, therefore the a's should hire him.
his response to the criticisms of baker is pretty meaningless.
in the second to last paragraph he repeatedly insults and kisses up to beane at the same time.
"I -- and a lot of A's fans -- would be a bit wistful over what might have been."
sure you would be, jenkins, but who are all these a's fans who want baker? please let us know so we can bitch slap some sense into them.
pitchers
so the problem is that baker hasn't had good pitchers other than in 2003, his first year with the cubs, and 1993, his first year with the giants.
and if he's the new a's manager, the best pitching he'll ever have will be in 2007.
Oliver Perez is the worst Game 7 starter ever
http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=sports&id=4675697
Did Oliver pitch last night?
Darren Oliver, I mean.
Managerial updates.
The Nationals don't seem to be sold on Girardi just yet, as their list of managerial candidates is growing:
Girardi, according to sources, remains a strong candidate. But the list of potential managers on the three teams remaining in the playoffs -- Detroit, St. Louis and the New York Mets -- includes Mets coaches Manny Acta and Jerry Manuel as well as Cardinals third base coach Jose Oquendo.
Wash and Dusty Baker are speculated upon later in the article.
Interview will be over a chile relleno dinner.
uh, that "NFL terrorism threat"?
Scariest threat contest?
- Hunting with Cheney
- Canadian Sushi with Chavvy
- Dinner at Applebees
- Doing monkeyball's dry cleaning
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Oct 19, 2006 2:44 PM PDT up reply actions
This is Hilarious!!!!
by saint @ Athletics Nation on Oct 19, 2006 2:37 PM PDT reply actions
And then Jack Cust walked in...
I used to be a huge Macha basher
by BruceBochte on Oct 19, 2006 2:44 PM PDT up reply actions
Eric Byrnes going to the WS
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/sports/sfl-spmlbnotes19oct19,0,5187836.story?coll=sfla-sports-headlines
Byrnes' flight itinerary
But -- damn! -- his hair will look cool.
Ah, little lad, you're staring at my fingers.
But seriously, the movie Night Of The Hunter is one of my favorites.
Your comment is in bad taste, sir.
Selig concerned about lack of minority mgrs.
What was that last sentence for, anyway?
Selig's take:
I will give Bud credit for ...
NLCS game seven open thread?
sitting here in motel in denver
AHHHHHHHHH!!!!
Seriously!!
by BobbyCrosbysGirl on Oct 19, 2006 7:39 PM PDT up reply actions
Weak hearted and A's fans
Okay
I still like Spiezio though. I've always liked that guy.
Is it just me...
OH here you guys are!
Uh, hi bbg.
That's what you said during the prom!
by baseballgirl on Oct 19, 2006 8:12 PM PDT up reply actions
Pretty good series, this one.
You know what Royals Review
HA!
Oh, sorry, did I say that out loud?
I'm officially rooting for the Cards.
<cocks head to one side>
by baseballgirl on Oct 19, 2006 8:28 PM PDT up reply actions
So much for the Subway series.
Is anyone else watching this?!
That was a pretty damn good baseball game
by baseballgirl on Oct 19, 2006 8:45 PM PDT up reply actions
i dislike the cards
well, we're not signing suppan
not that i wanted him
Around when...
have there ever been two world series teams
Nah...
it's because neither team clogs up the bases
Actually, no.
06 cards
i'm so glad the mets lost.
by larrysgurl on Oct 19, 2006 9:21 PM PDT reply actions
yay! i'm glad the mets lost too!!
tigers in 6!
Meanwhile, FOX is trying to figure out
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