Zito

by Mr Alex on Jun 18, 2005 1:06 AM PDT

There are MANY teams out there in contention and in great need of a starting pitcher. I'm sure one of them will package 3 phenomenal prospects that can be a part of this club for the next several years. Zito will be making 8.5 mil next year and will probably be unaffordable after that. I personally don't think he's worth that much. If Beane can get three quality players in return, 2 of which will be on the opening day roster next year, then I'd say trade him. But he'd have to get a starting pitcher, and maybe 2 good hitters back. Don't get me wrong, I love Z, I think he's been a class act in Oakland, but if we're building for the next 5-6 years, then we need to make a deal. I just hope we can field a winning team next year because all this losing is really getting to me. What do you guys think??

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If I were Beane

I would offer him an extention at his current salary. If he says no then trade him. If not we have, at worst a good #2 starter. Package him with Harden and Haren and in 2 years we have the next big 3. Then if meyer picks it up and Blanton keeps gettin better we are back with one of the best staffs in baseball. Also having Dallas Braden in the wings does not hurt.

A hot dog at the ball park is better than steak at the Ritz. --Humphrey Bogart

by West Bay A s Fan on Jun 18, 2005 2:01 AM PDT reply actions

If we can get three...

MAJOR LEAGUE ready phenomenal players for Z from a team (like players either just called up or in AAA on the verge of being calles up...who have been awesome all along), then I say you have to pull the trigger. If its for three phenomenal prospects that aren't ready to contribute though, I say we keep Zito. We're building to contend starting next season, and getting more prospects for our current talent won't help that. Zito can be a great piece to our rotation, and if we aren';t getting pieces we can plug in immediately, we should hold off on trading the big Z.

"The pitcher has got only a ball. I've got a bat. So the percentage of weapons is in my favor and I let the fellow with the ball do the fretting." - Hank Aaron

by ZeroIndulgence on Jun 18, 2005 3:46 AM PDT reply actions

No offense

But if again I hear the phrase "phenomenal prospect" in reference to trading a veteran... I'll go insane. This team is a cycle. Note to self... don't post while grumpy in the morning.

"My motto is I'm fat, but you're ugly, and I can diet." - David Wells

by JLaff on Jun 18, 2005 8:52 AM PDT reply actions

Kotsay does have a clause

in his contract that allows him to declare free agency during the offseason instead of returning to the A's for his final year.

by OaklandSi on Jun 18, 2005 9:51 AM PDT reply actions

I'm sensing a pattern ...

Zito wins ... CAN'T trade Zito.

Zito loses ... how much can we get for him?

Can't we come up with an objective viewpoint of whether or not Zito should stay, regardless of how he performs that particular day?

by Crosbino on Jun 18, 2005 10:26 AM PDT reply actions

couldn't agree more

i get a lot of "what have you done for me lately?" vibe here several times

i personally believe if we sign zito in the off season, it would be a bargain...save the tampa bay game, he's had an excellent year, yet the perception is he's a lost cause...buy low, sell high applies here, too: sign him while his value is low

before you insult someone, walk a mile in their shoes. that way, you'll be a mile away from them, and you'll have their shoes.

by andyc on Jun 18, 2005 5:49 PM PDT up reply actions

I think

(or at least hope) that guys like Kotsay recognize how this team is built to thrive in '06 and beyond and that injuries have severely impacted the team's '05 performance.

The A's track record the last 5 years should outweigh their track record the last 10 weeks.

Nico

by Nico on Jun 18, 2005 12:25 PM PDT reply actions

Several of the

best reasons that the last 5 years have been so good are no longer with the team. This team will be a crapshoot for quite a while.

by bayfrank on Jun 18, 2005 3:14 PM PDT up reply actions

to a buyer

Barry is only 27 years old; has had no serious health issues; is certainly among the top 33% of starting pitchers; he has very strong big game credentials.

But... he has had control problems the past two years; has had a disturbing tendency to give up big flies with men on base or otherwise let a big inning develop.

He's not a 10 million a year pitcher, no matter what craziness is affecting the market. But for a team with money needing one more starter to stabilize a rotation for the next 3-4 years, you could do a lot worse.

So I think he'll command somewhere in the neighborhood of 30 million over 4 years.

To the seller-- all the above is true.

The real questions are twofold: 1) Can the A's-- and their current financial structure (declining attendance; new owner; possible new ballpark and/or move on the horizon-- afford him at almost any price for 3-4 years? Particularly when they are paying Chavez and kendall-- and may have to decide soon regarding Kotsay; 2) If he leaves, is the rotation-- with Harden and haren at the top-- strong enough to contend in the next couple of years? because if the answer is no, then Beane-- without the offense that helped allow Lidle or Harang to ease into this team-- must find a veteran replacement who won't be that cheap, either (a la Redman).

Add to that Zito's willingness (or not) to stay, the potential market for Zito, and the potential changed compensation rules for free agents, and you have a real puzzle.

I think the odds favor an offseason trade, but it's a very close call.

oaktoon

by oaktoon on Jun 18, 2005 5:00 PM PDT reply actions

Good analysis

Though he's not performing up to our standards for him, he's still a Cy Young winner and a "name" pitcher. There are teams (Yanks, Sox) who WILL overpay for him, perhaps even more so than for Mulder or Hudson, because of the perception that Beane doesn't want to let the last of the Big 3 leave. That being said, I don't see the need to trade him now. Offseason seems right to me as well. There's no rush, and no need to let THIS season flush completely down the tubes just yet. In a way, because we're struggling, we're in a very good position. We don't NEED anything right now, and we don't NEED to sell right now either, seeing as Zito has another year on his contract. We're just waiting for the right offer. And when July (or December) rolls around, we're going to have our pick of the deals. No need to rush this one.

by Crosbino on Jun 18, 2005 5:39 PM PDT up reply actions

a great point

that deserves repeating. We really are in a good position to wait. And, hopefully, we get a really desperate team willing to part with some major league ready prospects. If not, we simply enjoy having Zito. If he goes, I am going to be really bummed. I like the guy a lot and given that he is the last of the Big 3, the nostalgia points are big. Yet, if we could get another Haren, I could live with it.

So, as Crosbino points out, we don't need to rush this. Let's just wait for teams to come to us. No shopping players. Let Billy wait for the calls to come and let him play the reluctant trader role as the offers get better and better.

by island of misfit toys on Jun 18, 2005 9:10 PM PDT up reply actions

Zito

Given the deals that Benson, Lieber, Pavano etc got this past winter I would think that Zito could get 10million a year easy.

One might also make the point that the A's need to keep Zito - instead of a prospect - to be serious contenders next year to draw fans.

Beane should try and sign Zito in the off season and if it does not look promising then consider trade options.

by Larry E on Jun 19, 2005 9:43 AM PDT up reply actions

One gets the feeling

that with the Big 3 anyway, Beane valued "quantity" (never misses a start) over "quality" and that as a result, Beane really likes Zito for now and for the future.

Barry leads the league in # of pitches thrown this year, so maybe Beane figures he's REALLY getting his money's worth.

Nico

by Nico on Jun 18, 2005 9:27 PM PDT reply actions

And I think he is getting his money's worth

What's Eric Milton making this year to give up 50 homers and sport a 8.00 ERA? By that standard, Zito's a freakin bargain. He ain't Pedro, but for the moment, I'll take him.

by Crosbino on Jun 18, 2005 9:30 PM PDT up reply actions

What's

Eric Gagne making to go, "OW! Again???"

Or consider what LaTroy Hawkins is making to say, "I just want you to know up front: I can't pitch in the 9th inning. Ow! Sorry, I can't pitch in the 8th, either."

Nico

by Nico on Jun 18, 2005 9:50 PM PDT reply actions

I think everyone should know

One thing about picking up his option: If he pitches 180 innigns or more (on pace for 200), his option is automatically picked up.

California here I come, right back where I started from, Californiaaaaa, Californiaaaaa, here I coooooome (June 24th). (OC, i was inspired)

by ohad on Jun 19, 2005 8:06 AM PDT reply actions

Zito

This reloading on the fly hasn't gone as smoothly as we (probably foolishly) thought it would. Unloading the staff leader will push us into the rebuilding mode for sure. As for the man himself, having to pitch a shutout to win (or no decision) must be getting old.

by skippy 13 on Jun 19, 2005 10:51 AM PDT reply actions