Concessions

by Vaillant on Apr 27, 2005 7:08 PM PDT Comment 25 comments

Lesson 1: How the A's (and Warriors and every other friggin' team) could make more money.

Here's what really bothers me. The other day, I went to the Warriors/Suns game. Great game, probably the best of the year for the Warriors. But, at the start of the second quarter, I wanted a hot dog and a drink, so I got up to go to a concession stand and waited TWENTY FRIGGIN' MINUTES for the six or seven people in front of me to get their food. Why is this? Every time I go to an A's game, a Warriors game, or most any other sporting event the lines take forever and I miss part of the game.

I was going to get something else in the second half, but didn't because of the stupid lines...thereby causing the Warriors to lose a potential sale.

Same thing at A's games. If they were more efficient with the concessions, I'd buy more. And they have every reason to be efficient (the more they sell, the more money they make) and it isn't like getting a hot dog from the stack of hot dogs and pouring a soda should take 3 minutes. It just shouldn't. Does anyone out there understand why it is so painful to buy a hot dog (or nachos/beer/whatever)? Does this bother anyone else? How much revenue do you think they are missing out on? I'd say at least a million or two (if every fan spent one more dollar at a game, that's $2 million right there).

Okay, rant over - long time listener, first time caller - yada yada yada - Go A's!

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I agree

But you have to put yourself in the shoes of the people working at the concession stand. A)most of the people don't say two words to them other than what they want, sometimes in a drunken rant B) minimum wage--the minimum wage jobs I've worked haven't exactly inspired me to break a sweat...I know I know thats not the best attitude to have, but its a fact.

I don't know how to get efficiency, but I do know it bugs the heck out of me when half of the concession stands are closed so the ones that are open are at least an inning and a half wait...

by drudown on Apr 27, 2005 7:22 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

How to do it...

Maybe there could be performance incentives. Something like, for every 5 more people you serve an hour, you get $1 tacked on to that hour's pay. So, you could try to serve 10 more people in an hour and your pay goes up by $2 an hour. That seems reasonable. There has to be a way to get speed up the sales (and therefore make more money). Just think if the A's had to decide to keep a player and it came down to a couple of million...if they made more at the concession stands, they could sign that player.

by Vaillant on Apr 27, 2005 7:31 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

It bothers me too but...

they have are all Union workers and have no incentive to work more quickly. Compare them to the few vendors that work the stands and hustle because they have to pay for their tray and make a profit on each one.

If they would actually pour a bunch of the most popular drink choices in advance it would make it easier. Or if they switched to all plastic bottles for beer and soda it would speed it up as well. Of course that would be more expensive for the concessionaire (Aramark - you could always call them to vent) than kegs or syrup mix.

You have to try to time it right or take your lumps in line. At least they have TV's. Those lines also make it impossible to maneuver around the concourse - especially behind the sections between the bases.

by southofcruiseamerica on Apr 27, 2005 7:52 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

plastic bottles

They actually do have the plastic bottles at the Warriors game and it still took that long. I missed nearly the whole 2nd quarter!

by Vaillant on Apr 27, 2005 8:10 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

My Question...

Do the A's actually make more money if sales go up, or does Aramark? I though that Aramark has a contract with the A's to let them do the vending, and whatever revenue they get, they keep. Do the A's share in the profits in any way?

by HigherPie on Apr 27, 2005 7:55 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

They both do...

the team's share is usually about one third. The important thing for both parties is the margin between wholesale and what the fan pays. Think about how much a beer from a keg or a soda from the fountain costs them as opposed to what they charge the fan. Arte Moreno gets all this credit for lowering beer prices at the Brea Angels Stadium but we never heard exactly how much they were lowered. I'm sure they're still making a killing though. The funny thing about the Union issue is that SBC has the same deal but their lines pale in comparison.

by southofcruiseamerica on Apr 27, 2005 8:06 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Good question...

Anyone know?

I think that if the A's do make more money based on more sales (rather than Aramark), then it would be anti-Moneyball to say "that's just the way things are" rather than trying to create a new better system. I don't blame the employees, I blame the system they work in which either lacks appropriate financial motivation or good management.

Are all the concession stands Aramark?

by Vaillant on Apr 27, 2005 8:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's way more

Than 1/3 to the A's. They don't have to share any of the take with a landlord, because, for all intents and purposes, the A's pay no rent to the city/county. Figure it's closer to 60-65% to the A's, rest to Aramark.

by Jeff in Seattle on Apr 27, 2005 9:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Even though...

the A's don't pay to play there, the City and County do have a stake in the concessions and parking. Plus, you have to account for Aramark's overhead costs. They are a giant in the food service industry and they didn't get that way by giving 2/3 back to the house.

by southofcruiseamerica on Apr 28, 2005 12:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes...

at the stadium they are all Aramark and at the Arena it is all Levy Restaurants. Levy used to have the West Side Club, suite level and diamond seats but that changed about a year ago.

by southofcruiseamerica on Apr 27, 2005 8:12 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Correction...

there are a few stands like the Black Muslim Bakery and the BBQ place down the third base line that use their own employees. It is from an arrangement for minority business owners and the City of Oakland.

by southofcruiseamerica on Apr 27, 2005 8:16 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

independents

Is their service any faster? I may have to check them out at the next ball game I go to.

by Vaillant on Apr 27, 2005 8:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

not sure but...

their selection is limited...no hot dogs at those stands, that's for sure.

By the way a $1 more per fan is $26,000 based on last year's approx. attendance average, not $2 million.

by southofcruiseamerica on Apr 27, 2005 8:28 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

how's that math work?

So, you take the sales, divide them by three (you said the A's get a third, right?) and then knock off the labor and cost of the food and it only comes down to $26,000? I mean, if you figure $1 extra per fan and 2,000,000 fans, that's $2,000,000 to start with...I'd figure the food and beer markups would be significantly higher and the labor rates lower than a mere $26,000/$666,666 = 3.9% profit would show.

by Vaillant on Apr 27, 2005 8:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Oh, I see...

...I must not have been clear in my original post. I meant a million or two dollars per year, not per game. If it was a million or two per game, I bet they'd find a way to get the employees to triple their output!!!!

by Vaillant on Apr 27, 2005 8:35 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

Okay, I see your math

but it has been a problem for years and it just won't go away. I'm sure Aramark would prefer that it was a non-union facility for both wage and speed of service reasons.

Now maybe we can talk about how there are only 2 designated Fastrak lanes out of 20 at the Bay Bridge toll plaza and none easily accessible from the 880 approach.

by southofcruiseamerica on Apr 27, 2005 8:46 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Fastrak

Don't get me started on the lack of 880 access to fastrak lanes at the Bay Bridge...

"I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE'RE YELLING ABOUT!!!" -Brick Tamland, Anchorman

by secret ASian man on Apr 27, 2005 10:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

One Observation

Over the years, there has been increasingly less and less vendors in the stands. I remember there used to be Hotdog vedors, Soda Vendors, Beer Vendors, ect everywhere!

Now there is only a cotton candy guy and an icecream guy who comes around once per game.

Confucius say; Baseball all wrong! Man with four ball cant walk!

by Zonis on Apr 27, 2005 10:18 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

And churros

Don't forget churros.

"I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE'RE YELLING ABOUT!!!" -Brick Tamland, Anchorman

by secret ASian man on Apr 27, 2005 10:18 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think that the concession stand people...

are working as fast as they can. It would make more sense to open up more stands.
Either way the job sucks. I used to volunteer with a club that did the concession stands at Cal games and even if you get a whole assembly line going things still take forever.

by kat on Apr 27, 2005 10:20 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs

Volunteers

Are usually better workers because the'yre working for a cause. I used to work Raider games with my fraternity those were fun. All of the non-profit volunteer groups seem to have disappeared in the last few years. I think we're not reliable enough as in attendance-wise.

The people they have are guaranteed to show, but are probably not the best workers.

"I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE'RE YELLING ABOUT!!!" -Brick Tamland, Anchorman

by secret ASian man on Apr 27, 2005 10:22 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

sacramento rivercats do it right

if you've ever caught a game at Raley Field, they will take your order in your seat, and have it delivered to your seat. That rocked my world.

by Apricot on Apr 28, 2005 12:16 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

The concession profession

If they were more efficient with the concessions, I'd buy more. And they have every reason to be efficient (the more they sell, the more money they make) and it isn't like getting a hot dog from the stack of hot dogs and pouring a soda should take 3 minutes. It just shouldn't. Does anyone out there understand why it is so painful to buy a hot dog (or nachos/beer/whatever)? Does this bother anyone else? How much revenue do you think they are missing out on? I'd say at least a million or two (if every fan spent one more dollar at a game, that's $2 million right there).

Short of pre-preparing food that sits under heat lamps and pre-pouring drinks, how can the process be more efficient without adding addition labor and utility costs? Revenue isn't what's important; amount of revenue above costs is! A business, if they're behaving rationally, will always focus on profit maximization - where marginal revenue is set equal to marginal costs.

And to top it off, the elasticity of the consession product might be such that if some customers were to ever become disatisfied with the higher prices needed to deliver better service, they may even lose more customers because of it.

How to Dismantle an Atomic Bomb-thrower

by LowcountryJoe on Apr 28, 2005 3:52 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs

I don't think heat lamps would be an issue

I think that during the game, the food supply needs to keep up with the demand. The cashiers don't cook or package the hot dogs, other employees do. If they can't keep up, then there is a problem with either the manpower or they have inefficient equipment that needs fixing. While it may take thousands of dollars to put in new equipment, they'd quickly make up for it with additional revenue.

I don't know what the staff makes, but it probably isn't minimum wage, especially if they are union. Figure something like $10 to $15 an hour. So, if you put an additional employee in a stand, at maybe 6 hours of work (guess) that'd be $90 of additional costs. I'd speculate that the markup on the food and drinks is somewhere around 400% (a $1 product costs $5 there) so over the course of the game, $113 additional would have to be brought in. That's hardly anything.

I think the biggest issue is settling and rationalizing the problem rather than trying to find a better way. If the A's didn't try to find a better way to evaluate talent and maximize payroll efficiency, they'd be the Brewers/Pirates/etc. Why can't the Moneyball mindset spread to other parts of the baseball operations?

Finally, I don't think they would need to raise prices, they'd simply need to sell slighty more to make up the costs and they could potentially sell a lot more and therefore make even more money.

by Vaillant on Apr 28, 2005 10:42 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs

I understand your frustration

but you cannot compare the efficiency of a 25 man big league roster to the concession employee pool in the East Bay. It is out of their hands to a degree as the organization wouldn't want ever take on the that entire operation. At the same time, I am sure that they have negotiated the best deal possible for their cut from Aramark.

Hurdles you can't get past:
Ancient facility
Union workers (which means well above minimum wage and a long leash of job security)
An average crowd of 26,000 people

Think of it as traffic during rush hour - to avoid it you just go at a different time (eat earlier or later), take an alternate route (go to an out of the way stand - there are plenty that are alcohol and peanuts/pretzels only that move quicker) or use alternate means (bring your own food).

Your experience sucked I know but even if they adhered to all of your suggestions there would still be complaints. Let it go or send both the A's and Aramark a letter and see what their responses are.

by southofcruiseamerica on Apr 28, 2005 11:58 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs