Thomas and Piazza Refused Arbitration

All this talk and so little

action is making me crazy.

by AlBowe on Dec 7, 2005 7:13 PM PST reply actions

These Pretzels are making me thirsty!

"I'm so green and gold that I hang on every pitch, not just every game." - Lew Wolff

by BleacherDrummer on Dec 7, 2005 10:47 PM PST up reply actions

<cough, cough>

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 11:04 AM PST up reply actions

Thomas always scared me bad

When we had to pitch to him, I mean. I like it, it would be very good to have him.

Oh well, all we can do is wait.

by paradox on Dec 7, 2005 7:15 PM PST reply actions

#1 Reason for Thomas to sign with A's

He won't have to face Barry Zito in the Batters Box. (Because Zito will either be in Oakland, or in the NL).

There are only two races in Baseball, Right Handers and Left Handers.

by Zonis on Dec 7, 2005 7:16 PM PST reply actions

beckett deal already a disaster?

saw this on mccovey...

From Rotoworld

The Red Sox probably won't attempt to sign Josh Beckett to a long-term deal before the start of next season.

"We kind of want to date for a while," said assistant GM Jed Hoyer. "We just acquired him. Let's get to know each other over the next couple months. If we decide we want to do a long-term deal, we'll do that." ESPN's Peter Gammons is going around saying that Beckett's MRI was so bad that the Red Sox aren't sure they'll get 20 starts from him next season. While we find that hard to believe -- he's an injury risk, but the Red Sox had access to the MRI before completing the deal -- waiting is clearly the smart play for Boston here. With two years remaining before free agency, it's not like he'd come cheap if he signed now.

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Dec 7, 2005 7:16 PM PST reply actions

AMEN!

Would love to see the "Big Hurt" in green and gold. A healthy "Big Hurt" that is - a big if. Of course, trusting in the genius of BB (and the rumors), if it happens, it will be an incentive laden contract that won't expose the A's to the risks inherent in Thomas' fickle health the past few years.

by Cy Norris 1980 on Dec 7, 2005 7:22 PM PST reply actions

Anyone affordable

will have to be a risk--that's why they're affordable. With some guys, the risk is they aren't good enough, with some guys the risk is attitude, with others it's health/age. At least we know that if healthy, Thomas is "too legit to quit" when it comes to ability and attitude. If Beane--who likes to deal health risks and keep workhorses--thinks Thomas is healthy enough to sign, that's good enough for me.

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 7:28 PM PST reply actions

Jamie Moyer re-signs

1 yr/5.5 MM

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/sports/2002670956_webmoyer07.html

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 7, 2005 7:30 PM PST reply actions

That's going to give

Satchell Paige some leverage in his current negotiations.

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 7:43 PM PST up reply actions

as mr. burns would say...

"get me mordecai three finger brown!"

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Dec 7, 2005 7:49 PM PST up reply actions

Awww, cute.

I was scared he'd be gone from the Mariners -- I gotta admit, I adore the guy. He's a great person and he's been a great pitcher. The end of Dan Wilson and Jamie Moyer from the M's in the same year would have been sad to see.

"Baseball fans are junkies, and their heroin is the statistic." -Robert S. Wieder

by Kyli on Dec 7, 2005 11:33 PM PST up reply actions

Ok, so this may sound silly

But I am a bit hesitant to vote for the poll on the front page.

I honestly don't know which one I would rather have in Green and Gold. I would like to see a side by side comparison of their stats and also a handful of opinions about their personalities and how they might mesh with the current roster. Then I can make a more informed decision.

Listen to me! I am talking like I am the one calling the shots. I guess what I really want to know is whether or not to be excited if and when one of these deals goes through. I just don't feel educated enough on either guy.

"If I'm not having fun, then I am not playing well" ~Bobby Crosby

by BobbyCrosbysGirl on Dec 7, 2005 7:34 PM PST reply actions

deals

The only deal i dont want to see is Duke to Boston for Wells. Unless its followed by then Wells shipped to...

by sctr76 on Dec 7, 2005 7:49 PM PST up reply actions

Happens ALL the time here...

Listen to me! I am talking like I am the one calling the shots.

...you know that. With all of the Assistant GMs that communicate on this board, it's amazing that Beane has chairs and desks for all of us at the main office.

by LowcountryJoe on Dec 7, 2005 7:50 PM PST up reply actions

Especially chairs,

since Billy throws so many of them.

How about a three way? You, me and some of this pork.-Donny Baker

by gatling on Dec 7, 2005 8:12 PM PST up reply actions

Bad fan!

Asking for evidence before forming an opinion? An outrage!

Beat the Angles (they're obtuse!)

by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 7, 2005 8:14 PM PST up reply actions

Thomas v. Piazza

I voted--along with 90+% of people thus far--for Thomas, and yet the numbers say it's not an obvious choice. The arguments for Thomas would be
1. Piazza was never as good as Thomas, not even close.

Well, actually, he was almost as good. He was definitely close. To wit--
Career numbers:
Thomas: 307/427/568
Piazza: 311/382/555

So the only difference that even comes close to being "big" is in on-base percentage. Both were awesome at the heights of their career.

2. Thomas has shown more recent signs of resurgence.

Sort of, I guess. I think what made me vote for Thomas more than anything was his play in 2005 during that one month he was healthy, or whatever it was. Every hit he had was a homer.

Still, a look at Thomas' stats shows that his run of consistent excellence, which started in 1991, ended in 2000. Since then:
2001 4HRs, 221/316/441
2002 28HRs, 252/361/472
2003 42HRs, 267/390/562
2004 18HRs, 271/434/563
2005 12HRs, 219/315/590

Meanwhile, Piazza's decade of excellence ended in 2002. Since then:
2003 11HRs, 286/377/483
2004 20HRs, 266/362/444
2005 19HRs, 251/326/452

So I don't know, seeing that Thomas hasn't hit for average since 2000, nor has he stayed injury-free since then ... I don't think he's THAT much better of a choice than Piazza. I'd still pick him over Piazza, though, if anything, just for his physical stature.

by rubin sierra on Dec 7, 2005 7:51 PM PST reply actions

OBP >> SLG

Remember, every point of OBP is roughly equal to two points of SLG which makes that difference in OBP a lot bigger than it already is.

There are arguments that can be made for both of them, but I'm rooting for Thomas.
--
Pascal

by mickelsp on Dec 7, 2005 8:00 PM PST up reply actions

Thank you so much!

My next question is about his injuries.

There have been a number of people on this site who constantly say that certain players are injury prone. Yet there is this overwhelming excitement to get a player who I see as being more injury prone than others already on the A's. Doesn't it seem a bit hypocritical of us to say we want a player who is injury prone, when we get mad at out current players when they get injured?

This is not to say that I am against this idea, I am just honestly curious what people think about that.

"If I'm not having fun, then I am not playing well" ~Bobby Crosby

by BobbyCrosbysGirl on Dec 7, 2005 8:06 PM PST up reply actions

I don't think we WANT someone

who is injury-prone. It's more a matter of what we can afford. If Thomas was a certainty to play 150+ games, we wouldn't be talking about him because his salary demands would justifiably be huge. Like most guys on the A's radar, he represents a risk, and one most of us feel is worth taking.

"We've come a long way, and I'm not talking about Virginia Slims, either." - Art Howe

by EastCoastA on Dec 8, 2005 10:31 AM PST up reply actions

add Thomas to the list ...

... Kotsay, Chavez, Harden ...

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 11:05 AM PST up reply actions

Thomas

Frank is also much taller.

What's the point of attaching a number to everything you do? If your numbers go up, you're having more fun.

by AlwaysSweatin on Dec 7, 2005 8:53 PM PST up reply actions

Batting practice, last year...

I think it was a Sunday game, later in the season; anyways it was during that brief period of time between stints on the DL for FT.

Was anybody else there?

Man but he KICKED the shite out of the baeball, like no one I've seen recently (maybe Manny, Ortiz, Sheffield). Reminded me of those long Canseco bombs during Bash Bros BP.

Yeah, I know, it's just BP. But a healthy Thomas could get some fans in the seats (and win some games). Exciting!

And won't he have something to prove? I don't think he's gonna Mo Vaughn on us (God, I hope not)

by eck767 on Dec 7, 2005 8:06 PM PST reply actions

Who's plan B?

The odds of Thomas staying healthy all year aren't good. As a matter of fact the A's should expect an eventual breakdown. So...

If Thomas goes down in the first 1/3 of the season, who takes over at DH?
If he goes down in the middle of the season, who takes over as DH?
If he goes down at the end of the year, who's the DH?

I don't know the answers, but I do know if the best option is Bobby Kielty than the A's are fucked.

I don't hate, I just respond aggressively to stupidity

by grover on Dec 7, 2005 8:06 PM PST reply actions

grover,

I know you've done multiple diaries on different bats to acquire, so I won't ask you to completely rehash those. But who would be your first choice at DH, either through a trade or a FA signing?

How about a three way? You, me and some of this pork.-Donny Baker

by gatling on Dec 7, 2005 8:15 PM PST up reply actions

Depends

If Thomas goes down early, I got nothing.

A midseason injury would likely lead to a trade.

An injury in August or September? Pray for a minor leaguer to be ready. Ethier is the most advanced bat in the system but he'd be hard pressed to cover for Thomas.

I don't hate, I just respond aggressively to stupidity

by grover on Dec 7, 2005 8:29 PM PST up reply actions

I'm sorry,

I meant instead of signing Thomas, who do you like best for the DH spot?

How about a three way? You, me and some of this pork.-Donny Baker

by gatling on Dec 7, 2005 8:40 PM PST up reply actions

Realistically?

I try to pry Ryan Shealy away from Colorado.

I don't hate, I just respond aggressively to stupidity

by grover on Dec 7, 2005 8:42 PM PST up reply actions

i would think that ...

DJ would be the immediate replacement for Thomas at DH, at just about any time in the season, with Swish moving to 1B and one of our surplus not-so-great outfielders moving to RF. MId-to-late in the season, maybe Ethier to RF.

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 11:06 AM PST up reply actions

So everyone switches chairs

and you still end up with Kielty's bat replacing Thomas'.

Got any more of them pretzels you were choking on earlier?

I don't hate, I just respond aggressively to stupidity

by grover on Dec 8, 2005 11:21 AM PST up reply actions

It was a projection, not a wish

I agree with you: the A's, if they do sign Thomas, need to have a serious additional contingency plan in place.

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 11:26 AM PST up reply actions

Hey, we're on a budget here

Obviously the not-so-great outfielder will be Thomas, Charles. Then we don't even have to pay for new jerseys. "I know Frank's a big guy! Just tuck it in more and get in the damn box!"

"Don't be an ass!" --Bill King

by batgirl on Dec 8, 2005 1:41 PM PST up reply actions

I can hear the call now...

"Thomas waddles to the plate. He likes to have his pants sag so he can keep it real with today's youths..."

I don't hate, I just respond aggressively to stupidity

by grover on Dec 8, 2005 1:49 PM PST up reply actions

Oooooo...Frank Thomas plumber's crack

bad mental image, must...purge...from...head...

"Put a Milo on him." -Billy Beane

by kaweahkaweah on Dec 8, 2005 2:39 PM PST up reply actions

Shudder at that thought, but his was saying

when Frank got hurt, put Charles in his clothes using the same uniform,

by theblackpearl on Dec 8, 2005 2:47 PM PST up reply actions

soriano

soriano just got traded to the nationals

by sctr76 on Dec 7, 2005 8:17 PM PST reply actions

link?

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 7, 2005 8:22 PM PST up reply actions

So much for Brad Wilkerson

becoming an A. I guess Kevin Mench is on the move for pitching now. Adding Sledge and Wilkerson crowds the OF in Texas.

How about a three way? You, me and some of this pork.-Donny Baker

by gatling on Dec 7, 2005 8:23 PM PST up reply actions

Big "Hurt"

"He would likely hit cleanup behind Eric Chavez and the A's would suddenly have several legitimate power threats from day one."

....and on day 2 the A's would have a very legitimate power threat on the DL.

"Oakland Athletics, and the art of emotional detachment"

by Force on Dec 7, 2005 8:22 PM PST reply actions

Dan Kolb back to the Brewers

for Wes Obermueller.

How about a three way? You, me and some of this pork.-Donny Baker

by gatling on Dec 7, 2005 8:22 PM PST reply actions

now

its on espnews right now

by sctr76 on Dec 7, 2005 8:23 PM PST reply actions

soriano

for wilkerson, sledge minor leager to be named

by sctr76 on Dec 7, 2005 8:24 PM PST reply actions

That sucks for us

Wilkerson > Soriano

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 7, 2005 8:27 PM PST up reply actions

Wow....I think that's way off...

I take Soriano every single day of the week. Interesting.

Bring back Hammer.

by OaktownPower on Dec 7, 2005 8:46 PM PST up reply actions

It's not even close

Soriano is entirely an Arlington phenom. Let's look at Wilkerson's road numbers versus Soriano's road numbers:

Soriano (road 2005):
.224/.265/.374
Wilkerson (road 2005):
.257/.337/.414

Wow. Soriano is awful away from Arlington. His OBP is downright miserable. Wilkerson has decent power and league-average OBP. Wilkerson also has a demonstrated ability to get on base over the course of his career. Soriano doesn't.

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 7, 2005 9:12 PM PST up reply actions

See what happens

When SABR-friendly GM's end up in our division? Chaos! Maybe we can convince Texas they absolutely need a high OBP, no power catcher....

Signatures? We don't need no stinking signatures.

by jubjub on Dec 7, 2005 8:28 PM PST up reply actions

who would that be?

Last I checked, we had a modest-OBP, no-power catcher ...

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 11:07 AM PST up reply actions

Over/under ABs for value? (the Do-or-Dye line)

If the A's sign Thomas, what number of ABs do you think the A's must get to make him worth it? Assuming expected production, I'd put the "worth it" over/under line at 300 ABs...250 or less having been a bad investment in hindsight, and 350+ having been a big win.

Same question for Piazza or Bradley or Nomar, for that matter...if the A's have only one shot at an established mid-order hitter, what's the minimum to make it worth it?

Beat the Angles (they're obtuse!)

by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 7, 2005 8:26 PM PST reply actions

WOW!

SORIANO TO NATS FOR SLEDGE, WILKERSON AND SOMEONE ELSE. WOW WOW WOW. Biggest trade so far!

Lets go Oakland!

by bballfanr33 on Dec 7, 2005 8:31 PM PST reply actions

espnews

They are in talks to sign bernie to return to play centerfield. Seams like this should be followed by BELIEVE IT OR NOT

by sctr76 on Dec 7, 2005 8:33 PM PST reply actions

Yankees

Sorry the Yankees

by sctr76 on Dec 7, 2005 8:34 PM PST up reply actions

Wilkerson in Texas?

No!!!!!!!!! I love Wilkerson. <sob>

"How much room do I have to cover out here?" -- Kotsay

by Sharon on Dec 7, 2005 8:43 PM PST reply actions

Is it possible that Wilkerson

could be part of an effort to make a Zito to Texas trade more attractive?

by Tyler Bleszinski on Dec 7, 2005 8:49 PM PST up reply actions

It's possible.

But I think Daniels probably likes Wilkerson as much as BB/Forst/Zaidi.

"How much room do I have to cover out here?" -- Kotsay

by Sharon on Dec 7, 2005 8:51 PM PST up reply actions

I don't think so

There's no way BB would trade Zito to a division rival, if he trades him anywhere he's going to the NL, look at Mulder and Hudson

by enz on Dec 7, 2005 8:52 PM PST up reply actions

I don't think so, Blez.

I think the Rangers took a hard look at their team and realized that they were one excellent hitter away from being...well, the Rangers.

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 9:04 PM PST up reply actions

To be fair

The rangers had a pretty awful outfield last year. Mench, Hidalgo, and etc? Wilkerson supposedly plays a credible centerfield, so it's actually a good deal from that perspective.

But yeah, they need pitchers.

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 7, 2005 9:08 PM PST up reply actions

I mentioned in another diary

that I do think this is a great deal for Texas. But at the moment, I'd still pick them to finish last in the AL West.

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 9:10 PM PST up reply actions

I agree

I hate this trade. I think it makes Texas both better and cheaper, whereas I'm always rooting for them to get older, more expensive, and worse.

by Faust on Dec 8, 2005 8:42 AM PST up reply actions

You forgot "uglier"

We want them to be uglier, too.

"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s

by Nick on Dec 8, 2005 8:59 AM PST up reply actions

As long as they keep Mench

They've got "ugly" covered.

I don't hate, I just respond aggressively to stupidity

by grover on Dec 8, 2005 9:02 AM PST up reply actions

Soriano/Wilkerson link

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2251887

by rubin sierra on Dec 7, 2005 8:47 PM PST reply actions

bluejays

have money.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/5148464

so much on my mind, i just can't recline -respiration

by ucla kid on Dec 7, 2005 8:53 PM PST reply actions

JP makes another big move

How about a three way? You, me and some of this pork.-Donny Baker

by gatling on Dec 7, 2005 9:22 PM PST up reply actions

Wow, I never heard about this rumor

until now:

Despite talk of Wells and Abreu, no action expected in Dallas

Late Wednesday, another rumor popped up, with the Phillies said to have offered outfielder Bobby Abreu, catcher Mike Lieberthal and pitching prospect Gavin Floyd for lefty Barry Zito and catcher Jason Kendall.

Given that Abreu is owed roughly $30 million over the next two seasons and Lieberthal is scheduled to make $7.5 million next year, such a deal would increase Oakland's payroll over the next two years by more than $10 million. Kendall is owed $24 million over the next two seasons, but the Pirates are paying $5 million of that in 2007, and Zito is scheduled to make $7.9 million next season -- not $8.5 million, as Forst reminded reporters -- in the last year of his contract.

"How much room do I have to cover out here?" -- Kotsay

by Sharon on Dec 7, 2005 8:56 PM PST reply actions

Wow

If not for money, I can't imagine Beane not jumping all over that one. Lieberthal probably wouldn't provide much more offense than Kendall, but to get Bobby Abreu...well, I'd do almost anything. If we throw in a good prospect, maybe the Phils throw in some cash to help offset the cost.

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 7, 2005 9:06 PM PST up reply actions

it definitely needs a little massaging for

it to work out, but yeah...wow

"How much room do I have to cover out here?" -- Kotsay

by Sharon on Dec 7, 2005 9:13 PM PST up reply actions

I should probably reiterate:

Wow.

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 7, 2005 9:14 PM PST up reply actions

lol

I'm still staring at that article. I just can't believe it.

"How much room do I have to cover out here?" -- Kotsay

by Sharon on Dec 7, 2005 9:15 PM PST up reply actions

I have to admit,

that's the first Zito-trade rumor that really got my attention. The only big negative I can see is that considering how important Haren-Blanton-Harden are to this team, from their standpoint, losing your role model/teacher AND the catcher you raved about working with might leave those guys feeling a bit...abandoned. I don't know if that matters; just mentioning it.

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 9:18 PM PST up reply actions

I like the deal too

but I don't think it would happen because of cost constraints. It makes sense for Philly to do it. They'd finally be making a splash to combat Omar's Onslaught.

by Tyler Bleszinski on Dec 7, 2005 9:20 PM PST up reply actions

It crossed my mind

I don't usually pay attention to such things, but I do wonder about the young pitchers switching catchers after a successful year. Lieberthal comes with a gold-glove reputation (and one actual one)...

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 7, 2005 9:21 PM PST up reply actions

Yes,

"BOBBY ABREU" tends to get my attention too.

;)

"How much room do I have to cover out here?" -- Kotsay

by Sharon on Dec 7, 2005 9:21 PM PST up reply actions

the part where Kendall

gets taken caught my attention.

Saber CW says catchers have very little effect on pitcher performance, despite what pitchers say. We've had musical catchers the last few years and our (starting) pitching has been solid, so I'm not too worried about that aspect.

Some posts in another thread cast doubt on Abreu's performance, and Gavin Floyd has gotten lit up in his brief time in the majors. Lieberthal is 33 and has shaky knees.

I don't think this trade is a slam dunk for the A's.

by Apricot on Dec 7, 2005 9:47 PM PST up reply actions

good points

A's v Giants "is kind of like the difference between going to see the Ramones and going to see the Bee Gees. A's fans will go see the Ramones." -BB 07/27/05

by xbhaskarx on Dec 8, 2005 1:04 AM PST up reply actions

Doubting Abreu

He'll be 32 next year.

He's missed less than 5 games a year since becoming a regular.

He's not a big HR hitter, but he should be good for 20-25 bombs and around 40 doubles.

He'll K 100+; BB 100+.

Hit near .300 with a .400 OBP.

Basically he's an ideal #3 hitter.

I don't hate, I just respond aggressively to stupidity

by grover on Dec 8, 2005 7:57 AM PST up reply actions

But old school scout types dont like his game...

And the Philly GM is one of those types.

Bring back Hammer.

by OaktownPower on Dec 8, 2005 9:05 AM PST up reply actions

Heart

Yeay, I hear his VORG (Value Over Replacement Gamer) is really bad.

"And Julio Franco is batting right-handed!" -- Wayne Hagin, A's radio play-by-play, mid-80s

by Nick on Dec 8, 2005 10:52 AM PST up reply actions

think about it this way

Pat Gillick is a smart man, but he got the nickname "Stand" Pat for a reason...he doesn't trade anyone! Why did he trade Thome? His injury history. Why is he trading Abreu? Not sure, but he has to have a reason. Possible 'roider? The deal would be a huge bust for us if he tests positive at ANY time of his contract...

by noava22 on Dec 8, 2005 12:45 PM PST up reply actions

I'd do a frickin' dance if we had Abreu.

Dream a little dream.

"Don't you play the flute, Huddy?"

by capper3 on Dec 7, 2005 9:09 PM PST up reply actions

I have no idea if this rumor is true

But if it is I guess it means we can forget about Wolff having big pockets.

I don't hate, I just respond aggressively to stupidity

by grover on Dec 7, 2005 10:10 PM PST up reply actions

If that is available - I say go for it

Have the A's throw in another prospect, to get cash from the Phils to offset some of the salary difference. Then the A's should sign both Piazza and Thomas to incentive laden contracts. Lieberthal won't catch 145+ games, so Piazza can spell him from time to time (taking care of the itch Piazza has to catch), while also providing insurance for the potential Thomas injury.
We all know the tools that Abreu has, but as for Gavin Floyd - wasn't he rated really high before breaking in? Did the ballpark in Philly have an adverse effect on him, or possibly his inexperience? Could a change of location make him a viable candidate to jump into the rotation, or be ready to spot start in case of someone else going down...ie. Harden. I just like the idea of attaining a player with all the tools that Abreu has, and this would look nice:

Ellis
Kotsay
Chavez/Abreu
Thomas
Abreu/Chavez
Johnson/Crosby
Crosby/Johnson
Swisher
Mirabelli

Now that is a lineup that would stir some fear within opposing pitchers...

by SD Erik on Dec 8, 2005 6:11 AM PST up reply actions

I'd do that one

... and just for the sheer heck of it, I'll reiterate my blockbuster Yankees trade idea: Zito, Chavez, Kendall, and either Payton or Kotsay to the Yanks for A-Rod and Posada and cash (and a pitching prospect? Do the Yanks have any?).

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 11:10 AM PST up reply actions

I'd like to add an amendment ...

Trade Crosby instead of Chavez. A-Rod would move back to shortstop. I think this would be better for both teams, since the A's need more proven bats, while the Yankees need to lower payroll (im my opinion--but probably not theirs).

Also, for them there is the additional bonus of being able to stockpile B.Crosbys.

by rubin sierra on Dec 8, 2005 1:05 PM PST up reply actions

Boo!

I don't like this idea at all! =P

"If I'm not having fun, then I am not playing well" ~Bobby Crosby

by BobbyCrosbysGirl on Dec 8, 2005 1:16 PM PST up reply actions

where is ...

... BubbaCrosbysGirl?

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 1:19 PM PST up reply actions

Open floor debate on amendment

That's an interesting amendment. I wouldn't necessarily oppose it if it were a condition of doing the deal -- but I would in that case insist on taking a lot more cash from the Yanks.

My reasoning in shipping Chavez rather than Croz is mostly about salary. I also think Croz will ultimately put up better offensive numbers than Chavvy.

... and if the Yanks are stockpiling B. Crosbys, then they can use the time machine and sign Der Bingle ...

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 1:18 PM PST up reply actions

Question for Blez, or anyone

who knows: I haven't heard anything about David Dellucci lately. What's his status? I think he'd be a great fit for the A's philosophy of OBP and defense, and Wilkerson's acquisition suggests DD is not in the Rangers' plans. I'm just wondering why his name hasn't been bantied about in general (not just in regards to the A's). Did I miss something with him?

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 9:14 PM PST reply actions

Delluci is signed through 2006

He will be paid 950K (700K in incentives, based on PA). For such a productive player, I imagine the Rangers hold on to him, even if only for a part-time role. I'm not sure about his defense; he DHed a ton last year.

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 7, 2005 9:18 PM PST up reply actions

OK, for some reason

I thought he was a FA after 2005. He's a great deal for them. Considering how much the Rangers need pitching and how Dellucci could upgrade us in LF (a Dellucci/Kielty platoon would be damn good), wouldn't a trade based on Saarloos-Dellucci be good for both teams right now?

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 9:24 PM PST up reply actions

Well...

Saarloos would become far and away their ace, wouldn't he?

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 7, 2005 9:28 PM PST up reply actions

How are we sure

That Thomas will be healthy? I've always liked him, good walk ratio too, Piazza nah

The tragedy of life is not that it ends so soon, but that we wait so long to begin it.-W. M. Lewis

by doublehustle22 on Dec 7, 2005 9:15 PM PST reply actions

If we could be sure

Thomas was going to be healthy, we could be just as sure we couldn't possibly afford him. So pick your risk, basically--health or talent--because we can afford a lot of healthy guys who, unfortunately, just aren't very good.

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 9:20 PM PST up reply actions

I found this especially interesting

out of the Urban article:

MLB.com has learned that Rincon has already agreed to reject the offer, and the club will wait to see how their expected addition of a right-handed power hitter affects the payroll before making Rincon a free-agent offer.

That makes a lot more sense. I don't understand why Houston and Clemens couldn't do something similar like this. Just watch...Clemens will wind up back with the Yankees.

by Tyler Bleszinski on Dec 7, 2005 9:18 PM PST reply actions

Clemens to TEX?

If he wants to stay close to home...

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 7, 2005 9:22 PM PST up reply actions

rumor has it

Rocket will pitch for the World Games then take a month + off and then join the Astros in somewhat mid-season.

"What I'm trying to do is set our pitching up for five years," said Beane

by Satchmo22 on Dec 8, 2005 4:33 AM PST up reply actions

What the heck

is going on, I heard Overbay just got traded and Ramon is going to the Orioles? Gosh I hate MLB rumors sometimes.

The tragedy of life is not that it ends so soon, but that we wait so long to begin it.-W. M. Lewis

by doublehustle22 on Dec 7, 2005 9:19 PM PST reply actions

Blue Jays get Overbay

That means Hillenbrand, Hinske, or Koskie is available. I am not a Hillenbrand fan, but JP and BB have an established rapport...trade brewing?

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 7, 2005 9:23 PM PST up reply actions

I honestly wouldn't want any of them

by Tyler Bleszinski on Dec 7, 2005 9:25 PM PST up reply actions

Yes!!!

A's in the West, Jays in the East--me would likey!!!!!!!

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 9:26 PM PST up reply actions

Hillenbrand was involved in the trade.

"How much room do I have to cover out here?" -- Kotsay

by Sharon on Dec 7, 2005 9:28 PM PST up reply actions

Not according to TSN.ca

http://www.tsn.ca/mlb/news_story.asp?id=146172

The Blue Jays have acquired first baseman Lyle Overbay and a prospect from the Brewers in exchange for right-hander David Bush, outfielder Gabe Gross and triple-A left-hander Zach Jackson.

Argh! Hot stove confusion

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 7, 2005 9:30 PM PST up reply actions

Okay...

I must have read an old link. There's no way I'm going to remember everything that went down tonight when I wake up tomorrow.

"How much room do I have to cover out here?" -- Kotsay

by Sharon on Dec 7, 2005 9:32 PM PST up reply actions

I know what you mean--

I'm pretty drunk tonight too.

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 9:35 PM PST up reply actions

lol

That too.

"How much room do I have to cover out here?" -- Kotsay

by Sharon on Dec 7, 2005 9:37 PM PST up reply actions

By the way...

two other bits of news from the AL. We're lucky Trevor Hoffman decided to stay in the NL West. We don't need the young team in Cleveland getting any stronger. Wickman may have had a bunch of saves last year, but he's no Trevor Hoffman.

And the Loretta for Mirabelli deal is a great trade for the Red Sox. Loretta slumped last season from his career season in 2004. But I'm betting that a move to Fenway Park will help the righty. Plus, he's also absolutely stellar defensively. That's an ouch under-the-radar deal for the rest of the AL.

by Tyler Bleszinski on Dec 7, 2005 9:35 PM PST reply actions

Yup.

Loretta is very comparable to Mark Ellis. And I would NEVER trade Ellis for Doug Mirabelli!

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 9:37 PM PST up reply actions

But...

I thought AN hated Mark Ellis. So obviously most ANers would trade him for Mirabelli in a heartbeat.

"A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings." -Earl Wilson

by whiteshoes40 on Dec 7, 2005 9:49 PM PST up reply actions

You're just saying that

because I once criticized Beane. So anyway, why does everyone on AN hate on Dennys Reyes?

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 9:56 PM PST up reply actions

tsk tsk

The proper plural of Denny Rey is Dennies Reies. Yeesh.

by Apricot on Dec 7, 2005 9:59 PM PST up reply actions

Which begs the question,

Is Dennys open 24 hours/day, or does the lack of an apostrophe get Reyes off the hook and allow him to sleep? Inquyring mynds want to know.

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 10:06 PM PST up reply actions

i know

that dennys is open on easter.

so much on my mind, i just can't recline -respiration

by ucla kid on Dec 7, 2005 10:11 PM PST up reply actions

Anyone who

has to work for Dennys on Easter should get a Reyes.

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 10:14 PM PST up reply actions

Damn, things are happening fast now!

"Put a Milo on him." -Billy Beane

by kaweahkaweah on Dec 7, 2005 9:53 PM PST up reply actions

I trust you are, of course,

referring to the terrible puns.

Nico

by Nico on Dec 7, 2005 10:15 PM PST up reply actions

Hey, the last thing I want to do

is incorrige the incorrigible punsters.

"Put a Milo on him." -Billy Beane

by kaweahkaweah on Dec 7, 2005 10:38 PM PST up reply actions

would you send them to ...

... Corregidor?

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 11:17 AM PST up reply actions

Don't forget to vote for AN

the Weblogs awards!!!

http://weblogawards.org/2005/12/best_sports_blog.php

"To me, boxing is like a ballet, except there's no music, no choreography, and the dancers hit each other." - Jack Handey

by JJ on Dec 7, 2005 10:52 PM PST reply actions

D R O O L . . .

All this talk about getting a big bat is making me drooool.

First, and foremost, FRANK THOMAS!!!! All of you ANers who talk about players going "down" in the first third, or second third, or whatever are driving me batty. Why? Because ANY player can go down, get hurt, be out ... a twist of an ankle is all it takes, so kindly leave off the subject of The Big Hurt GETTING hurt and start thinking of how much pain he will cause opposing pitchers, and how fat the lineup will look with his big bat in the four-spot, and how many runs he will drive in, and how many MORE HRs Chavvy will have, and so on and so forth. THINK POSITIVE, folks.

And being a sometime-fan for the Phils, I like Bobby, but not enough to give up Barry and Jason.

Drool is all over the keyboard, so I better sign off. But ... in Beane we trust.

Wish Bill King was still around to call the plays, that's the only sad thing about 2006. Otherwise, I'm looking at it with rose colored glasses ... actually, make that green 'n gold colored glasses.

Darn it, Bill, you just made Toledo even holier.

by Edwinwinwin on Dec 7, 2005 11:33 PM PST reply actions

Bad metaphor...

I expect the line up to look skinny with Thomas in the four spot. That is a big man, everyone else will look thin in comparison.

by Donner on Dec 8, 2005 8:57 AM PST up reply actions

Yes, It's Time to Slobber -

Sign Thomas. But if you wouldn't give up Zito and Kendall for Abreu and Leiberthal -assuming the $$$ works its way out - you're crazy. Zito has to go. His Oakland window is closing and we're looking at draft picks next year or a very expensive #2 whose best year was 2003. We have the pitching and the defense to back it up. Run production will pump up the SP like nothing else and give this team the balance it's been lacking since Tejada and Giambi days. IMHO.

"Cool it, brothers." Last words of Malcom X

by Bosnian on Dec 8, 2005 9:36 AM PST up reply actions

Wow, busy day in trades.

I'd hate to see Piazza come to the A's, his decline has been so steady and predictable, lacking any ray of hope...

I could go for Frank Thomas, though. I'm also terrified of the injury history, but if BB wants to take a big risk/big reward shot this season, this may be it. Not sure how much better we can get without paying serious prospects/players. The money/years would definitely be a huge factor, though. Maybe BB can get his agent drunk and work in some incentive clauses to chip down the overall price a tad.

I mean, if he can stay healthy for a decent portion of the season, it's got a good chance of being freaking awesome. Unless the Coliseum factor gets to him -- but then again, Thomas getting to hit more often in Texas? Man.

If he gets very predictably injured... BB will look the goat, but it's not like we didn't get a big, long look at inopportune injuries last season.

Definitely would be an interesting move to see. Though the whole 'signing a name I recognize' thing is gonna blow my mind.

And BB won't be able to trade Zito for about two more weeks. It's not close enough to Christmas yet.

"Baseball fans are junkies, and their heroin is the statistic." -Robert S. Wieder

by Kyli on Dec 7, 2005 11:38 PM PST reply actions

I agree...

Thomas has always scared me. He's just so big.

The last time Piazza scared me was when he tried to sing and dance at the all-star game.

by RenoTy on Dec 8, 2005 12:11 AM PST up reply actions

Office (AN) poll??

So now that the deadline for offering arb is over, what are the odds on when the announcement will be made regarding FA RH DH for the A's?? My bet is it happens around 1PM PST, but I have no clue when the Rule 5 draft takes place, I imagine that takes quite a bit or attention from BB. Any thoughts??

by mattclif on Dec 8, 2005 12:29 AM PST reply actions

Kenny "you-talkin'-to-me?" Rogers

signs 2X16mil in det.
good, that guy killed us pitching in oakland....1r, 4h, was the usual line against him.

by bigelephant on Dec 8, 2005 9:24 AM PST reply actions

new deal

apparently the Bo Sox are dealing Edgar Renteria to the Braves for 3B prospect Andy Marte. Any thoughts on how this will affect anything?

by HarenStyle on Dec 8, 2005 9:29 AM PST reply actions

Barry Zito

will be either traded to the Mets or Dodgers...if it all...more news soon before everyone

by Song Song on Dec 8, 2005 9:31 AM PST reply actions

Bad Contracts

Can anyone come up with a contract that was signed the last 5 that most people thought was ridiculous at the time that turned out to be good? It seems everytime people raise red flags about a deal, that deal turns out badly. Obviously, some deals look good in hindsight because of the inflation, but I'm looking for a FA contract (at least 3 years) that proved to be about right.

The trade of Renteria got me thinking about this because I remember thinking how crazy it was to give the guy $40MM for league-average play.

Note to self: Back-loaded contracts on the wrong side of 30 aren't good things (see Loaiza, Esteban).

Signatures? We don't need no stinking signatures.

by jubjub on Dec 8, 2005 9:43 AM PST reply actions

Here's one:

Alex Rodriguez has been worth every penny. Consistent offensive force, tons of homers and OBP, gold glove defense, durable...best contract in baseball.

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 8, 2005 9:52 AM PST up reply actions

A-Rod

I thought about that, but is he worth $25MM per year? If so, why did the Rangers only find the Yankees and Red Sox interested and even then have to throw in some money? Also, he's only half way through the contract, so there's no way to know.

But, your point is taken - if anyone deserves it, A-Rod does.

Signatures? We don't need no stinking signatures.

by jubjub on Dec 8, 2005 10:03 AM PST up reply actions

NO ballplayer is worth

25 million. no one.

by bigelephant on Dec 8, 2005 10:41 AM PST up reply actions

and such a great trade for the Yankees.

Hicks is a dumbass.

"How much room do I have to cover out here?" -- Kotsay

by Sharon on Dec 8, 2005 10:09 AM PST up reply actions

Quick! Rationalize!

Heart! Cluctch! When it counts! Clutch!

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 8, 2005 10:22 AM PST up reply actions

did you just misspell ...

... "Cthulu"?

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 11:28 AM PST up reply actions

Bless you

You should get that looked at...

I don't hate, I just respond aggressively to stupidity

by grover on Dec 8, 2005 11:30 AM PST up reply actions

As Duke of Left Field said:

AN Kneads a spillczecher

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 8, 2005 11:33 AM PST up reply actions

Spillczecher

Wasn't that one of the guys the Sharks traded for Thornton?

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 11:34 AM PST up reply actions

I thought

it was a brand of lager.

"Don't go getting all Alexander Haig on me, either." - Billy Beane

by andeux on Dec 8, 2005 11:42 AM PST up reply actions

I see you're a combatant in ...

... The War on Gesundheit ...

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 11:33 AM PST up reply actions

They call me

the Great Charlemin.

I don't hate, I just respond aggressively to stupidity

by grover on Dec 8, 2005 11:40 AM PST up reply actions

The only reason why A-rod

isn't worth $25 million is because the Rangers were bidding against themselves. I think they tacked on an extra $30 million just so Boras would call them back.

I don't hate, I just respond aggressively to stupidity

by grover on Dec 8, 2005 10:30 AM PST up reply actions

the Omar Minaya flag just went up, haha

"Ninety percent I'll spend on good times, women, and Irish whiskey. The other ten percent I'll probably waste." - Tug McGraw(Plans for 75K salary)

by balldood on Dec 8, 2005 10:42 AM PST up reply actions

Neyer doesn't think Zito to Phillies will go

through.

Bob (Philly): Stark has reported that the Phillies and A's are close to a deal that would send Abreu and Cole Hamels to Oakland for Zito. Any thoughts on the possibility of this happening and the potential impact?

Rob Neyer: (1:15 PM ET ) I'd be surprised if the A's can afford to pay Abreu's huge salary, but then they do have more money to spend than in the past, thanks to the new owner. Who plays right field for the Phillies, though?

by theblackpearl on Dec 8, 2005 10:17 AM PST reply actions

that's a different trade than the original rumor..

and where is Stark reporting this?

"How much room do I have to cover out here?" -- Kotsay

by Sharon on Dec 8, 2005 10:19 AM PST up reply actions

Neyer says A's lucky to get 15 HR's from Frank

dan (boston): rob, you do an excellent job of answering a lot of questions quickly (can you give typing lessons to the football guys?)... Do you see Frank Thomas hitting 30+ homers if he signs with the A's?

Rob Neyer: (1:25 PM ET ) Here's something I didn't know until just now . . . in the last four seasons, Thomas hit 76 home runs in Sox Park, and 24 on the road. In 2000, 30 at home, 13 on the road. Between Thomas's injury history and his struggles away from that hitter's ballpark, I think the A's would be lucky to get 15 homers from him.

by theblackpearl on Dec 8, 2005 10:28 AM PST reply actions

home/road splits...

they are bad, .100 career OPS difference between the home and road splits, substantially better hitter in chi-town.

anyways, here's something encouraging, his career numbers in oakland:

.304 / .433 / .553

not too shabby

i think realistically you can't expect THOSE numbers in oakland, but something to the tune of .270/.370/.500 would be nice... it's hard to measuring SLUG and HR, I just know .500 is my cut off line for a pretty productive season out of a "power hitter" or "slugger"... ill throw this out there anyways though: id say if thomas DH's 100 games, that could be roughly around 20 HRs...

furthermore, the .270 with a degree of pop would be nice, but the .370 OBP is the most important thing. the A's need to seperate themselves in OBP from the rest of the pack in the AL--minus the Red Sox and Yanks who have ridiculous resources...

"Ninety percent I'll spend on good times, women, and Irish whiskey. The other ten percent I'll probably waste." - Tug McGraw(Plans for 75K salary)

by balldood on Dec 8, 2005 10:41 AM PST up reply actions

Trades

Mark Redman is a Royal?! Did that team just get worse?

Jim Essian: The only Oakland Athletic to hit an Inside the Park Grand Slam.

by OaktownRajah on Dec 8, 2005 10:39 AM PST reply actions

Sadly, no

Mark Redman actually makes the Royals better. That's pretty pathetic.

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 8, 2005 10:41 AM PST up reply actions

what will be pathetic...

is when Kris Benson makes them better.... that's just a head shaker, lol....

"Ninety percent I'll spend on good times, women, and Irish whiskey. The other ten percent I'll probably waste." - Tug McGraw(Plans for 75K salary)

by balldood on Dec 8, 2005 10:43 AM PST up reply actions

Ick

KC gets Dessens. This team is horrid.

http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20051208&content_id=1279 158&vkey=pr_kc&fext=.jsp&c_id=kc

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 8, 2005 12:16 PM PST up reply actions

But like you say, probably improved

Still, they are throwing a lot of money at average players. Neyer must be pulling his hair out.

"Put a Milo on him." -Billy Beane

by kaweahkaweah on Dec 8, 2005 12:21 PM PST up reply actions

C Hernandez

Ramon is back in the AL! I hope he has a better season with the Orioles than he did last year.

Jim Essian: The only Oakland Athletic to hit an Inside the Park Grand Slam.

by OaktownRajah on Dec 8, 2005 10:48 AM PST reply actions

Ramoooooooon!

Looks likes Baltimore is the ex-A's party.

Hopefully, Ramon will get off the injury kick he's picked up. :-( His average might drop a bit now that he doesn't get to constantly beat up on the Giants, alas.

"Baseball fans are junkies, and their heroin is the statistic." -Robert S. Wieder

by Kyli on Dec 8, 2005 11:09 AM PST up reply actions

Baltimore is the preferred locale for GOOD ex-A's

KC has clearly become the demand destination for the outta town on a rail ex-A's. Can the KC return of Ben Grieve be far away?

Beat the Angles (they're obtuse!)

by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 8, 2005 11:36 AM PST up reply actions

He was great last year

until he got hurt

Bring back Hammer.

by OaktownPower on Dec 8, 2005 11:14 AM PST up reply actions

For 7 Million dollars he better, Baltimore now has

a $15 Million dollar Catcher platoon.

by theblackpearl on Dec 8, 2005 10:50 AM PST reply actions

Kenny Rogers signs with Tigers...

2 years, $15 million

Bring back Hammer.

by OaktownPower on Dec 8, 2005 11:13 AM PST reply actions

Good

At least he's out of our division now...

What's the point of attaching a number to everything you do? If your numbers go up, you're having more fun.

by AlwaysSweatin on Dec 8, 2005 11:16 AM PST up reply actions

Yeah!

Now he and Pudge can both throw tantrums in the dugout and on the field. It is not gonna be easy for cameramen or equipment bags in Detroit.

Jim Essian: The only Oakland Athletic to hit an Inside the Park Grand Slam.

by OaktownRajah on Dec 8, 2005 4:39 PM PST up reply actions

2006 Return of the 'swingin'' A's

I smell playoffs... no.... I smell a World Series!!!!

by GrewUpAtTheColiseum on Dec 8, 2005 12:11 PM PST reply actions

No!

Don't say that! Wait, till the season starts at least.

Jim Essian: The only Oakland Athletic to hit an Inside the Park Grand Slam.

by OaktownRajah on Dec 8, 2005 4:40 PM PST up reply actions

"artibritation"?

That sounds more like something the A's would offer Zito.

Or, if Martha Stewart were coming off her last contract year, they might offer artifartibritation.

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 12:28 PM PST reply actions

and for fjord design...

Slartibartfast-ation.

"Don't go getting all Alexander Haig on me," Beane told Forst.

by Poppy on Dec 8, 2005 1:54 PM PST up reply actions

boycott fjord!

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 2:10 PM PST up reply actions

Zito for Abreu....

AND HAMELS!!! Wow...

I would jump all over that if I were Billy. I know Hamels has had serious injury concerns but if he stays healthy, he has a great shot to become an ace.

I don't think I need to defend Bobby Abreu, his career speaks for itself. He's one of those guys who never really attracts much attention to himself, and hasn't gotten a chance to prove himself on any big stage. Chck out his career line- .303/.411/.512 with an average of 22 bombs and 40 doubles a year, as well as 30 steals a year and solid defense. What else could you possibly ask for out of a ballplayer???

by Little Rickey on Dec 8, 2005 12:29 PM PST reply actions

Personally

I'd rather have Madson and Abreu, not Hamels. Actually, i don't know. But Madson would be like another Duchscherer....

RIP Bill King "By the Beard of Zeus!" "I don't know if you heard me counting. I did over a thousand"

by ohad on Dec 8, 2005 12:50 PM PST reply actions

Not to be contradictory on purpose...

But I honestly think it's not worth the risk. And how old is he now? How long do we have him before he retires? He's incredibly injury prone, and if the team is built on him as DH...what happens when he goes down?

Carpe Diem---Seize the Day

by Squeaky on Dec 8, 2005 1:30 PM PST reply actions

All players are subject to injury

What happened when Crosby went down? When Harden went down? The A's lost a bunch of games!

What happened when the A's drafted Ariel Prieto, after being all set to get Todd Helton??

Who signed Juan Gonzales, only to have him out for the year in Game one of last year's season?

Dye came back from injury, but only after he left us. Thomas says the injury is healed, foot feels good... could be, he's telling the truth.

The A's aren't "building a club" around a DH. No question, he is prone to any injury, but the A's have a great shot at a proven inexpensive Big Bat.

Get Thomas today!!

"Don't go getting all Alexander Haig on me, either." Beane to Forst at GM winter meetings.

by Ducts on the Pawn on Dec 8, 2005 1:42 PM PST up reply actions

Cabrera

Hi guys,

I just read somewhere that the Marlins are now saying that their "untouchable" players might come over for the right price. So now they're touchable.

Now, obviously they wouldn't want Zito, since he's only signed through 06 and they're doing a salary dump anyway, but which of our young pitchers would we be willing to give up to get us some Cabrera? Thoughts?

by rockbutt on Dec 8, 2005 2:44 PM PST reply actions

Robb?

Too young?

How about Cindi? Is she above the age of consent?

(And, Robb, if you're reading this, I'm totally kidding. I'd suggest trading myself to the Fish for Cabrera, but Dade County has stringent regulations on keeping exotic pets.)

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 2:58 PM PST up reply actions

Why do old guys

always ask me if I'm above the age of consent? I totally don't get that.

-Cindi

Nico

by Nico on Dec 8, 2005 6:41 PM PST up reply actions

probably for the same reason ...

... old guys keep asking me just how "exotic" a "pet" I really am ...

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 9, 2005 8:42 AM PST up reply actions

Bye Harden... HELLO Cabrera!

If they don't like that deal (as a starting point) than forget about it.

I don't hate, I just respond aggressively to stupidity

by grover on Dec 8, 2005 4:43 PM PST up reply actions

I'd do that one

<ducks>

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 5:06 PM PST up reply actions

It would cost more, to be sure

But if that didn't get them twitching there'd be no way the A's could afford Cabrera.

I don't hate, I just respond aggressively to stupidity

by grover on Dec 8, 2005 5:10 PM PST up reply actions

checkout what miggy said...

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2252946
SANTO DOMINGO, Dominican Republic -- Baltimore Orioles shortstop Miguel Tejada said Thursday he's unhappy with the team's direction and wants to be traded.

"I've been with the Orioles for two years and things haven't gone in the direction that we were expecting, so I think the best thing will be a change of scenery," Tejada told The Associated Press during a telephone interview in his native Dominican Republic.

Tejada signed a $72 million, six-year contract with the Orioles before the 2004 season.

He hit .304 with 26 home runs and 98 RBI this year, but Baltimore finished 21 games behind the New York Yankees and Boston Red Sox in the AL East.

"I've done many things with this team and I haven't seen results, and the other teams are getting stronger while the Orioles have not made any signings to strengthen the club," Tejada said.

Tejada came to Baltimore after playing seven years with the Oakland Athletics.

by GrewUpAtTheColiseum on Dec 8, 2005 4:39 PM PST reply actions

nail that to zito's locker

Oaktown is a better place for a lot of players than wherever they wind up.... there aren't many places that know how to win without the owner/fans/writers putting so much pressure on you your stomach gets tied up in knots.

by vk on Dec 8, 2005 4:53 PM PST up reply actions

Tejada upset and wants a trade ...

Did anyone see this story from the Associated Press today? It comes the same day that Miggy's former teammate signs a deal with the Orioles. Ramon Hernandez probably ain't too happy about it.

SANTO DOMINGO, Dominican Republic -- Baltimore Orioles shortstop Miguel Tejada said Thursday he's unhappy with the team's direction and wants to be traded.

"I've been with the Orioles for two years and things haven't gone in the direction that we were expecting, so I think the best thing will be a change of scenery," Tejada told The Associated Press during a telephone interview in his native Dominican Republic.

Tejada signed a $72 million, six-year contract with the Orioles before the 2004 season.

He hit .304 with 26 home runs and 98 RBI this year, but Baltimore finished 21 games behind the New York Yankees and Boston Red Sox in the AL East.

"I've done many things with this team and I haven't seen results, and the other teams are getting stronger while the Orioles have not made any signings to strengthen the club," Tejada said.

Tejada came to Baltimore after playing seven years with the Oakland Athletics.

Katches

by Katches on Dec 8, 2005 5:01 PM PST reply actions

Lineup with Thomas

So what is it gonna look like next year?

2B Mark Ellis
CF Mark Kotsay
3B Eric Chavez
DH Frank Thomas
SS Bobby Crosby
1B Dan Johnson
LF Jay Payton
RF Nick Swisher
C Jason Kendall

I didn't know where to put Kendall or Ellis. This arrangement seemed plausible because we have two leadoff men in 1st and 9th positions. Any changes?

Jim Essian: The only Oakland Athletic to hit an Inside the Park Grand Slam.

by OaktownRajah on Dec 8, 2005 5:01 PM PST reply actions

Carpe Abreu!

Wouldn't it be great if we could add Abreu into that mix?

"Put a Milo on him." -Billy Beane

by kaweahkaweah on Dec 8, 2005 5:53 PM PST up reply actions

Carpe Cabrera!

I like mine better: it's got the alliteration going on, as well as the subtle "fish" theme connecting the two.

@('.')@

by monkeyball on Dec 8, 2005 5:58 PM PST up reply actions

Mike Myers signs with Yankees

Two-year contract worth $2.4 million.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=yankeesmyers&prov=st&type=lgns

by baseballnut020 on Dec 8, 2005 6:07 PM PST reply actions

One step closer

to seeing Ricardo in the A's bullpen next year.

Copernicus felt the same way about the geocentric crew.

by salb918 on Dec 8, 2005 8:34 PM PST up reply actions

Thomas is broken down

Over the years the A's have signed a lot of players in the twilight of their careers with little results:

Eric Karros - 2004 - .194 average - complete bust
Ron Gant - 2003 - .146 average - complete bust
David Justice - 2002 - 266 average, but only 11 HR's - mediocre performance

Frank Thomas hit .219 last year and is 37.

Before them there was Reggie at the end, Ron Cey, and host of others. Why is this any different?

Shooty

by Shooty Babbit on Dec 9, 2005 8:26 PM PST reply actions

Worth the risk

None of those guys had careers even remotely close to Thomas with the exception of Justice. Although Justice didn't have a spectacular season for us, he had a good season. And given what we paid for him, the character he brought, and his productivity in 2002, I would take him again.

That being said, I am scared of Thomas' health issues, and I know even as a DH, he will break down at some point in the season. The question is just when, and how severely?

However, Thomas was probably the most dominant hitter in the Major Leagues for a number of seasons. When he was in his prime, no one was even close to him except for Bonds. This was a guy who hit .340-40-130 routinely.

If we give him a $1.5 million deal with incentives of up to say, $4-5 million, I have no reason to see why he's not worth it. Best case scenario, we get a huge lift in the middle of the order for a moderate investment. Worst case, we throw $1.5 million down the drain after he injures himself for the entire season in his first AB as an A. But as I see it, thats better than the $4.5 million down the drain with Durazo's season last year, so really, worst case scenario is that we have a cheaper DH disaster than last year.

by InBeaneiTrust on Dec 11, 2005 12:52 AM PST up reply actions

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