It's Official: Third Deck Closed for 2006
I don't blame the A's for doing this. It's going to help limit supply and hopefully drive up demand.
At the same time, they can also test whether or not the new limited capacity stadium would actually work. It's somewhat of a test run, if you will.
But as someone who sat in the third deck multiple times (including the walk-off bunt game), it's disappointing to see that option shut off. I'm guilty of the walk-up, day-of ticket purchase as anyone. But that's in part because of the fact that I live in Sacramento, so it wasn't always easy to plan when we could get to a game. Now that supply is limited, I'm probably going to have to purchase some sort of mini-plan and in that way, Wolff and company are already succeeding.
Remember, he needs to see if Oakland can support the team in the new stadium. Since it will probably kill walk-ups you've got to think it's good for the team...but that doesn't necessarily mean it's best for the fans who've been season ticket holders in the third deck for years.
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Well, I don't know
Brian is actually enjoying a margarita
I got a ticket in 226 for the same price as mine would have cost in the third deck. They let me go in and sit in my seat before I coughed up the dough. It's ok... but I'm so used to the view from 317 it made me feel kind of off balance.
It is going to be weird looking up and knowing the seats are vacant upstairs. It really isn't going to feel "full" to me because of this, no matter what. Also, I'm going to miss the regular crowd we had in our section. I'll definitely move back up there if they open it up again, and for now I'll keep my AN handle for nostalgia's sake.
by Brian in 317 on Dec 21, 2005 6:43 PM PST up reply actions
thanks
by Brian in 317 on Dec 21, 2005 8:37 PM PST up reply actions
Not as awesome
Removing great seats and directing peole to crappy seats sucks. 317 and its immediate environs had a fantastic view of the game. Bah :-(
by green star oakland on Dec 21, 2005 11:17 PM PST up reply actions
here she is
Sorry I don't have a jpeg of her in full A's regalia. I was planning on doing a photo diary of our section last year and never got around to it.
by Brian in 317 on Dec 22, 2005 9:07 AM PST up reply actions
$2
by daygamesrthebest on Dec 22, 2005 2:55 AM PST up reply actions
How many $2 seats will exist?
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 22, 2005 9:03 AM PST up reply actions
Well, I'm looking forward
Hey, if it brings more cash to the
By the way, I added a new poll to see how people feel.
by Tyler Bleszinski on Dec 21, 2005 3:36 PM PST up reply actions
Ramon's walk-off bunt...
I'm assuming
Maybe it's both
Not that it matters
by Czech Micah on Dec 22, 2005 3:14 PM PST up reply actions
Jackson Livingston Seagull Pollack
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 21, 2005 5:13 PM PST up reply actions
Seagulls in the 3rd deck
A tarp?
by FormerHuntsvilleStar on Dec 21, 2005 6:14 PM PST up reply actions
Why doesn't anyone...
Not sure if this is still the case...
by He Can Foos on Dec 22, 2005 2:25 PM PST up reply actions
This might be an interesting prelude to
Here in earthquake country, a huge mass suspended high in the air requires a lot more $$ per seat to build than something at "field level". The higher you go, the more it costs, and you cannot charge "more for the advantage". The "advantage" of being further from the field??? Nope. Makes no sense to have "third decks".
I know the Athletics are giving the reason as "same day game costs" with concessions, cleaning, security, etc. Those are true enough.
Hey, maybe they should have a "bring a dummy day."
Everyone drops off a "dummy" and the A's permanently place them in the upper deck seats, so it looks like "huge crowds" all the time!
by Ducts on the Pawn on Dec 21, 2005 3:38 PM PST reply actions
For every game???
Tickets for those games
There's a part of this that hasn't been mentioned
MLB requires all teams to have a certain percentage of "house seats" and therefore the A's can't sell every seat in the house as a season seat. The amount of seats that need to be held back are detemined by a percentage of the total capacity. These seats are then used for Playoffs, World Series and All-Star games. There's a certain percentage needed between the bases in the lower deck, then between the base and the foul pole in the lower deck, then the second deck between the bases, and so on.
By diminishing the capacity, the A's have effectively freed up as many as 1000 really good seats that can be used as new season seats, including many MVP seats between the bases.
I'm not saying the only reason the A's are doing this is to free up some great seats, but it is certainly one of the considerations and is probably THE defining criteria that is restricting them from opening the third deck for ANY game.
by Alameda Greg on Dec 21, 2005 4:17 PM PST up reply actions
I'm excited for a full ballpark in 06
I think us fans have created the best atmosphere to see a game even though our stadium is a dump. The A's allowing fans to bring their drums and wave their flags, and the relaxed rock and roll vibe of the dugout/clubhouse is what made me a hardcore fan in the first place. I felt the team and players really needed my support, like I mattered and was special. I think that this excitement will continue with the capacity-filled game 81 times a year.
by Dig the Long Ball on Dec 21, 2005 3:58 PM PST reply actions
AN has the drumming market
No, I'm just a wannabe percussionist.
But, here's to high hopes for a symphonic 2006 - drums, flags and ball retrieving contraptions in left, and a reemergence of instrument-wielding Green Stampeders out in right.
Angels fans beware: Don't make us bust out the Cymbal-Monkey and Drums Sticks if push comes to shove.
by BleacherDrummer on Dec 22, 2005 2:39 PM PST up reply actions
SO...
THAT WAS APART OF MY IRRESISTABLE CHEVYS DINNER + $2 WEDNESDAY UNDER $20 TOTAL DATE! GAH!
by ConditionOakland on Dec 21, 2005 4:25 PM PST reply actions
Nope.
sweet.
I hope this turns out good.
It sounds like a solid plan, even if it kind of sucks.
deep down, its good.
by ConditionOakland on Dec 21, 2005 4:32 PM PST up reply actions
plaza level
http://oakland.athletics.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/oak/ballpark/seating_chart.jsp
Glad they are experimenting
When people start not being able to go to the games they want the only solution will be SEASON Ticket packages.
I wish them luck with this.
Hmm.
At least I should still have room to kick my feet up on the seat in front of me in the bleachers for those games. :-)
Consider yourselves lucky...
It may be cheaper to fly home to McAfee (or whatever they are calling it this year).
no tailgating?!?
Did you guys see this article?
"Deal for Raiders not good news for A's
By Guy AshleyCONTRA COSTA TIMES
OAKLAND - In patching things up with the Oakland Raiders, East Bay officials might be opening the door to the departure of the Oakland A's.
That prospect was raised Tuesday when the Alameda County Board of Supervisors approved a plan to revamp the county's financial relationship with the Raiders. The deal includes abolishing the widely despised "personal seat licenses" required of the football team's season-ticket holders.
The deal was approved on a 4-1 board vote and finalized Tuesday night, when six members of the Oakland City Council voted in its favor, with two council members abstaining.
A lengthy debate by the county supervisors revealed that the Oakland A's, the Raiders' fellow tenant at McAfee Coliseum, were less than thrilled by the new arrangement, in which the A's will be asked to share more revenue from advertisements inside the stadium with the Raiders.
A's officials confirmed they asked for a three-year lease extension at the Coliseum in exchange for the new advertising setup and were denied. Although A's officials said they're still committed to Oakland, Supervisor Keith Carson said he is concerned the new Raiders deal will prompt the A's to leave Oakland.
"We have yet to show the A's the same kind of love we have shown the Raiders," said Carson, the board's lone dissenting vote. "If you feel you're not getting the respect and love you deserve, as a businessperson you look for where you can get that respect and love."
Not a good sign if the A's are to stay in Oakland...
by johnspaz7 on Dec 21, 2005 5:53 PM PST reply actions
oops
by johnspaz7 on Dec 21, 2005 5:55 PM PST up reply actions
I kinda like it!

by BobbyCrosbysGirl on Dec 21, 2005 6:03 PM PST reply actions
Don't know...
by FormerHuntsvilleStar on Dec 21, 2005 6:15 PM PST up reply actions
You can't really see it in this picture
by BobbyCrosbysGirl on Dec 21, 2005 6:22 PM PST up reply actions
The outfield wall/backstop at Dodger Stadium
by Rob @ Athletics Nation on Dec 21, 2005 8:31 PM PST up reply actions
Except for blimp pilots...
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 21, 2005 8:41 PM PST up reply actions
Trust me
by green star oakland on Dec 22, 2005 1:03 AM PST up reply actions
This worries me somewhat ...
by Edwinwinwin on Dec 21, 2005 6:20 PM PST reply actions
Bobbleheads
Huston Street
Rickey Henderson
Dan Haren
Joe Blanton or Milton Bradley
I think
Huston, Swish, DJ, and Blanton.
by BobbyCrosbysGirl on Dec 21, 2005 6:28 PM PST up reply actions
It's always three plus a surprise
big acquisitions like Kendall and Dye have had a tendency to get bobblers ... enter Bradley ...
as for #4 ... I'll go with Swish.
big acquisitions
i'm hoping for street, blanton, rickey, haren
but i think it will be street, loaiza, bradley, blanton/haren.
They may want to wait on Rickey
If he'd retired when he should have
Bill King.
hopefully,
"posthumourously" must describe
You meant posthumously. ;)
by whiteshoes40 on Dec 22, 2005 10:53 PM PST up reply actions
Good call
For the fan,
The taxpayers built the damn park, the taxpayers should be able to use it.
If this is the kind of scuzzy tactics we are to expect from Wolff, the sooner he leaves the Bay Area the better.
Let me just say I would have no problem with the A's closing the third deck for low drawing series but for series with a lot of interest this decision is ridiculous.
Marty keeps mentioning Blez' being ill
Who demanded this supply of hogwash?
OK....breathe...find my happy place....GODDAMNIT, MY HAPPY PLACE IS IN SECTION 318! OK, maintain...find happy place number two...banks of the Eel River in Mendocino...ahhhhhhhh........
Now that I've regained composure, here goes: this deck closure is a terrible move for the franchise, the fans, and the chances of the team staying in Oakland, and there are a buncha reasons why. I'm going to group them into four areas.
The Revenue Argument
The most common reason from fans in favor of the closure seems to be "anything that brings the team more revenue to compete for a title/re-sign stars/stay in town is OK by me." (But perhaps the A's take PayPal). It baffles me, though, why everyone seems to just assume that the move on its face will bring the A's lotsa bucks...the A's haven't said that. There are reasons to think attendance will actually drop (more below). Last month Devo and I traded some WAGs and seemed to loosely agree that while the deck closure isn't likely to lose the A's a bunch of bucks, nor is it likely to gain them a whole lot either. Which makes sense...the A's will lose up to 10,000 tickets sold for each of the "premium" games (Yanks, BoSox, fireworks), while they'll save on the upkeep costs of the deck, plus they'll add some revenue from pre-bought tickets which don't get used. It's interesting that many pro-closure folks were certain that the deck would be open for these premium games. Apparently not.
And then there's the elusive (illusive?) scarcity quotient...the theory goes that making tickets less available will prompt more fans to buy them in advance, and actually increase the total ticket revenue. Proponents point to Some Phone Co. Park in SF, and Minuteman...oops, Minute Maid...in Houston, where smaller stadia in higher demand led to more tickets sold. But these were new parks, literally the next new thing, a modern smorgasbord of Krispy Kremes and wireless access. It's not hard to imagine why they were in high demand. The scarcity argument assumes there is an untapped fan base which will start buying seats under the new order. But when the new order is the same old crummy Coliseum, where half the seats point away from the plate and Brezhnevian architecture rules the day...someone please tell me who these Barnum-fodder are, who will start attending games at the same old deficient place because they're harder to get into, because I've got some multi-level marketing ideas I'm dying to lay on them. This way to the egress!
And the horrible burden of serving the walk-up customers? Please...after all these years the A's can surely make reasonable estimates of the staffing needed to handle the walk-ups for a given game. And c'mon, these ticket sellers just don't cost much. Ditto the top deck security and concession staff. Not having to pay those folks amounts to a trivial savings in revenue terms...less than a mediocre LOOGY, I'd say.
The Attendance Argument
I want a full park, believe me. I was there on Monday 9/19, the opener of the last A's homestand versus Minnie, in the thick of the race, with perhaps 12,000 others. It was grim. We need more butts in the seats, but to offer 2006 attendance as a referendum on Oakland support for the team (as Wolff did two weeks ago) while decreasing the number of seats available and making the average cost of the rest higher is either blind, perverse, or in support of a different agenda. I am willing to believe that the scarcity phenomenon will lead to some more advance sales...1,000 per game seems wildly optimistic, but some...but it seems clear to me that a decline in cheap seats available going to really be felt when KC is in town on a cold Tuesday night. I'm quite sure we'll see some 7-8,000 fan nights this year, as folks who would've made the last minute decision to dash down and buy a 3rd deck seat decide to stay home instead. Ain't no one planning ahead to buy that cold Tuesday night advance KC ticket because they're afraid they'll be shutout. No way. Subtract the up to 10,000 fewer for each premium game, and the A's will be hard pressed to match last year's total attendance even if they make more revenue at the bottom line. And yes, I understand that the cheapest seats are still $10 face cost, just like last year. But there are far fewer of them. And there's another shoe left to drop for us cheapskates...what of the AAA/Chevron $4 per ticket discount? If that goes away or is further restricted, in combination with the certainty that there will be many fewer $2 Wednesday tix made available, the cheapskates are just going to stay home on those last minute nights.
And when Lew stands up next November and decries the attendance of the A's, a solidly contending and (hopefully) playoff team, he's not going to quote revenue numbers...he's going to talk about total turnstile figures, and no one will mention that he himself reduced the top end number of turnstile spins per game. Which takes me to...
Relocation
Everyone likes to pile on the conspiracy theorist, so I'll be brief: start with San Jose flirtations, add a proposal for a swap meet ballpark which was set up for failure, mix in Oakland officials who cave when they should hold out and play hardball when they should cave, and you've got the makings of a tasty relocation cake. Ice it with declining attendance, and it's pretty damn irresistible. And remember: the A's in Oakland are a bottom tier franchise in resale terms, but the portable A's, with MLB blessing to move and well heeled suitors, are worth a whole lot more. Just ask the Expos cum Nationals.
Oh, and I don't imagine that timing this news release for a late December afternoon right before Christmas was a coincidence.
Disgruntled Fans
I know a lot of you think this move is a good one, so obviously, you're not going to be unhappy. But a key tenet of marketing is to hold onto your base. No matter how happy some might be about the new state of topdecklessness, it's not likely to make you a more enthusiastic fan in cash outlay terms. But us disgruntled types...we're feeling burned, and even if we try to maintain our enthusiasm, its going to be hard, especially when it comes to extras, like tee shirts and family nights and buying tix for friends who'd otherwise never go to a game. And it's not just us top deckers...watch what happens to the lower level concession stand lines, especially at the high traffic games, when there's no top deck stands to provide relief. Those concourses, already tough through poor design, are going to be nigh on impassable. And I'm going to say it again: the new cheapest seats offer views that are way, way worse than the better top deck seats. Crowley said in the press release that "we have created other seating options at the ballpark that we feel offer a better view at an affordable price." That is crap. The A's are asking their lower budget customers to pay more money for worse seats. Pure and simple.
I love the A's and will still go to as many games as I can afford. But that's going to be fewer than last year, a little for me and a lot for my kids. And I understand that putting the A's in a new park will cost more, and I'm willing to shoulder my share of that burden. But this move doesn't offer any promise of a new park...if anything, it makes them more likely to leave town. If the A's need revenue to prove franchise viability in Oakland then they should ask us loyalists to invest in a $5 per ticket surcharge which would be placed in an Oakland ballpark investment fund, to be re-credited down the line on future season tickets. There are other options. But hurting the lowest rung of fans simply to increase cashflow to Wolffisher, who are already running a profitable operation with substantially growing revenue? Closing the top deck might be a good business move for them, but not because they expect to sell more tickets...at least not in 2006, and not in Oakland.
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 21, 2005 7:35 PM PST reply actions
Great Post!
by Bearcat on Dec 21, 2005 8:06 PM PST up reply actions
Nice writeup
I hope you don't feel I sold out, FSU; but I just decided to take what they offered. You bet I think this was a bush league (for lack of a better description) move, and it still pisses me off they kicked me out of a seat I've had for years, but one/two: I want to go to ballgames, and I want the A's to stay in Oakland.
I'll get over this and I hope you will too. I just hope this isn't a prelude to an exit from Oakland. I don't have a lot of hope that this will change things for the A's in terms of higher profits or attendance, but I'm willing to wait and see what happens.
By the way, we've still not gotten an answer to the letter we wrote (and to which I added your name). At least Lewis hadn't as of last Wednesday when I bought my tix.
by Brian in 317 on Dec 21, 2005 9:01 PM PST up reply actions
I think you did get the reply
Hey, I'm just going to enjoy my Oakland A's while they're still in Oakland.
Beware the days
Hey, I'm a big Brian 317 fan
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 21, 2005 9:24 PM PST up reply actions
At least this solves the Teenage Fan Problem
Face it, folks, your worst nightmare conspiracy theory about this scheme is probably an insipid candyland fantasy next to the reality of MLB's insatiable hunger for taxpayer dollars- this is all about a shakedown for public funds from some (non-Oakland) city.
by AlamedaAphid on Dec 21, 2005 9:14 PM PST up reply actions
I can't tell if you are being sarcastic
by maxnelson on Dec 22, 2005 1:13 AM PST up reply actions
agreed.
The giants are seen as yuppy, white-collar wine drinkers, as opposed to the blue-collar, low payroll a's with $2 Wednesdays (formerly Wassup! Tuesdays if anyone remembers those) and $1 Taco/Tequila Fridays.
I love being able to go to as many A's games as I can in a summer and the reason I can do this is cuz of the cheap seats. Even if I snuck down to wherever I wanted to sit, I can't always afford to pay the price for those tickets. What this means is that I'll just have to pick the games ahead of time that I want to go to, and save up some cash. Sad to say, this means many more games will be watched on TV.
This guy puts it in perspective for how lucky we are to have cheap seats, and if we're not careful, we might just turn into the Red Sox.
You know, there are worse things in life..
Tons of money, winning playoff series [;)], having your stars leave by choice, rather than necessity etc, etc. Dashingly handsome fans..
I'm as guilty of the $2 boogie (buy an upper deck seat, sit in the lower reserved), but hey, the fundamental problem with it is my butt literally costs the A's money. I bring in my food and drink and between using the bathroom and my trash, that probably costs more than $2 in maintenance.
The A's were smart to market $2 Wednesdays as a loss leader in order to attract fans to A's baseball after years in the doldrums, but too many times you've seen a pair of 22,000 crowds sandwiched by 45,000 crowds on a Wednesday - IMHO, a lot of people basically only go to games on Wednesdays. It's bad PR to dump the thing entirely, but it's a good business move to restrict $2 Wednesdays to less attractive opponents and sparingly.
by FlynnSox on Dec 22, 2005 9:48 AM PST up reply actions
a few things, flynnsox.
- Choice v. Necessity?? Just tell me how it feel to lose Johnny Damon to the Yankees, whatever the reason. I'd much rather have my A's leave by necessity than have them choose to go my arch-rival. It says a lot about the types of players you do have. I'd say that A's fans can empathize, but clearly, we can't because you've already made that distinction.
- How many titles have the Boston Red Sox won since 1918? 1. How many have the Oakland Athletics won since 1918? 4. (6 if you count the Philly A's) So thanks. What's a 'bitter Red Sox fan' doing around here anyways? ;)
- You're wrong on 2 counts about the sneaking down thing:
b) "I bring in my food and drink and between using the bathroom and my trash, that probably costs more than $2 in maintenance."
Do the math. 2000x$2 tickets = $4000. Do you think 2000 people create an excess of $4000 in garbage per wednesday? Sure, when you break it down on an individual scale, it might cost more than $2 to hire someone to pick up just your trash (minimum wage and all), but when you consider the fact that it takes just four $2 seats being sold to finance an hour of payment for a clean-up employee, they can afford it. After all, they'd have to clean up after me wherever I sit, so I say let the sneaking down continue!
4. "years in the doldrums"?? Ha. that's all I have to say to that. 1918, buddy, 1918.
Yeah, they were doldrums
"it doesn't cost the A's anything if I sneak down into better seats. "
Yeah it does. It costs them the difference between a $2 seat and a $20 seat. Sure, not everybody who buys $2 seats will go if they have to pay $20. But enough will that they'll make more money, which should be the aim of the team.
" 4. "years in the doldrums"?? Ha. that's all I have to say to that. 1918, buddy, 1918."
I have no reply for this other than a contented smile. If that's the best you got, bring it on..
" I'd much rather have my A's leave by necessity than have them choose to go my arch-rival. "
I don't know. You guys have no love lost for the Yanks and Sox, and Giambi, Damon and Foulke didn't mind taking the dirty dollars.
by FlynnSox on Dec 22, 2005 4:28 PM PST up reply actions
Everything you say is probably true...
the bad news (to me): I didn't like the crowds at the concession stands on the lower decks before... I'm gonna hate them now. Which will mean I'll spend less and just try to smuggle in the booze.
the worst news (to me): Where will the smoking section be? Oh well, I have to quit anyway, I have a newborn.
by FoolshGame22 on Dec 21, 2005 10:59 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah to booze-smuggling
Personally I go for Sierra Nevada Pale Ale decanted into a gallon apple juice container, always remembering to release the pressure and drain off the head (inevitably built up on the BART ride) before passing security.
by green star oakland on Dec 21, 2005 11:26 PM PST up reply actions
back in the day...
by FoolshGame22 on Dec 21, 2005 11:34 PM PST up reply actions
I respectfully suggest that Brian and FSU
by southofcruiseamerica on Dec 22, 2005 12:09 AM PST up reply actions
Actually, I think the kids are good for the A's
Has anyone noticed the percentage of the crowd that's under 18 at a typical weeknight game? If not for the kids, most of those Tuesday evening games against the Royals and Devil Rays would have 3,000 fans instead of 11,000.
So that's what really burns my ass about this whole slimy move- by flashing a big middle finger in the faces of the teenage fans, the ownership might as well have a gigantic "There Is No Future Anywhere Near Oakland!" sign painted on the tarp covering the seats.
by AlamedaAphid on Dec 22, 2005 10:23 AM PST up reply actions
Kids are obviously the future of anything...
From what I understand there was a certain element up there that caused quite a few problems, especially on Wednesdays. As a regular I will take your word for it but that doesn't mean while you are sitting in 317 there isn't trouble going on in the concourse behind 301. All it takes is a couple of bad apples, just like we have seen here on AN with the CGV. However, Blez doesn't have a vast open section of this site that he can just close down...
by southofcruiseamerica on Dec 22, 2005 12:41 PM PST up reply actions
What "certain element" do you mean?
- 40-year-old suburban drunks with alky-fueled testosterone issues and an aggrieved (no, not Ben Grieved) sense of specialness.
- College-age Red Sox and (last couple years) Angels fans who have a few too many beers and start trying to start shit with A's fans (who, in almost all cases, ignore them).
by AlamedaAphid on Dec 22, 2005 3:16 PM PST up reply actions
The element that you perfectly described...
I highly doubt that this was a knee jerk decision by Wolff & Co. - a lot of thought went into and the PR ramifications must have been weighed. They made their choice and this is part of the new ownership group coming in and adjusting the M.O. instead of just sitting on their hands and bitching about things. If it ends up backfiring those tarps can certainly be removed in '07.
by southofcruiseamerica on Dec 22, 2005 5:16 PM PST up reply actions
I was at both those games
Anyway, these undesirable "roaming packs of kids" you described don't seem to cause problems at the many, many games I watch from the third deck. The kids I see aren't groups of PCP-addled thugs terrorizing the stands, they're relatively well-behaved teenagers doing normal teenage stuff (i.e., looking for their friends, flirting with each other, making more noise than adults, eating stunning quantities of high-fructose/grease food, etc). Hey, I'm a regular Travis Bickle when it comes to bitter tirades about the Collapse Of Civilization, but I ain't seeing it among the teenagers in the Coliseum's third deck.
In my opinion, the only legitimate claim that the third deck provided a bad "fan experience" was that many of the concession stands were closed during sparsely-attended games, forcing fans to take an extra 30 seconds to go downstairs for food/drink. That's it. If anyone out there has tales of being harassed or threatened by the third-deck kids, let's hear about it, because I sure as hell wasn't at those games.
by AlamedaAphid on Dec 22, 2005 5:59 PM PST up reply actions
Oops, I meant West Side Club
by AlamedaAphid on Dec 22, 2005 6:01 PM PST up reply actions
I see your POV
by southofcruiseamerica on Dec 22, 2005 6:11 PM PST up reply actions
And the REAL problem behavior...
by AlamedaAphid on Dec 22, 2005 3:17 PM PST up reply actions
Excellently put
by Lath on Dec 22, 2005 2:07 PM PST up reply actions
gah
Comment: That was a great post, should be a diary on its own (if it hasn't already been). I voted "ambivalent" in the poll because I'm trying to see everybody's side, so that's actually kind of like being blindfolded by gauze (or a "marketing" tarp) and seeing nothing clearly at all.
Though we can't blame them . . .
I don't think this is the first one, either.
Pacific Northwest
I have since joined and retired from the Navy. My family and I have lived up and down the west coast. We settled down near Seattle and we have kept our loyalty to the A's. Both my son and daughter (20 & 16) follow the A's and we never miss a game when they are at Safeco.
The Bay Area needs to wake up! I love the Raiders but they left us once and Al will do it again. When they left for LA they were DTM (dead to me), The A's have won four world championships in Oakland and they are still treated like a MLS franchise by Oakland and the county.
Bring the A's to Portland. Paul Allen has the Trail Blazers and the Seahawks. Give him the A's and he will win his first world championship.
I can't wait. Go Portland A's!!!
BTW Raiders KMA!!!!!
by Puget Sound Athletic on Dec 21, 2005 7:50 PM PST reply actions
Get buggered.
FlynnSox
by FlynnSox on Dec 21, 2005 10:13 PM PST up reply actions
I guess I am paranoid..
makes me nervous.
Although it will be great to feel like the stadium is fuller..that means more crowded lines, bathrooms, etc.
Guess we'll have to see how it all works out..and be there as often as we can!
Keep the A's in Oakland!
Don't worry about the crowded bathrooms
by AlamedaAphid on Dec 21, 2005 9:17 PM PST up reply actions
Is that a new tagline for this comment?
by Dig the Long Ball on Dec 21, 2005 11:01 PM PST up reply actions
the only fan friendly I really want..
Maybe this is a good time
It's just part of our attempt to make AN more "fan friendly".
Good move!
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 21, 2005 11:11 PM PST up reply actions
Tarp
by jav on Dec 21, 2005 10:03 PM PST reply actions
Wasn't that just for the hitters background?
by FlynnSox on Dec 21, 2005 10:14 PM PST up reply actions
Don't recall
by jav on Dec 21, 2005 10:19 PM PST up reply actions
I was around then
by FlynnSox on Dec 21, 2005 10:27 PM PST reply actions
schedule announced
17 days in a row with no day off with some teams that were decent in 05 (that is 17 unless you count seattle as days off)
Those'll be some AWESOME baseball, though.
...Let's hope MLB has done all its random drug screenings by then, given the amphetamines crackdown...
Squeezing us tighter...
by baseballbill on Dec 21, 2005 10:54 PM PST reply actions
The summer, uh, scenery..
It's a lot more fun than the sausagefest that is Pac Bell. :)))))
by FlynnSox on Dec 21, 2005 11:01 PM PST up reply actions
great idea! he has to figure out if the
Shameless (yet tuneful) self-promotion
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 21, 2005 11:50 PM PST reply actions
so if the VIEW is so terrible
by kotsbots on Dec 21, 2005 11:57 PM PST reply actions
As a teenager on a limited budget
Also, given that I work a part time job without any real set schedule, the inability to get walk up tickets means FSN will get a lot more of my ratings next season.
If it leads to a new stadium at all, I suppose I'm for it. It's selfish to be dissapointed, really, but I am, nonetheless.
Now, I went to a day game last year
The three teenagers who sat next to me? Plopped down at first pitch, and their cost?
$0, zero, nada. Tickets were given away. Seventeen rows from the dugout on the visitor (1b side).
That won't change. Walkup for scalping will rise $2 or so, but not much,.
by Ducts on the Pawn on Dec 22, 2005 3:03 PM PST up reply actions
slusser on the move
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/chronicle/archive/2005/12/22/SPGTTGBSU31.DTL&type=a s
Simply regurgitates press release
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 22, 2005 8:58 AM PST up reply actions
in my colleague's defense
Slusser here
I'm not sure whether they will or they won't with this move; sure, it could go down because they won't have those 47K crowds anymore, but making tickets more scarce might encourage the purchase of more partial season-ticket plans.
And thanks, commuter, for explaining my rushed day - I thought I was off and instead wound up writing two stories between 4-6 p.m. Life at the understaffed Chronicle.
How DARE you
<goes and finds fault with the way one-legged nun is dragging fire victim out of house>
Keep on 'slussing, Susan. AN loves you more than you will know...
A calculator?
For the record?
(serving up a "phatt" straight line, to be hit out of the park..)
by Ducts on the Pawn on Dec 22, 2005 3:27 PM PST up reply actions
Nice to have a place where
I like it, it takes journalism right to the audience, in a good way.
Upon reading your remarks, it reminded me (why? why!) of what Steve Young said in an interview, about interceptions:
"Sometimes you just want to run off the field, grab a microphone connected to the PA, and say, "Attention fans! THAT interception was NOT my fault! That was an outpattern, and the receiver was supposed to turn ten yards from scrimmage, but instead he went fifteen..."
I see not only do we have journalists on blogs, I see that bloggers ("Blez", with Tyler too) being quoted for reaction in the Oakland Tribune as part of the "story" about the Coliseum!
Newsflash! World changing!
by Ducts on the Pawn on Dec 22, 2005 3:00 PM PST up reply actions
I too am a Slusser fan
However, I do hope to read, in the post-holiday near-term as well as the empirically fueled mid or post-season longer term, a more critical analysis of the deck tarping, revenue generating, and the fans brought along and left behind in the process. Thanks for your post and your work.
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 22, 2005 5:55 PM PST up reply actions
Ticket sharing
by kkdaz on Dec 22, 2005 9:10 AM PST reply actions
Lots of good comments
But my reaction is purely personal.
I hate it. I have always liked sitting in 317 or 318. It's where I met friends when we were meeting at the game. It's right behind the plate, with a panoramic view of the entire field. And it's been affordable.
It's hard to see how this new plan, whatever its business justification, is good for me.
It seems to me
But since "empty paid for seats" don't buy concessions, don't buy souvenirs, and don't get excited about coming back, that "may" looks like a "may not" in "may"'s clothing.
Empty paid for seats
It may also bump up attendance at other games, as the Yanks/Sox/Giants are sold out, so fans buy tickets for the Angels/Mariners/Texas instead.
by FlynnSox on Dec 22, 2005 10:10 AM PST up reply actions
Yeah, if you believe
If they're A's fans they will
by FlynnSox on Dec 22, 2005 4:32 PM PST up reply actions
If the A's were a Business...
If they were a sporting team which supports the community, this would not happen...
What am I trying to get to? Pretty soon the A's will outsource our workers to warmer climates to work at the Colliseum...
by Instant Replay Umpire on Dec 22, 2005 11:21 AM PST reply actions
Was yesterday the day
Yeah... But why do sporting teams always ask for..
We want land or a partially taxed based stadium, blah blah blah.
Personally, I don't agree on funding sporting teams so that big phat gifted athletes can make millions.
But i'm addicted to my A's... Does that make sense?
by Instant Replay Umpire on Dec 22, 2005 4:06 PM PST up reply actions
They ask for public money
by AlamedaAphid on Dec 22, 2005 4:35 PM PST up reply actions
Good Point !
I don't even want a stadium or huge amounts of land, how about a nice home fully paid for? ^_^
by Instant Replay Umpire on Dec 22, 2005 5:20 PM PST up reply actions
Well, in fairness, Oakland's easy pickings
An extra cruel bit of irony in all this is that Oakland has been willing to toss bad money after more bad money to just about anyone who would show a little leg, and yet they're still going to end up doing little or nothing for the A's. That may be as much Wolffisher's fault as the City's (see: phony swap meet proposal) but the fact remains the City has been able to offer up cash and resources when it wants to...but somehow isn't doing so here.
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 22, 2005 6:37 PM PST up reply actions
I think this plan will work brilliantly
Sentiment seemingly abounds that the capacity reduction is a slap in the fans' faces. I am sure that some of you who believe this also think that a new stadium with limited capacity is as well. If you hold both positions, I can't take issue.
But I am curious as to those folks who dislike the motivation behind the current capacity reduction but wouldn't question the motives behind a new stadium with limited capacity. Is capacity reduction less objectionable in the latter case because we get more in the bargain, i.e. a new stadium? Is the assumption in the former case that Mr. Wolff is taking away from the fans with no offsetting benefit?
If that assumption were true, I too would take issue. But I believe the plan will create a better atmosphere overall and more than offset the disadvantages. Of course, this depends on how well the dressing of the upper tier is able to create a sense of intimacy. Like I said above, we'll have to wait and see on that.
In any event, I just got season tickets after hearing the news. I didn't renew after 2001 because it was so easy to get walk-ups and head down to my old seats. I am excited about the new configuration, so my analysis is likely skewed by wishful thinking. Take it for what it is. Go A's!!
by stewbaby on Dec 22, 2005 11:41 AM PST reply actions
It makes sense
whenever I sleep with a woman ...
... and, yes, my tarp takes advantage of "promotional opportunities" while at the same time celebrating my rich history ...
My facilities
Now I'm curious ...
noe that's just inappropriate ...
If Lew moves to Canada...
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/news/archive/2005/12/22/international/i032521S57.DTL
by stewbaby on Dec 22, 2005 11:56 AM PST up reply actions
Back to stewbaby's comment....
It's clear that this current change impacts the most price sensitive fans, but no doubt a new stadium will affect us all.
If we want to have the option to see A's games without buying even more expensive tickets (on air planes), then we need to have the new stadium with more expensive seats. And if we want to have that stadium the A's need to know who and how many fans they can expect in that stadium, hence this real-life experiment.
This is our opportunity as A's fans to put-up or shut-up and prove to Wolff and Fisher that Oakland is a viable investment. Otherwise, we'll only be left with that crappy phone booth on the other side of the bay.
It's not as if
Well I was one of those
I never sat there anyway.
But and do feel bad for Brian and Co.
I think I only sat in the third deck once
Of course, if you can remember a "Day On The Green" concert, you probably didn't really experience it. Pass the bong!
by Rob @ Athletics Nation on Dec 22, 2005 2:18 PM PST reply actions
the strong 3rd deck feelings
I cut my teeth sitting on the wooden bleachers in left center watching Dwayne Murphy's cap fly off every time he began a quick dash to the ball. Then in later years getting a head nod from Hendu to his admirers in Henduland. The low angle and close in view of the field view gave you a feeling that you had an effect on the game(albeit tiny) for a low dollar amount, that sitting in the bleachers today don't come close to
I feel for you 316-318ers because while you will go to future games and have great times, you'll always regret not seeing those same events in your old seats.
Frankly m'dear, closing the third deck sucks.
Yes, I'm sitting here on a rainy afternoon dreaming of baseball and waiting for the announcement: Frank Thomas is an Oakland A.
Or am I merely dreaming?
by Edwinwinwin on Dec 22, 2005 3:53 PM PST reply actions
Real Problem is not closing the Third deck
I guess I and people like me are the ones to blame for this decision. I do not blame the A's for trying to increase the value of the experience to those who pay the most. I am not happy about not being able to get more tickets to see the Yankees or Boston or fireworks at the last minute. But I understand why it is necessary.
I would not trade this team and Oakland for any other in baseball. I love the way we compete without all the strengths the other "big market" teams have with newer stadiums and more cash flow.
It takes unique and risk taking ownership to keep the team viable in this market. This is a risky move. And it certainly is unique. There is no guarantee it will generate more revenue. There is no guarantee it will work at all.
Lets just be happy that we (A's Nation) know which games we need to buy tickets for now. We will see the games we want to. The so called fans who go to see the "other" teams when they play here will be in for a surpise this year.
I hope this works. If it does the odds the A's will stay local will, for the first time, be in our favor.
Ditto all that
My practices have been much the same -- including cooking my own Aidell's dogs at home and mooching the stadium condiments.
It's the Moneyball approach to fandom: exploit the cracks and inefficiencies in the system. Wolff is trying to patch over the seams, which is good for the long-term health of the ballclub but bad for penny-pinchers like us.
silver lining
Insanely Stupid Idea
Closing the upper deck of the Coliseum could become a marketing idea that is joked about for years. A huge swath of the Coliseum viewing experience awash in advertising and photos of Rollie Fingers and Reggie Jackson. For what? Only one reason. Money, money, money. The almight dollar is important but not for the sake of hurting your fans.
This marketing ploy is a farce and I challenge A's fans to stand up for themselves instead of lapping it up like some have on AN.
by wonderbread74 on Dec 22, 2005 5:47 PM PST reply actions
don't be mean
by rich @ Athletics Nation on Dec 22, 2005 8:57 PM PST up reply actions
I'm don't have an opinion either way but
by Indiana Athletic on Dec 22, 2005 7:47 PM PST reply actions
The A's have been marketing FOR YEARS!!!
by haren4prez on Dec 22, 2005 10:08 PM PST reply actions
You should write the next A's press release
What makes you think the deck closure will mean any of those things? The A's don't say so...I doubt they even think so. And I look forward to your decibel reports during the season, explaining how fewer people are making more noise. Perhaps thunder sticks...
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 22, 2005 10:21 PM PST up reply actions
I'm looking at the field anyway, not the 3rd deck.
by haren4prez on Dec 22, 2005 10:09 PM PST reply actions
One way to look at it:
Maybe it would make more sense to cry foul over the A's closing the third deck if they routinely filled the second deck--which they don't. All of 144 season-ticket holders, out of 2,000,000+ fans, were affected by the closure, and they were offered more expensive seats at the same price.
Maybe the A's didn't cause a problem; maybe they reacted to one.
Only season-ticket holders count?

by AlamedaAphid on Dec 22, 2005 10:48 PM PST up reply actions
Yes, true, you have a right
Needs of the one/few/many
The A's would love this discussion to be about a mere gross of season ticket holders. But it isn't...thousands of fans bought 3rd deck tickets for every game. Those folks will now sit in worse seats and likely pay more for the privilege, and hence attend fewer games. There's a feeling on these pages that the A's relatively low prices make this OK. But that's faulty logic in an old park.
Like most, I accept (though don't like) the modern reality that a new ballpark is needed to keep the franchise in the revenue style to which its peers are accustomed. And new parks bring new prices...the Gnats left a lot of loyal blue collar Candlestick fans behind when they opened Some Bell Co. Many would say the atmosphere suffered accordingly, but that's not my point. The A's deck closure begins to squeeze those fans today with no promise of a new park tomorrow.
This idea of testing the 35K park idea is absurd, akin to the Ferrari dealer removing the back seats from an old Volvo 240 and using that for customers to sample the experience of a two person sports car. If the A's want to sample new park demand, let them announce a tentative Oakland location (a feasible one...in the spirit of the paragraph, perhaps the vacating Broadway Auto Row) and offer fans the chance to open refundable season ticket deposit accounts. The cash would be returned if no park was built; if plans proceeded apace, it would both give the team some cashflow while offering a gauge of actual new park interest. Using a stripped down old park for that purpose is another baramoter which is set up to fail...decrease capacity 22% and demand more tickets sold, or else...hmmm...
I want to express my support for keeping the A's in Oakland, man, do I. But the team is showing no matching support for staying. And there are ways to do both at the same time, and the A's know this, and aren't. And not only might Oakland fans be left out in the cold, we're being set up by even our own community to be blamed for what comes next.
by FreeSeatUpgrade on Dec 23, 2005 4:12 AM PST up reply actions
does that mean ...
Well said Nico
by haren4prez on Dec 22, 2005 10:33 PM PST reply actions
Some "Fan-Friendly" Ideas
- Fix the mess at the entrance to the BART bridge after games. The "cattle call" after games- even ones with 15,000 fans- when thousands try to cram onto the BART bridge is a major drag that could be solved quite readily with minimal manpower. Put the choke points further upstream, on the ramps, so that the merging takes place more gradually. Get stadium security to keep folks from gathering in big clots right at the bridge entrance. Have the cops clear the damn Five Dollah Hat guys off the bridge so they aren't bottlenecking things.
- Fix the mess at the exits from the stadium parking lots. A half-dozen strategically-placed guys directing traffic with those little airport-runway flashlights would do a world of good.
- Stop being such cheapskates with Stomper appearances and limiting the Stompster to weekends/big games only- I go to quite a few weeknight games with my little nieces & nephew and they must see Stomper!
- Let Roy Steele cut loose with any weird gibberish that comes into his head, at any time- it's obvious that he's the Bill King of stadium announcers and it's a shame to force him to hold back in the name of Yankees-style "professionalism." If he wants to narrate Dot Racing with a lenghty tirade on The Nature Of Reality, well by God, let him do it! He's been there long enough to have earned the right. Let that boy boogie woogie! it's in him and it's got to come out!
- Fix the radio speakers in the West Side Club men's bathroom. Come on, how much does a friggin' new radio cost? It sounds like I'm listening to Marconi's first experiments in there, and it's been that way as long as I can remember!
LOL
Hmm.
One thing I hadn't really thought of, though, was the impact this'll have on promotional days. It'll be quite disappointing to see people unable to get to fireworks days and events like Root Beer Float Day, but on the other hand, it'll probably help with safety concerns and general crowd control for getting on the field for fireworks and whatnot. That, at least, will be refreshing.
I do hope that if this supposed season ticket buying and increased consistancy in attendance happens, the A's might bump up the numbers for giveaways so that more people have chances to get the major ones -- bobbleheads, figurines.
And given the attedence for Eck Day, I really hope that when Rickey's time rolls around to be put on the outfield wall (or Bill King's, for his HOF moment!), they do consider opening up the upper deck for just that day -- screw profit, whoever wants to be in the park for a day like that should damn well be able to be there. Those are moments that transcend any of the other shit, IMHO.
For 61 games last season, we had under 30,000 people in attedence. Still plenty of room for walkup for those, at least. I could definitely see bleacher season tickets increasing as a replacement for the lost level... I'm really curious to see if this does have a definite impact in season ticket sales over the next three years, though. I guess decreasing walkup sales is valuable enough to them, since it will at least incite people to consider a little bit ahead of time about procuring tickets for some of the bigger games. I just hope this isn't about seriously yanking up the ticket prices in a year or two through preaching scarcity.
I hate feeling like we're the goddamn labrat on the way out of town. I don't WANT to do anything to help them make a venue in Portland or San Jose or whatever craptastic location Wolff is licking his chops over.
Just seems like it's gonna be a field day for Stubhub and scalpers with those Yankees/Giants/Red Sox games more than anything as a result of this. Which makes me sad.

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